• The Tesla is SLOOOOOWWWWWWWW!

    From Flyguy@21:1/5 to All on Sun May 29 19:28:29 2022
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up:
    the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John Larkin@21:1/5 to soar2morrow@yahoo.com on Sun May 29 20:20:09 2022
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up:
    the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record >The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For
    FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.



    --

    John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc trk

    The cork popped merrily, and Lord Peter rose to his feet.
    "Bunter", he said, "I give you a toast. The triumph of Instinct over Reason"

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to Flyguy on Mon May 30 00:26:52 2022
    On 05/29/2022 08:28 PM, Flyguy wrote:
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up:
    the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    Somebody needs to work on in-flight recharging, a KC-135 on wheels...
    Too bad wireless power transmission isn't ready for prime time.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to Flyguy on Mon May 30 08:50:31 2022
    On 5/29/2022 10:28 PM, Flyguy wrote:
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up:
    the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge


    AFAIK there's no officially accredited body that sanctions such a race
    and to even get a decent time you have to break most every traffic law
    in the book, so who cares? The whole endeavor seems ripe for fraud in
    the first place.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Mon May 30 08:55:13 2022
    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up:
    the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For
    FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what
    NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get
    the best times.

    Lots of people seem to love NASCAR can't say I really get a big thrill
    out of watching cars go 'round in a circle though

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ricky@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Mon May 30 07:46:01 2022
    On Sunday, May 29, 2022 at 11:20:21 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up:
    the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For
    FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    I try to understand Larkin's BEV phobia and I can't figure it out. He used to complain that he couldn't drive the round trip to a ski lodge in Truckee in a BEV and was shown wrong. He rages against the wind any time BEVs are mentioned. "You kids get
    off my lawn!"

    He also talks about how he likes the power of his Audi, but denigrates the power of many BEVs.

    This guy has some mental issues, for sure. But as a friend who is a nurse occasionally working the psych ward would say, "But highly functioning".

    I hope he's still posting here in 15 years when he can't find gas for his carbon spewing engine. It will be funny to hear him justify how much better BEVs are.

    --

    Rick C.

    - Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
    - Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John Larkin@21:1/5 to bitrex on Mon May 30 08:26:58 2022
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:50:31 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 10:28 PM, Flyguy wrote:
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up:
    the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge


    AFAIK there's no officially accredited body that sanctions such a race
    and to even get a decent time you have to break most every traffic law
    in the book, so who cares? The whole endeavor seems ripe for fraud in
    the first place.

    Cannonball: "Flat out between tickets."

    --

    John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc trk

    The cork popped merrily, and Lord Peter rose to his feet.
    "Bunter", he said, "I give you a toast. The triumph of Instinct over Reason"

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John Larkin@21:1/5 to All on Mon May 30 08:26:03 2022
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 00:26:52 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com>
    wrote:

    On 05/29/2022 08:28 PM, Flyguy wrote:
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up:
    the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    Somebody needs to work on in-flight recharging, a KC-135 on wheels...
    Too bad wireless power transmission isn't ready for prime time.

    Mid-air refueling/recharging of electric airplanes would be fun.

    --

    John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc trk

    The cork popped merrily, and Lord Peter rose to his feet.
    "Bunter", he said, "I give you a toast. The triumph of Instinct over Reason"

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John Larkin@21:1/5 to bitrex on Mon May 30 08:24:25 2022
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For
    FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what
    NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get
    the best times.

    To Safeway?


    Lots of people seem to love NASCAR can't say I really get a big thrill
    out of watching cars go 'round in a circle though

    I don't understand it either, but then I don't understand basketball
    or football either. Maybe nascar is just a big beer blast.

    --

    John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc trk

    The cork popped merrily, and Lord Peter rose to his feet.
    "Bunter", he said, "I give you a toast. The triumph of Instinct over Reason"

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ed Lee@21:1/5 to bitrex on Mon May 30 09:42:20 2022
    On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 5:50:40 AM UTC-7, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/29/2022 10:28 PM, Flyguy wrote:
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    AFAIK there's no officially accredited body that sanctions such a race
    and to even get a decent time you have to break most every traffic law
    in the book, so who cares? The whole endeavor seems ripe for fraud in
    the first place.

    And there's no rules, right. I can beat it if i can attach solid rocket booster on my Leaf. Give me a few more years to work on it.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ricky@21:1/5 to Ed Lee on Mon May 30 09:45:38 2022
    On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:42:25 PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
    On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 5:50:40 AM UTC-7, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/29/2022 10:28 PM, Flyguy wrote:
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    AFAIK there's no officially accredited body that sanctions such a race
    and to even get a decent time you have to break most every traffic law
    in the book, so who cares? The whole endeavor seems ripe for fraud in
    the first place.
    And there's no rules, right. I can beat it if i can attach solid rocket booster on my Leaf. Give me a few more years to work on it.

    I think you should do this as soon as possible. Maybe then you will get a real BEV.

    --

    Rick C.

    + Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
    + Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Mon May 30 12:53:32 2022
    On 5/30/2022 11:24 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For
    FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what
    NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get
    the best times.

    To Safeway?

    Nah, in motorsports! To get the best times around a track you have to
    either be accelerating or decelerating, "do the math." No coasting! Or
    at least as little as possible, maybe right at the apex of a turn, idk.

    But flooring it out of turns, accelerating down the straight, then
    jamming on the brakes (at just the right time) into a turn and then (at
    just the right time) flooring it back out of the turn is basically what
    a time trial is. When there other cars obviously you have to avoid
    hitting them firstly, but that's the ideal

    Lots of people seem to love NASCAR can't say I really get a big thrill
    out of watching cars go 'round in a circle though

    I don't understand it either, but then I don't understand basketball
    or football either. Maybe nascar is just a big beer blast.


    I expect the beer helps definitely

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to bitrex on Mon May 30 12:55:39 2022
    On 5/30/2022 12:53 PM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 11:24 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the
    speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast
    speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who
    know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record
    for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an
    average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m
    with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>>> FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what
    NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get
    the best times.

    To Safeway?

    Nah, in motorsports! To get the best times around a track you have to
    either be accelerating or decelerating, "do the math." No coasting! Or
    at least as little as possible, maybe right at the apex of a turn, idk.

    I guess whether it results in the best time to Safeway depends on how
    much your route resembles a rally track

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John Doe@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Mon May 30 17:02:03 2022
    John Larkin wrote:

    rbowman wrote:
    Flyguy wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the
    speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast
    speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who
    know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record
    for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average
    speed of 56 mph:

    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with
    an average speed of 110 mph:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    Somebody needs to work on in-flight recharging, a KC-135 on wheels...
    Too bad wireless power transmission isn't ready for prime time.

    Mid-air refueling/recharging of electric airplanes would be fun.

    Just use a lightning rod.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to Ed Lee on Mon May 30 13:02:41 2022
    On 5/30/2022 12:42 PM, Ed Lee wrote:
    On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 5:50:40 AM UTC-7, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/29/2022 10:28 PM, Flyguy wrote:
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    AFAIK there's no officially accredited body that sanctions such a race
    and to even get a decent time you have to break most every traffic law
    in the book, so who cares? The whole endeavor seems ripe for fraud in
    the first place.

    And there's no rules, right. I can beat it if i can attach solid rocket booster on my Leaf. Give me a few more years to work on it.


    Right. And nobody in a "no rules" race who is comfortable with the safety-to-others implications of doing well over 100 mph on public roads
    where people are driving totally oblivious that you're in a race would
    ever fudge with their times, right? right?

    I'd go to jail if I dressed up like a police officer to steal a loaf of
    bread, I definitely don't care about some jamokes with money to burn
    bragging about dressing their car up like a cruiser, it's dumb. Go enter
    and win a real race!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Lasse Langwadt Christensen@21:1/5 to All on Mon May 30 10:25:00 2022
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 14.55.23 UTC+2 skrev bitrex:
    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what
    NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get
    the best times.

    Lots of people seem to love NASCAR can't say I really get a big thrill
    out of watching cars go 'round in a circle though

    they also do road courses, though land yachtes that only just this year figured out that technology has evolved since the 70's is more spectacular than fast when they need to brake and turn

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Lasse Langwadt Christensen@21:1/5 to All on Mon May 30 10:30:36 2022
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 18.53.42 UTC+2 skrev bitrex:
    On 5/30/2022 11:24 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <us...@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked
    it up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>> FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what
    NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get >> the best times.

    To Safeway?
    Nah, in motorsports! To get the best times around a track you have to
    either be accelerating or decelerating, "do the math." No coasting! Or
    at least as little as possible, maybe right at the apex of a turn, idk.

    But flooring it out of turns, accelerating down the straight, then
    jamming on the brakes (at just the right time) into a turn and then (at
    just the right time) flooring it back out of the turn is basically what
    a time trial is. When there other cars obviously you have to avoid
    hitting them firstly, but that's the ideal
    Lots of people seem to love NASCAR can't say I really get a big thrill
    out of watching cars go 'round in a circle though

    I don't understand it either, but then I don't understand basketball
    or football either. Maybe nascar is just a big beer blast.

    I expect the beer helps definitely

    sure, and standing right next to the track when +30 ginormous V8s at flat chat pass at 200mph I'm sure is quite the visceral experience

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Mon May 30 13:16:58 2022
    On 5/30/2022 11:26 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:50:31 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 10:28 PM, Flyguy wrote:
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge


    AFAIK there's no officially accredited body that sanctions such a race
    and to even get a decent time you have to break most every traffic law
    in the book, so who cares? The whole endeavor seems ripe for fraud in
    the first place.

    Cannonball: "Flat out between tickets."


    I feel about it about the same as I do about these jamokes:

    <https://youtu.be/RWPf9rqPAB4>

    Why not take your Dad's money and your Daddy's car and enter a real
    race? Nobody thinks you're cool.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to Lasse Langwadt Christensen on Mon May 30 13:26:48 2022
    On 5/30/2022 1:25 PM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 14.55.23 UTC+2 skrev bitrex:
    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For
    FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what
    NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get
    the best times.

    Lots of people seem to love NASCAR can't say I really get a big thrill
    out of watching cars go 'round in a circle though

    they also do road courses, though land yachtes that only just this year figured out that technology has evolved since the 70's is more spectacular than fast when they need to brake and turn

    This is an engineer's kinda race:

    <https://24hoursoflemons.com/>

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to Lasse Langwadt Christensen on Mon May 30 13:43:43 2022
    On 5/30/2022 1:30 PM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 18.53.42 UTC+2 skrev bitrex:
    On 5/30/2022 11:24 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <us...@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked
    it up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>>>> FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what
    NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get >>>> the best times.

    To Safeway?
    Nah, in motorsports! To get the best times around a track you have to
    either be accelerating or decelerating, "do the math." No coasting! Or
    at least as little as possible, maybe right at the apex of a turn, idk.

    But flooring it out of turns, accelerating down the straight, then
    jamming on the brakes (at just the right time) into a turn and then (at
    just the right time) flooring it back out of the turn is basically what
    a time trial is. When there other cars obviously you have to avoid
    hitting them firstly, but that's the ideal
    Lots of people seem to love NASCAR can't say I really get a big thrill >>>> out of watching cars go 'round in a circle though

    I don't understand it either, but then I don't understand basketball
    or football either. Maybe nascar is just a big beer blast.

    I expect the beer helps definitely

    sure, and standing right next to the track when +30 ginormous V8s at flat chat pass at 200mph I'm sure is quite the visceral experience

    There used to be a sprint car track near where I grew up I used to go to
    as a kid, don't know if there's a similar sport in Europe but aside from
    some modern safety equipment like the modern multi-point harnesses, roll
    cages and fuel bladders these cars are seriously bare bones:

    <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sprint_car_racing>

    Sort of like something from the movie "Mad Max"

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From keith@kjwdesigns.com@21:1/5 to Flyguy on Mon May 30 10:48:59 2022
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 19:28:34 UTC-7, Flyguy wrote:
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up:
    the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You didn't even read your own link. The EV record is a bit faster than that at 42:52.

    "In October 2021, the EV record was broken twice in the same rented 2021 Tesla Model S Long Range.[59] The first drive, from Los Angeles to New York City, by Ryan Levenson and Will Wood, lowered the EV record to 42:52.[60] The second drive occurred on
    October 22, 2021, leaving from the Red Ball Garage in Manhattan at 11:00am and arriving at the Portifino Inn in Redondo Beach, CA 42 hours, 17 minutes later."

    But ok, you win. The next time I need to do a coast to coast speed run I'll use a gasoline vehicle.

    kw

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From keith@kjwdesigns.com@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Mon May 30 10:56:00 2022
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up:
    the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For
    FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional vehicle.

    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John Larkin@21:1/5 to bitrex on Mon May 30 10:52:56 2022
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 12:55:39 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/30/2022 12:53 PM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 11:24 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the
    speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast
    speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who >>>>>> know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record >>>>>> for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an
    average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m
    with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>>>> FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what
    NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get >>>> the best times.

    To Safeway?

    Nah, in motorsports! To get the best times around a track you have to
    either be accelerating or decelerating, "do the math." No coasting! Or
    at least as little as possible, maybe right at the apex of a turn, idk.

    I guess whether it results in the best time to Safeway depends on how
    much your route resembles a rally track

    I'm headed there now. The speed limit on Donner Pass Road is 35, 25 in
    the school zone.

    I'm up in the mountains doing cabin repairs. A wind storm pushed some
    tree limbs into wires and tore a chunk off the cabin and all the wires
    came down. Power, cable, pots. I climbed a tree and disappeared the
    old telephone pair. It hasn't been used in decades.

    https://www.dropbox.com/sh/lt38qw0yxrulr6v/AABtcYQNALQjZFqOfHV291dea?dl=0

    Albert Einstein couldn't invent a worse connector than an F.

    --

    John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc trk

    The cork popped merrily, and Lord Peter rose to his feet.
    "Bunter", he said, "I give you a toast. The triumph of Instinct over Reason"

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Lasse Langwadt Christensen@21:1/5 to All on Mon May 30 11:06:34 2022
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 19.43.51 UTC+2 skrev bitrex:
    On 5/30/2022 1:30 PM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 18.53.42 UTC+2 skrev bitrex:
    On 5/30/2022 11:24 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <us...@example.net> wrote: >>>
    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked
    it up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>>>> FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what >>>> NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get >>>> the best times.

    To Safeway?
    Nah, in motorsports! To get the best times around a track you have to
    either be accelerating or decelerating, "do the math." No coasting! Or
    at least as little as possible, maybe right at the apex of a turn, idk. >>
    But flooring it out of turns, accelerating down the straight, then
    jamming on the brakes (at just the right time) into a turn and then (at >> just the right time) flooring it back out of the turn is basically what >> a time trial is. When there other cars obviously you have to avoid
    hitting them firstly, but that's the ideal
    Lots of people seem to love NASCAR can't say I really get a big thrill >>>> out of watching cars go 'round in a circle though

    I don't understand it either, but then I don't understand basketball
    or football either. Maybe nascar is just a big beer blast.

    I expect the beer helps definitely

    sure, and standing right next to the track when +30 ginormous V8s at flat chat pass at 200mph I'm sure is quite the visceral experience
    There used to be a sprint car track near where I grew up I used to go to
    as a kid, don't know if there's a similar sport in Europe but aside from some modern safety equipment like the modern multi-point harnesses, roll cages and fuel bladders these cars are seriously bare bones:

    <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sprint_car_racing>

    Sort of like something from the movie "Mad Max"

    maybe this: https://youtu.be/7tMy5fxZNO0
    glasfiber bodies, 5/8 scale old american car style and a 1200cc motorcycle engine

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ricky@21:1/5 to ke...@kjwdesigns.com on Mon May 30 11:40:07 2022
    On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 1:56:04 PM UTC-4, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For FREE!
    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional vehicle.

    I know what you mean, because I drive one. But it's hard to explain to someone else. It's not just the lack of vibration, like it's not just the lack of noise either. It feels like you have infinite control over the power, effortlessly. It really is
    different from an ICE, fundamentally.


    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    Yeah, again, until you have one, and use it for a while, getting used to it, this just doesn't seem to sink in with people. As Bill is fond of pointing out, cars are parked 95% of the time. Charge anytime it's parked.


    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that occasionally locks you out and catches fire.
    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to catch fire than EVs.

    Larkin isn't aware of any other BEVs than Teslas. He seems to have taken a dislike to Musk, and transferred that to Tesla. So now he can't reason around the idea that Teslas represent all BEVs and he must hate them. I haven't heard him complain about
    the lack of charging in Truckee, other than the two sites which he also complains are always free. Weird guy.

    --

    Rick C.

    -- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
    -- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Phil Hobbs@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Mon May 30 16:13:02 2022
    John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For
    FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what
    NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get
    the best times.

    To Safeway?


    Lots of people seem to love NASCAR can't say I really get a big thrill
    out of watching cars go 'round in a circle though

    I don't understand it either, but then I don't understand basketball
    or football either. Maybe nascar is just a big beer blast.

    NASCAR is all about the tailgate party in the infield. (I've never
    been, but I'm reliably informed by my Texas relatives.)

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs

    --
    Dr Philip C D Hobbs
    Principal Consultant
    ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
    Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
    Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

    http://electrooptical.net
    http://hobbs-eo.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to bitrex on Mon May 30 15:05:13 2022
    On 05/30/2022 11:43 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:30 PM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 18.53.42 UTC+2 skrev bitrex:
    On 5/30/2022 11:24 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <us...@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the >>>>>>> speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast >>>>>>> speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics
    who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV >>>>>>> record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m
    with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m >>>>>>> with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. >>>>>> For
    FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what
    NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to
    get
    the best times.

    To Safeway?
    Nah, in motorsports! To get the best times around a track you have to
    either be accelerating or decelerating, "do the math." No coasting! Or
    at least as little as possible, maybe right at the apex of a turn, idk.

    But flooring it out of turns, accelerating down the straight, then
    jamming on the brakes (at just the right time) into a turn and then (at
    just the right time) flooring it back out of the turn is basically what
    a time trial is. When there other cars obviously you have to avoid
    hitting them firstly, but that's the ideal
    Lots of people seem to love NASCAR can't say I really get a big thrill >>>>> out of watching cars go 'round in a circle though

    I don't understand it either, but then I don't understand basketball
    or football either. Maybe nascar is just a big beer blast.

    I expect the beer helps definitely

    sure, and standing right next to the track when +30 ginormous V8s at
    flat chat pass at 200mph I'm sure is quite the visceral experience

    There used to be a sprint car track near where I grew up I used to go to
    as a kid, don't know if there's a similar sport in Europe but aside from
    some modern safety equipment like the modern multi-point harnesses, roll cages and fuel bladders these cars are seriously bare bones:

    <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sprint_car_racing>

    Sort of like something from the movie "Mad Max"

    https://americanhistory.si.edu/race-cars/stock-car-1952

    That's what I grew up with. Most of the cars were coupes from the '30s
    and '40s converted to a race car under the shade tree. The tracks were
    1/4 mile dirt so speeds weren't excessive and they were outlaw tracks,
    not NASCAR affiliated. Skill and balls, or insanity if you will, was
    more important than equipment.

