Michael Davison
Lives in Israel (1969present)Feb 5
Why is Israel such a technologically innovative nation, and why haven't
other nations in the Arab world and beyond -- been able to replicate
their success?
The OP may not like my answer and Im sure that many readers wont either.
For the Arab world, the real underlying problem is Islam itself. Any
religion that rejects all questions, doubts and reservations is not a
fertile garden for original thought and innovation. Islam is not only a >religion, but a political system as well we can see what happens when >national leaders are also the religious leaders of that country
throughout history.
------
Lee Hodson
October 10
There was an Islamic Golden Age. For a while, the Islamic World was at
the forefront of science, technology, agriculture, medicine, philosophy
and innovation. To blame Islam for problems created by frightened,
insecure authoritarian people who chose to use Islam to hinder the
Islamic world would be like saying the modern Western World is dying
because of Christianity or Catholicism. The truth is different.
The truth is that civilizations become too forgiving of bad ideas and
too ashamed of their own history for their own good.
Islam is not innately bad. It was co-opted and corrupted by false
followers who viewed Islam as their path to power over people. This is
true of Western democracy. As said many times before: societies do not
die because of the outside world, they die from within; outsiders finish
the job when they scavenge the carcass.
Im not Muslim. Many evils have been done in the name of Islam. Even so,
I cant let you blame Islam for problems caused by man and woman.
For the most part, most people just want to live their lives in peace, >unwatched and unhindered. People in the Muslim world are no different to >people in other human worlds.
------
Michael Davison
October 14
The so-called Golden Age of Islam did not include equality for
non-Muslims (dhimmi). In fact their rights were severely abbreviated and
they were often required to pay a tax (Jizya) for the privilege of
being allowed to breathe Islamic air.
The idea that For the most part, most people just want to live their
lives in peace, unwatched and unhindered. People in the Muslim world are
no different to people in other human worlds hints that you may have >---------
On Wed, 17 Nov 2021 14:28:57 -0800, a425couple
<a425couple@hotmail.com> wrote:
Michael Davison
Lives in Israel (1969–present)Feb 5
Why is Israel such a technologically innovative nation, and why haven't
other nations in the Arab world and beyond -- been able to replicate
their success?
The OP may not like my answer and I’m sure that many readers won’t either.
For the Arab world, the real underlying problem is Islam itself. Any
religion that rejects all questions, doubts and reservations is not a
fertile garden for original thought and innovation. Islam is not only a
religion, but a political system as well… we can see what happens when
national leaders are also the religious leaders of that country
throughout history.
iI'm assuming you copied and pasted this
from an unattributed web
forum somewhere and while it was interesting reading (and I did read
it all) there are a couple of howlers and logical inconsistencies I
can't let slide. >
------
Lee Hodson
· October 10
There was an Islamic Golden Age. For a while, the Islamic World was at
the forefront of science, technology, agriculture, medicine, philosophy
and innovation. To blame Islam for problems created by frightened,
insecure authoritarian people who chose to use Islam to hinder the
Islamic world would be like saying the modern Western World is dying
because of Christianity or Catholicism. The truth is different.
The truth is that civilizations become too forgiving of bad ideas and
too ashamed of their own history for their own good.
So Hodson wouldd presumably excuse the Spanish Inquisition and the use
made of the Catholic church by Franco for the same reason.
Islam is not innately bad. It was co-opted and corrupted by false
followers who viewed Islam as their path to power over people. This is
true of Western democracy. As said many times before: societies do not
die because of the outside world, they die from within; outsiders finish
the job when they scavenge the carcass.
I’m not Muslim. Many evils have been done in the name of Islam. Even so, >> I can’t let you blame Islam for problems caused by man and woman.
I can't let this one pass either. If Islam is innocent of crimes done
in its name then Christianity by the same logic deserves a free pass
as well for things like the atrocities committed both by Muslims and Catholics during the Crusades, for the Spanish Inquisition and in the settlement of North and South America (I'm thinking primarily of
treatment of aboriginal peoples but also of slavery which still exists
in some Muslim countries today). I would give Christianity a pass on
the Holocaust as while Hitler was a baptised Catholic he was no friend
of Catholicism or Christianity generally and the worst you can say is
that there were too many Christian Germans who tolerated the Third
Reich and not enough Dietrich Bonhoeffers or the networks that
successfully hid Jews particularly in Holland and Denmark
For the most part, most people just want to live their lives in peace,
unwatched and unhindered. People in the Muslim world are no different to
people in other human worlds.
