(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
You're two days early.
You, or the world, might not make it.
On 30/12/2023 16:53, Max Demian wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).You're two days early.
27 days late, if following the liturgical year.
You, or the world, might not make it.
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
In message <jWGdnRWv7ubmzQ34nZ2dnZeNn_Vi4p2d@giganews.com>, Colin
Bignell <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> writes
On 30/12/2023 16:53, Max Demian wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).You're two days early.
27 days late, if following the liturgical year.
You, or the world, might not make it.
You have to count from somewhere.
I don't really see why religion should > have any more input. We already have gods in the days of the week!
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
On 30/12/2023 18:59, Tim Lamb wrote:
You have to count from somewhere.
April 6th
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII
and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
In article <umpq9s$1ccjg$1@dont-email.me>,
SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
Possibly, but it was really because Henry VIII could not get a divorce, the RC church did not allow it.
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
Colin Bignell <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> writes:
On 30/12/2023 18:59, Tim Lamb wrote:
You have to count from somewhere.
April 6th
Give us back our 11 days!
In article <umpq9s$1ccjg$1@dont-email.me>,
SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
Possibly, but it was really because Henry VIII could not get a divorce, the RC church did not allow it.
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the pagans?
On Sun, 31 Dec 2023 10:13:08 +1100, Colin Bignell <cpb@bignellremovethis.me.uk> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 21:00, charles wrote:
In article <umpq9s$1ccjg$1@dont-email.me>,
SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:Possibly, but it was really because Henry VIII could not get a
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
divorce, the
RC church did not allow it.
The head of the Church didn't allow it, which is why he made himself
the head of the Catholic Church in England.
It was his children who broke the Church of England away from
Catholicism.
That's not accurate with the dissolution of the monasterys.
In article <umpq9s$1ccjg$1@dont-email.me>,
SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
Possibly, but it was really because Henry VIII could not get a divorce, the RC church did not allow it.
In message <jWGdnRWv7ubmzQ34nZ2dnZeNn_Vi4p2d@giganews.com>, Colin
Bignell <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> writes
On 30/12/2023 16:53, Max Demian wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).You're two days early.
27 days late, if following the liturgical year.
You, or the world, might not make it.
You have to count from somewhere. I don't really see why religion should
have any more input. We already have gods in the days of the week!
On 30 Dec 2023 at 20:49:33 GMT, ""Alan J. Wylie"" <alan@wylie.me.uk> wrote:
Colin Bignell <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> writes:
On 30/12/2023 18:59, Tim Lamb wrote:
You have to count from somewhere.
April 6th
Give us back our 11 days!
Apparently, no one ever actually said that.
In article <umpq9s$1ccjg$1@dont-email.me>,
SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
Possibly, but it was really because Henry VIII could not get a divorce, the RC church did not allow it.
On 2023-12-30, SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
Peace to you all. Afaik, the christians of the East celebrate Xhimas on
7th january. Not sure of the Ethiopian Church, who surely have the
closest line of descent from Jesus. Anyone know.?
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the pagans?
Saturnalia became Christmas.
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the pagans?
On 30/12/2023 23:16, Colin Bignell wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the
pagans?
Saturnalia became Christmas.
Nope. Saturnalia was Roman. Not Pagan. Yule was the pagan midwinter
festival that became Christmas
Most Europeans did not honour Roman gods post the fall of the Empire.
On 30/12/2023 18:59, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message <jWGdnRWv7ubmzQ34nZ2dnZeNn_Vi4p2d@giganews.com>, Colin
Bignell <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> writes
On 30/12/2023 16:53, Max Demian wrote:You have to count from somewhere.
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).You're two days early.
27 days late, if following the liturgical year.
You, or the world, might not make it.
April 6th
I don't really see why religion should > have any more input. We
already have gods in the days of the week!
On 30/12/2023 22:38, Tim Streater wrote:
On 30 Dec 2023 at 20:49:33 GMT, ""Alan J. Wylie"" <alan@wylie.me.uk> wrote: >>"Claims of civil unrest and rioters demanding “Give us our eleven days” may have arisen through a misinterpretation of a contemporary painting
Colin Bignell <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> writes:
On 30/12/2023 18:59, Tim Lamb wrote:
You have to count from somewhere.
April 6th
Give us back our 11 days!
Apparently, no one ever actually said that.
by William Hogarth. His 1755 painting entitled: “An Election Entertainment” refers to the elections of 1754 and depicts a tavern
dinner organised by Whig candidates. A stolen Tory campaign banner with
the slogan, “Give us our Eleven Days” can be seen lower right (on the black banner on the floor under the seated gentleman’s foot). The Tories can be seen outside the window, demonstrating."
the European Christmas is merely Christianization of the pagan midwinter festival of Yule, which features the death of the old year and the birth
of the new. And celebrates evergreens and winter birds because they
represent life in darkness and death.
On 30 Dec 2023 at 19:16:09 GMT, "SteveW" <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
It was an early example of Brexit. For a suggested view of what would have happened had Henry VIII not become king, see "The Alteration", by Kingsley Amis.
The Catholics could be better Catholics if they sacked all the Cardinals, and the Curia (the Catholic equivalent of the EU Commission), and scrapped the Papacy, none of which are in any way necessary, and are just another example of the snouters we see and love in Brussels. Then you break up the Catholic church and thus have a national church in each country. Here, f'rinstance, they could merge with the Anglicans, and in eastern Europe, with the respective Orthodox arrangement.
On 30/12/2023 23:16, Colin Bignell wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:Nope. Saturnalia was Roman. Not Pagan. Yule was the pagan midwinter
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the
pagans?
Saturnalia became Christmas.
festival that became Christmas
Most Europeans did not honour Roman gods post the fall of the Empire.
On 30/12/2023 10:38 pm, Tim Streater wrote:
On 30 Dec 2023 at 19:16:09 GMT, "SteveW" <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote: >>
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
It was an early example of Brexit. For a suggested view of what would have >> happened had Henry VIII not become king, see "The Alteration", by Kingsley >> Amis.
