• SLS weighs 10X Statue of Liberty

    From Mike Monett@21:1/5 to All on Fri Apr 8 13:50:55 2022
    Interesting to note NASA's Space Launch System, the first moon rocket in 50 years, weighs 10 times the Statue of Liberty.

    How much does SLS weigh?

    5.75 million lbs
    5.75e6/2000 = 2,875 tons

    NASA's Space Launch System, or SLS, is ... Offering the highest-ever
    payload mass and volume ... feet tall, higher than the Statue of
    Liberty.

    How much does the Statue of Liberty weigh in total?

    450,000 pounds
    450e3/2000 = 225 tons

    The famed Statue of Liberty, located in New York harbor was
    officially dedicated on October 28, 1886. The Statue has a 35-foot
    waistline and weighs 450,000 pounds. Some facts: Total overall
    height from the base of the pedestal foundation to the tip of the
    torch is 305 feet, 6 inches.

    Which only goes to show, if you have enough thrust, you can make anything
    fly.

    However, the huge cost of the SLS may get the program canceled by congress:

    "Why NASA's Monster Moon Rocket Will Likely Be Cancelled" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIR7IBnpvSU

    It is pointless to go to the moon. Space travel is lethal to humans. Cosmic radiation and destruction of blood due to microgravity is fatal. Nobody is going to travel to Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Pluto, or anywhere else. Colonies on the Moon have no purpose. Space stations are a
    waste of money. Manufacturing in zero gravity is too expensive and provides little benefit over manufacturing on earth. Low earth orbit is needed for
    GPS, communication, and earth observation, but these do not need humans for operation. Send robots, such as the solar probe. We can use VR to
    experience the trip.

    Spend the money, ingenuity, and effort on solving problems on earth. Global warming, pollution from fossil fuels, energy, conflict and violence, inequality, global health, poverty, and many other issues threaten the
    planet. These are much more important and demanding than sending a rocket
    into orbit. The problem is we don't know how to solve them, but we must to survive.



    --
    MRM

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jan Panteltje@21:1/5 to spamme@not.com on Fri Apr 8 14:43:07 2022
    On a sunny day (Fri, 8 Apr 2022 13:50:55 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Mike Monett <spamme@not.com> wrote in <XnsAE736426AB188idtokenpost@144.76.35.252>:

    Interesting to note NASA's Space Launch System, the first moon rocket in 50 >years, weighs 10 times the Statue of Liberty.

    How much does SLS weigh?

    5.75 million lbs
    5.75e6/2000 = 2,875 tons

    NASA's Space Launch System, or SLS, is ... Offering the highest-ever
    payload mass and volume ... feet tall, higher than the Statue of
    Liberty.

    How much does the Statue of Liberty weigh in total?

    450,000 pounds
    450e3/2000 = 225 tons

    The famed Statue of Liberty, located in New York harbor was
    officially dedicated on October 28, 1886. The Statue has a 35-foot
    waistline and weighs 450,000 pounds. Some facts: Total overall
    height from the base of the pedestal foundation to the tip of the
    torch is 305 feet, 6 inches.

    Which only goes to show, if you have enough thrust, you can make anything >fly.

    However, the huge cost of the SLS may get the program canceled by congress:

    "Why NASA's Monster Moon Rocket Will Likely Be Cancelled" >https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIR7IBnpvSU

    It is pointless to go to the moon. Space travel is lethal to humans. Cosmic >radiation and destruction of blood due to microgravity is fatal. Nobody is >going to travel to Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Pluto, or >anywhere else.


    We need to spread across the universe as the sun will one day engulf the earth. There are plenty solutions to all those problems you mentioned,
    political will is what is needed.
    Or maybe we can send some self modifying DNA or RNA that will then create ape like
    lifeforms on other planets :-)
    Or are we?


    Colonies on the Moon have no purpose. Space stations are a
    waste of money. Manufacturing in zero gravity is too expensive and provides >little benefit over manufacturing on earth. Low earth orbit is needed for >GPS, communication, and earth observation, but these do not need humans for >operation. Send robots, such as the solar probe. We can use VR to
    experience the trip.

    Spend the money, ingenuity, and effort on solving problems on earth. Global >warming, pollution from fossil fuels, energy, conflict and violence, >inequality, global health, poverty, and many other issues threaten the >planet. These are much more important and demanding than sending a rocket >into orbit. The problem is we don't know how to solve them, but we must to >survive.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRHqs8SffDo

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ricky@21:1/5 to Mike Monett on Fri Apr 8 07:49:47 2022
    On Friday, April 8, 2022 at 9:51:03 AM UTC-4, Mike Monett wrote:
    Interesting to note NASA's Space Launch System, the first moon rocket in 50 years, weighs 10 times the Statue of Liberty.

    How much does SLS weigh?

    5.75 million lbs
    5.75e6/2000 = 2,875 tons

    NASA's Space Launch System, or SLS, is ... Offering the highest-ever
    payload mass and volume ... feet tall, higher than the Statue of
    Liberty.

    How much does the Statue of Liberty weigh in total?

    450,000 pounds
    450e3/2000 = 225 tons

    The famed Statue of Liberty, located in New York harbor was
    officially dedicated on October 28, 1886. The Statue has a 35-foot
    waistline and weighs 450,000 pounds. Some facts: Total overall
    height from the base of the pedestal foundation to the tip of the
    torch is 305 feet, 6 inches.

    Which only goes to show, if you have enough thrust, you can make anything fly.

    However, the huge cost of the SLS may get the program canceled by congress:

    "Why NASA's Monster Moon Rocket Will Likely Be Cancelled" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIR7IBnpvSU

    It is pointless to go to the moon. Space travel is lethal to humans. Cosmic radiation and destruction of blood due to microgravity is fatal. Nobody is going to travel to Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Pluto, or anywhere else. Colonies on the Moon have no purpose. Space stations are a waste of money. Manufacturing in zero gravity is too expensive and provides little benefit over manufacturing on earth. Low earth orbit is needed for GPS, communication, and earth observation, but these do not need humans for operation. Send robots, such as the solar probe. We can use VR to
    experience the trip.

