Happened across this old thread which provides useful information relative to my research into the family of Woodhouse from the manor of Wodehuse, now Woodsome Hall, at Farnley-Tyas. Thanks to everyone who contributed.

I have been researching the family le Tyes aka Teutonicus for many years now and am highly confident that Teutonicus, in the context of the family le Tyes, has nothing to do with the country Germany. This is an ancient family moniker equivalent to forms
such as "Almain," "le Rous aka Rufus," "cum Barba," "le Riche," "Brito," "le Breton," "Flanderensis," and other forms. In the same way that "le Fleming" (eg, Erchembald le Fleming) does not always mean "from Flanders," (his ancestors are from Rouen and
Pont Audemer) likewise Teutonicus does not mean "from Germany." We can also bust other myths and modern inventions, such as cum Barba meaning “bearded” or Rufus meaning “with red hair.”

In the context of the Normans, the family le Rous aka Rufus (and variants) are known by this moniker as the descendants of Rou or Roux, founder of Normandy. All administrative offices in post-Conquest England are hereditary. As scholars of the Normans
know, birthright was the most powerful social force among the Normans. Naturally, post-Conquest offices are held by kinsmen of the Norman kings of England, and these offices are entirely dominated by members of the family le Rous. I am working on a
publication to this effect now. For example, the le Rous families descended from the Domesday figure Ralph le Rous of Oxfordshire are best known for occupying the hereditary offices of Cytharista or le Harpur, the royal music minister, clerici de Camera
or de Scaccario, clerk of the privy Exchequer and Justiciar or royal justice.

King William Rufus and Alan Rufus of Brittany are just two examples. Ever wonder why Alan Rufus held much land in Rouen and was trusted with the left wing of William’s forces at Senlac? Or why Alan became the richest man in post-Conquest England? (
and one of the richest men in history) In an age of battles fought by kinsmen, Alan was just that, a paternal kinsman of Duke William of Normandy in descent from Roux.

All these forms have the meaning "with sharp points." For example, Her/ Har and Ger/Gar have this meaning and the composite Ger-Man effectively means "people who fortify their principal towns with circular rings of thorny heather." This is a naming
convention tracing back to the time of the Visigoths and all the places they governed. They were distinguished in this way by the Romans, who built square fortifications without using heather. Caesar was fascinated by these fortifications which he
complained about when writing from Gaul about the Belgae and their impenetrable rings of thorny heather. Places such as Bulgaria (Bohlger, think bowl-ger), Paris (pea-hris) and Hungary (hun-gar) each mean “circular fortification of thorny heather,”
tracing to the Visigoths of Dacia The kings and princes of Denmark and their medieval descendants always used such names. For example:
Rous (from ON hris, thorny heather)
Anulo (Latin, meaning curved, ring)
Turquetil (Tur, thorny and quetil or chetil, round)
Heriulfr (Her, thorny and ulf, round)
Turulf (Tur, thorny and ulf, round)
Anschetil (Ans, thorny and chetil, round)
Ansfrid “the Dane” (thorny bush)
Anslech (thorny heather by the lake)
Sigfried “the Dane” (thorny bush)
Sigurd (thorny, round)
Humphry or Hunfridas from Hun (curved) and frida/ frisa (thorny heather)

A funny aside. Archaeologists at Hedeby have been puzzled by the presence of Hawthorn berries in the refuse layer at Hedeby, ancient caput of the Danish kings. Their conclusion is the populace must have been starving before resorting to such a poor
food source. What they don’t realize is these instead came from the town’s fortifications.

The family "le Tyes" is a branch of my own family, which produced families such as Troyer (a manor in Cornwall held by Henry le Tyes), Harper (le Harpur aka le Tyes) of Sherbourn (now Shirburn), Oxfordshire, and Hamilton (de Sherbourn of Hambleton,
Lancashire), among many others. My own family also derives from the Domesday figure Ralph le Rous, a tenant of Roger d'Ivry and William fitz Ansculf whose son Ralph le Rous of Lancashire (fl 1100) had a son Ralph de Eggleston (Great Eccleston, Lanc)
who married Alicia de Heriz, daughter of Geoffrey de Heriz of Stapleford, which marriage produced Geoffrey de Eccleston aka de Heriz, which branched into various families Herries and Harris.


Cheers,
Michae Harris
https://groups.io/g/crispincousins/




On Monday, October 15, 2007 at 12:41:41 PM UTC-5, John P. Ravilious wrote:

Dear Nancy,
Certainly the cognomen 'Teutonicus' points to Baldwin le Tyes (or
at least a parent) having come from a German-speaking land. The name
Baldwin would tend to point to Flanders or nearby in the Lowlands area
of the Holy Roman Empire.
'Tyes' sounds like a rendering by someone hearing 'Deitsch' or
'Deutsch'. My guess would be, Baldwin or his father having come from
western Flanders or elsewhere not too far off, explained their family
or tongue being 'Deutsche' or 'Deitsch', which was then taken up by Norman-French speaking neighbors as 'le Deitsch', or 'le
Tyes' (without the hard ending). This probably needs a knowledgeable
linguist to properly handle, but at least would explain why Baldwin
could be both 'le Tyes' (Norman French) and 'Teutonicus' (Latin).
Perhaps Leo, or another of the list who speaks Nederlans or
Vlaams, would chime in on this.....?
Cheers,
John

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