The Catholics could be better Catholics if they sacked all the Cardinals, and
the Curia (the Catholic equivalent of the EU Commission), and scrapped the >> Papacy, none of which are in any way necessary, and are just another example >> of the snouters we see and love in Brussels. Then you break up the Catholic >> church and thus have a national church in each country. Here, f'rinstance, >> they could merge with the Anglicans, and in eastern Europe, with the
respective Orthodox arrangement.
Or: "How to justify the totally self-centred actions of Henry VIII and
the opportunism of the Lutherans in just a few random words".
I had an excellent christmas this year, that managed to avoid a single
carol service and the kings speech altogether.
On 30/12/2023 20:45, maus wrote:
On 2023-12-30, SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
Peace to you all. Afaik, the christians of the East celebrate Xhimas on
7th january. Not sure of the Ethiopian Church, who surely have the
closest line of descent from Jesus. Anyone know.?
Well its all bollocks anyway. Shepherds do not graze their flocks by
night at midwinter.
the European Christmas is merely Christianization of the pagan midwinter festival of Yule, which features the death of the old year and the birth
of the new. And celebrates evergreens and winter birds because they
represent life in darkness and death.
I had an excellent christmas this year, that managed to avoid a single
carol service and the kings speech altogether.
I am at heart a Pagan I fear.
On 31/12/2023 09:10, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
the European Christmas is merely Christianization of the pagan
midwinter festival of Yule, which features the death of the old year
and the birth of the new. And celebrates evergreens and winter birds
because they represent life in darkness and death.
We will soon be celebrating Easter with the Christian symbols of a
chocolate egg or chocolate bunny.
In article <umrbu9$1m0cb$12@dont-email.me>,
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 23:16, Colin Bignell wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:Nope. Saturnalia was Roman. Not Pagan. Yule was the pagan midwinter
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the
pagans?
Saturnalia became Christmas.
festival that became Christmas
Depends on your definition of pagan. I believe it means non-Christian, so
the Roman gods were pagan gods, too.
Most Europeans did not honour Roman gods post the fall of the Empire.
and so?
On 31/12/2023 09:10 am, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 30/12/2023 20:45, maus wrote:
On 2023-12-30, SteveW <steve@walker-family.me.uk> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
Peace to you all. Afaik, the christians of the East celebrate Xhimas on
7th january. Not sure of the Ethiopian Church, who surely have the
closest line of descent from Jesus. Anyone know.?
Well its all bollocks anyway. Shepherds do not graze their flocks by
night at midwinter.
The sheep still need to be watched, though... yes?
the European Christmas is merely Christianization of the pagan
midwinter festival of Yule, which features the death of the old year
and the birth of the new. And celebrates evergreens and winter birds
because they represent life in darkness and death.
If the pagans (never really sure what that word means, and whether/how
it's different from "heathen") hadn't adopted the Roman calendar, what
was it that defined midwinter as the end/start of two consecutive years?
What did humans do in the southern hemisphere? Start the year in what we would call July?
I had an excellent christmas this year, that managed to avoid a single
carol service and the kings speech altogether.
I am at heart a Pagan I fear.
I saw the King's Speech on YouTube, listening on 'phones so as not to
disturb others.
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:Yes.
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the pagans?
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
I think there are more.
Many early churches were build on pagan sacred spots. St Catherines
Mount, near Guildford is one such and st Marthas, nearby, are examples...
On 30/12/2023 18:59, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message <jWGdnRWv7ubmzQ34nZ2dnZeNn_Vi4p2d@giganews.com>, ColinAnd why not? All part of life's rich tapestry of utter nonsense, that we
Bignell <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> writes
On 30/12/2023 16:53, Max Demian wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).You're two days early.
27 days late, if following the liturgical year.
You, or the world, might not make it.
You have to count from somewhere. I don't really see why religion
should have any more input. We already have gods in the days of the week!
have simply got used to. Like the Labour party.
On 31/12/2023 09:04, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 30/12/2023 18:59, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message <jWGdnRWv7ubmzQ34nZ2dnZeNn_Vi4p2d@giganews.com>, ColinAnd why not? All part of life's rich tapestry of utter nonsense, that
Bignell <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> writes
On 30/12/2023 16:53, Max Demian wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).You're two days early.
27 days late, if following the liturgical year.
You, or the world, might not make it.
You have to count from somewhere. I don't really see why religion
should have any more input. We already have gods in the days of the
week!
we have simply got used to. Like the Labour party.
And 'reform'/UKIP never electing any MP's
On Sun, 31 Dec 2023 09:20:46 +0000, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:Yes.
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the pagans? >>>
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish
Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are
the main exceptions.
I think there are more.
Many early churches were build on pagan sacred spots. St Catherines
Mount, near Guildford is one such and st Marthas, nearby, are examples...
On 31/12/2023 09:04, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 30/12/2023 18:59, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message <jWGdnRWv7ubmzQ34nZ2dnZeNn_Vi4p2d@giganews.com>, ColinAnd why not? All part of life's rich tapestry of utter nonsense, that
Bignell <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> writes
On 30/12/2023 16:53, Max Demian wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).You're two days early.
27 days late, if following the liturgical year.
You, or the world, might not make it.
You have to count from somewhere. I don't really see why religion
should have any more input. We already have gods in the days of the
week!
we have simply got used to. Like the Labour party.
And 'reform'/UKIP never electing any MP's
On 31/12/2023 09:38, alan_m wrote:
On 31/12/2023 09:10, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
the European Christmas is merely Christianization of the pagan
midwinter festival of Yule, which features the death of the old year
and the birth of the new. And celebrates evergreens and winter birds
because they represent life in darkness and death.
We will soon be celebrating Easter with the Christian symbols of a
chocolate egg or chocolate bunny.