    I never got into NASCAR with its purpose built 'stock cars' costing
    thousands of dollars. I went to a Gran Prix race at Watkins Glen once
    and that was even more boring than NASCAR.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From whit3rd@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Mon May 30 14:19:40 2022
    On Sunday, May 29, 2022 at 8:20:21 PM UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    Uh... that describes every car on the road that has locks.
    Driving isn't the glorious unicorns-and-rainbows experience
    that you imagined at age four. Esthetically, I'm told
    this is a superb teapot

    <https://www.yuuki-cha.com/japanese-teapots/nasu-banko-yaki-teapot>

    but tastes may vary.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to Lasse Langwadt Christensen on Mon May 30 15:23:10 2022
    On 05/30/2022 12:06 PM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 19.43.51 UTC+2 skrev bitrex:
    On 5/30/2022 1:30 PM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 18.53.42 UTC+2 skrev bitrex:
    On 5/30/2022 11:24 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <us...@example.net> wrote: >>>>>
    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked
    it up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>>>>>> FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that >>>>>>> occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what >>>>>> NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get >>>>>> the best times.

    To Safeway?
    Nah, in motorsports! To get the best times around a track you have to
    either be accelerating or decelerating, "do the math." No coasting! Or >>>> at least as little as possible, maybe right at the apex of a turn, idk. >>>>
    But flooring it out of turns, accelerating down the straight, then
    jamming on the brakes (at just the right time) into a turn and then (at >>>> just the right time) flooring it back out of the turn is basically what >>>> a time trial is. When there other cars obviously you have to avoid
    hitting them firstly, but that's the ideal
    Lots of people seem to love NASCAR can't say I really get a big thrill >>>>>> out of watching cars go 'round in a circle though

    I don't understand it either, but then I don't understand basketball >>>>> or football either. Maybe nascar is just a big beer blast.

    I expect the beer helps definitely

    sure, and standing right next to the track when +30 ginormous V8s at flat chat pass at 200mph I'm sure is quite the visceral experience
    There used to be a sprint car track near where I grew up I used to go to
    as a kid, don't know if there's a similar sport in Europe but aside from
    some modern safety equipment like the modern multi-point harnesses, roll
    cages and fuel bladders these cars are seriously bare bones:

    <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sprint_car_racing>

    Sort of like something from the movie "Mad Max"

    maybe this: https://youtu.be/7tMy5fxZNO0
    glasfiber bodies, 5/8 scale old american car style and a 1200cc motorcycle engine


    I saw one Legends race and it was fun. There were more body styles so it
    looked more like a '50s stock car race.

    There was a micro sprint track here that was also interesting. They're
    karts on steroids with 600cc bike engines:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlOTHz5GZ1o

    Both are attempts to have races that don't require hundreds of thousands
    to get into sort of like the Formula Vee for that style of racing.
    Somehow cubic cash always beats cubic inches though.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Lasse Langwadt Christensen@21:1/5 to All on Mon May 30 14:32:40 2022
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 23.05.21 UTC+2 skrev rbowman:
    On 05/30/2022 11:43 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:30 PM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 18.53.42 UTC+2 skrev bitrex:
    On 5/30/2022 11:24 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <us...@example.net> wrote: >>>>
    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the >>>>>>> speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast >>>>>>> speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics >>>>>>> who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV >>>>>>> record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m
    with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m >>>>>>> with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. >>>>>> For
    FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that >>>>>> occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what >>>>> NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to >>>>> get
    the best times.

    To Safeway?
    Nah, in motorsports! To get the best times around a track you have to
    either be accelerating or decelerating, "do the math." No coasting! Or >>> at least as little as possible, maybe right at the apex of a turn, idk. >>>
    But flooring it out of turns, accelerating down the straight, then
    jamming on the brakes (at just the right time) into a turn and then (at >>> just the right time) flooring it back out of the turn is basically what >>> a time trial is. When there other cars obviously you have to avoid
    hitting them firstly, but that's the ideal
    Lots of people seem to love NASCAR can't say I really get a big thrill >>>>> out of watching cars go 'round in a circle though

    I don't understand it either, but then I don't understand basketball >>>> or football either. Maybe nascar is just a big beer blast.

    I expect the beer helps definitely

    sure, and standing right next to the track when +30 ginormous V8s at
    flat chat pass at 200mph I'm sure is quite the visceral experience

    There used to be a sprint car track near where I grew up I used to go to
    as a kid, don't know if there's a similar sport in Europe but aside from some modern safety equipment like the modern multi-point harnesses, roll cages and fuel bladders these cars are seriously bare bones:

    <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sprint_car_racing>

    Sort of like something from the movie "Mad Max"
    https://americanhistory.si.edu/race-cars/stock-car-1952

    That's what I grew up with. Most of the cars were coupes from the '30s
    and '40s converted to a race car under the shade tree. The tracks were
    1/4 mile dirt so speeds weren't excessive and they were outlaw tracks,
    not NASCAR affiliated. Skill and balls, or insanity if you will, was
    more important than equipment.

    I never got into NASCAR with its purpose built 'stock cars' costing
    thousands of dollars. I went to a Gran Prix race at Watkins Glen once
    and that was even more boring than NASCAR.

    thousands? a Nascar cup team probably spends tens of millions a year

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to bitrex on Mon May 30 15:41:58 2022
    On 05/30/2022 10:53 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 11:24 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the
    speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast
    speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who
    know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record
    for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an
    average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m
    with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>>> FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what
    NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get
    the best times.

    To Safeway?

    Nah, in motorsports! To get the best times around a track you have to
    either be accelerating or decelerating, "do the math." No coasting! Or
    at least as little as possible, maybe right at the apex of a turn, idk.

    But flooring it out of turns, accelerating down the straight, then
    jamming on the brakes (at just the right time) into a turn and then (at
    just the right time) flooring it back out of the turn is basically what
    a time trial is. When there other cars obviously you have to avoid
    hitting them firstly, but that's the ideal

    I stumbled onto a drift meet in the parking lot of an abandoned lumber
    mill (followed the sound of screeching tires). At first I thought it
    was a time trial with exceeding poor drivers until I realized spinning
    out on every turn was sort of the point. I'm too frugal with tires to
    get into that.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Lasse Langwadt Christensen@21:1/5 to All on Mon May 30 15:00:16 2022
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 23.42.06 UTC+2 skrev rbowman:
    On 05/30/2022 10:53 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 11:24 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <us...@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the
    speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast
    speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who >>>>> know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record >>>>> for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an
    average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m
    with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>>> FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what
    NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get >>> the best times.

    To Safeway?

    Nah, in motorsports! To get the best times around a track you have to either be accelerating or decelerating, "do the math." No coasting! Or
    at least as little as possible, maybe right at the apex of a turn, idk.

    But flooring it out of turns, accelerating down the straight, then
    jamming on the brakes (at just the right time) into a turn and then (at just the right time) flooring it back out of the turn is basically what
    a time trial is. When there other cars obviously you have to avoid
    hitting them firstly, but that's the ideal
    I stumbled onto a drift meet in the parking lot of an abandoned lumber
    mill (followed the sound of screeching tires). At first I thought it
    was a time trial with exceeding poor drivers until I realized spinning
    out on every turn was sort of the point. I'm too frugal with tires to
    get into that.

    sometimes sideways is fast ;) https://youtu.be/XzH0etg-UvQ

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to Lasse Langwadt Christensen on Mon May 30 20:05:29 2022
    On 05/30/2022 03:32 PM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 23.05.21 UTC+2 skrev rbowman:
    On 05/30/2022 11:43 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:30 PM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 18.53.42 UTC+2 skrev bitrex:
    On 5/30/2022 11:24 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <us...@example.net> wrote: >>>>>>
    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the >>>>>>>>> speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast >>>>>>>>> speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics >>>>>>>>> who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV >>>>>>>>> record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m >>>>>>>>> with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m >>>>>>>>> with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. >>>>>>>> For
    FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that >>>>>>>> occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what >>>>>>> NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to >>>>>>> get
    the best times.

    To Safeway?
    Nah, in motorsports! To get the best times around a track you have to >>>>> either be accelerating or decelerating, "do the math." No coasting! Or >>>>> at least as little as possible, maybe right at the apex of a turn, idk. >>>>>
    But flooring it out of turns, accelerating down the straight, then
    jamming on the brakes (at just the right time) into a turn and then (at >>>>> just the right time) flooring it back out of the turn is basically what >>>>> a time trial is. When there other cars obviously you have to avoid
    hitting them firstly, but that's the ideal
    Lots of people seem to love NASCAR can't say I really get a big thrill >>>>>>> out of watching cars go 'round in a circle though

    I don't understand it either, but then I don't understand basketball >>>>>> or football either. Maybe nascar is just a big beer blast.

    I expect the beer helps definitely

    sure, and standing right next to the track when +30 ginormous V8s at
    flat chat pass at 200mph I'm sure is quite the visceral experience

    There used to be a sprint car track near where I grew up I used to go to >>> as a kid, don't know if there's a similar sport in Europe but aside from >>> some modern safety equipment like the modern multi-point harnesses, roll >>> cages and fuel bladders these cars are seriously bare bones:

    <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sprint_car_racing>

    Sort of like something from the movie "Mad Max"
    https://americanhistory.si.edu/race-cars/stock-car-1952

    That's what I grew up with. Most of the cars were coupes from the '30s
    and '40s converted to a race car under the shade tree. The tracks were
    1/4 mile dirt so speeds weren't excessive and they were outlaw tracks,
    not NASCAR affiliated. Skill and balls, or insanity if you will, was
    more important than equipment.

    I never got into NASCAR with its purpose built 'stock cars' costing
    thousands of dollars. I went to a Gran Prix race at Watkins Glen once
    and that was even more boring than NASCAR.

    thousands? a Nascar cup team probably spends tens of millions a year


    Well, I didn't say how many thousands... :) I knew it was a lot but was
    too lazy to research it and didn't want to overstate it.

    https://motorracingsports.com/how-much-does-it-cost-to-run-a-team-in-nascar/

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madison_(film)

    It's an offbeat film with Jim Caviezel that I enjoyed based on a true
    story. Madison IN is a river town that sponsors an unlimited hydroplane,
    Miss Madison, on a shoestring budget. Blow an engine and it's done.
    Budweiser sponsored the Miss Budweiser with very deep pockets.

    They bring the boat to one meet and the scene shows about 8 identical
    engines lined up to swap in if the Miss Budweiser blows one up.

    They're still racing but they've got real sponsors now.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to Lasse Langwadt Christensen on Mon May 30 20:27:40 2022
    On 05/30/2022 04:00 PM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
    mandag den 30. maj 2022 kl. 23.42.06 UTC+2 skrev rbowman:
    On 05/30/2022 10:53 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 11:24 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:55:13 -0400, bitrex <us...@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 11:20 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the >>>>>>> speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast >>>>>>> speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who >>>>>>> know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record >>>>>>> for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an
    average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m >>>>>>> with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>>>>> FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.


    Insane acceleration followed by frantic braking is pretty much what
    NASCAR is..in motorsport, at least, that's how you have to drive to get >>>>> the best times.

    To Safeway?

    Nah, in motorsports! To get the best times around a track you have to
    either be accelerating or decelerating, "do the math." No coasting! Or
    at least as little as possible, maybe right at the apex of a turn, idk.

    But flooring it out of turns, accelerating down the straight, then
    jamming on the brakes (at just the right time) into a turn and then (at
    just the right time) flooring it back out of the turn is basically what
    a time trial is. When there other cars obviously you have to avoid
    hitting them firstly, but that's the ideal
    I stumbled onto a drift meet in the parking lot of an abandoned lumber
    mill (followed the sound of screeching tires). At first I thought it
    was a time trial with exceeding poor drivers until I realized spinning
    out on every turn was sort of the point. I'm too frugal with tires to
    get into that.

    sometimes sideways is fast ;) https://youtu.be/XzH0etg-UvQ


    I learned to drive on roads like that and am not adverse to a little
    sideways. Fortunately with this Yaris I can turn of the traction and
    stability control. I couldn't on the previous one and a couple of times
    when I got playful I found myself parked in the middle of the road with
    the car refusing to move until I drove like an adult. Toyota even has a
    note in the owner's manual saying stability control doesn't work well on
    dirt and traction control makes it impossible to rock the car out of snow.

    Doing a controlled 4 wheel slide was what I always associated with
    'drift'. It wasn't until I say Tokyo Drift that I realized it had become
    an art form. I still think it's extreme to turn a FWD Corolla into RWD.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Flyguy@21:1/5 to bitrex on Tue May 31 16:49:28 2022
    On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 5:50:40 AM UTC-7, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/29/2022 10:28 PM, Flyguy wrote:
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    AFAIK there's no officially accredited body that sanctions such a race
    and to even get a decent time you have to break most every traffic law
    in the book, so who cares? The whole endeavor seems ripe for fraud in
    the first place.

    So what? This demonstrates the dramatically lower cross-country speed that you can expect driving an EV (assuming that you can even find an EV charging station off of the main highways).

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to soar2morrow@yahoo.com on Tue May 31 21:10:23 2022
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 16:49:28 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

    On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 5:50:40 AM UTC-7, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/29/2022 10:28 PM, Flyguy wrote:
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    AFAIK there's no officially accredited body that sanctions such a race
    and to even get a decent time you have to break most every traffic law
    in the book, so who cares? The whole endeavor seems ripe for fraud in
    the first place.

    So what? This demonstrates the dramatically lower cross-country speed that you can expect driving an EV (assuming that you can even find an EV charging station off of the main highways).

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can
    show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good
    economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.



    --

    Anybody can count to one.

    - Robert Widlar

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From whit3rd@21:1/5 to jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com on Tue May 31 21:46:33 2022
    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can
    show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good
    economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its
    one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?

    There's 20 miles of road in this story, too; power lines aren't the biggest connection cost that was jusified here.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to All on Tue May 31 22:07:48 2022
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 21:46:33 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com>
    wrote:

    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can
    show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good
    economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its
    one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?

    Ballpark 200.

    One advantage of gasoline is that it stores energy. An electric
    charging station doesn't. So the feed line has to support peak load.
    The gas truck only has to deliver the average load.





    --

    Anybody can count to one.

    - Robert Widlar

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ricky@21:1/5 to jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com on Tue May 31 22:55:47 2022
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 1:07:59 AM UTC-4, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 21:46:33 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can
    show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good
    economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its
    one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?
    Ballpark 200.

    One advantage of gasoline is that it stores energy. An electric
    charging station doesn't. So the feed line has to support peak load.
    The gas truck only has to deliver the average load.

    It is truly amazing how far people have to reach to find reasons to hate BEVs.

    It is hard to find a place where you would want to charge that doesn't have sufficient electric service to allow charging. People have to reach deep into the well to find something to complain about. It must be a very unhappy life that makes someone
    hate so much what others do. No one is making him do anything... at least, not yet. In 15 or so years he'll have trouble finding a gas station when they are mostly closed down or turned into laundromats.

    Actually, that was something I thought about, might have posted here a few weeks ago. They used to have laundromats with bars for city dwellers. They could do the same thing, but include car charging! lol

    I guarantee in just a few years, there will be some very creative businesses based around giving a free charge while you do something fun. Remember drive in movies? There were two in my city and my brother and I always wanted to go to the one that had
    a playground in front of the screen! They were actually pretty fun for kids. We often fell asleep during the movie though. I seem to recall they had a lot of double features and we hardly ever saw the second one. Even a single feature could put 60
    miles on a BEV.

    It's going to be an interesting BEV world.

    --

    Rick C.

    -+ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
    -+ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com on Wed Jun 1 07:55:30 2022
    On 05/31/2022 11:07 PM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 21:46:33 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com>
    wrote:

    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can
    show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good
    economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its
    one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?

    Ballpark 200.

    One advantage of gasoline is that it stores energy. An electric
    charging station doesn't. So the feed line has to support peak load.
    The gas truck only has to deliver the average load.

    Easily replaceable battery packs would solve that problem but I don't
    see that happening with the current skateboard chassis designs.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to rbowman on Wed Jun 1 07:19:09 2022
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 07:55:30 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 05/31/2022 11:07 PM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 21:46:33 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com>
    wrote:

    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can >>>> show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good
    economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its
    one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?

    Ballpark 200.

    One advantage of gasoline is that it stores energy. An electric
    charging station doesn't. So the feed line has to support peak load.
    The gas truck only has to deliver the average load.

    Easily replaceable battery packs would solve that problem but I don't
    see that happening with the current skateboard chassis designs.



    The lithium supply will be further stressed when all cars are electric
    and there are two battery packs per car.

    Swappable battery packs would have to be some standard size and
    interface. Possibly several small packs per car or many per truck.



    --

    Anybody can count to one.

    - Robert Widlar

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to ke...@kjwdesigns.com on Wed Jun 1 11:48:32 2022
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For
    FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional vehicle.

    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly.

    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing
    anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your
    rollerskate?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ricky@21:1/5 to jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com on Wed Jun 1 09:38:10 2022
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 10:19:19 AM UTC-4, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 07:55:30 -0600, rbowman <bow...@montana.com> wrote:

    On 05/31/2022 11:07 PM, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 21:46:33 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com>
    wrote:

    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can >>>> show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good
    economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its
    one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?

    Ballpark 200.

    One advantage of gasoline is that it stores energy. An electric
    charging station doesn't. So the feed line has to support peak load.
    The gas truck only has to deliver the average load.

    Easily replaceable battery packs would solve that problem but I don't
    see that happening with the current skateboard chassis designs.


    The lithium supply will be further stressed when all cars are electric
    and there are two battery packs per car.

    Swappable battery packs would have to be some standard size and
    interface. Possibly several small packs per car or many per truck.

    Exactly, that's why it will never happen. The battery is where all the magic is going to happen over the next few years and no BEV maker worth their salt is going to adopt a standard that limits what they can achieve.

    Also, no need really. I realized some time ago, the only people complaining about the charging time are those who don't own BEVs. Well, and Ed Lee.

    --

    Rick C.

    +- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
    +- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ed Lee@21:1/5 to Ricky on Wed Jun 1 11:49:04 2022
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 9:38:15 AM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 10:19:19 AM UTC-4, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 07:55:30 -0600, rbowman <bow...@montana.com> wrote:

    On 05/31/2022 11:07 PM, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 21:46:33 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com>
    wrote:

    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can >>>> show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good >>>> economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its
    one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?

    Ballpark 200.

    One advantage of gasoline is that it stores energy. An electric
    charging station doesn't. So the feed line has to support peak load.
    The gas truck only has to deliver the average load.

