Better than an opinion, studied assessment by professor of sociology at UCSD...
'But there is a problem with these massive investments: Most STEM graduates don’t work in STEM occupations. The Census Bureau reported in 2021 that a paltry 28% of STEM grads are working in these supposedly in-demand, highly paid and important STEM jobs.These include diverse sectors such as pharmaceuticals, chemicals and energy, but about half of STEM jobs are in computers, and tech firms typically complain the loudest of STEM shortages.'
That's ridiculous! This always happens when politics is involved: vast amounts of waste, lost opportunities, cesspool products and workplaces...
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/careersandeducation/opinion-why-pushing-stem-majors-is-turning-out-to-be-a-terrible-investment/ar-AA1mGDM9
On Tue, 9 Jan 2024 08:15:05 -0800 (PST), Fred Bloggs <bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com> wrote:
Better than an opinion, studied assessment by professor of sociology at UCSD...
I expect that a sociology degree is an equally bad investment.
jobs. These include diverse sectors such as pharmaceuticals, chemicals and energy, but about half of STEM jobs are in computers, and tech firms typically complain the loudest of STEM shortages.''But there is a problem with these massive investments: Most STEM graduates don’t work in STEM occupations. The Census Bureau reported in 2021 that a paltry 28% of STEM grads are working in these supposedly in-demand, highly paid and important STEM
That's ridiculous! This always happens when politics is involved: vast amounts of waste, lost opportunities, cesspool products and workplaces...
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/careersandeducation/opinion-why-pushing-stem-majors-is-turning-out-to-be-a-terrible-investment/ar-AA1mGDM9
On Tuesday, January 9, 2024 at 10:59:56?PM UTC-5, Bill Sloman wrote:
On 10/01/2024 11:50 am, John Larkin wrote:
On Tue, 9 Jan 2024 08:15:05 -0800 (PST), Fred BloggsJohn Larkin skipped most of his chemistry lectures at Tulane because he
<bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:
Better than an opinion, studied assessment by professor of sociology at UCSD...
I expect that a sociology degree is an equally bad investment.
thought that that was a bad investment of his time.
He might even had
been right - making sense of chemistry needs more intelligence that he
has shown here. I may be biased
On Tuesday, January 9, 2024 at 10:59:56?PM UTC-5, Bill Sloman wrote:jobs. These include diverse sectors such as pharmaceuticals, chemicals and energy, but about half of STEM jobs are in computers, and tech firms typically complain the loudest of STEM shortages.'
On 10/01/2024 11:50 am, John Larkin wrote:
On Tue, 9 Jan 2024 08:15:05 -0800 (PST), Fred BloggsJohn Larkin skipped most of his chemistry lectures at Tulane because he
<bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:
Better than an opinion, studied assessment by professor of sociology at UCSD...
I expect that a sociology degree is an equally bad investment.
thought that that was a bad investment of his time. He might even had
been right - making sense of chemistry needs more intelligence that he
has shown here. I may be biased
'But there is a problem with these massive investments: Most STEM graduates don’t work in STEM occupations. The Census Bureau reported in 2021 that a paltry 28% of STEM grads are working in these supposedly in-demand, highly paid and important STEM
What the article actually says is that the people who want STEM workers
That's ridiculous! This always happens when politics is involved: vast amounts of waste, lost opportunities, cesspool products and workplaces...
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/careersandeducation/opinion-why-pushing-stem-majors-is-turning-out-to-be-a-terrible-investment/ar-AA1mGDM9
don't pay them all that well, and are happy to fire them at the drop of
a hat.
It only says that in support of the thesis of it being a gigantic waste of money for excessive government funding of STEM education.
If the STEM employers actually wanted more employees, they would treat
them better. What is actually happening is that they are leaning on
politicians to get the universities to churn out more potential
employees so that they can hired gullible newbies, exploit them for a
couple of years and replace them with new suckers when the previous
generation move on to better employers.
University faculty are people whose careers were terminated early due to non-performance or uselessness in general. Then they suddenly see the light and determine 'they love teaching' to get a cushy teaching job.
I believe an IEEE statistic of EE's in U.S. is that after 5 years, 70% of them are no longer employed as engineers. The reality is 90% of them should never have been given employment to begin with.
Pushing STEM majors works fine for everybody involved, except the STEM
majors. It should be backed up by pressure on the STEM employers to
treat them employees better. Encouraging STEM workers to join trade
unions who could put pressure on the employers to treat their employees
better would make sense, but that isn't going to happen in the US.
STEM workers aren't a particularly homogenous group so conventional
trade unions don't work that well for them, but as the screen actors
guild make clear, they can still be useful.
Most of those STEM degree people are assholes, so who cares. The answer is nobody, because they're hated at the personal level.
--
Bill Sloman, Sydney
What the article actually says is that the people who want STEM workers
don't pay them all that well, and are happy to fire them at the drop of
a hat.
