• Re: What is "present time" in physics?

    From The Starmaker@21:1/5 to Ross Finlayson on Wed Sep 4 22:46:10 2024
    Ross Finlayson wrote:

    On 09/04/2024 08:10 AM, Richard Hachel wrote:
    The problem of relativity is the understanding of the notion of present time, that is to say the notion of simultaneity (which should not be confused with the notion of chronotropy).
    Is there on the planet Fomalhaut IV, a princess Alexandra who lives
    there, at the same time as me; me who is here on earth?
    That is to say in the same present moment?
    It must be said that yes, since whatever procedure of universal synchronization I adopt, whether mine or that of Albert Einstein, there
    is necessarily a LABEL, and only one, to characterize the existence of Alexandra simultaneous with mine.
    But according to the method of "synchronization of present time", we
    will not have the same label.
    Einstein uses procedure M, Hachel procedure H.
    Procedure M is the most practical, procedure H is the most true.
    Procedure M is the most practical, because it derives from the synchronization of the present time on a point M placed very far away in
    an imaginary fourth dimension, and at an equal distance from all the
    points constituting our universe. This gives an abstract universal time, but very useful, where the notion of universal present time is flat, and reciprocal. If A exists at the same time as B for M, then B exists at
    the same time as A for M. It is very practical.
    Procedure H proposed by Richard Hachel is less practical, but truer. It
    is less practical, because the notion of symmetry of the present time
    will not be absolute. But it is truer, physically more accurate, and
    more beautiful. It will remain eternally true experimentally, and
    eternally more beautiful philosophically. What could be more beautiful
    than saying to a child: "This horse in this meadow, this moon in the
    sky, this galaxy in this telescope, you see them instantly, as they are today, live-live".
    What is uglier than human thought, which thinks it is intelligent,
    even though it is full of stupid mockery, conceptual imbecilities,
    simply because it can say, as all morons say: "The speed of light is c,
    we know it, we have measured it, experimented with it, and we get 3.10^8m/s".
    This is the most stupid reflection in the history of humanity, proposed
    by mocking morons (Python, John Baez) who think they are funny and intelligent, authorized mockers, but who have not understood anything
    about the notion of universal anisochrony and the two possible ways in which we can (or even MUST be able to) synchronize the clocks of the universe.

    R.H.

    The (physical) space-time is a (mathematical) coordinate space, and
    the (physical) Space-Time is the continuous manifold of the field number formalism of QM combined with the inertial-systems'
    differential-system GR, where according to Einstein the GR is
    a differential-system parameterized by a "the time", and in
    QM the time-reversibility has never been falsified, with the
    time-ordering of the path-integral being pretty much classical,
    a "clock hypothesis" is not un-usual, that with respect to a
    coordinate space, yet there's only a forward-pointing ray of time,
    between zero and one a vector field over the entirety of Space-Time,
    that in deep space in absolute vacuum at absolute zero equals one.

    Clocks either slow or meet, ....

    That "there are no closed time-like curves" and "time reversibility
    has never been falsified" then as with regards to null geodesics
    and any usual ideas about using the time-like as simply an extra
    "Fourth Dimension" for only mathematical extrapolation, has that
    physically it might as well just be considered "the gradient" as
    with regards to "t" everywhere universally parameterizing the differential-system and time-ordering of GR and QM.

    This sort of theory can for example reduce functional freedom
    from 10^120 to approximately 1, while that "time dilation plus
    length contraction equals space contraction" is simply enough
    as of the FitzGeraldian and associated considerations of the
    Heaviside and Larmour with respect to Lorentz, while in QM
    there are both low-energy and high-energy supersymmetry, as
    whether "virtual" particles are just another model of continuum
    dynamics.

    I.e., all one theory, all one manifold, all one t.

    The d'Espagnat on a model philosopher's model physicist's
    model philosophy's model physics, "objective realism",
    with Broglie-Bohm and Aspect-like extra-locality, as
    with regards to "anti-realist model physics", helps
    explore then why making for a clock hypothesis and
    a "the time" as Einstein does in "Out of My Later Years",
    why curved space-time is just a model in the Cartesian
    for "space contraction" then that though its consideration
    as a "Fourth Dimension" asks a bit much of a simple numerical
    resource of a mathematical/physical continuum, continuous
    manifold.

    What time is now?

    Now here or now, or here and now??? where? here? now? is it here now?

    --
    The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
    to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable,
    and challenge the unchallengeable.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From The Starmaker@21:1/5 to The Starmaker on Thu Sep 5 09:40:59 2024
    The Starmaker wrote:

    Ross Finlayson wrote:

    On 09/04/2024 08:10 AM, Richard Hachel wrote:
    The problem of relativity is the understanding of the notion of present time, that is to say the notion of simultaneity (which should not be confused with the notion of chronotropy).
    Is there on the planet Fomalhaut IV, a princess Alexandra who lives there, at the same time as me; me who is here on earth?
    That is to say in the same present moment?
    It must be said that yes, since whatever procedure of universal synchronization I adopt, whether mine or that of Albert Einstein, there is necessarily a LABEL, and only one, to characterize the existence of Alexandra simultaneous with mine.
    But according to the method of "synchronization of present time", we
    will not have the same label.
    Einstein uses procedure M, Hachel procedure H.
    Procedure M is the most practical, procedure H is the most true. Procedure M is the most practical, because it derives from the synchronization of the present time on a point M placed very far away in an imaginary fourth dimension, and at an equal distance from all the points constituting our universe. This gives an abstract universal time, but very useful, where the notion of universal present time is flat, and reciprocal. If A exists at the same time as B for M, then B exists at
    the same time as A for M. It is very practical.
    Procedure H proposed by Richard Hachel is less practical, but truer. It is less practical, because the notion of symmetry of the present time will not be absolute. But it is truer, physically more accurate, and
    more beautiful. It will remain eternally true experimentally, and eternally more beautiful philosophically. What could be more beautiful than saying to a child: "This horse in this meadow, this moon in the
    sky, this galaxy in this telescope, you see them instantly, as they are today, live-live".
    What is uglier than human thought, which thinks it is intelligent,
    even though it is full of stupid mockery, conceptual imbecilities,
    simply because it can say, as all morons say: "The speed of light is c, we know it, we have measured it, experimented with it, and we get 3.10^8m/s".
    This is the most stupid reflection in the history of humanity, proposed by mocking morons (Python, John Baez) who think they are funny and intelligent, authorized mockers, but who have not understood anything about the notion of universal anisochrony and the two possible ways in which we can (or even MUST be able to) synchronize the clocks of the universe.

    R.H.

    The (physical) space-time is a (mathematical) coordinate space, and
    the (physical) Space-Time is the continuous manifold of the field number formalism of QM combined with the inertial-systems'
    differential-system GR, where according to Einstein the GR is
    a differential-system parameterized by a "the time", and in
    QM the time-reversibility has never been falsified, with the
    time-ordering of the path-integral being pretty much classical,
    a "clock hypothesis" is not un-usual, that with respect to a
    coordinate space, yet there's only a forward-pointing ray of time,
    between zero and one a vector field over the entirety of Space-Time,
    that in deep space in absolute vacuum at absolute zero equals one.

    Clocks either slow or meet, ....

    That "there are no closed time-like curves" and "time reversibility
    has never been falsified" then as with regards to null geodesics
    and any usual ideas about using the time-like as simply an extra
    "Fourth Dimension" for only mathematical extrapolation, has that
    physically it might as well just be considered "the gradient" as
    with regards to "t" everywhere universally parameterizing the differential-system and time-ordering of GR and QM.

    This sort of theory can for example reduce functional freedom
    from 10^120 to approximately 1, while that "time dilation plus
    length contraction equals space contraction" is simply enough
    as of the FitzGeraldian and associated considerations of the
    Heaviside and Larmour with respect to Lorentz, while in QM
    there are both low-energy and high-energy supersymmetry, as
    whether "virtual" particles are just another model of continuum
    dynamics.

    I.e., all one theory, all one manifold, all one t.

    The d'Espagnat on a model philosopher's model physicist's
    model philosophy's model physics, "objective realism",
    with Broglie-Bohm and Aspect-like extra-locality, as
    with regards to "anti-realist model physics", helps
    explore then why making for a clock hypothesis and
    a "the time" as Einstein does in "Out of My Later Years",
    why curved space-time is just a model in the Cartesian
    for "space contraction" then that though its consideration
    as a "Fourth Dimension" asks a bit much of a simple numerical
    resource of a mathematical/physical continuum, continuous
    manifold.

    What time is now?

    Now here or now, or here and now??? where? here? now? is it here now?

    The question nobody wants to ask is..Where is Now? and

    where is Here?

    Is Here and Now the same place or are they two different places?

    Here

    Now






    --
    The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
    to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable,
    and challenge the unchallengeable.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From The Starmaker@21:1/5 to Ross Finlayson on Fri Sep 6 14:58:07 2024
    Ross Finlayson wrote:

    On 09/05/2024 09:40 AM, The Starmaker wrote:
    The Starmaker wrote:

    Ross Finlayson wrote:

    On 09/04/2024 08:10 AM, Richard Hachel wrote:
    The problem of relativity is the understanding of the notion of present >>>> time, that is to say the notion of simultaneity (which should not be >>>> confused with the notion of chronotropy).
    Is there on the planet Fomalhaut IV, a princess Alexandra who lives
    there, at the same time as me; me who is here on earth?
    That is to say in the same present moment?
    It must be said that yes, since whatever procedure of universal
    synchronization I adopt, whether mine or that of Albert Einstein, there >>>> is necessarily a LABEL, and only one, to characterize the existence of >>>> Alexandra simultaneous with mine.
    But according to the method of "synchronization of present time", we >>>> will not have the same label.
    Einstein uses procedure M, Hachel procedure H.
    Procedure M is the most practical, procedure H is the most true.
    Procedure M is the most practical, because it derives from the
    synchronization of the present time on a point M placed very far away in >>>> an imaginary fourth dimension, and at an equal distance from all the >>>> points constituting our universe. This gives an abstract universal time, >>>> but very useful, where the notion of universal present time is flat, and >>>> reciprocal. If A exists at the same time as B for M, then B exists at >>>> the same time as A for M. It is very practical.
    Procedure H proposed by Richard Hachel is less practical, but truer. It >>>> is less practical, because the notion of symmetry of the present time >>>> will not be absolute. But it is truer, physically more accurate, and >>>> more beautiful. It will remain eternally true experimentally, and
    eternally more beautiful philosophically. What could be more beautiful >>>> than saying to a child: "This horse in this meadow, this moon in the >>>> sky, this galaxy in this telescope, you see them instantly, as they are >>>> today, live-live".
    What is uglier than human thought, which thinks it is intelligent,
    even though it is full of stupid mockery, conceptual imbecilities,
    simply because it can say, as all morons say: "The speed of light is c, >>>> we know it, we have measured it, experimented with it, and we get
    3.10^8m/s".
    This is the most stupid reflection in the history of humanity, proposed >>>> by mocking morons (Python, John Baez) who think they are funny and
    intelligent, authorized mockers, but who have not understood anything >>>> about the notion of universal anisochrony and the two possible ways in >>>> which we can (or even MUST be able to) synchronize the clocks of the >>>> universe.

