• Re: Do you condemn Hamas?

    From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to NefeshBarYochai on Fri Jun 7 15:48:06 2024
    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after over a
    decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea blockade,
    many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a music
    festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily a
    psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people who
    planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do it again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney


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  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to Bill Sloman on Fri Jun 7 07:32:17 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As
    Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after over a
    decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea blockade,
    many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a music
    festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily a
    psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people who
    planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do it again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He wants
    them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to Cursitor Doom on Fri Jun 7 21:52:41 2024
    On 7/06/2024 5:32 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As
    Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after over a
    decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea blockade,
    many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a music
    festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily a
    psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people who
    planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do it again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He wants
    them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal!

    Hamas is definitely disagreeable. Cursitor Doom seems to think that
    there's something "neo-Liberal" about not liking murderous terrorists.

    We know he like preposterous conspiracy theories. Presumably he's got
    one about the murderous antics of Hamas.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    --
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  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to cd999666@notformail.com on Fri Jun 7 07:49:17 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As
    Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after over a
    decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea blockade,
    many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a music
    festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily a
    psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people who
    planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do it again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He wants
    them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal!

    I suppose there can be different opinions on the virtues of gang
    raping, hostage taking, and killing chidren.

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to Bill Sloman on Fri Jun 7 11:18:54 2024
    On 6/7/2024 7:52 AM, Bill Sloman wrote:
    On 7/06/2024 5:32 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As
    Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after over a >>>> decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea blockade,
    many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a music
    festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily a
    psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people who
    planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do it again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He wants
    them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal!

    Hamas is definitely disagreeable. Cursitor Doom seems to think that
    there's something "neo-Liberal" about not liking murderous terrorists.

    We know he like preposterous conspiracy theories. Presumably he's got
    one about the murderous antics of Hamas.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney


    North Korea, Russia, and China are looking on with envious eyes as to
    how much firepower the US can help Israel put onto civilian targets,
    they're like "Hey! that was supposed to be our job!"

    They're taking notes on the "advanced tactics" being used in Gaza such
    as "Today's neighborhood is grid square E4, take a squad in there, kick
    down the doors of every home and office and shoot anything that moves."

    For all the trillions of taxpayer dollars that have been poured into the "science" of "modern warfare" it should come as no surprise that counter-insurgency tactics haven't fundamentally changed a bit since My
    Lai in 1968. Money well-spent...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to john larkin on Fri Jun 7 16:43:58 2024
    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 07:49:17 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As
    Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after over
    a decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea
    blockade, many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a music
    festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily a
    psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people who
    planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do it
    again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He wants >>them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal!

    I suppose there can be different opinions on the virtues of gang raping, hostage taking, and killing chidren.

    Wow, John. I never expected to see the day when you'd defend Bill Sloman!
    :-D He'll be glad to know he's finally made a friend here. ;-)

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to bitrex on Fri Jun 7 16:41:39 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 11:18:54 -0400, bitrex wrote:

    On 6/7/2024 7:52 AM, Bill Sloman wrote:
    On 7/06/2024 5:32 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As
    Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after over >>>>> a decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea
    blockade, many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a music
    festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily a
    psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people who
    planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do it
    again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He
    wants them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal!

    Hamas is definitely disagreeable. Cursitor Doom seems to think that
    there's something "neo-Liberal" about not liking murderous terrorists.

    We know he like preposterous conspiracy theories. Presumably he's got
    one about the murderous antics of Hamas.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney


    North Korea, Russia, and China are looking on with envious eyes as to
    how much firepower the US can help Israel put onto civilian targets,
    they're like "Hey! that was supposed to be our job!"

    They're taking notes on the "advanced tactics" being used in Gaza such
    as "Today's neighborhood is grid square E4, take a squad in there, kick
    down the doors of every home and office and shoot anything that moves."

    Well, it does kind of nullify America's moral authority!
    Perhaps you can tell us why the US supplies all these armaments to Israel effectively for free? I mean, supplying them at cost would be bad enough, given the purposes to which they're being put.


    For all the trillions of taxpayer dollars that have been poured into the "science" of "modern warfare" it should come as no surprise that counter-insurgency tactics haven't fundamentally changed a bit since My
    Lai in 1968. Money well-spent...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sat Jun 8 03:01:25 2024
    On 8/06/2024 12:49 am, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As
    Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after over a >>>> decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea blockade,
    many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a music
    festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily a
    psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people who
    planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do it again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He wants
    them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal!

    I suppose there can be different opinions on the virtues of gang
    raping, hostage taking, and killing children.

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.

    The Muslims don't describe Jew as heretics (which is pretty much a term
    used only by Christians to describe other Christians). Jews and
    Christian are seen as also people of the book - if not quite of the same
    book as Muslims - and don't get persecuted by Muslims on theological
    grounds.

    Hamas doesn't make any kind of sense, any more than Donald Trump does.
    Like him, they are performance artists who will do pretty much anything
    to get the attention they crave.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney



    --
    This email has been checked for viruses by Norton antivirus software. www.norton.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to Cursitor Doom on Sat Jun 8 03:06:54 2024
    On 8/06/2024 2:43 am, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 07:49:17 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As
    Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after over >>>>> a decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea
    blockade, many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a music
    festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily a
    psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people who
    planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do it
    again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis. I don't I doubt if s

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He wants >>> them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal!

    I suppose there can be different opinions on the virtues of gang raping,
    hostage taking, and killing chidren.

    Wow, John. I never expected to see the day when you'd defend Bill Sloman!
    :-D He'll be glad to know he's finally made a friend here. ;-)

    It's not exactly a defense, and I doubt if it is motivated by any kind
    of fellow-feeling

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.

    That's actually wrong, but Cursitor Doom won't have known enough about
    the subject to have noticed.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney



    --
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  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to Cursitor Doom on Fri Jun 7 13:16:25 2024
    On 6/7/2024 12:41 PM, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 11:18:54 -0400, bitrex wrote:

    On 6/7/2024 7:52 AM, Bill Sloman wrote:
    On 7/06/2024 5:32 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As
    Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after over >>>>>> a decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea
    blockade, many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a music >>>>> festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily a
    psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people who
    planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do it
    again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a menace, >>>>> and should be locked away on the same basis.

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He
    wants them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal!

    Hamas is definitely disagreeable. Cursitor Doom seems to think that
    there's something "neo-Liberal" about not liking murderous terrorists.

    We know he like preposterous conspiracy theories. Presumably he's got
    one about the murderous antics of Hamas.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney


    North Korea, Russia, and China are looking on with envious eyes as to
    how much firepower the US can help Israel put onto civilian targets,
    they're like "Hey! that was supposed to be our job!"

    They're taking notes on the "advanced tactics" being used in Gaza such
    as "Today's neighborhood is grid square E4, take a squad in there, kick
    down the doors of every home and office and shoot anything that moves."

    Well, it does kind of nullify America's moral authority!

    America had moral authority? It probably peaked about 1865, if it did...

    Perhaps you can tell us why the US supplies all these armaments to Israel effectively for free? I mean, supplying them at cost would be bad enough, given the purposes to which they're being put.

    Geopolitical reasons, oil security, historical hedge against the
    Soviets, religious reasons, some combination.

    It isn't entirely out of the goodness of our own hearts, that's for
    sure. But they're a heavily nuclear-armed nation that could wipe out
    every major city in the Arab world in an afternoon.

    If Israel still feels routinely insecure despite this ability I'm
    unconvinced how much one more F-16 or 500 more tons of smart bombs is
    going to help make a fundamental difference in that.

    I can understand why Iran isn't interested in a conflict right now
    they're probably all hands on deck trying to get their first atomic bomb
    test scheduled. Maybe the government of Israel just figures they'll
    fight a three-front war to nip that problem in the bud. I expect the US
    will be on the hook for the ammo for that one, too.

    It'll be interesting to see how many gruesome little wars the US can
    provide the gear for simultaneously while its 900 year old leaders
    regularly mumble some variant of "well, you see all those foreigners
    hate us for our freedom" but when the foreigners keep finding "Made in
    USA" on the bomb fragments in what used to be their house..

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to Bill Sloman on Fri Jun 7 13:28:55 2024
    On 6/7/2024 1:01 PM, Bill Sloman wrote:

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.

    The Muslims don't describe Jew as heretics (which is pretty much a term
    used only by Christians to describe other Christians). Jews and
    Christian are seen as also people of the book - if not quite of the same
    book as Muslims - and don't get persecuted by Muslims on theological
    grounds.

    Hamas doesn't make any kind of sense, any more than Donald Trump does.
    Like him, they are performance artists who will do pretty much anything
    to get the attention they crave.


    But for better or worse if Trump's supporters violently butchered 1300
    people in the US (not a difficult event to imagine...) every Democrat
    would be demanding an immediate cease fire and asking for unity and
    sending thoughts and prayers, not dispatching the strike fighters out to
    level the Mar-a-Lago Club and half of Palm Beach along with it.

    The right's politicians have spent 30 years playing to Republicans most
    vicious and violent revenge fantasies while the Dems always tell me why
    I can't have what I want because it might anger the wingnuts (they
    always are.) the Dems could learn a bit about how to run a campaign from
    them.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jeroen Belleman@21:1/5 to john larkin on Fri Jun 7 19:53:35 2024
    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to cd999666@notformail.com on Fri Jun 7 13:22:40 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:43:58 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 07:49:17 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As
    Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after over >>>>> a decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea
    blockade, many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a music
    festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily a
    psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people who
    planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do it
    again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He wants >>>them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal!

    I suppose there can be different opinions on the virtues of gang raping,
    hostage taking, and killing chidren.

    Wow, John. I never expected to see the day when you'd defend Bill Sloman!

    Just by accident, he's sort of right once in a while.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to bitrex on Fri Jun 7 13:25:07 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 13:28:55 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/7/2024 1:01 PM, Bill Sloman wrote:

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.

    The Muslims don't describe Jew as heretics (which is pretty much a term
    used only by Christians to describe other Christians). Jews and
    Christian are seen as also people of the book - if not quite of the same
    book as Muslims - and don't get persecuted by Muslims on theological
    grounds.

    Hamas doesn't make any kind of sense, any more than Donald Trump does.
    Like him, they are performance artists who will do pretty much anything
    to get the attention they crave.


    But for better or worse if Trump's supporters violently butchered 1300
    people in the US (not a difficult event to imagine...) every Democrat
    would be demanding an immediate cease fire and asking for unity and
    sending thoughts and prayers, not dispatching the strike fighters out to >level the Mar-a-Lago Club and half of Palm Beach along with it.

    The right's politicians have spent 30 years playing to Republicans most >vicious and violent revenge fantasies while the Dems always tell me why
    I can't have what I want because it might anger the wingnuts (they
    always are.) the Dems could learn a bit about how to run a campaign from >them.


    Tribal ranting is always easier than thinking.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to jeroen@nospam.please on Fri Jun 7 13:35:55 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper
    behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists.

    Better cooks too.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to john larkin on Fri Jun 7 20:43:01 2024
    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:22:40 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:43:58 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 07:49:17 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As
    Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after
    over a decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea
    blockade, many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a music >>>>> festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily a
    psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people who
    planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do it
    again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a
    menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He >>>>wants them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal!

    I suppose there can be different opinions on the virtues of gang
    raping,
    hostage taking, and killing chidren.

    Wow, John. I never expected to see the day when you'd defend Bill
    Sloman!

    Just by accident, he's sort of right once in a while.

    Like a busted clock you mean? Yeah, I guess...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to cd999666@notformail.com on Fri Jun 7 13:43:58 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:41:39 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 11:18:54 -0400, bitrex wrote:

    On 6/7/2024 7:52 AM, Bill Sloman wrote:
    On 7/06/2024 5:32 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As
    Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after over >>>>>> a decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea
    blockade, many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a music >>>>> festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily a
    psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people who
    planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do it
    again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a menace, >>>>> and should be locked away on the same basis.

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He
    wants them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal!

