• Bora centipede

    From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to All on Tue Feb 22 09:59:34 2022
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DerbyDad03@21:1/5 to wrober...@gmail.com on Tue Feb 22 10:48:58 2022
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    How do you breakdown the sheets on the assembly table? i.e. How do you support the cut?

    Isn't the Centipede just a bunch of "points"?

    A full sheet of foam insulation might work, but a couple of 2' x 4's wouldn't, would they?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Scott Lurndal@21:1/5 to Bob Davis on Tue Feb 22 20:28:07 2022
    Bob Davis <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> writes:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    If you have the room, nothing beats a panel saw for that application.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to teamarrows@eznet.net on Tue Feb 22 15:23:55 2022
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 10:48:58 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teamarrows@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote: >> I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    How do you breakdown the sheets on the assembly table? i.e. How do you support the cut?

    Isn't the Centipede just a bunch of "points"?

    A full sheet of foam insulation might work, but a couple of 2' x 4's wouldn't, would they?

    I use solid core doors with MDF or melamine as sacrificial tops for
    both my assembly and "cutting" tables. A door is a door, so they're
    the same size. ;-)

    For breaking down sheet goods, I do use 2x4s under the sheet. I have
    something like five (I think I have some others somewhere) 5' 2x4s
    that I place under the sheet. Two on each side of the cut and one
    goes somewhere else (depending on the cut). I get the inner 2x4's as
    close to the cut as possible. It works for me but I may switch to the insulation method. It looks easier.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DerbyDad03@21:1/5 to k...@notreal.com on Tue Feb 22 12:35:01 2022
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 3:24:00 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 10:48:58 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    How do you breakdown the sheets on the assembly table? i.e. How do you support the cut?

    Isn't the Centipede just a bunch of "points"?

    A full sheet of foam insulation might work, but a couple of 2' x 4's wouldn't, would they?
    I use solid core doors with MDF or melamine as sacrificial tops for
    both my assembly and "cutting" tables. A door is a door, so they're
    the same size. ;-)

    For breaking down sheet goods, I do use 2x4s under the sheet. I have something like five (I think I have some others somewhere) 5' 2x4s
    that I place under the sheet. Two on each side of the cut and one
    goes somewhere else (depending on the cut). I get the inner 2x4's as
    close to the cut as possible. It works for me but I may switch to the insulation method. It looks easier.

    I guess if you opened the Centipede just right, you could balance the 2 x 4's on the points. Good luck with that. Let us know how it works out. ;-)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Scott Lurndal@21:1/5 to Scott Lurndal on Tue Feb 22 21:00:14 2022
    scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) writes:
    Bob Davis <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> writes:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    If you have the room, nothing beats a panel saw for that application.


    On the other hand, I have a pair of these:

    https://www.homedepot.com/p/TOUGHBUILT-42-4-in-W-x-28-8-in-H-Steel-Sawhorse-and-Jobsite-Table-1100-lb-Capacity-TB-C550/205870368

    The slots on either end hold a 2x4, which gives you quick
    4' x 8' support for sheet goods - especially good for cross cutting if you don't mind kerfs in the 2x4 supports.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to teamarrows@eznet.net on Tue Feb 22 16:39:09 2022
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:35:01 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teamarrows@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 3:24:00 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 10:48:58 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    How do you breakdown the sheets on the assembly table? i.e. How do you support the cut?

    Isn't the Centipede just a bunch of "points"?

    A full sheet of foam insulation might work, but a couple of 2' x 4's wouldn't, would they?
    I use solid core doors with MDF or melamine as sacrificial tops for
    both my assembly and "cutting" tables. A door is a door, so they're
    the same size. ;-)

    For breaking down sheet goods, I do use 2x4s under the sheet. I have
    something like five (I think I have some others somewhere) 5' 2x4s
    that I place under the sheet. Two on each side of the cut and one
    goes somewhere else (depending on the cut). I get the inner 2x4's as
    close to the cut as possible. It works for me but I may switch to the
    insulation method. It looks easier.

    I guess if you opened the Centipede just right, you could balance the 2 x 4's >on the points. Good luck with that. Let us know how it works out. ;-)

    Sorry, I misunderstood you incorrectly. I thought you were talking
    about cutting on 2x4s or insulation in general. There is an issue
    with the sheet sagging but it can be mitigated.

    I wasn't talking about the centipede. That looks a little like hokum
    to me.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Tue Feb 22 16:47:00 2022
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 21:00:14 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
    wrote:

    scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) writes:
    Bob Davis <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> writes:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    If you have the room, nothing beats a panel saw for that application.


    On the other hand, I have a pair of these:

    https://www.homedepot.com/p/TOUGHBUILT-42-4-in-W-x-28-8-in-H-Steel-Sawhorse-and-Jobsite-Table-1100-lb-Capacity-TB-C550/205870368

    The slots on either end hold a 2x4, which gives you quick
    4' x 8' support for sheet goods - especially good for cross cutting if you >don't mind kerfs in the 2x4 supports.

    I have those two, four of those and two of its bigger brother. I was
    painting siding before putting it up a couple of years ago. I used
    the 2x4 slots for 14' 2x4s to lay out all the pieces to dry.

    Bora sells the same thing for five times the price. Nicer color
    though.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to Bob Davis on Tue Feb 22 16:17:21 2022
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17".
    2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with
    plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench
    straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and
    stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to
    handle all the tasks for assembly.





    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to Scott Lurndal on Tue Feb 22 14:16:55 2022
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 3:00:19 PM UTC-6, Scott Lurndal wrote:
    sc...@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) writes:
    Bob Davis <wrober...@gmail.com> writes:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    If you have the room, nothing beats a panel saw for that application.

    On the other hand, I have a pair of these:

    https://www.homedepot.com/p/TOUGHBUILT-42-4-in-W-x-28-8-in-H-Steel-Sawhorse-and-Jobsite-Table-1100-lb-Capacity-TB-C550/205870368

    The slots on either end hold a 2x4, which gives you quick
    4' x 8' support for sheet goods - especially good for cross cutting if you don't mind kerfs in the 2x4 supports.

    Those look really nice. I will stop by my home depot store and have a look. thanks for the idea.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to All on Tue Feb 22 16:21:44 2022
    On 2/22/2022 12:48 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    How do you breakdown the sheets on the assembly table? i.e. How do you support the cut?

    Isn't the Centipede just a bunch of "points"?

    A full sheet of foam insulation might work, but a couple of 2' x 4's wouldn't, would they?


    I used to use foam insulation but that got messy and it broke up. I use
    3 narrow, 4" wide, 1/2" x 8' plywood strips between the layers of
    plywood. When the top sheet is cut and removed I move the strips to
    below the next/top sheet.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Tue Feb 22 16:24:14 2022
    On 2/22/2022 2:23 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 10:48:58 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teamarrows@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    How do you breakdown the sheets on the assembly table? i.e. How do you support the cut?

    Isn't the Centipede just a bunch of "points"?

    A full sheet of foam insulation might work, but a couple of 2' x 4's wouldn't, would they?

    I use solid core doors with MDF or melamine as sacrificial tops for
    both my assembly and "cutting" tables. A door is a door, so they're
    the same size. ;-)

    For breaking down sheet goods, I do use 2x4s under the sheet. I have something like five (I think I have some others somewhere) 5' 2x4s
    that I place under the sheet. Two on each side of the cut and one
    goes somewhere else (depending on the cut). I get the inner 2x4's as
    close to the cut as possible. It works for me but I may switch to the insulation method. It looks easier.


    Insulation is sorta easier until it is worn out and breaks. I do
    similar to you, 2x4s" except substitute 1/2 x 4" plywood. Very lite
    weight and they are scraps from other projects.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to Scott Lurndal on Tue Feb 22 16:28:47 2022
    On 2/22/2022 2:28 PM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
    Bob Davis <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> writes:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    If you have the room, nothing beats a panel saw for that application.



    Yes that takes room. Do yu have a panel saw? I once thought of
    building one but after seeing them being used I wonder if the edge of
    plywood gets torn up when ripping a sheet. Nothing is supporting the
    upper section of the panel as the saw cuts and creates a kerf. I would
    think the upper sagging section would pinch the blade. Vertical cut
    should be no problem.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DerbyDad03@21:1/5 to Leon on Tue Feb 22 16:16:11 2022
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 5:17:35 PM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17".
    2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    Nope.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DerbyDad03@21:1/5 to Leon on Tue Feb 22 16:40:42 2022
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 5:21:55 PM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 12:48 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    How do you breakdown the sheets on the assembly table? i.e. How do you support the cut?

    Isn't the Centipede just a bunch of "points"?

    A full sheet of foam insulation might work, but a couple of 2' x 4's wouldn't, would they?
    I used to use foam insulation but that got messy and it broke up. I use
    3 narrow, 4" wide, 1/2" x 8' plywood strips between the layers of
    plywood. When the top sheet is cut and removed I move the strips to
    below the next/top sheet.

    3? When I've used strips, it's usually one at each edge and one on both
    sides of the cut. (assuming a cut in the middle-ish of the sheet) Fully supported, just like when using foam.

    As I'm sure you know, one big advantage of foam is there's no need to
    set up runners between cuts. Just drop the panel on the foam and cut
    wherever you want. Currently, I'm using the foam shown below. Doesn't
    make as much of a mess. I cut the sheet in half and then trimmed about
    an inch off so I have room for the clamps. Easy to store and easy to
    throw in the trailer or back of the van.

    I'm not saying it's better than your method. To each his own. ;-)

    https://images.thdstatic.com/productImages/f7a2ffd8-b89d-4bf2-b93d-aca1bf0db0d8/svn/owens-corning-foam-board-insulation-13ngx-64_145.jpg

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to All on Tue Feb 22 18:16:21 2022
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 6:40:48 PM UTC-6, DerbyDad03 wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 5:21:55 PM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 12:48 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    How do you breakdown the sheets on the assembly table? i.e. How do you support the cut?

    Isn't the Centipede just a bunch of "points"?

    A full sheet of foam insulation might work, but a couple of 2' x 4's wouldn't, would they?
    I used to use foam insulation but that got messy and it broke up. I use
    3 narrow, 4" wide, 1/2" x 8' plywood strips between the layers of
    plywood. When the top sheet is cut and removed I move the strips to
    below the next/top sheet.
    3? When I've used strips, it's usually one at each edge and one on both
    sides of the cut. (assuming a cut in the middle-ish of the sheet) Fully supported, just like when using foam.

    As I'm sure you know, one big advantage of foam is there's no need to
    set up runners between cuts. Just drop the panel on the foam and cut
    wherever you want. Currently, I'm using the foam shown below. Doesn't
    make as much of a mess. I cut the sheet in half and then trimmed about
    an inch off so I have room for the clamps. Easy to store and easy to
    throw in the trailer or back of the van.

    I'm not saying it's better than your method. To each his own. ;-)

    https://images.thdstatic.com/productImages/f7a2ffd8-b89d-4bf2-b93d-aca1bf0db0d8/svn/owens-corning-foam-board-insulation-13ngx-64_145.jpg

    That's what I use, too.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to Leon on Tue Feb 22 18:19:02 2022
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17".
    2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with
    plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and
    stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to
    handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.

    Bob

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to wrobertdavis@gmail.com on Tue Feb 22 22:32:08 2022
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs. >>
    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17".
    2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with
    plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench
    straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and
    stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to
    handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.

    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Tue Feb 22 22:22:27 2022
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 16:24:14 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/22/2022 2:23 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 10:48:58 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teamarrows@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    How do you breakdown the sheets on the assembly table? i.e. How do you support the cut?

    Isn't the Centipede just a bunch of "points"?

    A full sheet of foam insulation might work, but a couple of 2' x 4's wouldn't, would they?

    I use solid core doors with MDF or melamine as sacrificial tops for
    both my assembly and "cutting" tables. A door is a door, so they're
    the same size. ;-)

    For breaking down sheet goods, I do use 2x4s under the sheet. I have
    something like five (I think I have some others somewhere) 5' 2x4s
    that I place under the sheet. Two on each side of the cut and one
    goes somewhere else (depending on the cut). I get the inner 2x4's as
    close to the cut as possible. It works for me but I may switch to the
    insulation method. It looks easier.


    Insulation is sorta easier until it is worn out and breaks. I do
    similar to you, 2x4s" except substitute 1/2 x 4" plywood. Very lite
    weight and they are scraps from other projects.

    I'm thinking about putting dogs/dowels on the 2x4s so they stay still
    and on end. Obviously full size 2x4s aren't needed but I have loads
    of shorts.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Puckdropper@21:1/5 to Scott Lurndal on Wed Feb 23 07:55:33 2022
    scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote in news:y9cRJ.83906$Tr18.10219@fx42.iad:


    On the other hand, I have a pair of these:

    https://www.homedepot.com/p/TOUGHBUILT-42-4-in-W-x-28-8-in-H-Steel-Sawh orse-and-Jobsite-Table-1100-lb-Capacity-TB-C550/205870368

    The slots on either end hold a 2x4, which gives you quick
    4' x 8' support for sheet goods - especially good for cross cutting if
    you don't mind kerfs in the 2x4 supports.

    A little bit of wood putty and paint, and no one will ever know!
    Considering how many kerfs a 2x4 could take before needing replacement, I'd
    say 2x4s were cheap enough to be sacrificial.

    I've used 4 saw horses to break down plywood before. It also works pretty
    well on dimensional lumber that doesn't fit on the saw (or in the shop).
    Not having the piece drop off when the cut is done is a very nice thing,
    IMHO.

    Puckdropper

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to k...@notreal.com on Wed Feb 23 08:22:30 2022
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space. >>
    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes.... >>
    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not >> have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17".
    2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that >> black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs >> a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with
    plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench
    straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and
    stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to
    handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut router bit,
    the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Wed Feb 23 12:54:16 2022
    On 2/22/2022 9:32 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs. >>>
    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes.... >>>
    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17".
    2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs >>> a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with
    plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench
    straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and
    stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to
    handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.

    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)


    Yes, the Paulk benches are very rigid. I build mine from 1/2" "Baltic
    birch LIKE" 4x8 plywood from Lowes. Painted/primed on both sides IIRC.
    It was inexpensive and I will say not nearly as tough as Baltic Birch.
    BUT I abuse it and it has held up well so far, 4 years and counting.

    Building it is a job, especially of you populate the top with "dog"
    holes. Because I have a Festool MFT table I chose to not drill all of
    those holes.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to Bob Davis on Wed Feb 23 12:49:17 2022
    On 2/22/2022 8:19 PM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs. >>
    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17".
    2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with
    plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench
    straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and
    stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to
    handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.

    Bob


    Well Bob I did not mean to sound offensive in any way. But as you know
    a working knowledge trumps an idea/thoughts of what might work. We all
    have different needs and I was in the same place as you before the Paulk
    work bench. The fact that mine is big I have to take it down so that my
    wife can park in the garage when I don't have anything going on. AND
    each of my 2 piece bench tops are relative lite weight. So they are
    easy to put away and rather quickly once the top is cleared of clutter. ;~)


    And hopefully you saw me mention using scrap 1/2" x 4" x 96" spacers
    between the plywood being cut and the lower stack of plywood and or
    bench itself. These were left overs ftom building the bench. I use 3 of
    those. Typically one centered under the cut and one on each/both sides
    nearer the outer edges of the sheet.

    I deviated from the plans in some areas.
    IIRC his top is attached to the middle sections with pocket hole screws
    and glue.

    I did that for the bottom and went straight through the top into the mid section with counter sank screws and glue. I wanted to know exactly
    where the screws are, holding the top, in the event I might cut into the
    top.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Wed Feb 23 13:05:36 2022
    On 2/22/2022 9:22 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 16:24:14 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/22/2022 2:23 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 10:48:58 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teamarrows@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    How do you breakdown the sheets on the assembly table? i.e. How do you support the cut?

    Isn't the Centipede just a bunch of "points"?

    A full sheet of foam insulation might work, but a couple of 2' x 4's wouldn't, would they?

    I use solid core doors with MDF or melamine as sacrificial tops for
    both my assembly and "cutting" tables. A door is a door, so they're
    the same size. ;-)

    For breaking down sheet goods, I do use 2x4s under the sheet. I have
    something like five (I think I have some others somewhere) 5' 2x4s
    that I place under the sheet. Two on each side of the cut and one
    goes somewhere else (depending on the cut). I get the inner 2x4's as
    close to the cut as possible. It works for me but I may switch to the
    insulation method. It looks easier.


