Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 13:22:25 +0100, Cursitor Doom <cd@notformail.com>
wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
I doubt that there is any serious quality control on cheap batteries.
Kids are maiming and killing themselves on cheap unlicensed
battery-powered scooters and such too.
Imagine maybe a million unused battery-powered toys gathering dust in
garages and closets waiting to explode.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33963903/B00NOD6T4G
https://www.amazon.com/Go-Bowen-Baja-1000W-Electric-Go-Kart/dp/
On 22/06/2024 18:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 09:12:04 -0700, john larkin wrote:That's why we charged our RC lipos in a fireproof bag...
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 13:22:25 +0100, Cursitor Doom <cd@notformail.com>
wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
I doubt that there is any serious quality control on cheap batteries.
Kids are maiming and killing themselves on cheap unlicensed
battery-powered scooters and such too.
Imagine maybe a million unused battery-powered toys gathering dust in
garages and closets waiting to explode.
A frightening thought! Not so much batteries; more incendiary bombs.
B00NOD6T4G
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33963903/
https://www.amazon.com/Go-Bowen-Baja-1000W-Electric-Go-Kart/dp/
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 22:39:48 +0100, TTman <kraken.sankey@gmail.com>
wrote
On 22/06/2024 18:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 09:12:04 -0700, john larkin wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 13:22:25 +0100, Cursitor Doom <cd@notformail.com>
wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
I doubt that there is any serious quality control on cheap batteries.
Kids are maiming and killing themselves on cheap unlicensed
battery-powered scooters and such too.
Imagine maybe a million unused battery-powered toys gathering dust in
garages and closets waiting to explode.
A frightening thought! Not so much batteries; more incendiary bombs.
That's why we charged our RC lipos in a fireproof bag...https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33963903/B00NOD6T4G
https://www.amazon.com/Go-Bowen-Baja-1000W-Electric-Go-Kart/dp/
If it ignites, it would burn through a steel lunchbox.
On 23/06/2024 9:58 am, john larkin wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 22:39:48 +0100, TTman <kraken.sankey@gmail.com>
wrote
On 22/06/2024 18:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 09:12:04 -0700, john larkin wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 13:22:25 +0100, Cursitor Doom
<cd@notformail.com>
wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
I doubt that there is any serious quality control on cheap
batteries.
Kids are maiming and killing themselves on cheap unlicensed
battery-powered scooters and such too.
Imagine maybe a million unused battery-powered toys gathering dust
in garages and closets waiting to explode.
A frightening thought! Not so much batteries; more incendiary bombs.
If you can describe it as a thought. More a deluded fantasy/
That's why we charged our RC lipos in a fireproof bag...https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33963903/B00NOD6T4G
https://www.amazon.com/Go-Bowen-Baja-1000W-Electric-Go-Kart/dp/
If it ignites, it would burn through a steel lunchbox.
Really? Do you have any evidence for that that claim?
This is just more of the usual alarmist nonsense about lithium ion
batteries. This should be the kind of forum where we discuss the design
of lithium ion battery chargers and lithium ion battery condition
monitors - which could, in principle be designed to discharge the
battery if the internal temperature of the battery rose high enough to suggest a risk of runaway self-discharge.
Cursitor Doom and John Larkin are much too devoted to their alarmist fantasies to want to think about that (always assuming that they could
if they wanted to).
--
Bill Sloman, Sydney
On Sun, 23 Jun 2024 11:25:21 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:
On 23/06/2024 9:58 am, john larkin wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 22:39:48 +0100, TTman <kraken.sankey@gmail.com>
wrote
On 22/06/2024 18:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 09:12:04 -0700, john larkin wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 13:22:25 +0100, Cursitor Doom
<cd@notformail.com>
wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
I doubt that there is any serious quality control on cheap
batteries.
Kids are maiming and killing themselves on cheap unlicensed
battery-powered scooters and such too.
Imagine maybe a million unused battery-powered toys gathering dust >>>>>> in garages and closets waiting to explode.