    Hamas is definitely disagreeable. Cursitor Doom seems to think that
    there's something "neo-Liberal" about not liking murderous terrorists.

    We know he like preposterous conspiracy theories. Presumably he's got
    one about the murderous antics of Hamas.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney


    North Korea, Russia, and China are looking on with envious eyes as to
    how much firepower the US can help Israel put onto civilian targets,
    they're like "Hey! that was supposed to be our job!"

    They're taking notes on the "advanced tactics" being used in Gaza such
    as "Today's neighborhood is grid square E4, take a squad in there, kick
    down the doors of every home and office and shoot anything that moves."

    Well, it does kind of nullify America's moral authority!
    Perhaps you can tell us why the US supplies all these armaments to Israel >effectively for free?

    Because the world needs more modern democracies.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to cd999666@notformail.com on Fri Jun 7 13:55:01 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 20:43:01 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:22:40 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:43:58 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 07:49:17 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As >>>>>>> Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after
    over a decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea >>>>>>> blockade, many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a music >>>>>> festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily a
    psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people who >>>>>> planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do it
    again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a
    menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He >>>>>wants them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal!

    I suppose there can be different opinions on the virtues of gang
    raping,
    hostage taking, and killing chidren.

    Wow, John. I never expected to see the day when you'd defend Bill
    Sloman!

    Just by accident, he's sort of right once in a while.

    Like a busted clock you mean? Yeah, I guess...

    His motivations are emotional, not logical. I see that a lot, smart
    people doing very stupid things because their hormones dominate their
    neurons.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to invalid@invalid.invalid on Fri Jun 7 14:01:16 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:51:24 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:f7r66j9igh2jc9ndb8pj5vsc5310fbopvj@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of
    consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper
    behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists.

    https://russell-j.com/0464NP.HTM

    Gosh, what a jerk.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Edward Rawde@21:1/5 to john larkin on Fri Jun 7 16:51:24 2024
    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:f7r66j9igh2jc9ndb8pj5vsc5310fbopvj@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists.

    https://russell-j.com/0464NP.HTM


    Better cooks too.


    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Mike Monett VE3BTI@21:1/5 to Jeroen Belleman on Fri Jun 7 21:11:03 2024
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past this one, and
    that you are immortal.



    --
    MRM

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Edward Rawde@21:1/5 to Jeroen Belleman on Fri Jun 7 17:26:13 2024
    "Jeroen Belleman" <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote in message news:v3vtf6$2824r$1@dont-email.me...
    On 6/7/24 22:35, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of
    consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper
    behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists.

    Better cooks too.


    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like
    father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that
    many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality!
    Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit.
    Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've
    seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    That's pretty much my experience too.


    Jeroen Belleman

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to Jeroen Belleman on Fri Jun 7 17:48:03 2024
    On 6/7/2024 5:20 PM, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like
    father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that
    many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality!
    Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit.
    Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've
    seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    Jeroen Belleman

    I've been acquainted with some atheists whose main objection to the
    concept of a God seemed to be that it would necessarily imply there was
    an entity smarter and/or more powerful than them out there somewhere.

    Certainly might rub a number of engineers the wrong way:

    "Ok so here's the structure of the pyramid. First there's the animal
    kingdom, and then there's the degenerate people. and then there's the
    good people. and then there's all the other engineers (who are
    themselves better people than non-engineers), and then there's me at the
    top of the engineers. And then...well...that's about it. that's where
    the capstone is I guess."

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jeroen Belleman@21:1/5 to john larkin on Fri Jun 7 23:20:37 2024
    On 6/7/24 22:35, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists.

    Better cooks too.


    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like
    father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that
    many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality!
    Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit.
    Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've
    seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    Jeroen Belleman

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jeroen Belleman@21:1/5 to All on Fri Jun 7 23:57:54 2024
    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past this one, and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no
    afterlife, just as there was no forelife. There is no soul.
    My existence is the result of an uninterrupted sequence of
    incredibly improbable events, going back billions of years
    into the past, and I will cease to exist, never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not
    afraid of being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife
    is just another of those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to Edward Rawde on Fri Jun 7 18:02:38 2024
    On 6/7/2024 5:26 PM, Edward Rawde wrote:
    "Jeroen Belleman" <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote in message news:v3vtf6$2824r$1@dont-email.me...
    On 6/7/24 22:35, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are >>>>> heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of
    consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper
    behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists.

    Better cooks too.


    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like
    father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that
    many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality!
    Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit.
    Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've
    seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    That's pretty much my experience too.


    Come to New England you'll meet a different cut of conservative, who has
    no need for God or the Bible to explain why they think women shouldn't
    vote or homosexuals should be hung. "I just don't like the fuckers."

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to bitrex on Fri Jun 7 15:13:48 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 18:02:38 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/7/2024 5:26 PM, Edward Rawde wrote:
    "Jeroen Belleman" <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote in message news:v3vtf6$2824r$1@dont-email.me...
    On 6/7/24 22:35, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are >>>>>> heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for >>>>>> Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of
    consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper >>>> behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists.

    Better cooks too.


    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like
    father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that
    many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality!
    Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit.
    Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've
    seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    That's pretty much my experience too.


    Come to New England you'll meet a different cut of conservative, who has
    no need for God or the Bible to explain why they think women shouldn't
    vote or homosexuals should be hung. "I just don't like the fuckers."



    I have lots of relatives in Mass and have spent many months of my life
    in NYC and Vermont and don't know anyone like that. Maybe you hang out
    with a different crowd.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Edward Rawde@21:1/5 to bitrex on Fri Jun 7 18:12:09 2024
    "bitrex" <user@example.net> wrote in message news:6663837f$0$2363147$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com...
    On 6/7/2024 5:26 PM, Edward Rawde wrote:
    "Jeroen Belleman" <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote in message news:v3vtf6$2824r$1@dont-email.me...
    On 6/7/24 22:35, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are >>>>>> heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for >>>>>> Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of
    consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper >>>> behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists.

    Better cooks too.


    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like
    father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that
    many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality!
    Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit.
    Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've
    seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    That's pretty much my experience too.


    Come to New England

    Already lived there on two different occasions for a total of about six years.

    you'll meet a different cut of conservative, who has no need for God or the Bible to explain why they think women shouldn't vote
    or homosexuals should be hung. "I just don't like the fuckers."




    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to john larkin on Fri Jun 7 18:15:14 2024
    On 6/7/2024 5:01 PM, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:51:24 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:f7r66j9igh2jc9ndb8pj5vsc5310fbopvj@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are >>>>> heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of
    consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper
    behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists.

    https://russell-j.com/0464NP.HTM

    Gosh, what a jerk.


    Religion and atheism are probably somewhat tangential issues to the
    state of "being a jerk", which tends to develop based on experiences
    that begin in very early childhood, well before a person is able to
    grasp what either term means very well.

    That is to say I'm skeptical religion or atheism alone has the power to
    put the jerk in anyone who wasn't more-or-less already there, and I'm
    skeptical religion or atheism alone has the power to un-jerk anyone who
    showed up that way, already.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to Edward Rawde on Fri Jun 7 18:17:44 2024
    On 6/7/2024 6:12 PM, Edward Rawde wrote:
    "bitrex" <user@example.net> wrote in message news:6663837f$0$2363147$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com...
    On 6/7/2024 5:26 PM, Edward Rawde wrote:
    "Jeroen Belleman" <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote in message news:v3vtf6$2824r$1@dont-email.me...
    On 6/7/24 22:35, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are >>>>>>> heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for >>>>>>> Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of
    consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper >>>>> behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists. >>>>>
    Better cooks too.


    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like
    father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that
    many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality!
    Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit.
    Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've
    seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    That's pretty much my experience too.


    Come to New England

    Already lived there on two different occasions for a total of about six years.

    Well the whole area is full of intelligent, pragmatic, religion-averse
    bastards so...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to bitrex on Fri Jun 7 18:20:00 2024
    On 6/7/2024 6:17 PM, bitrex wrote:
    On 6/7/2024 6:12 PM, Edward Rawde wrote:
    "bitrex" <user@example.net> wrote in message
    news:6663837f$0$2363147$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com...
    On 6/7/2024 5:26 PM, Edward Rawde wrote:
    "Jeroen Belleman" <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote in message
    news:v3vtf6$2824r$1@dont-email.me...
    On 6/7/24 22:35, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they >>>>>>>> are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for >>>>>>>> Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of
    consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would >>>>>> morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about
    proper
    behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with, >>>>>> possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists. >>>>>>
    Better cooks too.


    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like
    father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that
    many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality!
    Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit.
    Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've
    seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    That's pretty much my experience too.


    Come to New England

    Already lived there on two different occasions for a total of about
    six years.

    Well the whole area is full of intelligent, pragmatic, religion-averse bastards so...


    To be fair a bunch of them call themselves "liberals"..

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jeroen Belleman@21:1/5 to bitrex on Sat Jun 8 00:25:00 2024
    On 6/7/24 23:48, bitrex wrote:
    On 6/7/2024 5:20 PM, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like
    father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that
    many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality!
    Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit.
    Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've
    seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    Jeroen Belleman

    I've been acquainted with some atheists whose main objection to the
    concept of a God seemed to be that it would necessarily imply there was
    an entity smarter and/or more powerful than them out there somewhere.

    Certainly might rub a number of engineers the wrong way:
    [...]

    Again, that has nothig to do with religion. Some people do
    need to believe they are better than others. Maybe in some
    way, some of them are! We all have our qualities and our
    blind spots.

    Jeroen Belleman

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jeroen Belleman@21:1/5 to bitrex on Sat Jun 8 00:35:58 2024
    On 6/8/24 00:15, bitrex wrote:
    On 6/7/2024 5:01 PM, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:51:24 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message
    news:f7r66j9igh2jc9ndb8pj5vsc5310fbopvj@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are >>>>>> heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for >>>>>> Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of
    consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper >>>> behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists.

    https://russell-j.com/0464NP.HTM

    Gosh, what a jerk.


    Religion and atheism are probably somewhat tangential issues to the
    state of "being a jerk", which tends to develop based on experiences
    that begin in very early childhood, well before a person is able to
    grasp what either term means very well.

    That is to say I'm skeptical religion or atheism alone has the power to
    put the jerk in anyone who wasn't more-or-less already there, and I'm skeptical religion or atheism alone has the power to un-jerk anyone who showed up that way, already.


    Yes, that's probably true.

    Who was it that said: "Kill them all, god will know his own!". Some
    -presumably religious- crusader commander? Now there's a jerk.

    Jeroen Belleman

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Edward Rawde@21:1/5 to john larkin on Fri Jun 7 19:25:36 2024
    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:7b176jdajq3co9nosj8qnie8rupdrsfoav@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 18:02:38 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/7/2024 5:26 PM, Edward Rawde wrote:
    "Jeroen Belleman" <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote in message news:v3vtf6$2824r$1@dont-email.me...
    On 6/7/24 22:35, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are >>>>>>> heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for >>>>>>> Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of
    consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper >>>>> behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists. >>>>>
    Better cooks too.


    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like
    father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that
    many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality!
    Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit.
    Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've
    seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    That's pretty much my experience too.


    Come to New England you'll meet a different cut of conservative, who has
    no need for God or the Bible to explain why they think women shouldn't
    vote or homosexuals should be hung. "I just don't like the fuckers."



    I have lots of relatives in Mass and have spent many months of my life
    in NYC and Vermont

    Would I be correct in thinking that you've never been outside the USA except perhaps for a short vacation?

    and don't know anyone like that. Maybe you hang out
    with a different crowd.


    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to john larkin on Fri Jun 7 23:27:38 2024
    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:55:01 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 20:43:01 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:22:40 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:43:58 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 07:49:17 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As >>>>>>>> Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after >>>>>>>> over a decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea >>>>>>>> blockade, many found themselves having to face this question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a
    music festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily >>>>>>> a psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people >>>>>>> who planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do >>>>>>> it again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a
    menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He >>>>>>wants them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal! >>>>>
    I suppose there can be different opinions on the virtues of gang
    raping,
    hostage taking, and killing chidren.

