• Long layback seatpost

    From Ian Jackson@21:1/5 to All on Fri Dec 17 16:27:37 2021
    For a long time I have had trouble with my bike eating my trousers:

    https://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~ijackson/2021/seatpost/IMG_20211217_155517.jpg

    The last time, after it got through my trousers, it started to eat my
    leg. I'll spare you photos of that, but it was quite poor really.

    I looked more closely and found that, looking at my saddle from above,
    the saddle clamp protruded out from under the side of the saddle nose.
    The bad spot was just where the clamp was. The clamp was at the very
    front of the saddle rails.[1]

    So, I thought, well, if I could get a seatpost with more layback, I
    could move the clamp back on the rails. So I set about hunting for
    such a seatpost. I typed in suitable search terms.

    The dominant kind of hit was a webforum thread where someone says "I
    want a seatpost with lots of layback because I like my saddle far
    back", followed by endless know-it-alls telling the OP that that
    wasn't really what they wanted. Typically they would accuse (and yes,
    an accusation, not a suggestion) the OP of adhering to some "KOPS"
    doctrine and told the OP that KOPS was discredited and they should go
    and get a proper bike fitting or something.

    In some cases this kind of useless behaviour would persist even if the
    OP told the forum that they had tried having their saddle further
    forward, but it gave them knee pain or back pain or something. The know-it-alls were still sure that they knew better.

    The idea that people might have a personal comfort preference about
    where they had their saddle, or might have personal experience of what
    worked best for them, was anathema. I felt sure that if I posted even
    my holes-in-my-trousers story I would be told some pile of nonsense
    about how the problem was something else. Jeez.

    I did find some recommendations. But they were all startlingly
    expensive. And/or unavailable - if you're lucky you might get
    something from the 70s or 80s on ebay, but it's a crapshoot
    (especially wrt diameter). The most layback you could get at a normal
    kind of price for a modern post was about 25mm - and that was what I
    had already.

    I conjecture that seatposts with lots of layback have been deemed
    heretical by the mass market, so the only people who can get them are
    racing types who have actual physios and coaches and doctors and so on
    - who are perhaps collectively less put off by suggestions of heresy.

    I did discover that some heavy people with Brooks saddles found that
    the rails kept breaking, because if you clamp them right at the front
    of the rail to get the saddle where you want, your weight is
    cantilevered out backwards. SJSC sell a kind of aluminium extender
    seatpost clamp thing which would probably do nicely for that problem
    if the loads it imposes don't destroy your actual seatpost, but of
    course it wouldn't help with my problem.

    Eventually I thought "this is ridiculous, I will save money on
    trousers if I buy a stupidly expensive seatpost". So now I have an
    IRD Wayback. Imported at fearsome expense and with great delay from a
    US ebay seller using the ebay "global shipping programme". It fits
    nicely and by dint of careful measurement, and a spin round the block,
    I have set it up just the way I had the saddle before:

    https://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~ijackson/2021/seatpost/IMG_20211217_155347.jpg
    https://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~ijackson/2021/seatpost/IMG_20211217_155234.jpg
    https://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~ijackson/2021/seatpost/IMG_20211217_155243.jpg

    You can see that the rails are barely visible in the from-above photo.
    I guess they may still rub a bit. Not sure if, with trousers-with-holes-already-in, it will still make a hole in my leg,
    but I think at the very least with as-yet-unperforated trousers it
    should reduce the rate of wear considerably.


    [1] Weirdly, it only seems to do this on the left side. But this is
    probably something to do with my right foot being oddly crooked. I
    once had a specialist ski boot shop refuse to deal with me because my
    right foot it was too odd![2] In my clippy shoes I have some ad-hoc
    shims between the cleat and the shoe, to make the right cleat be at an
    angle.

    [2] Last time I went skiing the ski boot hire shop found me some boots
    which were so good I bought them. And yes I ski crooked - you can see
    in photos and videos quite clearly that my right knee is generally
    tilted noticeably inwards - but I have been skiing like this for years
    and my knees are fine. I just wanted boots that didn't need me to
    cover the entire surface of my feet in Compeed and/or give me a
    hairline fracture of the talus.
    --
    Ian Jackson <ijackson@chiark.greenend.org.uk> These opinions are my own.

    Pronouns: they/he. If I emailed you from @fyvzl.net or @evade.org.uk,
    that is a private address which bypasses my fierce spamfilter.

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  • From Rob Morley@21:1/5 to Ian Jackson on Fri Dec 24 02:08:33 2021
    On 17 Dec 2021 16:27:37 +0000 (GMT)
    Ian Jackson <ijackson@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:

    Eventually I thought "this is ridiculous, I will save money on
    trousers if I buy a stupidly expensive seatpost". So now I have an
    IRD Wayback. Imported at fearsome expense and with great delay from a
    US ebay seller using the ebay "global shipping programme". It fits
    nicely and by dint of careful measurement, and a spin round the block,
    I have set it up just the way I had the saddle before:

    https://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~ijackson/2021/seatpost/IMG_20211217_155347.jpg
    https://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~ijackson/2021/seatpost/IMG_20211217_155234.jpg

    That's like the SR seatpost that Dawes used to put on their "Ranger"
    mountain bike; it had a QR so you could adjust the layback on the fly!

    I too like a fairly laid back saddle, but product designers seem less enthusiastic.

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  • From Nick Maclaren@21:1/5 to ijackson@chiark.greenend.org.uk on Wed Jan 26 20:10:28 2022
    In article <9Gw*E6YBy@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>,
    Ian Jackson <ijackson@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
    For a long time I have had trouble with my bike eating my trousers:

    ...

    Colour me unsurprised. You probably remember how often I got flamed
    for such things. Also there were damn good ergonomic reasons for the traditional utility bicycles and roadsters having more relaxed angles
    and longer wheelbases than the road racers that pushed them out of the
    market. But those come with a cost in 'responsiveness', which is why
    they were damned.

    As far as skiing is concerned, I had salesmen refuse to sell me boots
    I could wear, swearing that ones TWO sizes too small were 'right'.
    Well, yes, they were the right LENGTH, but I have very wide feet indeed
    and balance entirely by touch and proprioreception, so cramping my
    feet means that I would simply fall over (ignoring the frostbite that
    can be caused by restricting circulation). I was very chuffed when I
    learnt to parallel ski at 64, though it took me five times as long as
    for most people and I was happy only on the easier red runs (at a
    massive speed up up to 15 MPH).


    Regards,
    Nick Maclaren.

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