I beg to differ - there have been public opinion polls taken in
numerous countries in the aftermath of the Charlie Hebdo atrocities
where 40+% of Muslims in western countries supported the statement
that the murders of the Charlie Hebdo cartoonists was justified for
religious reasons while in "moderate" Muslim countries (Egypt for
example) it was 75% yes and 85% yes in more extrame majority Muslim
countries like Iran, Pakistan and Afghanistan (even under the now
former pro-Western government).
You simply cannot get such large majorities in countries with
populations making up more than 20% of this world's population and
still say with a straight face that there is no difference between how
them and adherents of other faiths view others not of their faith.
If I have to self-censor myself to avoid offending those who would
claim the right to use deadly force against me then put bluntly - I DO
NOT LIVE IN A FREE COUNTRY. And in my view anyone who believes they DO
have the right to use violence against me for that reason have no
place in our society and deserve immdiate deportation to a country
that would better support their twisted views.
As a Christian I was deeply offended by The Last temptation of Christ
but would never for a micro-second wished harm on author Nikos
Kazantzakis or Willem Dafoe (who played Jesus in the film version).
The thought of wishing them harm wouldn't occur to me. I could think
of several other cases.
For anybody who thinks this is an isolated outlier, Salman Rushdie has
had to pay for private security for 30+ years as he thinks (correctly
in my opinion) that he would risk personal harm if he didn't. Ayaan
Hirsi Ali has publicly said the same several times.
Bottom line is that a major difference between Christians and Muslims
is that virtually no Christian believes anyone who publishes ridicule
of Christianity or leaves the faith should be in risk of bodily harm
or death.
virtually no Christian believes anyone who publishes ridiculeYes. Very few "Christians" have gone off on violent
of Christianity or leaves the faith should be in risk of bodily harm
or death.
"
------
Michael Davison
· October 14
The so-called “Golden Age of Islam” did not include equality for
non-Muslims (dhimmi). In fact their rights were severely abbreviated and
they were often required to pay a tax (Jizya) for the “privilege” of
being allowed to breathe Islamic air.
Equal civil rights for all is definitely an anti-Muslim concept as
Davison's discussion of dhimmis makes plain.
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created
equal, that they are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of
happiness." is also an anti-Muslim concept - and treating non-Muslims
as 2nd class citizens in Muslim majority countries goes back to
Muhammed.
Which is why I categorically reject the following statement:
The idea that “For the most part, most people just want to live their
lives in peace, unwatched and unhindered. People in the Muslim world are
no different to people in other human worlds” hints that you may have
---------
I think I've made my point and don't need to belabor the point with a paragraph by paragraph analysis of a fairly long quotation from an unattributed site.
While I disagree with much of what you reposted, thank you for a very interesting read.
Michael Davison
Lives in Israel (1969–present)Feb 5
Why is Israel such a technologically innovative nation, and why haven't
other nations in the Arab world and beyond -- been able to replicate
their success?
The OP may not like my answer and I’m sure that many readers won’t either.
For the Arab world, the real underlying problem is Islam itself. Any
religion that rejects all questions, doubts and reservations is not a
fertile garden for original thought and innovation. Islam is not only a >religion, but a political system as well… we can see what happens when >national leaders are also the religious leaders of that country
throughout history.
Being required to accept a philosophy from the 7th century CE because it
is “the final, immutable word of God” under penalty of death for leaving >that religion isn’t a religion at all, but a method of mass mind control.
39K viewsView 1,162 upvotesView 5 sharesAnswer requested by
Mark Bartel
------
Lee Hodson
· October 10
There was an Islamic Golden Age. For a while, the Islamic World was at
the forefront of science, technology, agriculture, medicine, philosophy
and innovation. To blame Islam for problems created by frightened,
insecure authoritarian people who chose to use Islam to hinder the
Islamic world would be like saying the modern Western World is dying
because of Christianity or Catholicism. The truth is different.