On 1/9/2024 10:59 PM, Bill Sloman wrote:
What the article actually says is that the people who want STEM workers
don't pay them all that well, and are happy to fire them at the drop of
a hat.
US employees in e.g. fleet maintenance and railroad work have similar >complaints, they say "There are few industries whose managements will
promise you so much of the world in exchange for signing on, and then >dedicate their existence to finding a reason to fire you once you do"
On Wed, 10 Jan 2024 08:45:10 -0800 (PST), Fred Bloggs <bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tuesday, January 9, 2024 at 10:59:56?PM UTC-5, Bill Sloman wrote:
On 10/01/2024 11:50 am, John Larkin wrote:
On Tue, 9 Jan 2024 08:15:05 -0800 (PST), Fred Bloggs
<bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:
Pre-WW2 only a few per cent of Americans went to college. Now the
number is over 40%. Most of those shouldn't be trying to get their
degrees, which are expensive and ultimately useless.
There are lots of dropouts who are made to feel like losers and
struggle to pay off student loans. Private universities are now mostly gigabuck money machines.
We dropped into a 2-year course at Sierra College that trains control
and process engineers. 100% of the grads get job offers. One lady grad
runs the enormous Budweiser brewery near Sacramento.
On Thursday, January 11, 2024 at 5:57:41 AM UTC-8, Fred Bloggs wrote:STEM jobs. These include diverse sectors such as pharmaceuticals, chemicals and energy, but about half of STEM jobs are in computers, and tech firms typically complain the loudest of STEM shortages.'
On Wednesday, January 10, 2024 at 11:00:24 PM UTC-5, Anthony William Sloman wrote:
On Thursday, January 11, 2024 at 3:45:15 AM UTC+11, Fred Bloggs wrote: >>>> On Tuesday, January 9, 2024 at 10:59:56 PM UTC-5, Bill Sloman wrote: >>>>> On 10/01/2024 11:50 am, John Larkin wrote:
On Tue, 9 Jan 2024 08:15:05 -0800 (PST), Fred BloggsJohn Larkin skipped most of his chemistry lectures at Tulane because he >>>>> thought that that was a bad investment of his time. He might even had >>>>> been right - making sense of chemistry needs more intelligence that he >>>>> has shown here. I may be biased
<bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:
Better than an opinion, studied assessment by professor of sociology at UCSD...
I expect that a sociology degree is an equally bad investment.
'But there is a problem with these massive investments: Most STEM graduates don’t work in STEM occupations. The Census Bureau reported in 2021 that a paltry 28% of STEM grads are working in these supposedly in-demand, highly paid and important
It only says that in support of the thesis of it being a gigantic waste of money for excessive government funding of STEM education.What the article actually says is that the people who want STEM workers >>>>> don't pay them all that well, and are happy to fire them at the drop of >>>>> a hat.
That's ridiculous! This always happens when politics is involved: vast amounts of waste, lost opportunities, cesspool products and workplaces...
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/careersandeducation/opinion-why-pushing-stem-majors-is-turning-out-to-be-a-terrible-investment/ar-AA1mGDM9
If the STEM employers actually wanted more employees, they would treat >>>>> them better. What is actually happening is that they are leaning on
politicians to get the universities to churn out more potential
employees so that they can hired gullible newbies, exploit them for a >>>>> couple of years and replace them with new suckers when the previous
generation move on to better employers.
University faculty are people whose careers were terminated early due to non-performance or uselessness in general. Then they suddenly see the light and determine 'they love teaching' to get a cushy teaching job.
Not true of any of the university people I've known. Most of them went from being Ph.D. students to post-docs to becoming university staff without any exposure to a commercial environment.
I believe an IEEE statistic of EE's in U.S. is that after 5 years, 70% of them are no longer employed as engineers. The reality is 90% of them should never have been given employment to begin with.
Most of those STEM degree people are assholes, so who cares. The answer is nobody, because they're hated at the personal level.
Not my experience either. STEM degree people tend to work in cooperating and collaborative teams. People who don't play nice don't do well, and don't last.
That's a bunch of baloney. The infighting and workplace conflicts are well-documented and publicized.
In the spirit of 'if it bleeds, it leads', any documentation and publications will include story-teller exercises in finding conflicts, real or otherwise.
On Thu, 11 Jan 2024 16:02:04 -0500, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:When all the employers in a particular industry conspire to keep wages
On 1/9/2024 10:59 PM, Bill Sloman wrote:
What the article actually says is that the people who want STEM workers
don't pay them all that well, and are happy to fire them at the drop of
a hat.
US employees in e.g. fleet maintenance and railroad work have similar
complaints, they say "There are a few industries whose managements will
promise you so much of the world in exchange for signing on, and then
dedicate their existence to finding a reason to fire you once you do"
If you don't like your job, find a better one.
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