• Re: Kissinger Warns Biden Against ENDLESS Confrontation With China

    From A. Filip@21:1/5 to ltlee1@hotmail.com on Wed Jul 20 20:54:34 2022
    ltlee1 <ltlee1@hotmail.com> wrote:
    "“Biden and previous administrations have been too much influenced by
    the domestic aspects of the view of China,” Kissinger, 99, said in an interview Tuesday in New York with Bloomberg News Editor-in-Chief John Micklethwait. “It is, of course, important to prevent Chinese or any
    other country’s hegemony.”

    But “that is not something that can be achieved by endless confrontations,” he added in the interview produced by Intelligence
    Squared US and How To Academy. He’s previously said the increasingly adversarial relations between the US and China risk a global
    “catastrophe comparable to World War I.”"

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/kissinger-warns-biden-against-endless-confrontation-with-china/ar-AAZL2VS

    Kissinger, nevertheless, agrees that it is important to prevent
    Chinese or any other country's hegemony. US hegemony good. Chinese
    hegemony bad. But why? […[

    A short _cynical_ version: Because he is usanesse? :-)

    --
    A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
    | All the taxes paid over a lifetime by the average American are
    | spent by the government in less than a second. (Jim Fiebig)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From ltlee1@21:1/5 to A. Filip on Thu Jul 21 09:47:19 2022
    On Wednesday, July 20, 2022 at 2:54:36 PM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
    ltlee1 wrote:
    "“Biden and previous administrations have been too much influenced by the domestic aspects of the view of China,” Kissinger, 99, said in an interview Tuesday in New York with Bloomberg News Editor-in-Chief John Micklethwait. “It is, of course, important to prevent Chinese or any other country’s hegemony.”

    But “that is not something that can be achieved by endless confrontations,” he added in the interview produced by Intelligence Squared US and How To Academy. He’s previously said the increasingly adversarial relations between the US and China risk a global “catastrophe comparable to World War I.”"

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/kissinger-warns-biden-against-endless-confrontation-with-china/ar-AAZL2VS

    Kissinger, nevertheless, agrees that it is important to prevent
    Chinese or any other country's hegemony. US hegemony good. Chinese
    hegemony bad. But why? […[

    A short _cynical_ version: Because he is usanesse? :-)

    If this kind of answer is considered legitimate, then Sino-US was is inevitable.

    --
    A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
    | All the taxes paid over a lifetime by the average American are
    | spent by the government in less than a second. (Jim Fiebig)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From A. Filip@21:1/5 to ltlee1@hotmail.com on Fri Jul 22 05:28:00 2022
    ltlee1 <ltlee1@hotmail.com> wrote:
    On Wednesday, July 20, 2022 at 2:54:36 PM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
    ltlee1 wrote:
    "“Biden and previous administrations have been too much influenced by
    the domestic aspects of the view of China,” Kissinger, 99, said in an
    interview Tuesday in New York with Bloomberg News Editor-in-Chief John
    Micklethwait. “It is, of course, important to prevent Chinese or any
    other country’s hegemony.”

    But “that is not something that can be achieved by endless
    confrontations,” he added in the interview produced by Intelligence
    Squared US and How To Academy. He’s previously said the increasingly
    adversarial relations between the US and China risk a global
    “catastrophe comparable to World War I.”"

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/kissinger-warns-biden-against-endless-confrontation-with-china/ar-AAZL2VS

    Kissinger, nevertheless, agrees that it is important to prevent
    Chinese or any other country's hegemony. US hegemony good. Chinese
    hegemony bad. But why? […[

    A short _cynical_ version: Because he is usanesse? :-)

    If this kind of answer is considered legitimate, then Sino-US was is inevitable.

    This kind of answer is illegitimate but it is based on "interests of the speaker".
    It is easier to see what you want to see.
    It is a theater played (also) for *third* parties.

    Do you expect me to treat *also* your posts not like statements of
    *interested* party? You may dream.

