So I know I recall some Neanderthal site in Spain
(Gibraltar?) which was unambiguous evidence for
the exploitation of aquatic resources, but here's
some great stuff I ran across:

: Archaeological data from sites in Italy, France and
: Spain confirm that shell fishing and fresh water
: fishing was a common activity of Neandertals, as
: indicated by anatomical studies recently published
: by E. Trinkaus.

Eric Trinkaus is one of the men that I've mentioned
before, together with Wolpoff, part of my personal
journey through the hellscape that is paleo
anthropology. Seemed to me, they were two of the
precious few number of men willing to do science
and discuss facts, rather than mindlessly adhere to
some centrally distributed talking points...

Trinkaus pretty proved beyond the shadow of a
doubt that Neanderthals were interbreeding with
so called "Moderns," only to be upstaged by the
slightly later release of the DNA findings.

Which left me bitter.

Because could see the fossils. Even us outsiders,
we could see photographs. They could and did point
to exactly what they were talking about, men like
Trinkaus, and we could see the proof with out own
eyes... and people simple REFUSED to do that. BUT
THEN someone produced evidence which they couldn't
see, which they had to rely 100% on authority figures
for, and they were filling to believe... they instantly
accepted and "Forgot" everything they had believed
before that moment.

So that's why I have zero faith in people, when it
comes to paleo anthropology.

"Don't show me! Don't ask me to look and believe my
own senses! Don't ask me to form opinions! No,
instead bring out the high priest and have him tell me
exactly what I think."

Yeah, I hate people...

So when it comes to "Proving" Aquatic Ape to people
like that -- the public and run of the mill paleo
anthropology folks -- I could not care less. For one
thing I leave the "Proof" to those who are far smarter
than I am, and secondly why bother trying to convince
a stone? It can't hear you, it can't see and it's never
going to agree with you... it can't. It's not within it's
nature to think.

No, I'd rather move on from the "Proof" to a discussion
on the implications. Or working out the details. Or
arguing the extant. That's where my interest lies. Leave
the "Proof" to the smart people with infinitely more
patience than I ever had. It's proven. You did it. You
succeeded. You haven't convinced too many people
but that is the nature of the game... the flaw of
humanity.

Eventually some inbred twit will have nothing better to
do so he'll "Discover" Aquatic Ape and "Independently"
come up with all your proof, and Pavlov's Dogs will
drool on command... believing every word of it...
forgetting that they bad mouthed you all these years.

I hate people.





-- --

https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/677605208844550144

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Saturday, March 5, 2022 at 8:43:42 PM UTC-5, I Envy JTEM wrote:

So I know I recall some Neanderthal site in Spain
(Gibraltar?) which was unambiguous evidence for
the exploitation of aquatic resources, but here's
some great stuff I ran across:

: Archaeological data from sites in Italy, France and
: Spain confirm that shell fishing and fresh water
: fishing was a common activity of Neandertals, as
: indicated by anatomical studies recently published
: by E. Trinkaus.

Eric Trinkaus is one of the men that I've mentioned
before, together with Wolpoff, part of my personal
journey through the hellscape that is paleo
anthropology. Seemed to me, they were two of the
precious few number of men willing to do science
and discuss facts, rather than mindlessly adhere to
some centrally distributed talking points...

Trinkaus pretty proved beyond the shadow of a
doubt that Neanderthals were interbreeding with
so called "Moderns," only to be upstaged by the
slightly later release of the DNA findings.

Which left me bitter.

Because could see the fossils. Even us outsiders,
we could see photographs. They could and did point
to exactly what they were talking about, men like
Trinkaus, and we could see the proof with out own
eyes... and people simple REFUSED to do that. BUT
THEN someone produced evidence which they couldn't
see, which they had to rely 100% on authority figures
for, and they were filling to believe... they instantly
accepted and "Forgot" everything they had believed
before that moment.

So that's why I have zero faith in people, when it
comes to paleo anthropology.

"Don't show me! Don't ask me to look and believe my
own senses! Don't ask me to form opinions! No,
instead bring out the high priest and have him tell me
exactly what I think."

Yeah, I hate people...

So when it comes to "Proving" Aquatic Ape to people
like that -- the public and run of the mill paleo
anthropology folks -- I could not care less. For one
thing I leave the "Proof" to those who are far smarter
than I am, and secondly why bother trying to convince
a stone? It can't hear you, it can't see and it's never
going to agree with you... it can't. It's not within it's
nature to think.

No, I'd rather move on from the "Proof" to a discussion
on the implications. Or working out the details. Or
arguing the extant. That's where my interest lies. Leave
the "Proof" to the smart people with infinitely more
patience than I ever had. It's proven. You did it. You
succeeded. You haven't convinced too many people
but that is the nature of the game... the flaw of
humanity.

