This photo, https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:USB-OTG_Setup_IMG_2342.JPG
suggests, to me at least, that the phone can be charged while the
keyboard, mouse and flash store are used. True?
On 2024-03-09, peter@easthope.ca <peter@easthope.ca> wrote:
This photo,
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:USB-OTG_Setup_IMG_2342.JPG
suggests, to me at least, that the phone can be charged while the
keyboard, mouse and flash store are used. True?
There are altogether too many unknowns here. Looking at the date
of the photo - 2015 - some phones of that era could support USB
OTG but were unable to supply power to connected peripherals,
meaning you would need a Y cable to supply that separately. Others
could do the job inclusive of power delivery, others couldn't work
in OTG mode at all. Generally you couldn't use OTG and charge simultaneously, it's a role reversal that early USB wasn't designed
for.
Things are different with USB-C but of course that is much later.
But can even USB-C accept a signal input (keyboard and mouse for
instance) and unrelated signal output (audio for instance) on the
same physical socket? I ask only out of curiosity.
In article <2219572717.2fe80b82@uninhabited.net>, Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> wrote:
But can even USB-C accept a signal input (keyboard and mouse for
instance) and unrelated signal output (audio for instance) on the
same physical socket? I ask only out of curiosity.
The setup is rarely tried. Appears that nobody can reply.
A keyboard or mouse sends tiny amounts of data; a few bytes per
second. In principle the link should be able to fit that in without significant drop-outs in audio output. WIth so many details involved,
a general answer is difficult. When all else fails, we can test and
see what happens. =8~)
Regards, ... P.
On 12 Mar 2024 at 16:29:31 GMT, "peter@easthope.ca" <peter@easthope.ca> wrote:
In article <2219572717.2fe80b82@uninhabited.net>, Roger Hayter
<roger@hayter.org> wrote:
But can even USB-C accept a signal input (keyboard and mouse for
instance) and unrelated signal output (audio for instance) on the
same physical socket? I ask only out of curiosity.
The setup is rarely tried. Appears that nobody can reply.
A keyboard or mouse sends tiny amounts of data; a few bytes per
second. In principle the link should be able to fit that in without
significant drop-outs in audio output. WIth so many details involved,
a general answer is difficult. When all else fails, we can test and
see what happens. =8~)
Regards, ... P.
So you could use an overarching protocol which was bilateral (ethernet anyone?) and send and separate messages both ways. What I was aksing was whether within the USB protocol there was provision for using some pins in for
one electrical signal (bi or uni-directional) and other pins for another electrical signal. Because that would be the only way to do it without special
software on at least one of the devices.
On 2024-03-12, Roger Hayter wrote:
On 12 Mar 2024 at 16:29:31 GMT, "peter@easthope.ca" <peter@easthope.ca> wrote:
In article <2219572717.2fe80b82@uninhabited.net>, Roger Hayter
<roger@hayter.org> wrote:
But can even USB-C accept a signal input (keyboard and mouse for
instance) and unrelated signal output (audio for instance) on the
same physical socket? I ask only out of curiosity.
The setup is rarely tried. Appears that nobody can reply.
A keyboard or mouse sends tiny amounts of data; a few bytes per
second. In principle the link should be able to fit that in without
significant drop-outs in audio output. WIth so many details involved,
a general answer is difficult. When all else fails, we can test and
see what happens. =8~)
Regards, ... P.
So you could use an overarching protocol which was bilateral (ethernet
anyone?) and send and separate messages both ways. What I was aksing was
whether within the USB protocol there was provision for using some pins in for
one electrical signal (bi or uni-directional) and other pins for another
electrical signal. Because that would be the only way to do it without special
software on at least one of the devices.
There's only one set of pins (well, two sets if you count USB2 / USB3 --
but you can only use one set at a time).
USB2 -> D+/D- (Bi-directional / Half Duplex)
USB3 -> TX1+/TX1- and RX2+/RX2- (optionally Full Duplex, IIRC)
As I recall the "Tx" pair is "Host Transmit to Peripheral", and "Rx" is
"Host Receive from Peripheral", but it's been a while since I read up on
the USB3 / USB-C implementations.
On 12 Mar 2024 at 19:27:04 GMT, "Dan Purgert" <dan@djph.net> wrote:
On 2024-03-12, Roger Hayter wrote:
[...]