A frightening thought! Not so much batteries; more incendiary bombs.
If you can describe it as a thought. More a deluded fantasy/
That's why we charged our RC lipos in a fireproof bag...https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33963903/B00NOD6T4G
https://www.amazon.com/Go-Bowen-Baja-1000W-Electric-Go-Kart/dp/
If it ignites, it would burn through a steel lunchbox.
Really? Do you have any evidence for that that claim?
This is just more of the usual alarmist nonsense about lithium ion
batteries. This should be the kind of forum where we discuss the design
of lithium ion battery chargers and lithium ion battery condition
monitors - which could, in principle be designed to discharge the
battery if the internal temperature of the battery rose high enough to
suggest a risk of runaway self-discharge.
Cursitor Doom and John Larkin are much too devoted to their alarmist
fantasies to want to think about that (always assuming that they could
if they wanted to).
--
Bill Sloman, Sydney
Perhaps you'd like to explain to the lady who's house burned to the ground and her similarly stricken neighbours that this is all just an "alarmist fantasy" Bill.
On Sun, 23 Jun 2024 11:25:21 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:
On 23/06/2024 9:58 am, john larkin wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 22:39:48 +0100, TTman <kraken.sankey@gmail.com>
wrote
On 22/06/2024 18:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 09:12:04 -0700, john larkin wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 13:22:25 +0100, Cursitor Doom
<cd@notformail.com>
wrote:
Perhaps you'd like to explain to the lady who's house burned to the ground and her similarly stricken neighbours that this is all just an "alarmist fantasy" Bill.
On 6/23/24 09:56, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sun, 23 Jun 2024 11:25:21 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:
On 23/06/2024 9:58 am, john larkin wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 22:39:48 +0100, TTman <kraken.sankey@gmail.com>
wrote
On 22/06/2024 18:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 09:12:04 -0700, john larkin wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 13:22:25 +0100, Cursitor Doom
<cd@notformail.com>
wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
I doubt that there is any serious quality control on cheap
batteries.
Kids are maiming and killing themselves on cheap unlicensed
battery-powered scooters and such too.
Imagine maybe a million unused battery-powered toys gathering dust >>>>>>> in garages and closets waiting to explode.
A frightening thought! Not so much batteries; more incendiary bombs.
If you can describe it as a thought. More a deluded fantasy/
That's why we charged our RC lipos in a fireproof bag...https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33963903/B00NOD6T4G
https://www.amazon.com/Go-Bowen-Baja-1000W-Electric-Go-Kart/dp/
If it ignites, it would burn through a steel lunchbox.
Really? Do you have any evidence for that that claim?
This is just more of the usual alarmist nonsense about lithium ion
batteries. This should be the kind of forum where we discuss the design
of lithium ion battery chargers and lithium ion battery condition
monitors - which could, in principle be designed to discharge the
battery if the internal temperature of the battery rose high enough to >>> suggest a risk of runaway self-discharge.
Cursitor Doom and John Larkin are much too devoted to their alarmist
fantasies to want to think about that (always assuming that they could >>> if they wanted to).
Perhaps you'd like to explain to the lady who's house burned to the
ground and her similarly stricken neighbours that this is all just an "alarmist
fantasy" Bill.
Alarmist fantasy in action... https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/2024/05/18/battery-fire-at-storage-facility-in-otay-mesa-keeps-reigniting/
also: (different incident) "On April 19, 2019, a fire captain, a fire engineer and two career firefighters suffered serious injuries dealing
with a thermal runaway incident at a 2.16-megawatt battery facility in Surprise, Arizona. According to a Underwriters Laboratories report on
the incident, When firefighters opened a door to the building, a 75-foot
jet of flame extended outward from the doorway. The fire captain was
blown over 70 feet against a chain-link fence surrounding the building.
The entire hazardous materials team lost consciousness from the blast. "
Not to be an alarmist, just be aware that even professionally managed
lithium batteries can do bad things. Don't keep them in your house...
