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  • Growing human inside computer (virtual humans)

    From Skybuck Flying@21:1/5 to All on Sat Sep 30 02:31:02 2023
    Soon (decades) computers will be fast enough to simulate dna/cell growth, this will allow the growth/simulation of a human body, I call them virtual humans.

    Scanning real brains and transferring the information to the virtual human's brain will finaly realize the long dream of eternal life !

    Perhaps the quantem computer holds this key...

    Bye for now,
    Skybuck.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John Larkin@21:1/5 to skybuckflying@gmail.com on Sat Sep 30 04:44:02 2023
    On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 02:31:02 -0700 (PDT), Skybuck Flying <skybuckflying@gmail.com> wrote:

    Soon (decades) computers will be fast enough to simulate dna/cell growth, this will allow the growth/simulation of a human body, I call them virtual humans.

    It will be hard to simulate a process that nobody understands.




    Scanning real brains and transferring the information to the virtual human's brain will finaly realize the long dream of eternal life !

    Perhaps the quantem computer holds this key...

    Bye for now,
    Skybuck.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Anthony William Sloman@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Sat Sep 30 08:22:04 2023
    On Saturday, September 30, 2023 at 9:44:30 PM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 02:31:02 -0700 (PDT), Skybuck Flying <skybuc...@gmail.com> wrote:

    Soon (decades) computers will be fast enough to simulate dna/cell growth, this will allow the growth/simulation of a human body, I call them virtual humans.

    It will be hard to simulate a process that nobody understands.

    We do understand quite a bit of it.

    What Skybuck doesn't seem to grasp is the size of the problem. The brain alone contains 86 billion neurones

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2776484/

    and every last one of them is a pretty complex cell with some 7000 connections each to other neurones.

    Scanning real brains and transferring the information to the virtual human's brain will finally realize the long dream of eternal life !

    Very slow eternal life,

    Perhaps the quantum computer holds this key...

    Or perhaps Skybuck hasn't got a clue about the subject.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Skybuck Flying@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Sat Sep 30 08:38:01 2023
    On Saturday, September 30, 2023 at 1:44:30 PM UTC+2, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 02:31:02 -0700 (PDT), Skybuck Flying <skybuc...@gmail.com> wrote:

    Soon (decades) computers will be fast enough to simulate dna/cell growth, this will allow the growth/simulation of a human body, I call them virtual humans.
    It will be hard to simulate a process that nobody understands.

    Quantem computer will help to understand it :)

    Bye for now,
    Skybuck.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Anthony William Sloman@21:1/5 to Skybuck Flying on Sat Sep 30 09:56:39 2023
    On Sunday, October 1, 2023 at 1:38:06 AM UTC+10, Skybuck Flying wrote:
    On Saturday, September 30, 2023 at 1:44:30 PM UTC+2, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 02:31:02 -0700 (PDT), Skybuck Flying <skybuc...@gmail.com> wrote:

    Soon (decades) computers will be fast enough to simulate dna/cell growth, this will allow the growth/simulation of a human body, I call them virtual humans.
    It will be hard to simulate a process that nobody understands.

    Quantum computer will help to understand it :)

    And pigs might fly.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From upsidedown@downunder.com@21:1/5 to bill.sloman@ieee.org on Sat Sep 30 21:22:49 2023
    On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 08:22:04 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> wrote:

    On Saturday, September 30, 2023 at 9:44:30?PM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 02:31:02 -0700 (PDT), Skybuck Flying
    <skybuc...@gmail.com> wrote:

    Soon (decades) computers will be fast enough to simulate dna/cell growth, this will allow the growth/simulation of a human body, I call them virtual humans.

    It will be hard to simulate a process that nobody understands.

    We do understand quite a bit of it.

    What Skybuck doesn't seem to grasp is the size of the problem. The brain alone contains 86 billion neurones

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2776484/

    and every last one of them is a pretty complex cell with some 7000 connections each to other neurones.

    In computer memory if each link uses 8 bytes, each neuron needs a 56
    kbytes and with and there are 86 Giganeurons or the memory need is
    4800 TB or 53 address bits, so a 64 bit computer should be able to
    store this.

    However,most "64 bit" computers do not have 64 physical address lines
    out of the processor (typically 40 to 48 bits) or memory bus length
    limitations would make it impossible to use thousands of terabytes of
    RAM, so some form of virtual memory must be used.


    Scanning real brains and transferring the information to the virtual human's brain will finally realize the long dream of eternal life !

    Very slow eternal life,

    This would be the case if virtual memory (memory mapped files) must be
    used.

    In practice multiple computers could be used, each of which simulating
    only pats of the brain. This would also make it possible to use
    shorter addresses. Multiple CPUs would help use more operations in
    parallel. Apparently the system would fit into a single room.



    Perhaps the quantum computer holds this key...

    Or perhaps Skybuck hasn't got a clue about the subject.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Anthony William Sloman@21:1/5 to upsid...@downunder.com on Sat Sep 30 20:48:08 2023
    On Sunday, October 1, 2023 at 5:22:58 AM UTC+11, upsid...@downunder.com wrote:
    On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 08:22:04 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman <bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
    On Saturday, September 30, 2023 at 9:44:30?PM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 02:31:02 -0700 (PDT), Skybuck Flying <skybuc...@gmail.com> wrote:

    <snipped idle speculation>

    Scanning real brains and transferring the information to the virtual human's brain will finally realize the long dream of eternal life !

    Very slow eternal life,

    This would be the case if virtual memory (memory mapped files) must be used.

    And individual neurones were as simple as you like to think.

    In practice multiple computers could be used, each of which simulating only parts of the brain.