    Spend the money, ingenuity, and effort on solving problems on earth. Global warming, pollution from fossil fuels, energy, conflict and violence, inequality, global health, poverty, and many other issues threaten the planet. These are much more important and demanding than sending a rocket into orbit. The problem is we don't know how to solve them, but we must to survive.

    No purpose???

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8V2U7vTys0

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0P84NiVGJsw

    You clearly don't appreciate entertainment!

    Besides, what's so special about the human race that needs preserving? We seem hell bent on killing one another, or, failing that, dominating each other and inflicting as much grief on the rest of the world as humanly possible. Some do this by not
    sharing their toys, others by taking away someone else's toys. But the root is always the same. A lack of respect for others if not pure hatred.

    If I were an alien race, I'd just pass this planet by.

    --

    Rick C.

    - Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
    - Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ricky@21:1/5 to Jan Panteltje on Fri Apr 8 07:52:42 2022
    On Friday, April 8, 2022 at 10:44:07 AM UTC-4, Jan Panteltje wrote:
    On a sunny day (Fri, 8 Apr 2022 13:50:55 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Mike Monett <spa...@not.com> wrote in <XnsAE736426AB...@144.76.35.252>:
    Interesting to note NASA's Space Launch System, the first moon rocket in 50 >years, weighs 10 times the Statue of Liberty.

    How much does SLS weigh?

    5.75 million lbs
    5.75e6/2000 = 2,875 tons

    NASA's Space Launch System, or SLS, is ... Offering the highest-ever payload mass and volume ... feet tall, higher than the Statue of
    Liberty.

    How much does the Statue of Liberty weigh in total?

    450,000 pounds
    450e3/2000 = 225 tons

    The famed Statue of Liberty, located in New York harbor was
    officially dedicated on October 28, 1886. The Statue has a 35-foot waistline and weighs 450,000 pounds. Some facts: Total overall
    height from the base of the pedestal foundation to the tip of the
    torch is 305 feet, 6 inches.

    Which only goes to show, if you have enough thrust, you can make anything >fly.

    However, the huge cost of the SLS may get the program canceled by congress:

    "Why NASA's Monster Moon Rocket Will Likely Be Cancelled" >https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIR7IBnpvSU

    It is pointless to go to the moon. Space travel is lethal to humans. Cosmic >radiation and destruction of blood due to microgravity is fatal. Nobody is >going to travel to Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Pluto, or >anywhere else.
    We need to spread across the universe as the sun will one day engulf the earth.
    There are plenty solutions to all those problems you mentioned,
    political will is what is needed.

    Political will is what has caused many of our problems. So you recommend "hair of the dog that bit you"?


    Or maybe we can send some self modifying DNA or RNA that will then create ape like
    lifeforms on other planets :-)
    Or are we?

    Who cares? We live. We die. Not much changes. Especially in s.e.d.

    --

    Rick C.

    + Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
    + Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jan Panteltje@21:1/5 to spamme@not.com on Fri Apr 8 14:50:45 2022
    On a sunny day (Fri, 8 Apr 2022 13:50:55 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Mike Monett <spamme@not.com> wrote in <XnsAE736426AB188idtokenpost@144.76.35.252>:

    Interesting to note NASA's Space Launch System, the first moon rocket in 50 >years, weighs 10 times the Statue of Liberty.

    How much does SLS weigh?

    5.75 million lbs
    5.75e6/2000 = 2,875 tons

    NASA's Space Launch System, or SLS, is ... Offering the highest-ever
    payload mass and volume ... feet tall, higher than the Statue of
    Liberty.

    How much does the Statue of Liberty weigh in total?

    450,000 pounds
    450e3/2000 = 225 tons

    The famed Statue of Liberty, located in New York harbor was
    officially dedicated on October 28, 1886. The Statue has a 35-foot
    waistline and weighs 450,000 pounds. Some facts: Total overall
    height from the base of the pedestal foundation to the tip of the
    torch is 305 feet, 6 inches.

    Which only goes to show, if you have enough thrust, you can make anything >fly.

    However, the huge cost of the SLS may get the program canceled by congress:

    "Why NASA's Monster Moon Rocket Will Likely Be Cancelled" >https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIR7IBnpvSU

    Maybe
    lots of things are tried to get stuff into space
    https://www.space.com/spinlaunch-nasa-suborbital-test-flight-agreement

    Was thinking rail-gun and coil-gun, I mean to lauch from near vacuum like the moon

    Have not heard much recreating mass or organism elsewhere, like 'beam them up Scotty'
    I would volunteer for mars..
    Just for fun and curiosity.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Anthony William Sloman@21:1/5 to Mike Monett on Fri Apr 8 08:21:27 2022
    On Friday, April 8, 2022 at 11:51:03 PM UTC+10, Mike Monett wrote:
    Interesting to note NASA's Space Launch System, the first moon rocket in 50 years, weighs 10 times the Statue of Liberty.

    How much does SLS weigh?

    5.75 million lbs
    5.75e6/2000 = 2,875 tons

    NASA's Space Launch System, or SLS, is ... Offering the highest-ever
    payload mass and volume ... feet tall, higher than the Statue of
    Liberty.

    How much does the Statue of Liberty weigh in total?

    450,000 pounds
    450e3/2000 = 225 tons

    The famed Statue of Liberty, located in New York harbor was
    officially dedicated on October 28, 1886. The Statue has a 35-foot
    waistline and weighs 450,000 pounds. Some facts: Total overall
    height from the base of the pedestal foundation to the tip of the
    torch is 305 feet, 6 inches.

    Which only goes to show, if you have enough thrust, you can make anything fly.

