Jane Parr, wife of John Fox, was greatgrandmother of Obadiah Bruen. https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Parr-850 has her as daughter of William Parr and Mary Salisbury. I am pretty sure this is wrong as no reliable sources show this and William's very profile
at Wikitree doesn't list her as daughter. However, do we have any idea of where she fits in the Parr family?

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On Friday, October 15, 2021 at 5:39:50 PM UTC-7, Paulo Ricardo Canedo wrote:

Jane Parr, wife of John Fox, was greatgrandmother of Obadiah Bruen. https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Parr-850 has her as daughter of William Parr and Mary Salisbury. I am pretty sure this is wrong as no reliable sources show this and William's very

profile at Wikitree doesn't list her as daughter. However, do we have any idea of where she fits in the Parr family?

She is the daughter of Thomas and Margaret (Leyland) Parr. Jane and her husband John Fox are named in Thomas' will. See George John Piccope, editor, Lancashire and Cheshire Wills and Inventories, From the Ecclesiastical Court, Chester, Volume III [1596–
1639], O.S. 54 ([Manchester,] England: The Chetham Society, 1861), 118. Jane's ancestry, as I have it (always subject to corrections), can be followed from here: https://www.gdcooke.org/ss/org2-o/p4943.htm . Note that her ancestry is not from the more
prestigious Parrs that Jacobus suggested, at least, not that I can see.

Greg

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On Saturday, October 16, 2021 at 8:49:35 AM UTC-7, gdco...@gmail.com wrote:

On Friday, October 15, 2021 at 5:39:50 PM UTC-7, Paulo Ricardo Canedo wrote:

Jane Parr, wife of John Fox, was greatgrandmother of Obadiah Bruen. https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Parr-850 has her as daughter of William Parr and Mary Salisbury. I am pretty sure this is wrong as no reliable sources show this and William's very

profile at Wikitree doesn't list her as daughter. However, do we have any idea of where she fits in the Parr family?

She is the daughter of Thomas and Margaret (Leyland) Parr. Jane and her husband John Fox are named in Thomas' will. See George John Piccope, editor, Lancashire and Cheshire Wills and Inventories, From the Ecclesiastical Court, Chester, Volume III [1596â

€“1639], O.S. 54 ([Manchester,] England: The Chetham Society, 1861), 118. Jane's ancestry, as I have it (always subject to corrections), can be followed from here: https://www.gdcooke.org/ss/org2-o/p4943.htm . Note that her ancestry is not from the more
prestigious Parrs that Jacobus suggested, at least, not that I can see.

Greg

Note that the Manor of Parre was apparently in her hands (her widowers at any rate)

https://books.google.com/books?id=7k8MAQAAMAAJ&newbks=1&newbks_redir=0&dq=thomas%20parr%20margaret%20leyland&pg=PA18#v=onepage&q&f=true

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A sábado, 16 de outubro de 2021 à(s) 16:49:35 UTC+1, gdco...@gmail.com escreveu:

On Friday, October 15, 2021 at 5:39:50 PM UTC-7, Paulo Ricardo Canedo wrote:

Jane Parr, wife of John Fox, was greatgrandmother of Obadiah Bruen. https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Parr-850 has her as daughter of William Parr and Mary Salisbury. I am pretty sure this is wrong as no reliable sources show this and William's very

profile at Wikitree doesn't list her as daughter. However, do we have any idea of where she fits in the Parr family?

She is the daughter of Thomas and Margaret (Leyland) Parr. Jane and her husband John Fox are named in Thomas' will. See George John Piccope, editor, Lancashire and Cheshire Wills and Inventories, From the Ecclesiastical Court, Chester, Volume III [1596â

€“1639], O.S. 54 ([Manchester,] England: The Chetham Society, 1861), 118. Jane's ancestry, as I have it (always subject to corrections), can be followed from here: https://www.gdcooke.org/ss/org2-o/p4943.htm . Note that her ancestry is not from the more
prestigious Parrs that Jacobus suggested, at least, not that I can see.

Greg

Thanks.

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On Saturday, October 16, 2021 at 11:59:35 AM UTC-7, Paulo Ricardo Canedo wrote:

A sábado, 16 de outubro de 2021 à(s) 16:49:35 UTC+1, gdco...@gmail.com escreveu:

On Friday, October 15, 2021 at 5:39:50 PM UTC-7, Paulo Ricardo Canedo wrote:

Jane Parr, wife of John Fox, was greatgrandmother of Obadiah Bruen. https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Parr-850 has her as daughter of William Parr and Mary Salisbury. I am pretty sure this is wrong as no reliable sources show this and William's very

profile at Wikitree doesn't list her as daughter. However, do we have any idea of where she fits in the Parr family?

She is the daughter of Thomas and Margaret (Leyland) Parr. Jane and her husband John Fox are named in Thomas' will. See George John Piccope, editor, Lancashire and Cheshire Wills and Inventories, From the Ecclesiastical Court, Chester, Volume III [

1596–1639], O.S. 54 ([Manchester,] England: The Chetham Society, 1861), 118. Jane's ancestry, as I have it (always subject to corrections), can be followed from here: https://www.gdcooke.org/ss/org2-o/p4943.htm . Note that her ancestry is not from the
more prestigious Parrs that Jacobus suggested, at least, not that I can see.