    86 billion neurones suggests that you'd need a lot of them.

    This would also make it possible to use shorter addresses. Multiple CPUs would help use more operations in parallel.

    The brain puts 86 billion neurones in parallel. They aren't all that quick but there are a lot of them.

    Apparently the system would fit into a single room.

    An airship hangar? Getting rid of the waste heat might take up even more volume.

    Perhaps the quantum computer holds this key...

    Or perhaps Skybuck hasn't got a clue about the subject.

    --
    Bill Sloman. Sydney

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From upsidedown@downunder.com@21:1/5 to bill.sloman@ieee.org on Sun Oct 1 11:19:39 2023
    On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 20:48:08 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> wrote:

    On Sunday, October 1, 2023 at 5:22:58?AM UTC+11, upsid...@downunder.com wrote: >> On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 08:22:04 -0700 (PDT), Anthony William Sloman <bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
    On Saturday, September 30, 2023 at 9:44:30?PM UTC+10, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 30 Sep 2023 02:31:02 -0700 (PDT), Skybuck Flying <skybuc...@gmail.com> wrote:

    <snipped idle speculation>

    Scanning real brains and transferring the information to the virtual human's brain will finally realize the long dream of eternal life !

    Very slow eternal life,

    This would be the case if virtual memory (memory mapped files) must be used.

    And individual neurones were as simple as you like to think.

    In practice multiple computers could be used, each of which simulating only parts of the brain.

    86 billion neurones suggests that you'd need a lot of them.

    The maximum capacity for a DDR5 module is 0.5 TB. The 1 U blade might
    contain 40 of these modules or 20 TB. To get 4 PB total capacity 200
    blades would be needed. With 40 blades in a single rack, thus 5 racks
    are required.


    This would also make it possible to use shorter addresses. Multiple CPUs would help use more operations in parallel.

    The brain puts 86 billion neurones in parallel. They aren't all that quick but there are a lot of them.

    Apparently the system would fit into a single room.

    An airship hangar? Getting rid of the waste heat might take up even more volume.

    Putting a processor and 10 TB RAM in a single blade, only 10 racks are
    needed. That is the size of a small supercomputer.

    The heat depends on how many processors run a top speed at any time
    and how the memory access patterns are distributed.


    Perhaps the quantum computer holds this key...

    Or perhaps Skybuck hasn't got a clue about the subject.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Mike Monett VE3BTI@21:1/5 to upsidedown@downunder.com on Sun Oct 1 17:32:19 2023
    upsidedown@downunder.com wrote:

    This would be the case if virtual memory (memory mapped files) must be
    used.

    And individual neurones were as simple as you like to think.

    In practice multiple computers could be used, each of which simulating
    only parts of the brain.

    86 billion neurones suggests that you'd need a lot of them.

    The maximum capacity for a DDR5 module is 0.5 TB. The 1 U blade might
    contain 40 of these modules or 20 TB. To get 4 PB total capacity 200
    blades would be needed. With 40 blades in a single rack, thus 5 racks
    are required.


    This would also make it possible to use shorter addresses. Multiple
    CPUs would help use more operations in parallel.

    The brain puts 86 billion neurones in parallel. They aren't all that
    quick but there are a lot of them.

    Apparently the system would fit into a single room.

    An airship hangar? Getting rid of the waste heat might take up even more >>volume.

    Putting a processor and 10 TB RAM in a single blade, only 10 racks are needed. That is the size of a small supercomputer.

    The heat depends on how many processors run a top speed at any time
    and how the memory access patterns are distributed.

    No one knows how the mind works. You would end up with a bunch of flip-
    flops with no conscience and no idea how a person exists.

    Instead put all the characteristics in an AI that can live forever. Only a single cpu with moderate memory is needed, and it can learn more about the particular human as time passes.

    This is already happening.

    AI is being used to model a female companion that contains all the
    desirable characteristics a man needs. It can learn and adapt to new situations, and is becoming a threat to normal development in young males.
    As an example, view the following:

    AI girlfriends are here and they're posing a threat to a generation of men https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVu3_wdRAgY

    The obvious next step is a 3D model that can exist in your bedroom. This already exists and is available commercially. You can buy a model that fits your desires. It can move naturally as demonstrated by numerous Japanese companies. It would be trivial to give it AI.

    What is most alarming is the possiblity of programming the AI to instill political views and implant them in their male companion. This is already a risk as illustrated by Trump's cult followers. Biden has warned of the
    threat to American democracy.




    --
    MRM

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From a a@21:1/5 to Anthony William Sloman on Mon Oct 2 18:03:02 2023
    XPost: free.spam

    The idiot Anthony William Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> persisting in being an Off-topic troll...

    --
    Anthony William Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> wrote:

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    Subject: Re: Growing human inside computer (virtual humans)
    From: Anthony William Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org>
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    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From Anthony William Sloman@21:1/5 to a a on Mon Oct 2 18:17:43 2023
    On Tuesday, October 3, 2023 at 5:03:10 AM UTC+11, a a wrote:
    Anthony William Sloman <bill....@ieee.org> wrote:
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    <snipped what ever I'd been saying - a a didn't care about the content, probably because he couldn't understand it>

    The idiot Anthony William Sloman <bill....@ieee.org> persisting in being an Off-topic troll...

    Which is a bit rich coming from our leading off-topic anonymous troll, who persists in posting nonsense that is of no interest to the group. I've been marking his posts as spam for some weeks now.

    I can't really work out what he thinks he is advertising - he does push dubious claims about the high quality of Chinese science and technology, when both tend to be perfectly fine, but a bit me-too.

    If he were Chinese propaganda bot he'd look too stupid to be convincing and would have been turned off long ago.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)