• Hypersalinity drives convergent bone mass increases

    From littoral.homo@gmail.com@21:1/5 to All on Sun Mar 5 06:22:51 2023
    Hypersalinity drives convergent bone mass increases in Miocene marine mammals from the Paratethys
    Alexandra Houssaye cs 2022 Curr.Biol.32:R42-R44
    doi org/10.1016/j.cub.2021.10.065

    • Miocene marine mammals from the Para-tethys Sea often have highly compact bones.
    • Dense bones evolved independently in Para-tethyan whales, dolphins & seals. • Bone mass increase may have begun as an adaptation to regional hyper-salinity.
    • Para-tethyan marine mammals persisted, despite being isolated from the world ocean.

    Pachy-osteo-sclerosis (POS creates dense, bulky bones) often characterizes the early evolution of secondarily aquatic tetrapods (whales, dolphins), but then usu.fades away, as swimming efficiency increases.
    Here, we document a remarkable reversal of this pattern: the convergent re-emergence of bone densification in Miocene seals, dolphins & whales from the epi-continental Paratethys Sea (E-Europe, C-Asia).
    This phenomenon was driven by imbalanced remodeling & inhibited resorption of primary trabeculae,
    it coincided with hyper-saline conditions (the Badenian salinity crisis) that affected the C-Paratethys 13.8-13.4 Ma.
    Dense bones acting as ballast would have facilitated efficient swimming in the denser & more buoyant water, and hence were likely adaptive in this setting.
    From the C-Paratethys, POS subsequently spread E.ward, where it became a defining feature of the endemic late-Miocene whale assemblage.

    Pleistocene H.erectus also evolved POS: apparently, they were slow+shallow divers for sessile seafoods, probably mostly shellfish:
    - DHA & larger brain,
    - stone tool use,
    - shellfish engravings google "Joordens Munro".

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  • From Pandora@21:1/5 to littoral.homo@gmail.com on Sun Mar 5 16:43:50 2023
    On Sun, 5 Mar 2023 06:22:51 -0800 (PST), "littor...@gmail.com" <littoral.homo@gmail.com> wrote:

    Hypersalinity drives convergent bone mass increases in Miocene marine mammals from the Paratethys
    Alexandra Houssaye cs 2022 Curr.Biol.32:R42-R44
    doi org/10.1016/j.cub.2021.10.065

    • Miocene marine mammals from the Para-tethys Sea often have highly compact bones.
    • Dense bones evolved independently in Para-tethyan whales, dolphins & seals. >• Bone mass increase may have begun as an adaptation to regional hyper-salinity.
    • Para-tethyan marine mammals persisted, despite being isolated from the world ocean.

    Pachy-osteo-sclerosis (POS creates dense, bulky bones) often characterizes the early evolution of secondarily aquatic tetrapods (whales, dolphins), but then usu.fades away, as swimming efficiency increases.
    Here, we document a remarkable reversal of this pattern: the convergent re-emergence of bone densification in Miocene seals, dolphins & whales from the epi-continental Paratethys Sea (E-Europe, C-Asia).
    This phenomenon was driven by imbalanced remodeling & inhibited resorption of primary trabeculae,
    it coincided with hyper-saline conditions (the Badenian salinity crisis) that affected the C-Paratethys 13.8-13.4 Ma.
    Dense bones acting as ballast would have facilitated efficient swimming in the denser & more buoyant water, and hence were likely adaptive in this setting.
    From the C-Paratethys, POS subsequently spread E.ward, where it became a defining feature of the endemic late-Miocene whale assemblage.

    So there is a correlation between hypersalinity and POS in known
    marine mammals, cetaceans and pinnipeds.
    So far so good.

    Pleistocene H.erectus also evolved POS: apparently, they were slow+shallow divers for sessile seafoods, probably mostly shellfish:

    No Homo erectus fossil has ever been recovered from sediments that
    indicate hypersaline marine conditions.

    - DHA & larger brain,
    - stone tool use,

    I don't recall that stone tools are exclusive to marine exploitation.
    Early Oldowan tools suggest animal butchery in a freshwater
    environment:
    https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abo7452

    - shellfish engravings google "Joordens Munro".

    "we found evidence for freshwater shellfish consumption by hominins" https://www.researchgate.net/publication/269102248_Homo_Erectus_at_Trinil_on_Java_Used_Shells_for_Tool_Production_and_Engraving

    That's not sea food.

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  • From JTEM is so reasonable@21:1/5 to Pandora on Sun Mar 5 16:46:18 2023
    Pandora wrote:

    No Homo erectus fossil has ever been recovered from sediments that
    indicate hypersaline marine conditions.

    So what you're saying is that it's no coincidence what so ever that putting "Paleo" before "Anthropology" has the same result as putting "Biblical"
    before "Archaeology."