    R.H.

    The (physical) space-time is a (mathematical) coordinate space, and
    the (physical) Space-Time is the continuous manifold of the field number >>> formalism of QM combined with the inertial-systems'
    differential-system GR, where according to Einstein the GR is
    a differential-system parameterized by a "the time", and in
    QM the time-reversibility has never been falsified, with the
    time-ordering of the path-integral being pretty much classical,
    a "clock hypothesis" is not un-usual, that with respect to a
    coordinate space, yet there's only a forward-pointing ray of time,
    between zero and one a vector field over the entirety of Space-Time,
    that in deep space in absolute vacuum at absolute zero equals one.

    Clocks either slow or meet, ....

    That "there are no closed time-like curves" and "time reversibility
    has never been falsified" then as with regards to null geodesics
    and any usual ideas about using the time-like as simply an extra
    "Fourth Dimension" for only mathematical extrapolation, has that
    physically it might as well just be considered "the gradient" as
    with regards to "t" everywhere universally parameterizing the
    differential-system and time-ordering of GR and QM.

    This sort of theory can for example reduce functional freedom
    from 10^120 to approximately 1, while that "time dilation plus
    length contraction equals space contraction" is simply enough
    as of the FitzGeraldian and associated considerations of the
    Heaviside and Larmour with respect to Lorentz, while in QM
    there are both low-energy and high-energy supersymmetry, as
    whether "virtual" particles are just another model of continuum
    dynamics.

    I.e., all one theory, all one manifold, all one t.

    The d'Espagnat on a model philosopher's model physicist's
    model philosophy's model physics, "objective realism",
    with Broglie-Bohm and Aspect-like extra-locality, as
    with regards to "anti-realist model physics", helps
    explore then why making for a clock hypothesis and
    a "the time" as Einstein does in "Out of My Later Years",
    why curved space-time is just a model in the Cartesian
    for "space contraction" then that though its consideration
    as a "Fourth Dimension" asks a bit much of a simple numerical
    resource of a mathematical/physical continuum, continuous
    manifold.

    What time is now?

    Now here or now, or here and now??? where? here? now? is it here now?

    The question nobody wants to ask is..Where is Now? and

    where is Here?

    Is Here and Now the same place or are they two different places?

    Here

    Now







    "Do you know who ...?" "Yeah"

    I know it's Now everywhere, but is Here and Now Here or is Here
    everywhere, or over there or

    Here, There.. Everywhere?

    What time is it Here, and what time is it over there, is Here here? Is
    there here?








    --
    The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
    to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable,
    and challenge the unchallengeable.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From The Starmaker@21:1/5 to Ross Finlayson on Sat Sep 7 10:05:36 2024
    Ross Finlayson wrote:

    On 09/06/2024 08:53 PM, Ross Finlayson wrote:
    On 09/06/2024 05:07 PM, Ross Finlayson wrote:
    On 09/06/2024 02:58 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
    Ross Finlayson wrote:

    On 09/05/2024 09:40 AM, The Starmaker wrote:
    The Starmaker wrote:

    Ross Finlayson wrote:

    On 09/04/2024 08:10 AM, Richard Hachel wrote:
    The problem of relativity is the understanding of the notion of >>>>>>>> present
    time, that is to say the notion of simultaneity (which should >>>>>>>> not be
    confused with the notion of chronotropy).
    Is there on the planet Fomalhaut IV, a princess Alexandra who lives >>>>>>>> there, at the same time as me; me who is here on earth?
    That is to say in the same present moment?
    It must be said that yes, since whatever procedure of universal >>>>>>>> synchronization I adopt, whether mine or that of Albert Einstein, >>>>>>>> there
    is necessarily a LABEL, and only one, to characterize the
    existence of
    Alexandra simultaneous with mine.
    But according to the method of "synchronization of present
    time", we
    will not have the same label.
    Einstein uses procedure M, Hachel procedure H.
    Procedure M is the most practical, procedure H is the most true. >>>>>>>> Procedure M is the most practical, because it derives from the >>>>>>>> synchronization of the present time on a point M placed very far >>>>>>>> away in
    an imaginary fourth dimension, and at an equal distance from all >>>>>>>> the
    points constituting our universe. This gives an abstract
    universal time,
    but very useful, where the notion of universal present time is >>>>>>>> flat, and
    reciprocal. If A exists at the same time as B for M, then B
    exists at
    the same time as A for M. It is very practical.
    Procedure H proposed by Richard Hachel is less practical, but >>>>>>>> truer. It
    is less practical, because the notion of symmetry of the present >>>>>>>> time
    will not be absolute. But it is truer, physically more accurate, >>>>>>>> and
    more beautiful. It will remain eternally true experimentally, and >>>>>>>> eternally more beautiful philosophically. What could be more >>>>>>>> beautiful
    than saying to a child: "This horse in this meadow, this moon in >>>>>>>> the
    sky, this galaxy in this telescope, you see them instantly, as >>>>>>>> they are
    today, live-live".
    What is uglier than human thought, which thinks it is intelligent, >>>>>>>> even though it is full of stupid mockery, conceptual imbecilities, >>>>>>>> simply because it can say, as all morons say: "The speed of light >>>>>>>> is c,
    we know it, we have measured it, experimented with it, and we get >>>>>>>> 3.10^8m/s".
    This is the most stupid reflection in the history of humanity, >>>>>>>> proposed
    by mocking morons (Python, John Baez) who think they are funny and >>>>>>>> intelligent, authorized mockers, but who have not understood >>>>>>>> anything
    about the notion of universal anisochrony and the two possible >>>>>>>> ways in
    which we can (or even MUST be able to) synchronize the clocks of >>>>>>>> the
    universe.