    Wow, John. I never expected to see the day when you'd defend Bill >>>>Sloman!

    Just by accident, he's sort of right once in a while.

    Like a busted clock you mean? Yeah, I guess...

    His motivations are emotional, not logical. I see that a lot, smart
    people doing very stupid things because their hormones dominate their neurons.

    That's the peculiar thing about the new Leftists, though. These people
    call themselves "Liberals" but in truth they couldn't be farther away from
    the original meaning of the word. Classical Liberals would be horrified at
    the solution of executing or imprisoning someone who disagreed with them.
    Not so the neo Liberals. It's a deeply disturbing new trend and it's not confined solely to America.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to john larkin on Fri Jun 7 23:29:10 2024
    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:35:55 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. There is
    no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists.

    My experience is the complete opposite.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to Jeroen Belleman on Fri Jun 7 23:37:40 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. There
    is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do this
    lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no afterlife,
    just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My existence is the
    result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly improbable events,
    going back billions of years into the past, and I will cease to exist,
    never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid of
    being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just another of those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an after-life. And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I actually find the
    prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be like you in outlook!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to Jeroen Belleman on Fri Jun 7 20:04:33 2024
    On 6/7/2024 6:35 PM, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
    On 6/8/24 00:15, bitrex wrote:
    On 6/7/2024 5:01 PM, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:51:24 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message
    news:f7r66j9igh2jc9ndb8pj5vsc5310fbopvj@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are >>>>>>> heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for >>>>>>> Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of
    consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper >>>>> behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists.

    https://russell-j.com/0464NP.HTM

    Gosh, what a jerk.


    Religion and atheism are probably somewhat tangential issues to the
    state of "being a jerk", which tends to develop based on experiences
    that begin in very early childhood, well before a person is able to
    grasp what either term means very well.

    That is to say I'm skeptical religion or atheism alone has the power
    to put the jerk in anyone who wasn't more-or-less already there, and
    I'm skeptical religion or atheism alone has the power to un-jerk
    anyone who showed up that way, already.


    Yes, that's probably true.

    Who was it that said: "Kill them all, god will know his own!". Some -presumably religious- crusader commander? Now there's a jerk.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Incidentally, a significant amount of the rancor surrounding the debate
    on abortion hinges on the "nature" of the transition from not-life to
    life and from not-person to person.

    Richard Dawkins pointed out that it doesn't make much logical sense to
    call a clump of cells a few moments after conception a "person" and it
    doesn't make much sense to call a baby 1 second before birth a clump of
    cells, but that implies there must have been an exact moment at some
    point over the 9 months of gestation that a transition from not-person
    to person occurred. Which also makes no sense.

    Interestingly, there seems to be much less intense debate over the
    process of death, even though pretty much all the same conundrums with
    respect to binary transitions being nonsense happens there too, just in
    reverse order!

    Anyway, in summary: Birth is nonsense. Death is also nonsense. Thank u
    for coming to my TED talk.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to invalid@invalid.invalid on Fri Jun 7 17:42:09 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:25:36 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:7b176jdajq3co9nosj8qnie8rupdrsfoav@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 18:02:38 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/7/2024 5:26 PM, Edward Rawde wrote:
    "Jeroen Belleman" <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote in message news:v3vtf6$2824r$1@dont-email.me...
    On 6/7/24 22:35, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are >>>>>>>> heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for >>>>>>>> Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of
    consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would >>>>>> morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper >>>>>> behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with, >>>>>> possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists. >>>>>>
    Better cooks too.


    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like
    father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that
    many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality!
    Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit.
    Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've
    seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    That's pretty much my experience too.


    Come to New England you'll meet a different cut of conservative, who has >>>no need for God or the Bible to explain why they think women shouldn't >>>vote or homosexuals should be hung. "I just don't like the fuckers."



    I have lots of relatives in Mass and have spent many months of my life
    in NYC and Vermont

    Would I be correct in thinking that you've never been outside the USA except perhaps for a short vacation?


    I have spend a few months in France and a month working in Moscow.
    Some weeks working in England, in Oxford, and a few weeks vacatining
    in Ireland. Some time in Hamamatsu.

    I guess Alaska and Hawaii don't count.

    I have never encountered the sort of nastiness that other people seem
    to have. Most people are friendly and decent.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to cd999666@notformail.com on Fri Jun 7 17:45:38 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:27:38 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:55:01 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 20:43:01 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:22:40 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:43:58 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 07:49:17 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As >>>>>>>>> Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after >>>>>>>>> over a decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea >>>>>>>>> blockade, many found themselves having to face this question. >>>>>>>>
    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a >>>>>>>> music festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily >>>>>>>> a psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people >>>>>>>> who planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do >>>>>>>> it again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a
    menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He >>>>>>>wants them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal! >>>>>>
    I suppose there can be different opinions on the virtues of gang
    raping,
    hostage taking, and killing chidren.

    Wow, John. I never expected to see the day when you'd defend Bill >>>>>Sloman!

    Just by accident, he's sort of right once in a while.

    Like a busted clock you mean? Yeah, I guess...

    His motivations are emotional, not logical. I see that a lot, smart
    people doing very stupid things because their hormones dominate their
    neurons.

    That's the peculiar thing about the new Leftists, though. These people
    call themselves "Liberals" but in truth they couldn't be farther away from >the original meaning of the word. Classical Liberals would be horrified at >the solution of executing or imprisoning someone who disagreed with them.
    Not so the neo Liberals. It's a deeply disturbing new trend and it's not >confined solely to America.



    People, including women, are screaming and waving signs QUEERS FOR
    GAZA.

    Think about that one.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Edward Rawde@21:1/5 to john larkin on Fri Jun 7 21:18:20 2024
    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:dq976jlhrp1puom0ha9ogpte8aniroj94i@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:25:36 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:7b176jdajq3co9nosj8qnie8rupdrsfoav@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 18:02:38 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/7/2024 5:26 PM, Edward Rawde wrote:
    "Jeroen Belleman" <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote in message news:v3vtf6$2824r$1@dont-email.me...
    On 6/7/24 22:35, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are >>>>>>>>> heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for >>>>>>>>> Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of >>>>>>> consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would >>>>>>> morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper >>>>>>> behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with, >>>>>>> possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists. >>>>>>>
    Better cooks too.


    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like
    father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that
    many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality!
    Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit.
    Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've
    seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    That's pretty much my experience too.


    Come to New England you'll meet a different cut of conservative, who has >>>>no need for God or the Bible to explain why they think women shouldn't >>>>vote or homosexuals should be hung. "I just don't like the fuckers."



    I have lots of relatives in Mass and have spent many months of my life
    in NYC and Vermont

    Would I be correct in thinking that you've never been outside the USA except perhaps for a short vacation?


    I have spend a few months in France and a month working in Moscow.
    Some weeks working in England, in Oxford, and a few weeks vacatining
    in Ireland. Some time in Hamamatsu.

    I guess Alaska and Hawaii don't count.

    I have never encountered the sort of nastiness that other people seem
    to have. Most people are friendly and decent.


    Well your response to my reference to https://russell-j.com/0464NP.HTM was pretty nasty in my view.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to invalid@invalid.invalid on Fri Jun 7 18:59:25 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 21:18:20 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:dq976jlhrp1puom0ha9ogpte8aniroj94i@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:25:36 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:7b176jdajq3co9nosj8qnie8rupdrsfoav@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 18:02:38 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/7/2024 5:26 PM, Edward Rawde wrote:
    "Jeroen Belleman" <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote in message news:v3vtf6$2824r$1@dont-email.me...
    On 6/7/24 22:35, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are >>>>>>>>>> heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for >>>>>>>>>> Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of >>>>>>>> consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to >>>>>>>> enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would >>>>>>>> morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper >>>>>>>> behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with, >>>>>>>> possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists. >>>>>>>>
    Better cooks too.


    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like
    father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that
    many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality!
    Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit. >>>>>>> Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've
    seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    That's pretty much my experience too.


    Come to New England you'll meet a different cut of conservative, who has >>>>>no need for God or the Bible to explain why they think women shouldn't >>>>>vote or homosexuals should be hung. "I just don't like the fuckers."



    I have lots of relatives in Mass and have spent many months of my life >>>> in NYC and Vermont

    Would I be correct in thinking that you've never been outside the USA except perhaps for a short vacation?


    I have spend a few months in France and a month working in Moscow.
    Some weeks working in England, in Oxford, and a few weeks vacatining
    in Ireland. Some time in Hamamatsu.

    I guess Alaska and Hawaii don't count.

    I have never encountered the sort of nastiness that other people seem
    to have. Most people are friendly and decent.


    Well your response to my reference to https://russell-j.com/0464NP.HTM was pretty nasty in my view.



    BR is dead, so I didn't offend him.

    He sounded smug and nasty to me.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Edward Rawde@21:1/5 to john larkin on Fri Jun 7 22:11:58 2024
    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:fle76jld4pj0rj412uv49jjfe4grpupa44@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 21:18:20 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:dq976jlhrp1puom0ha9ogpte8aniroj94i@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:25:36 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:7b176jdajq3co9nosj8qnie8rupdrsfoav@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 18:02:38 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/7/2024 5:26 PM, Edward Rawde wrote:
    "Jeroen Belleman" <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote in message news:v3vtf6$2824r$1@dont-email.me...
    On 6/7/24 22:35, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for >>>>>>>>>>> Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of >>>>>>>>> consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to >>>>>>>>> enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would >>>>>>>>> morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper
    behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with, >>>>>>>>> possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists. >>>>>>>>>
    Better cooks too.


    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like
    father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that
    many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality!
    Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit. >>>>>>>> Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've
    seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    That's pretty much my experience too.


    Come to New England you'll meet a different cut of conservative, who has >>>>>>no need for God or the Bible to explain why they think women shouldn't >>>>>>vote or homosexuals should be hung. "I just don't like the fuckers." >>>>>>


    I have lots of relatives in Mass and have spent many months of my life >>>>> in NYC and Vermont

    Would I be correct in thinking that you've never been outside the USA except perhaps for a short vacation?


    I have spend a few months in France and a month working in Moscow.
    Some weeks working in England, in Oxford, and a few weeks vacatining
    in Ireland. Some time in Hamamatsu.

    I guess Alaska and Hawaii don't count.

    I have never encountered the sort of nastiness that other people seem
    to have. Most people are friendly and decent.


    Well your response to my reference to https://russell-j.com/0464NP.HTM was pretty nasty in my view.



    BR is dead, so I didn't offend him.

    I don't think he would have been offended even if he were still alive. https://www.google.com/search?q=bertrand+russell+message+to+future+generations


    He sounded smug and nasty to me.

    But did you take a moment to take in anything he said? Or did you just let your emotional hormones get the better of your neurones
    like the rest of us are capable of doing at times?



    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to john larkin on Fri Jun 7 22:44:18 2024
    On 6/7/2024 8:45 PM, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:27:38 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:55:01 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 20:43:01 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:22:40 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:43:58 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 07:49:17 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As >>>>>>>>>> Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after >>>>>>>>>> over a decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea >>>>>>>>>> blockade, many found themselves having to face this question. >>>>>>>>>
    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a >>>>>>>>> music festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily >>>>>>>>> a psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people >>>>>>>>> who planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do >>>>>>>>> it again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a >>>>>>>>> menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He >>>>>>>> wants them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal! >>>>>>>
    I suppose there can be different opinions on the virtues of gang >>>>>>> raping,
    hostage taking, and killing chidren.

    Wow, John. I never expected to see the day when you'd defend Bill
    Sloman!

    Just by accident, he's sort of right once in a while.

    Like a busted clock you mean? Yeah, I guess...

    His motivations are emotional, not logical. I see that a lot, smart
    people doing very stupid things because their hormones dominate their
    neurons.

    That's the peculiar thing about the new Leftists, though. These people
    call themselves "Liberals" but in truth they couldn't be farther away from >> the original meaning of the word. Classical Liberals would be horrified at >> the solution of executing or imprisoning someone who disagreed with them.
    Not so the neo Liberals. It's a deeply disturbing new trend and it's not
    confined solely to America.