    However, the huge cost of the SLS may get the program canceled by congress:

    "Why NASA's Monster Moon Rocket Will Likely Be Cancelled" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIR7IBnpvSU

    It is pointless to go to the moon.

    And will probably keep looking that way until we get there, and get settled in, and find out what we can do there which we can't do down here.

    Space travel is lethal to humans. Cosmic radiation and destruction of blood due to microgravity is fatal.

    It doesn't kill you fast enough to stop you getting to the moon, and once you are there you do have some gravity, and can get spun in a centrifuge from time to time to get more if you need it. Even cosmic rays don't get far through moon rock,

    Nobody is going to travel to Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Pluto, or anywhere else.

    Not all that soon.

    Colonies on the Moon have no purpose.

    None that you can think of.

    Space stations are a waste of money.

    The James Webb space telescope isn't.

    https://jwst.nasa.gov/

    It's not got anybody on board, and it's not in low earth orbit, but it does make the point that we can do some stuff up there that we can't do down here.

    Manufacturing in zero gravity is too expensive and provides little benefit over manufacturing on earth.

    So far.

    Low earth orbit is needed for GPS, communication, and earth observation, but these do not need humans for operation. Send robots, such as the solar probe. We can use VR to experience the trip.

    Once you've worked out exactly what you want to do, you don't need a human around. We've now worked out how to exploit low earth and synchronous orbits. We may not have covered the full spectrum of stuff that we might do.

    Spend the money, ingenuity, and effort on solving problems on earth.

    Spend most of it on that. Spend a bit on seeing if there is useful stuff we can do a bit further out.

    Global warming, pollution from fossil fuels, energy, conflict and violence, inequality, global health, poverty, and many other issues threaten the planet.

    They do, but people have other priorities. Spending money on doing stuff in space isn't going to subtract all that much from what gets spent on solving problems closer to home.

    These are much more important and demanding than sending a rocket into orbit.

    So why aren't they being tackled more effectively? If we spent the money that's now being spent on climate change denial propaganda on cutting CO2 emissions, we'd have a lot less climate change for them to deny.

    The problem is we don't know how to solve them, but we must to survive.

    That's not the real problem, which is the greedy crooks who want to keep on making money out of digging up fossil carbon and selling it as fuel. They want the money now, and can't be convinced that it is doing enough damage to worry about,. Check out
    John Larkin's opinions on the subject. They are Flyguy idiotic, but he doesn't get the message.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com on Fri Apr 8 08:55:47 2022
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 14:43:07 GMT, Jan Panteltje
    <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

    On a sunny day (Fri, 8 Apr 2022 13:50:55 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Mike Monett ><spamme@not.com> wrote in <XnsAE736426AB188idtokenpost@144.76.35.252>:

    Interesting to note NASA's Space Launch System, the first moon rocket in 50 >>years, weighs 10 times the Statue of Liberty.

    How much does SLS weigh?

    5.75 million lbs
    5.75e6/2000 = 2,875 tons

    NASA's Space Launch System, or SLS, is ... Offering the highest-ever
    payload mass and volume ... feet tall, higher than the Statue of
    Liberty.

    How much does the Statue of Liberty weigh in total?

    450,000 pounds
    450e3/2000 = 225 tons

    The famed Statue of Liberty, located in New York harbor was
    officially dedicated on October 28, 1886. The Statue has a 35-foot
    waistline and weighs 450,000 pounds. Some facts: Total overall
    height from the base of the pedestal foundation to the tip of the
    torch is 305 feet, 6 inches.

    Which only goes to show, if you have enough thrust, you can make anything >>fly.

    However, the huge cost of the SLS may get the program canceled by congress: >>
    "Why NASA's Monster Moon Rocket Will Likely Be Cancelled" >>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIR7IBnpvSU

    It is pointless to go to the moon. Space travel is lethal to humans. Cosmic >>radiation and destruction of blood due to microgravity is fatal. Nobody is >>going to travel to Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Pluto, or >>anywhere else.


    We need to spread across the universe as the sun will one day engulf the earth.

    Putting a few more bootprints on the moon won't help. NASA should do
    something new and useful.

    And why now? The sun isn't expanding very fast. Wait a few million
    years and re-evaluate the situation.



    --

    I yam what I yam - Popeye

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadenc@21:1/5 to Mike Monett on Fri Apr 8 16:35:50 2022
    Mike Monett <spamme@not.com> wrote in news:XnsAE736426AB188idtokenpost@ 144.76.35.252:

    . Send robots, such as the solar probe. We can use VR to
    experience the trip.

    Send me. I die... no big loss. I live, countless data tid bits on
    long term life on 1/6 gravity, which likely does not destroy blood
    cells or reduce bone mass. Place it in the shadow of a crater rim
    wall so the sun can be accessed for power generation and heating, yet
    the station itself remains out of the light or radiation.

    Send up modules for expansion of the original 'station'.
    Actual useful elements come after, and there could be many.

    The modules only need to be about 8 or 10 PSI to exist without a
    suit. Outside excursions of course still require one.

    I'm ready. Gave it thought most of my life. I am cheap. Cheaper
    than a robot even. Far cheaper than years of training for an expensive
    crew. They can come after they find out the effects on me.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jan Panteltje@21:1/5 to jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com on Fri Apr 8 16:56:47 2022
    On a sunny day (Fri, 08 Apr 2022 08:55:47 -0700) it happened jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote in <vfm05h9bkh1c1dhs2a0r8kcnam2ki5p4kg@4ax.com>:

    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 14:43:07 GMT, Jan Panteltje
    <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote:
    We need to spread across the universe as the sun will one day engulf the earth.

    Putting a few more bootprints on the moon won't help. NASA should do >something new and useful.

    Yes they should go to Mars .. Elon already has that plan.
    Long ago NASA had nuclear propulsion to do the Mars trip in a few weeks Politics and nuclear fear stopped it, greens...
    Push plate nuclear existed too, small nukes detonated behind the spacecraft to push it forward.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Orion_(nuclear_propulsion)

    And why now?

