Pliocene Homo did not live in Africa,
E & S.African australopiths evolved in parallel gracile->robust:
// E.African fossil Gorilla afarensis->boisei,
// S.African fossil Pan africanus ->robustus:

Gorilla-like features in E-African australopith crania:
• “Incisal dental microwear in A.afarensis is most similar to that observed in Gorilla”. Ryan & Johanson 1989.
• The composite skull reconstructed mostly from A.L.333 specimens “looked very much like a small female gorilla”. Johanson & Edey 1981:351.
• “Other primitive [or advanced gorilla-like! MV] features found in KNM-WT 17000, but not know or much discussed for A.afarensis, are: very small cranial capacity; low posterior profile of the calvaria; nasals extended far above the frontomaxillar
suture and well onto an uninflated glabella; and extremely convex inferolateral margins of the orbits such as found in some gorillas”. Walker cs 1986.
• As for the maximum parietal breadth and the biauriculare in O.H.5 and KNM-ER 406 “the robust australopithecines have values near the Gorilla mean: both the pongids and the robust australopithecines have highly pneumatized bases”. Kennedy 1991.
• In O.H.5, “the curious and characteristic features of the Paranthropus skull... parallel some of those of the gorilla”. Robinson 1960.
• The A.boisei “lineage has been characterized by sexual dimorphism of the degree seen in modern Gorilla for the length of its known history”. Leakey & Walker 1988.
• A.boisei teeth showed “a relative absence of prism decussation”; among extant hominoids, “Gorilla enamel showed relatively little decussation ...”. Beynon & Wood 1986.

Quotations on chimp-like features in S-African australopith crania:
• “Alan [Walker] has analysed a number of Australopithecus robustus teeth and they fall into the fruit-eating category ... their teeth patterns look like those of chimpanzees ... when be looked at some Homo erectus teeth, he found that the pattern
changed”. Leakey 1981:74-75.
• “The ‘keystone’ nasal bone arrangement suggested as a derived diagnostic of Paranthropus [robustus] is found in an appreciable number of pongids, particularly clearly in some chimpanzees”. Eckhardt 1987.
• “P.paniscus provides a suitable comparison for Australopithecus [Sts.5]; they are similar in body size, postcranial dimensions and... even in cranial and facial features”. Zihlman cs 1978.
• “A.africanus Sts.5, which... falls well within the range of Pan troglodytes, is markedly prognathous or hyperprognathous”". Ferguson 1989.
• In Taung, “I see nothing in the orbits, nasal bones, and canine teeth definitely nearer to the human condition than the corresponding parts of the skull of a modern young chimpanzee”. Woodward 1925.
• “The Taung juvenile seems to resemble a young chimpanzee more closely than it resembles L338y-6”, a juvenile A.boisei. Rak & Howell 1978.
• “In addition to similarities in facial remodeling it appears that Taung and Australopithecus in general, had maturation periods similar to those of the extant chimpanzee”. Bromage 1985.
• “I estimate an adult capacity for Taung ranging from 404-420 cm2, with a mean of 412 cm2. Application of Passingham’s curve for brain development in Pan is preferable to that for humans because (a) brain size of early hominids approximates that
of chimpanzees, and (b) the curves for brain volume relative to body weight are essentially parallel in pongids and australopithecines, leading Hofman to conclude that ‘as with pongids, the australopithecines probably differed only in size, not in
design’”. Falk 1987.
• In Taung, “pneumatization has also extended into the zygoma and hard palate. This is intriguing because an intrapalatal extension of the maxillary sinus has only been reported in chimpanzees and robust australopithecines among higher primates”.
Bromage & Dean 1985.
• “That the fossil ape Australopithecus [Taung] ‘is distinguished from all living apes by the... unfused nasal bones…’ as claimed by Dart (1940), cannot be maintained in view of the very considerable number of cases of separate nasal bones
among orang-utans and chimpanzees of ages corresponding to that of Australopithecus”. Schultz 1941.

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marc verhaegen wrote:

Pliocene Homo did not live in Africa,
E & S.African australopiths evolved in parallel gracile->robust:
// E.African fossil Gorilla afarensis->boisei,
// S.African fossil Pan africanus ->robustus:

Evidence for an Eurasian Origins:

#1. Teeth resembling Ardi & Lucy found in Germany but dating
back in the area of 10 million years.

#2. The Retro Virus whose evidence is carried in African apes
but not Asian apes, nor humans.

#3. The "Nuclear DNA Insert," the LM3 insert on Chromosome
11, which represents an extremely old mtDNA line, one
significantly older than any Out of Africa "Mitochondrial Eve,"
presently carried by BILLIONS of living people. And it's also
Eurasian in origins... maybe Melanesian.

#4. The Apidima Cave finds. The Out of Africa purists have no
way to account for such "Modern" skulls and are imagining that
so called modern man leapfrogged from Africa to Greece.

(You can't make this stuff up, it's so nutty!)

#5. Our heavy dependence on DHA, for our brains, which absolutely
rules out any jungle or savanna environment. It necessitated an
environment rich in DHA, and that requires Aquatic Ape.