    People, including women, are screaming and waving signs QUEERS FOR
    GAZA.

    Think about that one.


    Pretty surprised they haven't spotted you flying an American flag in SF
    and hauled you away for your compulsory DEI training. What are the woke
    police in that town even doing with all my donations!

    <https://x.com/InternetHippo/status/1798923854624199013>

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to bitrex on Fri Jun 7 20:10:42 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 22:44:18 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/7/2024 8:45 PM, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:27:38 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:55:01 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 20:43:01 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:22:40 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:43:58 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 07:49:17 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As >>>>>>>>>>> Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after >>>>>>>>>>> over a decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea >>>>>>>>>>> blockade, many found themselves having to face this question. >>>>>>>>>>
    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a >>>>>>>>>> music festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily >>>>>>>>>> a psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people >>>>>>>>>> who planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do >>>>>>>>>> it again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a >>>>>>>>>> menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He >>>>>>>>> wants them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal! >>>>>>>>
    I suppose there can be different opinions on the virtues of gang >>>>>>>> raping,
    hostage taking, and killing chidren.

    Wow, John. I never expected to see the day when you'd defend Bill >>>>>>> Sloman!

    Just by accident, he's sort of right once in a while.

    Like a busted clock you mean? Yeah, I guess...

    His motivations are emotional, not logical. I see that a lot, smart
    people doing very stupid things because their hormones dominate their
    neurons.

    That's the peculiar thing about the new Leftists, though. These people
    call themselves "Liberals" but in truth they couldn't be farther away from >>> the original meaning of the word. Classical Liberals would be horrified at >>> the solution of executing or imprisoning someone who disagreed with them. >>> Not so the neo Liberals. It's a deeply disturbing new trend and it's not >>> confined solely to America.



    People, including women, are screaming and waving signs QUEERS FOR
    GAZA.

    Think about that one.


    Pretty surprised they haven't spotted you flying an American flag in SF
    and hauled you away for your compulsory DEI training. What are the woke >police in that town even doing with all my donations!

    <https://x.com/InternetHippo/status/1798923854624199013>


    One of my neighbors is flying a giant American flag in front of his
    house. Right-side up. Nice.

    Another, a few houses down, is flying a Giants flag.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to invalid@invalid.invalid on Fri Jun 7 19:37:04 2024
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 22:11:58 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:fle76jld4pj0rj412uv49jjfe4grpupa44@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 21:18:20 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:dq976jlhrp1puom0ha9ogpte8aniroj94i@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:25:36 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message news:7b176jdajq3co9nosj8qnie8rupdrsfoav@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 18:02:38 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote: >>>>>>
    On 6/7/2024 5:26 PM, Edward Rawde wrote:
    "Jeroen Belleman" <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote in message news:v3vtf6$2824r$1@dont-email.me...
    On 6/7/24 22:35, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for >>>>>>>>>>>> Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of >>>>>>>>>> consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to >>>>>>>>>> enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would >>>>>>>>>> morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper
    behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with, >>>>>>>>>> possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists. >>>>>>>>>>
    Better cooks too.


    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like >>>>>>>>> father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that >>>>>>>>> many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality! >>>>>>>>> Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual benefit. >>>>>>>>> Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've >>>>>>>>> seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    That's pretty much my experience too.


    Come to New England you'll meet a different cut of conservative, who has >>>>>>>no need for God or the Bible to explain why they think women shouldn't >>>>>>>vote or homosexuals should be hung. "I just don't like the fuckers." >>>>>>>


    I have lots of relatives in Mass and have spent many months of my life >>>>>> in NYC and Vermont

    Would I be correct in thinking that you've never been outside the USA except perhaps for a short vacation?


    I have spend a few months in France and a month working in Moscow.
    Some weeks working in England, in Oxford, and a few weeks vacatining
    in Ireland. Some time in Hamamatsu.

    I guess Alaska and Hawaii don't count.

    I have never encountered the sort of nastiness that other people seem
    to have. Most people are friendly and decent.


    Well your response to my reference to https://russell-j.com/0464NP.HTM was pretty nasty in my view.



    BR is dead, so I didn't offend him.

    I don't think he would have been offended even if he were still alive. >https://www.google.com/search?q=bertrand+russell+message+to+future+generations


    He sounded smug and nasty to me.

    But did you take a moment to take in anything he said? Or did you just let your emotional hormones get the better of your neurones
    like the rest of us are capable of doing at times?




    I read the essay, and some others of his.

    He did have a good attitude towards women.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to Cursitor Doom on Sat Jun 8 17:35:07 2024
    On 8/06/2024 9:27 am, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:55:01 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 20:43:01 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:22:40 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:43:58 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 07:49:17 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. As >>>>>>>>> Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza after >>>>>>>>> over a decade and a half of living under total air, land, and sea >>>>>>>>> blockade, many found themselves having to face this question. >>>>>>>>
    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a >>>>>>>> music festival may be an ideological statement, but it's primarily >>>>>>>> a psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and the people >>>>>>>> who planned it need to be locked up someplace where they can't do >>>>>>>> it again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a
    menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He >>>>>>> wants them all either jailed or executed. How typically neo-Liberal! >>>>>>
    I suppose there can be different opinions on the virtues of gang
    raping,
    hostage taking, and killing chidren.

    Wow, John. I never expected to see the day when you'd defend Bill
    Sloman!

    Just by accident, he's sort of right once in a while.

    Like a busted clock you mean? Yeah, I guess...

    His motivations are emotional, not logical. I see that a lot, smart
    people doing very stupid things because their hormones dominate their
    neurons.

    That's the peculiar thing about the new Leftists, though. These people
    call themselves "Liberals" but in truth they couldn't be farther away from the original meaning of the word. Classical Liberals would be horrified at the solution of executing or imprisoning someone who disagreed with them.
    Not so the neo Liberals. It's a deeply disturbing new trend and it's not confined solely to America.

    Not that Cursitor Doom can identify a single example of a "neo-liberal"
    acting that way, probably because the label is one that has has been
    invented by people who need a an imagined target to be rude about.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney


    --
    This email has been checked for viruses by Norton antivirus software. www.norton.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sat Jun 8 17:30:00 2024
    On 8/06/2024 6:55 am, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 20:43:01 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:22:40 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:43:58 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 07:49:17 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:

    <snip>

    His motivations are emotional, not logical. I see that a lot, smart
    people doing very stupid things because their hormones dominate their neurons.

    As if John Larkin would have clue. He's an ignorant sucker who can be
    flattered into believing total nonsense, and resents it when his
    intellectual inadequacy is shown up.

    --
    Bill Sloman. Sydney




    --
    This email has been checked for viruses by Norton antivirus software. www.norton.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sat Jun 8 17:49:29 2024
    On 8/06/2024 10:45 am, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:27:38 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:55:01 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 20:43:01 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:22:40 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:43:58 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 07:49:17 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:

    <snip>

    People, including women, are screaming and waving signs QUEERS FOR
    GAZA.

    Think about that one.

    The LGBT community feel themselves to be an oppressed minority,and are expressing support for another oppressed minority.

    It's a pretty crazy idea - the Palistinians in Gaza are oppressed
    because they are occupying land that Israel would like to take over.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney



    --
    This email has been checked for viruses by Norton antivirus software. www.norton.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jeroen Belleman@21:1/5 to Cursitor Doom on Sat Jun 8 10:43:15 2024
    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are >>>>> heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. There
    is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do this
    lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no afterlife,
    just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My existence is the
    result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly improbable events,
    going back billions of years into the past, and I will cease to exist,
    never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid of
    being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just another of those
    weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an after-life. And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I actually find the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be like you in outlook!

    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife,
    and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sat Jun 8 09:46:01 2024
    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 17:45:38 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:27:38 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:55:01 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 20:43:01 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:22:40 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:43:58 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 07:49:17 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:
    This question became seemingly ubiquitous following October 7. >>>>>>>>>> As Palestinians defied the imagination, breaking out of Gaza >>>>>>>>>> after over a decade and a half of living under total air, land, >>>>>>>>>> and sea blockade, many found themselves having to face this >>>>>>>>>> question.

    <snipped the rest of the tedious nonsense>

    Everybody sane condemns Hamas. Murdering some 1300 people at a >>>>>>>>> music festival may be an ideological statement, but it's
    primarily a psychopathic act of attention-getting terrorism, and >>>>>>>>> the people who planned it need to be locked up someplace where >>>>>>>>> they can't do it again.

    An idiot who tries to justify it as a political gestures is a >>>>>>>>> menace,
    and should be locked away on the same basis.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    Bill has a bit of a problem with anyone who disagrees with him. He >>>>>>>>wants them all either jailed or executed. How typically >>>>>>>>neo-Liberal!

    I suppose there can be different opinions on the virtues of gang >>>>>>> raping,
    hostage taking, and killing chidren.

    Wow, John. I never expected to see the day when you'd defend Bill >>>>>>Sloman!

    Just by accident, he's sort of right once in a while.

    Like a busted clock you mean? Yeah, I guess...

    His motivations are emotional, not logical. I see that a lot, smart
    people doing very stupid things because their hormones dominate their
    neurons.

    That's the peculiar thing about the new Leftists, though. These people
    call themselves "Liberals" but in truth they couldn't be farther away
    from the original meaning of the word. Classical Liberals would be >>horrified at the solution of executing or imprisoning someone who
    disagreed with them. Not so the neo Liberals. It's a deeply disturbing
    new trend and it's not confined solely to America.



    People, including women, are screaming and waving signs QUEERS FOR GAZA.

    Think about that one.

    I'm not talking about the ME. I'm talking about freedom of thought and
    opinion in general and the fact that it's being eroded by neo-Liberalism
    and political correctness.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to Jeroen Belleman on Sat Jun 8 09:54:42 2024
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they
    are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So >>>>>> for Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do
    this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past
    this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no afterlife,
    just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My existence is the
    result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly improbable events,
    going back billions of years into the past, and I will cease to exist,
    never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid of
    being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just another of
    those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an after-life.
    And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I actually find
    the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be like you in outlook!

    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife,
    and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for expansion on
    this forum!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sat Jun 8 09:53:35 2024
    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 19:37:04 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 22:11:58 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message >>news:fle76jld4pj0rj412uv49jjfe4grpupa44@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 21:18:20 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message >>>>news:dq976jlhrp1puom0ha9ogpte8aniroj94i@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:25:36 -0400, "Edward Rawde"
    <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

    "john larkin" <jl@650pot.com> wrote in message >>>>>>news:7b176jdajq3co9nosj8qnie8rupdrsfoav@4ax.com...
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 18:02:38 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net>
    wrote:

    On 6/7/2024 5:26 PM, Edward Rawde wrote:
    "Jeroen Belleman" <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote in message
    news:v3vtf6$2824r$1@dont-email.me...
    On 6/7/24 22:35, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because >>>>>>>>>>>>> they are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed >>>>>>>>>>>>> martyrs. So for Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor >>>>>>>>>>>> hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious
    brainwashing. There is no afterlife. There is only this life. >>>>>>>>>>>> Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature >>>>>>>>>>> of consciousness, you can't know.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to >>>>>>>>>>> enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else >>>>>>>>>>> would morality and justice come from?

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings >>>>>>>>>>> about proper behavior to others. Obviously, there are
    different religions with, possibly, genetic components.

    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than >>>>>>>>>>> atheists.

    Better cooks too.


    Oh! That's nonsense. Religion is a human invention, much like >>>>>>>>>> father Christmas and the tooth fairy. The difference is that >>>>>>>>>> many people never get over it.

    Religion has no right to claim to be the source of morality! >>>>>>>>>> Morality stems from a desire to cooperate to our mutual
    benefit.
    Religion never even comes into it.

    I see no clear tendency of religious people to be nicer. I've >>>>>>>>>> seen quite a few who were real bastards.

    That's pretty much my experience too.


    Come to New England you'll meet a different cut of conservative, >>>>>>>>who has no need for God or the Bible to explain why they think >>>>>>>>women shouldn't vote or homosexuals should be hung. "I just don't >>>>>>>>like the fuckers."