    I only exist now
    Tomorrow never comes.


    The sun isn't expanding very fast. Wait a few million
    years and re-evaluate the situation.

    Big comet could kill us all here like it did the Dinos or so that say,
    Or WW3 could...
    Do not put off till tomorrow what you can do today sort of jive,

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jeroen Belleman@21:1/5 to jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com on Fri Apr 8 19:12:39 2022
    On 2022-04-08 17:55, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 14:43:07 GMT, Jan Panteltje
    <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

    On a sunny day (Fri, 8 Apr 2022 13:50:55 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Mike Monett
    <spamme@not.com> wrote in <XnsAE736426AB188idtokenpost@144.76.35.252>:

    Interesting to note NASA's Space Launch System, the first moon rocket in 50 >>> years, weighs 10 times the Statue of Liberty.

    How much does SLS weigh?

    5.75 million lbs
    5.75e6/2000 = 2,875 tons

    NASA's Space Launch System, or SLS, is ... Offering the highest-ever
    payload mass and volume ... feet tall, higher than the Statue of
    Liberty.

    How much does the Statue of Liberty weigh in total?

    450,000 pounds
    450e3/2000 = 225 tons

    The famed Statue of Liberty, located in New York harbor was
    officially dedicated on October 28, 1886. The Statue has a 35-foot
    waistline and weighs 450,000 pounds. Some facts: Total overall
    height from the base of the pedestal foundation to the tip of the
    torch is 305 feet, 6 inches.

    Which only goes to show, if you have enough thrust, you can make anything >>> fly.

    However, the huge cost of the SLS may get the program canceled by congress: >>>
    "Why NASA's Monster Moon Rocket Will Likely Be Cancelled"
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIR7IBnpvSU

    It is pointless to go to the moon. Space travel is lethal to humans. Cosmic >>> radiation and destruction of blood due to microgravity is fatal. Nobody is >>> going to travel to Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Pluto, or >>> anywhere else.


    We need to spread across the universe as the sun will one day engulf the earth.

    Putting a few more bootprints on the moon won't help. NASA should do something new and useful.

    And why now? The sun isn't expanding very fast. Wait a few million
    years and re-evaluate the situation.


    A few million? I'm panicking! Oh wait, it's a few _billion_. Phew. :-)

    Jeroen Belleman

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John Larkin@21:1/5 to jeroen@nospam.please on Fri Apr 8 10:21:25 2022
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 19:12:39 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 2022-04-08 17:55, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 14:43:07 GMT, Jan Panteltje
    <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

    On a sunny day (Fri, 8 Apr 2022 13:50:55 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Mike Monett
    <spamme@not.com> wrote in <XnsAE736426AB188idtokenpost@144.76.35.252>:

    Interesting to note NASA's Space Launch System, the first moon rocket in 50
    years, weighs 10 times the Statue of Liberty.

    How much does SLS weigh?

    5.75 million lbs
    5.75e6/2000 = 2,875 tons

    NASA's Space Launch System, or SLS, is ... Offering the highest-ever >>>> payload mass and volume ... feet tall, higher than the Statue of >>>> Liberty.

    How much does the Statue of Liberty weigh in total?

    450,000 pounds
    450e3/2000 = 225 tons

    The famed Statue of Liberty, located in New York harbor was >>>> officially dedicated on October 28, 1886. The Statue has a 35-foot >>>> waistline and weighs 450,000 pounds. Some facts: Total overall >>>> height from the base of the pedestal foundation to the tip of the >>>> torch is 305 feet, 6 inches.

    Which only goes to show, if you have enough thrust, you can make anything >>>> fly.

    However, the huge cost of the SLS may get the program canceled by congress:

    "Why NASA's Monster Moon Rocket Will Likely Be Cancelled"
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIR7IBnpvSU

    It is pointless to go to the moon. Space travel is lethal to humans. Cosmic
    radiation and destruction of blood due to microgravity is fatal. Nobody is >>>> going to travel to Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Pluto, or
    anywhere else.


    We need to spread across the universe as the sun will one day engulf the earth.

    Putting a few more bootprints on the moon won't help. NASA should do
    something new and useful.

    And why now? The sun isn't expanding very fast. Wait a few million
    years and re-evaluate the situation.


    A few million? I'm panicking! Oh wait, it's a few _billion_. Phew. :-)

    Jeroen Belleman

    What I meant is that our science and technology will be a lot better
    in a million years or so. And if we're extinct by then, it doesn't
    matter.

    There have been serious suggestions that we could boost Earth to a
    higher orbit. We almost have the technology to do that now.

    --

    If a man will begin with certainties, he shall end with doubts,
    but if he will be content to begin with doubts he shall end in certainties. Francis Bacon

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Anthony William Sloman@21:1/5 to jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com on Fri Apr 8 23:01:55 2022
    On Saturday, April 9, 2022 at 1:56:01 AM UTC+10, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 14:43:07 GMT, Jan Panteltje
    <pNaonSt...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    On a sunny day (Fri, 8 Apr 2022 13:50:55 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Mike Monett
    <spa...@not.com> wrote in <XnsAE736426AB...@144.76.35.252>:

    Interesting to note NASA's Space Launch System, the first moon rocket in 50
    years, weighs 10 times the Statue of Liberty.

    How much does SLS weigh?

    5.75 million lbs
    5.75e6/2000 = 2,875 tons

    NASA's Space Launch System, or SLS, is ... Offering the highest-ever
    payload mass and volume ... feet tall, higher than the Statue of
    Liberty.

    How much does the Statue of Liberty weigh in total?

    450,000 pounds
    450e3/2000 = 225 tons

    The famed Statue of Liberty, located in New York harbor was
    officially dedicated on October 28, 1886. The Statue has a 35-foot
    waistline and weighs 450,000 pounds. Some facts: Total overall
    height from the base of the pedestal foundation to the tip of the
    torch is 305 feet, 6 inches.