    --
    A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
    | I must get out of these wet clothes and into a dry Martini.
    | (Alexander Woolcott)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From ltlee1@21:1/5 to A. Filip on Fri Jul 22 04:34:13 2022
    On Thursday, July 21, 2022 at 11:28:50 PM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
    ltlee1 wrote:
    On Wednesday, July 20, 2022 at 2:54:36 PM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
    ltlee1 wrote:
    "“Biden and previous administrations have been too much influenced by >> > the domestic aspects of the view of China,” Kissinger, 99, said in an >> > interview Tuesday in New York with Bloomberg News Editor-in-Chief John >> > Micklethwait. “It is, of course, important to prevent Chinese or any >> > other country’s hegemony.”

    But “that is not something that can be achieved by endless
    confrontations,” he added in the interview produced by Intelligence >> > Squared US and How To Academy. He’s previously said the increasingly >> > adversarial relations between the US and China risk a global
    “catastrophe comparable to World War I.”"

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/kissinger-warns-biden-against-endless-confrontation-with-china/ar-AAZL2VS

    Kissinger, nevertheless, agrees that it is important to prevent
    Chinese or any other country's hegemony. US hegemony good. Chinese
    hegemony bad. But why? […[

    A short _cynical_ version: Because he is usanesse? :-)

    If this kind of answer is considered legitimate, then Sino-US was is inevitable.
    This kind of answer is illegitimate but it is based on "interests of the speaker".


    It is easier to see what you want to see.
    It is a theater played (also) for *third* parties.

    Do you expect me to treat *also* your posts not like statements of *interested* party? You may dream.

    Of course everyone, Kissinger, you or me, has he or her opinion based on interest.
    It is Kissinger's interest to think and suggest "US hegemony good. Chinese hegemony bad"
    because he is American.

    But is this reality based thinking or just wishful thinking?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From A. Filip@21:1/5 to ltlee1@hotmail.com on Fri Jul 22 15:18:41 2022
    ltlee1 <ltlee1@hotmail.com> wrote:
    On Thursday, July 21, 2022 at 11:28:50 PM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
    ltlee1 wrote:
    On Wednesday, July 20, 2022 at 2:54:36 PM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
    ltlee1 wrote:
    "“Biden and previous administrations have been too much influenced by >> >> > the domestic aspects of the view of China,” Kissinger, 99, said in an >> >> > interview Tuesday in New York with Bloomberg News Editor-in-Chief John >> >> > Micklethwait. “It is, of course, important to prevent Chinese or any >> >> > other country’s hegemony.”

    But “that is not something that can be achieved by endless
    confrontations,” he added in the interview produced by Intelligence >> >> > Squared US and How To Academy. He’s previously said the increasingly >> >> > adversarial relations between the US and China risk a global
    “catastrophe comparable to World War I.”"

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/kissinger-warns-biden-against-endless-confrontation-with-china/ar-AAZL2VS

    Kissinger, nevertheless, agrees that it is important to prevent
    Chinese or any other country's hegemony. US hegemony good. Chinese
    hegemony bad. But why? […[

    A short _cynical_ version: Because he is usanesse? :-)

    If this kind of answer is considered legitimate, then Sino-US was is inevitable.
    This kind of answer is illegitimate but it is based on "interests of the speaker".


    It is easier to see what you want to see.
    It is a theater played (also) for *third* parties.

    Do you expect me to treat *also* your posts not like statements of
    *interested* party? You may dream.

    Of course everyone, Kissinger, you or me, has he or her opinion based on interest.
    It is Kissinger's interest to think and suggest "US hegemony good. Chinese hegemony bad"
    because he is American.

    But is this reality based thinking or just wishful thinking?

    As in most cases it is a mix of both. We are unlikely+ to agree on
    _exact_ proportions because it is for many people (personal) opinion based. "Good" is so "imprecise", ask Good for WHOM, based on WHAT criteria,
    WHEN and HOW MUCH. Isn't it in US interest to "over emphasize" good consequences of US hegemony?
    Was US co-hegemony good for China when US military "visited" Beijing in 1900? Has it stayed in the same position for over a century?

    Be careful forcing (big) "not a friend" into plain enemy.
    Dose "unfriendliness" carefully. Kissinger words may be interpreted this
    way too.