    Good. This is good. You're recognizing one of the key issues here, what excludes paleo anthropology from ever being considered a real science:

    The Sample/Selection/Preservation bias.

    - DHA & larger brain,
    - stone tool use,

    I don't recall that stone tools are exclusive to marine exploitation.

    You're an obstructionist. You're not here to discuss ideas but to stop discussion.

    This is a trait of narcissists, btw. They tend to try to end -- obstruct --
    any exchange they can't control. This is something that should worry
    you.

    Because it's not about what you recall, it's about a culmination of
    evidence. It's not where you can find any one piece of the puzzle, it's
    where the pieces come together.

    The DHA thing is complete. It's done. We need DHA in our model.

    Without DHA we don't have our ancestors growing bigger & smarter
    brains...





    -- --

    https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/710425976700649472

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  • From littoral.homo@gmail.com@21:1/5 to All on Mon Mar 6 04:00:01 2023
    Hypersalinity drives convergent bone mass increases in Miocene marine mammals from the Paratethys
    Alexandra Houssaye cs 2022 Curr.Biol.32:R42-R44
    doi org/10.1016/j.cub.2021.10.065
    • Miocene marine mammals from the Para-tethys Sea often have highly compact bones.
    • Dense bones evolved independently in Para-tethyan whales, dolphins & seals.
    • Bone mass increase may have begun as an adaptation to regional hyper-salinity.
    • Para-tethyan marine mammals persisted, despite being isolated from the world ocean.
    Pachy-osteo-sclerosis (POS creates dense, bulky bones) often characterizes the early evolution of secondarily aquatic tetrapods (whales, dolphins), but then usu.fades away, as swimming efficiency increases.
    Here, we document a remarkable reversal of this pattern: the convergent re-emergence of bone densification in Miocene seals, dolphins & whales from the epi-continental Paratethys Sea (E-Europe, C-Asia).
    This phenomenon was driven by imbalanced remodeling & inhibited resorption of primary trabeculae,
    it coincided with hyper-saline conditions (Badenian salinity crisis, C-Paratethys 13.8-13.4 Ma).
    Dense bones acting as ballast would have facilitated efficient swimming in the denser & more buoyant water, and hence were likely adaptive in this setting.
    From the C-Paratethys, POS subsequently spread E.ward, where it became a defining feature of the endemic late-Miocene whale assemblage.

    Kudu runner:

    So there is a correlation between hypersalinity and POS in known
    marine mammals, cetaceans and pinnipeds. So far so good.

    Good boy, you're improving... :-)

    Pleistocene H.erectus also evolved POS: apparently, they were slow+shallow divers for sessile seafoods, probably mostly shellfish:

    No Homo erectus fossil has ever been recovered from sediments that
    indicate hypersaline marine conditions.

    :-D Making up your own nonsense, my little boy?? <inform a bit before speaking,
    e.g. José Joordens 2011 "The power of place" Free Univ.A'dam.

    - DHA & larger brain,
    - stone tool use,

    I don't recall that stone tools are exclusive to marine exploitation.
    Early Oldowan tools suggest animal butchery in a freshwater
    environment:
    https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abo7452

    Yes, thanks, my little boy, again:
    we're saying:
    our ancestors spread along the seas & from the coasts followed therviers inlands.
    Perhaps too difficult for ouw boy?

    - shellfish engravings google "Joordens Munro".
    "we found evidence for freshwater shellfish consumption by hominins" https://www.researchgate.net/publication/269102248_Homo_Erectus_at_Trinil_on_Java_Used_Shells_for_Tool_Production_and_Engraving

    That's not sea food.

    :-DDD
    Now the kudu runner want us to believe shells grow in his savanna... :-DDD Grow up, my little little boy.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Pandora@21:1/5 to littoral.homo@gmail.com on Mon Mar 6 16:16:10 2023
    On Mon, 6 Mar 2023 04:00:01 -0800 (PST), "littor...@gmail.com" <littoral.homo@gmail.com> wrote:

    Hypersalinity drives convergent bone mass increases in Miocene marine mammals from the Paratethys
    Alexandra Houssaye cs 2022 Curr.Biol.32:R42-R44
    doi org/10.1016/j.cub.2021.10.065
    • Miocene marine mammals from the Para-tethys Sea often have highly compact bones.
    • Dense bones evolved independently in Para-tethyan whales, dolphins & seals.
    • Bone mass increase may have begun as an adaptation to regional hyper-salinity.
    • Para-tethyan marine mammals persisted, despite being isolated from the world ocean.
    Pachy-osteo-sclerosis (POS creates dense, bulky bones) often characterizes the early evolution of secondarily aquatic tetrapods (whales, dolphins), but then usu.fades away, as swimming efficiency increases.
    Here, we document a remarkable reversal of this pattern: the convergent re-emergence of bone densification in Miocene seals, dolphins & whales from the epi-continental Paratethys Sea (E-Europe, C-Asia).
    This phenomenon was driven by imbalanced remodeling & inhibited resorption of primary trabeculae,
    it coincided with hyper-saline conditions (Badenian salinity crisis, C-Paratethys 13.8-13.4 Ma).
    Dense bones acting as ballast would have facilitated efficient swimming in the denser & more buoyant water, and hence were likely adaptive in this setting.
    From the C-Paratethys, POS subsequently spread E.ward, where it became a defining feature of the endemic late-Miocene whale assemblage.