    Which only goes to show, if you have enough thrust, you can make anything >>fly.

    However, the huge cost of the SLS may get the program canceled by congress:

    "Why NASA's Monster Moon Rocket Will Likely Be Cancelled" >>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIR7IBnpvSU

    It is pointless to go to the moon. Space travel is lethal to humans. Cosmic
    radiation and destruction of blood due to microgravity is fatal. Nobody is >>going to travel to Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Pluto, or
    anywhere else.


    We need to spread across the universe as the sun will one day engulf the earth.
    Putting a few more bootprints on the moon won't help. NASA should do something new and useful.

    I don't think that putting a few more bootprints on the moon is high on the list of things that they'd tried to do if they got there.
    John Larkin's grasp of what they might have in mind doesn't seem to be all that comprehensive

    Using a rail gun to put a space craft into low orbit around the moon is something you could do in the moon's thin atmosphere.

    Once you've got into orbit, all sort of low thrust solutions can get you where you wan to go.

    And why now? The sun isn't expanding very fast. Wait a few million years and re-evaluate the situation.

    About a billion years before we'll need to do anything energetic. The average life of a vertebrate species is about ten million years, and we should have been able to genetically engineer all sorts of variations on our genome long before then. There's
    lots of real estate on Jupiter for an organism that was well adapted to the conditions there, though there might be some competition there already.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Sylvia Else@21:1/5 to Mike Monett on Sat Apr 9 17:15:03 2022
    On 08-Apr-22 11:50 pm, Mike Monett wrote:
    Interesting to note NASA's Space Launch System, the first moon rocket in 50 years, weighs 10 times the Statue of Liberty.



    This is not very informative. The statue of liberty is hollow. Even an
    engineer would have considerable difficulty estimating it mass without
    detailed construction information.

    The rest of us would have no chance.

    Sylvia.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com@21:1/5 to pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com on Sat Apr 9 07:17:44 2022
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 16:56:47 GMT, Jan Panteltje
    <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

    On a sunny day (Fri, 08 Apr 2022 08:55:47 -0700) it happened >jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote in ><vfm05h9bkh1c1dhs2a0r8kcnam2ki5p4kg@4ax.com>:

    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 14:43:07 GMT, Jan Panteltje
    <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote:
    We need to spread across the universe as the sun will one day engulf the earth.

    Putting a few more bootprints on the moon won't help. NASA should do >>something new and useful.

    Yes they should go to Mars .. Elon already has that plan.

    Why? We have robots on Mars already.



    Long ago NASA had nuclear propulsion to do the Mars trip in a few weeks >Politics and nuclear fear stopped it, greens...
    Push plate nuclear existed too, small nukes detonated behind the spacecraft to push it forward.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Orion_(nuclear_propulsion)

    And why now?

    I only exist now
    Tomorrow never comes.


    The sun isn't expanding very fast. Wait a few million
    years and re-evaluate the situation.

    Big comet could kill us all here like it did the Dinos or so that say,
    Or WW3 could...
    Do not put off till tomorrow what you can do today sort of jive,


    NASA should be working on comet detection and deflection, which is
    arguably useful. ISS could be a staging station for deflectors.





    --

    I yam what I yam - Popeye

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Anthony William Sloman@21:1/5 to jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com on Sat Apr 9 07:39:32 2022
    On Sunday, April 10, 2022 at 12:17:56 AM UTC+10, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 16:56:47 GMT, Jan Panteltje <pNaonSt...@yahoo.com> wrote: >On a sunny day (Fri, 08 Apr 2022 08:55:47 -0700) it happened >jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote in <vfm05h9bkh1c1dhs2...@4ax.com>: >>On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 14:43:07 GMT, Jan Panteltje <pNaonSt...@yahoo.com> wrote:

    <snip>

    NASA should be working on comet detection and deflection, which is arguably useful.

    As indeed they are. Comets are just one of a variety of potential impacting objects.

    https://www.nasa.gov/planetarydefense/neoo

    ISS could be a staging station for deflectors.

    The moon would be more useful. It's easier to get stuff off it's surface, and you could probably make most of the deflecting hardware up there, eventually.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jan Panteltje@21:1/5 to jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com on Sat Apr 9 14:46:28 2022
    On a sunny day (Sat, 09 Apr 2022 07:17:44 -0700) it happened jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote in <h8535h1j3b5u12qolismpeqqcvfv1vr05a@4ax.com>:

    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 16:56:47 GMT, Jan Panteltje
    <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

    On a sunny day (Fri, 08 Apr 2022 08:55:47 -0700) it happened >>jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote in >><vfm05h9bkh1c1dhs2a0r8kcnam2ki5p4kg@4ax.com>:

    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 14:43:07 GMT, Jan Panteltje >>><pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote:
    We need to spread across the universe as the sun will one day engulf the earth.

    Putting a few more bootprints on the moon won't help. NASA should do >>>something new and useful.

    Yes they should go to Mars .. Elon already has that plan.

    Why? We have robots on Mars already.



    Long ago NASA had nuclear propulsion to do the Mars trip in a few weeks >>Politics and nuclear fear stopped it, greens...
    Push plate nuclear existed too, small nukes detonated behind the spacecraft to push it forward.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Orion_(nuclear_propulsion)

    And why now?

    I only exist now
    Tomorrow never comes.


    The sun isn't expanding very fast. Wait a few million
    years and re-evaluate the situation.

    Big comet could kill us all here like it did the Dinos or so that say,
    Or WW3 could...
    Do not put off till tomorrow what you can do today sort of jive,


    NASA should be working on comet detection and deflection, which is
    arguably useful. ISS could be a staging station for deflectors.