Easter is even named after a pagan fertility goddess. Eostre I think she
was called.
Got duck all to do with the crucifixion..
On 31 Dec 2023 at 11:11:42 GMT, "JNugent" <jnugent@mail.com> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 10:38 pm, Tim Streater wrote:
The Catholics could be better Catholics if they sacked all the Cardinals, and
the Curia (the Catholic equivalent of the EU Commission), and scrapped the >>> Papacy, none of which are in any way necessary, and are just another example
of the snouters we see and love in Brussels. Then you break up the Catholic >>> church and thus have a national church in each country. Here, f'rinstance, >>> they could merge with the Anglicans, and in eastern Europe, with the
respective Orthodox arrangement.
Or: "How to justify the totally self-centred actions of Henry VIII and
the opportunism of the Lutherans in just a few random words".
Sure Henry VIII was self-centred. But perhaps you imagine that the sale of indulgences and all the other iniquities of the Roman Church at the time should just have been put up with, and that Luther should have toed the line. Otherwise - off to the gulag with him!
My readings of books on the early Church paint a picture of disagreement (sometimes violent), conflict, and internecine hatred. I'm inclined to think that the Church was past its sell-by date even then.
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the
pagans?
Yes.
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish
Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are
the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
In message <jWGdnRWv7ubmzQ34nZ2dnZeNn_Vi4p2d@giganews.com>, Colin
Bignell <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> writes
On 30/12/2023 16:53, Max Demian wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).You're two days early.
27 days late, if following the liturgical year.
You, or the world, might not make it.
You have to count from somewhere. I don't really see why religion should
have any more input. We already have gods in the days of the week!
On 31/12/2023 11:59 am, Tim Streater wrote:
On 31 Dec 2023 at 11:11:42 GMT, "JNugent" <jnugent@mail.com> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 10:38 pm, Tim Streater wrote:
[ ... ]
The Catholics could be better Catholics if they sacked all the Cardinals, and
the Curia (the Catholic equivalent of the EU Commission), and scrapped the >>>> Papacy, none of which are in any way necessary, and are just another example
of the snouters we see and love in Brussels. Then you break up the Catholic
church and thus have a national church in each country. Here, f'rinstance, >>>> they could merge with the Anglicans, and in eastern Europe, with the
respective Orthodox arrangement.
Or: "How to justify the totally self-centred actions of Henry VIII and
the opportunism of the Lutherans in just a few random words".
Sure Henry VIII was self-centred. But perhaps you imagine that the sale of >> indulgences and all the other iniquities of the Roman Church at the time
should just have been put up with, and that Luther should have toed the line.
Otherwise - off to the gulag with him!
Or the stake, perhaps.
My readings of books on the early Church paint a picture of disagreement
(sometimes violent), conflict, and internecine hatred. I'm inclined to think >> that the Church was past its sell-by date even then.
It's amazing that it has managed to survive the intervening nearly five centuries.
On 31/12/2023 01:55 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the
pagans?
Yes.
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish
Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are
the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
In *English* (basically a germanic language), that is certainly so.
But in French (le Pques), Italian (Pasqua), Spanish (Pascua de >Resurreccin), Portuguese (Pscoa), Romanian (Pa?ti), Greek (?????) and
even Russian (?????)...?
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:
On Sun, 31 Dec 2023 09:20:46 +0000, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:Yes.
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the pagans? >>>>
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish
Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are
the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
I think there are more.
Many early churches were build on pagan sacred spots. St Catherines
Mount, near Guildford is one such and st Marthas, nearby, are examples...
On 31 Dec 2023 at 17:24:44 GMT, "JNugent" <jnugent@mail.com> wrote:
On 31/12/2023 11:59 am, Tim Streater wrote:
On 31 Dec 2023 at 11:11:42 GMT, "JNugent" <jnugent@mail.com> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 10:38 pm, Tim Streater wrote:
[ ... ]
The Catholics could be better Catholics if they sacked all the Cardinals, and
the Curia (the Catholic equivalent of the EU Commission), and scrapped the
Papacy, none of which are in any way necessary, and are just another example
of the snouters we see and love in Brussels. Then you break up the Catholic
church and thus have a national church in each country. Here, f'rinstance,
they could merge with the Anglicans, and in eastern Europe, with the >>>>> respective Orthodox arrangement.
Or: "How to justify the totally self-centred actions of Henry VIII and >>>> the opportunism of the Lutherans in just a few random words".
Sure Henry VIII was self-centred. But perhaps you imagine that the sale of >>> indulgences and all the other iniquities of the Roman Church at the time >>> should just have been put up with, and that Luther should have toed the line.
Otherwise - off to the gulag with him!
Or the stake, perhaps.
Catholic Church plus Inquisition, plus auto da fe, not much different from Stalin.
My readings of books on the early Church paint a picture of disagreement >>> (sometimes violent), conflict, and internecine hatred. I'm inclined to think
that the Church was past its sell-by date even then.
It's amazing that it has managed to survive the intervening nearly five
centuries.
ITYM 15 centuries.
By "early church", I meant the church in the first 500
years or so AD. That is what any book about "the early Christian church" will be talking about.
On 31/12/2023 06:37 pm, Tim Streater wrote:
On 31 Dec 2023 at 17:24:44 GMT, "JNugent" <jnugent@mail.com> wrote:The punishment for heresy was well-known. Ignorance would have been no defence. One has to remember that in a devout society, the threat of damnation for one's loved ones if infected by perceived heresy was taken extremely seriously. This was the major reason for the militant
On 31/12/2023 11:59 am, Tim Streater wrote:
On 31 Dec 2023 at 11:11:42 GMT, "JNugent" <jnugent@mail.com> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 10:38 pm, Tim Streater wrote:
[ ... ]
The Catholics could be better Catholics if they sacked all the Cardinals, and
the Curia (the Catholic equivalent of the EU Commission), and scrapped the
Papacy, none of which are in any way necessary, and are just another example
of the snouters we see and love in Brussels. Then you break up the Catholic
church and thus have a national church in each country. Here, f'rinstance,
they could merge with the Anglicans, and in eastern Europe, with the >>>>>> respective Orthodox arrangement.