The truth is that civilizations become too forgiving of bad ideas and
too ashamed of their own history for their own good.
I’m not Muslim.
The Western World now suffers from frightened politicians who view
themselves a class above their employers A.K.A the electorate; add to
them an underclass of people who have been brought up on a diet of fear, >shame, lies and delusions by over protective parents and teachers who >consider mentors the minions of Satan and consider the telling of
hurtful truths, unpopular opinions or the telling of unofficial opinions
and facts to be worse crimes than murder and we have a toxic mix ripe
for frightened power hungry visionless authoritarians to bring the
current height of Western civilisation to an end with a push back to the
Dark Ages that allowed feudalism to develop. Indeed, one might say we
are in a Democratic Dark Age (not to be confused with American political >groups) and are headed into neo-feudalism / technocratic feudalism.
The events might happen faster than in history but they are upon us,
like it or not.
I’ve warned people of the coming era of modern feudalism many times this >past decade. Without a vision of how to progress society from one in
which people work for income into one in which people live in leisure >afforded by AI and robots, there will only be one way forward and that
is one where politicians frightened by the prospect of more people with
time to protest, riot and ignore the rules of politicians will find ways
to exert ever more control over people’s lives. Politicians will do
their utmost to try and hold us back from a future with less distinction >between the haves and the have-nots.
I’m not socialist, either.
Back onto the subject of Islam and human progress. We are living in a
Western World that is about to end because of its success. This is
exactly what happened to the Islamic World. Its success was its undoing.
It did not need to go dark the way it did but that’s another topic.
Islam is not innately bad. It was co-opted and corrupted by false
followers who viewed Islam as their path to power over people. This is
true of Western democracy. As said many times before: societies do not
die because of the outside world, they die from within; outsiders finish
the job when they scavenge the carcass.
I’m not Muslim. Many evils have been done in the name of Islam. Even so,
I can’t let you blame Islam for problems caused by man and woman.
For the most part, most people just want to live their lives in peace, >unwatched and unhindered. People in the Muslim world are no different to >people in other human worlds.
------
Michael Davison
· October 14
The so-called “Golden Age of Islam” did not include equality for >non-Muslims (dhimmi). In fact their rights were severely abbreviated and
they were often required to pay a tax (Jizya) for the “privilege” of >being allowed to breathe Islamic air.
The idea that “For the most part, most people just want to live their
lives in peace, unwatched and unhindered. People in the Muslim world are
no different to people in other human worlds” hints that you may have
never ventured out of your own comfort area throughout your life. This >concept couldn’t be farther from the truth if you tried.
----------------
Lee Hodson
· October 14
I was born in England. I grew up in a multicultural area of England. The
East Midlands.
I learned some Ukrainian while drinking and partying with Ukrainians.
Little of it remembered now. I schooled with people from England, India, >Pakistan, Afghanistan and other nations. I schooled with the children of >Hungarians, Israelis and Poles. My dad has olive skin and so too do my
two youngest brothers. I am white though not always. I have body
dysmorphia so I only see my own skin colour when stood next to people
and catch my reflection by surprise.
I lived in the Netherlands for several years. I read Dutch (Nederlands).
I used to speak enough Dutch to hold conversations.
I dated a Czech woman in my early 20?s. I met her through my uncle who >married her aunt. I visited the Czech Republic and stayed with her
family frequently.
I learned a little Czech. Enough to argue with her aunt. It is a nice >language.
I lived in Gibraltar for a short while. I learned Spanish. Enough to get >around and annoy my then girlfriend who was the reason I went to Gib. I
still understand enough Spanish to know what my Spanish speaking
customers are saying when they switch from English to Spanish to speak
with friends or relatives while I’m present.
I dated an Iranian woman in my late 20’s. She is Muslim. I am not.
People in my area made only one comment about this. The message passed
onto me by a friend was ‘We know you are a good person so we are not >bothered that you are dating a Muslim girl.’