    R.H.

    The (physical) space-time is a (mathematical) coordinate space, and >>>>>>> the (physical) Space-Time is the continuous manifold of the field >>>>>>> number
    formalism of QM combined with the inertial-systems'
    differential-system GR, where according to Einstein the GR is
    a differential-system parameterized by a "the time", and in
    QM the time-reversibility has never been falsified, with the
    time-ordering of the path-integral being pretty much classical, >>>>>>> a "clock hypothesis" is not un-usual, that with respect to a
    coordinate space, yet there's only a forward-pointing ray of time, >>>>>>> between zero and one a vector field over the entirety of Space-Time, >>>>>>> that in deep space in absolute vacuum at absolute zero equals one. >>>>>>>
    Clocks either slow or meet, ....

    That "there are no closed time-like curves" and "time reversibility >>>>>>> has never been falsified" then as with regards to null geodesics >>>>>>> and any usual ideas about using the time-like as simply an extra >>>>>>> "Fourth Dimension" for only mathematical extrapolation, has that >>>>>>> physically it might as well just be considered "the gradient" as >>>>>>> with regards to "t" everywhere universally parameterizing the
    differential-system and time-ordering of GR and QM.

    This sort of theory can for example reduce functional freedom
    from 10^120 to approximately 1, while that "time dilation plus >>>>>>> length contraction equals space contraction" is simply enough
    as of the FitzGeraldian and associated considerations of the
    Heaviside and Larmour with respect to Lorentz, while in QM
    there are both low-energy and high-energy supersymmetry, as
    whether "virtual" particles are just another model of continuum >>>>>>> dynamics.

    I.e., all one theory, all one manifold, all one t.

    The d'Espagnat on a model philosopher's model physicist's
    model philosophy's model physics, "objective realism",
    with Broglie-Bohm and Aspect-like extra-locality, as
    with regards to "anti-realist model physics", helps
    explore then why making for a clock hypothesis and
    a "the time" as Einstein does in "Out of My Later Years",
    why curved space-time is just a model in the Cartesian
    for "space contraction" then that though its consideration
    as a "Fourth Dimension" asks a bit much of a simple numerical
    resource of a mathematical/physical continuum, continuous
    manifold.

    What time is now?

    Now here or now, or here and now??? where? here? now? is it here now? >>>>>>
    The question nobody wants to ask is..Where is Now? and

    where is Here?

    Is Here and Now the same place or are they two different places?

    Here

    Now







    "Do you know who ...?" "Yeah"

    I know it's Now everywhere, but is Here and Now Here or is Here
    everywhere, or over there or

    Here, There.. Everywhere?

    What time is it Here, and what time is it over there, is Here here? Is >>> there here?









    The idea of space contraction is still "Lorentzian" while it must
    still explain both length contraction and time dilation, which get
    arrived at according to both cosmological constant and L-principle
    and mass-energy equivalency, according to light-speed being the
    metered propagation of information, that the propagation of information
    is free, while metered, in terms of these establishing any reason
    why there's not otherwise just plain universal-time, at all.

    The idea is that there's FitzGerald, sitting next to Heaviside and
    Faraday and Larmour, a bit separately from Maxwell, yet as well all
    involved in E&M and the fields of potential, among a sort of tetrad
    of quantities, like electron/proton neutron/photon, charge/mass
    rest/motion and these kinds of things, in sum-of-histories
    sum-of-potentials.

    FitzGerald makes for a different Lorentzian than Maxwell and Einstein
    respectively, who make Lorentzians, as with regards to dx+dy+dz, -dt,
    and ds with regards to the metric, or for the Laplacian so related,
    dx^2+dy^2+dx^2, -dy, squared, and ds, squared, and that being zero.

    This way, what results is that the linear is Galilean again,
    and, the rotational, is free and independent itself, while
    yet both are Lorentzian, so that space-contraction, means
    nothing to objects in their orbits moving linearly, and
    makes for clock-slowing for objects moving circularly in
    their orbits.


    So, you don't have to care what time it is and can assume it's
    the same everywhere, except with regards to coming and going
    from quite distinct orbits and trajectories, that basically
    appear mostly classical while when they meet and part can show
    that the object having entered and left a free rotational slowed
    then met and demonstrates space contraction centrally and inwardly,
    while the object in linear motion plain departed and exhibits
    space-contraction in its own space-frame and space-frame?


    Or, you care, then can have what looks like a continuous space-time
    manifold again be re-attaching a FitzGeraldian (and Galilean) while
    still Lorentzian interpretation, for linear motion and kinetics,
    and rotational motion and kinematics, distinctly.


    When you look into Larmour forces then Faraday then Compton effect
    and so on, this is sort of the super-classical and non-linear which
    is sort of what theoretical physicists need to equip their model
    philosophy with if they'd care to get past the usual plain fluid
    model of electricity, which while correct and all "classically",
    ends up not sufficing more "thoroughly".

    For example, look into the 20 or more other lettered fields
    of electrical and electromagnetic potential besides B, D, and E,
    since at least the fin de siecle or Heaviside who have us the
    telegrapher's equation, Faraday, and Larmour. Then FitzGerald
    is for your space contraction, while of course other usual sorts
    of Lorentzians like Maxwell's and Einstein's have their own bits,
    as related to various particulars, in the dynamics.