Greg

Thanks.

You might check the National Archives for mentions of this manor in this time period.
There may be more details.

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On Saturday, October 16, 2021 at 12:25:00 PM UTC-7, wjhons...@gmail.com wrote:

On Saturday, October 16, 2021 at 11:59:35 AM UTC-7, Paulo Ricardo Canedo wrote:

A sábado, 16 de outubro de 2021 à(s) 16:49:35 UTC+1, gdco...@gmail.com escreveu:

On Friday, October 15, 2021 at 5:39:50 PM UTC-7, Paulo Ricardo Canedo wrote:

Jane Parr, wife of John Fox, was greatgrandmother of Obadiah Bruen. https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Parr-850 has her as daughter of William Parr and Mary Salisbury. I am pretty sure this is wrong as no reliable sources show this and William's very

profile at Wikitree doesn't list her as daughter. However, do we have any idea of where she fits in the Parr family?

She is the daughter of Thomas and Margaret (Leyland) Parr. Jane and her husband John Fox are named in Thomas' will. See George John Piccope, editor, Lancashire and Cheshire Wills and Inventories, From the Ecclesiastical Court, Chester, Volume III [

1596–1639], O.S. 54 ([Manchester,] England: The Chetham Society, 1861), 118. Jane's ancestry, as I have it (always subject to corrections), can be followed from here: https://www.gdcooke.org/ss/org2-o/p4943.htm . Note that her ancestry is not from the
more prestigious Parrs that Jacobus suggested, at least, not that I can see.

Greg

Thanks.

You might check the National Archives for mentions of this manor in this time period.
There may be more details.

Correction; oops; mea culpa:

I just reread Thomas' will and discovered that I misstated what is in it: he does NOT give Jane's husband, nor even her married name. I have to admit my conclusion that Jane is the daughter of Thomas and Margaret (Leyland) is based on "the name's the
same," though the chronology does not rule it out. Presuming Jane, wife of John Fox is Thomas' daughter, her marriage would have occurred after 1558 when Thomas wrote his will.

Greg

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It's odd to make the explicit claim that Ellen was "married at the age of 11"

https://books.google.com/books?id=7k8MAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA19#v=onepage&q&f=false

This makes me think there is some document, somewhere, that will give us Ellen's exact birthyear

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On Sunday, October 17, 2021 at 10:40:30 AM UTC-7, Will Johnson wrote:

It's odd to make the explicit claim that Ellen was "married at the age of 11"

https://books.google.com/books?id=7k8MAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA19#v=onepage&q&f=false

This makes me think there is some document, somewhere, that will give us Ellen's exact birthyear

I have to back up one step, from my assumption that the Manor of Parr was in the hands of John Byrom d 1593 because Jane (d 1579/81) had married him and he therefore had the Manor j.u.

It turns out, perhaps even simultaneously, or by preferment that this Jane's *mother* Margaret (Leyland) after her widowhood had *also* married some Byrom as she is called "my sister" "Margaret Byrom" in the will of her brother Thomas Leyland Will dated
2 Apr 1562, proved 23 Sep 1564

Whomever she married, it's entirely possible (perhaps probable) that this man was the father, by a prior marriage, of that exact same John who married the daughter secondly

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On Sunday, October 17, 2021 at 11:16:24 AM UTC-7, wjhons...@gmail.com wrote:

On Sunday, October 17, 2021 at 10:40:30 AM UTC-7, Will Johnson wrote:

It's odd to make the explicit claim that Ellen was "married at the age of 11"

https://books.google.com/books?id=7k8MAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA19#v=onepage&q&f=false

This makes me think there is some document, somewhere, that will give us Ellen's exact birthyear

I have to back up one step, from my assumption that the Manor of Parr was in the hands of John Byrom d 1593 because Jane (d 1579/81) had married him and he therefore had the Manor j.u.

It turns out, perhaps even simultaneously, or by preferment that this Jane's *mother* Margaret (Leyland) after her widowhood had *also* married some Byrom as she is called "my sister" "Margaret Byrom" in the will of her brother Thomas Leyland Will

dated 2 Apr 1562, proved 23 Sep 1564

Whomever she married, it's entirely possible (perhaps probable) that this man was the father, by a prior marriage, of that exact same John who married the daughter secondly

This seems odd: In his will of 1558, Thomas makes no mention of a son William, said in the pedigree to be age 19 at his father's death. The other nine children shown in the pedigree are named in the will. The three sons in the pedigree are styled "
younger." Presumably William is named in an IPM I haven't seen. How unusual is this?

Greg

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On Sunday, October 17, 2021 at 2:35:09 PM UTC-7, gdco...@gmail.com wrote:

This seems odd: In his will of 1558, Thomas makes no mention of a son William,
said in the pedigree to be age 19 at his father's death. The other nine children
shown in the pedigree are named in the will. The three sons in the pedigree are
styled "younger." Presumably William is named in an IPM I haven't seen. How unusual is this?

I am not familiar with the specific context here, but I have seen an occasional will that did not name the eldest son and heir (or that only named him as executor but made no mention among the legacies). I always presumed it was because the main property
going to the eldest son was already determined by standard inheritance law, and thus it didn't need to me made explicit in the will.

taf

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