• Another failing German parachute plan

    From a425couple@21:1/5 to All on Wed Mar 8 12:31:26 2017
    Another failing German parachute plan.

    Also in the April 2016 European trip, I drove in a track day
    / driving experience at the famous Spa-Franchorchamps race
    track in Belgium. The current track is much smaller than the
    original pre WWII one, or the famous 1950s - 1970s version.
    I enjoyed touring the area and viewing areas the old track went
    through and some of the area's history.

    I had done some searching about ways the area figured in the
    Battle of the Bulge in December 1944.

    I found this excerpt interesting: http://www.history.army.mil/books/wwii/7-8/7-8_11.HTM
    (or, when you start running out of people, materials, training ,
    and time, bad things just keep compounding!!!)

    "The airborne phase of Operation Greif, whose code name was Hohes Venn,
    seems to have been completely an afterthought, for the orders setting up the operation were not issued until 8 December.10 Hitler, like most of the
    higher German commanders, had lost confidence in airdrop tactics after the
    many casualties suffered by the German paratroopers in the Crete jump. Then too, in late 1944 the necessarily lengthy training for paratroop units was a luxury denied by the huge drain of battlefield losses. Apparently it was
    Model who suggested that paratroop tactics be tried once again, but
    undoubtedly Hitler seized upon the proposal with alacrity although there was
    no longer a single regular paratroop regiment active in the Wehrmacht. Model wanted the jump to be made in the Krinkelt area, and one may wonder what
    effect such a vertical attack might have had on the fight put up at the twin villages by the American 2d and 99th Infantry Divisions. Hitler, however,
    had one of his intuitive strokes and ordered the jump to be made north of Malmédy.

    His choice for commander devolved on Col. Friedrich A. Freiherr von der
    Heydte, a distinguished and experienced paratroop officer then commanding
    the Fallschirm Armee Waffen school where the nominal parachute regiments
    were being trained as ground troops. Colonel von der Heydte was ordered to organize a thousand-man parachute formation for immediate use. Four days
    later von der Heydte received his tactical mission from the Sixth SS Panzer Army commander during an uncomfortable session in which Dietrich was under
    the influence of alcohol. The paratroopers were to jump at dawn on D-day,
    first opening the roads in the Hohes Venn leading from the Elsenborn-Malmédy area toward Eupen for the armored spearhead units, then blocking Allied
    [270]
    forces if these attempted to intervene. Colonel von der Heydte was told that the German armor would reach him within twenty-four hours.

    The preparations for Operation Hohes Venn were rushed to completion. The
    troops received their equipment and a little jump training (many had never attended jump school); 112 war-weary, Junkers troop-carrier planes were gathered with an ill-assorted group of pilots, half of whom had never flown combat missions; 300 dummy figures were loaded for drops north of Camp Elsenborn to confuse the Americans (this turned out to be about the most successful feature of the entire operation); and the pilots and jump-masters were given instructions-but no joint training. It must be said that these preparations for what would be the first German paratroop assault at night
    and into woods left much to be desired.

    On the evening of 15 December Colonel von der Heydte formed his companies to entruck for the move to Paderborn, where the planes were assembled. The
    trucks never arrived-they had no fuel. Now the jump was ordered for 0300 on
    the 17th. This time the jump was made on schedule, although not quite as planned and into very bad cross winds. One rifle company was dropped behind
    the German lines fifty kilometers away from the drop zone, most of the
    signal platoon fell just in front of the German positions south of Monschau, and the bulk of the command and the weapons packages were scattered almost
    at random. Despite this bad beginning about one hundred paratroopers reached the rendezvous at the fork in the Eupen road north of Mont Rigi. Since this group was obviously too weak for open action, Colonel von der Heydte formed camp in the woods and sent out patrols to pick up information and harass the Americans in the vicinity. These patrols gathered in stragglers until some three hundred paratroopers had assembled, but it was now too late to carry
    out the planned operation. On the night of the 21st the paratroopers were ordered to find their way back to the German lines believed to be at
    Monschau. Von der Heydte was taken prisoner two days later. The tactical
    effect of this hastily conceived and ill-executed operation proved to be
    almost nil although American commanders did dispatch troops on wild-goose chases which netted little but a few paratroopers, empty parachutes, and dummies.11 "

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  • From a425couple@21:1/5 to a425couple@hotmail.com on Wed Mar 8 16:03:53 2017
    "a425couple" <a425couple@hotmail.com> wrote in...
    Another failing German parachute plan.
    Also in the April 2016 European trip, I drove in a track day
    / driving experience at the famous Spa-Franchorchamps race
    track in Belgium. The current track is much smaller than the
    original pre WWII one, or the famous 1950s - 1970s version.
    I enjoyed touring the area and viewing areas the old track went
    through and some of the area's history.
    I had done some searching about ways the area figured in the
    Battle of the Bulge in December 1944.

    I found this excerpt interesting: http://www.history.army.mil/books/wwii/7-8/7-8_11.HTM
    (or, when you start running out of people, materials, training ,
    and time, bad things just keep compounding!!!)
    -----------------
    Von der Heydte was taken prisoner two days later.

    Oberstleutnant Von der Heydte's arm had been broken in
    that disasterous, windy, night time jump. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friedrich_August_Freiherr_von_der_Heydte https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_St%C3%B6sser
    "Since many of the German paratroops were very inexperienced, some
    were crippled upon impact and died where they fell. Some were found
    the following spring when the snow melted." ----
    "Oberstgruppenführer Sepp Dietrich had scoffed at Heydte's request for
    carrier pigeons, and none of the unit's radios survived the drop, so he was unable to report the detailed information he gathered." ----
    "Heydte, wounded, frostbitten, and suffering from pneumonia, knocked on
    doors in Monschau until he found a German family. The next morning he
    sent a boy with a surrender note to the Allies."