    <irony? US brings freedom and democracy to the world even if "sometimes"
    it is "freedom and democracy" of Saudi Kingdom or Sisi Egypt. </irony>

    --
    A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
    | "Love may fail, but courtesy will previal." (A Kurt Vonnegut fan)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From ltlee1@21:1/5 to A. Filip on Fri Jul 22 08:09:28 2022
    On Friday, July 22, 2022 at 9:19:30 AM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
    ltlee1 wrote:
    On Thursday, July 21, 2022 at 11:28:50 PM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
    ltlee1 wrote:
    On Wednesday, July 20, 2022 at 2:54:36 PM UTC-4, A. Filip wrote:
    ltlee1 wrote:
    "“Biden and previous administrations have been too much influenced by
    the domestic aspects of the view of China,” Kissinger, 99, said in an
    interview Tuesday in New York with Bloomberg News Editor-in-Chief John
    Micklethwait. “It is, of course, important to prevent Chinese or any
    other country’s hegemony.”

    But “that is not something that can be achieved by endless
    confrontations,” he added in the interview produced by Intelligence
    Squared US and How To Academy. He’s previously said the increasingly
    adversarial relations between the US and China risk a global
    “catastrophe comparable to World War I.”"

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/kissinger-warns-biden-against-endless-confrontation-with-china/ar-AAZL2VS

    Kissinger, nevertheless, agrees that it is important to prevent
    Chinese or any other country's hegemony. US hegemony good. Chinese >> >> > hegemony bad. But why? […[

    A short _cynical_ version: Because he is usanesse? :-)

    If this kind of answer is considered legitimate, then Sino-US was is inevitable.
    This kind of answer is illegitimate but it is based on "interests of the speaker".


    It is easier to see what you want to see.
    It is a theater played (also) for *third* parties.

    Do you expect me to treat *also* your posts not like statements of
    *interested* party? You may dream.

    Of course everyone, Kissinger, you or me, has he or her opinion based on interest.
    It is Kissinger's interest to think and suggest "US hegemony good. Chinese hegemony bad"
    because he is American.

    But is this reality based thinking or just wishful thinking?
    As in most cases it is a mix of both. We are unlikely+ to agree on
    _exact_ proportions because it is for many people (personal) opinion based. "Good" is so "imprecise", ask Good for WHOM, based on WHAT criteria,
    WHEN and HOW MUCH. Isn't it in US interest to "over emphasize" good consequences of US hegemony?
    Was US co-hegemony good for China when US military "visited" Beijing in 1900?
    Has it stayed in the same position for over a century?

    Be careful forcing (big) "not a friend" into plain enemy.
    Dose "unfriendliness" carefully. Kissinger words may be interpreted this
    way too.

    <irony? US brings freedom and democracy to the world even if "sometimes"
    it is "freedom and democracy" of Saudi Kingdom or Sisi Egypt. </irony>

    If one thinks purely in term of interest, there is no friend or enemy.
    For friend or enemy to be meaningful beyond transactional, value must also
    be invoked.

    America's Middle East policy cannot balance its "freedom and democracy"
    value against interest. Hence the the "freedom and democracy" of Saudi
    Kingdom or al Sisi Egypt.

    Is America's "freedom and democracy" value really universal?
    Similarly, is America's "US hegemony good. Chinese hegemony bad"
    really universal? If so, why?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From A. Filip@21:1/5 to ltlee1@hotmail.com on Fri Jul 22 19:31:37 2022
    ltlee1 <ltlee1@hotmail.com> wrote:
    […]
    If one thinks purely in term of interest, there is no friend or enemy.
    For friend or enemy to be meaningful beyond transactional, value must also
    be invoked.

    America's Middle East policy cannot balance its "freedom and democracy"
    value against interest. Hence the the "freedom and democracy" of Saudi Kingdom or al Sisi Egypt.

    Is America's "freedom and democracy" value really universal?
    Similarly, is America's "US hegemony good. Chinese hegemony bad"
    really universal? If so, why?

    US hegemony is not good *for everyone*. IMHO US hegemony is slightly or
    more better than PRC hegemony for not too impressive majority (counting
    outside PRC and US).

    <full-cynicism> Too eager support for US hegemony "may" make too easy
    for US to lower standards even more. </full-cynicism>

    --
    A. Filip : Big (Tech) Brother is watching you.
    | Why was I born with such contemporaries? (Oscar Wilde)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)