    So there is a correlation between hypersalinity and POS in known
    marine mammals, cetaceans and pinnipeds. So far so good.

    Good boy, you're improving... :-)

    Of course cetaceans and pinnipeds also show a lot of other distinctly
    aquatic adaptations that makes them immediately recognizable as such. Pleistocene Homo erectus didn't have flippers.

    Pleistocene H.erectus also evolved POS: apparently, they were slow+shallow divers for sessile seafoods, probably mostly shellfish:

    No Homo erectus fossil has ever been recovered from sediments that
    indicate hypersaline marine conditions.

    :-D Making up your own nonsense, my little boy?? <inform a bit before speaking,
    e.g. José Joordens 2011 "The power of place" Free Univ.A'dam.

    Name one specimen of Homo erectus/ergaster that was recovered from
    marine sediments.

    - DHA & larger brain,
    - stone tool use,

    I don't recall that stone tools are exclusive to marine exploitation.
    Early Oldowan tools suggest animal butchery in a freshwater
    environment:
    https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abo7452

    Yes, thanks, my little boy, again:
    we're saying:
    our ancestors spread along the seas & from the coasts followed therviers inlands.
    Perhaps too difficult for ouw boy?

    Too speculative.

    - shellfish engravings google "Joordens Munro".
    "we found evidence for freshwater shellfish consumption by hominins"
    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/269102248_Homo_Erectus_at_Trinil_on_Java_Used_Shells_for_Tool_Production_and_Engraving

    That's not sea food.

    :-DDD
    Now the kudu runner want us to believe shells grow in his savanna... :-DDD

    See the Mara River Biodiversity Report: https://www.wwfkenya.org/mara_river_biodiversity_report/

    The Mara River is the main water channel in the Serengeti-Mara savanna ecosystem. It has several species of river mussels.

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    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From littoral.homo@gmail.com@21:1/5 to All on Mon Mar 6 09:58:58 2023
    Hypersalinity drives convergent bone mass increases in Miocene marine mammals from the Paratethys
    Alexandra Houssaye cs 2022 Curr.Biol.32:R42-R44
    doi org/10.1016/j.cub.2021.10.065
    • Miocene marine mammals from the Para-tethys Sea often have highly compact bones.
    • Dense bones evolved independently in Para-tethyan whales, dolphins & seals.
    • Bone mass increase may have begun as an adaptation to regional hyper-salinity.
    • Para-tethyan marine mammals persisted, despite being isolated from the world ocean.
    Pachy-osteo-sclerosis (POS creates dense, bulky bones) often characterizes the early evolution of secondarily aquatic tetrapods (whales, dolphins), but then usu.fades away, as swimming efficiency increases.
    Here, we document a remarkable reversal of this pattern: the convergent re-emergence of bone densification in Miocene seals, dolphins & whales from the epi-continental Paratethys Sea (E-Europe, C-Asia).
    This phenomenon was driven by imbalanced remodeling & inhibited resorption of primary trabeculae,
    it coincided with hyper-saline conditions (Badenian salinity crisis, C-Paratethys 13.8-13.4 Ma).
    Dense bones acting as ballast would have facilitated efficient swimming in the denser & more buoyant water, and hence were likely adaptive in this setting.
    From the C-Paratethys, POS subsequently spread E.ward, where it became a defining feature of the endemic late-Miocene whale assemblage.

    Kudu runner:

    So there is a correlation between hypersalinity and POS in known
    marine mammals, cetaceans and pinnipeds. So far so good.

    Good boy, you're improving... :-)

    Of course cetaceans and pinnipeds also show a lot of other distinctly aquatic adaptations that makes them immediately recognizable as such. Pleistocene Homo erectus didn't have flippers.

    Only incredible imbeciles believe flat feet are for running.
    Aquarboreal, my little boy!

    Pleistocene H.erectus also evolved POS: apparently, they were slow+shallow divers for sessile seafoods, probably mostly shellfish:

    No Homo erectus fossil has ever been recovered from sediments that
    indicate hypersaline marine conditions.

    :-D Making up your own nonsense, my little boy?? Inform a bit before speaking,
    e.g. José Joordens 2011 "The power of place" Free Univ.A'dam.

    Name one specimen of Homo erectus/ergaster that was recovered from
    marine sediments.

