• Re: Guns Are Simply Not a Human Right

    From 26B.X938@21:1/5 to dyno dan on Mon Apr 24 20:28:14 2023
    XPost: talk.politics.guns, talk.politics.misc, alt.society.liberalism
    XPost: alt.philosophy

    On 4/24/23 9:07 AM, dyno dan wrote:
    On Sun, 23 Apr 2023 10:15:29 -0500, !Jones <x@y.com> wrote:

    talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.misc,alt.society.liberalism,alt.philosophy,alt.philosophy.debate

    Guns Are Simply Not a Human Right


    Not specifically. But the right to self defense definitely is, using
    the most effective tool available. And in THIS country, with our Constitution, that tool is often a personal firearm. Deal with it. Or
    just move to Canada if personal freedoms bother you that much.

    An "effective MEANS" of self-defense goes along with
    the right to live and repel would-be assassins. 20,000
    years ago "effective means" would have been a club or
    crude spear. Not anymore. You have to have something
    like "They" have.

    And I've always liked the term "equalizer" - with a gun a
    80-year-old 4'11" woman is the equal of a 6'6" thug/rapist,
    maybe several.

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  • From !Jones@21:1/5 to 26BX938@zoq24q.net on Tue Apr 25 10:44:32 2023
    XPost: talk.politics.guns, talk.politics.misc, alt.society.liberalism
    XPost: alt.philosophy

    On Mon, 24 Apr 2023 20:28:14 -0400, in talk.politics.guns "26B.X938" <26BX938@zoq24q.net> wrote:

    An "effective MEANS" of self-defense goes along with
    the right to live and repel would-be assassins. 20,000
    years ago "effective means" would have been a club or
    crude spear. Not anymore. You have to have something
    like "They" have.

    And I've always liked the term "equalizer" - with a gun a
    80-year-old 4'11" woman is the equal of a 6'6" thug/rapist,
    maybe several.

    My definition of a human right is that it is intrinsic to the human
    experience, indelible, and universal. An example of a human right is
    the right to one's own individual theological beliefs (or the lack
    thereof.) Simply because I believe that the most "effective means" to
    worship my deity is over a pyre of burning tires doesn't extend the
    human right to my bonfire.

    The definition I gave above wouldn't necessarily include defense as a
    human right because it is a property of all living organisms. Every
    human will act in self defense, but so will every insect. If defense
    is a human right, then so is an acceleration of 9.807 m/s^2 toward
    Earth's center.

    I wouldn't have a problem if you included defense in the set of human
    rights. You could argue successfully that defense is intrinsic,
    indelible, and universal. You make a logical leap, though, when you
    extend the human right to any means you believe facilitates that
    right... my theological *beliefs* are protected human rights; however,
    my altar of burning tires is not.

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