    I.e. if you give Lorentzians then the rest of Relativity Theory
    has nothing else to say about it, at all.





    Larmor, rather.

    "Quasilinear theory of Brillouin resonances
    in rotating magnetized plasmas"


    "It is, however, shown that the Landau and cyclotron resonance
    conditions which classically describe resonant energy–momentum exchange between waves and particles are no longer valid in a rotating magnetized plasma column. In this case a new resonance
    condition which involves a resonant matching between the wave frequency, the cyclotron frequency modified by inertial effects and the harmonics
    of the guiding centre rotation is identified."
    -- Rax, Guerolt, Fisch

    Nienhuis appears to have an industry in "Faraday rotation".


    "Brillouin" and "resonance theory" for that matter is
    sort of usual when wave mechanics just won't do.

    "... the first successful application of rotating non-neutral plasmas
    was the magnetron microwave source theorized by Brillouin (1945)."


    "While quasilinear radial transport has been studied
    within the framework of non-neutral plasmas confinement deploying a so-called ‘rotating wall technique’ (Eggleston & O’Neil 1999; Kiwamoto,
    Soga & Aoki 2005), these studies were restricted to electrostatic modes. Finite Larmor radius effects were also neglected
    as an infinite magnetic field was assumed. Lastly, although inertial effects are central to equilibria in Brillouin configurations, these studies neglected inertial effects so that the resonance condition is limited to the axial Doppler-shifted resonance between the plasma
    rotation and the wave frequency. These restrictions are removed in the present paper."

    "Brillouin modes ...".

    "In summary, the first term on the right-hand side of (8.8) corresponds
    to a change of the moment of inertia of the particle as a result of the quasilinear radial drift and Larmor radius evolution."


    Of course you can read this for yourself and make of it what it is.


    "Although angular momentum exchange between a wave and a rotating plasma
    is of importance both to astrophysics (Goldreich & Julian 1969; Julian 1973; Ferrière 2006) and laboratory plasmas (Kostyukov et al. 2002; Shvets, Fisch & Rax 2002; Thaury et al. 2013), a kinetic model of this interaction had to our knowledge never been proposed."


    "Appendix A. The SAM and OAM of a vector field Consider a wave field
    A(r) exp jωt. The identification of (i) linear momentum, (ii) SAM
    and (iii) OAM eigenstates can be guided by the analysis of the transformation properties of the wave under translations and rotations."

    "The next step is to consider a Fourier decomposition of the O(V) oscillating Vlasov terms."

    Refers to a GARETZ , B.A. 1981 Angular Doppler effect. J. Opt. Soc. Am.
    71 (5), 609


    GOUGH , W. 1986 The angular momentum of radiation. Eur. J. Phys. 7 (2), 81–87.

    RAX , J.M. 1992 Compton harmonic resonances, stochastic instabilities, quasilinear diffusion, and collisionless damping with
    ultra-high-intensity laser waves. Phys. Fluids B 4 (12), 3962–3972.

    RAX , J.-M. & GUEROULT , R. 2021 Faraday–Fresnel rotation and splitting of orbital angular momentum carrying waves in a rotating plasma. J.
    Plasma Phys. 87 (5), 905870507.

    ("... we use the usual rule <Re[a(u)]Re[b(u)]>_u
    = Re[a(u)b^∗(u)]/2 ...".)


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vlasov_equation


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levi-Civita_connection

    Reintroduces "parallel transport", even "teleparallelism".


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_transport https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teleparallelism


    Anyways you just come up with Lorentzians for
    the propagation equations and that's Relativity.


    Right about now





    "In classical electrodynamics, problems are typically divided into two classes:

    Problems in which the charge and current sources of fields are specified
    and the fields are calculated, and

    The reverse situation, problems in which the fields are specified and
    the motion of particles are calculated."

    -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abraham%E2%80%93Lorentz_force#Background

    "The reason for this is twofold:

    Neglect of the "self-fields" usually leads to answers that are accurate enough for many applications, and
    Inclusion of self-fields leads to problems in physics such as renormalization, some of which are still unsolved, that relate to the
    very nature of matter and energy.

    These conceptual problems created by self-fields are highlighted in a standard graduate text. [Jackson]

    The difficulties presented by this problem touch one of the most
    fundamental aspects of physics, the nature of the elementary particle. Although partial solutions, workable within limited areas, can be given,
    the basic problem remains unsolved. One might hope that the transition
    from classical to quantum-mechanical treatments would remove the difficulties. While there is still hope that this may eventually occur,
    the present quantum-mechanical discussions are beset with even more
    elaborate troubles than the classical ones. It is one of the triumphs of comparatively recent years (~ 1948–1950) that the concepts of Lorentz covariance and gauge invariance were exploited sufficiently cleverly to circumvent these difficulties in quantum electrodynamics and so allow
    the calculation of very small radiative effects to extremely high
    precision, in full agreement with experiment. From a fundamental point
    of view, however, the difficulties remain. "

    Or, "QED is sort of a propitious lie".

    Anyways for _classical_ motion and "zero-eth laws" of motion,
    then getting into things like "the infinitely-many higher orders
    of acceleration, which are formally non-zero", helps reflect
    for example that while Born's "Restless Universe" has nowhere
    that v = 0, at the same time it results that nowhere are any
    of the infinitely-many higher orders of acceleration zero!
    What results in changes that Born is both contradicted and
    in the Mach-ian confirmed!

    (This is usually enough that "the potential fields are the
    real fields" and "it's, sum-of-histories, and, sum-of-potentials".)