    More likely US will use it as high security prison (from movies I have seen). :-)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Phil Hobbs@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Sat Apr 9 13:50:57 2022
    On 4/8/22 1:21 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 19:12:39 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 2022-04-08 17:55, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 14:43:07 GMT, Jan Panteltje
    <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

    On a sunny day (Fri, 8 Apr 2022 13:50:55 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Mike Monett
    <spamme@not.com> wrote in <XnsAE736426AB188idtokenpost@144.76.35.252>: >>>>
    Interesting to note NASA's Space Launch System, the first moon rocket in 50
    years, weighs 10 times the Statue of Liberty.

    How much does SLS weigh?

    5.75 million lbs
    5.75e6/2000 = 2,875 tons

    NASA's Space Launch System, or SLS, is ... Offering the highest-ever >>>>> payload mass and volume ... feet tall, higher than the Statue of >>>>> Liberty.

    How much does the Statue of Liberty weigh in total?

    450,000 pounds
    450e3/2000 = 225 tons

    The famed Statue of Liberty, located in New York harbor was >>>>> officially dedicated on October 28, 1886. The Statue has a 35-foot >>>>> waistline and weighs 450,000 pounds. Some facts: Total overall >>>>> height from the base of the pedestal foundation to the tip of the >>>>> torch is 305 feet, 6 inches.

    Which only goes to show, if you have enough thrust, you can make anything >>>>> fly.

    However, the huge cost of the SLS may get the program canceled by congress:

    "Why NASA's Monster Moon Rocket Will Likely Be Cancelled"
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIR7IBnpvSU

    It is pointless to go to the moon. Space travel is lethal to humans. Cosmic
    radiation and destruction of blood due to microgravity is fatal. Nobody is
    going to travel to Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Pluto, or
    anywhere else.


    We need to spread across the universe as the sun will one day engulf the earth.

    Putting a few more bootprints on the moon won't help. NASA should do
    something new and useful.

    And why now? The sun isn't expanding very fast. Wait a few million
    years and re-evaluate the situation.


    A few million? I'm panicking! Oh wait, it's a few _billion_. Phew. :-)

    Jeroen Belleman

    What I meant is that our science and technology will be a lot better
    in a million years or so. And if we're extinct by then, it doesn't
    matter.

    There have been serious suggestions that we could boost Earth to a
    higher orbit. We almost have the technology to do that now.


    Well, fusion power has been 30 years out for what, 60 years now? ;)

    Even with a very large fusion-powered rocket motor, it would be
    challenging to do it without ejecting the atmosphere as well.

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs

    --
    Dr Philip C D Hobbs
    Principal Consultant
    ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
    Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
    Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

    http://electrooptical.net
    https://hobbs-eo.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From RichD@21:1/5 to Phil Hobbs on Sat Apr 9 11:30:47 2022
    On April 9, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    There have been serious suggestions that we could boost Earth to a
    higher orbit. We almost have the technology to do that now.

    Even with a very large fusion-powered rocket motor, it would be
    challenging to do it without ejecting the atmosphere as well.

    We'd need to do some serious magma pumping for the expulsion
    material. But maybe in a billion years, Mother Nature will tire of
    those annoying momentum conservation constraints -

    Anyhow, a better idea is to deflect a few comet orbits into the earth -
    bumper cars have inspired many an engineer -
    But owners of beachfront property would probably whine about
    that solution.

    So why not a gravity slingshot? Deflect some comets and
    asteroids into nearby orbits. Humanity saved by hydrogen bombs!

    --
    Rich

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John Larkin@21:1/5 to pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical. on Sun Apr 10 14:05:51 2022
    On Sat, 9 Apr 2022 13:50:57 -0400, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

    On 4/8/22 1:21 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 19:12:39 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 2022-04-08 17:55, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 14:43:07 GMT, Jan Panteltje
    <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

    On a sunny day (Fri, 8 Apr 2022 13:50:55 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Mike Monett
    <spamme@not.com> wrote in <XnsAE736426AB188idtokenpost@144.76.35.252>: >>>>>
    Interesting to note NASA's Space Launch System, the first moon rocket in 50
    years, weighs 10 times the Statue of Liberty.

    How much does SLS weigh?

    5.75 million lbs
    5.75e6/2000 = 2,875 tons

    NASA's Space Launch System, or SLS, is ... Offering the highest-ever >>>>>> payload mass and volume ... feet tall, higher than the Statue of >>>>>> Liberty.

    How much does the Statue of Liberty weigh in total?

    450,000 pounds
    450e3/2000 = 225 tons

    The famed Statue of Liberty, located in New York harbor was >>>>>> officially dedicated on October 28, 1886. The Statue has a 35-foot >>>>>> waistline and weighs 450,000 pounds. Some facts: Total overall >>>>>> height from the base of the pedestal foundation to the tip of the >>>>>> torch is 305 feet, 6 inches.

    Which only goes to show, if you have enough thrust, you can make anything
    fly.

    However, the huge cost of the SLS may get the program canceled by congress:

    "Why NASA's Monster Moon Rocket Will Likely Be Cancelled"
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIR7IBnpvSU

    It is pointless to go to the moon. Space travel is lethal to humans. Cosmic
    radiation and destruction of blood due to microgravity is fatal. Nobody is
    going to travel to Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Pluto, or
    anywhere else.


    We need to spread across the universe as the sun will one day engulf the earth.

    Putting a few more bootprints on the moon won't help. NASA should do
    something new and useful.

    And why now? The sun isn't expanding very fast. Wait a few million
    years and re-evaluate the situation.


    A few million? I'm panicking! Oh wait, it's a few _billion_. Phew. :-)

    Jeroen Belleman

    What I meant is that our science and technology will be a lot better
    in a million years or so. And if we're extinct by then, it doesn't
    matter.

    There have been serious suggestions that we could boost Earth to a
    higher orbit. We almost have the technology to do that now.