    Thus, he was taken as a POW and survived WWII in England.
    He worked as a professor of military, constitutional and international law while also becoming a Brigadier General in the Reserves of the Bundeswehr.
    And got involved in later controversies: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flick_affair https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiegel_Affair
    "The magazine was accused of treason -- by publishing details that a hastily compiled Defense Ministry document claimed were state secrets."

    He made a couple of notable quotes:
    "The battle for Crete was to prove the overture to the great tragedy which reached its climax at El Alamein and Stalingrad. For the first time there
    had stood against us a brave and relentless opponent on a battleground
    which favoured him."

    "Regarding the Theresienstadt concentration camp in Czechoslovakia,
    Heydte said, "Half a million people have been put to death there for
    certain.
    I know that all the Jews from Bavaria were taken there. Yet the camp never became over-crowded. They gassed mental defectives, too."

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  • From The Horny Goat@21:1/5 to a425couple@hotmail.com on Fri Mar 10 09:25:38 2017
    On Wed, 08 Mar 2017 16:03:53 -0500, "a425couple"
    <a425couple@hotmail.com> wrote:

    "The battle for Crete was to prove the overture to the great tragedy which >reached its climax at El Alamein and Stalingrad. For the first time there
    had stood against us a brave and relentless opponent on a battleground
    which favoured him."

    Why is this a notable quote? For sure Crete was an airborne operation
    but neither El Al or Stalingrad involved serious numbers of paratroops
    either deployed by air or strictly as ground troops.

    About the ONLY "airborne" element of Stalingrad was the vain attempt
    to supply 6th Army by air but to refer to that in the same breath as
    Crete is ludicrous.

    As for Crete itself, had the British and ANZAC forces been as "brave
    and relentless" as he says the Germans would not have taken Crete. For
    sure the troops were brave enough but their deployment left a lot to
    be desired and Maleme should not have been taken against a properly
    deployed defence.

    For sure Freyberg was popular with the New Zealand troops but he
    certainly was not one of the great Allied commanders of WW2..

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  • From Michele@21:1/5 to All on Fri Mar 10 10:52:40 2017
    Il 08/03/2017 18.31, a425couple ha scritto:
    Another failing German parachute plan.


    Another?

    Let's see, their part in Weserübung was a qualified success. Eben Emael
    was a full success. The Dutch operation too. Crete was very costly but certainly not a failure. Leros worked. Other minor operations either
    succedeed, or failed but through no fault of the paratroopers. Not so
    bad a record, I'd say.

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  • From a425couple@21:1/5 to Michele on Fri Mar 10 18:16:09 2017
    "Michele" <SPAMmiarmelNOT@tin.it> wrote in message...
    Il 08/03/2017 18.31, a425couple ha scritto:
    Another failing German parachute plan.

    Another?

    Prior to going to Belgium, we had spent time in Norway.
    I have read of the parachute drop at Dombas.
    The Germans fought hard there, but all ended up
    surrendering (or dead).
    But the POWs later were freed, and went back into combat. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Domb%C3%A5s

    Let's see, their part in Weserübung was a qualified success. Eben Emael
    was a full success. The Dutch operation too. Crete was very costly but certainly not a failure. Leros worked. Other minor operations either succedeed, or failed but through no fault of the paratroopers. Not so bad
    a record, I'd say.

    You count the "Dutch operation" as a "full success"?
    But I've read,
    "Kurt Student (12 May 1890 - 1 July 1978) was a German paratroop
    general in the Luftwaffe during World War II. He lost the first major
    airborne operation of the war, the Battle for The Hague in May 1940."

    "The Battle for The Hague was one of the first opposed paratroop
    assaults in history. (Unopposed assaults took place on 9 April 1940
    against Masnedøfortet and Aalborg airport, Denmark.) (The first
    opposed assaults took place on 9 April 1940 against Sola airport,
    Norway.) It took place on 10 May 1940 as part of the Battle of the
    Netherlands between the Royal Netherlands Army and Luftwaffe
    Fallschirmjäger (paratroops)."
    They failed in their goals, retreated into sand dunes, until 5 days later
    when brutal city bombing forced Dutch surrender. Bad Public Relations. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotterdam_Blitz https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotterdam_Blitz#/media/File:Zadkine_II_rb.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_for_The_Hague
    "They also lost 182 transport aircraft, including 47 damaged."
    "Aftermath The main effect of the battle was unforeseen: the large loss
    of German transport aircraft. According to military historian Lt. Col.
    E.H. Brongers (ret.), the loss of the transport aircraft had a direct
    effect on the planning for the proposed German cross channel invasion
    of Britain"
    "Because of the failure of this campaign, Hitler lost interest in this
    "new weapon" and only used it again in the attack on Crete in 1941"
    And after that, he just had them fight as infantry.

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  • From The Horny Goat@21:1/5 to All on Fri Mar 10 19:35:55 2017
    On Fri, 10 Mar 2017 10:52:40 -0500, Michele <SPAMmiarmelNOT@tin.it>
    wrote:

    Il 08/03/2017 18.31, a425couple ha scritto:
    Another failing German parachute plan.


    Another?

    Let's see, their part in Weserübung was a qualified success. Eben Emael
    was a full success. The Dutch operation too. Crete was very costly but >certainly not a failure. Leros worked. Other minor operations either >succedeed, or failed but through no fault of the paratroopers. Not so
    bad a record, I'd say.

    For sure - and Leros was long ater Crete and during an era where the
    Allies had air superiority in most theatres of war.To me that makes it
    more impressive even than Eben Emael which for many was the high point
    of German paratroop action.

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