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 22:39:48 +0100, TTman <kraken.sankey@gmail.com>
wrote:
On 22/06/2024 18:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 09:12:04 -0700, john larkin wrote:That's why we charged our RC lipos in a fireproof bag...
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 13:22:25 +0100, Cursitor Doom <cd@notformail.com>
wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
I doubt that there is any serious quality control on cheap batteries.
Kids are maiming and killing themselves on cheap unlicensed
battery-powered scooters and such too.
Imagine maybe a million unused battery-powered toys gathering dust in
garages and closets waiting to explode.
A frightening thought! Not so much batteries; more incendiary bombs.
B00NOD6T4G
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33963903/
https://www.amazon.com/Go-Bowen-Baja-1000W-Electric-Go-Kart/dp/
If it ignites, it would burn through a steel lunchbox.
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 16:58:40 -0700, john larkin <jl@650pot.com> wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 22:39:48 +0100, TTman <kraken.sankey@gmail.com>
wrote:
On 22/06/2024 18:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 09:12:04 -0700, john larkin wrote:That's why we charged our RC lipos in a fireproof bag...
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 13:22:25 +0100, Cursitor Doom <cd@notformail.com> >>>>> wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
I doubt that there is any serious quality control on cheap batteries. >>>>>
Kids are maiming and killing themselves on cheap unlicensed
battery-powered scooters and such too.
Imagine maybe a million unused battery-powered toys gathering dust in >>>>> garages and closets waiting to explode.
A frightening thought! Not so much batteries; more incendiary bombs.
B00NOD6T4G
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33963903/
https://www.amazon.com/Go-Bowen-Baja-1000W-Electric-Go-Kart/dp/
If it ignites, it would burn through a steel lunchbox.
Yeah. A lithium BEV fire has no problem melting the girders of a big
parking facility, collapsing same.
But there is also a building Code problem on exhibit. In Baltimore,
where row houses are very common, it used to be that the wall between >adjacent was just an ordinary wall, so if a fire started in one unit,
the whole row would burn to the ground.
So, the Building Code was changed to require a double-thickness
masonry (brick usually) wall between units. This almost worked, but
the brick wall stopped at the top of the rooms below the attic, which
was still in common. So, fires still spread to the whole row, only
slightly less quickly.
The Building Code was again updated, now to require that the wall
extend a foot or two above the roof (which was sloped flat). Success
at last.
Units now burned independently of one another, and the Insurance
Companies stopped threatening to exclude most of the housing in
Baltimore from house insurance.
I wonder why the UK didn't learn this bit of history. Maybe those
units were grandfathered in.
Joe Gwinn
On 6/23/24 09:56, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sun, 23 Jun 2024 11:25:21 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:
On 23/06/2024 9:58 am, john larkin wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 22:39:48 +0100, TTman <kraken.sankey@gmail.com>
wrote
On 22/06/2024 18:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 09:12:04 -0700, john larkin wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 13:22:25 +0100, Cursitor Doom
<cd@notformail.com>
wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
I doubt that there is any serious quality control on cheap
batteries.
Kids are maiming and killing themselves on cheap unlicensed
battery-powered scooters and such too.
Imagine maybe a million unused battery-powered toys gathering dust >>>>>>> in garages and closets waiting to explode.
A frightening thought! Not so much batteries; more incendiary bombs.
If you can describe it as a thought. More a deluded fantasy/
That's why we charged our RC lipos in a fireproof bag...https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33963903/B00NOD6T4G
https://www.amazon.com/Go-Bowen-Baja-1000W-Electric-Go-Kart/dp/
If it ignites, it would burn through a steel lunchbox.
Really? Do you have any evidence for that that claim?
This is just more of the usual alarmist nonsense about lithium ion
batteries. This should be the kind of forum where we discuss the design
of lithium ion battery chargers and lithium ion battery condition
monitors - which could, in principle be designed to discharge the
battery if the internal temperature of the battery rose high enough to
suggest a risk of runaway self-discharge.
Cursitor Doom and John Larkin are much too devoted to their alarmist
fantasies to want to think about that (always assuming that they could >>> if they wanted to).