    Well, fusion power has been 30 years out for what, 60 years now? ;)

    Even with a very large fusion-powered rocket motor, it would be
    challenging to do it without ejecting the atmosphere as well.

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs

    The idea is to nudge a rock to swing past a bigger rock in the
    asteroid belt. Do that a bunch of times and eventually swing an
    asteroid in a hyperbolic loop past earth and transfer some momentum.
    Do that for a million years or whatever.

    That would take very little energy, just a good aim.

    --

    If a man will begin with certainties, he shall end with doubts,
    but if he will be content to begin with doubts he shall end in certainties. Francis Bacon

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Phil Hobbs@21:1/5 to John Larkin on Sun Apr 10 18:50:00 2022
    John Larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 9 Apr 2022 13:50:57 -0400, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

    On 4/8/22 1:21 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 19:12:39 +0200, Jeroen Belleman
    <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    On 2022-04-08 17:55, jlarkin@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 14:43:07 GMT, Jan Panteltje
    <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote:

    On a sunny day (Fri, 8 Apr 2022 13:50:55 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Mike Monett
    <spamme@not.com> wrote in <XnsAE736426AB188idtokenpost@144.76.35.252>: >>>>>>
    Interesting to note NASA's Space Launch System, the first moon rocket in 50
    years, weighs 10 times the Statue of Liberty.

    How much does SLS weigh?

    5.75 million lbs
    5.75e6/2000 = 2,875 tons

    NASA's Space Launch System, or SLS, is ... Offering the highest-ever >>>>>>> payload mass and volume ... feet tall, higher than the Statue of >>>>>>> Liberty.

    How much does the Statue of Liberty weigh in total?

    450,000 pounds
    450e3/2000 = 225 tons

    The famed Statue of Liberty, located in New York harbor was >>>>>>> officially dedicated on October 28, 1886. The Statue has a 35-foot >>>>>>> waistline and weighs 450,000 pounds. Some facts: Total overall >>>>>>> height from the base of the pedestal foundation to the tip of the >>>>>>> torch is 305 feet, 6 inches.

    Which only goes to show, if you have enough thrust, you can make anything
    fly.

    However, the huge cost of the SLS may get the program canceled by congress:

    "Why NASA's Monster Moon Rocket Will Likely Be Cancelled"
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIR7IBnpvSU

    It is pointless to go to the moon. Space travel is lethal to humans. Cosmic
    radiation and destruction of blood due to microgravity is fatal. Nobody is
    going to travel to Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Pluto, or
    anywhere else.


    We need to spread across the universe as the sun will one day engulf the earth.

    Putting a few more bootprints on the moon won't help. NASA should do >>>>> something new and useful.

    And why now? The sun isn't expanding very fast. Wait a few million
    years and re-evaluate the situation.


    A few million? I'm panicking! Oh wait, it's a few _billion_. Phew. :-) >>>>
    Jeroen Belleman

    What I meant is that our science and technology will be a lot better
    in a million years or so. And if we're extinct by then, it doesn't
    matter.

    There have been serious suggestions that we could boost Earth to a
    higher orbit. We almost have the technology to do that now.


    Well, fusion power has been 30 years out for what, 60 years now? ;)

    Even with a very large fusion-powered rocket motor, it would be
    challenging to do it without ejecting the atmosphere as well.


    The idea is to nudge a rock to swing past a bigger rock in the
    asteroid belt. Do that a bunch of times and eventually swing an
    asteroid in a hyperbolic loop past earth and transfer some momentum.
    Do that for a million years or whatever.

    That would take very little energy, just a good aim.

    Nope. The main asteroid belt orbits are several times further out than
    the Earth's, so you have to get rid of most of the asteroid's kinetic
    energy if you want to get its angular momentum low enough for it to
    reach the orbit of the Earth.

    Even then, I seriously doubt there's enough mass in the asteroid belt to
    do much to the Earth's orbit.

    This paper <https://www.cambridge.org/core/services/aop-cambridge-core/content/view/S1743921315008388>
    claims that the main asteroid belt has a mass of 1.2E-9 of the Sun's.

    The solar mass is 2E30 kg, so the asteroid belt's is 2.4e21 kg. The
    Earth's is 6e24 kg, so the ratio of the total mass of the asteroid belt
    to that of the Earth is

    ratio = 2.4e21 kg / 6e24 kg = 0.0004.

    One can do orbital mechanics till one is blue in the face, and never
    figure out a way to make the Earth's orbit grow by an amount more than a
    few times that 400 ppm number.

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs

    --
    Dr Philip C D Hobbs
    Principal Consultant
    ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
    Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
    Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

    http://electrooptical.net
    http://hobbs-eo.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Mike Monett@21:1/5 to Phil Hobbs on Sun Apr 10 23:01:36 2022
    Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

    John Larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 9 Apr 2022 13:50:57 -0400, Phil Hobbs
    <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:
    [...]

    Nope. The main asteroid belt orbits are several times further out than
    the Earth's, so you have to get rid of most of the asteroid's kinetic
    energy if you want to get its angular momentum low enough for it to
    reach the orbit of the Earth.

    Even then, I seriously doubt there's enough mass in the asteroid belt to
    do much to the Earth's orbit.

    This paper <https://www.cambridge.org/core/services/aop-cambridge-core/content/view/ S1743921315008388> claims that the main asteroid belt has a mass of
    1.2E-9 of the Sun's.

    The solar mass is 2E30 kg, so the asteroid belt's is 2.4e21 kg. The
    Earth's is 6e24 kg, so the ratio of the total mass of the asteroid belt
    to that of the Earth is

    ratio = 2.4e21 kg / 6e24 kg = 0.0004.

    One can do orbital mechanics till one is blue in the face, and never
    figure out a way to make the Earth's orbit grow by an amount more than a
    few times that 400 ppm number.