I have spent quite a few months in South Florida, too.
Up until the last decade I averaged 3 fights (brawls, not flights) a year.
Do I need to continue to prove my point?
I’m not sheltered. I have lived a life that has expanded my knowledge of >people, humanity and the world around us beyond that of most. I am
travelled, though not as much as I would like to be. I am not afraid to
throw my fists when necessary, though I prefer to use words — took me a >long time to work out that words and compassion work as well as fists if
not better on occasion. Words can lead to friendships. Fists usually
create fear.
I understand very well that Islam is a way of life and that Islam is a >nation. I have written this many times. Perhaps you have read me in the
past.
Islam evolved out of the need to bring nomadic people’s together under
one nation no matter where they are in the world. Islam is an ideology
and a religion. I understand this. Have understood this for a very long
time.
Some Muslims are more strict than others. This is true of any religion.
I think, if I recall correctly, Sikhism is the only religion that
explicitly instructs adherents to follow the laws and practices of their
host nation when they are there as guests.
All mammals have a similar underlying biologically determined set of >behaviours. Humans are mammals. We might think we are something special
but we are no more special than any other mammal. Many would say other >mammals have it easier. At least other mammals need no instruction on
their beliefs.
Muslims are not clones of one and other. They do not have a hive mind. A >Ukrainian woman once said to me “People are people”. Know who else said >that to me? An old Iranian friend I drank with. Neither he nor she knew
one and other. They had independently arrived at that same thought. No >religious instruction required; just life experience.
I’ve drunk with a number of Muslims. According to you that should not
have happened. Alcohol is forbidden in Islam. Maybe Muslims, like
Christians and Catholics have minds of their own.
I cannot and will not accept the killing of innocents or infidels. No
one should. Likewise, no one should consider all followers of any
ideology to be all the same. Humans are incredibly varied. Most humans
just want to live their lives in peace. For most humans this means they
take the path of least resistance (physics does this too). When the Imam
says ‘Go kill all infidels’ most people ignore the Imam, like any other >religious leader’s sayings. What would Homer do? Same as almost anyone else.
I suggest it’s you who needs to get out more and speak with open ears,
non judgmentally and with even temperament, with (not to but with) more >varied people from a wider range of cultural and religious backgrounds.
I think you are hurting from a past injustice. That this hurt and
injustice has restricted your openness to see people instead of the
version of Islam you expect them to embody.
No one can tell you what you can and cannot think or feel. You are your
own person. Your experience is your own truth. I think you might be
overly hardened toward Islam and people who live where Islam is widely >practiced. If I were you I would speak with a different group of Muslims
to the ones you’re most likely to meet in or around Israel.
-----
Michael Davison
· October 14
The idea that “people are people all over the world” is, like most >generalization, a fiction born of wishful thinking.
According to your own biography, you’ve never lived in an
Arabic-speaking, Muslim majority country for any length of time, so I
can only wonder how you think you can make any comments about the 400
million or so Arabs living in the Middle East and North Africa, under >dictatorships of one kind or another.
Please do some serious homework.