    Insulation is sorta easier until it is worn out and breaks. I do
    similar to you, 2x4s" except substitute 1/2 x 4" plywood. Very lite
    weight and they are scraps from other projects.

    I'm thinking about putting dogs/dowels on the 2x4s so they stay still
    and on end. Obviously full size 2x4s aren't needed but I have loads
    of shorts.


    I have not worried about he spacers moving around... I wonder if the dogs/dowels will hinder placement.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to Bob Davis on Wed Feb 23 13:02:16 2022
    On 2/23/2022 10:22 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs. >>>>
    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space. >>>>
    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes.... >>>>
    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not >>>> have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17".
    2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that >>>> black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs >>>> a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or >>>> creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of >>>> clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with
    plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it >>>> all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench >>>> straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and
    stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to
    handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut router
    bit, the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.



    This is true BUT.... You should consider if you will use the bench top
    like many use the MFT table. Others depend on the dog holes to be
    "PRECICELY" located so that they can use dogs to square up stock and cut
    with a track saw. Aligning visually will not guarantee precise placement.

    Others use the dogs and track to make precise 90 and 45 degree cuts with
    their track saws.

    I would advise to draw the holes in Sketchup, precisely, and convert to
    an SVG file. Ultimately that would probably be faster as you would not
    have to mark the top and or alight the Origin on those marks for each of
    those holes.

    BUT If you do not intend to use the holes to align stock or a track,
    close is probably good enough.

    Just a thought.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to All on Wed Feb 23 13:20:14 2022
    On 2/22/2022 6:40 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 5:21:55 PM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 12:48 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    How do you breakdown the sheets on the assembly table? i.e. How do you support the cut?

    Isn't the Centipede just a bunch of "points"?

    A full sheet of foam insulation might work, but a couple of 2' x 4's wouldn't, would they?
    I used to use foam insulation but that got messy and it broke up. I use
    3 narrow, 4" wide, 1/2" x 8' plywood strips between the layers of
    plywood. When the top sheet is cut and removed I move the strips to
    below the next/top sheet.

    3? When I've used strips, it's usually one at each edge and one on both
    sides of the cut. (assuming a cut in the middle-ish of the sheet) Fully supported, just like when using foam.

    Yes 3. Similar to you but the middle is under the cut. It provides
    support on both sides of the cut and I like to think helps eliminate
    any possibility tear out on the bottom side of the cut. I quite often
    let that cut be the finish cut. So one less spacer to deal with.

    Certainly foam is easy to use but I have gone through several sheets of
    the stuff in the past 12 or so years. That stuff adds up considering
    its price to scrap plywood.

    AND do not use the foam board with the metallic film on one side.
    Those panels begin to warp with the first cut.



    As I'm sure you know, one big advantage of foam is there's no need to
    set up runners between cuts. Just drop the panel on the foam and cut
    wherever you want. Currently, I'm using the foam shown below. Doesn't
    make as much of a mess. I cut the sheet in half and then trimmed about
    an inch off so I have room for the clamps. Easy to store and easy to
    throw in the trailer or back of the van.

    I'm not saying it's better than your method. To each his own. ;-)

    Absolutely less trouble and easier to use but I cut a lot and the stuff
    does not hold up long for me.




    https://images.thdstatic.com/productImages/f7a2ffd8-b89d-4bf2-b93d-aca1bf0db0d8/svn/owens-corning-foam-board-insulation-13ngx-64_145.jpg

    About 2~3 years ago I bought 2 sheets of this stuff that is 2" thick.
    That made me take a double take on the price.

    BUT I had a use for the thick stuff. My wife covered both with a linen
    like cloth and I hung both side by side on a wall in her sewing room.
    She now has an 8'x8' wall to place her quilt pieces on to when designing
    and laying out the pieces. The pieces stick to the cloth and if
    necessary she can push a pin through the fabric into the foam to
    securely hold the piece in place.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Wed Feb 23 14:47:41 2022
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 13:05:36 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/22/2022 9:22 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 16:24:14 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/22/2022 2:23 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 10:48:58 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teamarrows@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    How do you breakdown the sheets on the assembly table? i.e. How do you support the cut?

    Isn't the Centipede just a bunch of "points"?

    A full sheet of foam insulation might work, but a couple of 2' x 4's wouldn't, would they?

    I use solid core doors with MDF or melamine as sacrificial tops for
    both my assembly and "cutting" tables. A door is a door, so they're
    the same size. ;-)

    For breaking down sheet goods, I do use 2x4s under the sheet. I have
    something like five (I think I have some others somewhere) 5' 2x4s
    that I place under the sheet. Two on each side of the cut and one
    goes somewhere else (depending on the cut). I get the inner 2x4's as
    close to the cut as possible. It works for me but I may switch to the >>>> insulation method. It looks easier.


    Insulation is sorta easier until it is worn out and breaks. I do
    similar to you, 2x4s" except substitute 1/2 x 4" plywood. Very lite
    weight and they are scraps from other projects.

    I'm thinking about putting dogs/dowels on the 2x4s so they stay still
    and on end. Obviously full size 2x4s aren't needed but I have loads
    of shorts.


    I have not worried about he spacers moving around... I wonder if the >dogs/dowels will hinder placement.

    IME, they move around when the sheet is moved and I have to reposition everything so the saw goes between the two pairs and the inner
    supports are reasonably close to the cut.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Wed Feb 23 17:55:25 2022
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 13:20:14 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/22/2022 6:40 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 5:21:55 PM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 12:48 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    How do you breakdown the sheets on the assembly table? i.e. How do you support the cut?

    Isn't the Centipede just a bunch of "points"?

    A full sheet of foam insulation might work, but a couple of 2' x 4's wouldn't, would they?
    I used to use foam insulation but that got messy and it broke up. I use
    3 narrow, 4" wide, 1/2" x 8' plywood strips between the layers of
    plywood. When the top sheet is cut and removed I move the strips to
    below the next/top sheet.

    3? When I've used strips, it's usually one at each edge and one on both
    sides of the cut. (assuming a cut in the middle-ish of the sheet) Fully
    supported, just like when using foam.

    Yes 3. Similar to you but the middle is under the cut. It provides
    support on both sides of the cut and I like to think helps eliminate
    any possibility tear out on the bottom side of the cut. I quite often
    let that cut be the finish cut. So one less spacer to deal with.

    Certainly foam is easy to use but I have gone through several sheets of
    the stuff in the past 12 or so years. That stuff adds up considering
    its price to scrap plywood.

    Can't you just bust it up and throw it in the trash? I do that with
    the mountains of foam inserts they pack tools in.

    AND do not use the foam board with the metallic film on one side.
    Those panels begin to warp with the first cut.



    As I'm sure you know, one big advantage of foam is there's no need to
    set up runners between cuts. Just drop the panel on the foam and cut
    wherever you want. Currently, I'm using the foam shown below. Doesn't
    make as much of a mess. I cut the sheet in half and then trimmed about
    an inch off so I have room for the clamps. Easy to store and easy to
    throw in the trailer or back of the van.

    I'm not saying it's better than your method. To each his own. ;-)

    Absolutely less trouble and easier to use but I cut a lot and the stuff
    does not hold up long for me.




    https://images.thdstatic.com/productImages/f7a2ffd8-b89d-4bf2-b93d-aca1bf0db0d8/svn/owens-corning-foam-board-insulation-13ngx-64_145.jpg

    About 2~3 years ago I bought 2 sheets of this stuff that is 2" thick.
    That made me take a double take on the price.

    $34 at HD. Last time I bought some it was more like $5. It's been a
    while. ;-)

    BUT I had a use for the thick stuff. My wife covered both with a linen
    like cloth and I hung both side by side on a wall in her sewing room.
    She now has an 8'x8' wall to place her quilt pieces on to when designing
    and laying out the pieces. The pieces stick to the cloth and if
    necessary she can push a pin through the fabric into the foam to
    securely hold the piece in place.

    It probably deadens sound some too. Panels could be part of the
    interior decoration. You could show them on HGTV and make a bundle.


    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Wed Feb 23 18:11:56 2022
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 13:02:16 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 10:22 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>> On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space. >>>>>
    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or >>>>> you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes.... >>>>>
    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not >>>>> have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to >>>>> clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up >>>>> store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that >>>>> black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs >>>>> a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or >>>>> creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of >>>>> clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with >>>>> plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it >>>>> all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench >>>>> straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut router
    bit, the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.



    This is true BUT.... You should consider if you will use the bench top
    like many use the MFT table. Others depend on the dog holes to be >"PRECICELY" located so that they can use dogs to square up stock and cut
    with a track saw. Aligning visually will not guarantee precise placement.

    Others use the dogs and track to make precise 90 and 45 degree cuts with >their track saws.

    I would advise to draw the holes in Sketchup, precisely, and convert to
    an SVG file. Ultimately that would probably be faster as you would not
    have to mark the top and or alight the Origin on those marks for each of >those holes.

    I bought one of these in 2017 when it was a one-time tool.

    <https://www.woodpeck.com/hole-boring-jig-2019.html>

    BUT If you do not intend to use the holes to align stock or a track,
    close is probably good enough.

    Just a thought.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Wed Feb 23 18:19:33 2022
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 12:54:16 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/22/2022 9:32 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs. >>>>
    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space. >>>>
    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes.... >>>>
    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not >>>> have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17".
    2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that >>>> black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs >>>> a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or >>>> creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of >>>> clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with
    plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it >>>> all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench >>>> straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and
    stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to
    handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.

    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)


    Yes, the Paulk benches are very rigid. I build mine from 1/2" "Baltic
    birch LIKE" 4x8 plywood from Lowes. Painted/primed on both sides IIRC.
    It was inexpensive and I will say not nearly as tough as Baltic Birch.
    BUT I abuse it and it has held up well so far, 4 years and counting.

    Building it is a job, especially of you populate the top with "dog"
    holes. Because I have a Festool MFT table I chose to not drill all of
    those holes.

    That raises an important point. The torsion box sides have to be
    thought out with the dog holes in mind. A dog hole through a box edge
    probably wouldn't work so well.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to Leon on Wed Feb 23 21:01:53 2022
    On Wednesday, February 23, 2022 at 12:49:27 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 8:19 PM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs. >>
    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes.... >>
    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17".
    2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs >> a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with
    plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench
    straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and
    stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to
    handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.

    Bob
    Well Bob I did not mean to sound offensive in any way. But as you know

    No offense taken. It was a left handed complement.

    a working knowledge trumps an idea/thoughts of what might work. We all
    have different needs and I was in the same place as you before the Paulk
    work bench. The fact that mine is big I have to take it down so that my
    wife can park in the garage when I don't have anything going on. AND
    each of my 2 piece bench tops are relative lite weight. So they are
    easy to put away and rather quickly once the top is cleared of clutter. ;~)


    And hopefully you saw me mention using scrap 1/2" x 4" x 96" spacers
    between the plywood being cut and the lower stack of plywood and or
    bench itself. These were left overs ftom building the bench. I use 3 of those. Typically one centered under the cut and one on each/both sides
    nearer the outer edges of the sheet.

    I deviated from the plans in some areas.
    IIRC his top is attached to the middle sections with pocket hole screws
    and glue.

    I did that for the bottom and went straight through the top into the mid section with counter sank screws and glue. I wanted to know exactly
    where the screws are, holding the top, in the event I might cut into the
    top.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to Leon on Wed Feb 23 21:07:27 2022
    On Wednesday, February 23, 2022 at 1:02:26 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/23/2022 10:22 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space. >>>>
    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or >>>> you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not >>>> have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to >>>> clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up >>>> store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that >>>> black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or >>>> creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of >>>> clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with >>>> plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it >>>> all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench >>>> straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut router
    bit, the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.
    This is true BUT.... You should consider if you will use the bench top
    like many use the MFT table. Others depend on the dog holes to be "PRECICELY" located so that they can use dogs to square up stock and cut with a track saw. Aligning visually will not guarantee precise placement.

    My "X marks the spot" description was meant for non-critical dog holes. As an example, I wanted to drill 16 20mm holes on a new horizontal spoilboard for the shaper origin workbench. They could be off a fraction and it would not matter. Pencil and
    ruler were the quick and dirty approach. I just drilled a hole, then copy and move it to the next "X" on the screen. For implementing a precise layout like an MFT top, I definitely agree with your advice.


    Others use the dogs and track to make precise 90 and 45 degree cuts with their track saws.

    I would advise to draw the holes in Sketchup, precisely, and convert to
    an SVG file. Ultimately that would probably be faster as you would not
    have to mark the top and or alight the Origin on those marks for each of those holes.

    BUT If you do not intend to use the holes to align stock or a track,
    close is probably good enough.

    Just a thought.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Brian Welch@21:1/5 to All on Thu Feb 24 06:06:03 2022
    On Thursday, February 24, 2022 at 8:49:57 AM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
    On Thursday, February 24, 2022 at 8:26:22 AM UTC-5, Brian Welch wrote:
    On Thursday, February 24, 2022 at 12:07:33 AM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    On Wednesday, February 23, 2022 at 1:02:26 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/23/2022 10:22 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote: >>>> On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17".
    2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/ >>>>
    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with
    plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench
    straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and
    stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to
    handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some >> storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut
    router bit, the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.
    This is true BUT.... You should consider if you will use the bench top like many use the MFT table. Others depend on the dog holes to be "PRECICELY" located so that they can use dogs to square up stock and cut
    with a track saw. Aligning visually will not guarantee precise placement.
    My "X marks the spot" description was meant for non-critical dog holes. As an example, I wanted to drill 16 20mm holes on a new horizontal spoilboard for the shaper origin workbench. They could be off a fraction and it would not matter. Pencil and
    ruler were the quick and dirty approach. I just drilled a hole, then copy and move it to the next "X" on the screen. For implementing a precise layout like an MFT top, I definitely agree with your advice.

    Others use the dogs and track to make precise 90 and 45 degree cuts with
    their track saws.

    I would advise to draw the holes in Sketchup, precisely, and convert to
    an SVG file. Ultimately that would probably be faster as you would not have to mark the top and or alight the Origin on those marks for each of
    those holes.

    BUT If you do not intend to use the holes to align stock or a track, close is probably good enough.

    Just a thought.
    Going back to the OP, I have one of the larger Centipedes...While I don't use it that often, I have used it successfully. It comes with attachments that support/permit 2bys as cross members. I generally prefer a rigid table, but have no knocks on the
    Centipede...
    That answers my original question. Thanks.

    Next question: Do the attachments stay attached?

    IOW, do you always have to "find" them when you want to use
    them or do they fold up with the Centipede?
    The attachments are loose. This enables you to use them on any of the posts. The unit comes with a bag to help keep everything together. But it is very lightweight, not very durable...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Brian Welch@21:1/5 to wrober...@gmail.com on Thu Feb 24 05:26:16 2022
    On Thursday, February 24, 2022 at 12:07:33 AM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    On Wednesday, February 23, 2022 at 1:02:26 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/23/2022 10:22 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or >>>> you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to >>>> clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up >>>> store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with >>>> plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench
    straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut router
    bit, the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.
    This is true BUT.... You should consider if you will use the bench top like many use the MFT table. Others depend on the dog holes to be "PRECICELY" located so that they can use dogs to square up stock and cut with a track saw. Aligning visually will not guarantee precise placement.
    My "X marks the spot" description was meant for non-critical dog holes. As an example, I wanted to drill 16 20mm holes on a new horizontal spoilboard for the shaper origin workbench. They could be off a fraction and it would not matter. Pencil and
    ruler were the quick and dirty approach. I just drilled a hole, then copy and move it to the next "X" on the screen. For implementing a precise layout like an MFT top, I definitely agree with your advice.

    Others use the dogs and track to make precise 90 and 45 degree cuts with their track saws.

    I would advise to draw the holes in Sketchup, precisely, and convert to
    an SVG file. Ultimately that would probably be faster as you would not have to mark the top and or alight the Origin on those marks for each of those holes.

    BUT If you do not intend to use the holes to align stock or a track,
    close is probably good enough.

