• automatic center punch

    From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to All on Sun Aug 14 21:12:12 2022
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett. I should have done this a long time ago.

    Bob

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  • From Jack@21:1/5 to Bob Davis on Mon Aug 15 09:56:01 2022
    On 8/15/2022 12:12 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett. I should have done this a long time ago.

    Bob

    I have an el-cheapo center punch that I mainly use on wood, but it seems
    to work fine on metal when I use it. I think I paid about 6x's less than
    a Starrett that does the same thing?

    Seems an extremely uncomplicated tool, I'm a little curious what failed?

    --
    Jack
    Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.

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  • From Leon@21:1/5 to Jack on Mon Aug 15 10:24:03 2022
    On 8/15/2022 8:56 AM, Jack wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 12:12 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center
    punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett.  I should have done
    this a long time ago.

    Bob

    I have an el-cheapo center punch that I mainly use on wood, but it seems
    to work fine on metal when I use it. I think I paid about 6x's less than
    a Starrett that does the same thing?

    Seems an extremely uncomplicated tool, I'm a little curious what failed?


    The key problem is probably the "automatic" center punch. Some are
    spring loaded and I guess they will jump or relocate when pulling back
    on the spring.

    I use a pointy pokey thing, similar to an awl. for wood and a 40 year
    old Craftsman center punch for metal. I have re-pointed that one
    several times.

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  • From hubops@ccanoemail.com@21:1/5 to All on Mon Aug 15 11:48:02 2022
    On Mon, 15 Aug 2022 10:24:03 -0500, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 8/15/2022 8:56 AM, Jack wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 12:12 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center
    punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett. I should have done
    this a long time ago.

    Bob

    I have an el-cheapo center punch that I mainly use on wood, but it seems
    to work fine on metal when I use it. I think I paid about 6x's less than
    a Starrett that does the same thing?

    Seems an extremely uncomplicated tool, I'm a little curious what failed?


    The key problem is probably the "automatic" center punch. Some are
    spring loaded and I guess they will jump or relocate when pulling back
    on the spring.


    No pulling up involved in these spring loaded ones -
    - just pressing down :

    https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/hand-tools/punches/56652-spring-loaded-punches

    The Starrett is the same - position the point & push down.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TsY8U4exqOE

    There is a version that self centers for hinges.

    John T.

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  • From DerbyDad03@21:1/5 to hub...@ccanoemail.com on Mon Aug 15 09:36:08 2022
    On Monday, August 15, 2022 at 11:47:36 AM UTC-4, hub...@ccanoemail.com wrote:
    On Mon, 15 Aug 2022 10:24:03 -0500, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 8:56 AM, Jack wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 12:12 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center
    punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett. I should have done
    this a long time ago.

    Bob

    I have an el-cheapo center punch that I mainly use on wood, but it seems >> to work fine on metal when I use it. I think I paid about 6x's less than >> a Starrett that does the same thing?

    Seems an extremely uncomplicated tool, I'm a little curious what failed? >>

    The key problem is probably the "automatic" center punch. Some are
    spring loaded and I guess they will jump or relocate when pulling back
    on the spring.

    No pulling up involved in these spring loaded ones -
    - just pressing down :

    https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/hand-tools/punches/56652-spring-loaded-punches

    The Starrett is the same - position the point & push down.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TsY8U4exqOE

    There is a version that self centers for hinges.

    John T.

    I've used brad point drill bits as center punches.

    For my last project, where I wanted to plug the screw holes,
    I made a jig from 1/2" ply with 3/8" holes to line up the screw
    holes. I chucked up a 3/8" brad point bit, held the jig in place,
    and gave the trigger a quick pull in each hole. Removed the jig
    and drilled each hole with a counter sink bit, then drove the
    screws.

    It's good to have 3 cordless drills. ;-)

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  • From DerbyDad03@21:1/5 to wrober...@gmail.com on Mon Aug 15 09:18:48 2022
    On Monday, August 15, 2022 at 12:12:14 AM UTC-4, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett. I should have done this a long time ago.

    Bob

    What failed?

    I had an HF center punch that failed after about 10 years, so
    I bought another one. Still going strong, although I don't remember
    how long I've had the 2nd one. It's been quite a while, i.e. years.

    The 1st device stopped firing. Current price is $4. I'd buy it again.

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  • From Eli the Bearded@21:1/5 to wrobertdavis@gmail.com on Mon Aug 15 22:03:52 2022
    In rec.woodworking, Bob Davis <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous
    brand automatic center punch, I bit the bullet
    and bought a Starrett. I should have done this
    a long time ago.