Or: "How to justify the totally self-centred actions of Henry VIII and >>>>> the opportunism of the Lutherans in just a few random words".
Sure Henry VIII was self-centred. But perhaps you imagine that the sale of >>>> indulgences and all the other iniquities of the Roman Church at the time >>>> should just have been put up with, and that Luther should have toed the line.
Otherwise - off to the gulag with him!
Or the stake, perhaps.
Catholic Church plus Inquisition, plus auto da fe, not much different from >> Stalin.
opposition to heresy and heretics.
Stalin certainly shared the militancy, if not the devoutness.
My readings of books on the early Church paint a picture of disagreement >>>> (sometimes violent), conflict, and internecine hatred. I'm inclined to think
that the Church was past its sell-by date even then.
It's amazing that it has managed to survive the intervening nearly five
centuries.
ITYM 15 centuries.
It isn't five centuries since the English "Reformation".
By "early church", I meant the church in the first 500
years or so AD. That is what any book about "the early Christian church" will
be talking about.
The thread was centred upon Henry VIII and his kleptomania.
In any case, whilst there has been an identifiable Pope ever since
Apostolic times, had the Church evolved by 533 AD (just a century after
the fall of Imperial Rome) to include a college of Cardinals, the Curia,
etc? I suggest not.
In any case, whilst there has been an identifiable Pope ever since
Apostolic times,
On 31/12/2023 01:55 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:This is an English newsgroup dedicated to English people
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the
pagans?
Yes.
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish
Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are
the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
In *English* (basically a germanic language), that is certainly so.
On Sun, 31 Dec 2023 13:55:25 +0000, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:Indubitably. But we were talking about the dates of the celebrations,
On Sun, 31 Dec 2023 09:20:46 +0000, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:Yes.
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the pagans? >>>>>
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish
Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are
the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
not the names. LRN2RD.
the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are
the main exceptions.
I think there are more.
Many early churches were build on pagan sacred spots. St Catherines
Mount, near Guildford is one such and st Marthas, nearby, are examples...
On 31/12/2023 17:32, JNugent wrote:
On 31/12/2023 01:55 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the
pagans?
Yes.
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish
Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are
the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
In *English* (basically a germanic language), that is certainly so.This is an English newsgroup dedicated to English people
On 31/12/2023 19:18, Custos Custodum wrote:
On Sun, 31 Dec 2023 13:55:25 +0000, The Natural PhilosopherNo, we were not.
<tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:Indubitably. But we were talking about the dates of the celebrations,
On Sun, 31 Dec 2023 09:20:46 +0000, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:Yes.
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the pagans?
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish
Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are
the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
not the names. LRN2RD.
Yes.
In article <umuciu$277ko$3@dont-email.me>,
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 31/12/2023 17:32, JNugent wrote:
On 31/12/2023 01:55 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:This is an English newsgroup dedicated to English people
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the >>>>>>> pagans?
Yes.
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish
Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are
the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
In *English* (basically a germanic language), that is certainly so.
the .uk would imply Scots, Welsh & N Irish as well.
On 01/01/2024 13:45, charles wrote:
In article <umuciu$277ko$3@dont-email.me>,Well they are just English people with chips on their shoulders
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 31/12/2023 17:32, JNugent wrote:
On 31/12/2023 01:55 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:This is an English newsgroup dedicated to English people
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the >>>>>>>> pagans?
Yes.
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish
Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are >>>>>> the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
In *English* (basically a germanic language), that is certainly so.
the .uk would imply Scots, Welsh & N Irish as well.
On 2023-12-31, JNugent <jnugent@mail.com> wrote:
In any case, whilst there has been an identifiable Pope ever since
Apostolic times,
Indeed - sometimes more than one at the same time!
https://www.christian-history.org/western-great-schism.html
On 31/12/2023 17:32, JNugent wrote:
On 31/12/2023 01:55 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the
pagans?
Yes.
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish
Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are
the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
In *English* (basically a germanic language), that is certainly so.
This is an English newsgroup dedicated to English people
On 31/12/2023 13:23, Andrew wrote:
On 31/12/2023 09:04, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 30/12/2023 18:59, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message <jWGdnRWv7ubmzQ34nZ2dnZeNn_Vi4p2d@giganews.com>, ColinAnd why not? All part of life's rich tapestry of utter nonsense, that
Bignell <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> writes
On 30/12/2023 16:53, Max Demian wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).You're two days early.
27 days late, if following the liturgical year.
You, or the world, might not make it.
You have to count from somewhere. I don't really see why religion
should have any more input. We already have gods in the days of the
week!
we have simply got used to. Like the Labour party.
And 'reform'/UKIP never electing any MP's
UKIP elected a LOT of MEPS though.
More than any other party.
Reform is not Ukip.
Ukip is now a spent force.
On 31/12/2023 13:23, Andrew wrote:
On 31/12/2023 09:04, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 30/12/2023 18:59, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message <jWGdnRWv7ubmzQ34nZ2dnZeNn_Vi4p2d@giganews.com>, ColinAnd why not? All part of life's rich tapestry of utter nonsense, that
Bignell <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> writes
On 30/12/2023 16:53, Max Demian wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).You're two days early.
27 days late, if following the liturgical year.
You, or the world, might not make it.
You have to count from somewhere. I don't really see why religion
should have any more input. We already have gods in the days of the
week!
we have simply got used to. Like the Labour party.
And 'reform'/UKIP never electing any MP's
UKIP is dead. Long live Brexit.
On 01/01/2024 12:52 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/12/2023 17:32, JNugent wrote:
On 31/12/2023 01:55 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the >>>>>>> pagans?
Yes.
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish
Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are
the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
In *English* (basically a germanic language), that is certainly so.