    Easily replaceable battery packs would solve that problem but I don't
    see that happening with the current skateboard chassis designs.


    The lithium supply will be further stressed when all cars are electric
    and there are two battery packs per car.

    Swappable battery packs would have to be some standard size and
    interface. Possibly several small packs per car or many per truck.
    Exactly, that's why it will never happen. The battery is where all the magic is going to happen over the next few years and no BEV maker worth their salt is going to adopt a standard that limits what they can achieve.

    I just need a two pins coaxial plug with constant-on 400V, directly from the battery.

    Also, no need really. I realized some time ago, the only people complaining about the charging time are those who don't own BEVs. Well, and Ed Lee.

    No, Ed Lee never complaint about charging time, just lack of chargers between way-points.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From whit3rd@21:1/5 to jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com on Wed Jun 1 12:40:30 2022
    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 10:07:59 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 21:46:33 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can
    show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good
    economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its
    one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?

    Ballpark 200.

    with the 'several weeks' meaning that the megawatt lines deliver up to
    700 MWh

    One advantage of gasoline is that it stores energy. An electric
    charging station doesn't. So the feed line has to support peak load.
    The gas truck only has to deliver the average load.

    However, the 'peak load' can be less than four Tesla superchargers,
    for the hypothetical 'rural gas station' .

    If you really need 20 miles of range, a simple
    level 2 charger can deliver that in a little over a half hour, only needs
    a dozen kilowatts (not a megawatt) and that gives you time
    to enjoy the hot dog (that, hypothetically, is available nearby).

    I'm thinking these numbers are workable. Save the fuel-and-storage
    option for REAL distances in uninhabited areas (Antarctica won't
    be a good economic prospect for automobile chargers this year).

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Don Y@21:1/5 to All on Wed Jun 1 13:23:27 2022
    On 6/1/2022 12:40 PM, whit3rd wrote:
    If you really need 20 miles of range, a simple
    level 2 charger can deliver that in a little over a half hour, only needs
    a dozen kilowatts (not a megawatt) and that gives you time
    to enjoy the hot dog (that, hypothetically, is available nearby).

    I'm thinking these numbers are workable. Save the fuel-and-storage
    option for REAL distances in uninhabited areas (Antarctica won't
    be a good economic prospect for automobile chargers this year).

    There are many places in the US where 20 miles wouldn't bring you
    from one "fill up" to the next. E.g., a trip up the mountain and
    back would require 60 miles of range -- assuming you could refuel
    at the base going and coming. Likewise, you'd need several stops
    on the trip to feenigs.

    Kansas? Nebraska? Montana? Idaho? Texas? (i.e., all the
    "big square states")

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ricky@21:1/5 to Don Y on Wed Jun 1 13:43:53 2022
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 4:23:45 PM UTC-4, Don Y wrote:
    On 6/1/2022 12:40 PM, whit3rd wrote:
    If you really need 20 miles of range, a simple
    level 2 charger can deliver that in a little over a half hour, only needs
    a dozen kilowatts (not a megawatt) and that gives you time
    to enjoy the hot dog (that, hypothetically, is available nearby).

    I'm thinking these numbers are workable. Save the fuel-and-storage
    option for REAL distances in uninhabited areas (Antarctica won't
    be a good economic prospect for automobile chargers this year).
    There are many places in the US where 20 miles wouldn't bring you
    from one "fill up" to the next. E.g., a trip up the mountain and
    back would require 60 miles of range -- assuming you could refuel
    at the base going and coming. Likewise, you'd need several stops
    on the trip to feenigs.

    Kansas? Nebraska? Montana? Idaho? Texas? (i.e., all the
    "big square states")

    I guess there's nobody buying BEVs in Texas. That must be why Tesla moved headquarters there, to promote sales even if they can't have sales centers.

    --

    Rick C.

    ++ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
    ++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Lasse Langwadt Christensen@21:1/5 to All on Wed Jun 1 13:53:48 2022
    onsdag den 1. juni 2022 kl. 22.43.57 UTC+2 skrev Ricky:
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 4:23:45 PM UTC-4, Don Y wrote:
    On 6/1/2022 12:40 PM, whit3rd wrote:
    If you really need 20 miles of range, a simple
    level 2 charger can deliver that in a little over a half hour, only needs a dozen kilowatts (not a megawatt) and that gives you time
    to enjoy the hot dog (that, hypothetically, is available nearby).

    I'm thinking these numbers are workable. Save the fuel-and-storage
    option for REAL distances in uninhabited areas (Antarctica won't
    be a good economic prospect for automobile chargers this year).
    There are many places in the US where 20 miles wouldn't bring you
    from one "fill up" to the next. E.g., a trip up the mountain and
    back would require 60 miles of range -- assuming you could refuel
    at the base going and coming. Likewise, you'd need several stops
    on the trip to feenigs.

    Kansas? Nebraska? Montana? Idaho? Texas? (i.e., all the
    "big square states")
    I guess there's nobody buying BEVs in Texas. That must be why Tesla moved headquarters there, to promote sales even if they can't have sales centers.


    more likely they got a tax break for doing it ....

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Clifford Heath@21:1/5 to jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com on Thu Jun 2 09:23:05 2022
    On 2/6/22 00:19, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 07:55:30 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 05/31/2022 11:07 PM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 21:46:33 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com>
    wrote:

    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can >>>>> show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good
    economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its
    one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?

    Ballpark 200.

    One advantage of gasoline is that it stores energy. An electric
    charging station doesn't. So the feed line has to support peak load.
    The gas truck only has to deliver the average load.

    Easily replaceable battery packs would solve that problem but I don't
    see that happening with the current skateboard chassis designs.



    The lithium supply will be further stressed when all cars are electric
    and there are two battery packs per car.

    Swappable battery packs would have to be some standard size and
    interface. Possibly several small packs per car or many per truck.

    If batteries were standardised (not gonna happen as Ricky points out)
    then you don't need to own one, and you definitely don't need two for
    each car - just a swap&go rental system like BBQ gas cylinder exchange.

    But since cars are a vanity item (like clothes and accessories) there's
    no way to standardise a format that imposes strict dimensional and
    structural requirements on the chassis.

    Clifford Heath

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com on Wed Jun 1 20:33:53 2022
    On 06/01/2022 08:19 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 07:55:30 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 05/31/2022 11:07 PM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 21:46:33 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com>
    wrote:

    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can >>>>> show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good
    economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its
    one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?

    Ballpark 200.

    One advantage of gasoline is that it stores energy. An electric
    charging station doesn't. So the feed line has to support peak load.
    The gas truck only has to deliver the average load.

    Easily replaceable battery packs would solve that problem but I don't
    see that happening with the current skateboard chassis designs.



    The lithium supply will be further stressed when all cars are electric
    and there are two battery packs per car.

    Swappable battery packs would have to be some standard size and
    interface. Possibly several small packs per car or many per truck.



    Based on years of experience standard sizes are anathema to the
    automotive industry. For a brief period DIN radios almost succeeded even
    if the harness connections were idiosyncratic but I think the
    infotainment devices took care of that.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to bitrex on Wed Jun 1 20:36:47 2022
    On 06/01/2022 09:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the
    speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast
    speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who
    know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record
    for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an
    average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m
    with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For
    FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much
    smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional vehicle.

    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it
    charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from
    conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already
    posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to
    catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly.

    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing
    anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the
    car was pre-wrecked.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ed Lee@21:1/5 to Clifford Heath on Wed Jun 1 19:33:54 2022
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 4:23:15 PM UTC-7, Clifford Heath wrote:
    On 2/6/22 00:19, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 07:55:30 -0600, rbowman <bow...@montana.com> wrote:

    On 05/31/2022 11:07 PM, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 21:46:33 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com>
    wrote:

    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can >>>>> show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good >>>>> economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its
    one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?

    Ballpark 200.

    One advantage of gasoline is that it stores energy. An electric
    charging station doesn't. So the feed line has to support peak load.
    The gas truck only has to deliver the average load.

    Easily replaceable battery packs would solve that problem but I don't
    see that happening with the current skateboard chassis designs.



    The lithium supply will be further stressed when all cars are electric
    and there are two battery packs per car.

    Swappable battery packs would have to be some standard size and
    interface. Possibly several small packs per car or many per truck.
    If batteries were standardised (not gonna happen as Ricky points out)
    then you don't need to own one, and you definitely don't need two for
    each car - just a swap&go rental system like BBQ gas cylinder exchange.

    But since cars are a vanity item (like clothes and accessories) there's
    no way to standardise a format that imposes strict dimensional and
    structural requirements on the chassis.

    Clifford Heath

    The fixed one can never be standardized, but the removable one can. All we need is a common connector. All other features (charging, moving) are still tie to the fixed one.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to Lasse Langwadt Christensen on Wed Jun 1 20:41:50 2022
    On 06/01/2022 02:53 PM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
    onsdag den 1. juni 2022 kl. 22.43.57 UTC+2 skrev Ricky:
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 4:23:45 PM UTC-4, Don Y wrote:
    On 6/1/2022 12:40 PM, whit3rd wrote:
    If you really need 20 miles of range, a simple
    level 2 charger can deliver that in a little over a half hour, only needs >>>> a dozen kilowatts (not a megawatt) and that gives you time
    to enjoy the hot dog (that, hypothetically, is available nearby).

    I'm thinking these numbers are workable. Save the fuel-and-storage
    option for REAL distances in uninhabited areas (Antarctica won't
    be a good economic prospect for automobile chargers this year).
    There are many places in the US where 20 miles wouldn't bring you
    from one "fill up" to the next. E.g., a trip up the mountain and
    back would require 60 miles of range -- assuming you could refuel
    at the base going and coming. Likewise, you'd need several stops
    on the trip to feenigs.

    Kansas? Nebraska? Montana? Idaho? Texas? (i.e., all the
    "big square states")
    I guess there's nobody buying BEVs in Texas. That must be why Tesla moved headquarters there, to promote sales even if they can't have sales centers.


    more likely they got a tax break for doing it ....


    Probably not a lot of sales out around Marfa either.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to rbowman on Wed Jun 1 22:55:16 2022
    On 6/1/2022 10:36 PM, rbowman wrote:

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly.

    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing
    anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your
    rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the
    car was pre-wrecked.

    Yeah, they tried making the minivan cool by giving them an "aggressive"
    front end, four doors and a slight lift (not nearly enough for real
    offroading, though) and calling them a "crossover activity vehicle" or
    "outdoor lifestyle vehicle" or something.

    It's a minivan I'm sorry

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Don Y@21:1/5 to bitrex on Wed Jun 1 20:20:30 2022
    On 6/1/2022 8:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly.

    Vehicles are for transportation, not fashion statements. Lots of panel
    trucks on the road, should they be "beautified"? Pickups? Motorcycles
    (c'mon, can't you do something more than just those two/three wheels??)

    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your rollerskate?

    It's actually a station wagon. How many people do you think buy station
    wagons for their aesthetic value? They are "enclosed pickup trucks";
    the only difference being that, unlike pickup owners, SUV drivers actually *use* that space/volume.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to Don Y on Wed Jun 1 23:44:40 2022
    On 6/1/2022 11:20 PM, Don Y wrote:
    On 6/1/2022 8:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly.

    Vehicles are for transportation, not fashion statements.  Lots of panel trucks on the road, should they be "beautified"?  Pickups?  Motorcycles (c'mon, can't you do something more than just those two/three wheels??)

    When someone has the money to select a car as a fashion statement they
    often tend to become fashion statements. Not everyone has the money to
    do that, but BMW and Mercedes et al don't sell entirely on their driving quality and the quality of their German engineering alone. Or Teslas for
    that matter.

    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing
    anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your
    rollerskate?

    It's actually a station wagon.  How many people do you think buy station wagons for their aesthetic value?  They are "enclosed pickup trucks";
    the only difference being that, unlike pickup owners, SUV drivers actually *use* that space/volume.

    I was thinking more like a minivan but station wagon works.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From keith@kjwdesigns.com@21:1/5 to Clifford Heath on Wed Jun 1 20:18:01 2022
    On Wednesday, 1 June 2022 at 16:23:15 UTC-7, Clifford Heath wrote:
    On 2/6/22 00:19, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 07:55:30 -0600, rbowman <bow...@montana.com> wrote:

    On 05/31/2022 11:07 PM, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 21:46:33 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com>
    wrote:

    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can >>>>> show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good >>>>> economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its
    one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?

    Ballpark 200.

    One advantage of gasoline is that it stores energy. An electric
    charging station doesn't. So the feed line has to support peak load.
    The gas truck only has to deliver the average load.

    Easily replaceable battery packs would solve that problem but I don't
    see that happening with the current skateboard chassis designs.



    The lithium supply will be further stressed when all cars are electric
    and there are two battery packs per car.

    Swappable battery packs would have to be some standard size and
    interface. Possibly several small packs per car or many per truck.
    If batteries were standardised (not gonna happen as Ricky points out)
    then you don't need to own one, and you definitely don't need two for
    each car - just a swap&go rental system like BBQ gas cylinder exchange.

    But since cars are a vanity item (like clothes and accessories) there's
    no way to standardise a format that imposes strict dimensional and
    structural requirements on the chassis.

    Clifford Heath

    Nio operates more than 1,400 battery swapping stations in China. A battery change takes about three minutes.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-Qsi_kSiNw

    The car owner does not own the battery.

    Tesla did promote battery swapping early on but they didn't get a positive response from customers.

    kw

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Don Y@21:1/5 to bitrex on Wed Jun 1 21:28:08 2022
    On 6/1/2022 8:44 PM, bitrex wrote:
    On 6/1/2022 11:20 PM, Don Y wrote:
    On 6/1/2022 8:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly.

    Vehicles are for transportation, not fashion statements. Lots of panel
    trucks on the road, should they be "beautified"? Pickups? Motorcycles
    (c'mon, can't you do something more than just those two/three wheels??)

    When someone has the money to select a car as a fashion statement they often tend to become fashion statements. Not everyone has the money to do that, but BMW and Mercedes et al don't sell entirely on their driving quality and the quality of their German engineering alone. Or Teslas for that matter.

    People think of eyeglasses as fashion statements. Q: Do you want to
    "look good"? Or, "see well"?

    People buy overpriced items as a show of affluence, not as "value
    statements". I.e., "I can afford to have this car perpetually in need
    of repair..."

    A friend is thinking of selling/trading his Huracan -- it's got almost 1000 miles on it (OhMiGosh! Despair!!).

    Would I like to drive it? No, thank you (the idea of someone hitting
    me while behind the wheel and the hassles that would entail isn't
    worth it!)

    Would you like to go for a ride? No, thank you (I'd have to sit on the
    ground and LIFT myself into it!)

    But, gee, isn't it pretty?? <rolls eyes>

    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing
    anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your rollerskate?

    It's actually a station wagon. How many people do you think buy station
    wagons for their aesthetic value? They are "enclosed pickup trucks";
    the only difference being that, unlike pickup owners, SUV drivers actually >> *use* that space/volume.

    I was thinking more like a minivan but station wagon works.

    Folks who buy minivans are looking for a different sort of vehicle.

    A friend ribs me as SWMBO's vehicle has "too many doors". OTOH,
    he'd be hard-pressed to transport anything larger than a breadbox
    in his vehicle!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ricky@21:1/5 to lang...@fonz.dk on Thu Jun 2 00:31:09 2022
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 4:53:52 PM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote:
    onsdag den 1. juni 2022 kl. 22.43.57 UTC+2 skrev Ricky:
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 4:23:45 PM UTC-4, Don Y wrote:
    On 6/1/2022 12:40 PM, whit3rd wrote:
    If you really need 20 miles of range, a simple
    level 2 charger can deliver that in a little over a half hour, only needs
    a dozen kilowatts (not a megawatt) and that gives you time
    to enjoy the hot dog (that, hypothetically, is available nearby).

    I'm thinking these numbers are workable. Save the fuel-and-storage option for REAL distances in uninhabited areas (Antarctica won't
    be a good economic prospect for automobile chargers this year).
    There are many places in the US where 20 miles wouldn't bring you
    from one "fill up" to the next. E.g., a trip up the mountain and
    back would require 60 miles of range -- assuming you could refuel
    at the base going and coming. Likewise, you'd need several stops
    on the trip to feenigs.

    Kansas? Nebraska? Montana? Idaho? Texas? (i.e., all the
    "big square states")
    I guess there's nobody buying BEVs in Texas. That must be why Tesla moved headquarters there, to promote sales even if they can't have sales centers.

    more likely they got a tax break for doing it ....

    I really need to start using sarcasm flags or something.

    Tesla sells very well in Texas. Larkin is being his silly self. I don't know why he has such a hard on about Tesla. He has been dead set against them since day one. It can't have anything to do with the facts, because he literally is in total
    ignorance of them. He has said things before about how he doesn't like Musk. I really think he is jealous of him and so he has to denigrate everything Musk does that is successful... which is pretty much everything he does.

    --

    Rick C.

    --- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
    --- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ricky@21:1/5 to Ed Lee on Thu Jun 2 00:33:54 2022
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 10:33:59 PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 4:23:15 PM UTC-7, Clifford Heath wrote:
    On 2/6/22 00:19, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 07:55:30 -0600, rbowman <bow...@montana.com> wrote:

    On 05/31/2022 11:07 PM, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 21:46:33 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com> >>> wrote:

    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can
    show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good >>>>> economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its >>>> one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?

    Ballpark 200.

    One advantage of gasoline is that it stores energy. An electric
    charging station doesn't. So the feed line has to support peak load. >>> The gas truck only has to deliver the average load.

    Easily replaceable battery packs would solve that problem but I don't >> see that happening with the current skateboard chassis designs.



    The lithium supply will be further stressed when all cars are electric and there are two battery packs per car.

    Swappable battery packs would have to be some standard size and interface. Possibly several small packs per car or many per truck.
    If batteries were standardised (not gonna happen as Ricky points out)
    then you don't need to own one, and you definitely don't need two for
    each car - just a swap&go rental system like BBQ gas cylinder exchange.

    But since cars are a vanity item (like clothes and accessories) there's
    no way to standardise a format that imposes strict dimensional and structural requirements on the chassis.

    Clifford Heath
    The fixed one can never be standardized, but the removable one can. All we need is a common connector. All other features (charging, moving) are still tie to the fixed one.

    Ed, only you would not even understand the concept of a swappable battery, thinking there was some utility to only swapping half of your charging capacity, meaning you have to stop twice as often. But for you, that would be a 400% improvement over what
    you are doing now.

    --

    Rick C.

    --+ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
    --+ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ricky@21:1/5 to ke...@kjwdesigns.com on Thu Jun 2 00:42:25 2022
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 11:18:07 PM UTC-4, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Wednesday, 1 June 2022 at 16:23:15 UTC-7, Clifford Heath wrote:
    On 2/6/22 00:19, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 07:55:30 -0600, rbowman <bow...@montana.com> wrote:

    On 05/31/2022 11:07 PM, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 21:46:33 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com> >>> wrote:

    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can
    show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good >>>>> economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its >>>> one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?