    I have lots of relatives in Mass and have spent many months of my >>>>>>> life in NYC and Vermont

    Would I be correct in thinking that you've never been outside the >>>>>>USA except perhaps for a short vacation?


    I have spend a few months in France and a month working in Moscow.
    Some weeks working in England, in Oxford, and a few weeks vacatining >>>>> in Ireland. Some time in Hamamatsu.

    I guess Alaska and Hawaii don't count.

    I have never encountered the sort of nastiness that other people
    seem to have. Most people are friendly and decent.


    Well your response to my reference to https://russell-j.com/0464NP.HTM >>>>was pretty nasty in my view.



    BR is dead, so I didn't offend him.

    I don't think he would have been offended even if he were still alive. >>https://www.google.com/search? q=bertrand+russell+message+to+future+generations


    He sounded smug and nasty to me.

    But did you take a moment to take in anything he said? Or did you just
    let your emotional hormones get the better of your neurones like the
    rest of us are capable of doing at times?




    I read the essay, and some others of his.

    He did have a good attitude towards women.

    So did this fellow:

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/feb/07/david-carrick-jailed-life- rapes-met-police-officer

    ;-)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to Cursitor Doom on Sat Jun 8 21:00:13 2024
    On 8/06/2024 7:46 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 17:45:38 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:27:38 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:55:01 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 20:43:01 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 13:22:40 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:43:58 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 07 Jun 2024 07:49:17 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 07:32:17 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 15:48:06 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 7/06/2024 7:27 am, NefeshBarYochai wrote:

    <snip>

    I'm not talking about the ME. I'm talking about freedom of thought and opinion in general and the fact that it's being eroded by neo-Liberalism
    and political correctness.

    You are talking specifically about your freedom to post fatuous
    nonsense. You'd like people to take you seriously and that isn't going
    to happen.

    --
    Bill Sloman. Sydney


    --
    This email has been checked for viruses by Norton antivirus software. www.norton.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jeroen Belleman@21:1/5 to Cursitor Doom on Sat Jun 8 12:51:50 2024
    On 6/8/24 11:54, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    [Snip!]

    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife,
    and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for expansion on
    this forum!

    This whole thread has been OT from the start, but OK, fair enough.

    Jeroen Belleman

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sat Jun 8 21:07:40 2024
    On 8/06/2024 6:35 am, john larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 19:53:35 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they are
    heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So for
    Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Until you understand the origin of the universe and the nature of consciousness, you can't know.

    You can be pretty sure that primitive creation myths aren't going to be helpful.

    Religion is human's reason to have morality. Morality leads to
    enlightment and a kind, just, productive society. Where else would
    morality and justice come from?

    Try reading some Spinoza.

    One interpretation of religion is our collective feelings about proper behavior to others. Obviously, there are different religions with,
    possibly, genetic components.

    Religions are a political systems, and not a a particularly constructive example of the breed.
    In my personal experience, religious people are nicer than atheists.

    Better cooks too.

    Except that you also think that Donald Trump has common sense. Your
    judgement isn't wonderful.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney



    --
    This email has been checked for viruses by Norton antivirus software. www.norton.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to cd999666@notformail.com on Sat Jun 8 07:45:08 2024
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they >>>>>>> are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So >>>>>>> for Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do
    this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past
    this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no afterlife,
    just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My existence is the
    result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly improbable events,
    going back billions of years into the past, and I will cease to exist, >>>> never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid of
    being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just another of
    those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an after-life.
    And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I actually find
    the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be like you in outlook!

    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife,
    and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for expansion on
    this forum!

    Designing electronics has obviously suggestions of quantum
    consciousness, and even Einstein thought that QM was spooky.

    Don't give up on miracles quite yet.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jeroen Belleman@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sat Jun 8 19:30:11 2024
    On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they >>>>>>>> are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So >>>>>>>> for Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing.
    There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do
    this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past
    this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no afterlife, >>>>> just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My existence is the >>>>> result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly improbable events, >>>>> going back billions of years into the past, and I will cease to exist, >>>>> never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid of
    being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just another of
    those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an after-life. >>>> And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I actually find
    the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be like you in outlook! >>>
    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife,
    and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for expansion on
    this forum!

    Designing electronics has obviously suggestions of quantum
    consciousness, and even Einstein thought that QM was spooky.

    Don't give up on miracles quite yet.


    You have referred to quantum effects in the brain many
    times. In as far as the brain is a chemical machine, and
    that chemistry is basically a manifestation of quantum
    mechanics, I agree. In practice, QM is just a level too
    deep in the abstraction stack. Somehow I believe that
    that is not how you see it. Would you elaborate?

    Much of technology, electronics in particular, is a miracle,
    though not in the mystical or religious sense.

    Jeroen Belleman

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to Cursitor Doom on Sat Jun 8 15:48:46 2024
    On 6/8/2024 5:46 AM, Cursitor Doom wrote:

    People, including women, are screaming and waving signs QUEERS FOR GAZA.

    Think about that one.

    I'm not talking about the ME. I'm talking about freedom of thought and opinion in general and the fact that it's being eroded by neo-Liberalism
    and political correctness.

    Have there been any big revolutions in right-wing thought lately or is
    still just primarily the usual long list of commies, queers, and
    degenerates who need to be gotten rid of.

    I think it's probably possible to suppress novel thought but I'm
    uncertain there's much novel on offer I guess that's why they call it "conservatism", after all.

    It was all better in the old days, need to get back to the good ol'
    days. Am I missing something?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to jeroen@nospam.please on Sat Jun 8 12:55:18 2024
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 19:30:11 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they >>>>>>>>> are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So >>>>>>>>> for Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do >>>>>>> this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past >>>>>>> this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no afterlife, >>>>>> just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My existence is the >>>>>> result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly improbable events, >>>>>> going back billions of years into the past, and I will cease to exist, >>>>>> never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid of >>>>>> being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just another of >>>>>> those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an after-life. >>>>> And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I actually find >>>>> the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be like you in outlook! >>>>
    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife,
    and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for expansion on >>> this forum!

    Designing electronics has obviously suggestions of quantum
    consciousness, and even Einstein thought that QM was spooky.

    Don't give up on miracles quite yet.


    You have referred to quantum effects in the brain many
    times. In as far as the brain is a chemical machine, and
    that chemistry is basically a manifestation of quantum
    mechanics, I agree. In practice, QM is just a level too
    deep in the abstraction stack. Somehow I believe that
    that is not how you see it. Would you elaborate?


    DNA and RNA and other things aren't flat linear molecules as the
    cartoons suggest. They are twisted and tangled into writhing balls. So
    any sequence gets continuously and randomly rubbed against the rest of
    the string. That's a quantum cross-correlation machine.

    Much of technology, electronics in particular, is a miracle,
    though not in the mystical or religious sense.

    I like the Barrie Gilbert essay, "Where do little circuits come from?"

    They are all out there in the infinite solution space, and it's hard
    to explore an infinite space serially.

    There's nothing mystical about a universe that obviously works.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sat Jun 8 16:08:51 2024
    On 6/8/2024 3:55 PM, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 19:30:11 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they >>>>>>>>>> are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So >>>>>>>>>> for Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do >>>>>>>> this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past >>>>>>>> this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no afterlife, >>>>>>> just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My existence is the >>>>>>> result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly improbable events, >>>>>>> going back billions of years into the past, and I will cease to exist, >>>>>>> never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid of >>>>>>> being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just another of >>>>>>> those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an after-life. >>>>>> And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I actually find >>>>>> the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be like you in outlook! >>>>>
    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife,
    and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for expansion on >>>> this forum!

    Designing electronics has obviously suggestions of quantum
    consciousness, and even Einstein thought that QM was spooky.

    Don't give up on miracles quite yet.


    You have referred to quantum effects in the brain many
    times. In as far as the brain is a chemical machine, and
    that chemistry is basically a manifestation of quantum
    mechanics, I agree. In practice, QM is just a level too
    deep in the abstraction stack. Somehow I believe that
    that is not how you see it. Would you elaborate?


    DNA and RNA and other things aren't flat linear molecules as the
    cartoons suggest. They are twisted and tangled into writhing balls. So
    any sequence gets continuously and randomly rubbed against the rest of
    the string. That's a quantum cross-correlation machine.

    Much of technology, electronics in particular, is a miracle,
    though not in the mystical or religious sense.

    I like the Barrie Gilbert essay, "Where do little circuits come from?"

    They are all out there in the infinite solution space, and it's hard
    to explore an infinite space serially.

    There's nothing mystical about a universe that obviously works.


    The "RNA world" hypothesis is that RNA is a very special molecule, the
    "killer app" that bootstrapped life.

    Turns out that while the ribosome both synthesizes proteins and is made
    of proteins, RNA does a lot of the heavy lifting. It can synthesize
    proteins on its own outside of the ribosome but it's just not as good.
    And it can function as an enzyme, though not as good as many other
    enzymes. It can store information but DNA is a better solution for
    eukaryotic cells.

    It's a jack-of-all trades from the solution space that took 500 million
    years to hit on but once it was hit on life was off and running.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to bitrex on Sat Jun 8 20:33:28 2024
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 15:48:46 -0400, bitrex wrote:

    On 6/8/2024 5:46 AM, Cursitor Doom wrote:

    People, including women, are screaming and waving signs QUEERS FOR
    GAZA.

    Think about that one.

    I'm not talking about the ME. I'm talking about freedom of thought and
    opinion in general and the fact that it's being eroded by
    neo-Liberalism and political correctness.

    Have there been any big revolutions in right-wing thought lately or is
    still just primarily the usual long list of commies, queers, and
    degenerates who need to be gotten rid of.

    You missed out the Jews.

    I think it's probably possible to suppress novel thought but I'm
    uncertain there's much novel on offer I guess that's why they call it "conservatism", after all.

    It was all better in the old days, need to get back to the good ol'
    days. Am I missing something?

    You'll be fine. You and me'll go on a good ol' fashioned lynchin' party -
    don't worry, you'll soon get the flavor for it and the more you do, the
    sweeter it gets.
    ;-)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to bitrex on Sat Jun 8 13:30:20 2024
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 16:08:51 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/8/2024 3:55 PM, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 19:30:11 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they >>>>>>>>>>> are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So >>>>>>>>>>> for Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do >>>>>>>>> this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past >>>>>>>>> this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no afterlife, >>>>>>>> just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My existence is the >>>>>>>> result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly improbable events, >>>>>>>> going back billions of years into the past, and I will cease to exist, >>>>>>>> never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid of >>>>>>>> being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just another of >>>>>>>> those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an after-life. >>>>>>> And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I actually find >>>>>>> the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be like you in outlook! >>>>>>
    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife, >>>>>> and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for expansion on >>>>> this forum!

    Designing electronics has obviously suggestions of quantum
    consciousness, and even Einstein thought that QM was spooky.

    Don't give up on miracles quite yet.


    You have referred to quantum effects in the brain many
    times. In as far as the brain is a chemical machine, and
    that chemistry is basically a manifestation of quantum
    mechanics, I agree. In practice, QM is just a level too
    deep in the abstraction stack. Somehow I believe that
    that is not how you see it. Would you elaborate?


    DNA and RNA and other things aren't flat linear molecules as the
    cartoons suggest. They are twisted and tangled into writhing balls. So
    any sequence gets continuously and randomly rubbed against the rest of
    the string. That's a quantum cross-correlation machine.

    Much of technology, electronics in particular, is a miracle,
    though not in the mystical or religious sense.

    I like the Barrie Gilbert essay, "Where do little circuits come from?"

    They are all out there in the infinite solution space, and it's hard
    to explore an infinite space serially.

    There's nothing mystical about a universe that obviously works.


    The "RNA world" hypothesis is that RNA is a very special molecule, the >"killer app" that bootstrapped life.

    There are lots of people who want that to be true (never mind the
    details) because they don't want to admit that other things might be
    true.

