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  • all old shells such as programmers' workbench (PWB)/Mashey shell?

    From David Chmelik@21:1/5 to All on Sun Aug 28 07:13:38 2022
    Has The Programmers' Workbench (PWB)/Mashey shell been ported to any
    current UNIX/*BSD/IllumOS or GNU/Linux? I've found all other shells I've
    heard of (many rarely heard of anymore) except the PWB/Mashey shell...

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  • From Ben Bacarisse@21:1/5 to David Chmelik on Sun Aug 28 12:44:46 2022
    David Chmelik <dchmelik@gmail.com> writes:

    Has The Programmers' Workbench (PWB)/Mashey shell been ported to any
    current UNIX/*BSD/IllumOS or GNU/Linux? I've found all other shells I've heard of (many rarely heard of anymore) except the PWB/Mashey shell...

    I can't help with your question, but have you found any shells from the
    same era as the PWB shell? If so, they must have been ported solely as historical curiosities.

    --
    Ben.

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  • From David Chmelik@21:1/5 to Ben Bacarisse on Sun Aug 28 12:33:33 2022
    On Sun, 28 Aug 2022 12:44:46 +0100, Ben Bacarisse wrote:
    I can't help with your question, but have you found any shells from the
    same era as the PWB shell? If so, they must have been ported solely as historical curiosities.

    Yes: Almquist, original Bourne, Thompson shell, maybe others. A couple
    decades ago a/the UNIX trademark owner made much/all earlier UNIX source
    code Free/Libre/Opensource Software (FLS, OSS, FOSS, FLOSS) including PWM/ Mashey shell which is still at archives/repositories such as The UNIX
    Heritage Society.

    Later there was a lawsuit that organization didn't have right to because
    AT&T sold trademark to several organizations, but 'the cat is out of the
    bag' and people can use that code as long as they don't sell it (maybe not distribute it either or at least not largely-publicize it to attract wrong attention).

    Of course, PWB/Mashey shell still freely/legally runs on UNIX servers and personal-use emulators... for newer servers/PCs it's merely a question of updates that may be minor (as was the case with other three I mentioned).

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  • From Ben Bacarisse@21:1/5 to David Chmelik on Sun Aug 28 15:56:45 2022
    David Chmelik <dchmelik@gmail.com> writes:

    On Sun, 28 Aug 2022 12:44:46 +0100, Ben Bacarisse wrote:
    I can't help with your question, but have you found any shells from the
    same era as the PWB shell? If so, they must have been ported solely as
    historical curiosities.

    Yes: Almquist, original Bourne, Thompson shell, maybe others. A couple decades ago a/the UNIX trademark owner made much/all earlier UNIX source
    code Free/Libre/Opensource Software (FLS, OSS, FOSS, FLOSS) including PWM/ Mashey shell which is still at archives/repositories such as The UNIX Heritage Society.

    Are the ports freely available? I wonder why the PWB shell was not
    ported...

    --
    Ben.

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  • From Geoff Clare@21:1/5 to David Chmelik on Mon Aug 29 14:45:13 2022
    David Chmelik wrote:

    A couple
    decades ago a/the UNIX trademark owner made much/all earlier UNIX source
    code Free/Libre/Opensource Software (FLS, OSS, FOSS, FLOSS) including PWM/ Mashey shell which is still at archives/repositories such as The UNIX Heritage Society.

    You are mixing up two different intellectual property rights: copyright
    and trademarks. The UNIX trademark was given to X/Open (now The Open
    Group) by Novell in 1993. The events concerning UNIX source code and copyrights that you describe happened much later, after the source code
    had been sold by Novell to SCO and SCO had been bought by Caldera.

    Later there was a lawsuit that organization didn't have right to because
    AT&T sold trademark to several organizations

    AT&T sold the trademark, source code, and copyrights to one organisation: Novell. Novell gave the trademark to X/Open and sold the source code to
    SCO. The dispute over the copyright was not because there were multiple organisations but because of the way the contract between Novell and SCO
    was worded. The eventual result of the legal process was that the
    copyrights were not included in the transfer from Novell to SCO.
    For details see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SCO_v._Novell

    --
    Geoff Clare <netnews@gclare.org.uk>

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  • From Christian Weisgerber@21:1/5 to Geoff Clare on Mon Aug 29 14:52:00 2022
    On 2022-08-29, Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> wrote:

    The eventual result of the legal process was that the
    copyrights were not included in the transfer from Novell to SCO.
    For details see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SCO_v._Novell

    Huh. I guess this means that my

    The Santa Cruz Operation, Inc.
    Special Software License Agreement for Ancient UNIX Source Code
    ...
    1999

    is void?

    As well as the open-sourcing of Version 7 by Caldera in 2002, since
    they acquired the rights from SCO?

    --
    Christian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de

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  • From Chris Elvidge@21:1/5 to Christian Weisgerber on Tue Aug 30 13:59:38 2022
    On 29/08/2022 15:52, Christian Weisgerber wrote:
    On 2022-08-29, Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> wrote:

    The eventual result of the legal process was that the
    copyrights were not included in the transfer from Novell to SCO.
    For details see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SCO_v._Novell

    Huh. I guess this means that my

    The Santa Cruz Operation, Inc.
    Special Software License Agreement for Ancient UNIX Source Code
    ...
    1999

    is void?

    As well as the open-sourcing of Version 7 by Caldera in 2002, since
    they acquired the rights from SCO?


    SCO Group - as in spat over copyright - and Santa Cruz Operation were
    not the same people.
    I was using Santa Cruz Operation UNIX on an 80486 in (I suppose) early
    1990's


    --
    Chris Elvidge
    England

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  • From Geoff Clare@21:1/5 to Christian Weisgerber on Tue Aug 30 14:44:28 2022
    Christian Weisgerber wrote:

    On 2022-08-29, Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> wrote:

    The eventual result of the legal process was that the
    copyrights were not included in the transfer from Novell to SCO.
    For details see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SCO_v._Novell

    Huh. I guess this means that my

    The Santa Cruz Operation, Inc.
    Special Software License Agreement for Ancient UNIX Source Code
    ...
    1999

    is void?

    As well as the open-sourcing of Version 7 by Caldera in 2002, since
    they acquired the rights from SCO?

    It would seem so, although the various UNIX copyright owners
    (Attachmate and Micro Focus) since Novell don't appear to have taken
    any action against sites hosting the code.

    The ownership is soon to change again (OpenText is buying Micro Focus)
    so that could change, but it seems unlikely.

    --
    Geoff Clare <netnews@gclare.org.uk>

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  • From jak@21:1/5 to All on Tue Aug 30 18:36:13 2022
    Il 30/08/2022 14:59, Chris Elvidge ha scritto:
    On 29/08/2022 15:52, Christian Weisgerber wrote:
    On 2022-08-29, Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> wrote:

    The eventual result of the legal process was that the
    copyrights were not included in the transfer from Novell to SCO.
    For details see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SCO_v._Novell

    Huh.  I guess this means that my

       The Santa Cruz Operation, Inc.
       Special Software License Agreement for Ancient UNIX Source Code
       ...
       1999

    is void?

    As well as the open-sourcing of Version 7 by Caldera in 2002, since
    they acquired the rights from SCO?


    SCO Group - as in spat over copyright - and Santa Cruz Operation were
    not the same people.
    I was using Santa Cruz Operation UNIX on an 80486 in (I suppose) early
    1990's



    I still keep a backup copy of the floppy installation disks (fd096ds15)
    of "Sco Unix 80386"... and their yellow cap with the "SCO" logo in blue.
    :-)

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