    You know why renormalization is such a problem for physics?
    Because "normalization" is really "de-normalization".

    So, for space-contraction and the linear and rotational being
    different at all, makes for that it's simple that Lorentzians
    are given, and it's a gauge theory, and that objects moving
    linearly are, ..., "mostly space" and carry their space-frames
    and frame-spaces with them, while, objects moving rotationally
    are both free and focal as it were, with space-contraction on
    the in-side.

    All this "abstract physics", absent even a notion of the
    infinitely-many higher orders of acceleration all formally
    non-zero while each yet vanishing, has that mathematics _owes_
    physics why this is so so that philosophers and physicists like
    d'Espagnat can equip model philosopher's model physicists' like
    Einstein's with enough mental apparatus of the true super-classical
    to arrive at the true centrifugal and fulfill things like
    "the zero-eth laws of motion", which are slightly yet only
    so much more so involved than otherwise the first few.

    According to Einstein in "Out of My Later Years",
    the "present time" is what is called "the time",
    and usually pronounced "thee" to indicate that
    moreso than trivial, it's proper, the definite article.


    The "present time" in einstein's mind is 'what time is it there?'


    The NOW time is the time it is ...Now.

    Since Now is everywhere...'"What time it it now?" can also mean, not
    here, there but everywhere.


    What time is it Everywhere, Now?


    Not, 'what time do you have?' since you means there.


    What time is it Everywhere, Now?


    Your 'clocks' do not apply.

    Because you all have the wrong time...now.


    --
    The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
    to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable,
    and challenge the unchallengeable.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From The Starmaker@21:1/5 to Ross Finlayson on Sat Sep 7 10:34:39 2024
    Ross Finlayson wrote:

    On 09/06/2024 08:53 PM, Ross Finlayson wrote:
    On 09/06/2024 05:07 PM, Ross Finlayson wrote:
    On 09/06/2024 02:58 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
    Ross Finlayson wrote:

    On 09/05/2024 09:40 AM, The Starmaker wrote:
    The Starmaker wrote:

    Ross Finlayson wrote:

    On 09/04/2024 08:10 AM, Richard Hachel wrote:
    The problem of relativity is the understanding of the notion of >>>>>>>> present
    time, that is to say the notion of simultaneity (which should >>>>>>>> not be
    confused with the notion of chronotropy).
    Is there on the planet Fomalhaut IV, a princess Alexandra who lives >>>>>>>> there, at the same time as me; me who is here on earth?
    That is to say in the same present moment?
    It must be said that yes, since whatever procedure of universal >>>>>>>> synchronization I adopt, whether mine or that of Albert Einstein, >>>>>>>> there
    is necessarily a LABEL, and only one, to characterize the
    existence of
    Alexandra simultaneous with mine.
    But according to the method of "synchronization of present
    time", we
    will not have the same label.
    Einstein uses procedure M, Hachel procedure H.
    Procedure M is the most practical, procedure H is the most true. >>>>>>>> Procedure M is the most practical, because it derives from the >>>>>>>> synchronization of the present time on a point M placed very far >>>>>>>> away in
    an imaginary fourth dimension, and at an equal distance from all >>>>>>>> the
    points constituting our universe. This gives an abstract
    universal time,
    but very useful, where the notion of universal present time is >>>>>>>> flat, and
    reciprocal. If A exists at the same time as B for M, then B
    exists at
    the same time as A for M. It is very practical.
    Procedure H proposed by Richard Hachel is less practical, but >>>>>>>> truer. It
    is less practical, because the notion of symmetry of the present >>>>>>>> time
    will not be absolute. But it is truer, physically more accurate, >>>>>>>> and
    more beautiful. It will remain eternally true experimentally, and >>>>>>>> eternally more beautiful philosophically. What could be more >>>>>>>> beautiful
    than saying to a child: "This horse in this meadow, this moon in >>>>>>>> the
    sky, this galaxy in this telescope, you see them instantly, as >>>>>>>> they are
    today, live-live".
    What is uglier than human thought, which thinks it is intelligent, >>>>>>>> even though it is full of stupid mockery, conceptual imbecilities, >>>>>>>> simply because it can say, as all morons say: "The speed of light >>>>>>>> is c,
    we know it, we have measured it, experimented with it, and we get >>>>>>>> 3.10^8m/s".
    This is the most stupid reflection in the history of humanity, >>>>>>>> proposed
    by mocking morons (Python, John Baez) who think they are funny and >>>>>>>> intelligent, authorized mockers, but who have not understood >>>>>>>> anything
    about the notion of universal anisochrony and the two possible >>>>>>>> ways in
    which we can (or even MUST be able to) synchronize the clocks of >>>>>>>> the
    universe.

    R.H.

    The (physical) space-time is a (mathematical) coordinate space, and >>>>>>> the (physical) Space-Time is the continuous manifold of the field >>>>>>> number
    formalism of QM combined with the inertial-systems'
    differential-system GR, where according to Einstein the GR is
    a differential-system parameterized by a "the time", and in
    QM the time-reversibility has never been falsified, with the
    time-ordering of the path-integral being pretty much classical, >>>>>>> a "clock hypothesis" is not un-usual, that with respect to a
    coordinate space, yet there's only a forward-pointing ray of time, >>>>>>> between zero and one a vector field over the entirety of Space-Time, >>>>>>> that in deep space in absolute vacuum at absolute zero equals one. >>>>>>>
    Clocks either slow or meet, ....