--
Bill Sloman, Sydney
Perhaps you'd like to explain to the lady who's house burned to the ground >> and her similarly stricken neighbours that this is all just an "alarmist
fantasy" Bill.
Alarmist fantasy in action... >https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/2024/05/18/battery-fire-at-storage-facility-in-otay-mesa-keeps-reigniting/
also: (different incident) "On April 19, 2019, a fire captain, a fire >engineer and two career firefighters suffered serious injuries dealing
with a thermal runaway incident at a 2.16-megawatt battery facility in >Surprise, Arizona. According to a Underwriters Laboratories report on
the incident, When firefighters opened a door to the building, a 75-foot
jet of flame extended outward from the doorway. The fire captain was
blown over 70 feet against a chain-link fence surrounding the building.
The entire hazardous materials team lost consciousness from the blast. "
Not to be an alarmist, just be aware that even professionally managed
lithium batteries can do bad things. Don't keep them in your house...
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
On Mon, 24 Jun 2024 10:06:31 -0400, Joe Gwinn <joegwinn@comcast.net>
wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 16:58:40 -0700, john larkin <jl@650pot.com> wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 22:39:48 +0100, TTman <kraken.sankey@gmail.com> >>>wrote:
On 22/06/2024 18:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 09:12:04 -0700, john larkin wrote:That's why we charged our RC lipos in a fireproof bag...
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 13:22:25 +0100, Cursitor Doom <cd@notformail.com> >>>>>> wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
I doubt that there is any serious quality control on cheap batteries. >>>>>>
Kids are maiming and killing themselves on cheap unlicensed
battery-powered scooters and such too.
Imagine maybe a million unused battery-powered toys gathering dust in >>>>>> garages and closets waiting to explode.
A frightening thought! Not so much batteries; more incendiary bombs. >>>>>
B00NOD6T4G
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33963903/
https://www.amazon.com/Go-Bowen-Baja-1000W-Electric-Go-Kart/dp/
If it ignites, it would burn through a steel lunchbox.
Yeah. A lithium BEV fire has no problem melting the girders of a big >>parking facility, collapsing same.
But there is also a building Code problem on exhibit. In Baltimore,
where row houses are very common, it used to be that the wall between >>adjacent was just an ordinary wall, so if a fire started in one unit,
the whole row would burn to the ground.
So, the Building Code was changed to require a double-thickness
masonry (brick usually) wall between units. This almost worked, but
the brick wall stopped at the top of the rooms below the attic, which
was still in common. So, fires still spread to the whole row, only >>slightly less quickly.
The Building Code was again updated, now to require that the wall
extend a foot or two above the roof (which was sloped flat). Success
at last.
Units now burned independently of one another, and the Insurance
Companies stopped threatening to exclude most of the housing in
Baltimore from house insurance.
I wonder why the UK didn't learn this bit of history. Maybe those
units were grandfathered in.
Joe Gwinn
I can walk my whole block on the flat roofs. There is zero gap between >houses, and the standard lot is 24 feet wide.
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/l0cbx3kx0fx9m6scvj5pj/Roof_Lake_1.jpg?rlkey=m0yl1wnvw6oy69pkferilltcn&raw=1
It's thermally great; only two houses on the block have sideways heat
loss, and even that is half normal.
The walls (of new stuff) are fire-resistant drywall, and there is a
foot or so vertical extention between roofs like you describe. And we
have a lot of firestations and firefighters. There are TWO San
Francisco Firefighter Cookbooks.
When I go to Safeway in the morning, there are commonly one or two
fire trucks parked ouside and the big macho uniformed firefighters are
inside having heated debates about which kind of onions to buy.
On 6/22/24 14:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
there's a crapton of other stuff with possibly dodgy batteries, what
makes you think e-scooters so special?