This is an English newsgroup dedicated to English people
True (but did you mean "British"?).
But treating the English word for the feast of the Resurrection as a
global phenomenon is an error.
On Mon, 1 Jan 2024 14:42:34 +0000, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 01/01/2024 13:45, charles wrote:
In article <umuciu$277ko$3@dont-email.me>,Well they are just English people with chips on their shoulders
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 31/12/2023 17:32, JNugent wrote:
On 31/12/2023 01:55 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:This is an English newsgroup dedicated to English people
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics). >>>>>>The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the >>>>>>>>> pagans?
Yes.
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish
Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are >>>>>>> the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
In *English* (basically a germanic language), that is certainly so.
the .uk would imply Scots, Welsh & N Irish as well.
Pòg mo thòin. Some of our ancestors were here long before the Saxon Johnny-come-latelys arrived.
Bliadhna mhath ùr. (HNY)
On 31/12/2023 13:56, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/12/2023 13:23, Andrew wrote:With turnouts down to and sometimes less than 15%. Only
On 31/12/2023 09:04, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 30/12/2023 18:59, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message <jWGdnRWv7ubmzQ34nZ2dnZeNn_Vi4p2d@giganews.com>, ColinAnd why not? All part of life's rich tapestry of utter nonsense,
Bignell <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> writes
On 30/12/2023 16:53, Max Demian wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics). >>>>>>> You're two days early.
27 days late, if following the liturgical year.
You, or the world, might not make it.
You have to count from somewhere. I don't really see why religion
should have any more input. We already have gods in the days of the
week!
that we have simply got used to. Like the Labour party.
And 'reform'/UKIP never electing any MP's
UKIP elected a LOT of MEPS though.
More than any other party.
the UKIP planks bothered to vote in the EU elections,
most people simply couldn't be arsed.
Reform is not Ukip.
Oh yes it is !. The *same* bunch of geriatric losers
are the only people who support them.
On 01/01/2024 16:29, Custos Custodum wrote:
On Mon, 1 Jan 2024 14:42:34 +0000, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 01/01/2024 13:45, charles wrote:
In article <umuciu$277ko$3@dont-email.me>,Well they are just English people with chips on their shoulders
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 31/12/2023 17:32, JNugent wrote:
On 31/12/2023 01:55 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics). >>>>>>>The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the >>>>>>>>>> pagans?
Yes.
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish >>>>>>>> Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is >>>>>>>> cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are >>>>>>>> the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
In *English* (basically a germanic language), that is certainly so. >>>>> This is an English newsgroup dedicated to English people
the .uk would imply Scots, Welsh & N Irish as well.
Pg mo thin. Some of our ancestors were here long before the Saxon
Johnny-come-latelys arrived.
Bliadhna mhath r. (HNY)
Indeed. Queen Boudicca. Still English
On 01/01/2024 16:43, JNugent wrote:
On 01/01/2024 12:52 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/12/2023 17:32, JNugent wrote:
On 31/12/2023 01:55 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from
the pagans?
Yes.
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish
Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is
cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are >>>>>> the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
In *English* (basically a germanic language), that is certainly so.
This is an English newsgroup dedicated to English people
True (but did you mean "British"?).
But treating the English word for the feast of the Resurrection as a
global phenomenon is an error.
Then why did you do it?
On 31/12/2023 11:16, JNugent wrote:
The sheep still need to be watched, though... yes?
Not really, unless the sheep are lambing or being moved to a different pasture they are pretty much left to themselves (with the possible
addition of some sheep dogs [those that protect the flock from wolves
rather than those used to herd them]).
On 01/01/2024 07:49 pm, soup wrote:Why would that matter?
On 31/12/2023 11:16, JNugent wrote:
The sheep still need to be watched, though... yes?
Not really, unless the sheep are lambing or being moved to a different
pasture they are pretty much left to themselves (with the possible
addition of some sheep dogs [those that protect the flock from wolves
rather than those used to herd them]).
But 2,000 years ago...?
On 01/01/2024 19:52, JNugent wrote:
On 01/01/2024 07:49 pm, soup wrote:Why would that matter?
On 31/12/2023 11:16, JNugent wrote:
The sheep still need to be watched, though... yes?
Not really, unless the sheep are lambing or being moved to a
different pasture they are pretty much left to themselves (with the
possible addition of some sheep dogs [those that protect the flock
from wolves rather than those used to herd them]).
But 2,000 years ago...?
WTF was stonehenge FOR after all?
The sheep still need to be watched, though... yes?
Indeed. Queen Boudicca. Still English
Boudicca was a Brythonic (i.e., Celtic) queen of the 1st century AD.
The Angles and Saxons didn't arrive in numbers until the Romans left
in the 5th century. Please stop digging - it's embarrassing.
Building, even of mere dry-stone walls, would have been a high order
expense. Whether sheep-herders could afford all of the wall mileage
required for the various pens required from time to time in order to
be able to leave a flock unattended is an imponderable.
On 01/01/2024 07:53 pm, soup wrote:
On 01/01/2024 19:52, JNugent wrote:
On 01/01/2024 07:49 pm, soup wrote:Why would that matter?
On 31/12/2023 11:16, JNugent wrote:
The sheep still need to be watched, though... yes?
Not really, unless the sheep are lambing or being moved to a
different pasture they are pretty much left to themselves (with the
possible addition of some sheep dogs [those that protect the flock
from wolves rather than those used to herd them]).
But 2,000 years ago...?
Building, even of mere dry-stone walls, would have been a high order
expense. Whether sheep-herders could afford all of the wall mileage
required for the various pens required from time to time in order to be
able to leave a flock unattended is an imponderable.
On Mon, 1 Jan 2024 20:09:53 +0000, JNugent <jnugent@mail.com> wrote:
On 01/01/2024 07:53 pm, soup wrote:
On 01/01/2024 19:52, JNugent wrote:
On 01/01/2024 07:49 pm, soup wrote:Why would that matter?