-----------
disperate perceptions there lives the truth. If we all thought the same
about everything in life we would have no need to talk. And I think talk
is healthy. You are correct that I have not lived in a majority Muslim >country. What you missed in my comment is that I was saying to you that
the people who make the rules in any country only create rules that most >people abide by as limitedly as necessary in order to live as peaceful a
life as possible. In many places, Muslim majority or not, life under
those people who make (and break as often as not) the local rules for
society and governance is either punitive or forgiving, harsh or
comfortable depending on the fair & just or the uneven & sadistic nature
of the rule makers, the checks in place to restrict those rule makers
and the will of the people to follow those rules or revolt. People in
England follow their local rules. Good and bad rules created for genuine
or unbelievable reasons. Our democratic political system, our legal
framework and the checks and balances in place to hinder the creation of >rules in order to give the electorate’s (mostly) appointed
representatives time to question proposed laws and the option to permit
or stop the ascension of proposed laws into our legal codex is what
keeps most bad, harmful and freedom restricting laws at bay. If the UK >parliament passed a law that said people could go to market every Sunday
to observe public canings then many people who today regard themselves
law abiding and goodly people morally superior to ‘them others
elsewhere’ would go watch, cheer and participate. They would do the same >were public executions a part of UK life. They would still consider >themselves morally superior to people in other lands because the law
permits their (in my opinion) bad behaviour. Are people in the UK truly
any different compared to people in the Middle East where this is law
today or are we simply governed by a kinder local ideology? Those same
people would leave the market place, go home and break all the rules in >private but in public they would pay lip-service to all the rules they
need to in order to get on in life and they would ignore the rules they
think they can break when they chose to. I’m sure you will disagree with >me. That would be a good thing. It would prove people can be different
to each other. It would demonstrate we have some measure of free will. I
like to think we all have some measure of free will regardless the
culture we grow up within and live within. I agree with you that the >objective of Islam is for the whole world to live under Islam. I
disagree that all Muslims want to behead infidels or even observe Islam >strictly. Do you know what I think would happen if we all lived within
the Caliphate? Some bright spark would start a new religion to replace
Islam with something new. Do Muslims expect another prophet to arise
anytime soon?
Lorenzo Cutuliero--
· October 14
Your arguments have a lot of validity, but there’s an underlying history >that you completely gloss over when speaking of Islamic nations: most
(please note I certainly make no claim to all) Islamic nations were very
much in stride with their western counterparts in regards to national, >economic, education, and sexual equality issues up until the upheavals
of the 1970s. When observations are made of urban settings, university >settings, political settings, etc., we see populations that were every
bit as “hip” as their western counterparts. Women were in positions of >“power” throughout the middle-east (professors, politicians,
businesses), and a lot of major cities throughout the Muslim world were >tourist destinations.
There was a horrible regression that happened in that era (who is to
blame is entirely debatable) that has led to the entrenchment of
zealots. I’m not sure if that will ever change in the near future as our >world has become terribly polarized, but Muslims in their own right were
in lockstep with the west for a long time.
-------------
Ravindra Khattree
· October 25
A religion is identified by its practices and its past record. For a
good 1400 Years of blood shed, slavery, sexual slavery, forced
conversions, discrimination ( Muslim vs non Muslim, make vs female),
extra taxation on nonmuslims combined with endorsements of incestious >relationships, child marriage and pedophilic behavior by showcasing as
the life style of their role model pretty much has defined the Islam.
Quran openly endorses it and justifies it and with a claim of it being >timeless and spaceless prohibits any change from status quo.
much of the “contribution” of Islam to science is essentially being the >transfer point of indian science and mathematics to Europe. Can you name
one single original contribution of Islam to science?
how many Nobel prizes have Muslims countries bagged even collectively.
How little original scientific research come from Muslim country? Before
oil was found most Saudi people were nomads.
How much manpower development taken place since the discovery of oil?
Not much!!!
I do believe that Muslim will continue to not help themselves because of >faulty practices and their unwillingness to change.
----------------
Oded Ben-Josef
· February 13
I think it has more to do with religion in the region, in general.
Targeting Islam or any specific religion for criticism is not an
effective, persuasive method. It primarily “convinces the convinced” and >little else. Studies in Israel show that the more secular Israelis are,
the higher their income; the more devout - the more poor they are (see
graph at the comments below); also, as soon as one removes both Israelis
and Palestinians from the region, when they immigrate to the U.S., for >example, their official religion stays the same (Jews and Muslims), but
their success and integration rate is similar to each other. I believe
it is conservatism that is the inhibitor; i.e. the region’s societies -
and many of them are not Muslim - there are other minority groups in the >Middle East.
To my mind, it is simply an excessively conservative and authoritarian >region, one of many, where “wrong and strong” leadership is usually >preferred over “right and weak”. The lack of liberal values, freedom in >politics, education and, therefore - economics. Comparing North Korea
vs. South Korea is an excellent illustration of how the same ethnicity
and religion (either agnostic or Buddhist) performs radically
differently only because of values and attitudes to liberalism. The same >religion can be interpreted in various ways.