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs

    You also have to include the moon. This is needed to stabilize the Earth's spin. Quote:

    "The Moon keeps the Earth from wobbling violently as it spins. “Without the Moon the tilt of the Earth's axis would vary more, with potentially strong climatic effects,” says Aksnes. With no moon as a stabilizer, the Earth
    would sometimes tilt all the way over and lie on its side in relation to
    its orbit around the Sun."

    https://sciencenorway.no/forskningno-norway-planets/what-would-we-do- without-the-moon/1433295

    Perpetual daylight or darkness would have some effect on global warming and climate.



    --
    MRM

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Anthony William Sloman@21:1/5 to Phil Hobbs on Sun Apr 10 23:00:52 2022
    On Monday, April 11, 2022 at 8:50:09 AM UTC+10, Phil Hobbs wrote:
    John Larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 9 Apr 2022 13:50:57 -0400, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:
    On 4/8/22 1:21 PM, John Larkin wrote:
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 19:12:39 +0200, Jeroen Belleman <jer...@nospam.please> wrote:
    On 2022-04-08 17:55, jla...@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
    On Fri, 08 Apr 2022 14:43:07 GMT, Jan Panteltje <pNaonSt...@yahoo.com> wrote:
    On a sunny day (Fri, 8 Apr 2022 13:50:55 -0000 (UTC)) it happened Mike Monett <spa...@not.com> wrote in <XnsAE736426AB...@144.76.35.252>:

    <snip>

    The idea is to nudge a rock to swing past a bigger rock in the
    asteroid belt. Do that a bunch of times and eventually swing an
    asteroid in a hyperbolic loop past earth and transfer some momentum.
    Do that for a million years or whatever.

    That would take very little energy, just a good aim.

    Nope. The main asteroid belt orbits are several times further out than
    the Earth's, so you have to get rid of most of the asteroid's kinetic
    energy if you want to get its angular momentum low enough for it to
    reach the orbit of the Earth.

    Wrong. You actually have to add enough kinetic energy to make the asteroid's orbit elliptical enough cross the orbit of the earth.

    If you did it right, the asteroid will have the right sort of gravitational interaction with the earth to raise the earth into a slightly higher orbit. while itself ending up in somewhat lower orbit, ready to do it again and again. You'd need a super-
    Newton, or somebody with a lot of computer time to play with, to work out what you actually could do, but they probably they wouldn't start off thinking that they had to get rid of an asteroid's kinetic energy before they started the process

    Even then, I seriously doubt there's enough mass in the asteroid belt to do much to the Earth's orbit.

    This paper <https://www.cambridge.org/core/services/aop-cambridge-core/content/view/S1743921315008388>
    claims that the main asteroid belt has a mass of 1.2E-9 of the Sun's.

    The solar mass is 2E30 kg, so the asteroid belt's is 2.4e21 kg. The
    Earth's is 6e24 kg, so the ratio of the total mass of the asteroid belt
    to that of the Earth is

    ratio = 2.4e21 kg / 6e24 kg = 0.0004.

    One can do orbital mechanics till one is blue in the face, and never
    figure out a way to make the Earth's orbit grow by an amount more than a
    few times that 400 ppm number.

    Put enough energy into making lots of asteroids make lots of passes around the earth, and the asteroidal mass could be used as a conveyer belt.

    If you routed the asteroid orbits past Jupiter as well , you could presumably end up transferring some of it's orbital momentum to the Earth as well.

    Jupiter would end up in a slightly lower orbit, but it wouldn't become a near earth object.

    --
    Bill Sloman, Sydney

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jeroen Belleman@21:1/5 to Mike Monett on Mon Apr 11 09:03:17 2022
    Mike Monett wrote:
    Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

    John Larkin wrote:
    On Sat, 9 Apr 2022 13:50:57 -0400, Phil Hobbs
    <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:
    [...]

    Nope. The main asteroid belt orbits are several times further out than
    the Earth's, so you have to get rid of most of the asteroid's kinetic
    energy if you want to get its angular momentum low enough for it to
    reach the orbit of the Earth.

    Even then, I seriously doubt there's enough mass in the asteroid belt to
    do much to the Earth's orbit.

    This paper
    <https://www.cambridge.org/core/services/aop-cambridge-core/content/view/
    S1743921315008388> claims that the main asteroid belt has a mass of
    1.2E-9 of the Sun's.

    The solar mass is 2E30 kg, so the asteroid belt's is 2.4e21 kg. The
    Earth's is 6e24 kg, so the ratio of the total mass of the asteroid belt
    to that of the Earth is

    ratio = 2.4e21 kg / 6e24 kg = 0.0004.

    One can do orbital mechanics till one is blue in the face, and never
    figure out a way to make the Earth's orbit grow by an amount more than a
    few times that 400 ppm number.

    Cheers

    Phil Hobbs

    You also have to include the moon. This is needed to stabilize the Earth's spin. [...]

    I've seen that stated many times, without anyone ever even explaining
    why that should be so. So, why would the earth wobble without the moon?

    Jeroen Belleman

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Mike Monett@21:1/5 to Jeroen Belleman on Mon Apr 11 11:52:15 2022
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

    Mike Monett wrote:
    [...]

    You also have to include the moon. This is needed to stabilize the
    Earth's spin. [...]

    I've seen that stated many times, without anyone ever even explaining
    why that should be so. So, why would the earth wobble without the moon?

    Jeroen Belleman

    Gravity, orbits and nonuniform mass distribution of Earth.

    1. "The Moon: Required for Life on Earth" https://www.icr.org/article/moon-required-for-life-on-earth

    2. "Who Needs a Moon?"
    https://www.science.org/content/article/who-needs-moon

    3. "Earth's Stabilizing Moon May Be Unique Within Universe" https://www.space.com/12464-earth-moon-unique-solar-system-universe.html

    4. "The Past and the Future of the Earth-Moon System" https://www.wondriumdaily.com/the-past-and-the-future-of-the-earth-moon- system/




    --
    MRM

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)