    Ballpark 200.

    One advantage of gasoline is that it stores energy. An electric
    charging station doesn't. So the feed line has to support peak load. >>> The gas truck only has to deliver the average load.

    Easily replaceable battery packs would solve that problem but I don't >> see that happening with the current skateboard chassis designs.



    The lithium supply will be further stressed when all cars are electric and there are two battery packs per car.

    Swappable battery packs would have to be some standard size and interface. Possibly several small packs per car or many per truck.
    If batteries were standardised (not gonna happen as Ricky points out)
    then you don't need to own one, and you definitely don't need two for
    each car - just a swap&go rental system like BBQ gas cylinder exchange.

    But since cars are a vanity item (like clothes and accessories) there's
    no way to standardise a format that imposes strict dimensional and structural requirements on the chassis.

    Clifford Heath
    Nio operates more than 1,400 battery swapping stations in China. A battery change takes about three minutes.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-Qsi_kSiNw

    The car owner does not own the battery.

    Tesla did promote battery swapping early on but they didn't get a positive response from customers.

    Nio has proven that battery swapping could work, except for all the reasons why it doesn't. Yes, you can't own your battery with battery swapping. But you still have to buy it when you buy the car. Battery swapping has many issues. It's not all about
    the rapid swap. It's anathema to night charging because the batteries have to be charged as soon as they are taken out of a car, so they can be ready for their next use. I'm sure Nio isn't going to stock a bazillion batteries, so they can sit around
    waiting for night utility rates.

    This has all been discussed before. What Nio is doing is very much like having gas stations for just one make of autos. The financials just aren't there. But we will see. I believe Nio makes cars that do not swap as well, no?

    --

    Rick C.

    -+- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
    -+- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ed Lee@21:1/5 to Ricky on Thu Jun 2 04:49:37 2022
    On Thursday, June 2, 2022 at 12:33:58 AM UTC-7, Ricky wrote:
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 10:33:59 PM UTC-4, Ed Lee wrote:
    On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 4:23:15 PM UTC-7, Clifford Heath wrote:
    On 2/6/22 00:19, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 07:55:30 -0600, rbowman <bow...@montana.com> wrote:

    On 05/31/2022 11:07 PM, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Tue, 31 May 2022 21:46:33 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com> >>> wrote:

    On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:10:34 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:

    At some dinky rural gas startion and hot dog emporium, a gas truck can
    show up every few weeks and reload the tanks. It might not be good >>>>> economics to run 20 miles of megwatt power lines.

    And the gas truck delivers how many megawatt-hours of energy in its >>>> one load of fuel per 'few weeks'?

    Ballpark 200.

    One advantage of gasoline is that it stores energy. An electric
    charging station doesn't. So the feed line has to support peak load. >>> The gas truck only has to deliver the average load.

    Easily replaceable battery packs would solve that problem but I don't >> see that happening with the current skateboard chassis designs.



    The lithium supply will be further stressed when all cars are electric and there are two battery packs per car.

    Swappable battery packs would have to be some standard size and interface. Possibly several small packs per car or many per truck.
    If batteries were standardised (not gonna happen as Ricky points out) then you don't need to own one, and you definitely don't need two for each car - just a swap&go rental system like BBQ gas cylinder exchange.

    But since cars are a vanity item (like clothes and accessories) there's no way to standardise a format that imposes strict dimensional and structural requirements on the chassis.

    Clifford Heath
    The fixed one can never be standardized, but the removable one can. All we need is a common connector. All other features (charging, moving) are still tie to the fixed one.
    Ed, only you would not even understand the concept of a swappable battery, thinking there was some utility to only swapping half of your charging capacity, meaning you have to stop twice as often. But for you, that would be a 400% improvement over what
    you are doing now.

    I do understand and I do need to provide a separate charging path (OBC mod DC/CCS). My mobile battery has separate BMS and can be charged from AC 110V/220V, DC 400V or 12V (from emergency vehicle). Mobile battery is like a luggage. It can be any size
    or shape. but a standard interface cord. I have several different form factors. One 10kwh is 28"x24"x16" in 150 pounds, just siting in the back seat area.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to bitrex on Thu Jun 2 06:41:35 2022
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 11:48:32 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For
    FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional vehicle.

    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly.

    Especially ugly vehicles seem to have a niche market. The designers
    must giggle a lot.




    --

    Anybody can count to one.

    - Robert Widlar

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to rbowman on Thu Jun 2 06:43:18 2022
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 20:36:47 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/01/2022 09:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the
    speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast
    speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who
    know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record
    for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an
    average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m
    with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>>> FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much
    smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional vehicle. >>>
    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it
    charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from
    conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already
    posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to
    catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly.

    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing
    anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your
    rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the
    car was pre-wrecked.

    And silly side creases. And random slabs of chrome. And bizarre rear
    lights.

    Don't get me started on Volvos.



    --

    Anybody can count to one.

    - Robert Widlar

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to bitrex on Thu Jun 2 06:44:40 2022
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 22:55:16 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/1/2022 10:36 PM, rbowman wrote:

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly.

    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing
    anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your
    rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the
    car was pre-wrecked.

    Yeah, they tried making the minivan cool by giving them an "aggressive"
    front end, four doors and a slight lift (not nearly enough for real >offroading, though) and calling them a "crossover activity vehicle" or >"outdoor lifestyle vehicle" or something.

    It's a minivan I'm sorry

    The designers of one Cadillac SUV admitted that the image that they
    wanted was "menacing."



    --

    Anybody can count to one.

    - Robert Widlar

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Clifford Heath@21:1/5 to jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com on Fri Jun 3 14:10:01 2022
    On 2/6/22 23:43, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 20:36:47 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/01/2022 09:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the
    speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast
    speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who >>>>>> know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record >>>>>> for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an
    average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m
    with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>>>> FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much
    smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional vehicle. >>>>
    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it
    charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from
    conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already
    posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to
    catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly.

    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing
    anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your
    rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the
    car was pre-wrecked.

    And silly side creases. And random slabs of chrome. And bizarre rear
    lights.

    It is a spectacularly rare event that an American car company produces
    anything even vaguely aesthetic. But then I have Italian cars in the blood.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Flyguy@21:1/5 to bitrex on Thu Jun 2 21:24:22 2022
    On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 10:17:07 AM UTC-7, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 11:26 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:50:31 -0400, bitrex <us...@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 10:28 PM, Flyguy wrote:
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge


    AFAIK there's no officially accredited body that sanctions such a race
    and to even get a decent time you have to break most every traffic law
    in the book, so who cares? The whole endeavor seems ripe for fraud in
    the first place.

    Cannonball: "Flat out between tickets."

    I feel about it about the same as I do about these jamokes:

    <https://youtu.be/RWPf9rqPAB4>

    Why not take your Dad's money and your Daddy's car and enter a real
    race? Nobody thinks you're cool.

    This is what the Left does when they are on the short side of logical arguments: they start talking about your family heritage.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com on Thu Jun 2 22:22:15 2022
    On 06/02/2022 07:44 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 22:55:16 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/1/2022 10:36 PM, rbowman wrote:

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly. >>>>
    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing
    anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your
    rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the >>> car was pre-wrecked.

    Yeah, they tried making the minivan cool by giving them an "aggressive"
    front end, four doors and a slight lift (not nearly enough for real
    offroading, though) and calling them a "crossover activity vehicle" or
    "outdoor lifestyle vehicle" or something.

    It's a minivan I'm sorry

    The designers of one Cadillac SUV admitted that the image that they
    wanted was "menacing."




    There were a few years when a third gen black Dodge Challenger looked
    like something James Cagney would drive in a gangster movie. I've always
    had a weakness for cars that looked evil. There are a couple Traction
    Avant models I'd love to have.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com on Thu Jun 2 22:16:02 2022
    On 06/02/2022 07:43 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 20:36:47 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/01/2022 09:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the
    speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast
    speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who >>>>>> know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record >>>>>> for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an
    average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m
    with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>>>> FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much
    smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional vehicle. >>>>
    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it
    charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from
    conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already
    posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to
    catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly.

    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing
    anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your
    rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the
    car was pre-wrecked.

    And silly side creases. And random slabs of chrome. And bizarre rear
    lights.

    Don't get me started on Volvos.




    Someone at work drove a Subaru Forester. I knew the car but every time I
    saw it I had to convince myself it hadn't been sideswiped. There was
    something about the panels that looked bent.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From bitrex@21:1/5 to Flyguy on Fri Jun 3 10:21:48 2022
    On 6/3/2022 12:24 AM, Flyguy wrote:
    On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 10:17:07 AM UTC-7, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 11:26 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:50:31 -0400, bitrex <us...@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 10:28 PM, Flyguy wrote:
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it
    up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge


    AFAIK there's no officially accredited body that sanctions such a race >>>> and to even get a decent time you have to break most every traffic law >>>> in the book, so who cares? The whole endeavor seems ripe for fraud in
    the first place.

    Cannonball: "Flat out between tickets."

    I feel about it about the same as I do about these jamokes:

    <https://youtu.be/RWPf9rqPAB4>

    Why not take your Dad's money and your Daddy's car and enter a real
    race? Nobody thinks you're cool.

    This is what the Left does when they are on the short side of logical arguments: they start talking about your family heritage.

    Flyguy has definitely used the line "Don't you know who my DAD is?!"
    before..

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to Clifford Heath on Fri Jun 3 08:19:08 2022
    On 06/02/2022 10:10 PM, Clifford Heath wrote:
    On 2/6/22 23:43, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 20:36:47 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/01/2022 09:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the >>>>>>> speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast >>>>>>> speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who >>>>>>> know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record >>>>>>> for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an
    average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record


    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m >>>>>>> with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. >>>>>> For
    FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much
    smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional
    vehicle.

    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it
    charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from
    conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already
    posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to
    catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly. >>>>
    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing
    anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your
    rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the >>> car was pre-wrecked.

    And silly side creases. And random slabs of chrome. And bizarre rear
    lights.

    It is a spectacularly rare event that an American car company produces anything even vaguely aesthetic. But then I have Italian cars in the blood.

    I had an Italian car in my blood when a friend rolled his Alfa Romeo. 50
    years later a doctor remarked on the odd scars around my eye.

    I had a Fiat Spyder briefly. It had to be admired for its aesthetics
    since it rarely was operational. I got to like the Mustang loaner so
    much I traded the Fiat for it.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Phil Hobbs@21:1/5 to rbowman on Fri Jun 3 11:35:53 2022
    rbowman wrote:
    On 06/02/2022 10:10 PM, Clifford Heath wrote:
    On 2/6/22 23:43, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 20:36:47 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/01/2022 09:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the >>>>>>>> speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast >>>>>>>> speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who >>>>>>>> know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record >>>>>>>> for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an >>>>>>>> average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record



    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m >>>>>>>> with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration
    alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. >>>>>>> For
    FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much
    smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional
    vehicle.

    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it >>>>>> charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that >>>>>>> occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from
    conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already >>>>>> posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to >>>>>> catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly. >>>>>
    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing >>>>> anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your
    rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like
    the
    car was pre-wrecked.

    And silly side creases. And random slabs of chrome. And bizarre rear
    lights.

    It is a spectacularly rare event that an American car company produces
    anything even vaguely aesthetic. But then I have Italian cars in the
    blood.

    I had an Italian car in my blood when a friend rolled his Alfa Romeo. 50 years later a doctor remarked on the odd scars around my eye.

    I had a Fiat Spyder briefly. It had to be admired for its aesthetics
    since it rarely was operational. I got to like the Mustang loaner so
    much I traded the Fiat for it.

    My first car was a 1973 Fiat 128, which worked fine(*) till the rocker
    panels completely rusted out in 1981.

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs


    (*) For sufficiently-small values of "fine"--it blew a timing belt at
    50k miles, taking out all eight valves.


    --
    Dr Philip C D Hobbs
    Principal Consultant
    ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
    Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
    Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

    http://electrooptical.net
    http://hobbs-eo.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to rbowman on Fri Jun 3 08:51:26 2022
    On Fri, 3 Jun 2022 08:19:08 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/02/2022 10:10 PM, Clifford Heath wrote:
    On 2/6/22 23:43, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 20:36:47 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/01/2022 09:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the >>>>>>>> speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast >>>>>>>> speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who >>>>>>>> know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record >>>>>>>> for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an >>>>>>>> average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record


    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m >>>>>>>> with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. >>>>>>> For
    FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much
    smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional
    vehicle.

    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it >>>>>> charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that >>>>>>> occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from
    conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already >>>>>> posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to >>>>>> catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly. >>>>>
    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing >>>>> anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your
    rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the >>>> car was pre-wrecked.

    And silly side creases. And random slabs of chrome. And bizarre rear
    lights.

    It is a spectacularly rare event that an American car company produces
    anything even vaguely aesthetic. But then I have Italian cars in the blood.

    I had an Italian car in my blood when a friend rolled his Alfa Romeo. 50 >years later a doctor remarked on the odd scars around my eye.

    I had a Fiat Spyder briefly. It had to be admired for its aesthetics
    since it rarely was operational. I got to like the Mustang loaner so
    much I traded the Fiat for it.

    Alfas were wonderful, almost erotic, to drive, and about impossible to
    work on.



    --

    Anybody can count to one.

    - Robert Widlar

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical. on Fri Jun 3 09:04:36 2022
    On Fri, 3 Jun 2022 11:35:53 -0400, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

    rbowman wrote:
    On 06/02/2022 10:10 PM, Clifford Heath wrote:
    On 2/6/22 23:43, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 20:36:47 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote: >>>>
    On 06/01/2022 09:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the >>>>>>>>> speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast >>>>>>>>> speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who >>>>>>>>> know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record >>>>>>>>> for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an >>>>>>>>> average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record



    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m >>>>>>>>> with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration
    alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. >>>>>>>> For
    FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much >>>>>>> smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional
    vehicle.

    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it >>>>>>> charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that >>>>>>>> occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from >>>>>>> conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already >>>>>>> posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to >>>>>>> catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly. >>>>>>
    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing >>>>>> anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your >>>>>> rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like >>>>> the
    car was pre-wrecked.

    And silly side creases. And random slabs of chrome. And bizarre rear
    lights.

    It is a spectacularly rare event that an American car company produces
    anything even vaguely aesthetic. But then I have Italian cars in the
    blood.

    I had an Italian car in my blood when a friend rolled his Alfa Romeo. 50
    years later a doctor remarked on the odd scars around my eye.

    I had a Fiat Spyder briefly. It had to be admired for its aesthetics
    since it rarely was operational. I got to like the Mustang loaner so
    much I traded the Fiat for it.

    My first car was a 1973 Fiat 128, which worked fine(*) till the rocker
    panels completely rusted out in 1981.



    Mine was an Austin-Healy Sprite. Great fun with the top down,
    mechanically barbaric, fairly easy to fix, which was good given the
    frequency of breakdowns. Kept a tool box in the tiny truck.

    Didn't need jumper cables. I could push it, jump in, and dump the
    clutch to start it. When the clutch worked. I drove from Mt Tam,
    across the GG bridge home, without a clutch. My Filipino GF was
    impressed.

    The Sprite got totaled so I got an MG Midget, basically the same
    thing.

    I sold the MG to an artist who completely restored it and painted the
    ocean on it as a canvass. He displayed it and rarely drove it.

    https://adrianruyle.com/3-d-art/art-cars/mg-3/



    --

    Anybody can count to one.

    - Robert Widlar

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John Larkin@21:1/5 to rbowman on Fri Jun 3 11:18:02 2022
    On Thu, 2 Jun 2022 22:22:15 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/02/2022 07:44 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 22:55:16 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/1/2022 10:36 PM, rbowman wrote:

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly. >>>>>
    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing >>>>> anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your
    rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the >>>> car was pre-wrecked.

    Yeah, they tried making the minivan cool by giving them an "aggressive"
    front end, four doors and a slight lift (not nearly enough for real
    offroading, though) and calling them a "crossover activity vehicle" or
    "outdoor lifestyle vehicle" or something.

    It's a minivan I'm sorry

    The designers of one Cadillac SUV admitted that the image that they
    wanted was "menacing."




    There were a few years when a third gen black Dodge Challenger looked
    like something James Cagney would drive in a gangster movie. I've always
    had a weakness for cars that looked evil. There are a couple Traction
    Avant models I'd love to have.

    My wife drives an adorable little orange Honda Fit but lusts after a
    black Challenger. Maybe I'll rent her one to get it out of her system.

    --

    If a man will begin with certainties, he shall end with doubts,
    but if he will be content to begin with doubts he shall end in certainties. Francis Bacon

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John Larkin@21:1/5 to rbowman on Fri Jun 3 11:21:27 2022
    On Thu, 2 Jun 2022 22:16:02 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/02/2022 07:43 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 20:36:47 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/01/2022 09:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the >>>>>>> speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast >>>>>>> speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who >>>>>>> know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record >>>>>>> for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an
    average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m >>>>>>> with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>>>>> FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much
    smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional vehicle. >>>>>
    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it
    charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from
    conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already
    posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to
    catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly. >>>>
    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing
    anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your
    rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the >>> car was pre-wrecked.

    And silly side creases. And random slabs of chrome. And bizarre rear
    lights.

    Don't get me started on Volvos.




    Someone at work drove a Subaru Forester. I knew the car but every time I
    saw it I had to convince myself it hadn't been sideswiped. There was >something about the panels that looked bent.

    Maybe a tree fell on it.

    --

    If a man will begin with certainties, he shall end with doubts,
    but if he will be content to begin with doubts he shall end in certainties. Francis Bacon

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John Larkin@21:1/5 to soar2morrow@yahoo.com on Fri Jun 3 11:23:55 2022
    On Thu, 2 Jun 2022 21:24:22 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

    On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 10:17:07 AM UTC-7, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 11:26 AM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Mon, 30 May 2022 08:50:31 -0400, bitrex <us...@example.net> wrote:

    On 5/29/2022 10:28 PM, Flyguy wrote:
    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked
    it up: the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge


    AFAIK there's no officially accredited body that sanctions such a race
    and to even get a decent time you have to break most every traffic law
    in the book, so who cares? The whole endeavor seems ripe for fraud in
    the first place.

    Cannonball: "Flat out between tickets."

    I feel about it about the same as I do about these jamokes:

    <https://youtu.be/RWPf9rqPAB4>

    Why not take your Dad's money and your Daddy's car and enter a real
    race? Nobody thinks you're cool.