    That "there are no closed time-like curves" and "time reversibility >>>>>>> has never been falsified" then as with regards to null geodesics >>>>>>> and any usual ideas about using the time-like as simply an extra >>>>>>> "Fourth Dimension" for only mathematical extrapolation, has that >>>>>>> physically it might as well just be considered "the gradient" as >>>>>>> with regards to "t" everywhere universally parameterizing the
    differential-system and time-ordering of GR and QM.

    This sort of theory can for example reduce functional freedom
    from 10^120 to approximately 1, while that "time dilation plus >>>>>>> length contraction equals space contraction" is simply enough
    as of the FitzGeraldian and associated considerations of the
    Heaviside and Larmour with respect to Lorentz, while in QM
    there are both low-energy and high-energy supersymmetry, as
    whether "virtual" particles are just another model of continuum >>>>>>> dynamics.

    I.e., all one theory, all one manifold, all one t.

    The d'Espagnat on a model philosopher's model physicist's
    model philosophy's model physics, "objective realism",
    with Broglie-Bohm and Aspect-like extra-locality, as
    with regards to "anti-realist model physics", helps
    explore then why making for a clock hypothesis and
    a "the time" as Einstein does in "Out of My Later Years",
    why curved space-time is just a model in the Cartesian
    for "space contraction" then that though its consideration
    as a "Fourth Dimension" asks a bit much of a simple numerical
    resource of a mathematical/physical continuum, continuous
    manifold.

    What time is now?

    Now here or now, or here and now??? where? here? now? is it here now? >>>>>>
    The question nobody wants to ask is..Where is Now? and

    where is Here?

    Is Here and Now the same place or are they two different places?

    Here

    Now







    "Do you know who ...?" "Yeah"

    I know it's Now everywhere, but is Here and Now Here or is Here
    everywhere, or over there or

    Here, There.. Everywhere?

    What time is it Here, and what time is it over there, is Here here? Is >>> there here?









    The idea of space contraction is still "Lorentzian" while it must
    still explain both length contraction and time dilation, which get
    arrived at according to both cosmological constant and L-principle
    and mass-energy equivalency, according to light-speed being the
    metered propagation of information, that the propagation of information
    is free, while metered, in terms of these establishing any reason
    why there's not otherwise just plain universal-time, at all.

    The idea is that there's FitzGerald, sitting next to Heaviside and
    Faraday and Larmour, a bit separately from Maxwell, yet as well all
    involved in E&M and the fields of potential, among a sort of tetrad
    of quantities, like electron/proton neutron/photon, charge/mass
    rest/motion and these kinds of things, in sum-of-histories
    sum-of-potentials.

    FitzGerald makes for a different Lorentzian than Maxwell and Einstein
    respectively, who make Lorentzians, as with regards to dx+dy+dz, -dt,
    and ds with regards to the metric, or for the Laplacian so related,
    dx^2+dy^2+dx^2, -dy, squared, and ds, squared, and that being zero.

    This way, what results is that the linear is Galilean again,
    and, the rotational, is free and independent itself, while
    yet both are Lorentzian, so that space-contraction, means
    nothing to objects in their orbits moving linearly, and
    makes for clock-slowing for objects moving circularly in
    their orbits.


    So, you don't have to care what time it is and can assume it's
    the same everywhere, except with regards to coming and going
    from quite distinct orbits and trajectories, that basically
    appear mostly classical while when they meet and part can show
    that the object having entered and left a free rotational slowed
    then met and demonstrates space contraction centrally and inwardly,
    while the object in linear motion plain departed and exhibits
    space-contraction in its own space-frame and space-frame?


    Or, you care, then can have what looks like a continuous space-time
    manifold again be re-attaching a FitzGeraldian (and Galilean) while
    still Lorentzian interpretation, for linear motion and kinetics,
    and rotational motion and kinematics, distinctly.


    When you look into Larmour forces then Faraday then Compton effect
    and so on, this is sort of the super-classical and non-linear which
    is sort of what theoretical physicists need to equip their model
    philosophy with if they'd care to get past the usual plain fluid
    model of electricity, which while correct and all "classically",
    ends up not sufficing more "thoroughly".

    For example, look into the 20 or more other lettered fields
    of electrical and electromagnetic potential besides B, D, and E,
    since at least the fin de siecle or Heaviside who have us the
    telegrapher's equation, Faraday, and Larmour. Then FitzGerald
    is for your space contraction, while of course other usual sorts
    of Lorentzians like Maxwell's and Einstein's have their own bits,
    as related to various particulars, in the dynamics.

    I.e. if you give Lorentzians then the rest of Relativity Theory
    has nothing else to say about it, at all.





    Larmor, rather.

    "Quasilinear theory of Brillouin resonances
    in rotating magnetized plasmas"


    "It is, however, shown that the Landau and cyclotron resonance
    conditions which classically describe resonant energy–momentum exchange between waves and particles are no longer valid in a rotating magnetized plasma column. In this case a new resonance
    condition which involves a resonant matching between the wave frequency, the cyclotron frequency modified by inertial effects and the harmonics
    of the guiding centre rotation is identified."
    -- Rax, Guerolt, Fisch

    Nienhuis appears to have an industry in "Faraday rotation".


    "Brillouin" and "resonance theory" for that matter is
    sort of usual when wave mechanics just won't do.

    "... the first successful application of rotating non-neutral plasmas
    was the magnetron microwave source theorized by Brillouin (1945)."