    Just a thought.
    Going back to the OP, I have one of the larger Centipedes...While I don't use it that often, I have used it successfully. It comes with attachments that support/permit 2bys as cross members. I generally prefer a rigid table, but have no knocks on the
    Centipede...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DerbyDad03@21:1/5 to Brian Welch on Thu Feb 24 05:49:50 2022
    On Thursday, February 24, 2022 at 8:26:22 AM UTC-5, Brian Welch wrote:
    On Thursday, February 24, 2022 at 12:07:33 AM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    On Wednesday, February 23, 2022 at 1:02:26 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/23/2022 10:22 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17".
    2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/ >>>>
    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with
    plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench
    straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and
    stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to
    handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some >> storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut
    router bit, the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.
    This is true BUT.... You should consider if you will use the bench top like many use the MFT table. Others depend on the dog holes to be "PRECICELY" located so that they can use dogs to square up stock and cut with a track saw. Aligning visually will not guarantee precise placement.
    My "X marks the spot" description was meant for non-critical dog holes. As an example, I wanted to drill 16 20mm holes on a new horizontal spoilboard for the shaper origin workbench. They could be off a fraction and it would not matter. Pencil and
    ruler were the quick and dirty approach. I just drilled a hole, then copy and move it to the next "X" on the screen. For implementing a precise layout like an MFT top, I definitely agree with your advice.

    Others use the dogs and track to make precise 90 and 45 degree cuts with their track saws.

    I would advise to draw the holes in Sketchup, precisely, and convert to an SVG file. Ultimately that would probably be faster as you would not have to mark the top and or alight the Origin on those marks for each of those holes.

    BUT If you do not intend to use the holes to align stock or a track, close is probably good enough.

    Just a thought.
    Going back to the OP, I have one of the larger Centipedes...While I don't use it that often, I have used it successfully. It comes with attachments that support/permit 2bys as cross members. I generally prefer a rigid table, but have no knocks on the
    Centipede...

    That answers my original question. Thanks.

    Next question: Do the attachments stay attached?

    IOW, do you always have to "find" them when you want to use
    them or do they fold up with the Centipede?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Brian Welch@21:1/5 to Brian Welch on Thu Feb 24 06:15:37 2022
    On Thursday, February 24, 2022 at 9:06:09 AM UTC-5, Brian Welch wrote:
    On Thursday, February 24, 2022 at 8:49:57 AM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
    On Thursday, February 24, 2022 at 8:26:22 AM UTC-5, Brian Welch wrote:
    On Thursday, February 24, 2022 at 12:07:33 AM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    On Wednesday, February 23, 2022 at 1:02:26 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/23/2022 10:22 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote: >>>> On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17".
    2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with
    plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench
    straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and
    stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to
    handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut
    router bit, the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.
    This is true BUT.... You should consider if you will use the bench top
    like many use the MFT table. Others depend on the dog holes to be "PRECICELY" located so that they can use dogs to square up stock and cut
    with a track saw. Aligning visually will not guarantee precise placement.
    My "X marks the spot" description was meant for non-critical dog holes. As an example, I wanted to drill 16 20mm holes on a new horizontal spoilboard for the shaper origin workbench. They could be off a fraction and it would not matter. Pencil
    and ruler were the quick and dirty approach. I just drilled a hole, then copy and move it to the next "X" on the screen. For implementing a precise layout like an MFT top, I definitely agree with your advice.

    Others use the dogs and track to make precise 90 and 45 degree cuts with
    their track saws.

    I would advise to draw the holes in Sketchup, precisely, and convert to
    an SVG file. Ultimately that would probably be faster as you would not
    have to mark the top and or alight the Origin on those marks for each of
    those holes.

    BUT If you do not intend to use the holes to align stock or a track, close is probably good enough.

    Just a thought.
    Going back to the OP, I have one of the larger Centipedes...While I don't use it that often, I have used it successfully. It comes with attachments that support/permit 2bys as cross members. I generally prefer a rigid table, but have no knocks on
    the Centipede...
    That answers my original question. Thanks.

    Next question: Do the attachments stay attached?

    IOW, do you always have to "find" them when you want to use
    them or do they fold up with the Centipede?
    The attachments are loose. This enables you to use them on any of the posts. The unit comes with a bag to help keep everything together. But it is very lightweight, not very durable...

    Point of clarification...I was referring to the bag as not being very durable. It does come with a handful of plastic hold downs to help keep things in place.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Thu Feb 24 10:27:46 2022
    On 2/23/2022 5:19 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 12:54:16 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/22/2022 9:32 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space. >>>>>
    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or >>>>> you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes.... >>>>>
    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not >>>>> have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to >>>>> clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up >>>>> store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that >>>>> black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs >>>>> a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or >>>>> creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of >>>>> clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with >>>>> plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it >>>>> all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench >>>>> straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.

    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)


    Yes, the Paulk benches are very rigid. I build mine from 1/2" "Baltic
    birch LIKE" 4x8 plywood from Lowes. Painted/primed on both sides IIRC.
    It was inexpensive and I will say not nearly as tough as Baltic Birch.
    BUT I abuse it and it has held up well so far, 4 years and counting.

    Building it is a job, especially of you populate the top with "dog"
    holes. Because I have a Festool MFT table I chose to not drill all of
    those holes.

    That raises an important point. The torsion box sides have to be
    thought out with the dog holes in mind. A dog hole through a box edge probably wouldn't work so well.


    I bought the plans a few years back and IIRC they take this into
    consideration.
    If you are considering the Paulk design.

    If you are going to do the regular torsion grid under the top you need
    to do a lot of planing.

    Something to consider with the traditional torsion box design that has a
    top and bottom. If you drill dog holes and accidentally drop something
    into one of those holes it will be difficult to retrieve.

    FWIW things, in particular screws, drop through the MFT table holes all
    the time.
    Since I use that table to add slides to drawers I have to use a screw
    container as those screws are particularly vulnerable to fall through.

    The Paulk design is very much like a torsion box design. BUT it only
    has bracing crossing from side to side and on the ends. The long sides
    are only on the outside. And then it is open all the way through both directions.

    I sometimes put my long clamps inside.

    Take a look as his latest plans/videos at least for ideas. He has
    changed the elongated cut outs from having half circle ends to squares
    corners. Drawers might be a consideration if it will be permanently set
    up..

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Thu Feb 24 10:36:38 2022
    On 2/23/2022 5:11 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 13:02:16 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 10:22 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>>> On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space. >>>>>>
    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or >>>>>> you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not >>>>>> have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to >>>>>> clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up >>>>>> store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that >>>>>> black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs >>>>>> a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or >>>>>> creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of >>>>>> clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with >>>>>> plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it >>>>>> all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench >>>>>> straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut router
    bit, the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.



    This is true BUT.... You should consider if you will use the bench top
    like many use the MFT table. Others depend on the dog holes to be
    "PRECICELY" located so that they can use dogs to square up stock and cut
    with a track saw. Aligning visually will not guarantee precise placement. >>
    Others use the dogs and track to make precise 90 and 45 degree cuts with
    their track saws.

    I would advise to draw the holes in Sketchup, precisely, and convert to
    an SVG file. Ultimately that would probably be faster as you would not
    have to mark the top and or alight the Origin on those marks for each of
    those holes.

    I bought one of these in 2017 when it was a one-time tool.

    <https://www.woodpeck.com/hole-boring-jig-2019.html>


    That will work too! You do want the accuracy if you can. Swingman,
    remember him? He bought the Parf set up and built his Paulk work bench. https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/tools/jigs-guides-and-fixtures/110468-mk-ii-parf-guide-drilling-system?item=58B3996&utm_source=free_google_shopping&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=shopping_feed&gclid=
    CjwKCAiA9tyQBhAIEiwA6tdCrDIzYfaBCWbsfR87Sh5PKzOiJ4Q_LSIMSfk_QLj3PE7vTcK6ecgaRhoCp9sQAvD_BwE


    Your Origin would be easier to use for this operation. There will be no cutting and moving a jig to a new location. And no pushing to plunge.

    That said, IIRC the Shaper Hub has downloadable SVG files to recreate
    the MFT table dog holes. While you needs may require a larger work
    surface with dog holes you can use the same SVG file and tell the Origin
    to begin as a different location for more holes.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to Bob Davis on Thu Feb 24 10:44:35 2022
    On 2/23/2022 11:07 PM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Wednesday, February 23, 2022 at 1:02:26 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/23/2022 10:22 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>>> On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space. >>>>>>
    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or >>>>>> you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not >>>>>> have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to >>>>>> clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up >>>>>> store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that >>>>>> black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs >>>>>> a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or >>>>>> creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of >>>>>> clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with >>>>>> plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it >>>>>> all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench >>>>>> straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut router
    bit, the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.
    This is true BUT.... You should consider if you will use the bench top
    like many use the MFT table. Others depend on the dog holes to be
    "PRECICELY" located so that they can use dogs to square up stock and cut
    with a track saw. Aligning visually will not guarantee precise placement.

    My "X marks the spot" description was meant for non-critical dog holes. As an example, I wanted to drill 16 20mm holes on a new horizontal spoilboard for the shaper origin workbench. They could be off a fraction and it would not matter. Pencil and
    ruler were the quick and dirty approach. I just drilled a hole, then copy and move it to the next "X" on the screen. For implementing a precise layout like an MFT top, I definitely agree with your advice.

    There is nothing wrong with your method for "close is good enough"!

    I used the exact same method for the mortises needed mid field in the
    MDO sides of the Murphy bed that I built last summer.

    Aligning the Origin at a known/marked starting spot vs. a distance from
    the the x/y intersection is soooo much easier.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to Brian Welch on Thu Feb 24 10:47:27 2022
    On 2/24/2022 7:26 AM, Brian Welch wrote:
    On Thursday, February 24, 2022 at 12:07:33 AM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    On Wednesday, February 23, 2022 at 1:02:26 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/23/2022 10:22 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>>>> On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space. >>>>>>>
    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or >>>>>>> you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not >>>>>>> have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to >>>>>>> clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>>>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up >>>>>>> store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that >>>>>>> black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or >>>>>>> creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of >>>>>>> clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/ >>>>>>>
    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with >>>>>>> plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it >>>>>>> all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench >>>>>>> straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>>>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>>>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut router
    bit, the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.
    This is true BUT.... You should consider if you will use the bench top
    like many use the MFT table. Others depend on the dog holes to be
    "PRECICELY" located so that they can use dogs to square up stock and cut >>> with a track saw. Aligning visually will not guarantee precise placement. >> My "X marks the spot" description was meant for non-critical dog holes. As an example, I wanted to drill 16 20mm holes on a new horizontal spoilboard for the shaper origin workbench. They could be off a fraction and it would not matter. Pencil and
    ruler were the quick and dirty approach. I just drilled a hole, then copy and move it to the next "X" on the screen. For implementing a precise layout like an MFT top, I definitely agree with your advice.

    Others use the dogs and track to make precise 90 and 45 degree cuts with >>> their track saws.

    I would advise to draw the holes in Sketchup, precisely, and convert to
    an SVG file. Ultimately that would probably be faster as you would not
    have to mark the top and or alight the Origin on those marks for each of >>> those holes.

    BUT If you do not intend to use the holes to align stock or a track,
    close is probably good enough.

    Just a thought.
    Going back to the OP, I have one of the larger Centipedes...While I don't use it that often, I have used it successfully. It comes with attachments that support/permit 2bys as cross members. I generally prefer a rigid table, but have no knocks on the
    Centipede...


    How does or how would the Cenepede work on an irregular, non flat
    surface? Will all those legs compensate or telegraph the floor/ground irregularities to the top working area?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Thu Feb 24 11:17:55 2022
    On 2/23/2022 4:55 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 13:20:14 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/22/2022 6:40 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 5:21:55 PM UTC-5, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 12:48 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC-5, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    How do you breakdown the sheets on the assembly table? i.e. How do you support the cut?

    Isn't the Centipede just a bunch of "points"?

    A full sheet of foam insulation might work, but a couple of 2' x 4's wouldn't, would they?
    I used to use foam insulation but that got messy and it broke up. I use >>>> 3 narrow, 4" wide, 1/2" x 8' plywood strips between the layers of
    plywood. When the top sheet is cut and removed I move the strips to
    below the next/top sheet.

    3? When I've used strips, it's usually one at each edge and one on both
    sides of the cut. (assuming a cut in the middle-ish of the sheet) Fully
    supported, just like when using foam.

    Yes 3. Similar to you but the middle is under the cut. It provides
    support on both sides of the cut and I like to think helps eliminate
    any possibility tear out on the bottom side of the cut. I quite often
    let that cut be the finish cut. So one less spacer to deal with.

    Certainly foam is easy to use but I have gone through several sheets of
    the stuff in the past 12 or so years. That stuff adds up considering
    its price to scrap plywood.

    Can't you just bust it up and throw it in the trash? I do that with
    the mountains of foam inserts they pack tools in.

    That is how I got rid of the sheets/chunks of sheets. But I cut way too
    much plywood for the packing foam inserts inventory to keep up.

    Last year I did a kitchen re-do. Approximately 30 new doors with white
    oak panels, and approximately 30, 1/2" Baltic birch drawers with and
    1/4" birch bottoms.
    Off the top of my head, 10 sheets of plywood.

    The our Murphy bed and tower cabinets with a boat load of adjustable
    shelves for the towers Off the top of my head, 8 sheets of plywood and MDO.

    Then a 4 unit hutch, all sheet goods except for the frames of the 8
    doors and drawer fronts and front and back face frames and trim.
    Probably 8 sheets.

    When I buy sheet goods they go directly to the Paulk style work bench.
    Then I used to put the foam sheet in between the top sheet good and
    the one below. The foam sheets get pretty tattered just moving them
    down below the top sheet and the next sheet with out actually removing
    the top sheet and placing the foam sheet and then replacing the top sheet.

    I much prefer the sturdy thin plywood scraps.




    AND do not use the foam board with the metallic film on one side.
    Those panels begin to warp with the first cut.



    As I'm sure you know, one big advantage of foam is there's no need to
    set up runners between cuts. Just drop the panel on the foam and cut
    wherever you want. Currently, I'm using the foam shown below. Doesn't
    make as much of a mess. I cut the sheet in half and then trimmed about
    an inch off so I have room for the clamps. Easy to store and easy to
    throw in the trailer or back of the van.

    I'm not saying it's better than your method. To each his own. ;-)

    Absolutely less trouble and easier to use but I cut a lot and the stuff
    does not hold up long for me.




    https://images.thdstatic.com/productImages/f7a2ffd8-b89d-4bf2-b93d-aca1bf0db0d8/svn/owens-corning-foam-board-insulation-13ngx-64_145.jpg

    About 2~3 years ago I bought 2 sheets of this stuff that is 2" thick.
    That made me take a double take on the price.

    $34 at HD. Last time I bought some it was more like $5. It's been a
    while. ;-)

    Yeah! LOL



    BUT I had a use for the thick stuff. My wife covered both with a linen
    like cloth and I hung both side by side on a wall in her sewing room.
    She now has an 8'x8' wall to place her quilt pieces on to when designing
    and laying out the pieces. The pieces stick to the cloth and if
    necessary she can push a pin through the fabric into the foam to
    securely hold the piece in place.

    It probably deadens sound some too. Panels could be part of the
    interior decoration. You could show them on HGTV and make a bundle.


    One could only wish. She has 3 sewing machines and all will run by
    themselves. Meaning it is not unusual for at least two to be running
    with just her up there. And she has a sewing group of 3 other ladies so
    all the machines are going.

    All hard surfaces for the walls/ceilings and floors. The foam design
    center is half of one of the short walls. The biggest machine travels
    along a 11' long track so its noise is ever changing. The other two
    machines are on a table that is against the short wall along the
    staircase. Their noise goes over the short wall and down the hard
    surfaced stairs to our tile floors down stairs.

    As far as showing of this foam board wall, not my idea. I got the idea
    from one of her sewing buddies and I am certain that she did not come up
    with the idea herself.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Thu Feb 24 18:15:24 2022
    On Thu, 24 Feb 2022 10:36:38 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 5:11 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 13:02:16 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 10:22 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>>>> On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space. >>>>>>>
    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or >>>>>>> you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not >>>>>>> have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to >>>>>>> clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>>>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up >>>>>>> store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that >>>>>>> black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or >>>>>>> creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of >>>>>>> clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/ >>>>>>>
    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with >>>>>>> plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it >>>>>>> all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench >>>>>>> straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>>>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>>>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut router
    bit, the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.



    This is true BUT.... You should consider if you will use the bench top
    like many use the MFT table. Others depend on the dog holes to be
    "PRECICELY" located so that they can use dogs to square up stock and cut >>> with a track saw. Aligning visually will not guarantee precise placement. >>>
    Others use the dogs and track to make precise 90 and 45 degree cuts with >>> their track saws.