On Sun, 23 Jun 2024 12:51:30 -0700, wmartin <wwm@wwmartin.net> wrote:
On 6/23/24 09:56, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sun, 23 Jun 2024 11:25:21 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:
On 23/06/2024 9:58 am, john larkin wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 22:39:48 +0100, TTman <kraken.sankey@gmail.com>
wrote
On 22/06/2024 18:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 09:12:04 -0700, john larkin wrote:
On Sat, 22 Jun 2024 13:22:25 +0100, Cursitor Doom
<cd@notformail.com>
wrote:
From what I've read, most lithium battery explosions happen when the batteries are idle, neither charging nor discharging, basically
connected to nothing.
The times from normal to smoking to exploded is
seconds.
On 6/22/24 14:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
there's a crapton of other stuff with possibly dodgy batteries, what
makes you think e-scooters so special?
On Mon, 24 Jun 2024 22:13:49 +0200, Lasse Langwadt <llc@fonz.dk>
wrote:
On 6/22/24 14:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
there's a crapton of other stuff with possibly dodgy batteries, what
makes you think e-scooters so special?
Some are incredibly cheap, and I expect that most people park them
indoors.
john larkin <jl@650pot.com> wrote:
On Mon, 24 Jun 2024 22:13:49 +0200, Lasse Langwadt <llc@fonz.dk>
wrote:
On 6/22/24 14:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
there's a crapton of other stuff with possibly dodgy batteries, what
makes you think e-scooters so special?
Some are incredibly cheap, and I expect that most people park them
indoors.
Seems like the problem is that the fuel and oxidizer are stored way too
close together.
If only we could separate them—hey, maybe we could save weight and be safer >by using air as oxidizer, and even more by not carrying the oxidized fuel >around!
What an amazing advance that would be!
Cheers
Phil Hobbs
On Tue, 25 Jun 2024 22:03:41 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs ><pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:
john larkin <jl@650pot.com> wrote:
On Mon, 24 Jun 2024 22:13:49 +0200, Lasse Langwadt <llc@fonz.dk>
wrote:
On 6/22/24 14:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
there's a crapton of other stuff with possibly dodgy batteries, what
makes you think e-scooters so special?
Some are incredibly cheap, and I expect that most people park them
indoors.
Seems like the problem is that the fuel and oxidizer are stored way too >>close together.
If only we could separate them—hey, maybe we could save weight and be safer >>by using air as oxidizer, and even more by not carrying the oxidized fuel >>around!
What an amazing advance that would be!
Cheers
Phil Hobbs
Don't be silly. That's obviously impossible.
On Tue, 25 Jun 2024 22:03:41 -0000 (UTC), Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:
john larkin <jl@650pot.com> wrote:
On Mon, 24 Jun 2024 22:13:49 +0200, Lasse Langwadt <llc@fonz.dk>
wrote:
On 6/22/24 14:22, Cursitor Doom wrote:
Get rid of it!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxwwzd99r2do
there's a crapton of other stuff with possibly dodgy batteries, what
makes you think e-scooters so special?
Some are incredibly cheap, and I expect that most people park them
indoors.
Seems like the problem is that the fuel and oxidizer are stored way too
close together.
If only we could separate them—hey, maybe we could save weight and be safer
by using air as oxidizer, and even more by not carrying the oxidized fuel
around!
What an amazing advance that would be!
Don't be silly. That's obviously impossible.
That's why we charged our RC lipos in a fireproof bag...
If it ignites, it would burn through a steel lunchbox.
On 25/06/2024 23:03, Phil Hobbs wrote:
<snip>
Seems like the problem is that the fuel and oxidizer are stored way too
close together.
If only we could separate them—hey, maybe we could save weight and be safer >> by using air as oxidizer, and even more by not carrying the oxidized fuel
around!
What an amazing advance that would be!
Cheers
Phil Hobbs
But the vehicle would get progressively heavier as the reaction products >built up. I mean, surely no-one would simply dump them to atmosphere?
Seems like the problem is that the fuel and oxidizer are stored way too
close together.
If only we could separate them—hey, maybe we could save weight and be safer by using air as oxidizer, and even more by not carrying the oxidized fuel around!
What an amazing advance that would be!
Cheers
Phil Hobbs
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