Eventually some inbred twit will have nothing better to
do so he'll "Discover" Aquatic Ape and "Independently"
come up with all your proof, and Pavlov's Dogs will
drool on command... believing every word of it...
forgetting that they bad mouthed you all these years.

I hate people.

-- --

https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/677605208844550144

Devotee of mermaid victoria.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

I Envy JTEM wrote:

So I know I recall some Neanderthal site in Spain
(Gibraltar?) which was unambiguous evidence for
the exploitation of aquatic resources, but here's
some great stuff I ran across:

: Archaeological data from sites in Italy, France and
: Spain confirm that shell fishing and fresh water
: fishing was a common activity of Neandertals, as
: indicated by anatomical studies recently published
: by E. Trinkaus.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31940356/

Forgot to include the cite. Oh I know I posted it elsewhere
but I should have included it here...

Eric Trinkaus is one of the men that I've mentioned
before, together with Wolpoff, part of my personal
journey through the hellscape that is paleo
anthropology. Seemed to me, they were two of the
precious few number of men willing to do science
and discuss facts, rather than mindlessly adhere to
some centrally distributed talking points...

Trinkaus pretty proved beyond the shadow of a
doubt that Neanderthals were interbreeding with
so called "Moderns," only to be upstaged by the
slightly later release of the DNA findings.

Which left me bitter.

Because could see the fossils. Even us outsiders,
we could see photographs. They could and did point
to exactly what they were talking about, men like
Trinkaus, and we could see the proof with out own
eyes... and people simple REFUSED to do that. BUT
THEN someone produced evidence which they couldn't
see, which they had to rely 100% on authority figures
for, and they were filling to believe... they instantly
accepted and "Forgot" everything they had believed
before that moment.

So that's why I have zero faith in people, when it
comes to paleo anthropology.

"Don't show me! Don't ask me to look and believe my
own senses! Don't ask me to form opinions! No,
instead bring out the high priest and have him tell me
exactly what I think."

Yeah, I hate people...

So when it comes to "Proving" Aquatic Ape to people
like that -- the public and run of the mill paleo
anthropology folks -- I could not care less. For one
thing I leave the "Proof" to those who are far smarter
than I am, and secondly why bother trying to convince
a stone? It can't hear you, it can't see and it's never
going to agree with you... it can't. It's not within it's
nature to think.

No, I'd rather move on from the "Proof" to a discussion
on the implications. Or working out the details. Or
arguing the extant. That's where my interest lies. Leave
the "Proof" to the smart people with infinitely more
patience than I ever had. It's proven. You did it. You
succeeded. You haven't convinced too many people
but that is the nature of the game... the flaw of
humanity.

Eventually some inbred twit will have nothing better to
do so he'll "Discover" Aquatic Ape and "Independently"
come up with all your proof, and Pavlov's Dogs will
drool on command... believing every word of it...
forgetting that they bad mouthed you all these years.

I hate people.

-- --

https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/677605208844550144

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Op zondag 6 maart 2022 om 04:08:13 UTC+1 schreef I Envy JTEM:

: Archaeological data from sites in Italy, France and
: Spain confirm that shell fishing and fresh water
: fishing was a common activity of Neandertals, as
: indicated by anatomical studies recently published
: by E. Trinkaus.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31940356/

Thanks a lot! :-)

Neandertals on the beach:
use of marine resources at Grotta dei Moscerini (Latium, Italy)
Paola Villa cs 2020 PLoS One 15:e0226690
doi 10.1371/journal.pone.0226690

Excavated in 1949, GdM (MIS-5 to early-MIS-4) is 1 of two 2 Hn sites with a large assemblage of retouched shells (n=171) from 21 layers.
The other occurrence is from the broadly contemporaneous layer-L of Grotta del Cavallo, S-Italy (n=126).
8 other Mousterian sites in Italy & 1 in Greece also have shell tools, but in a very small number.

The shell tools are made on valves of the smooth clam Callista chione.
The general idea that the valves of Callista chione were collected by Hn on the beach, after the death of the mollusk is incomplete:
at Moscerini, 24 % of the spms were gathered directly from the sea-floor as live animals by skin-diving Hn.
Archaeological data from sites in Italy, France & Spain confirm:
shell-fishing & fresh-water fishing was a common activity of Hn, as indicated by anatomical studies (E.Trinkaus).
Lithic analysis provides data to show the relation between stone tools & shell tools.
Several layers contain pumices, derived from volcanic eruptions in the Ischia Island or the Campi Flegrei (prior to the Campanian Ignimbrite mega-eruption).
Their rounded edges indicate:
they were transported by sea-currents to the beach at the base of the Moscerini sequence.
Their presence in the occupation layers above the beach is discussed.
The most plausible hypothesis is: they were collected by Hn.
Incontrovertible evidence that Hn collected pumices is provided by a cave in Liguria. Use of pumices as abraders is well documented in the UP.
We prove :
the exploitation of submerged aquatic resources & the collection of pumices common in the UP were part of Hn behavior, well before Hs arrival in W-Europe.