    About ten years ago I bought an automatic center punch from my local
    hardware store. Clerk selling it said she'd recently had the same brand
    one fail on her (busted spring) and I should save the receipt in case it happens to me.

    It hasn't, and I tossed the receipt, which I had tacked up on the wall
    next to the bench, earlier this year.

    Elijah
    ------
    might consider replacing spring if it breaks

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  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to Jack on Mon Aug 15 18:01:29 2022
    On Monday, August 15, 2022 at 8:56:07 AM UTC-5, Jack wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 12:12 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett. I should have done this a long time ago.

    Bob
    I have an el-cheapo center punch that I mainly use on wood, but it seems
    to work fine on metal when I use it. I think I paid about 6x's less than
    a Starrett that does the same thing?

    Seems an extremely uncomplicated tool, I'm a little curious what failed?

    --
    Jack
    Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.

    I saw an article that highlighted the number of designs for automatic center punch at the US Patent office. The variations are an assortment of springs, ball bearings, and odd shaped metal pistons - not quite as uncomplicated as outside appearances.

    Every one of mine that failed, just quit releasing the spring energy designed to slam the punch into the target workpiece. There was no obvious wear or misalignment.

    Bob

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  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to Leon on Mon Aug 15 18:05:55 2022
    On Monday, August 15, 2022 at 10:24:08 AM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 8:56 AM, Jack wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 12:12 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center
    punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett. I should have done
    this a long time ago.

    Bob

    I have an el-cheapo center punch that I mainly use on wood, but it seems
    to work fine on metal when I use it. I think I paid about 6x's less than
    a Starrett that does the same thing?

    Seems an extremely uncomplicated tool, I'm a little curious what failed?

    The key problem is probably the "automatic" center punch. Some are
    spring loaded and I guess they will jump or relocate when pulling back
    on the spring.

    I use a pointy pokey thing, similar to an awl. for wood and a 40 year
    old Craftsman center punch for metal. I have re-pointed that one
    several times.

    An automatic punch can get into tight situations where there is no room for a manual punch and the associated hammer swing to drive it. In the end, it's all personal preference and style. Everyone's method is the best if it works for them.

    Bob

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  • From DerbyDad03@21:1/5 to wrober...@gmail.com on Mon Aug 15 19:08:52 2022
    On Monday, August 15, 2022 at 9:05:58 PM UTC-4, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    On Monday, August 15, 2022 at 10:24:08 AM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 8:56 AM, Jack wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 12:12 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center
    punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett. I should have done
    this a long time ago.

    Bob

    I have an el-cheapo center punch that I mainly use on wood, but it seems to work fine on metal when I use it. I think I paid about 6x's less than a Starrett that does the same thing?

    Seems an extremely uncomplicated tool, I'm a little curious what failed?

    The key problem is probably the "automatic" center punch. Some are
    spring loaded and I guess they will jump or relocate when pulling back
    on the spring.

    I use a pointy pokey thing, similar to an awl. for wood and a 40 year
    old Craftsman center punch for metal. I have re-pointed that one
    several times.
    An automatic punch can get into tight situations where there is no room for a manual punch and the associated hammer swing to drive it. In the end, it's all personal preference and style. Everyone's method is the best if it works for them.

    Bob

    ...and it's good to have multiple methods.

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  • From pyotr filipivich@21:1/5 to All on Tue Aug 16 08:54:00 2022
    Bob Davis <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> on Mon, 15 Aug 2022 18:05:55 -0700
    (PDT) typed in rec.woodworking the following:
    On Monday, August 15, 2022 at 10:24:08 AM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 8:56 AM, Jack wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 12:12 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center
    punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett. I should have done
    this a long time ago.

    Bob

    I have an el-cheapo center punch that I mainly use on wood, but it seems >> > to work fine on metal when I use it. I think I paid about 6x's less than >> > a Starrett that does the same thing?

    Seems an extremely uncomplicated tool, I'm a little curious what failed? >> >
    The key problem is probably the "automatic" center punch. Some are
    spring loaded and I guess they will jump or relocate when pulling back
    on the spring.

    I use a pointy pokey thing, similar to an awl. for wood and a 40 year
    old Craftsman center punch for metal. I have re-pointed that one
    several times.

    An automatic punch can get into tight situations where there is no room for a manual punch and the associated hammer swing to drive it. In the end, it's all personal preference and style. Everyone's method is the best if it works for them.