    Too lazy to look it, my little boy?
    It's your problem, not mine:
    e.g. José Joordens 2011 "The power of place" Free Univ.A'dam.
    Never heard of Mojokerto, my little boy?? ever heard of barnacles?? corals?? Never heard of Sangiran (skull 17)??


    - DHA & larger brain,
    - stone tool use,

    I don't recall that stone tools are exclusive to marine exploitation.
    Early Oldowan tools suggest animal butchery in a freshwater
    environment:
    https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abo7452

    Yes, thanks, my little boy, again:
    we're saying:
    our ancestors spread along the seas & from the coasts followed therviers inlands.
    Perhaps too difficult for our boy?

    Too speculative.

    said the kudu runner... :-DDD
    Waste your own time, my boy.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Pandora@21:1/5 to littoral.homo@gmail.com on Tue Mar 7 11:04:05 2023
    On Mon, 6 Mar 2023 09:58:58 -0800 (PST), "littor...@gmail.com" <littoral.homo@gmail.com> wrote:

    So there is a correlation between hypersalinity and POS in known
    marine mammals, cetaceans and pinnipeds. So far so good.

    Good boy, you're improving... :-)

    Of course cetaceans and pinnipeds also show a lot of other distinctly
    aquatic adaptations that makes them immediately recognizable as such.
    Pleistocene Homo erectus didn't have flippers.

    Only incredible imbeciles believe flat feet are for running.

    Again, the human foot is not flat, it's arched (flatfoot is a
    pathological condition), and as such it is a marvel of spring-lever engineering. See for example: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/19354007_The_spring_in_the_arch_of_the_human_foot

    Now all you have to do is attach this structure to long legs to
    increase stride length.

    Aquarboreal, my little boy!

    Pleistocene H.erectus also evolved POS: apparently, they were slow+shallow divers for sessile seafoods, probably mostly shellfish:

    No Homo erectus fossil has ever been recovered from sediments that
    indicate hypersaline marine conditions.

    :-D Making up your own nonsense, my little boy?? Inform a bit before speaking,
    e.g. José Joordens 2011 "The power of place" Free Univ.A'dam.

    Name one specimen of Homo erectus/ergaster that was recovered from
    marine sediments.

    Too lazy to look it, my little boy?
    It's your problem, not mine:
    e.g. José Joordens 2011 "The power of place" Free Univ.A'dam.
    Never heard of Mojokerto, my little boy?? ever heard of barnacles?? corals??

    "The relocated discovery bed is ~3.3 m of fossiliferous pebbly
    sandstone, a river-channel deposit cut into tuffaceous mudstone. The
    sandstone and mudstone beds correspond to original site descriptions.
    Pebbly sandstone is also found within the skull. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.jhevol.2005.11.002

    No barnacles, no corals.

    Never heard of Sangiran (skull 17)??

    Sangiran 17 derives from fluvial deposits of the Bapang Formation: https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.081077298

    For reconstruction of Sangiran paleoenvironments see: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/23472350

    "By 1.5 Ma, large streams filled the lake and the landscape became
    more riverine in nature, with riparian forests, savanna, and open
    woodland."

    Obviously not marine.

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  • From littoral.homo@gmail.com@21:1/5 to All on Tue Mar 7 03:24:14 2023
    Kudu runner:
    Again, the human foot is not flat,

    :-DDD
    The savanna fantasts become more+more ridiculous:
    Ever seen a horse or dog foot, my little boy?
    Ever heard of digitigrady?? unguligrady?? plantigrady??

    Sigh.
    Waste your own time, e.g. keep running after your kudu...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Pandora@21:1/5 to littoral.homo@gmail.com on Tue Mar 7 15:37:56 2023
    On Tue, 7 Mar 2023 03:24:14 -0800 (PST), "littor...@gmail.com" <littoral.homo@gmail.com> wrote:

    Kudu runner:
    Again, the human foot is not flat,

    :-DDD
    The savanna fantasts become more+more ridiculous:
    Ever seen a horse or dog foot, my little boy?

    Are they bipedal primates?
    Mind historical/phylogenetic constraints.

    Ever heard of digitigrady?? unguligrady?? plantigrady??

    Sure, I have a copy of "Analysis of Vertebrate Structure" by
    Hildebrand and Goslow. See fig. 24.5 in that book: https://www.madsci.org/posts/archives/2000-03/953863144.Zo.1.gif

    Now, watch plantigrade vs unguligrade: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUkB_yKvBHQ

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  • From littoral.homo@gmail.com@21:1/5 to All on Tue Mar 7 12:52:25 2023
    Kudu runner:

    Again, the human foot is not flat,

    :-DDD The savanna fantasts become more+more ridiculous:
    Ever seen a horse or dog foot, my little boy?

    Are they bipedal primates?

    ??? Waste your own time, my boy.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)