_____

Yes, we knew this:
-Hn had huge brains: CC Hn>Hs>He,
-pachyosteosclerosis: POS He>Hn>Hs.

Probably
- Hn had more variable diets than He (only sea-food?),
- Hn seasonally followed the rivers inland (reduced POS),
- Hs had also a lot non-aquatic foods: CC Hs<Hn.


Callista chione (the smooth clam) is a rather large, temperate, marine, bivalve mollusc (sandy bottoms or with small pebbles in clean waters down to c 200 m from the British Isles to the Med).
The shell can reach up to c 110 mm Ø, its outer side is smooth, and ranges from light greenish creamy colour to medium brown (probably matching the background), the interior is white to soft pink.
The concentric & radial growth-lines are easily seen.
It is edible, different dishes are prepared throughout the Med: Spain, Italy, France, the Balkan, Maghreb.

As is the case with many bivalve molluscs (filter-feeders filter food particles from the water), Callista chione is common in fish-markets in the Mediterranean.
It concentrates toxins from dino-flagellates blooms ass.x pollution events: red tides, sewage water, old sediment dredging, ship ballast water dumping etc.
These toxins cannot be eliminated by the traditional cleansing of shellfish in clean water or by cooking,
they can be responsible for complex human health problems: respiratory ailments, skin rashes, paralysis (PSP paralytic shellfish poisoning) etc.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Sunday, March 6, 2022 at 8:23:14 AM UTC-5, littor...@gmail.com wrote:

Op zondag 6 maart 2022 om 04:08:13 UTC+1 schreef I Envy JTEM:

: Archaeological data from sites in Italy, France and
: Spain confirm that shell fishing and fresh water
: fishing was a common activity of Neandertals, as
: indicated by anatomical studies recently published
: by E. Trinkaus.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31940356/

Thanks a lot! :-)

Neandertals on the beach:
use of marine resources at Grotta dei Moscerini (Latium, Italy)
Paola Villa cs 2020 PLoS One 15:e0226690
doi 10.1371/journal.pone.0226690

Excavated in 1949, GdM (MIS-5 to early-MIS-4) is 1 of two 2 Hn sites with a large assemblage of retouched shells (n=171) from 21 layers.
The other occurrence is from the broadly contemporaneous layer-L of Grotta del Cavallo, S-Italy (n=126).
8 other Mousterian sites in Italy & 1 in Greece also have shell tools, but in a very small number.

The shell tools are made on valves of the smooth clam Callista chione.
The general idea that the valves of Callista chione were collected by Hn on the beach, after the death of the mollusk is incomplete:
at Moscerini, 24 % of the spms were gathered directly from the sea-floor as live animals by skin-diving Hn.
Archaeological data from sites in Italy, France & Spain confirm: shell-fishing & fresh-water fishing was a common activity of Hn, as indicated by anatomical studies (E.Trinkaus).
Lithic analysis provides data to show the relation between stone tools & shell tools.
Several layers contain pumices, derived from volcanic eruptions in the Ischia Island or the Campi Flegrei (prior to the Campanian Ignimbrite mega-eruption).
Their rounded edges indicate:
they were transported by sea-currents to the beach at the base of the Moscerini sequence.
Their presence in the occupation layers above the beach is discussed.
The most plausible hypothesis is: they were collected by Hn. Incontrovertible evidence that Hn collected pumices is provided by a cave in Liguria. Use of pumices as abraders is well documented in the UP.
We prove :
the exploitation of submerged aquatic resources & the collection of pumices common in the UP were part of Hn behavior, well before Hs arrival in W-Europe.

_____

Yes, we knew this:
-Hn had huge brains: CC Hn>Hs>He,
-pachyosteosclerosis: POS He>Hn>Hs.

Probably
- Hn had more variable diets than He (only sea-food?),
- Hn seasonally followed the rivers inland (reduced POS),
- Hs had also a lot non-aquatic foods: CC Hs<Hn.