    I would advise to draw the holes in Sketchup, precisely, and convert to
    an SVG file. Ultimately that would probably be faster as you would not
    have to mark the top and or alight the Origin on those marks for each of >>> those holes.

    I bought one of these in 2017 when it was a one-time tool.

    <https://www.woodpeck.com/hole-boring-jig-2019.html>


    That will work too! You do want the accuracy if you can. Swingman,
    remember him? He bought the Parf set up and built his Paulk work bench. >https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/tools/jigs-guides-and-fixtures/110468-mk-ii-parf-guide-drilling-system?item=58B3996&utm_source=free_google_shopping&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=shopping_feed&gclid=
    CjwKCAiA9tyQBhAIEiwA6tdCrDIzYfaBCWbsfR87Sh5PKzOiJ4Q_LSIMSfk_QLj3PE7vTcK6ecgaRhoCp9sQAvD_BwE


    Your Origin would be easier to use for this operation. There will be no >cutting and moving a jig to a new location. And no pushing to plunge.

    The Origin may be more accurate too. Any errors in the jig, for
    whatever reason (spacing, hole size, hole/pin fit, or whatever) is
    cumulative. The origin wouldn't be, unless the tape stretches.

    That said, IIRC the Shaper Hub has downloadable SVG files to recreate
    the MFT table dog holes. While you needs may require a larger work
    surface with dog holes you can use the same SVG file and tell the Origin
    to begin as a different location for more holes.

    It would seem that "offset" would do it. The spacing of 3/4" holes and
    20mm holes is the same, isn't it? If there is any imperial/metric
    conversion error, it would be cumulative too.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Thu Feb 24 18:27:24 2022
    On Thu, 24 Feb 2022 10:27:46 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 5:19 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 12:54:16 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/22/2022 9:32 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space. >>>>>>
    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or >>>>>> you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not >>>>>> have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to >>>>>> clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up >>>>>> store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that >>>>>> black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs >>>>>> a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or >>>>>> creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of >>>>>> clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/

    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with >>>>>> plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it >>>>>> all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench >>>>>> straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.

    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some
    storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)


    Yes, the Paulk benches are very rigid. I build mine from 1/2" "Baltic
    birch LIKE" 4x8 plywood from Lowes. Painted/primed on both sides IIRC.
    It was inexpensive and I will say not nearly as tough as Baltic Birch. >>> BUT I abuse it and it has held up well so far, 4 years and counting.

    Building it is a job, especially of you populate the top with "dog"
    holes. Because I have a Festool MFT table I chose to not drill all of
    those holes.

    That raises an important point. The torsion box sides have to be
    thought out with the dog holes in mind. A dog hole through a box edge
    probably wouldn't work so well.


    I bought the plans a few years back and IIRC they take this into >consideration.
    If you are considering the Paulk design.

    I was considering stealing from it anyway. I like the arch structure
    in the sides. They look like a perfect place to stick tools to keep
    them off the top while working.

    If you are going to do the regular torsion grid under the top you need
    to do a lot of planing.

    The Paulk design is a tort ion design, isn't it? ...just with more
    widely separated top/bottom.

    Something to consider with the traditional torsion box design that has a
    top and bottom. If you drill dog holes and accidentally drop something
    into one of those holes it will be difficult to retrieve.

    Mag switch. ;-) I've found that they'll even pick up most stainless fasteners.

    FWIW things, in particular screws, drop through the MFT table holes all
    the time.
    Since I use that table to add slides to drawers I have to use a screw >container as those screws are particularly vulnerable to fall through.

    The Paulk design is very much like a torsion box design. BUT it only
    has bracing crossing from side to side and on the ends. The long sides
    are only on the outside. And then it is open all the way through both >directions.

    Right. That's what I thought. Good point about fewer supports though.

    I sometimes put my long clamps inside.

    Take a look as his latest plans/videos at least for ideas. He has
    changed the elongated cut outs from having half circle ends to squares >corners. Drawers might be a consideration if it will be permanently set
    up..

    Good place for tracks too. Won't help the 108" but the 55" should be
    easy to hide in the ends.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Fri Feb 25 17:13:23 2022
    On 2/24/2022 5:15 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 24 Feb 2022 10:36:38 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 5:11 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 13:02:16 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 10:22 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or >>>>>>>> you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to >>>>>>>> clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>>>>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up >>>>>>>> store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or >>>>>>>> creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of >>>>>>>> clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/ >>>>>>>>
    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with >>>>>>>> plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it >>>>>>>> all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench >>>>>>>> straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>>>>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>>>>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some >>>>>> storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut
    router bit, the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.



    This is true BUT.... You should consider if you will use the bench top >>>> like many use the MFT table. Others depend on the dog holes to be
    "PRECICELY" located so that they can use dogs to square up stock and cut >>>> with a track saw. Aligning visually will not guarantee precise placement. >>>>
    Others use the dogs and track to make precise 90 and 45 degree cuts with >>>> their track saws.

    I would advise to draw the holes in Sketchup, precisely, and convert to >>>> an SVG file. Ultimately that would probably be faster as you would not >>>> have to mark the top and or alight the Origin on those marks for each of >>>> those holes.

    I bought one of these in 2017 when it was a one-time tool.

    <https://www.woodpeck.com/hole-boring-jig-2019.html>


    That will work too! You do want the accuracy if you can. Swingman,
    remember him? He bought the Parf set up and built his Paulk work bench.
    https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/tools/jigs-guides-and-fixtures/110468-mk-ii-parf-guide-drilling-system?item=58B3996&utm_source=free_google_shopping&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=shopping_feed&gclid=
    CjwKCAiA9tyQBhAIEiwA6tdCrDIzYfaBCWbsfR87Sh5PKzOiJ4Q_LSIMSfk_QLj3PE7vTcK6ecgaRhoCp9sQAvD_BwE


    Your Origin would be easier to use for this operation. There will be no
    cutting and moving a jig to a new location. And no pushing to plunge.

    The Origin may be more accurate too. Any errors in the jig, for
    whatever reason (spacing, hole size, hole/pin fit, or whatever) is cumulative. The origin wouldn't be, unless the tape stretches.

    Probably more accurate and yes the re-placement of the jig would add up
    an error if there was one. If the tape stretches the Origin may not
    recognize it al all. I know that it does not recognize a partial
    domino. When you scan the work area, the Origin will let you know if
    the tape is good. The scan screen changes the color of the tape as it "approves". ;~)




    That said, IIRC the Shaper Hub has downloadable SVG files to recreate
    the MFT table dog holes. While you needs may require a larger work
    surface with dog holes you can use the same SVG file and tell the Origin
    to begin as a different location for more holes.

    It would seem that "offset" would do it. The spacing of 3/4" holes and
    20mm holes is the same, isn't it? If there is any imperial/metric
    conversion error, it would be cumulative too.

    The spacing is a particular metric measurement IIRC.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Fri Feb 25 17:07:50 2022
    On 2/24/2022 5:27 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 24 Feb 2022 10:27:46 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 5:19 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 12:54:16 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/22/2022 9:32 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space. >>>>>>>
    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or >>>>>>> you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not >>>>>>> have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to >>>>>>> clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>>>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up >>>>>>> store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that >>>>>>> black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or >>>>>>> creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of >>>>>>> clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/ >>>>>>>
    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with >>>>>>> plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it >>>>>>> all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench >>>>>>> straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>>>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>>>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.

    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some >>>>> storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)


    Yes, the Paulk benches are very rigid. I build mine from 1/2" "Baltic >>>> birch LIKE" 4x8 plywood from Lowes. Painted/primed on both sides IIRC. >>>> It was inexpensive and I will say not nearly as tough as Baltic Birch. >>>> BUT I abuse it and it has held up well so far, 4 years and counting. >>>>
    Building it is a job, especially of you populate the top with "dog"
    holes. Because I have a Festool MFT table I chose to not drill all of >>>> those holes.

    That raises an important point. The torsion box sides have to be
    thought out with the dog holes in mind. A dog hole through a box edge
    probably wouldn't work so well.


    I bought the plans a few years back and IIRC they take this into
    consideration.
    If you are considering the Paulk design.

    I was considering stealing from it anyway. I like the arch structure
    in the sides. They look like a perfect place to stick tools to keep
    them off the top while working.


    Yes! I store clamps and tools under there. The new design sides are
    square vs round.


    If you are going to do the regular torsion grid under the top you need
    to do a lot of planing.

    The Paulk design is a tort ion design, isn't it? ...just with more
    widely separated top/bottom.

    Probably, but open all the way through from all sides.



    Something to consider with the traditional torsion box design that has a
    top and bottom. If you drill dog holes and accidentally drop something
    into one of those holes it will be difficult to retrieve.

    Mag switch. ;-) I've found that they'll even pick up most stainless fasteners.


    But will it go down through a 3/4" dog hole?


    FWIW things, in particular screws, drop through the MFT table holes all
    the time.
    Since I use that table to add slides to drawers I have to use a screw
    container as those screws are particularly vulnerable to fall through.

    The Paulk design is very much like a torsion box design. BUT it only
    has bracing crossing from side to side and on the ends. The long sides
    are only on the outside. And then it is open all the way through both
    directions.

    Right. That's what I thought. Good point about fewer supports though.

    I sometimes put my long clamps inside.

    Take a look as his latest plans/videos at least for ideas. He has
    changed the elongated cut outs from having half circle ends to squares
    corners. Drawers might be a consideration if it will be permanently set
    up..

    Good place for tracks too. Won't help the 108" but the 55" should be
    easy to hide in the ends.

    Depends on how long you make it. Mine is 96" The long track would not
    stick out too much. ;~)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Fri Feb 25 22:05:17 2022
    On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 17:13:23 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/24/2022 5:15 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 24 Feb 2022 10:36:38 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 5:11 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 13:02:16 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 10:22 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote: >>>>>>>>> On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or >>>>>>>>> you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to >>>>>>>>> clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>>>>>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up >>>>>>>>> store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/ >>>>>>>>>
    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with >>>>>>>>> plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench
    straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>>>>>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>>>>>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some >>>>>>> storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut
    router bit, the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.



    This is true BUT.... You should consider if you will use the bench top >>>>> like many use the MFT table. Others depend on the dog holes to be
    "PRECICELY" located so that they can use dogs to square up stock and cut >>>>> with a track saw. Aligning visually will not guarantee precise placement.

    Others use the dogs and track to make precise 90 and 45 degree cuts with >>>>> their track saws.

    I would advise to draw the holes in Sketchup, precisely, and convert to >>>>> an SVG file. Ultimately that would probably be faster as you would not >>>>> have to mark the top and or alight the Origin on those marks for each of >>>>> those holes.

    I bought one of these in 2017 when it was a one-time tool.

    <https://www.woodpeck.com/hole-boring-jig-2019.html>


    That will work too! You do want the accuracy if you can. Swingman,
    remember him? He bought the Parf set up and built his Paulk work bench. >>> https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/tools/jigs-guides-and-fixtures/110468-mk-ii-parf-guide-drilling-system?item=58B3996&utm_source=free_google_shopping&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=shopping_feed&gclid=
    CjwKCAiA9tyQBhAIEiwA6tdCrDIzYfaBCWbsfR87Sh5PKzOiJ4Q_LSIMSfk_QLj3PE7vTcK6ecgaRhoCp9sQAvD_BwE


    Your Origin would be easier to use for this operation. There will be no >>> cutting and moving a jig to a new location. And no pushing to plunge.

    The Origin may be more accurate too. Any errors in the jig, for
    whatever reason (spacing, hole size, hole/pin fit, or whatever) is
    cumulative. The origin wouldn't be, unless the tape stretches.

    Probably more accurate and yes the re-placement of the jig would add up
    an error if there was one. If the tape stretches the Origin may not >recognize it al all. I know that it does not recognize a partial
    domino. When you scan the work area, the Origin will let you know if
    the tape is good. The scan screen changes the color of the tape as it >"approves". ;~)


    The videos I've watched warn that stretching the tape will throw the
    scaling off.


    That said, IIRC the Shaper Hub has downloadable SVG files to recreate
    the MFT table dog holes. While you needs may require a larger work
    surface with dog holes you can use the same SVG file and tell the Origin >>> to begin as a different location for more holes.

    It would seem that "offset" would do it. The spacing of 3/4" holes and
    20mm holes is the same, isn't it? If there is any imperial/metric
    conversion error, it would be cumulative too.

    The spacing is a particular metric measurement IIRC.

    Strange. The Woodpecker jig does 3/4" and 20mm holes but uses the
    same template for both. The 20mm holes are specifically designed to
    make MFT compatible/replacement tops.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Fri Feb 25 22:11:04 2022
    On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 17:07:50 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/24/2022 5:27 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 24 Feb 2022 10:27:46 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 5:19 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 12:54:16 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/22/2022 9:32 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or >>>>>>>> you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to >>>>>>>> clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>>>>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up >>>>>>>> store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or >>>>>>>> creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of >>>>>>>> clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/ >>>>>>>>
    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with >>>>>>>> plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it >>>>>>>> all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench >>>>>>>> straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>>>>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>>>>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.

    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some >>>>>> storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)


    Yes, the Paulk benches are very rigid. I build mine from 1/2" "Baltic >>>>> birch LIKE" 4x8 plywood from Lowes. Painted/primed on both sides IIRC. >>>>> It was inexpensive and I will say not nearly as tough as Baltic Birch. >>>>> BUT I abuse it and it has held up well so far, 4 years and counting. >>>>>
    Building it is a job, especially of you populate the top with "dog"
    holes. Because I have a Festool MFT table I chose to not drill all of >>>>> those holes.

    That raises an important point. The torsion box sides have to be
    thought out with the dog holes in mind. A dog hole through a box edge
    probably wouldn't work so well.


    I bought the plans a few years back and IIRC they take this into
    consideration.
    If you are considering the Paulk design.

    I was considering stealing from it anyway. I like the arch structure
    in the sides. They look like a perfect place to stick tools to keep
    them off the top while working.


    Yes! I store clamps and tools under there. The new design sides are
    square vs round.


    If you are going to do the regular torsion grid under the top you need
    to do a lot of planing.

    The Paulk design is a tort ion design, isn't it? ...just with more
    widely separated top/bottom.

    Probably, but open all the way through from all sides.

    ...and further apart.


    Something to consider with the traditional torsion box design that has a >>> top and bottom. If you drill dog holes and accidentally drop something
    into one of those holes it will be difficult to retrieve.

    Mag switch. ;-) I've found that they'll even pick up most stainless
    fasteners.


    But will it go down through a 3/4" dog hole?

    Have you ever seen the magnetic puppies kids play with (or used to
    before toys were banned)? Use the magswitch to move the thing around
    until it falls out (holes on both sides?).

    FWIW things, in particular screws, drop through the MFT table holes all
    the time.
    Since I use that table to add slides to drawers I have to use a screw
    container as those screws are particularly vulnerable to fall through.

    The Paulk design is very much like a torsion box design. BUT it only
    has bracing crossing from side to side and on the ends. The long sides
    are only on the outside. And then it is open all the way through both
    directions.

    Right. That's what I thought. Good point about fewer supports though.

    I sometimes put my long clamps inside.

    Take a look as his latest plans/videos at least for ideas. He has
    changed the elongated cut outs from having half circle ends to squares
    corners. Drawers might be a consideration if it will be permanently set >>> up..

    Good place for tracks too. Won't help the 108" but the 55" should be
    easy to hide in the ends.

    Depends on how long you make it. Mine is 96" The long track would not
    stick out too much. ;~)

    I'd hate to put an expensive ding in the end.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Sat Feb 26 09:08:01 2022
    On 2/25/2022 9:11 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 17:07:50 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/24/2022 5:27 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 24 Feb 2022 10:27:46 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 5:19 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 12:54:16 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/22/2022 9:32 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote: >>>>>>>>> On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or >>>>>>>>> you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to >>>>>>>>> clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>>>>>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up >>>>>>>>> store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/ >>>>>>>>>
    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with >>>>>>>>> plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench
    straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>>>>>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>>>>>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.

    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some >>>>>>> storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)


    Yes, the Paulk benches are very rigid. I build mine from 1/2" "Baltic >>>>>> birch LIKE" 4x8 plywood from Lowes. Painted/primed on both sides IIRC. >>>>>> It was inexpensive and I will say not nearly as tough as Baltic Birch.
    BUT I abuse it and it has held up well so far, 4 years and counting. >>>>>>
    Building it is a job, especially of you populate the top with "dog" >>>>>> holes. Because I have a Festool MFT table I chose to not drill all of >>>>>> those holes.