    This is what the Left does when they are on the short side of logical arguments: they start talking about your family heritage.

    He probably just stole the car.

    But yes, bitrex has wealth jealousy problems.

    --

    If a man will begin with certainties, he shall end with doubts,
    but if he will be content to begin with doubts he shall end in certainties. Francis Bacon

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Phil Hobbs@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Fri Jun 3 14:34:21 2022
    John Larkin wrote:
    On Thu, 2 Jun 2022 22:22:15 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/02/2022 07:44 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 22:55:16 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:

    On 6/1/2022 10:36 PM, rbowman wrote:

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly. >>>>>>
    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing >>>>>> anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your >>>>>> rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the >>>>> car was pre-wrecked.

    Yeah, they tried making the minivan cool by giving them an "aggressive" >>>> front end, four doors and a slight lift (not nearly enough for real
    offroading, though) and calling them a "crossover activity vehicle" or >>>> "outdoor lifestyle vehicle" or something.

    It's a minivan I'm sorry

    The designers of one Cadillac SUV admitted that the image that they
    wanted was "menacing."




    There were a few years when a third gen black Dodge Challenger looked
    like something James Cagney would drive in a gangster movie. I've always
    had a weakness for cars that looked evil. There are a couple Traction
    Avant models I'd love to have.

    My wife drives an adorable little orange Honda Fit but lusts after a
    black Challenger. Maybe I'll rent her one to get it out of her system.


    Well, then you'd get to park in the garage. ;)

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs

    --
    Dr Philip C D Hobbs
    Principal Consultant
    ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
    Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
    Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

    http://electrooptical.net
    http://hobbs-eo.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com on Fri Jun 3 22:24:37 2022
    On 06/03/2022 10:04 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    Mine was an Austin-Healy Sprite. Great fun with the top down,
    mechanically barbaric, fairly easy to fix, which was good given the
    frequency of breakdowns. Kept a tool box in the tiny truck.

    Ah, memories. I had a '62. No bug-eye charm, a slightly larger engine,
    and the semi-adequate brakes from '61. Sudden rain storms were a
    problem. By the time you got the frame out of the trunk, installed it in
    the sockets, stretched the top over it, retrieved the side curtains, and
    put them in place, you might as well have kept driving.


    Didn't need jumper cables. I could push it, jump in, and dump the
    clutch to start it. When the clutch worked. I drove from Mt Tam,
    across the GG bridge home, without a clutch. My Filipino GF was
    impressed.

    I ran out of gas a few blocks from home. The city streets were level, so
    I got out, walked beside it and pushed it along with no problem. Until I
    got to an intersection where a cop was directing traffic. "Do you
    always take your car for a walk?" At least cops still had a sense of
    humor then.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to rbowman on Fri Jun 3 21:35:14 2022
    On Fri, 3 Jun 2022 22:24:37 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/03/2022 10:04 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    Mine was an Austin-Healy Sprite. Great fun with the top down,
    mechanically barbaric, fairly easy to fix, which was good given the
    frequency of breakdowns. Kept a tool box in the tiny truck.

    Ah, memories. I had a '62. No bug-eye charm, a slightly larger engine,
    and the semi-adequate brakes from '61. Sudden rain storms were a
    problem. By the time you got the frame out of the trunk, installed it in
    the sockets, stretched the top over it, retrieved the side curtains, and
    put them in place, you might as well have kept driving.

    Drive above 30 mph or so and the rain barely touches your hair. Just
    don't stop.



    Didn't need jumper cables. I could push it, jump in, and dump the
    clutch to start it. When the clutch worked. I drove from Mt Tam,
    across the GG bridge home, without a clutch. My Filipino GF was
    impressed.

    I ran out of gas a few blocks from home. The city streets were level, so
    I got out, walked beside it and pushed it along with no problem. Until I
    got to an intersection where a cop was directing traffic. "Do you
    always take your car for a walk?" At least cops still had a sense of
    humor then.


    I once ran out of gas and coasted about a block into a gas station.
    Really.



    --

    Anybody can count to one.

    - Robert Widlar

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Fri Jun 3 22:32:45 2022
    On 06/03/2022 12:21 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Thu, 2 Jun 2022 22:16:02 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/02/2022 07:43 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 20:36:47 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/01/2022 09:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the >>>>>>>> speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast >>>>>>>> speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who >>>>>>>> know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record >>>>>>>> for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an >>>>>>>> average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m >>>>>>>> with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>>>>>> FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much
    smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional vehicle. >>>>>>
    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it >>>>>> charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that >>>>>>> occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from
    conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already >>>>>> posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to >>>>>> catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly. >>>>>
    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing >>>>> anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your
    rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the >>>> car was pre-wrecked.

    And silly side creases. And random slabs of chrome. And bizarre rear
    lights.

    Don't get me started on Volvos.




    Someone at work drove a Subaru Forester. I knew the car but every time I
    saw it I had to convince myself it hadn't been sideswiped. There was
    something about the panels that looked bent.

    Maybe a tree fell on it.


    Never can tell around here. A friend was out getting firewood and
    reasoned if he fell a tree on the upside of the road he could saw
    lengths off and roll them down to the road. Worked well until one log
    bounced off a rock, altered course, and took out the front quarter of
    his pickup.

    Around here there are a lot of comedy routines about the economics of
    burning 'free' firewood.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to Phil Hobbs on Fri Jun 3 22:17:13 2022
    On 06/03/2022 09:35 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    rbowman wrote:
    On 06/02/2022 10:10 PM, Clifford Heath wrote:
    On 2/6/22 23:43, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 20:36:47 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote: >>>>
    On 06/01/2022 09:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the >>>>>>>>> speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast >>>>>>>>> speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who >>>>>>>>> know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV >>>>>>>>> record
    for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an >>>>>>>>> average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record



    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m >>>>>>>>> with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration
    alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. >>>>>>>> For
    FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much >>>>>>> smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional
    vehicle.

    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it >>>>>>> charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that >>>>>>>> occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from >>>>>>> conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already >>>>>>> posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to >>>>>>> catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty
    ugly.

    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing >>>>>> anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your >>>>>> rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look
    like the
    car was pre-wrecked.

    And silly side creases. And random slabs of chrome. And bizarre rear
    lights.

    It is a spectacularly rare event that an American car company produces
    anything even vaguely aesthetic. But then I have Italian cars in the
    blood.

    I had an Italian car in my blood when a friend rolled his Alfa Romeo.
    50 years later a doctor remarked on the odd scars around my eye.

    I had a Fiat Spyder briefly. It had to be admired for its aesthetics
    since it rarely was operational. I got to like the Mustang loaner so
    much I traded the Fiat for it.

    My first car was a 1973 Fiat 128, which worked fine(*) till the rocker
    panels completely rusted out in 1981.

    It lasted longer than the Yugos it sired... I didn't care much for
    Clinton but bombing the Yugo factory was a plus in his ledger.


    (*) For sufficiently-small values of "fine"--it blew a timing belt at
    50k miles, taking out all eight valves.

    Ah, interference engines. The friend with a thing for Alfas was
    rebuilding another one. DOHC driven by a chain with a tensioner that
    could take your finger off if you released in incorrectly. He was an
    excellent architect, a not so excellent mechanic and got the timing
    marks wrong. At least it was still in the garage when it wiped the
    valves out.

    I'd rebuilt one for a guy when I was in college. It was the only wet
    liner engine I've ever worked on. No oversized pistons, just replace the
    whole liner/piston assembly.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Phil Hobbs@21:1/5 to rbowman on Sat Jun 4 09:00:49 2022
    rbowman wrote:
    On 06/03/2022 09:35 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    rbowman wrote:
    On 06/02/2022 10:10 PM, Clifford Heath wrote:
    On 2/6/22 23:43, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 20:36:47 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote: >>>>>
    On 06/01/2022 09:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the >>>>>>>>>> speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast >>>>>>>>>> speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics >>>>>>>>>> who
    know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV >>>>>>>>>> record
    for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an >>>>>>>>>> average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record




    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m >>>>>>>>>> with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration
    alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. >>>>>>>>> For
    FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much >>>>>>>> smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional >>>>>>>> vehicle.

    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it >>>>>>>> charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that >>>>>>>>> occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from >>>>>>>> conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already >>>>>>>> posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to >>>>>>>> catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty >>>>>>> ugly.

    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing >>>>>>> anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your >>>>>>> rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look
    like the
    car was pre-wrecked.

    And silly side creases. And random slabs of chrome. And bizarre rear >>>>> lights.

    It is a spectacularly rare event that an American car company produces >>>> anything even vaguely aesthetic. But then I have Italian cars in the
    blood.

    I had an Italian car in my blood when a friend rolled his Alfa Romeo.
    50 years later a doctor remarked on the odd scars around my eye.

    I had a Fiat Spyder briefly. It had to be admired for its aesthetics
    since it rarely was operational. I got to like the Mustang loaner so
    much I traded the Fiat for it.

    My first car was a 1973 Fiat 128, which worked fine(*) till the rocker
    panels  completely rusted out in 1981.

    It lasted longer than the Yugos it sired... I didn't care much for
    Clinton but bombing the Yugo factory was a plus in his ledger.


    (*) For sufficiently-small values of "fine"--it blew a timing belt at
    50k miles, taking out all eight valves.

    Ah, interference engines.  The friend with a thing for Alfas was
    rebuilding another one. DOHC driven by a chain with a tensioner that
    could take your finger off if you released in incorrectly. He was an excellent architect, a not so excellent mechanic and got the timing
    marks wrong. At least it was still in the garage when it wiped the
    valves out.

    I'd rebuilt one for a guy when I was in college. It was the only wet
    liner engine I've ever worked on. No oversized pistons, just replace the whole liner/piston assembly.


    SOHC engines are pretty easy to get right, even interference ones. DOHC
    is another matter--you have to get all the slack on the tensioner side,
    or else.

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs

    --
    Dr Philip C D Hobbs
    Principal Consultant
    ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
    Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
    Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

    http://electrooptical.net
    http://hobbs-eo.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to rbowman on Sat Jun 4 09:23:36 2022
    On Fri, 3 Jun 2022 22:32:45 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/03/2022 12:21 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Thu, 2 Jun 2022 22:16:02 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/02/2022 07:43 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 20:36:47 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote: >>>>
    On 06/01/2022 09:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the >>>>>>>>> speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast >>>>>>>>> speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who >>>>>>>>> know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record >>>>>>>>> for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an >>>>>>>>> average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m >>>>>>>>> with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For >>>>>>>> FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much >>>>>>> smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional vehicle.

    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it >>>>>>> charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that >>>>>>>> occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from >>>>>>> conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already >>>>>>> posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to >>>>>>> catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly. >>>>>>
    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing >>>>>> anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your >>>>>> rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the >>>>> car was pre-wrecked.

    And silly side creases. And random slabs of chrome. And bizarre rear
    lights.

    Don't get me started on Volvos.




    Someone at work drove a Subaru Forester. I knew the car but every time I >>> saw it I had to convince myself it hadn't been sideswiped. There was
    something about the panels that looked bent.

    Maybe a tree fell on it.


    Never can tell around here. A friend was out getting firewood and
    reasoned if he fell a tree on the upside of the road he could saw
    lengths off and roll them down to the road. Worked well until one log
    bounced off a rock, altered course, and took out the front quarter of
    his pickup.

    Youtube has lots of flics of idiots with chainsaws.

    Our city version: we were driving uphill on Swiss Street and a
    driverless recycling wheelie bin was screaming down the street at us.
    Last second, it changed its mind and swerved into a parked car.


    Around here there are a lot of comedy routines about the economics of
    burning 'free' firewood.

    I just came back from three days up at the cabin in Truckee, one day
    without power. Life is different without electricity.

    A few cabins up the block, a tree fell in a windstorm. It slammed the
    power line and sent a shock wave down the block. That propagated to us
    and tugged on the roughly 100 foot tap-off from the street to our
    cabin. It ripped the fascia off the roofline and dumped the power,
    cable, and POTS wires on the ground.

    I could model that in Spice.

    https://www.dropbox.com/sh/lt38qw0yxrulr6v/AABtcYQNALQjZFqOfHV291dea?dl=0



    --

    Anybody can count to one.

    - Robert Widlar

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com on Sat Jun 4 11:49:07 2022
    On 06/03/2022 10:35 PM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    I once ran out of gas and coasted about a block into a gas station.
    Really.

    They only weighed 1500 pounds, not much rolling resistance. That's about
    100 pounds less than a Smart clown car. There aren't many production
    more or less road legal cars that weigh less other than the Lotus 7/Caterham/Westfield family. Even the Polaris Slingshot three wheeler
    weighs more.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Phil Hobbs@21:1/5 to rbowman on Sat Jun 4 17:45:00 2022
    rbowman wrote:
    On 06/03/2022 10:35 PM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    I once ran out of gas and coasted about a block into a gas station.
    Really.

    They only weighed 1500 pounds, not much rolling resistance. That's about
    100 pounds less than a Smart clown car. There aren't many production
    more or less road legal cars that weigh less other than the Lotus 7/Caterham/Westfield family. Even the Polaris Slingshot three wheeler
    weighs more.

    My Fiat was about 1400 pounds, with a blistering 68 hp (not bad from an
    1100 cc engine--about one hp per cube).

    It was one of the earlier transverse engine FWD cars, so the back end
    was very light--there was basically nothing back there. Occasionally
    when I was liable to be late for class, I'd find some impossibly tight
    parking space, nose in, then climb out and lift the back of the car into
    the spot. Got some funny looks. ;)

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical. on Sat Jun 4 15:05:38 2022
    On Sat, 4 Jun 2022 17:45:00 -0400, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

    rbowman wrote:
    On 06/03/2022 10:35 PM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    I once ran out of gas and coasted about a block into a gas station.
    Really.

    They only weighed 1500 pounds, not much rolling resistance. That's about
    100 pounds less than a Smart clown car. There aren't many production
    more or less road legal cars that weigh less other than the Lotus
    7/Caterham/Westfield family. Even the Polaris Slingshot three wheeler
    weighs more.

    My Fiat was about 1400 pounds, with a blistering 68 hp (not bad from an
    1100 cc engine--about one hp per cube).

    It was one of the earlier transverse engine FWD cars, so the back end
    was very light--there was basically nothing back there. Occasionally
    when I was liable to be late for class, I'd find some impossibly tight >parking space, nose in, then climb out and lift the back of the car into
    the spot. Got some funny looks. ;)

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs

    I was parked with a date one night, near a beach, and my Sprite was
    stuck in the sand alongside the road. A few guys came along and lifted
    it, and us, onto the pavement.

    I weighed a bit less then, I'm guessing.



    --

    Anybody can count to one.

    - Robert Widlar

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to Phil Hobbs on Sat Jun 4 19:30:24 2022
    On 06/04/2022 03:45 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    It was one of the earlier transverse engine FWD cars, so the back end
    was very light--there was basically nothing back there. Occasionally
    when I was liable to be late for class, I'd find some impossibly tight parking space, nose in, then climb out and lift the back of the car into
    the spot. Got some funny looks.

    The fans claim it was the progenitor of modern car designs but I still
    give that honor to the Mini despite quibbles about the drive train
    design. I liked to watch the Mini's running at Lime Rock. They could
    embarrass much more powerful cars in the twisties. I like to think my
    Yaris is closer to the concept of a cheap little box that could run like
    a scalded cat than the upmarket Mini Coopers.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Phil Hobbs@21:1/5 to rbowman on Sat Jun 4 23:06:40 2022
    rbowman wrote:
    On 06/04/2022 03:45 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    It was one of the earlier transverse engine FWD cars, so the back end
    was very light--there was basically nothing back there. Occasionally
    when I was liable to be late for class, I'd find some impossibly tight
    parking space, nose in, then climb out and lift the back of the car into
    the spot. Got some funny looks.

    The fans claim it was the progenitor of modern car designs but I still
    give that honor to the Mini despite quibbles about the drive train
    design. I liked to watch the Mini's running at Lime Rock. They could embarrass much more powerful cars in the twisties. I like to think my
    Yaris is closer to the concept of a cheap little box that could run like
    a scalded cat than the upmarket Mini Coopers.

    IIRC there was a small Audi that came out a bit before the 128, with the
    same layout. Mine had a dash-mounted choke _and_ a dash-mounted
    throttle, so you could do the Italian cruise control thing without
    needing a cinder block to put on the gas pedal. ;)

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs

    --
    Dr Philip C D Hobbs
    Principal Consultant
    ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
    Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
    Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

    http://electrooptical.net
    http://hobbs-eo.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ricky@21:1/5 to Phil Hobbs on Sat Jun 4 21:45:01 2022
    On Saturday, June 4, 2022 at 5:45:12 PM UTC-4, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    rbowman wrote:
    On 06/03/2022 10:35 PM, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    I once ran out of gas and coasted about a block into a gas station.
    Really.

    They only weighed 1500 pounds, not much rolling resistance. That's about 100 pounds less than a Smart clown car. There aren't many production
    more or less road legal cars that weigh less other than the Lotus 7/Caterham/Westfield family. Even the Polaris Slingshot three wheeler weighs more.
    My Fiat was about 1400 pounds, with a blistering 68 hp (not bad from an
    1100 cc engine--about one hp per cube).

    It was one of the earlier transverse engine FWD cars, so the back end
    was very light--there was basically nothing back there. Occasionally
    when I was liable to be late for class, I'd find some impossibly tight parking space, nose in, then climb out and lift the back of the car into
    the spot. Got some funny looks. ;)

    Did the Fiat have trouble with the exhaust system pulling apart from the motor torque? My Austin America did. Obviously, people slapped that car together without a thought of what might happen when you turn the engine 90 degrees.

    It was not a bad car in other respects than it was British. British never made reliable cars. The US made crappy cars back then, but even US automakers laughed at British cars. Lucas electrics was enough to cripple any machine. It's always amazed me
    the Brits were able to hold off the Germans by building airplanes. Now, BEVs look like they will be the death of the Brits. They can't even keep their kettles hot, there's no way they can figure out how to span a 6 foot sidewalk to charge a car.

    --

    Rick C.

    -++ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
    -++ Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to Phil Hobbs on Sun Jun 5 00:12:41 2022
    On 06/04/2022 09:06 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    IIRC there was a small Audi that came out a bit before the 128, with the
    same layout. Mine had a dash-mounted choke _and_ a dash-mounted
    throttle, so you could do the Italian cruise control thing without
    needing a cinder block to put on the gas pedal. ;)

    I think the first Audi badged car was the F103 derived from a DKW by
    replacing the 2 stroke with a 4 stroke longitudinal engine FWD. I don't
    think it made it to the US. I bought a 100LS in '71 and I think that was
    the first US model before the smaller F80 Fox. It was longitudinal too.

    https://www.thedrive.com/news/36535/this-1975-audi-100-has-a-rare-engine-layout-thats-uncommon-for-a-reason

    https://www.curbsideclassic.com/curbside-classics-european/curbside-classic-1970-audi-100-ls-ingolstadts-table-setter/

    The second link is much longer but has a view of the drive train.
    Everything they say in both articles is true. I almost killed myself
    before I got it sorted out. Not only was it the first FWD car I'd driven
    but the extremely nose heavy weight distribution meant it was happiest
    going in a straight line, telephone poles and maple trees be damned. It
    also had a number of electrical and mechanical issues. When we split my
    wife got the Audi and I got the Lincoln. She later got a few hundred
    bucks on a trade-in for a Rabbit which was a vast improvement.