    Nature has a rude habit of doing things that scientists didn't approve
    of.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sat Jun 8 20:38:12 2024
    On Sat, 08 Jun 2024 12:55:18 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 19:30:11 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because >>>>>>>>>> they are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed >>>>>>>>>> martyrs. So for Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor
    hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do >>>>>>>> this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past >>>>>>>> this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no
    afterlife, just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My
    existence is the result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly >>>>>>> improbable events, going back billions of years into the past, and >>>>>>> I will cease to exist,
    never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid >>>>>>> of being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just another >>>>>>> of those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an
    after-life. And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I >>>>>> actually find the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be
    like you in outlook!

    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife,
    and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for expansion
    on this forum!

    Designing electronics has obviously suggestions of quantum
    consciousness, and even Einstein thought that QM was spooky.

    Don't give up on miracles quite yet.


    You have referred to quantum effects in the brain many times. In as far
    as the brain is a chemical machine, and that chemistry is basically a >>manifestation of quantum mechanics, I agree. In practice, QM is just a >>level too deep in the abstraction stack. Somehow I believe that that is
    not how you see it. Would you elaborate?


    DNA and RNA and other things aren't flat linear molecules as the
    cartoons suggest. They are twisted and tangled into writhing balls. So
    any sequence gets continuously and randomly rubbed against the rest of
    the string. That's a quantum cross-correlation machine.

    Much of technology, electronics in particular, is a miracle,
    though not in the mystical or religious sense.

    I like the Barrie Gilbert essay, "Where do little circuits come from?"

    They are all out there in the infinite solution space, and it's hard to explore an infinite space serially.

    There's nothing mystical about a universe that obviously works.

    And then the Leftists come along and decide that although it works, it
    works badly and they can fix it - or at least improve it somehow - simply
    by implementing policies which defy nature in an act of ultimate 'magical thinking'.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jeroen Belleman@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sat Jun 8 23:59:33 2024
    On 6/8/24 21:55, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 19:30:11 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they >>>>>>>>>> are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So >>>>>>>>>> for Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do >>>>>>>> this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past >>>>>>>> this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no afterlife, >>>>>>> just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My existence is the >>>>>>> result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly improbable events, >>>>>>> going back billions of years into the past, and I will cease to exist, >>>>>>> never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid of >>>>>>> being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just another of >>>>>>> those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an after-life. >>>>>> And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I actually find >>>>>> the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be like you in outlook! >>>>>
    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife,
    and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for expansion on >>>> this forum!

    Designing electronics has obviously suggestions of quantum
    consciousness, and even Einstein thought that QM was spooky.

    Don't give up on miracles quite yet.


    You have referred to quantum effects in the brain many
    times. In as far as the brain is a chemical machine, and
    that chemistry is basically a manifestation of quantum
    mechanics, I agree. In practice, QM is just a level too
    deep in the abstraction stack. Somehow I believe that
    that is not how you see it. Would you elaborate?


    DNA and RNA and other things aren't flat linear molecules as the
    cartoons suggest. They are twisted and tangled into writhing balls. So
    any sequence gets continuously and randomly rubbed against the rest of
    the string. That's a quantum cross-correlation machine.

    Hmm. I see DNA as a template for making molecular machines,
    enzymes and such, that do useful things for living organisms.
    Useful things such as transforming nutrients into suitable
    energy-carrying chemicals or building blocks for cell components.
    Pumps to move stuff into or out of cell compartments, and many
    other functions needed to make a living cell thrive.

    DNA doesn't do much by itself. It's the molecular machines that
    do the work.


    Much of technology, electronics in particular, is a miracle,
    though not in the mystical or religious sense.

    I like the Barrie Gilbert essay, "Where do little circuits come from?"

    They are all out there in the infinite solution space, and it's hard
    to explore an infinite space serially.

    Hmm. When I design a circuit, I don't randomly jump through
    solution space. I start with something simple, then identify
    limitations and add or change things to address them. I may
    add bootstraps or cascodes to reduce the effect of parasitic
    capacitance. Add buffers to reduce load or output impedance
    effects. Add symmetry to tackle thermal or offset issues.
    Change or add components to tweak phase/frequency responses.
    Move components around to reduce parasitics, or to profit
    from some fortuitous beneficial one. And so on.

    Basically I'll choose some promising starting point and then
    try to move forward through the solution space, exploring
    interesting branches on the way. Rarely I'll throw everything
    out and start over.

    It's still a serial process. I can't see much of the space at
    once. Maybe you can. So much the better for you.

    Jeroen Belleman

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From john larkin@21:1/5 to jeroen@nospam.please on Sat Jun 8 17:01:10 2024
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 23:59:33 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 21:55, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 19:30:11 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they >>>>>>>>>>> are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So >>>>>>>>>>> for Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do >>>>>>>>> this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past >>>>>>>>> this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no afterlife, >>>>>>>> just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My existence is the >>>>>>>> result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly improbable events, >>>>>>>> going back billions of years into the past, and I will cease to exist, >>>>>>>> never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid of >>>>>>>> being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just another of >>>>>>>> those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an after-life. >>>>>>> And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I actually find >>>>>>> the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be like you in outlook! >>>>>>
    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife, >>>>>> and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for expansion on >>>>> this forum!

    Designing electronics has obviously suggestions of quantum
    consciousness, and even Einstein thought that QM was spooky.

    Don't give up on miracles quite yet.


    You have referred to quantum effects in the brain many
    times. In as far as the brain is a chemical machine, and
    that chemistry is basically a manifestation of quantum
    mechanics, I agree. In practice, QM is just a level too
    deep in the abstraction stack. Somehow I believe that
    that is not how you see it. Would you elaborate?


    DNA and RNA and other things aren't flat linear molecules as the
    cartoons suggest. They are twisted and tangled into writhing balls. So
    any sequence gets continuously and randomly rubbed against the rest of
    the string. That's a quantum cross-correlation machine.

    Hmm. I see DNA as a template for making molecular machines,
    enzymes and such, that do useful things for living organisms.
    Useful things such as transforming nutrients into suitable
    energy-carrying chemicals or building blocks for cell components.
    Pumps to move stuff into or out of cell compartments, and many
    other functions needed to make a living cell thrive.

    DNA doesn't do much by itself. It's the molecular machines that
    do the work.


    Much of technology, electronics in particular, is a miracle,
    though not in the mystical or religious sense.

    I like the Barrie Gilbert essay, "Where do little circuits come from?"

    They are all out there in the infinite solution space, and it's hard
    to explore an infinite space serially.

    Hmm. When I design a circuit, I don't randomly jump through
    solution space. I start with something simple, then identify
    limitations and add or change things to address them. I may
    add bootstraps or cascodes to reduce the effect of parasitic
    capacitance. Add buffers to reduce load or output impedance
    effects. Add symmetry to tackle thermal or offset issues.
    Change or add components to tweak phase/frequency responses.
    Move components around to reduce parasitics, or to profit
    from some fortuitous beneficial one. And so on.

    Basically I'll choose some promising starting point and then
    try to move forward through the solution space, exploring
    interesting branches on the way. Rarely I'll throw everything
    out and start over.

    That's incremental design, which is necessary, but it doesn't create
    entirely new circuits or products.

    Some big companies stick to tweaking what they know, and get crushed
    by upstarts in dorm rooms.

    Some big companies have futurists and fellows whose job is to consider possibilities. Somebody at Boeing is thinking about what airplanes (or whatever) might look like 30 years from now. I have friends at
    Raytheon and ASML whose job is to do that, think far away from where
    they are now.

    I like to imagine planting a grenade inside my brain and blowing bits
    all over the possible solution space, to start a zillion parallel
    processors. Let that soak for a while.

    There are think tanks like HRL that do just that.

    Most engineers are uncomfortable with uncertainty and confusion so
    latch onto a design concept ASAP, preferably something already
    sanctioned somewhere, and buckle down to implementing.


    It's still a serial process. I can't see much of the space at
    once. Maybe you can. So much the better for you.

    It takes some practice to be willing to be confused for a while. It
    helps to be a bit autistic, to not much care what other people think.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sat Jun 8 22:41:25 2024
    On 6/8/2024 4:30 PM, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 16:08:51 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/8/2024 3:55 PM, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 19:30:11 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they >>>>>>>>>>>> are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So >>>>>>>>>>>> for Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do >>>>>>>>>> this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past >>>>>>>>>> this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no afterlife, >>>>>>>>> just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My existence is the >>>>>>>>> result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly improbable events, >>>>>>>>> going back billions of years into the past, and I will cease to exist,
    never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid of >>>>>>>>> being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just another of >>>>>>>>> those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an after-life. >>>>>>>> And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I actually find >>>>>>>> the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be like you in outlook!

    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife, >>>>>>> and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for expansion on >>>>>> this forum!

    Designing electronics has obviously suggestions of quantum
    consciousness, and even Einstein thought that QM was spooky.

    Don't give up on miracles quite yet.


    You have referred to quantum effects in the brain many
    times. In as far as the brain is a chemical machine, and
    that chemistry is basically a manifestation of quantum
    mechanics, I agree. In practice, QM is just a level too
    deep in the abstraction stack. Somehow I believe that
    that is not how you see it. Would you elaborate?


    DNA and RNA and other things aren't flat linear molecules as the
    cartoons suggest. They are twisted and tangled into writhing balls. So
    any sequence gets continuously and randomly rubbed against the rest of
    the string. That's a quantum cross-correlation machine.

    Much of technology, electronics in particular, is a miracle,
    though not in the mystical or religious sense.

    I like the Barrie Gilbert essay, "Where do little circuits come from?"

    They are all out there in the infinite solution space, and it's hard
    to explore an infinite space serially.

    There's nothing mystical about a universe that obviously works.


    The "RNA world" hypothesis is that RNA is a very special molecule, the
    "killer app" that bootstrapped life.

    There are lots of people who want that to be true (never mind the
    details) because they don't want to admit that other things might be
    true.

    Nature has a rude habit of doing things that scientists didn't approve
    of.


    I tend to be of the opinion that actionable scientific theories of
    either how to get life to bootstrap from non-life in a lab environment,
    or how to make a machine emulate the significantly human qualities of a
    mind, will remain frustratingly elusive for the foreseeable future.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jeroen Belleman@21:1/5 to bitrex on Sun Jun 9 10:22:37 2024
    On 6/9/24 04:41, bitrex wrote:
    On 6/8/2024 4:30 PM, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 16:08:51 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/8/2024 3:55 PM, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 19:30:11 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because >>>>>>>>>>>>> they
    are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed >>>>>>>>>>>>> martyrs. So
    for Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor >>>>>>>>>>>> hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>>>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing >>>>>>>>>>> to do
    this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life >>>>>>>>>>> past
    this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no >>>>>>>>>> afterlife,
    just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My existence >>>>>>>>>> is the
    result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly improbable >>>>>>>>>> events,
    going back billions of years into the past, and I will cease >>>>>>>>>> to exist,
    never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not
    afraid of
    being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just
    another of
    those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an
    after-life.
    And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I
    actually find
    the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be like you in >>>>>>>>> outlook!

    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife, >>>>>>>> and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for
    expansion on
    this forum!

    Designing electronics has obviously suggestions of quantum
    consciousness, and even Einstein thought that QM was spooky.

    Don't give up on miracles quite yet.


    You have referred to quantum effects in the brain many
    times. In as far as the brain is a chemical machine, and
    that chemistry is basically a manifestation of quantum
    mechanics, I agree. In practice, QM is just a level too
    deep in the abstraction stack. Somehow I believe that
    that is not how you see it. Would you elaborate?


    DNA and RNA and other things aren't flat linear molecules as the
    cartoons suggest. They are twisted and tangled into writhing balls. So >>>> any sequence gets continuously and randomly rubbed against the rest of >>>> the string. That's a quantum cross-correlation machine.

    Much of technology, electronics in particular, is a miracle,
    though not in the mystical or religious sense.

    I like the Barrie Gilbert essay, "Where do little circuits come from?" >>>>
    They are all out there in the infinite solution space, and it's hard
    to explore an infinite space serially.

    There's nothing mystical about a universe that obviously works.


    The "RNA world" hypothesis is that RNA is a very special molecule, the
    "killer app" that bootstrapped life.

