• shwm only - A Quora - Why do some people think that Israel has a right

    From a425couple@21:1/5 to All on Wed Jan 5 10:43:46 2022
    Chaim Handler
    Oct 20
    Why do some people think that Israel has a right over Palestine?

    In Rome there is a monument erected in the year 80 called the “Arch of Titus”. It commemorates the Roman conquest of a land known as Judea,
    which subsequently became the Roman province by the same name, until, 65
    years later, it was combined with Syria into the Roman province “Syria Palestina”. Palestine is JUDEA and Judea was taken from the JEWS by the Romans.

    The only people of consequence who thought that the Jews had a right to Palestine were those who belonged to the League of Nations in the
    1920’s. They were the people who thought Mesopotamia should belong to
    the people who had lived under Ottoman imperial rule until the first
    World War within the geographical confines the League defined as Iraq.
    They were the people who thought Syria should belong to the people who
    had lived under Ottoman imperial rule until the first World War within
    the geographical confines the League defined as Syria. They were the
    people who thought Lebanon should belong to the people who had lived
    under Ottoman imperial rule until the first World War within the
    geographical confines the League defined as Lebanon.

    And they were the people who thought Palestine should belong to the
    people who descended from the nation that lived in the Kingdom of Judea
    and whose land was subjugated, first under Roman imperial rule, and subsequently by the Islamic Caliphates, the Crusades, and Ottoman
    Empire. They said as much quite explicitly in a legal document called
    the League of Nations Mandate for Palestine, the very document that
    created the entity (not a country nor a State but merely a Mandate) that existed from 1923 to 1948 and was known as Mandatory Palestine.

    You may disagree with what the League of Nations decreed a century ago,
    just as I disagree with what Rome did 1,951 years ago. Disagreeing with historical reality is pointless. The Arabs disagreed with the Mandate
    and they did something about it. They carried out violent riots and
    massacred Jews in Palestine at every opportunity from 1920 through 1948
    in the hopes that they could prevent the inevitable establishment of the
    Jewish national home. Then on May 15, 1948 their allies, the Egyptians, Transjordanians, Syrians, Iraqis, and Lebanese sent their armies to
    obliterate the State of Israel, proclaimed less than a day earlier.
    Their combined military might couldn’t stop the Jews from
    re-establishing their country.

    Now, 73 years later, there are many people like yourself claiming that
    the Jews don’t have a right to their ancestral homeland. Well, go on,
    enjoy your sanctimonious hate-fest against myself and my people. We have exercised our rights and are a free and independent nation again as we
    had been in the past, and we could care less if that fact is unpopular
    with those who think that the so called “Palestinians” have a “right
    over Judea”.

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    34 comments from
    David Nathanson
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    David Nathanson
    · November 2
    You said that “Disagreeing with reality is pointless.” That is the
    point. Indeed, it is the only point to be made. Israel is a reality. It
    is here to stay. Whether it has a “right” to exist is now irrelevant. It exists.

    Profile photo for Chaim Handler
    Profile photo for Doug Ribot
    Doug Ribot
    · Sun
    and it does have a right to exist.

    Profile photo for Jase M
    Jase M
    · December 28
    We all have a right to a home, glad you guys have got yours. I like what you’ve done with the place and admire the scientific contributions
    Israel has given the world. May Israel live forever.

    Shachy Cohn
    · November 9
    VERY well articulated Chaim!

    More power to you & G-d bless!

    Here's a rather lengthy explanation by Dr. Mordechai Keidar regarding
    the origins of the invented nation of the “Palestinians” invaders,
    looters and terrorists:

    It's in Hevrew and yet to have subtitles in English.

    Enlightening overview.

    Profile photo for Chaim Handler
    Profile photo for Julea Bacall
    Julea Bacall
    · October 30
    What I ask is Why people think Israel is Arab? And by the way, the
    Greeks ruled even before Rome. They made Greek the official language.
    They heard Yisra in Hebrew means struggle or wrestle, as in Jacob who
    wrestled EL. So the Greek word for wrestle is Palestes. “ine” in Greek means ‘followers of’. So the Greeks wanted to call Israel, Palestine and Greeks wrote all the oldest histories, maps etc for the West, who all
    read Greek. The WEST called Israel and Canaan Palestine using
    Greek.You’d be surprised how many Greek words we still us today like
    Gym, Democracy and so many more, Canaanites were not Arab but a few
    Arabs invaded about 700AD and more followed. Later. Arabs always wanted
    the regions ruled by the Ottoman so helped Brits, France, Russia expel
    them. Only Transjordan was assigned to Arab Hashemites. Still they covet
    the whole thing. So the people called Palestinian, since Arafat knew the
    West used that name for Israel (it is not Arab, not Canaanite, not any
    tribe or language other than what the West used) think they will be
    Heroes of Islam if they can wipe Israel out. Iran same way. Its for
    Supremacy of their religion.