    I have seen, (and sold) some which aren't "automatic" but are two
    parts connected by a spring. place the pointy end on the target, pull
    the other 'handle' away and let go, the spring provides enough "oomph"
    to make the mark.
    I wish I'd bought one. My one automatic punch has a burr ...
    works fin as a "punch" but the pointy bit doesn't slide.
    --
    pyotr filipivich
    This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
    Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
    Selecting who insufficiently Woke(tm) as to serve as the new Them(tm)

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  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to phamp@mindspring.com on Tue Aug 16 15:46:32 2022
    On Tue, 16 Aug 2022 08:54:00 -0700, pyotr filipivich
    <phamp@mindspring.com> wrote:

    Bob Davis <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> on Mon, 15 Aug 2022 18:05:55 -0700
    (PDT) typed in rec.woodworking the following:
    On Monday, August 15, 2022 at 10:24:08 AM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 8:56 AM, Jack wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 12:12 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center
    punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett. I should have done
    this a long time ago.

    Bob

    I have an el-cheapo center punch that I mainly use on wood, but it seems >>> > to work fine on metal when I use it. I think I paid about 6x's less than >>> > a Starrett that does the same thing?

    Seems an extremely uncomplicated tool, I'm a little curious what failed? >>> >
    The key problem is probably the "automatic" center punch. Some are
    spring loaded and I guess they will jump or relocate when pulling back
    on the spring.

    I use a pointy pokey thing, similar to an awl. for wood and a 40 year
    old Craftsman center punch for metal. I have re-pointed that one
    several times.

    An automatic punch can get into tight situations where there is no room for a manual punch and the associated hammer swing to drive it. In the end, it's all personal preference and style. Everyone's method is the best if it works for them.

    I have seen, (and sold) some which aren't "automatic" but are two
    parts connected by a spring. place the pointy end on the target, pull
    the other 'handle' away and let go, the spring provides enough "oomph"
    to make the mark.
    I wish I'd bought one. My one automatic punch has a burr ...
    works fin as a "punch" but the pointy bit doesn't slide.

    Woodcraft sells these with different sized pointy ends for hinges. I
    don't see them on their site but they had them in the store(?).

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    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From hubops@ccanoemail.com@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Tue Aug 16 16:04:52 2022
    On Tue, 16 Aug 2022 15:46:32 -0400, krw@notreal.com wrote:

    On Tue, 16 Aug 2022 08:54:00 -0700, pyotr filipivich
    <phamp@mindspring.com> wrote:

    Bob Davis <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> on Mon, 15 Aug 2022 18:05:55 -0700
    (PDT) typed in rec.woodworking the following:
    On Monday, August 15, 2022 at 10:24:08 AM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 8:56 AM, Jack wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 12:12 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center >>>> >> punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett. I should have done
    this a long time ago.

    Bob

    I have an el-cheapo center punch that I mainly use on wood, but it seems >>>> > to work fine on metal when I use it. I think I paid about 6x's less than >>>> > a Starrett that does the same thing?

    Seems an extremely uncomplicated tool, I'm a little curious what failed? >>>> >
    The key problem is probably the "automatic" center punch. Some are
    spring loaded and I guess they will jump or relocate when pulling back >>>> on the spring.

    I use a pointy pokey thing, similar to an awl. for wood and a 40 year
    old Craftsman center punch for metal. I have re-pointed that one
    several times.

    An automatic punch can get into tight situations where there is no room for a manual punch and the associated hammer swing to drive it. In the end, it's all personal preference and style. Everyone's method is the best if it works for them.

    I have seen, (and sold) some which aren't "automatic" but are two >>parts connected by a spring. place the pointy end on the target, pull
    the other 'handle' away and let go, the spring provides enough "oomph"
    to make the mark.
    I wish I'd bought one. My one automatic punch has a burr ...
    works fin as a "punch" but the pointy bit doesn't slide.

    Woodcraft sells these with different sized pointy ends for hinges. I
    don't see them on their site but they had them in the store(?).


    Seems like a 2-handed device < ? > where a 1-handed version
    is more-available .. and, I'd guess - much faster to use ..
    Unless I'm missing something ?
    I also use an ancient little scratch awl for my centre-pokes <wood>
    and a much newer < ~ 50 year old > solid centre punch for sinking
    finishing nails or for metal. No moving parts. No complaints.
    John T.

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  • From pyotr filipivich@21:1/5 to All on Tue Aug 16 19:03:34 2022
    hubops@ccanoemail.com on Tue, 16 Aug 2022 16:04:52 -0400 typed in rec.woodworking the following:

    An automatic punch can get into tight situations where there is no room for a manual punch and the associated hammer swing to drive it. In the end, it's all personal preference and style. Everyone's method is the best if it works for them.