    There are lots of people who want that to be true (never mind the
    details) because they don't want to admit that other things might be
    true.

    Nature has a rude habit of doing things that scientists didn't approve
    of.


    I tend to be of the opinion that actionable scientific theories of
    either how to get life to bootstrap from non-life in a lab environment,
    or how to make a machine emulate the significantly human qualities of a
    mind, will remain frustratingly elusive for the foreseeable future.

    I'm with Dijkstra: Asking if a computer can think makes as much sense
    as asking whether a submarine can swim.

    Jeroen Belleman

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sun Jun 9 10:22:19 2024
    On Sat, 08 Jun 2024 13:30:20 -0700, john larkin wrote:


    Nature has a rude habit of doing things that scientists didn't approve
    of.

    You could substitute "Liberals" for "scientists" here and it would still
    make perfect sense.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to Cursitor Doom on Sun Jun 9 21:33:04 2024
    On 9/06/2024 6:33 am, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 15:48:46 -0400, bitrex wrote:

    On 6/8/2024 5:46 AM, Cursitor Doom wrote:

    People, including women, are screaming and waving signs QUEERS FOR
    GAZA.

    Think about that one.

    I'm not talking about the ME. I'm talking about freedom of thought and
    opinion in general and the fact that it's being eroded by
    neo-Liberalism and political correctness.

    Have there been any big revolutions in right-wing thought lately or is
    still just primarily the usual long list of commies, queers, and
    degenerates who need to be gotten rid of.

    You missed out the Jews.

    I think it's probably possible to suppress novel thought but I'm
    uncertain there's much novel on offer I guess that's why they call it
    "conservatism", after all.

    It was all better in the old days, need to get back to the good ol'
    days. Am I missing something?

    You'll be fine. You and me'll go on a good ol' fashioned lynchin' party - don't worry, you'll soon get the flavor for it and the more you do, the sweeter it gets.
    ;-)

    Cursitor Doom doesn't understand that he is morally defective. If you
    don't understand that being unpleasant to strangers is not a
    constructive reaction to the unfamiliar, you can go in for this kind of nonsense and not realise that other people find it repellent. Some of
    them will notice that it is also illegal, and put you in prison.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney


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  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sun Jun 9 22:13:30 2024
    On 9/06/2024 6:30 am, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 16:08:51 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/8/2024 3:55 PM, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 19:30:11 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:

    <snip>

    There's nothing mystical about a universe that obviously works.


    The "RNA world" hypothesis is that RNA is a very special molecule, the
    "killer app" that bootstrapped life.

    There are lots of people who want that to be true (never mind the
    details) because they don't want to admit that other things might be
    true.

    And aren't supported by any evidence at all.

    Nature has a rude habit of doing things that scientists didn't approve
    of.

    Science is process of studying what exists, and making sense of it.
    "Approving" of what they find isn't part of the process.

    "Soapy Sam" Wilberforce didn't approve of Darwin's theoryu of evolution,
    but he was theologian rather than a scientist.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Wilberforce

    Huxley made mince meat of him.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

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  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sun Jun 9 21:48:10 2024
    On 9/06/2024 5:55 am, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 19:30:11 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because they >>>>>>>>>> are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed martyrs. So >>>>>>>>>> for Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor hell. >>>>>>>>> Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to do >>>>>>>> this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life past >>>>>>>> this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no afterlife, >>>>>>> just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My existence is the >>>>>>> result of an uninterrupted sequence of incredibly improbable events, >>>>>>> going back billions of years into the past, and I will cease to exist, >>>>>>> never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid of >>>>>>> being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just another of >>>>>>> those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an after-life. >>>>>> And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. I actually find >>>>>> the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be like you in outlook! >>>>>
    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife,
    and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for expansion on >>>> this forum!

    Designing electronics has obviously suggestions of quantum
    consciousness, and even Einstein thought that QM was spooky.

    Don't give up on miracles quite yet.


    You have referred to quantum effects in the brain many
    times. In as far as the brain is a chemical machine, and
    that chemistry is basically a manifestation of quantum
    mechanics, I agree. In practice, QM is just a level too
    deep in the abstraction stack. Somehow I believe that
    that is not how you see it. Would you elaborate?


    DNA and RNA and other things aren't flat linear molecules as the
    cartoons suggest. They are twisted and tangled into writhing balls. So
    any sequence gets continuously and randomly rubbed against the rest of
    the string.

    But nothing happens to the DNA in the process.

    That's a quantum cross-correlation machine.

    It would be if the DNA came out different. It doesn't.

    Much of technology, electronics in particular, is a miracle,
    though not in the mystical or religious sense.

    I like the Barrie Gilbert essay, "Where do little circuits come from?"

    They are all out there in the infinite solution space, and it's hard
    to explore an infinite space serially.

    It's not difficult, just time consuming. You work outwards from the area
    you have already explored - you don't, but people like Barry Gilbert and
    Bob Widlar did. It's what science is about, but you don't anything about
    that either.

    There's nothing mystical about a universe that obviously works.

    Our current model of the universe depends on lots of dark matter -
    though we don't what it is and have never seen anything that might
    qualify - small black holes might fill the gap, but we haven't
    identified any of them either. The first LIGO result showed us two
    unexpectedly small black holes fusing, but not small enough to fit the
    dark mater profile.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney



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  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to Cursitor Doom on Sun Jun 9 22:31:37 2024
    On 9/06/2024 6:38 am, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Sat, 08 Jun 2024 12:55:18 -0700, john larkin wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 19:30:11 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:

    <snip>

    I like the Barrie Gilbert essay, "Where do little circuits come from?"

    They are all out there in the infinite solution space, and it's hard to
    explore an infinite space serially.

    There's nothing mystical about a universe that obviously works.

    And then the Leftists come along and decide that although it works, it
    works badly and they can fix it - or at least improve it somehow - simply
    by implementing policies which defy nature in an act of ultimate 'magical thinking'.

    That's Cursitor Doom being an ignorant rightist. The fundamental
    difference between leftist and rightist is that leftists think that
    society can be improved, and rightists think that the risk of changing
    society are too great to make it a practical proposition.

    When twits like Cursitor Doom claim that some left wing proposal
    "defies nature" all they means is that they don't understand it, and
    aren't prepared to learn enough about it to understand why the leftist
    like the idea.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

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  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to john larkin on Sun Jun 9 22:56:09 2024
    On 9/06/2024 10:01 am, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 23:59:33 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 21:55, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 19:30:11 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Basically I'll choose some promising starting point and then
    try to move forward through the solution space, exploring
    interesting branches on the way. Rarely I'll throw everything
    out and start over.

    That's incremental design, which is necessary, but it doesn't create
    entirely new circuits or products.

    "Rarely I'll throw everything out and start over". That isn't
    incremental design. You don't do that - or if you have you haven't
    talked about it. I've commented on this before.

    Some big companies stick to tweaking what they know, and get crushed
    by upstarts in dorm rooms.

    Some big companies have futurists and fellows whose job is to consider possibilities. Somebody at Boeing is thinking about what airplanes (or whatever) might look like 30 years from now. I have friends at
    Raytheon and ASML whose job is to do that, think far away from where
    they are now.

    But the comapany superstructure means that it doesn't happen often.

    ASML was a spin-off from Philips, and took their human factors
    department with them. I applied for one job at ASML and made it to
    interview, but didn't seem to fit the pattern that their personnel
    officers expected,

    I like to imagine planting a grenade inside my brain and blowing bits
    all over the possible solution space, to start a zillion parallel
    processors. Let that soak for a while.

    What a silly idea.

    There are think tanks like HRL that do just that.

    Not exactly. They sell expertise, and planting a grenade inside an
    expert's brain would destroy that expertise. Brainstorming is a rather different sort of activity.

    Most engineers are uncomfortable with uncertainty and confusion so
    latch onto a design concept ASAP, preferably something already
    sanctioned somewhere, and buckle down to implementing.

    If you know of a solution that will work, you'd be mad not to use it.
    I had a good idea in 1978 that a programmable logic device to make it practical. I got my hands on one in 1993 and it ended up in

    Sloman A.W., Buggs P., Molloy J., and Stewart D. “A
    microcontroller-based driver to stabilise the temperature of an optical
    stage to 1mK in the range 4C to 38C, using a Peltier heat pump and a
    thermistor sensor” Measurement Science and Technology, 7 1653-64 (1996)

    It's still a serial process. I can't see much of the space at
    once. Maybe you can. So much the better for you.

    It takes some practice to be willing to be confused for a while.

    You seem to be confused most of the time.


    It helps to be a bit autistic, to not much care what other people think.

    And some people think that you confuse tinkering with a circuit with
    circuit design.

    Somebody thinks that a two-transistor emitter-coupled monostable is a "horrendous mess" can expect to earn that kind of reputation.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney



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  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to Bill Sloman on Sun Jun 9 13:09:34 2024
    On Sun, 9 Jun 2024 22:17:37 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 9/06/2024 8:22 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Sat, 08 Jun 2024 13:30:20 -0700, john larkin wrote:


    Nature has a rude habit of doing things that scientists didn't approve
    of.

    You could substitute "Liberals" for "scientists" here and it would
    still make perfect sense.

    Since it didn't make sense in the first place - science isn't about "approval" but about consistency with the rest of science, Cursitor Doom
    is just advertising his ignorance here.

    Er, no. It's about the systematic study of nature and the pursuit of
    Truth. We're already seeing the damage that 'consistency with the rest of science' is having on our economic life thanks to all that climate
    claptrap that you and others falsely claim is settled science.


    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

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  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to Cursitor Doom on Sun Jun 9 22:17:37 2024
    On 9/06/2024 8:22 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Sat, 08 Jun 2024 13:30:20 -0700, john larkin wrote:


    Nature has a rude habit of doing things that scientists didn't approve
    of.

    You could substitute "Liberals" for "scientists" here and it would still
    make perfect sense.

    Since it didn't make sense in the first place - science isn't about
    "approval" but about consistency with the rest of science, Cursitor Doom
    is just advertising his ignorance here.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

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  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to Bill Sloman on Sun Jun 9 12:16:39 2024
    On Sun, 9 Jun 2024 21:33:04 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 9/06/2024 6:33 am, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 15:48:46 -0400, bitrex wrote:

    On 6/8/2024 5:46 AM, Cursitor Doom wrote:

    People, including women, are screaming and waving signs QUEERS FOR
    GAZA.

    Think about that one.

    I'm not talking about the ME. I'm talking about freedom of thought
    and opinion in general and the fact that it's being eroded by
    neo-Liberalism and political correctness.

    Have there been any big revolutions in right-wing thought lately or is
    still just primarily the usual long list of commies, queers, and
    degenerates who need to be gotten rid of.

    You missed out the Jews.

    I think it's probably possible to suppress novel thought but I'm
    uncertain there's much novel on offer I guess that's why they call it
    "conservatism", after all.

    It was all better in the old days, need to get back to the good ol'
    days. Am I missing something?

    You'll be fine. You and me'll go on a good ol' fashioned lynchin' party
    -
    don't worry, you'll soon get the flavor for it and the more you do, the
    sweeter it gets.
    ;-)

    Cursitor Doom doesn't understand that he is morally defective. If you
    don't understand that being unpleasant to strangers is not a
    constructive reaction to the unfamiliar, you can go in for this kind of nonsense and not realise that other people find it repellent. Some of
    them will notice that it is also illegal, and put you in prison.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    Sorry, Bill. I should have known that you as a Jew would be unduly
    sensitive to my little joke (you didn't seem to notice the smiley). No
    offence was intended, but if any were taken, I humbly apologise. Now can
    we be friends again?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to Cursitor Doom on Mon Jun 10 01:13:29 2024
    On 9/06/2024 10:16 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Sun, 9 Jun 2024 21:33:04 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 9/06/2024 6:33 am, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 15:48:46 -0400, bitrex wrote:

    On 6/8/2024 5:46 AM, Cursitor Doom wrote:

    People, including women, are screaming and waving signs QUEERS FOR >>>>>> GAZA.

    Think about that one.

    I'm not talking about the ME. I'm talking about freedom of thought
    and opinion in general and the fact that it's being eroded by
    neo-Liberalism and political correctness.