    I can only assume Audis have greatly improved. Oh, and there were the
    ergonomic seats designed for somebody else's ergo. I've driven
    everything from a $35 '51 Chevy on up to Kenworths and it was the most uncomfortable thing of the pack.

    I'd really went in to buy a Porsche 914 but just sitting in one in the
    showroom convinced me it wouldn't work so I wound up with the Audi. It
    is telling that in '71 it was a mid-sized executive car; today it would
    barely make it into the compact class.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to rbowman on Sun Jun 5 07:12:37 2022
    On Sun, 5 Jun 2022 00:12:41 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/04/2022 09:06 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    IIRC there was a small Audi that came out a bit before the 128, with the
    same layout. Mine had a dash-mounted choke _and_ a dash-mounted
    throttle, so you could do the Italian cruise control thing without
    needing a cinder block to put on the gas pedal. ;)

    I think the first Audi badged car was the F103 derived from a DKW by >replacing the 2 stroke with a 4 stroke longitudinal engine FWD. I don't
    think it made it to the US. I bought a 100LS in '71 and I think that was
    the first US model before the smaller F80 Fox. It was longitudinal too.

    https://www.thedrive.com/news/36535/this-1975-audi-100-has-a-rare-engine-layout-thats-uncommon-for-a-reason

    https://www.curbsideclassic.com/curbside-classics-european/curbside-classic-1970-audi-100-ls-ingolstadts-table-setter/

    The second link is much longer but has a view of the drive train.
    Everything they say in both articles is true. I almost killed myself
    before I got it sorted out. Not only was it the first FWD car I'd driven
    but the extremely nose heavy weight distribution meant it was happiest
    going in a straight line, telephone poles and maple trees be damned. It
    also had a number of electrical and mechanical issues. When we split my
    wife got the Audi and I got the Lincoln. She later got a few hundred
    bucks on a trade-in for a Rabbit which was a vast improvement.

    I can only assume Audis have greatly improved. Oh, and there were the >ergonomic seats designed for somebody else's ergo. I've driven
    everything from a $35 '51 Chevy on up to Kenworths and it was the most >uncomfortable thing of the pack.

    I'd really went in to buy a Porsche 914 but just sitting in one in the >showroom convinced me it wouldn't work so I wound up with the Audi. It
    is telling that in '71 it was a mid-sized executive car; today it would >barely make it into the compact class.

    I think one of the first transverse-4 front-wheel drive cars was the
    Austin America. Innvative but still British.

    https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/austin-america

    The 914 was a killer. The 914/6 would actually do a wheelie. During a
    wheelie, it was hard to steer.

    My MGs had a lot of oversteer (not power oversteer of course!) but
    that was sort of controllable and kinda fun.



    --

    Anybody can count to one.

    - Robert Widlar

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Phil Hobbs@21:1/5 to jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com on Sun Jun 5 12:15:18 2022
    jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Sun, 5 Jun 2022 00:12:41 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/04/2022 09:06 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    IIRC there was a small Audi that came out a bit before the 128, with the >>> same layout. Mine had a dash-mounted choke _and_ a dash-mounted
    throttle, so you could do the Italian cruise control thing without
    needing a cinder block to put on the gas pedal. ;)

    I think the first Audi badged car was the F103 derived from a DKW by
    replacing the 2 stroke with a 4 stroke longitudinal engine FWD. I don't
    think it made it to the US. I bought a 100LS in '71 and I think that was
    the first US model before the smaller F80 Fox. It was longitudinal too.

    https://www.thedrive.com/news/36535/this-1975-audi-100-has-a-rare-engine-layout-thats-uncommon-for-a-reason

    https://www.curbsideclassic.com/curbside-classics-european/curbside-classic-1970-audi-100-ls-ingolstadts-table-setter/

    The second link is much longer but has a view of the drive train.
    Everything they say in both articles is true. I almost killed myself
    before I got it sorted out. Not only was it the first FWD car I'd driven
    but the extremely nose heavy weight distribution meant it was happiest
    going in a straight line, telephone poles and maple trees be damned. It
    also had a number of electrical and mechanical issues. When we split my
    wife got the Audi and I got the Lincoln. She later got a few hundred
    bucks on a trade-in for a Rabbit which was a vast improvement.

    I can only assume Audis have greatly improved. Oh, and there were the
    ergonomic seats designed for somebody else's ergo. I've driven
    everything from a $35 '51 Chevy on up to Kenworths and it was the most
    uncomfortable thing of the pack.

    I'd really went in to buy a Porsche 914 but just sitting in one in the
    showroom convinced me it wouldn't work so I wound up with the Audi. It
    is telling that in '71 it was a mid-sized executive car; today it would
    barely make it into the compact class.

    I think one of the first transverse-4 front-wheel drive cars was the
    Austin America. Innvative but still British.

    https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/austin-america

    The 914 was a killer. The 914/6 would actually do a wheelie. During a wheelie, it was hard to steer.

    My MGs had a lot of oversteer (not power oversteer of course!) but
    that was sort of controllable and kinda fun.

    And of course leaked oil. Everything designed in England in the 1960s
    was legally required to leak oil. The Concorde, the QE2, Triumphs, MGs, Astons, tea pots, garden hosepipes, all of them.

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs
    (Former Triumph owner)

    --
    Dr Philip C D Hobbs
    Principal Consultant
    ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
    Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
    Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

    http://electrooptical.net
    http://hobbs-eo.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical. on Sun Jun 5 10:53:05 2022
    On Sun, 5 Jun 2022 12:15:18 -0400, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

    jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Sun, 5 Jun 2022 00:12:41 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/04/2022 09:06 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    IIRC there was a small Audi that came out a bit before the 128, with the >>>> same layout. Mine had a dash-mounted choke _and_ a dash-mounted
    throttle, so you could do the Italian cruise control thing without
    needing a cinder block to put on the gas pedal. ;)

    I think the first Audi badged car was the F103 derived from a DKW by
    replacing the 2 stroke with a 4 stroke longitudinal engine FWD. I don't
    think it made it to the US. I bought a 100LS in '71 and I think that was >>> the first US model before the smaller F80 Fox. It was longitudinal too.

    https://www.thedrive.com/news/36535/this-1975-audi-100-has-a-rare-engine-layout-thats-uncommon-for-a-reason

    https://www.curbsideclassic.com/curbside-classics-european/curbside-classic-1970-audi-100-ls-ingolstadts-table-setter/

    The second link is much longer but has a view of the drive train.
    Everything they say in both articles is true. I almost killed myself
    before I got it sorted out. Not only was it the first FWD car I'd driven >>> but the extremely nose heavy weight distribution meant it was happiest
    going in a straight line, telephone poles and maple trees be damned. It
    also had a number of electrical and mechanical issues. When we split my
    wife got the Audi and I got the Lincoln. She later got a few hundred
    bucks on a trade-in for a Rabbit which was a vast improvement.

    I can only assume Audis have greatly improved. Oh, and there were the
    ergonomic seats designed for somebody else's ergo. I've driven
    everything from a $35 '51 Chevy on up to Kenworths and it was the most
    uncomfortable thing of the pack.

    I'd really went in to buy a Porsche 914 but just sitting in one in the
    showroom convinced me it wouldn't work so I wound up with the Audi. It
    is telling that in '71 it was a mid-sized executive car; today it would
    barely make it into the compact class.

    I think one of the first transverse-4 front-wheel drive cars was the
    Austin America. Innvative but still British.

    https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/austin-america

    The 914 was a killer. The 914/6 would actually do a wheelie. During a
    wheelie, it was hard to steer.

    My MGs had a lot of oversteer (not power oversteer of course!) but
    that was sort of controllable and kinda fun.

    And of course leaked oil. Everything designed in England in the 1960s
    was legally required to leak oil. The Concorde, the QE2, Triumphs, MGs, >Astons, tea pots, garden hosepipes, all of them.

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs
    (Former Triumph owner)

    Honda made the amazing discovery that a motorcycle crankcase could be
    split horizontally.

    Yamaha and Honda bikes, myself.

    We need a new pick-and-place machine. Our old Universal is getting
    cranky and there is one guy in the USA that can fix it. We'll probably
    get a Yamaha. They also make pianos, motorcycles, outboard motors,
    offroad things, golf clubs, all sorts of stuff.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRtawkNXj5E



    --

    Anybody can count to one.

    - Robert Widlar

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com on Sun Jun 5 14:03:28 2022
    On 06/05/2022 08:12 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    I think one of the first transverse-4 front-wheel drive cars was the
    Austin America. Innvative but still British.

    https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/austin-america

    I may have seen one but it wasn't memorable. I do remember the first
    Mini I saw. It was in Quebec and I was following it wondering what sort
    of thing it was. Then the driver made a right hand turn onto a side road without slowing appreciably and I decided whatever it was it handled
    pretty well.

    The 914 was a killer. The 914/6 would actually do a wheelie. During a wheelie, it was hard to steer.

    Understandable.


    My MGs had a lot of oversteer (not power oversteer of course!) but
    that was sort of controllable and kinda fun.

    My future brother in law was riding in my Sprite one evening making
    disparaging remarks about the roller skate. When he asked how it handled
    I pulled a 180. 'Oh' he said faintly. It may have been the most fun car
    I've owned. Part of the fun was having people watch me extract my over
    6' frame from the car. I found it more comfortable than a friend's A-H
    3000.

    That was my problem with the Audi. I was used to understeering American
    iron but an application of throttle solved the problem. With the Audi
    more throttle just got you to the tree faster.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to Phil Hobbs on Sun Jun 5 14:12:05 2022
    On 06/05/2022 10:15 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Sun, 5 Jun 2022 00:12:41 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/04/2022 09:06 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    IIRC there was a small Audi that came out a bit before the 128, with
    the
    same layout. Mine had a dash-mounted choke _and_ a dash-mounted
    throttle, so you could do the Italian cruise control thing without
    needing a cinder block to put on the gas pedal. ;)

    I think the first Audi badged car was the F103 derived from a DKW by
    replacing the 2 stroke with a 4 stroke longitudinal engine FWD. I don't
    think it made it to the US. I bought a 100LS in '71 and I think that was >>> the first US model before the smaller F80 Fox. It was longitudinal too.

    https://www.thedrive.com/news/36535/this-1975-audi-100-has-a-rare-engine-layout-thats-uncommon-for-a-reason


    https://www.curbsideclassic.com/curbside-classics-european/curbside-classic-1970-audi-100-ls-ingolstadts-table-setter/


    The second link is much longer but has a view of the drive train.
    Everything they say in both articles is true. I almost killed myself
    before I got it sorted out. Not only was it the first FWD car I'd driven >>> but the extremely nose heavy weight distribution meant it was happiest
    going in a straight line, telephone poles and maple trees be damned. It
    also had a number of electrical and mechanical issues. When we split my
    wife got the Audi and I got the Lincoln. She later got a few hundred
    bucks on a trade-in for a Rabbit which was a vast improvement.

    I can only assume Audis have greatly improved. Oh, and there were the
    ergonomic seats designed for somebody else's ergo. I've driven
    everything from a $35 '51 Chevy on up to Kenworths and it was the most
    uncomfortable thing of the pack.

    I'd really went in to buy a Porsche 914 but just sitting in one in the
    showroom convinced me it wouldn't work so I wound up with the Audi. It
    is telling that in '71 it was a mid-sized executive car; today it would
    barely make it into the compact class.

    I think one of the first transverse-4 front-wheel drive cars was the
    Austin America. Innvative but still British.

    https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/austin-america

    The 914 was a killer. The 914/6 would actually do a wheelie. During a
    wheelie, it was hard to steer.

    My MGs had a lot of oversteer (not power oversteer of course!) but
    that was sort of controllable and kinda fun.

    And of course leaked oil. Everything designed in England in the 1960s
    was legally required to leak oil. The Concorde, the QE2, Triumphs, MGs, Astons, tea pots, garden hosepipes, all of them.

    Oil was cheap... The Brits were pining for the days of total loss
    lubrication systems.

    Triumph as in TR3/TR4 or Bonneville? Not that it makes a difference when
    it comes to marking its territory.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com on Sun Jun 5 19:54:25 2022
    On 06/05/2022 11:53 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Sun, 5 Jun 2022 12:15:18 -0400, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

    jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Sun, 5 Jun 2022 00:12:41 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/04/2022 09:06 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    IIRC there was a small Audi that came out a bit before the 128, with the >>>>> same layout. Mine had a dash-mounted choke _and_ a dash-mounted
    throttle, so you could do the Italian cruise control thing without
    needing a cinder block to put on the gas pedal. ;)

    I think the first Audi badged car was the F103 derived from a DKW by
    replacing the 2 stroke with a 4 stroke longitudinal engine FWD. I don't >>>> think it made it to the US. I bought a 100LS in '71 and I think that was >>>> the first US model before the smaller F80 Fox. It was longitudinal too. >>>>
    https://www.thedrive.com/news/36535/this-1975-audi-100-has-a-rare-engine-layout-thats-uncommon-for-a-reason

    https://www.curbsideclassic.com/curbside-classics-european/curbside-classic-1970-audi-100-ls-ingolstadts-table-setter/

    The second link is much longer but has a view of the drive train.
    Everything they say in both articles is true. I almost killed myself
    before I got it sorted out. Not only was it the first FWD car I'd driven >>>> but the extremely nose heavy weight distribution meant it was happiest >>>> going in a straight line, telephone poles and maple trees be damned. It >>>> also had a number of electrical and mechanical issues. When we split my >>>> wife got the Audi and I got the Lincoln. She later got a few hundred
    bucks on a trade-in for a Rabbit which was a vast improvement.

    I can only assume Audis have greatly improved. Oh, and there were the
    ergonomic seats designed for somebody else's ergo. I've driven
    everything from a $35 '51 Chevy on up to Kenworths and it was the most >>>> uncomfortable thing of the pack.

    I'd really went in to buy a Porsche 914 but just sitting in one in the >>>> showroom convinced me it wouldn't work so I wound up with the Audi. It >>>> is telling that in '71 it was a mid-sized executive car; today it would >>>> barely make it into the compact class.

    I think one of the first transverse-4 front-wheel drive cars was the
    Austin America. Innvative but still British.

    https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/austin-america

    The 914 was a killer. The 914/6 would actually do a wheelie. During a
    wheelie, it was hard to steer.

    My MGs had a lot of oversteer (not power oversteer of course!) but
    that was sort of controllable and kinda fun.

    And of course leaked oil. Everything designed in England in the 1960s
    was legally required to leak oil. The Concorde, the QE2, Triumphs, MGs,
    Astons, tea pots, garden hosepipes, all of them.

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs
    (Former Triumph owner)

    Honda made the amazing discovery that a motorcycle crankcase could be
    split horizontally.

    Yamaha and Honda bikes, myself.

    Of the three bikes in the driveway the Harley is the one that doesn't
    leak in some sort of twist of fate. The DR650 needs a chain tensioner
    gasket and the VStrom needs a side cover gasket. I'll admit to munging
    up the VStrom gasket when replacing the stator but it doesn't leak that
    much and serves as a chain oiler.

    I never had a Honda but I did have a Yamaha Seca 400. It was fun in a
    Jeckyl and Hyde sort of way. You could short shift around town and it
    was docile if no powerhouse. At 7500 rpm it went into raped ape mode and
    pulled strong until the redline which iirc was 13,000. The transition
    was like a two-stroke coming onto the pipe but with a lot wider power
    band. People sneer at 400 cc's but it was perfectly capable and
    comfortable for long rides.

    Yamaha also makes guitars; got one hanging on the wall, an old FG-331
    that's my goto 6 string acoustic.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gy1U8Yhsjyg

    Laminated back and sides but it sounds good. After all there's a reason
    the Yamaha logo is crossed tuning forks.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Flyguy@21:1/5 to jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com on Sun Jun 5 19:10:37 2022
    On Friday, June 3, 2022 at 9:35:26 PM UTC-7, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Fri, 3 Jun 2022 22:24:37 -0600, rbowman <bow...@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/03/2022 10:04 AM, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    Mine was an Austin-Healy Sprite. Great fun with the top down,
    mechanically barbaric, fairly easy to fix, which was good given the
    frequency of breakdowns. Kept a tool box in the tiny truck.

    Ah, memories. I had a '62. No bug-eye charm, a slightly larger engine,
    and the semi-adequate brakes from '61. Sudden rain storms were a
    problem. By the time you got the frame out of the trunk, installed it in >the sockets, stretched the top over it, retrieved the side curtains, and >put them in place, you might as well have kept driving.
    Drive above 30 mph or so and the rain barely touches your hair. Just
    don't stop.


    Didn't need jumper cables. I could push it, jump in, and dump the
    clutch to start it. When the clutch worked. I drove from Mt Tam,
    across the GG bridge home, without a clutch. My Filipino GF was
    impressed.

    I ran out of gas a few blocks from home. The city streets were level, so
    I got out, walked beside it and pushed it along with no problem. Until I >got to an intersection where a cop was directing traffic. "Do you
    always take your car for a walk?" At least cops still had a sense of
    humor then.

    I once ran out of gas and coasted about a block into a gas station.
    Really.

    Good planning to run out of gas uphill from a gas station!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Phil Hobbs@21:1/5 to rbowman on Mon Jun 6 11:55:08 2022
    rbowman wrote:
    On 06/05/2022 10:15 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Sun, 5 Jun 2022 00:12:41 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/04/2022 09:06 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    IIRC there was a small Audi that came out a bit before the 128, with >>>>> the
    same layout.  Mine had a dash-mounted choke _and_ a dash-mounted
    throttle, so you could do the Italian cruise control thing without
    needing a cinder block to put on the gas pedal. ;)

    I think the first Audi badged car was the F103 derived from a DKW by
    replacing the 2 stroke with a 4 stroke longitudinal engine FWD. I don't >>>> think it made it to the US. I bought a 100LS in '71 and I think that
    was
    the first US model before the smaller F80 Fox. It was longitudinal too. >>>>
    https://www.thedrive.com/news/36535/this-1975-audi-100-has-a-rare-engine-layout-thats-uncommon-for-a-reason



    https://www.curbsideclassic.com/curbside-classics-european/curbside-classic-1970-audi-100-ls-ingolstadts-table-setter/



    The second link is much longer but has a view of the drive train.
    Everything they say in both articles is true. I almost killed myself
    before I got it sorted out. Not only was it the first FWD car I'd
    driven
    but the extremely nose heavy weight distribution meant it was happiest >>>> going in a straight line, telephone poles and maple trees be damned. It >>>> also had a number of electrical and mechanical issues. When we split my >>>> wife got the Audi and I got the Lincoln. She later got a few hundred
    bucks on a trade-in for a Rabbit which was a vast improvement.