    I have seen, (and sold) some which aren't "automatic" but are two >>>parts connected by a spring. place the pointy end on the target, pull
    the other 'handle' away and let go, the spring provides enough "oomph"
    to make the mark.
    I wish I'd bought one. My one automatic punch has a burr ...
    works fin as a "punch" but the pointy bit doesn't slide.

    Woodcraft sells these with different sized pointy ends for hinges. I
    don't see them on their site but they had them in the store(?).


    Seems like a 2-handed device < ? >

    Now that I think about, yes, it is.

    where a 1-handed version is more-available .. and, I'd guess - much faster to use ..
    Unless I'm missing something ?

    Nope. Which maybe one of the reasons I didn't get one.

    I also use an ancient little scratch awl for my centre-pokes <wood>
    and a much newer < ~ 50 year old > solid centre punch for sinking
    finishing nails or for metal. No moving parts. No complaints.

    No moving parts is good.
    --
    pyotr filipivich
    This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
    Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
    Selecting who insufficiently Woke(tm) as to serve as the new Them(tm)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jack@21:1/5 to Leon on Wed Aug 17 10:16:57 2022
    On 8/15/2022 11:24 AM, Leon wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 8:56 AM, Jack wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 12:12 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center
    punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett.  I should have done
    this a long time ago.

    Bob

    I have an el-cheapo center punch that I mainly use on wood, but it
    seems to work fine on metal when I use it. I think I paid about 6x's
    less than a Starrett that does the same thing?

    Seems an extremely uncomplicated tool, I'm a little curious what failed?


    The key problem is probably the "automatic" center punch.   Some are
    spring loaded and I guess they will jump or relocate when pulling back
    on the spring.
    The one I have you simply push down, no pulling required. I reckon the
    spring could break, or weaken with enough use.



    --
    Jack
    Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jack@21:1/5 to Bob Davis on Wed Aug 17 10:25:01 2022
    On 8/15/2022 9:01 PM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Monday, August 15, 2022 at 8:56:07 AM UTC-5, Jack wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 12:12 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett. I should have done this a long time ago.

    Bob
    I have an el-cheapo center punch that I mainly use on wood, but it seems
    to work fine on metal when I use it. I think I paid about 6x's less than
    a Starrett that does the same thing?

    Seems an extremely uncomplicated tool, I'm a little curious what failed?

    --
    Jack
    Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.

    I saw an article that highlighted the number of designs for automatic center punch at the US Patent office. The variations are an assortment of springs, ball bearings, and odd shaped metal pistons - not quite as uncomplicated as outside appearances.

    Every one of mine that failed, just quit releasing the spring energy designed to slam the punch into the target workpiece. There was no obvious wear or misalignment.

    Bob

    Thanks Bob, I reckon you use yours a lot. I've had mine a long time but
    it doesn't get all that much use. The tension is adjustable, which I set
    on most powerful and forget about it.

    I use mine most often on wood in my wood lathe, where I can easily place
    a dent for the live center and so on. Works great for that and it has a permanent location in my lathe bench top. Works fine for punching metal
    as well, and the one hand use is what is so handy.

    --
    Jack
    Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.

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    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to Jack on Thu Aug 18 08:33:15 2022
    On Wednesday, August 17, 2022 at 9:25:07 AM UTC-5, Jack wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 9:01 PM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Monday, August 15, 2022 at 8:56:07 AM UTC-5, Jack wrote:
    On 8/15/2022 12:12 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    After the failure of the third miscellaneous brand automatic center punch, I bit the bullet and bought a Starrett. I should have done this a long time ago.

    Bob
    I have an el-cheapo center punch that I mainly use on wood, but it seems >> to work fine on metal when I use it. I think I paid about 6x's less than >> a Starrett that does the same thing?

    Seems an extremely uncomplicated tool, I'm a little curious what failed? >>
    --
    Jack
    Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.

    I saw an article that highlighted the number of designs for automatic center punch at the US Patent office. The variations are an assortment of springs, ball bearings, and odd shaped metal pistons - not quite as uncomplicated as outside appearances.

    Every one of mine that failed, just quit releasing the spring energy designed to slam the punch into the target workpiece. There was no obvious wear or misalignment.

    Bob

    Thanks Bob, I reckon you use yours a lot.

    I am a klutz when it comes to lining something up with one hand and striking it with a hammer in the other. The automatic punch requires less coordination (for me).

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