• OT: Life from a drop of rain, New research suggests rainwater helped fo

    From Jan Panteltje@21:1/5 to All on Thu Aug 22 04:33:34 2024
    Life from a drop of rain: New research suggests rainwater helped form the first protocell walls
    A Nobel-winning biologist, two engineering schools, and a vial of Houston rainwater
    cast new light on the origin of life on Earth
    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/08/240821150020.htm
    Date:
    August 21, 2024
    Source:
    University of Chicago
    Summary:
    New research shows that rainwater could have helped create a meshy wall around protocells 3.8 billion years ago, a critical step in the transition from tiny beads of RNA to every bacterium, plant, animal, and human that ever lived.

    There you go, simplicity!

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  • From boB@21:1/5 to All on Thu Aug 22 15:08:06 2024
    On Thu, 22 Aug 2024 04:33:34 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
    wrote:

    Life from a drop of rain: New research suggests rainwater helped form the first protocell walls
    A Nobel-winning biologist, two engineering schools, and a vial of Houston rainwater
    cast new light on the origin of life on Earth
    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/08/240821150020.htm
    Date:
    August 21, 2024
    Source:
    University of Chicago
    Summary:
    New research shows that rainwater could have helped create a meshy wall around protocells 3.8 billion years ago, a critical step in the transition from tiny beads of RNA to every bacterium, plant, animal, and human that ever lived.

    There you go, simplicity!


    I thought everybody knew this ?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to All on Thu Aug 22 15:40:22 2024
    On Thu, 22 Aug 2024 04:33:34 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
    wrote:

    Life from a drop of rain: New research suggests rainwater helped form the first protocell walls
    A Nobel-winning biologist, two engineering schools, and a vial of Houston rainwater
    cast new light on the origin of life on Earth
    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/08/240821150020.htm
    Date:
    August 21, 2024
    Source:
    University of Chicago
    Summary:
    New research shows that rainwater could have helped create a meshy wall around protocells 3.8 billion years ago, a critical step in the transition from tiny beads of RNA to every bacterium, plant, animal, and human that ever lived.

    There you go, simplicity!

    It's easy to form a blob with some goo inside. Like mayonaise.

    The hard part is the DNA and all its tousands of supporting
    structures.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Martin Brown@21:1/5 to john larkin on Fri Aug 23 10:59:17 2024
    On 22/08/2024 23:40, john larkin wrote:
    On Thu, 22 Aug 2024 04:33:34 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
    wrote:

    Life from a drop of rain: New research suggests rainwater helped form the first protocell walls
    A Nobel-winning biologist, two engineering schools, and a vial of Houston rainwater
    cast new light on the origin of life on Earth
    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/08/240821150020.htm
    Date:
    August 21, 2024
    Source:
    University of Chicago
    Summary:
    New research shows that rainwater could have helped create a meshy wall around protocells 3.8 billion years ago, a critical step in the transition from tiny beads of RNA to every bacterium, plant, animal, and human that ever lived.

    There you go, simplicity!

    It's easy to form a blob with some goo inside. Like mayonaise.

    One conjecture is that it takes a planet with a decent sized moon so
    that tide range is variable to have rock pools that concentrate the
    chemistry to a point where it works. We will know better once Mars or
    Europa has been properly explored. Finding life independently evolved
    somewhere else would go a long way to answering these questions.

    The hard part is the DNA and all its tousands of supporting
    structures.

    That is why self replicating autocatalytic peptides and RNA probably
    came first. They are much less stable and mutate faster. But RNA is good
    enough that plenty of viruses and viroids (plant pathogens) still use it
    today. They are the last remnants of earlier pre-DNA life on Earth.

    DNA with its double helix preserves information much more reliably in
    complex organisms, but that came much later when cells started to have a nucleus and organelles inside. Primitive life had neither just a single chromosome (and bacteria today are descendents of those archaea).

    --
    Martin Brown

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  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to john larkin on Fri Aug 23 23:48:42 2024
    On 23/08/2024 8:40 am, john larkin wrote:
    On Thu, 22 Aug 2024 04:33:34 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
    wrote:

    Life from a drop of rain: New research suggests rainwater helped form the first protocell walls
    A Nobel-winning biologist, two engineering schools, and a vial of Houston rainwater
    cast new light on the origin of life on Earth
    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/08/240821150020.htm
    Date:
    August 21, 2024
    Source:
    University of Chicago
    Summary:
    New research shows that rainwater could have helped create a meshy wall around protocells 3.8 billion years ago, a critical step in the transition from tiny beads of RNA to every bacterium, plant, animal, and human that ever lived.