Overly conservative societies, which are suspicious of anything or
anyone foreign or new (and the two are frequently tied together),
frighten away investors and initiative. Israel, for example, is at the
same risk of devolution, if it embraces too much authoritarianism and >conservative values. An Israeli “Halacha state”, for example (a
religious orthodox autocracy), will rapidly “catch up downwards” with
its neighbors in modernity and economics. It is the relatively liberal
and secular communities that develop and maintain most infrastructures
and wealth in Israel. Just like Silicon Valley in CA, those people are >relatively flexible and mobile - unlike their more stubborn conservative
and religious compatriots, who stay in the same place whether they are
happy or miserable. The liberals can be easily driven out, if pushed too >much. The process of “brain drain” has been going on for many decades,
in the Middle East and specifically, Israel. Hand in hand with the
increasing conservatism.
Study: Economic Assimilation in the United States of Arab and Jewish >Immigrants from Israel and the Territories
-----
Michael Davison
· February 16
Since Islam is not only a religion but a form of government, your
argument doesn’t really hold water.
Any person emigrating from a super-conservative society ruled by its
church to a more open, secular society is bound to change and adopt the >customs and mentality to some extent, at least.
For many of those emigrating from Muslim or other totalitarian regimes,
the changes are usually expressed in the surprise that the immigrants
have been lied to for most of their lives by the regimes demonizing the
more free societies.
----------
Oded Ben-Josef
· February 17
Leaving emigration aside for a moment (not everyone can or has the will
to) - religiosity in general has a marked effect on economics and
success. Here is a graph in Hebrew that shows the direct relationship
between religious devoutness and poverty in Israel. The orange bar on
the right - seculars - have the highest average income per family (in >thousands of NIS per month, not dollars); almost double that of the most >religious Jews, Orthodox Haredi, the black bar on the left.
The two middle bars represent less strict religious communities - people
who are not entirely secular but not strictly Orthodox either.
The percentages below the bars show the employment participation rate of
each community.
Average Income most religious =17
then 21, then 22, most secular 28.
----
Feride Can
· February 17
“Comparing North Korea vs. South Korea is an excellent illustration of
how the same ethnicity and religion (either agnostic or Buddhist)
performs radically differently only because of values and attitudes to >liberalism. “
South Korea was living under a regime of military dictatorship, which
began in 1961 and lasted 18 years when the country's economy experienced
a take off and a Great stride towards industrialization. It was due to
the economic policies implemented by the Dictator who ruled in this era
which were anything but liberal.
Liberal economy and liberal policies are not prerequisets of eonomic >development, pr technological advance, or social change, or >industrialization, or progress, etc. These can come under authoritirian >regimes as well.
Ottoman underdevelepment has been studied with reference to the effects
of islamic law on economic transactions and propery rightes, on the >backwardness of Ottoman Economy. There are works which show that it
could be,one of the factors.
But todays predominantly muslim countries would not face this impediment
of islamic institutions they are not governed by strick islamic rules,
in the economic sphere islamic imfluence is at the minimum, the islamic
ban on the interest rate is ignored one way or another. So i would not >suggest that predominantly ?slam countries are at a disadvantage.
----------
Oded Ben-Josef
· February 16
It is a question whether the “melting pot” in Israel is working as well >as it appears to, or marketed to outsiders. It has always been an odd
hybrid of irreconcilables, with the lid held together tight, most
decades, only by external threats in the Middle East and short-sighted
social engineering efforts by the Israeli elite. It is no accident that
there was never an elected Israeli prime minister wearing a Kippah, nor
an army chief of staff, defence minister or director of the bank of
Israel. They were all secular. That was “the lid” over the melting pot, >despite secular Israelis amounting to 40% of society at most. However,
the immense inside pressures and initial fissures could be seen as far
back as 1948.