So you could use an overarching protocol which was bilateral (ethernet
anyone?) and send and separate messages both ways. What I was
aksing was whether within the USB protocol there was provision for
using some pins in for one electrical signal (bi or uni-directional)
and other pins for another electrical signal. Because that would be
the only way to do it without special software on at least one of
the devices.
There's only one set of pins (well, two sets if you count USB2 / USB3 --
but you can only use one set at a time).
USB2 -> D+/D- (Bi-directional / Half Duplex)
USB3 -> TX1+/TX1- and RX2+/RX2- (optionally Full Duplex, IIRC)
As I recall the "Tx" pair is "Host Transmit to Peripheral", and "Rx" is
"Host Receive from Peripheral", but it's been a while since I read up on
the USB3 / USB-C implementations.
Usbc seems to have about 20 pins, that's why I asked.
On 9 Mar 2024 at 21:54:51 GMT, "Andrew Smallshaw" <andrews@sdf.org> wrote:
On 2024-03-09, peter@easthope.ca <peter@easthope.ca> wrote:
This photo,
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:USB-OTG_Setup_IMG_2342.JPG
suggests, to me at least, that the phone can be charged while the
keyboard, mouse and flash store are used. True?
There are altogether too many unknowns here. Looking at the date
of the photo - 2015 - some phones of that era could support USB
OTG but were unable to supply power to connected peripherals,
meaning you would need a Y cable to supply that separately. Others
could do the job inclusive of power delivery, others couldn't work
in OTG mode at all. Generally you couldn't use OTG and charge
simultaneously, it's a role reversal that early USB wasn't designed
for.
Things are different with USB-C but of course that is much later.
But can even USB-C accept a signal input (keyboard and mouse for instance) and
unrelated signal output (audio for instance) on the same physical socket? I ask only out of curiosity.
In article <2219572717.2fe80b82@uninhabited.net>, Roger Hayter <roger@hayter.org> wrote:
But can even USB-C accept a signal input (keyboard and mouse for
instance) and unrelated signal output (audio for instance) on the
same physical socket? I ask only out of curiosity.
The setup is rarely tried. Appears that nobody can reply.
A keyboard or mouse sends tiny amounts of data; a few bytes per
second. In principle the link should be able to fit that in without significant drop-outs in audio output. WIth so many details involved,
a general answer is difficult. When all else fails, we can test and
see what happens. =8~)
On 2024-03-12, Roger Hayter wrote:
On 12 Mar 2024 at 19:27:04 GMT, "Dan Purgert" <dan@djph.net> wrote:
There's only one set of pins (well, two sets if you count USB2 / USB3 -- >>> but you can only use one set at a time).
USB2 -> D+/D- (Bi-directional / Half Duplex)
USB3 -> TX1+/TX1- and RX2+/RX2- (optionally Full Duplex, IIRC)
As I recall the "Tx" pair is "Host Transmit to Peripheral", and "Rx" is
"Host Receive from Peripheral", but it's been a while since I read up on >>> the USB3 / USB-C implementations.
Usbc seems to have about 20 pins, that's why I asked.
Yeah, that's just to allow the connector to be flipped over, and still connect to the host / peripheral. The host/peripheral ports themselves
only have one orientation.
On 2024-03-13, Dan Purgert <dan@djph.net> wrote:
On 2024-03-12, Roger Hayter wrote:
On 12 Mar 2024 at 19:27:04 GMT, "Dan Purgert" <dan@djph.net> wrote:
There's only one set of pins (well, two sets if you count USB2 / USB3 -- >>>> but you can only use one set at a time).
USB2 -> D+/D- (Bi-directional / Half Duplex)
USB3 -> TX1+/TX1- and RX2+/RX2- (optionally Full Duplex, IIRC)
As I recall the "Tx" pair is "Host Transmit to Peripheral", and "Rx" is >>>> "Host Receive from Peripheral", but it's been a while since I read up on >>>> the USB3 / USB-C implementations.
Usbc seems to have about 20 pins, that's why I asked.
Yeah, that's just to allow the connector to be flipped over, and still
connect to the host / peripheral. The host/peripheral ports themselves
only have one orientation.
USB-C supports SuperSpeed which uses two additional pairs on top
of USB2 and also allows for full-duplex. That is what the additional contacts on a USB3 A plug are for.
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