    That raises an important point. The torsion box sides have to be
    thought out with the dog holes in mind. A dog hole through a box edge >>>>> probably wouldn't work so well.


    I bought the plans a few years back and IIRC they take this into
    consideration.
    If you are considering the Paulk design.

    I was considering stealing from it anyway. I like the arch structure
    in the sides. They look like a perfect place to stick tools to keep
    them off the top while working.


    Yes! I store clamps and tools under there. The new design sides are
    square vs round.


    If you are going to do the regular torsion grid under the top you need >>>> to do a lot of planing.

    The Paulk design is a tort ion design, isn't it? ...just with more
    widely separated top/bottom.

    Probably, but open all the way through from all sides.

    ...and further apart.


    Something to consider with the traditional torsion box design that has a >>>> top and bottom. If you drill dog holes and accidentally drop something >>>> into one of those holes it will be difficult to retrieve.

    Mag switch. ;-) I've found that they'll even pick up most stainless
    fasteners.


    But will it go down through a 3/4" dog hole?

    Have you ever seen the magnetic puppies kids play with (or used to
    before toys were banned)? Use the magswitch to move the thing around
    until it falls out (holes on both sides?).


    Gotcha but I don't think you would want to do that. That could be very
    time consuming. AND I was thinking a completely closed in torsion box
    where the only opening to the inside would be the dog holes. Otherwise
    just reach inside for the Paulk style bench with your hand. With the
    MFT the screw falls through, hits the concrete floor, and goes who knows
    where. ;~)




    FWIW things, in particular screws, drop through the MFT table holes all >>>> the time.
    Since I use that table to add slides to drawers I have to use a screw
    container as those screws are particularly vulnerable to fall through. >>>>
    The Paulk design is very much like a torsion box design. BUT it only
    has bracing crossing from side to side and on the ends. The long sides >>>> are only on the outside. And then it is open all the way through both >>>> directions.

    Right. That's what I thought. Good point about fewer supports though.

    I sometimes put my long clamps inside.

    Take a look as his latest plans/videos at least for ideas. He has
    changed the elongated cut outs from having half circle ends to squares >>>> corners. Drawers might be a consideration if it will be permanently set >>>> up..

    Good place for tracks too. Won't help the 108" but the 55" should be
    easy to hide in the ends.

    Depends on how long you make it. Mine is 96" The long track would not
    stick out too much. ;~)

    I'd hate to put an expensive ding in the end.

    Yes! And why I simply hang my 3 tracks from the hole on the end. That
    said, several years ago I certainly did some damage to one of my tracks.
    Some how the saw was not indexed properly and when I plunged the blade
    cut into the edge and splinter guard and about 1/4" into the track.
    Fortunately it did not affect performance of the track. Just looks like
    crap.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Sat Feb 26 09:21:51 2022
    On 2/25/2022 9:05 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 17:13:23 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/24/2022 5:15 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 24 Feb 2022 10:36:38 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 5:11 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 13:02:16 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 10:22 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 9:32:12 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote: >>>>>>>>>> On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>>>>>>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/ >>>>>>>>>>
    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with
    plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench
    straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>>>>>>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>>>>>>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.
    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some >>>>>>>> storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)

    The shaper origin is very effective and efficient for cutting perfect dog holes. I just draw a crosshair on the surface for where it is to be located, then visually place the hole with the origin on that crosshair. Using a 1/2" straight cut
    router bit, the shaper will cut the hole in 18mm baltic birch in about 5 seconds.



    This is true BUT.... You should consider if you will use the bench top >>>>>> like many use the MFT table. Others depend on the dog holes to be >>>>>> "PRECICELY" located so that they can use dogs to square up stock and cut >>>>>> with a track saw. Aligning visually will not guarantee precise placement.

    Others use the dogs and track to make precise 90 and 45 degree cuts with >>>>>> their track saws.

    I would advise to draw the holes in Sketchup, precisely, and convert to >>>>>> an SVG file. Ultimately that would probably be faster as you would not >>>>>> have to mark the top and or alight the Origin on those marks for each of >>>>>> those holes.

    I bought one of these in 2017 when it was a one-time tool.

    <https://www.woodpeck.com/hole-boring-jig-2019.html>


    That will work too! You do want the accuracy if you can. Swingman,
    remember him? He bought the Parf set up and built his Paulk work bench. >>>> https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/tools/jigs-guides-and-fixtures/110468-mk-ii-parf-guide-drilling-system?item=58B3996&utm_source=free_google_shopping&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=shopping_feed&gclid=
    CjwKCAiA9tyQBhAIEiwA6tdCrDIzYfaBCWbsfR87Sh5PKzOiJ4Q_LSIMSfk_QLj3PE7vTcK6ecgaRhoCp9sQAvD_BwE


    Your Origin would be easier to use for this operation. There will be no >>>> cutting and moving a jig to a new location. And no pushing to plunge.

    The Origin may be more accurate too. Any errors in the jig, for
    whatever reason (spacing, hole size, hole/pin fit, or whatever) is
    cumulative. The origin wouldn't be, unless the tape stretches.

    Probably more accurate and yes the re-placement of the jig would add up
    an error if there was one. If the tape stretches the Origin may not
    recognize it al all. I know that it does not recognize a partial
    domino. When you scan the work area, the Origin will let you know if
    the tape is good. The scan screen changes the color of the tape as it
    "approves". ;~)


    The videos I've watched warn that stretching the tape will throw the
    scaling off.

    I guess that is possible. I have never given it a thought. The tape is
    not reeeeeel sticky so it comes off of the roll quite easily therefore
    it does not stretch when pulling the roll across the area to be scanned.

    And concerning that I put several strips on a piece of plywood for using
    like the work station domino field, just a larger area. That was summer
    before last. I still use that for larger stuff that will not fit on the
    work station. The tape has held up well and not come off.





    That said, IIRC the Shaper Hub has downloadable SVG files to recreate
    the MFT table dog holes. While you needs may require a larger work
    surface with dog holes you can use the same SVG file and tell the Origin >>>> to begin as a different location for more holes.

    It would seem that "offset" would do it. The spacing of 3/4" holes and
    20mm holes is the same, isn't it? If there is any imperial/metric
    conversion error, it would be cumulative too.

    The spacing is a particular metric measurement IIRC.

    Strange. The Woodpecker jig does 3/4" and 20mm holes but uses the
    same template for both. The 20mm holes are specifically designed to
    make MFT compatible/replacement tops.

    I would guess that the centers of the holes on the jig are a specific
    distance. If they copy the MFT they are probably a metric spacing.

    Different sized holes are accomplished by different sized guide
    bushings. AND the indexing plugs are different sized, 3 of each.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Sat Feb 26 13:56:01 2022
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:08:01 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/25/2022 9:11 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:

    <...>
    I'd hate to put an expensive ding in the end.

    Yes! And why I simply hang my 3 tracks from the hole on the end.

    My ceiling is high enough for the 108" track. It will fit between the
    floor joists above but it's a PITA taking it out, with all the wires
    and stuff up there. It's still in the wood box it came in so pretty
    well protected.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Sat Feb 26 13:36:20 2022
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:21:51 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/25/2022 9:05 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 17:13:23 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    Probably more accurate and yes the re-placement of the jig would add up
    an error if there was one. If the tape stretches the Origin may not
    recognize it al all. I know that it does not recognize a partial
    domino. When you scan the work area, the Origin will let you know if
    the tape is good. The scan screen changes the color of the tape as it
    "approves". ;~)


    The videos I've watched warn that stretching the tape will throw the
    scaling off.

    I guess that is possible. I have never given it a thought. The tape is
    not reeeeeel sticky so it comes off of the roll quite easily therefore
    it does not stretch when pulling the roll across the area to be scanned.

    And concerning that I put several strips on a piece of plywood for using
    like the work station domino field, just a larger area. That was summer >before last. I still use that for larger stuff that will not fit on the
    work station. The tape has held up well and not come off.

    I've seen references to that but it doesn't make much sense to me. The
    camera only looks so far so the "workstation" can't be any deeper than
    that. I guess it can be any width but there is a maximum distance
    between the cutter and the camera's vision.



    That said, IIRC the Shaper Hub has downloadable SVG files to recreate >>>>> the MFT table dog holes. While you needs may require a larger work
    surface with dog holes you can use the same SVG file and tell the Origin >>>>> to begin as a different location for more holes.

    It would seem that "offset" would do it. The spacing of 3/4" holes and >>>> 20mm holes is the same, isn't it? If there is any imperial/metric
    conversion error, it would be cumulative too.

    The spacing is a particular metric measurement IIRC.

    Strange. The Woodpecker jig does 3/4" and 20mm holes but uses the
    same template for both. The 20mm holes are specifically designed to
    make MFT compatible/replacement tops.

    I would guess that the centers of the holes on the jig are a specific >distance. If they copy the MFT they are probably a metric spacing.

    But then two-hole stops in the imperial top won't work. I'm sure I
    can find the details on line.

    Different sized holes are accomplished by different sized guide
    bushings. AND the indexing plugs are different sized, 3 of each.

    Right, but the distance between hole centers is fixed.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Sat Feb 26 13:52:02 2022
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:08:01 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/25/2022 9:11 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 17:07:50 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/24/2022 5:27 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 24 Feb 2022 10:27:46 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/23/2022 5:19 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 12:54:16 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/22/2022 9:32 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:19:02 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:17:35 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote: >>>>>>>>>> On 2/22/2022 11:59 AM, Bob Davis wrote:
    I am always on the lookout for easier/better ways to handle breakdown of full size sheets of plywood and MDF. I have an assembly table with drop down leaf extension that will hold it. I have a Festool tracksaw.

    Using the assembly table means I have clear it off completely before getting started. I've considered the Paulk workbench. I just do not want to donate the space to store it.

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Soooo. I have the Paulk work bench, I modified the size to suite my needs.

    This will address your question above and respond to the storage space.

    Your assembly table remains filled because you do not have a place or
    you choose to not clear it off after a job. We all know how that goes....

    My Paulk work bench gets put away after every job. Therefore it doe not
    have to be cleared off before use. That solves the issue of having to
    clear it off to cut plywood.

    Put away my 8' long by 40" wide bench has a foot print of 20" x 17". >>>>>>>>>> 2.36 square feet. That is both halves. The saw horses that hold it up
    store fold flat and are 1" thick when folded up. I put both behind that
    black tool box in the attached picture.

    This is my assembly table, sanding table, cutting table, what ever needs
    a bench table/bench.

    When set up for use I can hop up on it and sit and it does not move or
    creak. It holds my heaviest of projects including a full compliment of
    clamps with no issue.


    https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb11211/51897050957/in/datetaken/ >>>>>>>>>>
    Someone on here, Derbydad,? has a centipede.

    I prefer something that is stable and will not move when loading with
    plywood and cutting with a track saw. I actually crawl up on top of it
    all when making long cuts.

    When I start project I load all of my plywood on top of the Pulk bench
    straight off of my truck. Then I cut all the pieces, label them, and >>>>>>>>>> stack on edge elsewhere. Then the wood surface is empty and ready to >>>>>>>>>> handle all the tasks for assembly.

    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?

    Bob

    Leon, you are doing what you are so good at - talk up an idea and defend it until we think its a good idea, too. Most of the time, you are right. So I am going to find those Paulk plans I bought a while back.

    I was thinking about torsion box benches. The Paulk would give some >>>>>>>> storage space under the bench, out of the way of the work.
    I don't need to put benches away, just what's on them. ;-)


    Yes, the Paulk benches are very rigid. I build mine from 1/2" "Baltic >>>>>>> birch LIKE" 4x8 plywood from Lowes. Painted/primed on both sides IIRC. >>>>>>> It was inexpensive and I will say not nearly as tough as Baltic Birch.
    BUT I abuse it and it has held up well so far, 4 years and counting.

    Building it is a job, especially of you populate the top with "dog" >>>>>>> holes. Because I have a Festool MFT table I chose to not drill all of >>>>>>> those holes.

    That raises an important point. The torsion box sides have to be
    thought out with the dog holes in mind. A dog hole through a box edge >>>>>> probably wouldn't work so well.


    I bought the plans a few years back and IIRC they take this into
    consideration.
    If you are considering the Paulk design.

    I was considering stealing from it anyway. I like the arch structure
    in the sides. They look like a perfect place to stick tools to keep
    them off the top while working.


    Yes! I store clamps and tools under there. The new design sides are
    square vs round.


    If you are going to do the regular torsion grid under the top you need >>>>> to do a lot of planing.

    The Paulk design is a tort ion design, isn't it? ...just with more
    widely separated top/bottom.

    Probably, but open all the way through from all sides.

    ...and further apart.


    Something to consider with the traditional torsion box design that has a >>>>> top and bottom. If you drill dog holes and accidentally drop something >>>>> into one of those holes it will be difficult to retrieve.

    Mag switch. ;-) I've found that they'll even pick up most stainless
    fasteners.


    But will it go down through a 3/4" dog hole?

    Have you ever seen the magnetic puppies kids play with (or used to
    before toys were banned)? Use the magswitch to move the thing around
    until it falls out (holes on both sides?).


    Gotcha but I don't think you would want to do that. That could be very
    time consuming. AND I was thinking a completely closed in torsion box
    where the only opening to the inside would be the dog holes. Otherwise
    just reach inside for the Paulk style bench with your hand. With the
    MFT the screw falls through, hits the concrete floor, and goes who knows >where. ;~)

    Your foot!

    If the torsion box only has an inch or so interior cavity, a magswitch
    is strong enough to get a steel fastener.

    The torsion box could have dog holes top and bottom without
    compromising its strength. That's the point of a torsion box. The
    pitch of the slats would have to match the pitch of the dog holes and
    you'd grow old drilling the dog holes but it should work.

    That's all academic though. If I build another bench it would be more
    of a Paulk style top on a permanent base. I like your idea of
    drawers. It would be really easy to add the rails before the top is
    glued down. The problem is that no matter what tool you need, its
    drawer is going to be on the other side of the top. ;-)




    FWIW things, in particular screws, drop through the MFT table holes all >>>>> the time.
    Since I use that table to add slides to drawers I have to use a screw >>>>> container as those screws are particularly vulnerable to fall through. >>>>>
    The Paulk design is very much like a torsion box design. BUT it only >>>>> has bracing crossing from side to side and on the ends. The long sides >>>>> are only on the outside. And then it is open all the way through both >>>>> directions.

    Right. That's what I thought. Good point about fewer supports though. >>>>>
    I sometimes put my long clamps inside.

    Take a look as his latest plans/videos at least for ideas. He has
    changed the elongated cut outs from having half circle ends to squares >>>>> corners. Drawers might be a consideration if it will be permanently set >>>>> up..

    Good place for tracks too. Won't help the 108" but the 55" should be
    easy to hide in the ends.

    Depends on how long you make it. Mine is 96" The long track would not
    stick out too much. ;~)

    I'd hate to put an expensive ding in the end.

    Yes! And why I simply hang my 3 tracks from the hole on the end. That
    said, several years ago I certainly did some damage to one of my tracks.
    Some how the saw was not indexed properly and when I plunged the blade
    cut into the edge and splinter guard and about 1/4" into the track. >Fortunately it did not affect performance of the track. Just looks like >crap.

    I did the same thing except I think it kicked somehow (?) but it
    bounced out of the track and chewed a ugly scar across the rail, about
    4". It didn't cut through the rail all the way across so the rail
    still works as well as it did before.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Sat Feb 26 14:29:29 2022
    On 2/26/2022 12:56 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:08:01 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/25/2022 9:11 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:

    <...>
    I'd hate to put an expensive ding in the end.

    Yes! And why I simply hang my 3 tracks from the hole on the end.

    My ceiling is high enough for the 108" track. It will fit between the
    floor joists above but it's a PITA taking it out, with all the wires
    and stuff up there. It's still in the wood box it came in so pretty
    well protected.


    Ah! My ceilings/sheet rock is 108" on the short height/back of the
    garage and progress higher towards the garage doors to about 114"

    Actually the floor drops 3" at the bump stop, then angles lower towards
    the garage door.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Sat Feb 26 14:23:44 2022
    On 2/26/2022 12:36 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:21:51 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/25/2022 9:05 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 17:13:23 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    Probably more accurate and yes the re-placement of the jig would add up >>>> an error if there was one. If the tape stretches the Origin may not
    recognize it al all. I know that it does not recognize a partial
    domino. When you scan the work area, the Origin will let you know if
    the tape is good. The scan screen changes the color of the tape as it >>>> "approves". ;~)


    The videos I've watched warn that stretching the tape will throw the
    scaling off.