On 31/12/2023 11:16, JNugent wrote:
The sheep still need to be watched, though... yes?
Not really, unless the sheep are lambing or being moved to a
different pasture they are pretty much left to themselves (with the
possible addition of some sheep dogs [those that protect the flock
from wolves rather than those used to herd them]).
But 2,000 years ago...?
Building, even of mere dry-stone walls, would have been a high order
expense. Whether sheep-herders could afford all of the wall mileage
required for the various pens required from time to time in order to be
able to leave a flock unattended is an imponderable.
In the north of Scotland, and probably in places like Yorkshire, etc.,
sheep are free to roam the hills unsupervised. They are gathered and
brought in for activities such as dosing, dipping and clipping. They
are only kept in fields at lambing time, when they might need
assistance and new lambs will need protection from predators, or prior
to being shipped off to market.
JNugent <jnugent@mail.com> writes:
Building, even of mere dry-stone walls, would have been a high order
expense. Whether sheep-herders could afford all of the wall mileage
required for the various pens required from time to time in order to
be able to leave a flock unattended is an imponderable.
http://lakesworldheritage.co.uk/blog/2020/april/02/what-is-hefting/
"Hefting is the basis for shepherding on unenclosed mountain and
moorland in the British Isles. This uses the homing and herding
instincts of hill sheep making it possible for individual flocks owned
by different farmers to graze ‘open’ fells with no physical barriers between them"
On Mon, 1 Jan 2024 18:46:15 +0000, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 01/01/2024 16:29, Custos Custodum wrote:
On Mon, 1 Jan 2024 14:42:34 +0000, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 01/01/2024 13:45, charles wrote:
In article <umuciu$277ko$3@dont-email.me>,Well they are just English people with chips on their shoulders
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 31/12/2023 17:32, JNugent wrote:
On 31/12/2023 01:55 pm, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/12/2023 12:19, Custos Custodum wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
On 30/12/2023 22:11, alan_m wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics). >>>>>>>>The modern churches just pinched the dates for festivals from the >>>>>>>>>>> pagans?
Yes.
Winter Solstice (Midwinter / Yule)
Imbolc (Candlemas)
Spring Equinox (Ostara)
Beltane (May Eve)
Summer Solstice (Midsummer / Litha)
Lughnasadh (Lammas)
Autumn Equinox (Mabon)
Not Easter, the timing of which is closely linked to the Jewish >>>>>>>>> Passover. In most European languages, the word for "Easter " is >>>>>>>>> cognate with the Hebrew "Pesach" (Passover). English and German are >>>>>>>>> the main exceptions.
Bullshit. Easter is from Eostre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eostre
In *English* (basically a germanic language), that is certainly so. >>>>>> This is an English newsgroup dedicated to English people
the .uk would imply Scots, Welsh & N Irish as well.
Pòg mo thòin. Some of our ancestors were here long before the Saxon
Johnny-come-latelys arrived.
Bliadhna mhath ùr. (HNY)
Indeed. Queen Boudicca. Still English
Boudicca was a Brythonic (i.e., Celtic) queen of the 1st century AD.
The Angles and Saxons didn't arrive in numbers until the Romans left
in the 5th century. Please stop digging - it's embarrassing.
On 01/01/2024 11:29 am, Jim Jackson wrote:
On 2023-12-31, JNugent <jnugent@mail.com> wrote:
In any case, whilst there has been an identifiable Pope ever since
Apostolic times,
Indeed - sometimes more than one at the same time!
https://www.christian-history.org/western-great-schism.html
True enough.
We humans are full of faults. Religion is one of the ways in which we
try to overcome that.
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics).
Too early.
As for Anglicans being bad Catholics - they followed the reforms of
Henry VIII and a big part of the reformation was to get rid of the
excesses, the indulgences and the misused power of the Roman Catholic
church. So you could perhaps say that Anglicans are the "better"
Catholics :)
On 31/12/2023 14:11, Fredxx wrote:
On 31/12/2023 13:23, Andrew wrote:
On 31/12/2023 09:04, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 30/12/2023 18:59, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message <jWGdnRWv7ubmzQ34nZ2dnZeNn_Vi4p2d@giganews.com>, ColinAnd why not? All part of life's rich tapestry of utter nonsense,
Bignell <cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> writes
On 30/12/2023 16:53, Max Demian wrote:
On 30/12/2023 16:42, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
(That includes Anglicans, because they are just bad Catholics). >>>>>>> You're two days early.
27 days late, if following the liturgical year.
You, or the world, might not make it.
You have to count from somewhere. I don't really see why religion
should have any more input. We already have gods in the days of the
week!
that we have simply got used to. Like the Labour party.
And 'reform'/UKIP never electing any MP's
UKIP is dead. Long live Brexit.
Huge numbers of UKIP supporters or who voted Brexit *are* now dead
since 2016 !
On 31/12/2023 12:17, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
WTF was stonehenge FOR after all?
Answer that (provably) and there is a Nobel prize waiting for you.
On 01/01/2024 19:51, soup wrote:
On 31/12/2023 12:17, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
WTF was stonehenge FOR after all?
Answer that (provably) and there is a Nobel prize waiting for you.
No as there isn't one for archaeology (or anything similar).
Don't be silly. We are all descended from the same people. What we are
called today is English
Unless you are some kind of racist
In message <umvhui$2c854$2@dont-email.me>, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
Don't be silly. We are all descended from the same people. What we areAccording to my DNA, I'm 1% Ashkenazi Jewish . I checked my schmeckle ,
called today is English
Unless you are some kind of racist
it's not that bit.
Brian
On 04/01/2024 10:41, brian wrote:
In message <umvhui$2c854$2@dont-email.me>, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
Don't be silly. We are all descended from the same people. What weAccording to my DNA, I'm 1% Ashkenazi Jewish . I checked my schmeckle
are called today is English
Unless you are some kind of racist
, it's not that bit.