    "While quasilinear radial transport has been studied
    within the framework of non-neutral plasmas confinement deploying a so-called ‘rotating wall technique’ (Eggleston & O’Neil 1999; Kiwamoto,
    Soga & Aoki 2005), these studies were restricted to electrostatic modes. Finite Larmor radius effects were also neglected
    as an infinite magnetic field was assumed. Lastly, although inertial effects are central to equilibria in Brillouin configurations, these studies neglected inertial effects so that the resonance condition is limited to the axial Doppler-shifted resonance between the plasma
    rotation and the wave frequency. These restrictions are removed in the present paper."

    "Brillouin modes ...".

    "In summary, the first term on the right-hand side of (8.8) corresponds
    to a change of the moment of inertia of the particle as a result of the quasilinear radial drift and Larmor radius evolution."


    Of course you can read this for yourself and make of it what it is.


    "Although angular momentum exchange between a wave and a rotating plasma
    is of importance both to astrophysics (Goldreich & Julian 1969; Julian 1973; Ferrière 2006) and laboratory plasmas (Kostyukov et al. 2002; Shvets, Fisch & Rax 2002; Thaury et al. 2013), a kinetic model of this interaction had to our knowledge never been proposed."


    "Appendix A. The SAM and OAM of a vector field Consider a wave field
    A(r) exp jωt. The identification of (i) linear momentum, (ii) SAM
    and (iii) OAM eigenstates can be guided by the analysis of the transformation properties of the wave under translations and rotations."

    "The next step is to consider a Fourier decomposition of the O(V) oscillating Vlasov terms."

    Refers to a GARETZ , B.A. 1981 Angular Doppler effect. J. Opt. Soc. Am.
    71 (5), 609


    GOUGH , W. 1986 The angular momentum of radiation. Eur. J. Phys. 7 (2), 81–87.

    RAX , J.M. 1992 Compton harmonic resonances, stochastic instabilities, quasilinear diffusion, and collisionless damping with
    ultra-high-intensity laser waves. Phys. Fluids B 4 (12), 3962–3972.

    RAX , J.-M. & GUEROULT , R. 2021 Faraday–Fresnel rotation and splitting of orbital angular momentum carrying waves in a rotating plasma. J.
    Plasma Phys. 87 (5), 905870507.

    ("... we use the usual rule <Re[a(u)]Re[b(u)]>_u
    = Re[a(u)b^∗(u)]/2 ...".)


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vlasov_equation


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levi-Civita_connection

    Reintroduces "parallel transport", even "teleparallelism".


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_transport https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teleparallelism


    Anyways you just come up with Lorentzians for
    the propagation equations and that's Relativity.


    Right about now





    "In classical electrodynamics, problems are typically divided into two classes:

    Problems in which the charge and current sources of fields are specified
    and the fields are calculated, and

    The reverse situation, problems in which the fields are specified and
    the motion of particles are calculated."

    -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abraham%E2%80%93Lorentz_force#Background

    "The reason for this is twofold:

    Neglect of the "self-fields" usually leads to answers that are accurate enough for many applications, and
    Inclusion of self-fields leads to problems in physics such as renormalization, some of which are still unsolved, that relate to the
    very nature of matter and energy.

    These conceptual problems created by self-fields are highlighted in a standard graduate text. [Jackson]

    The difficulties presented by this problem touch one of the most
    fundamental aspects of physics, the nature of the elementary particle. Although partial solutions, workable within limited areas, can be given,
    the basic problem remains unsolved. One might hope that the transition
    from classical to quantum-mechanical treatments would remove the difficulties. While there is still hope that this may eventually occur,
    the present quantum-mechanical discussions are beset with even more
    elaborate troubles than the classical ones. It is one of the triumphs of comparatively recent years (~ 1948–1950) that the concepts of Lorentz covariance and gauge invariance were exploited sufficiently cleverly to circumvent these difficulties in quantum electrodynamics and so allow
    the calculation of very small radiative effects to extremely high
    precision, in full agreement with experiment. From a fundamental point
    of view, however, the difficulties remain. "

    Or, "QED is sort of a propitious lie".

    Anyways for _classical_ motion and "zero-eth laws" of motion,
    then getting into things like "the infinitely-many higher orders
    of acceleration, which are formally non-zero", helps reflect
    for example that while Born's "Restless Universe" has nowhere
    that v = 0, at the same time it results that nowhere are any
    of the infinitely-many higher orders of acceleration zero!
    What results in changes that Born is both contradicted and
    in the Mach-ian confirmed!

    (This is usually enough that "the potential fields are the
    real fields" and "it's, sum-of-histories, and, sum-of-potentials".)

    You know why renormalization is such a problem for physics?
    Because "normalization" is really "de-normalization".

    So, for space-contraction and the linear and rotational being
    different at all, makes for that it's simple that Lorentzians
    are given, and it's a gauge theory, and that objects moving
    linearly are, ..., "mostly space" and carry their space-frames
    and frame-spaces with them, while, objects moving rotationally
    are both free and focal as it were, with space-contraction on
    the in-side.

    All this "abstract physics", absent even a notion of the
    infinitely-many higher orders of acceleration all formally
    non-zero while each yet vanishing, has that mathematics _owes_
    physics why this is so so that philosophers and physicists like
    d'Espagnat can equip model philosopher's model physicists' like
    Einstein's with enough mental apparatus of the true super-classical
    to arrive at the true centrifugal and fulfill things like
    "the zero-eth laws of motion", which are slightly yet only
    so much more so involved than otherwise the first few.

    According to Einstein in "Out of My Later Years",
    the "present time" is what is called "the time",
    and usually pronounced "thee" to indicate that
    moreso than trivial, it's proper, the definite article.


    Eisnein's "present time" refers to here or there time, not everywhere
    time.


    --
    The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
    to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable,
    and challenge the unchallengeable.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)