    I guess that is possible. I have never given it a thought. The tape is
    not reeeeeel sticky so it comes off of the roll quite easily therefore
    it does not stretch when pulling the roll across the area to be scanned.

    And concerning that I put several strips on a piece of plywood for using
    like the work station domino field, just a larger area. That was summer
    before last. I still use that for larger stuff that will not fit on the
    work station. The tape has held up well and not come off.

    I've seen references to that but it doesn't make much sense to me. The
    camera only looks so far so the "workstation" can't be any deeper than
    that. I guess it can be any width but there is a maximum distance
    between the cutter and the camera's vision.

    The Origin shipped before the work station so I used what I had. But it
    is also wider than the workstation so there is no limit to how wide the
    field can be.

    Some guys have taped off a whole floor to do inlay. You can cut into
    the tape. I cut out speaker grills several months ago, much
    bigger/deeper than the area on the work station. Just start close to
    you and work your way away so that you will not be referencing tape that
    has been damaged by the Origin cuts. I did the opposite on one grill,
    started on the far side and cut thought the tape. I had some issues
    with the damaged tape.

    I don't think there is a limit to how big the scan can be.

    If you have enough Domino tape there is really no limit as to how big
    the project can be. And another reason I chose the Origin over a fixed
    size CNC machine.





    That said, IIRC the Shaper Hub has downloadable SVG files to recreate >>>>>> the MFT table dog holes. While you needs may require a larger work >>>>>> surface with dog holes you can use the same SVG file and tell the Origin >>>>>> to begin as a different location for more holes.

    It would seem that "offset" would do it. The spacing of 3/4" holes and >>>>> 20mm holes is the same, isn't it? If there is any imperial/metric
    conversion error, it would be cumulative too.

    The spacing is a particular metric measurement IIRC.

    Strange. The Woodpecker jig does 3/4" and 20mm holes but uses the
    same template for both. The 20mm holes are specifically designed to
    make MFT compatible/replacement tops.

    I would guess that the centers of the holes on the jig are a specific
    distance. If they copy the MFT they are probably a metric spacing.

    But then two-hole stops in the imperial top won't work. I'm sure I
    can find the details on line.

    Some two hole stops have adjustable dogs to fit odd spacing.

    https://armor-tool.com/product/8%e2%80%b3-dog-fence/


    Different sized holes are accomplished by different sized guide
    bushings. AND the indexing plugs are different sized, 3 of each.

    Right, but the distance between hole centers is fixed.


    Yes.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Sonny@21:1/5 to wrober...@gmail.com on Sat Feb 26 16:19:20 2022
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of the
    whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were times when
    I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and though
    partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to run well
    past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a dedicated
    carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to my
    nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these days,
    have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to Leon on Sat Feb 26 16:39:08 2022
    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 2:23:55 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/26/2022 12:36 PM, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:21:51 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/25/2022 9:05 PM, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 17:13:23 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    Probably more accurate and yes the re-placement of the jig would add up >>>> an error if there was one. If the tape stretches the Origin may not
    recognize it al all. I know that it does not recognize a partial
    domino. When you scan the work area, the Origin will let you know if >>>> the tape is good. The scan screen changes the color of the tape as it >>>> "approves". ;~)


    The videos I've watched warn that stretching the tape will throw the
    scaling off.

    I guess that is possible. I have never given it a thought. The tape is
    not reeeeeel sticky so it comes off of the roll quite easily therefore
    it does not stretch when pulling the roll across the area to be scanned. >>
    And concerning that I put several strips on a piece of plywood for using >> like the work station domino field, just a larger area. That was summer
    before last. I still use that for larger stuff that will not fit on the
    work station. The tape has held up well and not come off.

    I've seen references to that but it doesn't make much sense to me. The camera only looks so far so the "workstation" can't be any deeper than that. I guess it can be any width but there is a maximum distance
    between the cutter and the camera's vision.
    The Origin shipped before the work station so I used what I had. But it
    is also wider than the workstation so there is no limit to how wide the
    field can be.

    Some guys have taped off a whole floor to do inlay. You can cut into
    the tape. I cut out speaker grills several months ago, much
    bigger/deeper than the area on the work station. Just start close to
    you and work your way away so that you will not be referencing tape that
    has been damaged by the Origin cuts. I did the opposite on one grill,
    started on the far side and cut thought the tape. I had some issues
    with the damaged tape.

    I don't think there is a limit to how big the scan can be.

    If you have enough Domino tape there is really no limit as to how big
    the project can be. And another reason I chose the Origin over a fixed
    size CNC machine.

    My origin uses SHAPER tape. Have you worked out an advanced approach that marries the domino to the Origin. :~)




    That said, IIRC the Shaper Hub has downloadable SVG files to recreate >>>>>> the MFT table dog holes. While you needs may require a larger work >>>>>> surface with dog holes you can use the same SVG file and tell the Origin
    to begin as a different location for more holes.

    It would seem that "offset" would do it. The spacing of 3/4" holes and >>>>> 20mm holes is the same, isn't it? If there is any imperial/metric
    conversion error, it would be cumulative too.

    The spacing is a particular metric measurement IIRC.

    Strange. The Woodpecker jig does 3/4" and 20mm holes but uses the
    same template for both. The 20mm holes are specifically designed to
    make MFT compatible/replacement tops.

    I would guess that the centers of the holes on the jig are a specific
    distance. If they copy the MFT they are probably a metric spacing.

    But then two-hole stops in the imperial top won't work. I'm sure I
    can find the details on line.
    Some two hole stops have adjustable dogs to fit odd spacing.

    https://armor-tool.com/product/8%e2%80%b3-dog-fence/

    Different sized holes are accomplished by different sized guide
    bushings. AND the indexing plugs are different sized, 3 of each.

    Right, but the distance between hole centers is fixed.

    Yes.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to wrobertdavis@gmail.com on Sat Feb 26 20:09:00 2022
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:39:08 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 2:23:55 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/26/2022 12:36 PM, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:21:51 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/25/2022 9:05 PM, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 17:13:23 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:
    <..>
    Probably more accurate and yes the re-placement of the jig would add up >> >>>> an error if there was one. If the tape stretches the Origin may not
    recognize it al all. I know that it does not recognize a partial
    domino. When you scan the work area, the Origin will let you know if
    the tape is good. The scan screen changes the color of the tape as it >> >>>> "approves". ;~)


    The videos I've watched warn that stretching the tape will throw the
    scaling off.

    I guess that is possible. I have never given it a thought. The tape is
    not reeeeeel sticky so it comes off of the roll quite easily therefore
    it does not stretch when pulling the roll across the area to be scanned. >> >>
    And concerning that I put several strips on a piece of plywood for using >> >> like the work station domino field, just a larger area. That was summer >> >> before last. I still use that for larger stuff that will not fit on the >> >> work station. The tape has held up well and not come off.

    I've seen references to that but it doesn't make much sense to me. The
    camera only looks so far so the "workstation" can't be any deeper than
    that. I guess it can be any width but there is a maximum distance
    between the cutter and the camera's vision.
    The Origin shipped before the work station so I used what I had. But it
    is also wider than the workstation so there is no limit to how wide the
    field can be.

    Some guys have taped off a whole floor to do inlay. You can cut into
    the tape. I cut out speaker grills several months ago, much
    bigger/deeper than the area on the work station. Just start close to
    you and work your way away so that you will not be referencing tape that
    has been damaged by the Origin cuts. I did the opposite on one grill,
    started on the far side and cut thought the tape. I had some issues
    with the damaged tape.

    I don't think there is a limit to how big the scan can be.

    If you have enough Domino tape there is really no limit as to how big
    the project can be. And another reason I chose the Origin over a fixed
    size CNC machine.

    My origin uses SHAPER tape. Have you worked out an advanced approach that marries the domino to the Origin. :~)

    But your Origin fixes your Domino.

    Seems like it should be possible to do M&T joints on an Origin. It
    may be a pain on larger parts but there is no reason it shouldn't
    work.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Sat Feb 26 20:04:30 2022
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 14:23:44 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/26/2022 12:36 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:21:51 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/25/2022 9:05 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 17:13:23 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:
    <..>
    Probably more accurate and yes the re-placement of the jig would add up >>>>> an error if there was one. If the tape stretches the Origin may not >>>>> recognize it al all. I know that it does not recognize a partial
    domino. When you scan the work area, the Origin will let you know if >>>>> the tape is good. The scan screen changes the color of the tape as it >>>>> "approves". ;~)


    The videos I've watched warn that stretching the tape will throw the
    scaling off.

    I guess that is possible. I have never given it a thought. The tape is >>> not reeeeeel sticky so it comes off of the roll quite easily therefore
    it does not stretch when pulling the roll across the area to be scanned. >>>
    And concerning that I put several strips on a piece of plywood for using >>> like the work station domino field, just a larger area. That was summer >>> before last. I still use that for larger stuff that will not fit on the >>> work station. The tape has held up well and not come off.

    I've seen references to that but it doesn't make much sense to me. The
    camera only looks so far so the "workstation" can't be any deeper than
    that. I guess it can be any width but there is a maximum distance
    between the cutter and the camera's vision.

    The Origin shipped before the work station so I used what I had. But it
    is also wider than the workstation so there is no limit to how wide the
    field can be.

    That's what I thought. I couldn't see how a "workstation" could be
    any wider than the depth of the vision system. If it could, there
    wouldn't be any need for a lot of tape.

    Some guys have taped off a whole floor to do inlay. You can cut into
    the tape. I cut out speaker grills several months ago, much
    bigger/deeper than the area on the work station. Just start close to
    you and work your way away so that you will not be referencing tape that
    has been damaged by the Origin cuts. I did the opposite on one grill, >started on the far side and cut thought the tape. I had some issues
    with the damaged tape.

    I've seen that. Inlays on floors look really cool. I bet there is
    money to be made there. Shaper may be cheating though.

    I don't think there is a limit to how big the scan can be.

    There has to be some limit of memory but it could be ridiculously
    large.

    If you have enough Domino tape there is really no limit as to how big
    the project can be. And another reason I chose the Origin over a fixed
    size CNC machine.

    I was considering a gantry style CNC but when you were talking about
    the Origin here, I got that point. Then, I was reading about gantry
    CNCs and one of the writers said something on the order of "you can
    only make so many plaques...'. I decided that the Origin would be
    more fun. The programming of gantry CNCs sounds a lot like work.

    So it's all your fault!





    That said, IIRC the Shaper Hub has downloadable SVG files to recreate >>>>>>> the MFT table dog holes. While you needs may require a larger work >>>>>>> surface with dog holes you can use the same SVG file and tell the Origin
    to begin as a different location for more holes.

    It would seem that "offset" would do it. The spacing of 3/4" holes and >>>>>> 20mm holes is the same, isn't it? If there is any imperial/metric >>>>>> conversion error, it would be cumulative too.

    The spacing is a particular metric measurement IIRC.

    Strange. The Woodpecker jig does 3/4" and 20mm holes but uses the
    same template for both. The 20mm holes are specifically designed to
    make MFT compatible/replacement tops.

    I would guess that the centers of the holes on the jig are a specific
    distance. If they copy the MFT they are probably a metric spacing.

    But then two-hole stops in the imperial top won't work. I'm sure I
    can find the details on line.

    Some two hole stops have adjustable dogs to fit odd spacing.

    https://armor-tool.com/product/8%e2%80%b3-dog-fence/


    Different sized holes are accomplished by different sized guide
    bushings. AND the indexing plugs are different sized, 3 of each.

    Right, but the distance between hole centers is fixed.


    Yes.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Sat Feb 26 20:19:13 2022
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedarsonny@aol.com>
    wrote:

    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of the
    whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were times
    when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and though
    partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to run well
    past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a dedicated
    carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to my
    nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these days,
    have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny

    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Sonny@21:1/5 to k...@notreal.com on Sat Feb 26 18:30:34 2022
    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in

    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    Yes, ply on top of C. For garage work, I have to carry the C from the woodshop, 150' away. The ply is leaning against the garage wall, just lay and lift one end onto the C. I tilt load upholstery furniture into the truck similarly.... tilt unload
    onto a furniture cart when delivering.

    I have a few facia & soffit repairs to do on the shop this spring. I'd like to finish replacing the old siding on the west side of the shop, also. Not looking forward to lifting scaffold boards and ply onto the scaffolds for those tasks.

    I had recently hire a 20-something guy, who said he needed work, to do some of these easier tasks. He worked 4 hours on each of 2 days and hasn't come back. I've offered upholstery work (tearing apart furniture) to several people wanting work.
    They never show up. I over heard a young girl (20-ish?) say she hoped to get home on just the gas she bought, $4 and some change. I gave her $10 for more gas and asked if she wanted work, describing the upholstery work. She said yes. She never
    showed up. I wonder how some of the folks have gotten along if their stimulus funds have run dry.

    On a funny note: I was in the hospital a few days, a few weeks back. My sister came over to do some chores around the house, including cleaning the frig. She wouldn't accept any pay. I discovered, too late, my ~ $100 worth of shellac flakes, in
    the bottom of the frig, was gone. She thought it was some old dried up groceries and tossed it. I didn't have the shop frig when I bought the shellac and I never thought to put the shellac in the shop frig once I bought it.

    Sonny

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Sat Feb 26 21:50:35 2022
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 18:30:34 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedarsonny@aol.com>
    wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in

    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    Yes, ply on top of C. For garage work, I have to carry the C from the woodshop, 150' away. The ply is leaning against the garage wall, just lay and lift one end onto the C. I tilt load upholstery furniture into the truck similarly.... tilt unload
    onto a furniture cart when delivering.

    I have a few facia & soffit repairs to do on the shop this spring. I'd like to finish replacing the old siding on the west side of the shop, also. Not looking forward to lifting scaffold boards and ply onto the scaffolds for those tasks.

    I had to replace the siding (hardie plank) on one side of the house. I
    ended up hiring it out. SWMBO won't let me on ladders anymore. The
    guy is good but not cheap and somewhat hard to get to commit to the
    job.

    I had recently hire a 20-something guy, who said he needed work, to do some of these easier tasks. He worked 4 hours on each of 2 days and hasn't come back. I've offered upholstery work (tearing apart furniture) to several people wanting work.
    They never show up. I over heard a young girl (20-ish?) say she hoped to get home on just the gas she bought, $4 and some change. I gave her $10 for more gas and asked if she wanted work, describing the upholstery work. She said yes. She never
    showed up. I wonder how some of the folks have gotten along if their stimulus funds have run dry.

    Yeah. I was listening to someone talking about the "great
    resignation" and employee shortage was because of covid driving the 50somethings out of work (age discrimination) and they just said F-it
    and retired. if that's true why can't fast food restaurants find
    workers?" Those jobs weren't filled by 50somethings.

    There's real money to be made for those who want to work. As you point
    out, it may take a little work to learn a skill/trade but there is
    good money to be made and sooner rather than later. Help to get there
    too.

    <https://www.mikeroweworks.org/>


    On a funny note: I was in the hospital a few days, a few weeks back. My sister came over to do some chores around the house, including cleaning the frig. She wouldn't accept any pay. I discovered, too late, my ~ $100 worth of shellac flakes, in
    the bottom of the frig, was gone. She thought it was some old dried up groceries and tossed it. I didn't have the shop frig when I bought the shellac and I never thought to put the shellac in the shop frig once I bought it.

    At least she didn't eat it.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DerbyDad03@21:1/5 to Sonny on Sat Feb 26 18:53:20 2022
    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 9:30:38 PM UTC-5, Sonny wrote:
    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?
    Yes, ply on top of C. For garage work, I have to carry the C from the woodshop, 150' away. The ply is leaning against the garage wall, just lay and lift one end onto the C. I tilt load upholstery furniture into the truck similarly.... tilt unload onto
    a furniture cart when delivering.

    I have a few facia & soffit repairs to do on the shop this spring. I'd like to finish replacing the old siding on the west side of the shop, also. Not looking forward to lifting scaffold boards and ply onto the scaffolds for those tasks.