It is not so much a matter of faith contradicting modernity in principle
- suitably interpreted, it shouldn’t. Haredi Jews in Brooklyn do not
oppose it. In Israeli society and the Middle East at large, faith isn’t >just faith, it’s politics and a rigid national vision for the state at
all levels, from community to school, business and family. The next time
you encounter a Haredi, the pertinent question to ask is not
metaphysical but a more practical one: “Do you support a Halacha state
in Israel, yes or no?” or, for a secular Israeli, “Should Israel
separate religion and state, yes or no?” Israeli society has been
spending the last few decades in doing its damnedest to avoid those
questions and play for time. That does not mean the answer is not in the >making; quite the reverse. The question is not whether a particular
Israeli Haredi can personally reconcile science and faith; but whether
his discrete choice at the ballot box, community leadership and, >consequently, boards of education would.
Below: a screenshot from the Israeli mini-series “Autonomies”, a >dystopian tale of a future Israel split into a secular state and a
Halachaic autonomy. The leader of the autocratic autonomy insists that
it is a “Noah’s Ark… at a time of a spiritual flood.” (There are English
subtitles in the settings).
Now that many of the external threats have dissipated, in the 21s
century, the melting pot lid all but blew off, and Israel society is
revealed to be a composite web of ethnic and socio-political communities >that, while professing unity, struggle to maintain it and, in practice, >can’t conjure sufficient unity to support even a basic concept such as a >constitution, nor elect a government with anything like a sizeable
majority that allows it to implement significant changes in any
direction. Most elected governments in the last 20 years achieved only a >scant majority, and spent most of their efforts on political survival
and little else. The last time an Israeli government held sufficient
power to implement any kind of far-reaching legislation with national or >strategic implications was in 2004, the disengagement and withdrawal
from the Gaza strip, nearly tearing Israeli society in half.
The inflationary growth in the number of political parties, particularly >those too small for consequence (13 parties in 2021, for 9 million
people, compared to 9 in the UK for 66 million, for example) and the >resultant political fragmentation and chronic stalemate - causes
repeated elections at the cost of one billion NIS (around $308 million)
a pop - three of them in the last year alone. This is because Israeli >elections gradually became a costly drag show substitute to change,
rather than an instrument of it. Israeli society is no longer able to >implement any kind of unified vision for the future; not in economics, >religion or defence policy. There are far too many conflicting layers
pulling in opposite directions while maintaining a charade of unity,
which results in treading water, playing for time and delaying strategic >decisions - and even that, at immense efforts.
---------
A factor which is even hotter to handle than religions is inherent >cultural/racial intelligence. For historical reasons jews have been
selected and bred for intelligence. Most of the people with whom they
are being compared have not. It's not only the jewish people who by
and large are more intelligent but so too is their culture.
Sigh, for the past time of interesting discussions
on the newsgroups.
Sure. Those six people have expressed opinions.
I find them more worth consideration than some
sources, but certainly not all real ideal.
Your opinions are welcome.
And certainly, you could also contribute to
the real Quora.
On Fri, 19 Nov 2021 13:12:17 +1300, Eric Stevens
<eric.stevens@sum.co.nz> wrote:
A factor which is even hotter to handle than religions is inherent >>cultural/racial intelligence. For historical reasons jews have been >>selected and bred for intelligence. Most of the people with whom they
are being compared have not. It's not only the jewish people who by
and large are more intelligent but so too is their culture.
They're bred for more than intelligence. Like the Rothschilds
first-cousin marriages tend to keep wealth within families. A fact to
promote wealth & education.
Come to think of it, they are not smart enough to avoid persecution
for the past 2500 years. The Jews themselves are the ONE common
factor over all this time!
On Fri, 19 Nov 2021 12:44:17 +1100, Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote:
On Fri, 19 Nov 2021 13:12:17 +1300, Eric StevensThat they have survived 2500 years of persecution says something of
<eric.stevens@sum.co.nz> wrote:
A factor which is even hotter to handle than religions is inherent >>>cultural/racial intelligence. For historical reasons jews have been >>>selected and bred for intelligence. Most of the people with whom they
are being compared have not. It's not only the jewish people who by
and large are more intelligent but so too is their culture.
They're bred for more than intelligence. Like the Rothschilds
first-cousin marriages tend to keep wealth within families. A fact to >>promote wealth & education.
Come to think of it, they are not smart enough to avoid persecution
for the past 2500 years. The Jews themselves are the ONE common
factor over all this time!
their intelligence.
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