    Profile photo for David Kolinsky
    David Kolinsky
    · November 3
    The Greek word for Wrestle is “paleyo” παλεύω. The word Palestine comes
    from P’LiShTyM (פְּלִשְׁתִּ֔ים) which was the Hebrew name for Greek
    colonists from about 12th century BCE until 604 BCE on the southern
    coast of what is now Israel.

    It is believed that this word came from the Semitic root PaLaSh (פלש) meaning “invader.” While in Syriac (Aramaic), the root means “to break through, dig through a wall, pierce, undermine, force into, fathom; violation” and in Akkadian in means “perforate, make a breach, bore;” it literally means “to go back and forth or from end to end” hence: extent
    (of a cloud)(Ek27:30), and to wallow (Jr6:26) in Hebrew.

    Profile photo for Yaakov Bar-Nahman
    Yaakov Bar-Nahman
    · November 4
    BTW you forgot to mention that the Jews gave up 78% of the Mandate land
    that ad been promised to us for the sake of peace. THE ORIGINAL 2 STATE SOLUTION was to give that 78% east of the Jordan river to the Arabs to establish a newly invented, never before existed Muslim Arab State of Palestine. It was established as a free sovereign state even a few years
    before Israel.

    It’s called Jordan. THAT is THE only legitimate Arab/Muslim Palestine
    state, and it was given to them by Jews in exchange for a promise of
    peace. Yet that very state was a part of the genocidal army that
    ILLEGALLY attacked Israel the day it was reborn. That very 2 state
    FROM THE JEWISH STATE of Israel and committed ethnic cleansing there as
    for 19 years and kept the refugees that they created in squalid
    concentration camps to use them as propaganda.

    Profile photo for Christina Aldridge
    Christina Aldridge
    · 19h ago
    Might makes right. And the loser is always a whiner. And nature is
    bloody and raw and without justice.

    Man is subject to nature. And his-story is long.

    Muhib Omar
    · December 14
    i don’t think disagreeing is pointless. Or else you could have told that
    to the jews before the mandate was established. Also the question was
    referring to palestine. Questioning that palestine maybe has a right to
    exist on their own is not negating the right to exist of israel. It’s
    even weird that one has to point that out. Imagine germans saying that
    the right of poland to exist is threatening german existence and that
    they are here to stay. Sure stay, but within some borders lol. That’s as
    far as I can tell all the international community wants from israel. to
    define finally some borders and just stay within them. That palestine
    should be established within some borders and that the non-jewish
    population that has made up the majority on that land longer than the
    jews when counting from the conquest of canaan to the Roman expulsion
    (13 th century bc to say 130 ad vs well all the time from there to the
    20th century and even today when counting the children of the refugees
    and refugees) should not be thrown into the sea. If those two things are
    too much for those sensitive people online that’s I think telling more
    of them than of either history or israel or palestine. If people here
    seriously want the whole mandates territory to be israel well alright. Naturalisation of palestinians should be a given though then. A jewish
    state with non-jewish majority could have been established anywhere
    though but if that is their wish, so be it.

    Profile photo for Eliyahu Skoczylas
    Eliyahu Skoczylas
    · Sun
    “Questioning that palestine maybe has a right to exist on their own is
    not negating the right to exist of israel. It’s even weird that one has
    to point that out.”

    The problem is that the PLO and Hamas both insist that Palestine is the
    entire territory of Israel so that they do not agree that both can exist.

    “That’s as far as I can tell all the international community wants from israel. to define finally some borders and just stay within them.”

    What “the international community” and what the leaders of the two Palestines — the PLO in “the West Bank” and Hamas in Gaza — want are a bit different. Besides that they don’t want there to be any Israel at
    all (as witness on their maps, their slogans, etc.) they also want a
    return to the pre-Tanzimat structure of the Ottoman Empire, when Jews
    (and Christians) were dhimmi with lesser rights than Moslems. The
    international community by contrast expects a situation similar to what
    exists in Israel now, where all people have the same legal rights and
    status irrespective of their religion.

    As for borders, the Oslo II Accords mapped out Areas A, B, and C and the
    PA has been given a free hand within Areas A and B, while Hamas has been
    given a free hand throughout the entire Strip, including Area C as well.

    When you talk about “the whole mandates territory” I don’t think you understand that the western strip of Transjordan was inhabited by Jews
    up until 1923, and that it was part of the territory controlled by Rome,
    and was partly Jewish, especially to the north in the Decapolis (modern northern Jordan and southern Syria). Following the various rebellions in
    Judea and the wars with Romans in the 1st and 2nd centuries, many Jews
    fled northeast to that region, where they intermingled with early
    Christians. Dozens of Byzantine-era synagogues, still present as
    archaeological ruins, testify to the ongoing Jewish presence then /
    there, as well as Jewish writings by and about people from those
    communities. They aren’t Biblical Jewish lands because the Bibles ended before then (the Jewish Tanach stopping before the Hellenist era and the Christian OT & NT stopping after Paul’s death) but they were historical Jewish and Christian lands. From that region came the Jewish troops who
    fought with the Sassanians against the Byzantines in the Jewish revolt
    against Heraclius at the beginning of the Seventh century, just before
    the Moslem invasion.

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