    Have there been any big revolutions in right-wing thought lately or is >>>> still just primarily the usual long list of commies, queers, and
    degenerates who need to be gotten rid of.

    You missed out the Jews.

    I think it's probably possible to suppress novel thought but I'm
    uncertain there's much novel on offer I guess that's why they call it
    "conservatism", after all.

    It was all better in the old days, need to get back to the good ol'
    days. Am I missing something?

    You'll be fine. You and me'll go on a good ol' fashioned lynchin' party
    -
    don't worry, you'll soon get the flavor for it and the more you do, the
    sweeter it gets.
    ;-)

    Cursitor Doom doesn't understand that he is morally defective. If you
    don't understand that being unpleasant to strangers is not a
    constructive reaction to the unfamiliar, you can go in for this kind of
    nonsense and not realise that other people find it repellent. Some of
    them will notice that it is also illegal, and put you in prison.

    Sorry, Bill. I should have known that you as a Jew would be unduly
    sensitive to my little joke (you didn't seem to notice the smiley).

    I'm not actually Jewish. Sloman is a west country name - there are more
    Slomans in the Taunton telephone directory than there are in the London telephone directory, and my great-grandfather Sloman was born in Bristol
    in 1850, though the family promptly got on the boat to Australia.

    There is a family of Slomans in Melbourne who are Jewish, but their grandparents were called Slominsky in Poland before they headed out to Australia around 1870. One of my chemistry lecturers was a member of the
    family (though he didn't have the Sloman surname).

    No offence was intended, but if any were taken, I humbly apologise. Now can we be friends again?

    You find inviting Bitrex to join a lynching party to be an inoffensive joke?

    Like I said, you are morally defective, and that is not something you
    can apologise your way out of.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney


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  • From Bill Sloman@21:1/5 to Cursitor Doom on Mon Jun 10 01:19:34 2024
    On 9/06/2024 11:09 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Sun, 9 Jun 2024 22:17:37 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 9/06/2024 8:22 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Sat, 08 Jun 2024 13:30:20 -0700, john larkin wrote:


    Nature has a rude habit of doing things that scientists didn't approve >>>> of.

    You could substitute "Liberals" for "scientists" here and it would
    still make perfect sense.

    Since it didn't make sense in the first place - science isn't about
    "approval" but about consistency with the rest of science, Cursitor Doom
    is just advertising his ignorance here.

    Er, no. It's about the systematic study of nature and the pursuit of
    Truth. We're already seeing the damage that 'consistency with the rest of science' is having on our economic life thanks to all that climate
    claptrap that you and others falsely claim is settled science.

    It's definitely settled science. You don't know enough about the subject
    to form a useful opinion.

    The people who broadcast the propaganda that you are echoing aren't that
    silly, but they are making a lot of money out of digging up fossil
    carbon and selling it as fuel, and it's worth spending some of it on
    cheap propaganda that is good enough to fool suckers like you and John
    Larkin.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney



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  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to Bill Sloman on Sun Jun 9 16:47:46 2024
    On Mon, 10 Jun 2024 01:13:29 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 9/06/2024 10:16 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Sun, 9 Jun 2024 21:33:04 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 9/06/2024 6:33 am, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 15:48:46 -0400, bitrex wrote:

    On 6/8/2024 5:46 AM, Cursitor Doom wrote:

    People, including women, are screaming and waving signs QUEERS FOR >>>>>>> GAZA.

    Think about that one.

    I'm not talking about the ME. I'm talking about freedom of thought >>>>>> and opinion in general and the fact that it's being eroded by
    neo-Liberalism and political correctness.

    Have there been any big revolutions in right-wing thought lately or
    is still just primarily the usual long list of commies, queers, and
    degenerates who need to be gotten rid of.

    You missed out the Jews.

    I think it's probably possible to suppress novel thought but I'm
    uncertain there's much novel on offer I guess that's why they call
    it "conservatism", after all.

    It was all better in the old days, need to get back to the good ol'
    days. Am I missing something?

    You'll be fine. You and me'll go on a good ol' fashioned lynchin'
    party -
    don't worry, you'll soon get the flavor for it and the more you do,
    the sweeter it gets.
    ;-)

    Cursitor Doom doesn't understand that he is morally defective. If you
    don't understand that being unpleasant to strangers is not a
    constructive reaction to the unfamiliar, you can go in for this kind
    of nonsense and not realise that other people find it repellent. Some
    of them will notice that it is also illegal, and put you in prison.

    Sorry, Bill. I should have known that you as a Jew would be unduly
    sensitive to my little joke (you didn't seem to notice the smiley).

    I'm not actually Jewish. Sloman is a west country name - there are more Slomans in the Taunton telephone directory than there are in the London telephone directory, and my great-grandfather Sloman was born in Bristol
    in 1850, though the family promptly got on the boat to Australia.

    There is a family of Slomans in Melbourne who are Jewish, but their grandparents were called Slominsky in Poland before they headed out to Australia around 1870. One of my chemistry lecturers was a member of the family (though he didn't have the Sloman surname).

    No offence was intended, but if any were taken, I humbly apologise. Now
    can we be friends again?

    You find inviting Bitrex to join a lynching party to be an inoffensive
    joke?

    Yes, yes I do. Unlike you, I don't go out of my way to upset people here.
    AIUI, Bitrex is a white, urban Liberal. If he were black, I'd not have
    posted that remark; wouldn't have dreamed of it.
    I hope you're not one of those people who take offence vicariously on
    behalf of others who may have taken no offence at all, because people like
    that are just despicable - and responsible for so much that is wrong in
    the world today.

    Like I said, you are morally defective, and that is not something you
    can apologise your way out of.

    I'll leave it to the silent majority to determine who's the moral
    defective here as I don't believe you're in any position to judge, given
    your reputation.

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  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to Bill Sloman on Sun Jun 9 16:55:07 2024
    On Mon, 10 Jun 2024 01:19:34 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 9/06/2024 11:09 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Sun, 9 Jun 2024 22:17:37 +1000, Bill Sloman wrote:

    On 9/06/2024 8:22 pm, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Sat, 08 Jun 2024 13:30:20 -0700, john larkin wrote:


    Nature has a rude habit of doing things that scientists didn't
    approve of.

    You could substitute "Liberals" for "scientists" here and it would
    still make perfect sense.

    Since it didn't make sense in the first place - science isn't about
    "approval" but about consistency with the rest of science, Cursitor
    Doom is just advertising his ignorance here.

    Er, no. It's about the systematic study of nature and the pursuit of
    Truth. We're already seeing the damage that 'consistency with the rest
    of science' is having on our economic life thanks to all that climate
    claptrap that you and others falsely claim is settled science.

    It's definitely settled science. You don't know enough about the subject
    to form a useful opinion.

    The people who broadcast the propaganda that you are echoing aren't that silly, but they are making a lot of money out of digging up fossil
    carbon and selling it as fuel, and it's worth spending some of it on
    cheap propaganda that is good enough to fool suckers like you and John Larkin.

    Nonsense. Fortunately, the truth is emerging from under all the lies. More
    and more people are realising climate change is a complete and utter scam. There is no cause for concern. There is no need for 'action' of any kind.
    It's just a complete, stinking, pile of crap.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwvVephTIHU

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to Jeroen Belleman on Sun Jun 9 21:36:52 2024
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 23:59:33 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 21:55, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 19:30:11 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/8/24 16:45, john larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 09:54:42 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
    <cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:

    On Sat, 8 Jun 2024 10:43:15 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/8/24 01:37, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    On Fri, 7 Jun 2024 23:57:54 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/7/24 23:11, Mike Monett VE3BTI wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 6/7/24 16:49, john larkin wrote:
    [...]

    Actually, Hamas makes sense. They send Jews to hell because >>>>>>>>>>> they are heretics, and send Muslims to heaven to be blessed >>>>>>>>>>> martyrs. So for Hamas, killing is always win-win.


    Some kind of sense, given that there is neither heaven, nor >>>>>>>>>> hell.
    Religion, islam in particular, is only pernicious brainwashing. >>>>>>>>>> There is no afterlife. There is only this life. Don't waste it. >>>>>>>>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    Learn how to do soul travel. It is the most important thing to >>>>>>>>> do this lifetime. It will give you absolute proof there is life >>>>>>>>> past this one,
    and that you are immortal.

    I don't know what soul travel is, but I'm sure there is no
    afterlife, just as there was no forelife. There is no soul. My >>>>>>>> existence is the result of an uninterrupted sequence of
    incredibly improbable events, going back billions of years into >>>>>>>> the past, and I will cease to exist,
    never to come back,
    when some essential part of my body fails.

    While I'm certainly not looking forward to dying, I'm not afraid >>>>>>>> of being dead. The need to believe in an afterlife is just
    another of those weird religious ideas.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Well, I'm not religious at all but am convinced there's an
    after-life. And that's not just so I can feel all warm and fuzzy. >>>>>>> I actually find the prospect deeply concerning. I'd much rather be >>>>>>> like you in outlook!

    How did you come to be convinced of the existence of an afterlife, >>>>>> and what kind of experience do you expect to have?

    Jeroen Belleman

    I'm afraid that's *way* too big and off-topic a subject for
    expansion on this forum!

    Designing electronics has obviously suggestions of quantum
    consciousness, and even Einstein thought that QM was spooky.

    Don't give up on miracles quite yet.


    You have referred to quantum effects in the brain many times. In as
    far as the brain is a chemical machine, and that chemistry is
    basically a manifestation of quantum mechanics, I agree. In practice,
    QM is just a level too deep in the abstraction stack. Somehow I
    believe that that is not how you see it. Would you elaborate?


    DNA and RNA and other things aren't flat linear molecules as the
    cartoons suggest. They are twisted and tangled into writhing balls. So
    any sequence gets continuously and randomly rubbed against the rest of
    the string. That's a quantum cross-correlation machine.

    Hmm. I see DNA as a template for making molecular machines, enzymes and
    such, that do useful things for living organisms. Useful things such as transforming nutrients into suitable energy-carrying chemicals or
    building blocks for cell components.
    Pumps to move stuff into or out of cell compartments, and many other functions needed to make a living cell thrive.

    DNA doesn't do much by itself. It's the molecular machines that do the
    work.


    Much of technology, electronics in particular, is a miracle,
    though not in the mystical or religious sense.

    I like the Barrie Gilbert essay, "Where do little circuits come from?"

    They are all out there in the infinite solution space, and it's hard to
    explore an infinite space serially.

    Hmm. When I design a circuit, I don't randomly jump through solution
    space. I start with something simple, then identify limitations and add
    or change things to address them. I may add bootstraps or cascodes to
    reduce the effect of parasitic capacitance. Add buffers to reduce load
    or output impedance effects. Add symmetry to tackle thermal or offset
    issues.
    Change or add components to tweak phase/frequency responses. Move
    components around to reduce parasitics, or to profit from some
    fortuitous beneficial one. And so on.

    Basically I'll choose some promising starting point and then try to move forward through the solution space, exploring interesting branches on
    the way. Rarely I'll throw everything out and start over.

    It's still a serial process. I can't see much of the space at once.
    Maybe you can. So much the better for you.

    Jeroen Belleman

    Jeroen, this may be of interest to you....

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0hsby62

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  • From Jeroen Belleman@21:1/5 to Cursitor Doom on Mon Jun 10 12:51:24 2024
    On 6/9/24 23:36, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    [...]

    Jeroen, this may be of interest to you....

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0hsby62

    A podcast about paranormal phenomena? Not really, or rather,
    really not. Why did you think so?

    Jeroen Belleman

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  • From Cursitor Doom@21:1/5 to Jeroen Belleman on Mon Jun 10 13:55:00 2024
    On Mon, 10 Jun 2024 12:51:24 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:

    On 6/9/24 23:36, Cursitor Doom wrote:
    [...]

    Jeroen, this may be of interest to you....

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0hsby62

    A podcast about paranormal phenomena? Not really, or rather,
    really not. Why did you think so?

    Jeroen Belleman

    It must have been someone else on this group that expressed an interest in
    the subject, then. Just ignore it and apologies for any confusion.

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