THE FACT FACT THAT THE NUTTERS ARE MISSING:

We are not speaking of apes here, and neither are we talking about
Homo. There were lots of different populations, found in many
different environments. But none of them matter. The only one that
matters is the one that gave rise to us.

Mathematically it is claimed that ANYONE who lived 4 thousand
years ago is either the ancestor to EVERYONE who is alive right
now, or NOBODY.

Get it? Statistically, working out the numbers, if a man lived even
four thousand years ago then he either has ZERO living descendant
today or EVERYONE is a descendant. This doesn't even mean that
you'd be able to find his DNA within a living human!

As a man he won't pass on his mtDNA, so that's gone after a single
generation. If he has only daughters then his y chromosome is
erased, along with half of all of his other DNA... which can be cut in
half with each succeeding generation. Without some inbreeding, his
DNA is going to vanish pretty quick. Some sources claim in about a
thousand years. But he still lived, and he has ancestors.

So when it comes to human origins, this is all about ANCESTORS!
It's not about who lived 3 million years ago. That's irrelevant. It's
about who our ANCESTOR was 3 million years ago, what did they
look like...



-- --

https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/713719423361531904/i-wanted-to-but-i-could-not-talk-to-roomie-into

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Op woensdag 5 april 2023 om 07:55:10 UTC+2 schreef JTEM is my hero:

marc verhaegen wrote:

Pliocene Homo did not live in Africa,
E & S.African australopiths evolved in parallel gracile->robust:
// E.African fossil Gorilla afarensis->boisei,
// S.African fossil Pan africanus ->robustus:

Evidence for an Eurasian Origins:
#1. Teeth resembling Ardi & Lucy found in Germany but dating
back in the area of 10 million years.

Of course, but this says nothing about Homo:
Homo & Pan split c 5 Ma, HP/Gorilla c 8-7 Ma, probably in Red Sea swamp forests.

The Mesopotamian Seaway closure c 15 Ma split
- pongids-sivapiths East = Ind.Ocean coastal forests,
- hominids-dryopiths West = Medit.Sea (only Red Sea hominids survive):
IOW, all Miocene European teeth are hominid = resemble HPG teeth.

Ardipith & Lucy are fossil relatives of Gorilla IMO https://www.researchgate.net/publication/271769593_Marc_Verhaegen_1987-2013_Human_Evolution_papers

#2. The Retro Virus whose evidence is carried in African apes
but not Asian apes, nor humans.

Of course:
- Pliocene Homo followed S-Asian coasts -> H.erectus early-Pleist. Java,
- Pliocene Pan E.Afr.coastal forests -> southern Rift -> late-Pliocene Transvaal Au.africanus.

#3. The "Nuclear DNA Insert," the LM3 insert on Chromosome
11, which represents an extremely old mtDNA line, one
significantly older than any Out of Africa "Mitochondrial Eve,"
presently carried by BILLIONS of living people. And it's also
Eurasian in origins... maybe Melanesian.

Well possible (I have no idea).

#4. The Apidima Cave finds. The Out of Africa purists have no
way to account for such "Modern" skulls and are imagining that
so called modern man leapfrogged from Africa to Greece.
(You can't make this stuff up, it's so nutty!)

OK, but Apidima is Pleistocene: it says nothing about Mio-Pliocene origins.
Not unlikely, early-Pleistocene archaic Homo (e.g. erectus) spread in evol."short" times along Eurasian & African coasts,
google "coastal dispersal Pleistocene Homo".

#5. Our heavy dependence on DHA, for our brains, which absolutely
rules out any jungle or savanna environment. It necessitated an
environment rich in DHA, and that requires Aquatic Ape.

Yes, the first unquestionable evidence for shallow-diving is early-Pleist.H.erectus'
- pachyosteosclerotic skeleton (only seen in slow+shallow-diving tetrapods) &
- larger brain (which probably required aquatic foods + DHA etc.).

THE FACT FACT THAT THE NUTTERS ARE MISSING:
We are not speaking of apes here, and neither are we talking about
Homo. There were lots of different populations, found in many
different environments. But none of them matter. The only one that
matters is the one that gave rise to us.
Mathematically it is claimed that ANYONE who lived 4 thousand
years ago is either the ancestor to EVERYONE who is alive right
now, or NOBODY.
Get it? Statistically, working out the numbers, if a man lived even
four thousand years ago then he either has ZERO living descendant
today or EVERYONE is a descendant. This doesn't even mean that
you'd be able to find his DNA within a living human!
As a man he won't pass on his mtDNA, so that's gone after a single generation. If he has only daughters then his Y-chromosome is
erased, along with half of all of his other DNA... which can be cut in
half with each succeeding generation. Without some inbreeding, his
DNA is going to vanish pretty quick. Some sources claim in about a
thousand years. But he still lived, and he has ancestors.
So when it comes to human origins, this is all about ANCESTORS!
It's not about who lived 3 million years ago. That's irrelevant. It's
about who our ANCESTOR was 3 million years ago, what did they
look like...

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