    I can only assume Audis have greatly improved. Oh, and there were the
    ergonomic seats designed for somebody else's ergo. I've driven
    everything from a $35 '51 Chevy on up to Kenworths and it was the most >>>> uncomfortable thing of the pack.

    I'd really went in to buy a Porsche 914 but just sitting in one in the >>>> showroom convinced me it wouldn't work so I wound up with the Audi. It >>>> is telling that in '71 it was a mid-sized executive car; today it would >>>> barely make it into the compact class.

    I think one of the first transverse-4 front-wheel drive cars was the
    Austin America. Innvative but still British.

    https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/austin-america

    The 914 was a killer. The 914/6 would actually do a wheelie. During a
    wheelie, it was hard to steer.

    My MGs had a lot of oversteer (not power oversteer of course!) but
    that was sort of controllable and kinda fun.

    And of course leaked oil.  Everything designed in England in the 1960s
    was legally required to leak oil.  The Concorde, the QE2, Triumphs, MGs,
    Astons, tea pots, garden hosepipes, all of them.

    Oil was cheap...   The Brits were pining for the days of total loss lubrication systems.

    Triumph as in TR3/TR4 or Bonneville? Not that it makes a difference when
    it comes to marking its territory.


    Mine was a TR7 with four- and five-speed transmissions at various times.

    The four was made of glass, so when it went, I had a local shop put a
    5-speed transmission and matching bell housing on. The rear end stayed
    the same, so it needed a Frankenstein drive shaft, which worked fine. I
    sold it when I got married and went to grad school.

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Flyguy@21:1/5 to Phil Hobbs on Mon Jun 6 10:09:37 2022
    On Monday, June 6, 2022 at 8:55:18 AM UTC-7, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    rbowman wrote:
    On 06/05/2022 10:15 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Sun, 5 Jun 2022 00:12:41 -0600, rbowman <bow...@montana.com> wrote: >>>
    On 06/04/2022 09:06 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    IIRC there was a small Audi that came out a bit before the 128, with >>>>> the
    same layout. Mine had a dash-mounted choke _and_ a dash-mounted
    throttle, so you could do the Italian cruise control thing without >>>>> needing a cinder block to put on the gas pedal. ;)

    I think the first Audi badged car was the F103 derived from a DKW by >>>> replacing the 2 stroke with a 4 stroke longitudinal engine FWD. I don't >>>> think it made it to the US. I bought a 100LS in '71 and I think that >>>> was
    the first US model before the smaller F80 Fox. It was longitudinal too. >>>>
    https://www.thedrive.com/news/36535/this-1975-audi-100-has-a-rare-engine-layout-thats-uncommon-for-a-reason



    https://www.curbsideclassic.com/curbside-classics-european/curbside-classic-1970-audi-100-ls-ingolstadts-table-setter/



    The second link is much longer but has a view of the drive train.
    Everything they say in both articles is true. I almost killed myself >>>> before I got it sorted out. Not only was it the first FWD car I'd
    driven
    but the extremely nose heavy weight distribution meant it was happiest >>>> going in a straight line, telephone poles and maple trees be damned. It >>>> also had a number of electrical and mechanical issues. When we split my >>>> wife got the Audi and I got the Lincoln. She later got a few hundred >>>> bucks on a trade-in for a Rabbit which was a vast improvement.

    I can only assume Audis have greatly improved. Oh, and there were the >>>> ergonomic seats designed for somebody else's ergo. I've driven
    everything from a $35 '51 Chevy on up to Kenworths and it was the most >>>> uncomfortable thing of the pack.

    I'd really went in to buy a Porsche 914 but just sitting in one in the >>>> showroom convinced me it wouldn't work so I wound up with the Audi. It >>>> is telling that in '71 it was a mid-sized executive car; today it would >>>> barely make it into the compact class.

    I think one of the first transverse-4 front-wheel drive cars was the
    Austin America. Innvative but still British.

    https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/austin-america

    The 914 was a killer. The 914/6 would actually do a wheelie. During a >>> wheelie, it was hard to steer.

    My MGs had a lot of oversteer (not power oversteer of course!) but
    that was sort of controllable and kinda fun.

    And of course leaked oil. Everything designed in England in the 1960s
    was legally required to leak oil. The Concorde, the QE2, Triumphs, MGs, >> Astons, tea pots, garden hosepipes, all of them.

    Oil was cheap... The Brits were pining for the days of total loss lubrication systems.

    Triumph as in TR3/TR4 or Bonneville? Not that it makes a difference when it comes to marking its territory.


    Mine was a TR7 with four- and five-speed transmissions at various times.

    The four was made of glass, so when it went, I had a local shop put a 5-speed transmission and matching bell housing on. The rear end stayed
    the same, so it needed a Frankenstein drive shaft, which worked fine. I
    sold it when I got married and went to grad school.

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs

    This is an article about an actual cross-country road trip in an EV (https://www.wsj.com/articles/i-rented-an-electric-car-for-a-four-day-road-trip-i-spent-more-time-charging-it-than-i-did-sleeping-11654268401?page=1):

    I thought it would be fun.

    That’s what I told my friend Mack when I asked her to drive with me from New Orleans to Chicago and back in an electric car.

    I’d made long road trips before, surviving popped tires, blown headlights and shredded wheel-well liners in my 2008 Volkswagen Jetta. I figured driving the brand-new Kia EV6 I’d rented would be a piece of cake.

    If, that is, the public-charging infrastructure cooperated. We wouldn’t be the first to test it. Sales of pure and hybrid plug-ins doubled in the U.S. last year to 656,866—over 4% of the total market, according to database EV-volumes. More than half
    of car buyers say they want their next car to be an EV, according to recent Ernst & Young Global Ltd. data.

    BY THE NUMBERS
    Our reporter’s four-day, three-night EV road trip included many charging stops, little sleep—and less junk food than you might expect

    Miles driven: 2,013
    Number of charges: 14
    Total charging cost: $175
    Hours spent waiting to charge: 18
    Hours of sleep: 16
    Calories of junk food consumed (estimated): 1,465
    Giant chicken statues passed: 1
    Oh—and we aimed to make the 2,000-mile trip in just under four days so Mack could make her Thursday-afternoon shift as a restaurant server.

    Given our battery range of up to 310 miles, I plotted a meticulous route, splitting our days into four chunks of roughly 7½-hours each. We’d need to charge once or twice each day and plug in near our hotel overnight.

    The PlugShare app—a user-generated map of public chargers—showed thousands of charging options between New Orleans and Chicago. But most were classified as Level 2, requiring around 8 hours for a full charge.

    While we’d be fine overnight, we required fast chargers during the days. ChargePoint Holdings Inc., which manufactures and maintains many fast-charging stations, promises an 80% charge in 20 to 30 minutes. Longer than stopping for gas—but good for a
    bite or bathroom break.

    The government is spending $5 billion to build a nationwide network of fast chargers, which means thousands more should soon dot major highways. For now, though, fast chargers tend to be located in parking lots of suburban shopping malls, or tethered to
    gas stations or car dealerships.

    Cost varies widely based on factors such as local electricity prices and charger brands. Charging at home tends to be cheaper than using a public charger, though some businesses offer free juice as a perk to existing customers or to entice drivers to
    come inside while they wait.

    Over four days, we spent $175 on charging. We estimated the equivalent cost for gas in a Kia Forte would have been $275, based on the AAA average national gas price for May 19. That $100 savings cost us many hours in waiting time.

    But that’s not the whole story.

    New Orleans, our starting point, has exactly zero fast chargers, according to PlugShare. As we set out, one of the closest is at a Harley-Davidson dealership in Slidell, La., about 40 minutes away. So we use our Monday-morning breakfast stop to top off
    there on the way out of town.

    But when we tick down 15% over 35 miles? Disconcerting. And the estimated charging time after plugging in? Even more so. This “quick charge” should take 5 minutes, based on our calculations. So why does the dashboard tell us it will take an hour?

    “Maybe it’s just warming up,” I say to Mack. “Maybe it’s broken?” she says.

    Over Egg McMuffins at McDonald’s, we check Google. Chargers slow down when the battery is 80% full, the State of Charge YouTube channel tells us.

    Worried about time, we decide to unplug once we return to the car, despite gaining a measly 13% in 40 minutes.

    Our real troubles begin when we can’t find the wall-mounted charger at the Kia dealership in Meridian, Miss., the state’s seventh-largest city and hometown of country-music legend Jimmie Rodgers.

    When I ask a mechanic working on an SUV a few feet away for help, he says he doesn’t know anything about the machine and points us inside. At the front desk, the receptionist asks if we’ve checked with a technician and sends us back outside.

    Not many people use the charger, the mechanic tells us when we return. We soon see why. Once up and running, our dashboard tells us a full charge, from 18% to 100%, will take 3-plus hours.

    It turns out not all “fast chargers” live up to the name. The biggest variable, according to State of Charge, is how many kilowatts a unit can churn out in an hour. To be considered “fast,” a charger must be capable of about 24 kW. The fastest
    chargers can pump out up to 350. Our charger in Meridian claims to meet that standard, but it has trouble cracking 20.

    “Even among DC fast chargers, there are different level chargers with different charging speeds,” a ChargePoint spokeswoman says.

    Worse, it is a 30-minute walk to downtown restaurants. We set off on foot, passing warehouses with shattered windows and an overgrown lot filled with rusted fuel pumps and gas-station signs. Clambering over a flatcar of a stalled freight train, we half-
    wish we could hop a boxcar to Chicago.

    By the time we reach our next station, at a Mercedes-Benz dealership outside Birmingham, Ala., we’ve already missed our dinner reservations in Nashville—still 200 miles away.

    Here, at least, the estimated charging time is only an hour—and we get to make use of two automatic massage chairs while we wait.

    Salesman Kurt Long tells us the dealership upgraded its chargers to 54-kW models a few weeks earlier when the 2022 Mercedes EQS-Class arrived.

    “Everyone’s concern is how far can the cars go on a charge,” he says. He adds that he would trade in his car for an EV tomorrow if he could afford the $102,000 price tag. “Just because it would be convenient for me because I work here,” he says.
    “Otherwise, I don’t know if I would just yet.”

    A customer who has just bought a new BMW says he’d consider an EV one day—if the price drops.

    “You remember when the microwave came out? Or DVD players?” says Dennis Boatwright, a 58-year-old tree surgeon. “When you first get them the prices were real high, but the older they are, the cheaper they get.”

    When we tell him about our trip, he asks if we’ll make it to Chicago.

    “We’re hoping,” I say.

    “I’m hoping, too,” he says.

    After the Birmingham suburbs, our journey takes us along nightmarish, dark mountain roads. We stop for snacks at a gas station featuring a giant chicken in a chef’s costume. We lean heavily on cruise control, which helps conserve battery life by
    reducing inadvertent acceleration and deceleration. We are beat when we finally stumble into our Nashville hotel at 12:30 a.m.

    To get back on schedule, we are up and out early, amid pouring rain, writing the previous day off as a warm-up, an electric-car hazing.

    For the most part, we are right. Thanks to vastly better charging infrastructure on this leg, all our stops last less than an hour.

    It isn’t all smooth sailing, though. At one point we find ourselves wandering through a Kroger, sopping wet, in search of coffee after wrestling with a particularly finicky charger in the rain. By this point, not once have we managed to back in close
    enough to reach the pump, or gotten the stiff cord hooked around the right way on the first try.

    In the parking lot of a Clarksville, Ind., Walmart, we barely have time for lunch, as the Electrify America charging station fills up our battery in about 25 minutes, as advertised.

    The woman charging next to us describes a harrowing recent trip in her Volkswagen ID.4. Deborah Carrico, 65, had to be towed twice while driving between her Louisville, Ky., apartment and Boulder, Colo., where her daughter was getting married.

    “My daughter was like, ‘You’ve lost it mom; just fly,’ ” the retired hairdresser says. She says she felt safer in a car during the pandemic—but also vulnerable when waiting at remote charging stations alone late at night. “But if someone is
    going to get me, they’re going to have to really fight me,” she says, wielding her key between her fingers like a weapon.

    While she loves embracing the future, she says, her family has been giving her so much pushback that she is considering trading the car in and going back to gas.

    At another Walmart, in Indianapolis, we meet Bill Stempowski as he waits for his Ford Mustang Mach-E to charge. A medical-equipment operations manager, 45, he drives all over the Midwest from his home in LaGrange, Ohio, for work.

    In nine months, he says, he’s put 30,000 miles on the car and figures he’s saved thousands on gas. “I smile as the gas-sign prices tick up,” he says. That day, his charge comes to about $15, similar to what we are paying to fill up.

    We pull into Chicago at 9 p.m., having made the planned 7½-hour trip in 12 hours. Not bad, we agree.

    ‘What if we just risk it?’
    Leaving Chicago after a full night of sleep, I tell Mack I might write only about the journey’s first half. “The rest will just be the same,” I predict, as thunder claps ominously overhead.

    “Don’t say that!” she says. “We’re at the mercy of this goddamn spaceship.” She still hasn’t mastered the lie-flat door handles after three days.

    As intense wind and rain whip around us, the car cautions, “Conditions have not been met” for its cruise-control system. Soon the battery starts bleeding life. What began as a 100-mile cushion between Chicago and our planned first stop in Effingham,
    Ill., has fallen to 30.

    “If it gets down to 10, we’re stopping at a Level 2,” Mack says as she frantically searches PlugShare.

    We feel defeated pulling into a Nissan Mazda dealership in Mattoon, Ill. “How long could it possibly take to charge the 30 miles we need to make it to the next fast station?” I wonder.

    Three hours. It takes 3 hours.

    I begin to lose my mind as I set out in search of gas-station doughnuts, the wind driving sheets of rain into my face.

    Seated atop a pyramid of Smirnoff Ice 12-packs, Little Debbie powdered sugar sprinkled down the pajama shirt I haven’t removed in three days, I phone Mack. “What if we just risk it?” I say. “Maybe we’ll make it there on electrical fumes.”

    “That’s a terrible idea!” she says, before asking me to bring back a bag of nuts.

    ‘Charge, Urgently!’
    Back on the road, we can’t even make it 200 miles on a full charge en route to Miner, Mo. Clearly, tornado warnings and electric cars don’t mix. The car’s highway range actually seems worse than its range in cities.

    Indeed, highway driving doesn’t benefit as much from the car’s regenerative-braking technology—which uses energy generated in slowing down to help a car recharge its battery—Kia spokesman James Bell tells me later. He suspects our car is the less-
    expensive EV6 model with a range not of 310 miles, as listed on Turo, but 250. He says he can’t be sure what model we were driving without physically inspecting the car.

    “As we have all learned over many years of experience with internal combustion engine vehicles, factors such as average highway speed, altitude changes, and total cargo weight can all impact range, whether derived from a tank of gasoline or a fully
    charged battery,” he says.

    To save power, we turn off the car’s cooling system and the radio, unplug our phones and lower the windshield wipers to the lowest possible setting while still being able to see. Three miles away from the station, we have one mile of estimated range.

    “Charge, Urgently!” the dashboard urges. “We know!” we respond.

    At zero miles, we fly screeching into a gas-station parking lot. A trash can goes flying and lands with a clatter to greet us. Dinner is beef jerky, our plans to dine at a kitschy beauty shop-turned-restaurant in Memphis long gone.

    Then we start to argue. Mack reminds me she needs to be back in time for her shift the next day. There’s no way we’ll make it, I tell her.

    “Should we just drive straight through to New Orleans?” I finally ask desperately, even as I realize I’ve failed to map out the last 400 miles of our route.

    To scout our options, Mack calls a McDonald’s in Winona, Miss., that is home to one of the few fast chargers along our route back to New Orleans. PlugShare tells us the last user has reported the charger broken. An employee who picks up reasonably
    responds that given the rain, she’ll pass on checking to see if an error message is flashing across the charger’s screen.

    Home, sweet $4-a-gallon home
    At our hotel, we decide 4 hours of sleep is better than none, and set our alarms for 4 a.m.

    We figure 11 hours should be plenty for a trip that would normally take half as long. That is, if absolutely everything goes right.

    Miraculously, it does. At the McDonald’s where we stop for our first charge at 6 a.m., the charger zaps to life. The body shop and parts department director at Rogers-Dabbs Chevrolet in Brandon, Miss., comes out to unlock the charger for us with a
    keycard at 10 a.m. We’re thrilled we waited for business hours, realizing we can only charge while he’s there.

    We pull into New Orleans 30 minutes before Mack’s shift starts—exhausted and grumpy.

    The following week, I fill up my Jetta at a local Shell station. Gas is up to $4.08 a gallon.

    I inhale deeply. Fumes never smelled so sweet.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John Larkin@21:1/5 to All on Mon Jun 6 10:19:08 2022
    On Sat, 04 Jun 2022 09:23:36 -0700, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com
    wrote:

    On Fri, 3 Jun 2022 22:32:45 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/03/2022 12:21 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Thu, 2 Jun 2022 22:16:02 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

    On 06/02/2022 07:43 AM, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Wed, 1 Jun 2022 20:36:47 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote: >>>>>
    On 06/01/2022 09:48 AM, bitrex wrote:
    On 5/30/2022 1:56 PM, ke...@kjwdesigns.com wrote:
    On Sunday, 29 May 2022 at 20:20:21 UTC-7, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the >>>>>>>>>> speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast >>>>>>>>>> speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who >>>>>>>>>> know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up: the EV record >>>>>>>>>> for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an >>>>>>>>>> average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record

    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m >>>>>>>>>> with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge
    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated >>>>>>>>> with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For
    FREE!

    Actually, the beauty of electric propulsion is that you get much >>>>>>>> smoother acceleration and deceleration than with a conventional vehicle.

    In most circumstances I don't wait for the car to charge at all, it >>>>>>>> charges while I'm asleep or doing something else.

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that >>>>>>>>> occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    The aesthetics of many modern EVs are hardly distinguishable from >>>>>>>> conventional vehicles as they have the same goals and we've already >>>>>>>> posted evidence that conventional vehicles are much more likely to >>>>>>>> catch fire than EVs.
    ...
    kw

    It's unfair to single out EVs when most vehicles sold are pretty ugly. >>>>>>>
    The crossover/CUV form factor seems particularly refractory to doing >>>>>>> anything very aesthetically pleasing with. How would you like your >>>>>>> rollerskate?

    For my money some of the 'aggressive' front end treatments look like the >>>>>> car was pre-wrecked.