    I had recently hire a 20-something guy, who said he needed work, to do some of these easier tasks. He worked 4 hours on each of 2 days and hasn't come back. I've offered upholstery work (tearing apart furniture) to several people wanting work. They
    never show up. I over heard a young girl (20-ish?) say she hoped to get home on just the gas she bought, $4 and some change. I gave her $10 for more gas and asked if she wanted work, describing the upholstery work. She said yes. She never showed up. I
    wonder how some of the folks have gotten along if their stimulus funds have run dry.

    On a funny note: I was in the hospital a few days, a few weeks back. My sister came over to do some chores around the house, including cleaning the frig. She wouldn't accept any pay. I discovered, too late, my ~ $100 worth of shellac flakes, in the
    bottom of the frig, was gone. She thought it was some old dried up groceries and tossed it. I didn't have the shop frig when I bought the shellac and I never thought to put the shellac in the shop frig once I bought it.

    Sonny

    Maybe she knew what they were, fenced them and that's why she was
    gracious enough to work for free. ;-)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Sonny@21:1/5 to All on Sat Feb 26 19:33:05 2022
    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 8:53:24 PM UTC-6, DerbyDad03 wrote:

    Maybe she knew what they were, fenced them and that's why she was
    gracious enough to work for free. ;-)

    Yeah. At some gathering, long ago, I tagged her "Sinister Sister". Can't recall the event.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to k...@notreal.com on Sat Feb 26 20:58:41 2022
    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of the
    whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were times when
    I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and though
    partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to run well
    past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a dedicated
    carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to my
    nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these days, have
    been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your truck
    and getting the material to the shop.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to Bob Davis on Sun Feb 27 10:08:18 2022
    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 10:58:45 PM UTC-6, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of the
    whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were times
    when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and though
    partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to run
    well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a dedicated
    carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to my
    nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these days,
    have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.
    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your truck and
    getting the material to the shop.

    I am rethinking how to use/store the material mate, instead of sitting against the wall gathering dust. There are some interesting reviews and user photos on the rockler website. Here is a stumpy nubbs youtube video on the product (start viewing at 3:23)
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2n1gZ8PU7eo

    Bob

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to wrobertdavis@gmail.com on Sun Feb 27 16:12:26 2022
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of the
    whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were times
    when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and though
    partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to run
    well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a dedicated
    carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to my
    nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these days,
    have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your truck
    and getting the material to the shop.



    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Sun Feb 27 16:02:47 2022
    On 2/26/2022 7:04 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 14:23:44 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/26/2022 12:36 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:21:51 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/25/2022 9:05 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 17:13:23 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:
    <..>
    Probably more accurate and yes the re-placement of the jig would add up >>>>>> an error if there was one. If the tape stretches the Origin may not >>>>>> recognize it al all. I know that it does not recognize a partial
    domino. When you scan the work area, the Origin will let you know if >>>>>> the tape is good. The scan screen changes the color of the tape as it >>>>>> "approves". ;~)


    The videos I've watched warn that stretching the tape will throw the >>>>> scaling off.

    I guess that is possible. I have never given it a thought. The tape is >>>> not reeeeeel sticky so it comes off of the roll quite easily therefore >>>> it does not stretch when pulling the roll across the area to be scanned. >>>>
    And concerning that I put several strips on a piece of plywood for using >>>> like the work station domino field, just a larger area. That was summer >>>> before last. I still use that for larger stuff that will not fit on the >>>> work station. The tape has held up well and not come off.

    I've seen references to that but it doesn't make much sense to me. The
    camera only looks so far so the "workstation" can't be any deeper than
    that. I guess it can be any width but there is a maximum distance
    between the cutter and the camera's vision.

    The Origin shipped before the work station so I used what I had. But it
    is also wider than the workstation so there is no limit to how wide the
    field can be.

    That's what I thought. I couldn't see how a "workstation" could be
    any wider than the depth of the vision system. If it could, there
    wouldn't be any need for a lot of tape.

    Some guys have taped off a whole floor to do inlay. You can cut into
    the tape. I cut out speaker grills several months ago, much
    bigger/deeper than the area on the work station. Just start close to
    you and work your way away so that you will not be referencing tape that
    has been damaged by the Origin cuts. I did the opposite on one grill,
    started on the far side and cut thought the tape. I had some issues
    with the damaged tape.

    I've seen that. Inlays on floors look really cool. I bet there is
    money to be made there. Shaper may be cheating though.

    https://hackaday.com/2018/04/15/superb-wood-floor-inlay-shows-off-computer-augmented-tools/




    I don't think there is a limit to how big the scan can be.

    There has to be some limit of memory but it could be ridiculously
    large.

    If you have enough Domino tape there is really no limit as to how big
    the project can be. And another reason I chose the Origin over a fixed
    size CNC machine.

    I was considering a gantry style CNC but when you were talking about
    the Origin here, I got that point. Then, I was reading about gantry
    CNCs and one of the writers said something on the order of "you can
    only make so many plaques...'. I decided that the Origin would be
    more fun. The programming of gantry CNCs sounds a lot like work.

    So it's all your fault!

    It is always my fault! ;~(

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to Bob Davis on Sun Feb 27 15:54:38 2022
    On 2/26/2022 6:39 PM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 2:23:55 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/26/2022 12:36 PM, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:21:51 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/25/2022 9:05 PM, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 17:13:23 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:
    <..>
    Probably more accurate and yes the re-placement of the jig would add up >>>>>> an error if there was one. If the tape stretches the Origin may not >>>>>> recognize it al all. I know that it does not recognize a partial
    domino. When you scan the work area, the Origin will let you know if >>>>>> the tape is good. The scan screen changes the color of the tape as it >>>>>> "approves". ;~)


    The videos I've watched warn that stretching the tape will throw the >>>>> scaling off.

    I guess that is possible. I have never given it a thought. The tape is >>>> not reeeeeel sticky so it comes off of the roll quite easily therefore >>>> it does not stretch when pulling the roll across the area to be scanned. >>>>
    And concerning that I put several strips on a piece of plywood for using >>>> like the work station domino field, just a larger area. That was summer >>>> before last. I still use that for larger stuff that will not fit on the >>>> work station. The tape has held up well and not come off.

    I've seen references to that but it doesn't make much sense to me. The
    camera only looks so far so the "workstation" can't be any deeper than
    that. I guess it can be any width but there is a maximum distance
    between the cutter and the camera's vision.
    The Origin shipped before the work station so I used what I had. But it
    is also wider than the workstation so there is no limit to how wide the
    field can be.

    Some guys have taped off a whole floor to do inlay. You can cut into
    the tape. I cut out speaker grills several months ago, much
    bigger/deeper than the area on the work station. Just start close to
    you and work your way away so that you will not be referencing tape that
    has been damaged by the Origin cuts. I did the opposite on one grill,
    started on the far side and cut thought the tape. I had some issues
    with the damaged tape.

    I don't think there is a limit to how big the scan can be.

    If you have enough Domino tape there is really no limit as to how big
    the project can be. And another reason I chose the Origin over a fixed
    size CNC machine.

    My origin uses SHAPER tape. Have you worked out an advanced approach that marries the domino to the Origin. :~)


    LOL. No I use the Shaper brand stuff.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Sun Feb 27 16:12:09 2022
    On 2/27/2022 3:12 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of the
    whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were times
    when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and though
    partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to run
    well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a dedicated
    carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to my
    nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these days,
    have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your truck
    and getting the material to the shop.



    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>


    Sooooo I'm not lifting 3/4" ply by myself anymore either. My Paulk
    style bench is situated near the garage door. I slide the plywood out
    of the bed directly on the work bench and I cut it before moving the ply
    again.


    Is your walk out basement door to narrow to slide a sheet of plywood
    through?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Sun Feb 27 16:24:07 2022
    On 2/27/2022 4:16 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 15:54:38 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/26/2022 6:39 PM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 2:23:55 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/26/2022 12:36 PM, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:21:51 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/25/2022 9:05 PM, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 17:13:23 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> >>>>>>> wrote:
    <..>
    Probably more accurate and yes the re-placement of the jig would add up
    an error if there was one. If the tape stretches the Origin may not >>>>>>>> recognize it al all. I know that it does not recognize a partial >>>>>>>> domino. When you scan the work area, the Origin will let you know if >>>>>>>> the tape is good. The scan screen changes the color of the tape as it >>>>>>>> "approves". ;~)


    The videos I've watched warn that stretching the tape will throw the >>>>>>> scaling off.

    I guess that is possible. I have never given it a thought. The tape is >>>>>> not reeeeeel sticky so it comes off of the roll quite easily therefore >>>>>> it does not stretch when pulling the roll across the area to be scanned. >>>>>>
    And concerning that I put several strips on a piece of plywood for using >>>>>> like the work station domino field, just a larger area. That was summer >>>>>> before last. I still use that for larger stuff that will not fit on the >>>>>> work station. The tape has held up well and not come off.

    I've seen references to that but it doesn't make much sense to me. The >>>>> camera only looks so far so the "workstation" can't be any deeper than >>>>> that. I guess it can be any width but there is a maximum distance
    between the cutter and the camera's vision.
    The Origin shipped before the work station so I used what I had. But it >>>> is also wider than the workstation so there is no limit to how wide the >>>> field can be.

    Some guys have taped off a whole floor to do inlay. You can cut into
    the tape. I cut out speaker grills several months ago, much
    bigger/deeper than the area on the work station. Just start close to
    you and work your way away so that you will not be referencing tape that >>>> has been damaged by the Origin cuts. I did the opposite on one grill,
    started on the far side and cut thought the tape. I had some issues
    with the damaged tape.

    I don't think there is a limit to how big the scan can be.

    If you have enough Domino tape there is really no limit as to how big
    the project can be. And another reason I chose the Origin over a fixed >>>> size CNC machine.

    My origin uses SHAPER tape. Have you worked out an advanced approach that marries the domino to the Origin. :~)


    LOL. No I use the Shaper brand stuff.

    AIUI, you can print your own, though I'm not sure why. The only
    requirement of the tape is that there aren't any duplicated. The size
    and distance between would have to be identical too.


    I have read that you can copy the tape but..... I have not yet used the
    first roll. I build the price of the into the job.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Sun Feb 27 17:16:21 2022
    On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 15:54:38 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/26/2022 6:39 PM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 2:23:55 PM UTC-6, Leon wrote:
    On 2/26/2022 12:36 PM, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:21:51 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/25/2022 9:05 PM, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 17:13:23 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:
    <..>
    Probably more accurate and yes the re-placement of the jig would add up >>>>>>> an error if there was one. If the tape stretches the Origin may not >>>>>>> recognize it al all. I know that it does not recognize a partial >>>>>>> domino. When you scan the work area, the Origin will let you know if >>>>>>> the tape is good. The scan screen changes the color of the tape as it >>>>>>> "approves". ;~)


    The videos I've watched warn that stretching the tape will throw the >>>>>> scaling off.

    I guess that is possible. I have never given it a thought. The tape is >>>>> not reeeeeel sticky so it comes off of the roll quite easily therefore >>>>> it does not stretch when pulling the roll across the area to be scanned. >>>>>
    And concerning that I put several strips on a piece of plywood for using >>>>> like the work station domino field, just a larger area. That was summer >>>>> before last. I still use that for larger stuff that will not fit on the >>>>> work station. The tape has held up well and not come off.

    I've seen references to that but it doesn't make much sense to me. The >>>> camera only looks so far so the "workstation" can't be any deeper than >>>> that. I guess it can be any width but there is a maximum distance
    between the cutter and the camera's vision.
    The Origin shipped before the work station so I used what I had. But it
    is also wider than the workstation so there is no limit to how wide the
    field can be.

    Some guys have taped off a whole floor to do inlay. You can cut into
    the tape. I cut out speaker grills several months ago, much
    bigger/deeper than the area on the work station. Just start close to
    you and work your way away so that you will not be referencing tape that >>> has been damaged by the Origin cuts. I did the opposite on one grill,
    started on the far side and cut thought the tape. I had some issues
    with the damaged tape.

    I don't think there is a limit to how big the scan can be.

    If you have enough Domino tape there is really no limit as to how big
    the project can be. And another reason I chose the Origin over a fixed
    size CNC machine.

    My origin uses SHAPER tape. Have you worked out an advanced approach that marries the domino to the Origin. :~)


    LOL. No I use the Shaper brand stuff.

    AIUI, you can print your own, though I'm not sure why. The only
    requirement of the tape is that there aren't any duplicated. The size
    and distance between would have to be identical too.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Sun Feb 27 20:19:21 2022
    On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:12:09 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet>
    wrote:

    On 2/27/2022 3:12 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of the
    whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were times
    when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and though
    partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to run
    well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a dedicated
    carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to my
    nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these days,
    have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your
    truck and getting the material to the shop.



    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>


    Sooooo I'm not lifting 3/4" ply by myself anymore either. My Paulk
    style bench is situated near the garage door. I slide the plywood out
    of the bed directly on the work bench and I cut it before moving the ply >again.


    Is your walk out basement door to narrow to slide a sheet of plywood
    through?

    No, it's a double 36" door but it's under the deck. There's no way to
    get the truck near enough to the door to just slide sheets into the
    basement. SWMBO wants to extend the deck and cover at least part of
    it. Because of the slope of the back yard, I'll have to put the
    supports far enough apart to be able to drive under the deck. With all
    that, a concrete pad will be cheap. $40-$50K will solve a lot of
    problems.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to k...@notreal.com on Wed Mar 2 10:14:19 2022
    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of the
    whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were times
    when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and though
    partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to run
    well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a dedicated
    carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to my
    nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these days,
    have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your truck
    and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.

    I have a troll panel lift. I bought it about 19 years ago. It is pretty handy. It would be pretty straighforward to add a larger diameter handgrip.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to wrobertdavis@gmail.com on Wed Mar 2 21:30:51 2022
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >> >> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of the
    whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were times
    when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and
    though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to run
    well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a dedicated
    carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to my
    nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these days,
    have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your truck
    and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.

    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    There's something in here to think about though.

    I have a troll panel lift. I bought it about 19 years ago. It is pretty handy. It would be pretty straighforward to add a larger diameter handgrip.

    Exactly. I have one and as you say, it's handle is the problem. The
    handle is a loop so putting on a larger handle is a bit of a problem.
    I haven't figured out how, yet, but maybe a bicycle handgrip on a
    cut-away dowel? ...and a wad of electrical tape? If the handle were
    open, instead of a loop, a dowel and fly-rod shrink tubing would work.

    I use one to move sheets around the shop but I don't have to pick them
    up to move them more than a couple of inches and the floor is flat.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Markem618@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Wed Mar 2 21:10:20 2022
    On Wed, 02 Mar 2022 21:30:51 -0500, krw@notreal.com wrote:

    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of
    the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were times
    when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and
    though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to run
    well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a dedicated
    carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to my
    nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these days,
    have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your truck
    and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.

    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    There's something in here to think about though.

    I have a troll panel lift. I bought it about 19 years ago. It is pretty handy. It would be pretty straighforward to add a larger diameter handgrip.

    Exactly. I have one and as you say, it's handle is the problem. The
    handle is a loop so putting on a larger handle is a bit of a problem.
    I haven't figured out how, yet, but maybe a bicycle handgrip on a
    cut-away dowel? ...and a wad of electrical tape? If the handle were
    open, instead of a loop, a dowel and fly-rod shrink tubing would work.

    I use one to move sheets around the shop but I don't have to pick them
    up to move them more than a couple of inches and the floor is flat.

    Would foam pipe insulation work for padding out the handle?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to All on Wed Mar 2 22:49:05 2022
    On Wed, 02 Mar 2022 21:10:20 -0600, Markem618 <markrm618@hotmail.com>
    wrote:

    On Wed, 02 Mar 2022 21:30:51 -0500, krw@notreal.com wrote:

    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of
    the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were
    times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and
    though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to
    run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to
    my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these days,
    have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around >>>> >> the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your truck
    and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.

    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    There's something in here to think about though.

    I have a troll panel lift. I bought it about 19 years ago. It is pretty handy. It would be pretty straighforward to add a larger diameter handgrip.

    Exactly. I have one and as you say, it's handle is the problem. The >>handle is a loop so putting on a larger handle is a bit of a problem.
    I haven't figured out how, yet, but maybe a bicycle handgrip on a
    cut-away dowel? ...and a wad of electrical tape? If the handle were
    open, instead of a loop, a dowel and fly-rod shrink tubing would work.

    I use one to move sheets around the shop but I don't have to pick them
    up to move them more than a couple of inches and the floor is flat.

    Would foam pipe insulation work for padding out the handle?