Brian
Well there you go then. According to DNA homo sap. was down to a few hundred people once, and we are all descended from them.
On 04/01/2024 11:24, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 04/01/2024 10:41, brian wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
Don't be silly. We are all descended from the same people. What we
are called today is English
Unless you are some kind of racist
According to my DNA, I'm 1% Ashkenazi Jewish . I checked my schmeckle
, it's not that bit.
Brian
Well there you go then. According to DNA homo sap. was down to a few
hundred people once, and we are all descended from them.
The scientific community suggest 1,280, so only an order of magnitude out.
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abq7487
Caused by climate change. Perhaps we should take this more seriously
rather than placing our head in the sand singing La La La.
In message <umvhui$2c854$2@dont-email.me>, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
Don't be silly. We are all descended from the same people. What we areAccording to my DNA, I'm 1% Ashkenazi Jewish . I checked my schmeckle ,
called today is English
Unless you are some kind of racist
it's not that bit.
Brian
On 04/01/2024 01:49 pm, Fredxx wrote:
On 04/01/2024 11:24, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 04/01/2024 10:41, brian wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
Don't be silly. We are all descended from the same people. What we
are called today is English
Unless you are some kind of racist
According to my DNA, I'm 1% Ashkenazi Jewish . I checked my
schmeckle , it's not that bit.
Brian
Well there you go then. According to DNA homo sap. was down to a few
hundred people once, and we are all descended from them.
The scientific community suggest 1,280, so only an order of magnitude
out.
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abq7487
Thinking back, I'm reasonably sure that I never encountered the term
"order of magnitude" in education, whether primary, secondary or higher
(I was an arts person). But in recent decades, I have seen it used many
times in discussion and argument.
Today, I decided to ascertain the correct meaning of the phrase (which
is clearly a term of art with a specific definition).
It seems that item B is an order of magnitude larger then item B if and
only if item B is at least ten times the value / size / measurement of
item A.
So... what does "a few hundred" mean?
Obviously, "a few" has to be greater in value than "a couple". In this context, it is used of discrete, countable items (people). Its value therefore has to be expressed as a whole number. So... it has to be at
least three, yes?
What is 300 (minimum value for "a few hundred people") multiplied by 10?
Is it greater or smaller than 1,280?
If greater, then the necessary characteristic for the numbers to be
described as being an order of magnitude apart is not present.
I am grateful to you for prompting me (at last) to check the meaning of
that phrase. We all can learn something every day.
Caused by climate change. Perhaps we should take this more seriously
rather than placing our head in the sand singing La La La.
Am 04/01/2024 um 10:41 schrieb brian:
In message <umvhui$2c854$2@dont-email.me>, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
Don't be silly. We are all descended from the same people. What weAccording to my DNA, I'm 1% Ashkenazi Jewish . I checked my schmeckle
are called today is English
Unless you are some kind of racist
, it's not that bit.
Brian
I did a DNA test and apparently I'm related to God from my mother's side.
On 04/01/2024 14:06, JNugent wrote:
On 04/01/2024 01:49 pm, Fredxx wrote:
On 04/01/2024 11:24, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 04/01/2024 10:41, brian wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
Don't be silly. We are all descended from the same people. What we >>>>>> are called today is English
Unless you are some kind of racist
According to my DNA, I'm 1% Ashkenazi Jewish . I checked my
schmeckle , it's not that bit.
Brian
Well there you go then. According to DNA homo sap. was down to a
few hundred people once, and we are all descended from them.
The scientific community suggest 1,280, so only an order of magnitude
out.
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abq7487
Thinking back, I'm reasonably sure that I never encountered the term
"order of magnitude" in education, whether primary, secondary or
higher (I was an arts person). But in recent decades, I have seen it
used many times in discussion and argument.
Today, I decided to ascertain the correct meaning of the phrase (which
is clearly a term of art with a specific definition).
It seems that item B is an order of magnitude larger then item B if
and only if item B is at least ten times the value / size /
measurement of item A.
So... what does "a few hundred" mean?
Obviously, "a few" has to be greater in value than "a couple". In this
context, it is used of discrete, countable items (people). Its value
therefore has to be expressed as a whole number. So... it has to be at
least three, yes?
What is 300 (minimum value for "a few hundred people") multiplied by
10? Is it greater or smaller than 1,280?
If greater, then the necessary characteristic for the numbers to be
described as being an order of magnitude apart is not present.
I am grateful to you for prompting me (at last) to check the meaning
of that phrase. We all can learn something every day.
Pleasure, I admit I was stretching the definition, but the need to add
an extra nought was sufficient.
It's shameful that TNP can never back up his claims by citing an
independent source.
Caused by climate change. Perhaps we should take this more seriously
rather than placing our head in the sand singing La La La.
On 04/01/2024 01:49 pm, Fredxx wrote:
On 04/01/2024 11:24, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 04/01/2024 10:41, brian wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
Don't be silly. We are all descended from the same people. What we
are called today is English
Unless you are some kind of racist
According to my DNA, I'm 1% Ashkenazi Jewish . I checked my
schmeckle , it's not that bit.
Brian
Well there you go then. According to DNA homo sap. was down to a few
hundred people once, and we are all descended from them.
The scientific community suggest 1,280, so only an order of magnitude
out.
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abq7487
Thinking back, I'm reasonably sure that I never encountered the term
"order of magnitude" in education, whether primary, secondary or higher
(I was an arts person). But in recent decades, I have seen it used many
times in discussion and argument.
Today, I decided to ascertain the correct meaning of the phrase (which
is clearly a term of art with a specific definition).
It seems that item B is an order of magnitude larger then item B if and
only if item B is at least ten times the value / size / measurement of
item A.
So... what does "a few hundred" mean?
Obviously, "a few" has to be greater in value than "a couple". In this context, it is used of discrete, countable items (people). Its value therefore has to be expressed as a whole number. So... it has to be at
least three, yes?