    And silly side creases. And random slabs of chrome. And bizarre rear >>>>> lights.

    Don't get me started on Volvos.




    Someone at work drove a Subaru Forester. I knew the car but every time I >>>> saw it I had to convince myself it hadn't been sideswiped. There was
    something about the panels that looked bent.

    Maybe a tree fell on it.


    Never can tell around here. A friend was out getting firewood and
    reasoned if he fell a tree on the upside of the road he could saw
    lengths off and roll them down to the road. Worked well until one log >>bounced off a rock, altered course, and took out the front quarter of
    his pickup.

    Youtube has lots of flics of idiots with chainsaws.

    Our city version: we were driving uphill on Swiss Street and a
    driverless recycling wheelie bin was screaming down the street at us.
    Last second, it changed its mind and swerved into a parked car.


    Around here there are a lot of comedy routines about the economics of >>burning 'free' firewood.

    I just came back from three days up at the cabin in Truckee, one day
    without power. Life is different without electricity.

    A few cabins up the block, a tree fell in a windstorm. It slammed the
    power line and sent a shock wave down the block. That propagated to us
    and tugged on the roughly 100 foot tap-off from the street to our
    cabin. It ripped the fascia off the roofline and dumped the power,
    cable, and POTS wires on the ground.

    I could model that in Spice.

    https://www.dropbox.com/sh/lt38qw0yxrulr6v/AABtcYQNALQjZFqOfHV291dea?dl=0

    A Spice transmission line has one mode. A real wire has lots of
    mechanical modes: horizontal, vertical, longitudinal, twist. That
    would be hard to Spice.

    --

    If a man will begin with certainties, he shall end with doubts,
    but if he will be content to begin with doubts he shall end in certainties. Francis Bacon

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From rbowman@21:1/5 to Phil Hobbs on Mon Jun 6 23:02:58 2022
    On 06/06/2022 09:55 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    rbowman wrote:
    On 06/05/2022 10:15 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Sun, 5 Jun 2022 00:12:41 -0600, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote: >>>>
    On 06/04/2022 09:06 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    IIRC there was a small Audi that came out a bit before the 128, with >>>>>> the
    same layout. Mine had a dash-mounted choke _and_ a dash-mounted
    throttle, so you could do the Italian cruise control thing without >>>>>> needing a cinder block to put on the gas pedal. ;)

    I think the first Audi badged car was the F103 derived from a DKW by >>>>> replacing the 2 stroke with a 4 stroke longitudinal engine FWD. I
    don't
    think it made it to the US. I bought a 100LS in '71 and I think
    that was
    the first US model before the smaller F80 Fox. It was longitudinal
    too.

    https://www.thedrive.com/news/36535/this-1975-audi-100-has-a-rare-engine-layout-thats-uncommon-for-a-reason



    https://www.curbsideclassic.com/curbside-classics-european/curbside-classic-1970-audi-100-ls-ingolstadts-table-setter/



    The second link is much longer but has a view of the drive train.
    Everything they say in both articles is true. I almost killed myself >>>>> before I got it sorted out. Not only was it the first FWD car I'd
    driven
    but the extremely nose heavy weight distribution meant it was happiest >>>>> going in a straight line, telephone poles and maple trees be
    damned. It
    also had a number of electrical and mechanical issues. When we
    split my
    wife got the Audi and I got the Lincoln. She later got a few hundred >>>>> bucks on a trade-in for a Rabbit which was a vast improvement.

    I can only assume Audis have greatly improved. Oh, and there were the >>>>> ergonomic seats designed for somebody else's ergo. I've driven
    everything from a $35 '51 Chevy on up to Kenworths and it was the most >>>>> uncomfortable thing of the pack.

    I'd really went in to buy a Porsche 914 but just sitting in one in the >>>>> showroom convinced me it wouldn't work so I wound up with the Audi. It >>>>> is telling that in '71 it was a mid-sized executive car; today it
    would
    barely make it into the compact class.

    I think one of the first transverse-4 front-wheel drive cars was the
    Austin America. Innvative but still British.

    https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/austin-america

    The 914 was a killer. The 914/6 would actually do a wheelie. During a
    wheelie, it was hard to steer.

    My MGs had a lot of oversteer (not power oversteer of course!) but
    that was sort of controllable and kinda fun.

    And of course leaked oil. Everything designed in England in the 1960s
    was legally required to leak oil. The Concorde, the QE2, Triumphs, MGs, >>> Astons, tea pots, garden hosepipes, all of them.

    Oil was cheap... The Brits were pining for the days of total loss
    lubrication systems.

    Triumph as in TR3/TR4 or Bonneville? Not that it makes a difference
    when it comes to marking its territory.


    Mine was a TR7 with four- and five-speed transmissions at various times.

    The four was made of glass, so when it went, I had a local shop put a
    5-speed transmission and matching bell housing on. The rear end stayed
    the same, so it needed a Frankenstein drive shaft, which worked fine. I
    sold it when I got married and went to grad school.

    I lusted after the TR3. Like the MGA to MGB I thought they lost their
    charm when they tried to modernize. The MGA's were nice but the TR3's
    were a little faster. For real style there were the MG TD's but they
    were barely road worthy.

    I almost bought a MGA but my father noticed all 4 wheels weren't exactly pointed in the same direction.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ricky@21:1/5 to rbowman on Tue Jun 7 20:11:25 2022
    On Tuesday, June 7, 2022 at 1:03:08 AM UTC-4, rbowman wrote:
    On 06/06/2022 09:55 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    rbowman wrote:
    On 06/05/2022 10:15 AM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Sun, 5 Jun 2022 00:12:41 -0600, rbowman <bow...@montana.com> wrote: >>>>
    On 06/04/2022 09:06 PM, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    IIRC there was a small Audi that came out a bit before the 128, with >>>>>> the
    same layout. Mine had a dash-mounted choke _and_ a dash-mounted >>>>>> throttle, so you could do the Italian cruise control thing without >>>>>> needing a cinder block to put on the gas pedal. ;)

    I think the first Audi badged car was the F103 derived from a DKW by >>>>> replacing the 2 stroke with a 4 stroke longitudinal engine FWD. I >>>>> don't
    think it made it to the US. I bought a 100LS in '71 and I think
    that was
    the first US model before the smaller F80 Fox. It was longitudinal >>>>> too.

    https://www.thedrive.com/news/36535/this-1975-audi-100-has-a-rare-engine-layout-thats-uncommon-for-a-reason



    https://www.curbsideclassic.com/curbside-classics-european/curbside-classic-1970-audi-100-ls-ingolstadts-table-setter/



    The second link is much longer but has a view of the drive train. >>>>> Everything they say in both articles is true. I almost killed myself >>>>> before I got it sorted out. Not only was it the first FWD car I'd >>>>> driven
    but the extremely nose heavy weight distribution meant it was happiest >>>>> going in a straight line, telephone poles and maple trees be
    damned. It
    also had a number of electrical and mechanical issues. When we
    split my
    wife got the Audi and I got the Lincoln. She later got a few hundred >>>>> bucks on a trade-in for a Rabbit which was a vast improvement.

    I can only assume Audis have greatly improved. Oh, and there were the >>>>> ergonomic seats designed for somebody else's ergo. I've driven
    everything from a $35 '51 Chevy on up to Kenworths and it was the most >>>>> uncomfortable thing of the pack.

    I'd really went in to buy a Porsche 914 but just sitting in one in the >>>>> showroom convinced me it wouldn't work so I wound up with the Audi. It >>>>> is telling that in '71 it was a mid-sized executive car; today it >>>>> would
    barely make it into the compact class.

    I think one of the first transverse-4 front-wheel drive cars was the >>>> Austin America. Innvative but still British.

    https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/austin-america

    The 914 was a killer. The 914/6 would actually do a wheelie. During a >>>> wheelie, it was hard to steer.

    My MGs had a lot of oversteer (not power oversteer of course!) but
    that was sort of controllable and kinda fun.

    And of course leaked oil. Everything designed in England in the 1960s >>> was legally required to leak oil. The Concorde, the QE2, Triumphs, MGs, >>> Astons, tea pots, garden hosepipes, all of them.

    Oil was cheap... The Brits were pining for the days of total loss
    lubrication systems.

    Triumph as in TR3/TR4 or Bonneville? Not that it makes a difference
    when it comes to marking its territory.


    Mine was a TR7 with four- and five-speed transmissions at various times.

    The four was made of glass, so when it went, I had a local shop put a 5-speed transmission and matching bell housing on. The rear end stayed
    the same, so it needed a Frankenstein drive shaft, which worked fine. I sold it when I got married and went to grad school.

    I lusted after the TR3. Like the MGA to MGB I thought they lost their
    charm when they tried to modernize. The MGA's were nice but the TR3's
    were a little faster. For real style there were the MG TD's but they
    were barely road worthy.

    I almost bought a MGA but my father noticed all 4 wheels weren't exactly pointed in the same direction.

    My brother had an MGA and an MGB-GT. The MGA has aluminum trunk, and possibly hood. It was hard to get paint to stick to them because people didn't know what they were doing at that time. I remember seeing the paint chip off the trunk in large pieces.
    I don't remember it being all that fast really. It did corner like it was on rails though. So you didn't have to slow down as much.

    --

    Rick C.

    +-- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
    +-- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From David Eather@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Wed Jun 8 18:53:57 2022
    On 30/05/2022 1:20 pm, John Larkin wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up:
    the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For
    FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.




    Someone chooses a trip virtually no one does, in a way no one does, so
    is irrelevant to virtually all drivers, to use as a benchmark and says
    "see I told you it was no good". That makes no sense at all.

    And if you were going cross country it makes more sense to fly and then
    rent a car at destination.

    The lock you out thing and catching fire is a bit more, lets say
    "inconvenient" - but I'd like to look at the data first to see how often
    per hour driven compared to other vehicles.

    We used to have a thing in this country (the land of Oz) where every
    time a car with LPG was in an accident it made the news, so giving the impression they were unsafe. Checking the data in states with a decent installation standard (not all states at the time) revealed they were
    just as safe as any other car.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Don Y@21:1/5 to David Eather on Wed Jun 8 06:09:12 2022
    On 6/8/2022 1:53 AM, David Eather wrote:
    Someone chooses a trip virtually no one does, in a way no one does, so is irrelevant to virtually all drivers, to use as a benchmark and says "see I told
    you it was no good". That makes no sense at all.

    Sort of like flying ANYWHERE solo.

    And if you were going cross country it makes more sense to fly and then rent a
    car at destination.

    Unless you were making a poor-man's *delivery* of said vehicle (someone
    too cheap to have it shipped)

    The lock you out thing and catching fire is a bit more, lets say "inconvenient"
    - but I'd like to look at the data first to see how often per hour driven compared to other vehicles.

    I wonder how often folks misplace their keys! Surely that's an argument against locks on cars! <grin>

    We used to have a thing in this country (the land of Oz) where every time a car
    with LPG was in an accident it made the news, so giving the impression they were unsafe. Checking the data in states with a decent installation standard (not all states at the time) revealed they were just as safe as any other car.

    Sort of like the coverage given to aircraft "disasters" making them seem
    like a dreadfully risky way of traveling -- yet driving a car is considerably riskier. And, closer to home!

    People choose data/events to reinforce their opinions. (ever been to a casino and listen to all the "theories" about how/when a player EXPECTS to win?) Statisticians (and, more importantly, actuaries) just look at the numbers.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From David Eather@21:1/5 to Don Y on Thu Jun 9 23:02:57 2022
    On 8/06/2022 11:09 pm, Don Y wrote:
    On 6/8/2022 1:53 AM, David Eather wrote:
    Someone chooses a trip virtually no one does, in a way no one does, so
    is irrelevant to virtually all drivers, to use as a benchmark and says
    "see I told you it was no good". That makes no sense at all.

    Sort of like flying ANYWHERE solo.

    Business trips?


    And if you were going cross country it makes more sense to fly and
    then rent a car at destination.

    Unless you were making a poor-man's *delivery* of said vehicle (someone
    too cheap to have it shipped)

    "Someone chooses a trip *virtually* no one does"

    The lock you out thing and catching fire is a bit more, lets say
    "inconvenient" - but I'd like to look at the data first to see how
    often per hour driven compared to other vehicles.

    I wonder how often folks misplace their keys!  Surely that's an argument against locks on cars!  <grin>

    We used to have a thing in this country (the land of Oz) where every
    time a car with LPG was in an accident it made the news, so giving the
    impression they were unsafe. Checking the data in states with a decent
    installation standard (not all states at the time) revealed they were
    just as safe as any other car.

    Sort of like the coverage given to aircraft "disasters" making them seem
    like a dreadfully risky way of traveling -- yet driving a car is
    considerably
    riskier.  And, closer to home!

    People choose data/events to reinforce their opinions.  (ever been to a casino
    and listen to all the "theories" about how/when a player EXPECTS to win?) Statisticians (and, more importantly, actuaries) just look at the numbers.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Don Y@21:1/5 to David Eather on Fri Jun 10 12:48:31 2022
    On 6/9/2022 6:02 AM, David Eather wrote:
    On 8/06/2022 11:09 pm, Don Y wrote:
    On 6/8/2022 1:53 AM, David Eather wrote:
    Someone chooses a trip virtually no one does, in a way no one does, so is >>> irrelevant to virtually all drivers, to use as a benchmark and says "see I >>> told you it was no good". That makes no sense at all.

    Sort of like flying ANYWHERE solo.

    Business trips?

    You'd fly a private aircraft, with no other passengers, just to
    attend a "business trip"? I'd rather assume you'd fly *commercial*
    and not bother dealing with the hassle of filing a flight plan,
    fueling the vehicle, etc.

    And if you were going cross country it makes more sense to fly and then rent
    a car at destination.

    Unless you were making a poor-man's *delivery* of said vehicle (someone
    too cheap to have it shipped)

    "Someone chooses a trip *virtually* no one does"

    Lots of people hire folks to drive vehicle cross country -- or do so themselves.

    <https://nationwideautotransportation.com/blog/drive-away-service/> <https://www.gonomad.com/1562-drive-across-the-usa-with-auto-driveaway-cars> <https://www.dollarbreak.com/get-paid-to-drive-cars-across-country/>

    I suspect it is cheaper (and possibly less of a hassle) than
    shipping a vehicle. And, much more convenient than driving it,
    yourself.

    But, driving across the country in an effort to see how QUICKLY
    you can do it is truly something that DAMN NEAR NOONE does!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Cydrome Leader@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Sun Jun 12 18:48:10 2022
    John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:
    On Sun, 29 May 2022 19:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Flyguy
    <soar2morrow@yahoo.com> wrote:

    Under the Tesla is Fast thread I posited the question of what the speed would be of an EV run in the Cannonball Run (coast to coast speed run). NO ONE answered! Not even the hardcore EV fanatics who know everything about EVERYTHING. So, I looked it up:
    the EV record for the Cannonball Run is held by a Tesla at 51 h 47 m with an average speed of 56 mph:
    https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/9/15938028/tesla-model-s-cannonball-run-record
    The current fossil fuel record is HALF of that time at 25 h 39 m with an average speed of 110 mph:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannonball_Run_challenge

    You just don't appreciate the charm of insane acceleration alternated
    with frantic braking and then waiting a couple of hours to charge. For
    FREE!

    And you don't understand how hip it is to drive an ugly car that
    occasionally locks you out and catches fire.

    But they look like a ransom notes. None of panels, trim, pillars or even windows line up on a tesla. They must be assembled by blind folks with
    nerve damaged to their hands.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From David Eather@21:1/5 to Don Y on Wed Jun 15 10:43:09 2022
    On 11/06/2022 5:48 am, Don Y wrote:
    On 6/9/2022 6:02 AM, David Eather wrote:
    On 8/06/2022 11:09 pm, Don Y wrote:
    On 6/8/2022 1:53 AM, David Eather wrote:
    Someone chooses a trip virtually no one does, in a way no one does,
    so is irrelevant to virtually all drivers, to use as a benchmark and
    says "see I told you it was no good". That makes no sense at all.

    Sort of like flying ANYWHERE solo.

    Business trips?

    You'd fly a private aircraft, with no other passengers, just to
    attend a "business trip"?  I'd rather assume you'd fly *commercial*
    and not bother dealing with the hassle of filing a flight plan,
    fueling the vehicle, etc.


    Me? No. But there are people who do.

    And if you were going cross country it makes more sense to fly and
    then rent a car at destination.

    Unless you were making a poor-man's *delivery* of said vehicle (someone
    too cheap to have it shipped)

    "Someone chooses a trip *virtually* no one does"

    Lots of people hire folks to drive vehicle cross country -- or do so themselves.

    <https://nationwideautotransportation.com/blog/drive-away-service/> <https://www.gonomad.com/1562-drive-across-the-usa-with-auto-driveaway-cars>

    <https://www.dollarbreak.com/get-paid-to-drive-cars-across-country/>

    I suspect it is cheaper (and possibly less of a hassle) than
    shipping a vehicle.  And, much more convenient than driving it,
    yourself.

    But, driving across the country in an effort to see how QUICKLY
    you can do it is truly something that DAMN NEAR NOONE does!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Don Y@21:1/5 to David Eather on Tue Jun 14 17:53:12 2022
    On 6/14/2022 5:43 PM, David Eather wrote:
    On 11/06/2022 5:48 am, Don Y wrote:
    On 6/9/2022 6:02 AM, David Eather wrote:
    On 8/06/2022 11:09 pm, Don Y wrote:
    On 6/8/2022 1:53 AM, David Eather wrote:
    Someone chooses a trip virtually no one does, in a way no one does, so is >>>>> irrelevant to virtually all drivers, to use as a benchmark and says "see I
    told you it was no good". That makes no sense at all.

    Sort of like flying ANYWHERE solo.

    Business trips?

    You'd fly a private aircraft, with no other passengers, just to
    attend a "business trip"? I'd rather assume you'd fly *commercial*
    and not bother dealing with the hassle of filing a flight plan,
    fueling the vehicle, etc.


    Me? No. But there are people who do.

    I.e., "a trip virtually no one does, in a way no one does"?

    And if you were going cross country it makes more sense to fly and then >>>>> rent a car at destination.

    Unless you were making a poor-man's *delivery* of said vehicle (someone >>>> too cheap to have it shipped)

    "Someone chooses a trip *virtually* no one does"

    Lots of people hire folks to drive vehicle cross country -- or do so
    themselves.

    <https://nationwideautotransportation.com/blog/drive-away-service/>
    <https://www.gonomad.com/1562-drive-across-the-usa-with-auto-driveaway-cars> >> <https://www.dollarbreak.com/get-paid-to-drive-cars-across-country/>

    I suspect it is cheaper (and possibly less of a hassle) than
    shipping a vehicle. And, much more convenient than driving it,
    yourself.

    But, driving across the country in an effort to see how QUICKLY
    you can do it is truly something that DAMN NEAR NOONE does!


    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)