    There you go, simplicity!

    It's easy to form a blob with some goo inside. Like mayonaise.

    The hard part is the DNA and all its thousands of supporting
    structures.

    The general impression is that the first life was RNA-based, rather than DNA-based, and that it wasn't all that complicated. DNA and the
    "thousands of supporting structures" came later. We've got some 20,000
    genes that code for specific proteins, and they get tweaked to produce
    about 100,000 different proteins. First life was presumably quite a lot simpler.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to '''newspam'''@nonad.co.uk on Fri Aug 23 11:03:10 2024
    On Fri, 23 Aug 2024 10:59:17 +0100, Martin Brown
    <'''newspam'''@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

    On 22/08/2024 23:40, john larkin wrote:
    On Thu, 22 Aug 2024 04:33:34 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
    wrote:

    Life from a drop of rain: New research suggests rainwater helped form the first protocell walls
    A Nobel-winning biologist, two engineering schools, and a vial of Houston rainwater
    cast new light on the origin of life on Earth
    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/08/240821150020.htm
    Date:
    August 21, 2024
    Source:
    University of Chicago
    Summary:
    New research shows that rainwater could have helped create a meshy wall around protocells 3.8 billion years ago, a critical step in the transition from tiny beads of RNA to every bacterium, plant, animal, and human that ever lived.

    There you go, simplicity!

    It's easy to form a blob with some goo inside. Like mayonaise.

    One conjecture is that it takes a planet with a decent sized moon so
    that tide range is variable to have rock pools that concentrate the
    chemistry to a point where it works. We will know better once Mars or
    Europa has been properly explored. Finding life independently evolved >somewhere else would go a long way to answering these questions.

    The hard part is the DNA and all its tousands of supporting
    structures.

    That is why self replicating autocatalytic peptides and RNA probably
    came first. They are much less stable and mutate faster. But RNA is good >enough that plenty of viruses and viroids (plant pathogens) still use it >today. They are the last remnants of earlier pre-DNA life on Earth.


    Or they are parasites that evolved after DNA life.


    DNA with its double helix preserves information much more reliably in
    complex organisms, but that came much later when cells started to have a >nucleus and organelles inside. Primitive life had neither just a single >chromosome (and bacteria today are descendents of those archaea).

    Proponents of RNA World should design an RNA based reproducing,
    evolving life form.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sat Aug 24 16:55:15 2024
    On 24/08/2024 4:03 am, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 23 Aug 2024 10:59:17 +0100, Martin Brown
    <'''newspam'''@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

    On 22/08/2024 23:40, john larkin wrote:
    On Thu, 22 Aug 2024 04:33:34 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
    wrote:

    Life from a drop of rain: New research suggests rainwater helped form the first protocell walls
    A Nobel-winning biologist, two engineering schools, and a vial of Houston rainwater
    cast new light on the origin of life on Earth
    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/08/240821150020.htm
    Date:
    August 21, 2024
    Source:
    University of Chicago
    Summary:
    New research shows that rainwater could have helped create a meshy wall around protocells 3.8 billion years ago, a critical step in the transition from tiny beads of RNA to every bacterium, plant, animal, and human that ever lived.

    There you go, simplicity!

    It's easy to form a blob with some goo inside. Like mayonaise.

    One conjecture is that it takes a planet with a decent sized moon so
    that tide range is variable to have rock pools that concentrate the
    chemistry to a point where it works. We will know better once Mars or
    Europa has been properly explored. Finding life independently evolved
    somewhere else would go a long way to answering these questions.

    The hard part is the DNA and all its tousands of supporting
    structures.

    That is why self replicating autocatalytic peptides and RNA probably
    came first. They are much less stable and mutate faster. But RNA is good
    enough that plenty of viruses and viroids (plant pathogens) still use it
    today. They are the last remnants of earlier pre-DNA life on Earth.


    Or they are parasites that evolved after DNA life.

    From what?

    DNA with its double helix preserves information much more reliably in
    complex organisms, but that came much later when cells started to have a
    nucleus and organelles inside. Primitive life had neither just a single
    chromosome (and bacteria today are descendants of those archaea).

    Proponents of RNA World should design an RNA based reproducing,
    evolving life form.

    They don't have to. Covid-19 is a perfectly adequate example. It does
    depend on us for reproduction, but you failed to exclude that mode of reproduction.

    You probably want a free-living RNA-based life-form that can get its
    energy and its and its constituents from a non-living environment, which
    is a much bigger ask, in part because we don't know all that much about
    the environment prevailing before life had got its first toe-hold.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

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