What is 300 (minimum value for "a few hundred people") multiplied by 10?
Is it greater or smaller than 1,280?
If greater, then the necessary characteristic for the numbers to be
described as being an order of magnitude apart is not present.
I am grateful to you for prompting me (at last) to check the meaning of
that phrase. We all can learn something every day.
Caused by climate change. Perhaps we should take this more seriously
rather than placing our head in the sand singing La La La.
On 04/01/2024 14:06, JNugent wrote:
On 04/01/2024 01:49 pm, Fredxx wrote:Er no. a few hundred peole is fairly close to 1280. It is in fact 12.8 hundred people. Covered well by 'a few'
On 04/01/2024 11:24, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 04/01/2024 10:41, brian wrote:
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
Don't be silly. We are all descended from the same people. What we >>>>>> are called today is English
Unless you are some kind of racist
According to my DNA, I'm 1% Ashkenazi Jewish . I checked my
schmeckle , it's not that bit.
Brian
Well there you go then. According to DNA homo sap. was down to a
few hundred people once, and we are all descended from them.
The scientific community suggest 1,280, so only an order of magnitude
out.
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abq7487
Thinking back, I'm reasonably sure that I never encountered the termI think I heard it the moment I started doing any science at all.
"order of magnitude" in education, whether primary, secondary or
higher (I was an arts person). But in recent decades, I have seen it
used many times in discussion and argument.
Today, I decided to ascertain the correct meaning of the phrase (whichWell exactly.
is clearly a term of art with a specific definition).
It seems that item B is an order of magnitude larger then item B if
and only if item B is at least ten times the value / size /
measurement of item A.
So... what does "a few hundred" mean?
Certainly more than one hundred, certainly less than one hundred hundred.
Obviously, "a few" has to be greater in value than "a couple". In this
context, it is used of discrete, countable items (people). Its value
therefore has to be expressed as a whole number. So... it has to be at
least three, yes?
What is 300 (minimum value for "a few hundred people") multiplied by
10? Is it greater or smaller than 1,280?
If greater, then the necessary characteristic for the numbers to be
described as being an order of magnitude apart is not present.
I am grateful to you for prompting me (at last) to check the meaning
of that phrase. We all can learn something every day.
Caused by climate change. Perhaps we should take this more seriously
rather than placing our head in the sand singing La La La.
Well lookee here. it's all 'caused bu climate change' for him!.
Strangely however, not by human induced climate change. Which rather
gives the lie to 'its all man made' ...
Never let facts get in the way of a good bit of ad hominen attack.
Today, I decided to ascertain the correct meaning of the phrase (which
is clearly a term of art with a specific definition).
It seems that item B is an order of magnitude larger than item A if and
only if item B is at least ten times the value / size / measurement of
item A.
So... what does "a few hundred" mean?
Obviously, "a few" has to be greater in value than "a couple". In this context, it is used of discrete, countable items (people). Its value therefore has to be expressed as a whole number. So... it has to be at
least three, yes?
What is 300 (minimum value for "a few hundred people") multiplied by 10?
Is it greater or smaller than 1,280?
If greater, then the necessary characteristic for the numbers to be
described as being an order of magnitude apart is not present.
Caused by climate change. Perhaps we should take this more seriously
rather than placing our head in the sand singing La La La.
Well lookee here. it's all 'caused by climate change' for him!.
Strangely however, not by human induced climate change. Which rather
gives the lie to 'its all man made' ...
Quite, so we should be more concerned, not less.
Climate change, IOW, is going to happen whether there are humans about or not.This is the real issue we *ought* to be addressing. We are not
And the glaciers will be back soon.
Am 04/01/2024 um 10:41 schrieb brian:
In message <umvhui$2c854$2@dont-email.me>, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
Don't be silly. We are all descended from the same people. What weAccording to my DNA, I'm 1% Ashkenazi Jewish . I checked my schmeckle
are called today is English
Unless you are some kind of racist
, it's not that bit.
Brian
I did a DNA test and apparently I'm related to God from my mother's side.
On 04/01/2024 14:11, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
Am 04/01/2024 um 10:41 schrieb brian:
In message <umvhui$2c854$2@dont-email.me>, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
Don't be silly. We are all descended from the same people. What weAccording to my DNA, I'm 1% Ashkenazi Jewish . I checked my schmeckle
are called today is English
Unless you are some kind of racist
, it's not that bit.
Brian
I did a DNA test and apparently I'm related to God from my mother's side.
Are you now claiming Jesus was married to Mary Magdalene and had
children? I suppose that's more likely that your claim that bendy
bananas are banned in the EU.
On 04/01/2024 14:11, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
Am 04/01/2024 um 10:41 schrieb brian:
In message <umvhui$2c854$2@dont-email.me>, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
Don't be silly. We are all descended from the same people. What weAccording to my DNA, I'm 1% Ashkenazi Jewish . I checked my schmeckle
are called today is English
Unless you are some kind of racist
, it's not that bit.
Brian
I did a DNA test and apparently I'm related to God from my mother's side.
There is growing evidence that if you take multi DNA tests carried out
by the companies that advertise the service to the public for a fee then
you are likely to get multiple different results.
Take another test and you may find that you are related to Satan, or a
fruit fly.
On 04/01/2024 14:11, Ottavio Caruso wrote:
Am 04/01/2024 um 10:41 schrieb brian:
In message <umvhui$2c854$2@dont-email.me>, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
Don't be silly. We are all descended from the same people. What weAccording to my DNA, I'm 1% Ashkenazi Jewish . I checked my schmeckle
are called today is English
Unless you are some kind of racist
, it's not that bit.
Brian
I did a DNA test and apparently I'm related to God from my mother's side.
There is growing evidence that if you take multi DNA tests carried out
by the companies that advertise the service to the public for a fee then
you are likely to get multiple different results.
Take another test and you may find that you are related to Satan, or a
fruit fly.
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