Callista chione (the smooth clam) is a rather large, temperate, marine, bivalve mollusc (sandy bottoms or with small pebbles in clean waters down to c 200 m from the British Isles to the Med).
The shell can reach up to c 110 mm Ø, its outer side is smooth, and ranges from light greenish creamy colour to medium brown (probably matching the background), the interior is white to soft pink.
The concentric & radial growth-lines are easily seen.
It is edible, different dishes are prepared throughout the Med: Spain, Italy, France, the Balkan, Maghreb.

As is the case with many bivalve molluscs (filter-feeders filter food particles from the water), Callista chione is common in fish-markets in the Mediterranean.
It concentrates toxins from dino-flagellates blooms ass.x pollution events: red tides, sewage water, old sediment dredging, ship ballast water dumping etc.
These toxins cannot be eliminated by the traditional cleansing of shellfish in clean water or by cooking,
they can be responsible for complex human health problems: respiratory ailments, skin rashes, paralysis (PSP paralytic shellfish poisoning) etc.

-

Sorry Charlie.

"On the beach", "just offshore". Seafloor starts 1mm below the water surface at low tide.

RESEARCH NOTES Growth of the smooth clam, Callista chione (Linnaeus, 1758) (Bivalvia: Veneridae)from the Thracian Sea, northeastern MediterraneanP.K. Leontarakis1and C.A. Richardson21Fisheries Research Institute, N.AG.RE.F., Nea Peramos, 640 07 Kavala,
Greece; 2School of Ocean Sciences, University of Wales, Bangor, Menai Bridge LL59 5AB, UK

The smooth clam, Callista chione (Linnaeus, 1758), is a shallow-burrowing filter feeder, inhabiting sandy sediments, from just offshore...

The Homo with the densest bones are Central West Africans, same area as West African Manatees, one sleeps in water, one in dome huts.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Op maandag 7 maart 2022 om 03:13:54 UTC+1 schreef DD'eDeN aka note/nickname/alas_my_loves:

Our little mermaid can't stop repeating the same irrelevancies:
:

The Homo with the densest bones are Central West Africans

Dear mermaid,
no healthy human (Asiatic, African, Eur., American...) is pachyosteosclerotic. Luckily: POS = fragile = osteopetrosis = bone freactures++

POS He>Hn>Hs
-erectus dived for shellfish
-neand. seasonally dived for shellfish
-sapiens rarely dives for shellfish

But this is probably too difficult for mermaids...

In any case, only incredible imbeciles believe their Pleistocene ancestors ran after antelopes.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Monday, March 7, 2022 at 6:25:11 AM UTC-5, littor...@gmail.com wrote:

Op maandag 7 maart 2022 om 03:13:54 UTC+1 schreef DD'eDeN aka note/nickname/alas_my_loves:

Our little mermaid can't stop repeating the same irrelevancies:
:

The Homo with the densest bones are Central West Africans

Dear mermaid,
no healthy human (Asiatic, African, Eur., American...) is pachyosteosclerotic.
Luckily: POS = fragile = osteopetrosis = bone freactures++

I've already showed posts about human dense bones being extremely fracture-resistant. You are in denial. Osteoporosis = fragile!! Study a bit.

POS He>Hn>Hs
-erectus dived for shellfish
-neand. seasonally dived for shellfish
-sapiens rarely dives for shellfish

But this is probably too difficult for mermaids...

In any case, only incredible imbeciles believe their Pleistocene ancestors ran after antelopes.

Backfloating saiga??

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

DD'eDeN aka note/nickname/alas_my_loves wrote:

[...]

http://aquatic-human-ancestor.org/anatomy/pachyostosis.html

Don't give up! Maybe there's some truth to reincarnation and you can come
back next time as someone who isn't a moron.

Good luck!




-- --

https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/678043055282061312

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

.On Monday, March 7, 2022 at 7:14:29 AM UTC-5, DD'eDeN aka note/nickname/alas_my_loves wrote:

On Monday, March 7, 2022 at 6:25:11 AM UTC-5, littor...@gmail.com wrote:

Op maandag 7 maart 2022 om 03:13:54 UTC+1 schreef DD'eDeN aka note/nickname/alas_my_loves:

Our little mermaid can't stop repeating the same irrelevancies:
:

The Homo with the densest bones are Central West Africans

Dear mermaid,
no healthy human (Asiatic, African, Eur., American...) is pachyosteosclerotic.
Luckily: POS = fragile = osteopetrosis = bone freactures++

I've already showed posts about human dense bones being extremely fracture-resistant. You are in denial. Osteoporosis = fragile!! Study a bit.

POS He>Hn>Hs
-erectus dived for shellfish
-neand. seasonally dived for shellfish
-sapiens rarely dives for shellfish

But this is probably too difficult for mermaids...

In any case, only incredible imbeciles believe their Pleistocene ancestors ran after antelopes.

Backfloating saiga??

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)