    I don't think so. I think it has to be firmer than that. The issue
    isn't that it's too hard, rather too small (diameter). If it were 1"
    diameter steel, it would be just fine. Rubber coated would be a bonus
    but the key is not digging into the hand.

    It's easy enough to try. I have pipe insulation in the basement. I'll
    give it a try tomorrow and let you know.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to k...@notreal.com on Thu Mar 3 21:39:21 2022
    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of
    the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were
    times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and
    though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to
    run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to
    my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these days,
    have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around >> >> the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your truck
    and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174


    There's something in here to think about though.
    I have a troll panel lift. I bought it about 19 years ago. It is pretty handy. It would be pretty straighforward to add a larger diameter handgrip.
    Exactly. I have one and as you say, it's handle is the problem. The
    handle is a loop so putting on a larger handle is a bit of a problem.
    I haven't figured out how, yet, but maybe a bicycle handgrip on a
    cut-away dowel? ...and a wad of electrical tape? If the handle were
    open, instead of a loop, a dowel and fly-rod shrink tubing would work.

    I use one to move sheets around the shop but I don't have to pick them
    up to move them more than a couple of inches and the floor is flat.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to Bob Davis on Fri Mar 4 10:56:40 2022
    On 3/3/2022 11:39 PM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com> >>>>>> wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of
    the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were times
    when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and
    though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to run
    well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a dedicated
    carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to my
    nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these days,
    have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it >>>>>> gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around >>>>>> the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your truck
    and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174


    And a discount for 6 or more! ;~)

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to wrobertdavis@gmail.com on Fri Mar 4 14:03:17 2022
    On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >> >> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of
    the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were
    times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and
    though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to
    run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to
    my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these
    days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around >> >> >> the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your
    truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174

    How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)?


    There's something in here to think about though.
    I have a troll panel lift. I bought it about 19 years ago. It is pretty handy. It would be pretty straighforward to add a larger diameter handgrip.
    Exactly. I have one and as you say, it's handle is the problem. The
    handle is a loop so putting on a larger handle is a bit of a problem.
    I haven't figured out how, yet, but maybe a bicycle handgrip on a
    cut-away dowel? ...and a wad of electrical tape? If the handle were
    open, instead of a loop, a dowel and fly-rod shrink tubing would work.

    I use one to move sheets around the shop but I don't have to pick them
    up to move them more than a couple of inches and the floor is flat.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to Leon on Fri Mar 4 14:07:09 2022
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 10:56:40 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:

    On 3/3/2022 11:39 PM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com> >>>>>>> wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of
    the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were
    times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and
    though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to
    run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to
    my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these days,
    have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it >>>>>>> gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around >>>>>>> the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem. >>>>>>
    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your
    truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use >>>>> bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place >>>>> with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel >>>>> over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a >>>>> little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174


    And a discount for 6 or more! ;~)

    Rollin, rollin, rollin,
    Rollin, rollin, rollin,
    Head 'em up and move 'em on!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to krw@notreal.com on Fri Mar 4 15:38:04 2022
    On 3/4/2022 1:07 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 10:56:40 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:

    On 3/3/2022 11:39 PM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>>> On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com> >>>>>>>> wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of
    the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were
    times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and
    though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to
    run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to
    my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these
    days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it >>>>>>>> gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets >>>>>>>> anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around >>>>>>>> the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem. >>>>>>>
    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your
    truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at >>>>>> the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate >>>>>> that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use >>>>>> bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place >>>>>> with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart >>>>>> would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine >>>>>> are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel >>>>>> over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a >>>>>> little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174


    And a discount for 6 or more! ;~)

    Rollin, rollin, rollin,
    Rollin, rollin, rollin,
    Head 'em up and move 'em on!

    Raw-Hiiiiiide

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DerbyDad03@21:1/5 to k...@notreal.com on Fri Mar 4 14:00:47 2022
    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 2:03:21 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com> >> >> >> wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability
    of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were
    times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and
    though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to
    run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag
    to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these
    days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it >> >> >> gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem. >> >> >
    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your
    truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use >> >> bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place >> >> with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel >> >> over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a >> >> little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174
    How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)?

    OK, how about this then? Move, cut, assemble, etc.

    https://i.imgur.com/T0uPb2s.jpg

    All you need to do is add these:

    https://i.imgur.com/71dos8Z.jpg

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to Leon on Fri Mar 4 17:57:05 2022
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 15:38:04 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:

    On 3/4/2022 1:07 PM, krw@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 10:56:40 -0600, Leon <lcb11211@swbelldotnet> wrote:

    On 3/3/2022 11:39 PM, Bob Davis wrote:
    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>>>> On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com> >>>>>>>>> wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability of
    the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were
    times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and
    though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to
    run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag to
    my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these
    days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it >>>>>>>>> gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets >>>>>>>>> anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around >>>>>>>>> the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem. >>>>>>>>
    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your
    truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at >>>>>>> the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate >>>>>>> that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use >>>>>>> bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place >>>>>>> with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop >>>>>>> either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and >>>>>>> opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart >>>>>>> would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't >>>>>>> already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine >>>>>>> are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel >>>>>>> over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too >>>>>>> narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a >>>>>>> little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174


    And a discount for 6 or more! ;~)

    Rollin, rollin, rollin,
    Rollin, rollin, rollin,
    Head 'em up and move 'em on!

    Raw-Hiiiiiide

    You're showing your age again, Leon.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to k...@notreal.com on Fri Mar 4 15:10:44 2022
    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 1:03:21 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com> >> >> >> wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability
    of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were
    times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and
    though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade to
    run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag
    to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these
    days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it >> >> >> gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem. >> >> >
    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your
    truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use >> >> bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place >> >> with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel >> >> over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a >> >> little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174
    How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)?


    There's something in here to think about though.
    I have a troll panel lift. I bought it about 19 years ago. It is pretty handy. It would be pretty straighforward to add a larger diameter handgrip.
    Exactly. I have one and as you say, it's handle is the problem. The
    handle is a loop so putting on a larger handle is a bit of a problem.
    I haven't figured out how, yet, but maybe a bicycle handgrip on a
    cut-away dowel? ...and a wad of electrical tape? If the handle were
    open, instead of a loop, a dowel and fly-rod shrink tubing would work.

    I use one to move sheets around the shop but I don't have to pick them
    up to move them more than a couple of inches and the floor is flat.

    I thought since it was same bed length as most short bed pickups, it might hold a sheet of plywood. It certainly has easier rolling wheels compared casters on other carts mentioned. 3/4" MDF would still be a challenge

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to teamarrows@eznet.net on Fri Mar 4 18:15:51 2022
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 14:00:47 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teamarrows@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 2:03:21 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com> >> >> >> >> wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability
    of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were
    times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and
    though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade
    to run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag
    to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these
    days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it >> >> >> >> gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem. >> >> >> >
    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your
    truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use >> >> >> bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place >> >> >> with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel >> >> >> over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a >> >> >> little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174
    How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)?

    OK, how about this then? Move, cut, assemble, etc.

    https://i.imgur.com/T0uPb2s.jpg

    All you need to do is add these:

    https://i.imgur.com/71dos8Z.jpg

    I guess I'm looking to go off-road.

    I got to thinking about these: <https://www.harborfreight.com/10-inch-pneumatic-tire-with-gold-hub-41475.html> with some aluminum channel to make a larger-wheeled version of <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_35>Or
    While looking for a picture of the above, I found these: <https://www.amazon.com/Weha-Yellow-Install-Pneumatic-Capacity/dp/B06X19G4X6/ref=sr_1_24>

    <https://www.amazon.com/Strongway-Panel-Dolly-Pneumatic-Wheels/dp/B07RV54ZC6/ref=sr_1_12>

    Close

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to wrobertdavis@gmail.com on Fri Mar 4 19:50:20 2022
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 15:10:44 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 1:03:21 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com> >> >> >> >> wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the stability
    of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There were
    times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.... and
    though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade
    to run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my bag
    to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop, these
    days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it >> >> >> >> gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem. >> >> >> >
    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your
    truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use >> >> >> bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place >> >> >> with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel >> >> >> over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a >> >> >> little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174
    How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)?


    There's something in here to think about though.
    I have a troll panel lift. I bought it about 19 years ago. It is pretty handy. It would be pretty straighforward to add a larger diameter handgrip.
    Exactly. I have one and as you say, it's handle is the problem. The
    handle is a loop so putting on a larger handle is a bit of a problem.
    I haven't figured out how, yet, but maybe a bicycle handgrip on a
    cut-away dowel? ...and a wad of electrical tape? If the handle were
    open, instead of a loop, a dowel and fly-rod shrink tubing would work.

    I use one to move sheets around the shop but I don't have to pick them
    up to move them more than a couple of inches and the floor is flat.

    I thought since it was same bed length as most short bed pickups, it might hold a sheet of plywood. It certainly has easier rolling wheels compared casters on other carts mentioned. 3/4" MDF would still be a challenge

    It might work. It's 5' long but 3' would have to hang off the end. It
    couldn't be centered because of the handle. Maybe a clamp or
    something at the front edge could stabilize the sheet. 13" tires is
    certainly good.

    Why would MDF be different than ply?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DerbyDad03@21:1/5 to k...@notreal.com on Fri Mar 4 16:51:18 2022
    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 6:15:56 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 14:00:47 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 2:03:21 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >> >> On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the
    stability of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There
    were times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time....
    and though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade
    to run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my
    bag to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop,
    these days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets >> >> >> >> anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your
    truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at >> >> >> the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate >> >> >> that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop >> >> >> either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart >> >> >> would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine >> >> >> are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174
    How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)?

    OK, how about this then? Move, cut, assemble, etc.

    https://i.imgur.com/T0uPb2s.jpg

    All you need to do is add these:

    https://i.imgur.com/71dos8Z.jpg
    I guess I'm looking to go off-road.

    Well, you do need to get stuff into your backyard, down the step, etc.


    I got to thinking about these: <https://www.harborfreight.com/10-inch-pneumatic-tire-with-gold-hub-41475.html>

    Run away. Those cheap tube tires will go flat and stay flat. BTDT

    I replaced the wheels/tires on my 2-wheeled lawn cart with these. Flat free.

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08BCLJZN4

    with some aluminum channel to make a larger-wheeled version of <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_35>Or
    While looking for a picture of the above, I found these: <https://www.amazon.com/Weha-Yellow-Install-Pneumatic-Capacity/dp/B06X19G4X6/ref=sr_1_24>

    <https://www.amazon.com/Strongway-Panel-Dolly-Pneumatic-Wheels/dp/B07RV54ZC6/ref=sr_1_12>

    Close

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Bob Davis@21:1/5 to k...@notreal.com on Fri Mar 4 19:26:51 2022
    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 6:50:27 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 15:10:44 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 1:03:21 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >> >> On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the
    stability of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There
    were times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time....
    and though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a blade
    to run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my
    bag to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop,
    these days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets >> >> >> >> anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading your
    truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at >> >> >> the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate >> >> >> that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop >> >> >> either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart >> >> >> would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine >> >> >> are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174
    How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)?


    There's something in here to think about though.
    I have a troll panel lift. I bought it about 19 years ago. It is pretty handy. It would be pretty straighforward to add a larger diameter handgrip.
    Exactly. I have one and as you say, it's handle is the problem. The
    handle is a loop so putting on a larger handle is a bit of a problem. >> >> I haven't figured out how, yet, but maybe a bicycle handgrip on a
    cut-away dowel? ...and a wad of electrical tape? If the handle were
    open, instead of a loop, a dowel and fly-rod shrink tubing would work. >> >>
    I use one to move sheets around the shop but I don't have to pick them >> >> up to move them more than a couple of inches and the floor is flat.

    I thought since it was same bed length as most short bed pickups, it might hold a sheet of plywood. It certainly has easier rolling wheels compared casters on other carts mentioned. 3/4" MDF would still be a challenge
    It might work. It's 5' long but 3' would have to hang off the end. It couldn't be centered because of the handle. Maybe a clamp or
    something at the front edge could stabilize the sheet. 13" tires is certainly good.

    Why would MDF be different than ply?

    3/4" plywood weighs 60lb
    3/4" MDF weighs 87lb

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to teamarrows@eznet.net on Fri Mar 4 22:34:03 2022
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:51:18 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teamarrows@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 6:15:56 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 14:00:47 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 2:03:21 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >> >> >> On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the
    stability of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There
    were times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time....
    and though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a
    blade to run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my
    bag to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop,
    these days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets >> >> >> >> >> anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading
    your truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at >> >> >> >> the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate >> >> >> >> that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop >> >> >> >> either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart >> >> >> >> would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine >> >> >> >> are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174
    How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)?

    OK, how about this then? Move, cut, assemble, etc.

    https://i.imgur.com/T0uPb2s.jpg

    All you need to do is add these:

    https://i.imgur.com/71dos8Z.jpg
    I guess I'm looking to go off-road.

    Well, you do need to get stuff into your backyard, down the step, etc.

    I can get into the back yard with the truck. Step up (no big deal).

    I got to thinking about these:
    <https://www.harborfreight.com/10-inch-pneumatic-tire-with-gold-hub-41475.html>

    Run away. Those cheap tube tires will go flat and stay flat. BTDT

    I have eight of them that I used to move my big tools. They were flat
    but hold air. I think they have a tube.

    I replaced the wheels/tires on my 2-wheeled lawn cart with these. Flat free.

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08BCLJZN4

    Some time ago I replaced my wheel barrow tire with one.

    It was tubeless. Bad idea!

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to wrobertdavis@gmail.com on Fri Mar 4 22:39:08 2022
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 19:26:51 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrobertdavis@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 6:50:27 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 15:10:44 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 1:03:21 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote: >> >> >> On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the
    stability of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There
    were times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time....
    and though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a
    blade to run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my
    bag to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop,
    these days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets >> >> >> >> >> anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading
    your truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at >> >> >> >> the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate >> >> >> >> that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop >> >> >> >> either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart >> >> >> >> would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine >> >> >> >> are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174
    How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)?


    There's something in here to think about though.
    I have a troll panel lift. I bought it about 19 years ago. It is pretty handy. It would be pretty straighforward to add a larger diameter handgrip.
    Exactly. I have one and as you say, it's handle is the problem. The
    handle is a loop so putting on a larger handle is a bit of a problem. >> >> >> I haven't figured out how, yet, but maybe a bicycle handgrip on a
    cut-away dowel? ...and a wad of electrical tape? If the handle were
    open, instead of a loop, a dowel and fly-rod shrink tubing would work. >> >> >>
    I use one to move sheets around the shop but I don't have to pick them >> >> >> up to move them more than a couple of inches and the floor is flat.

    I thought since it was same bed length as most short bed pickups, it might hold a sheet of plywood. It certainly has easier rolling wheels compared casters on other carts mentioned. 3/4" MDF would still be a challenge
    It might work. It's 5' long but 3' would have to hang off the end. It
    couldn't be centered because of the handle. Maybe a clamp or
    something at the front edge could stabilize the sheet. 13" tires is
    certainly good.

    Why would MDF be different than ply?

    3/4" plywood weighs 60lb
    3/4" MDF weighs 87lb

    It's rated at 800lbs. Since it would carry sheets flat, getting them
    out of the truck onto it would be easy. A couple of 2x4s as a ramp.
    If it would stay on the cart, the only problem would standing the
    sheet up. I'd only have to lift 1/2 the weight.

    I think the key would be stabilizing the sheet on the cart.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DerbyDad03@21:1/5 to k...@notreal.com on Sat Mar 5 06:35:57 2022
    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 10:34:09 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:51:18 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 6:15:56 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 14:00:47 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 2:03:21 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the
    stability of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There
    were times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time....
    and though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a
    blade to run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my
    bag to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop,
    these days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading
    your truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and >> >> >> >> opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the >> >> >> >> basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't >> >> >> >> already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too >> >> >> >> narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy. >> >> >
    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174 >> >> How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)?

    OK, how about this then? Move, cut, assemble, etc.

    https://i.imgur.com/T0uPb2s.jpg

    All you need to do is add these:

    https://i.imgur.com/71dos8Z.jpg
    I guess I'm looking to go off-road.

    Well, you do need to get stuff into your backyard, down the step, etc.

    I can get into the back yard with the truck. Step up (no big deal).
    I got to thinking about these:
    <https://www.harborfreight.com/10-inch-pneumatic-tire-with-gold-hub-41475.html>

    Run away. Those cheap tube tires will go flat and stay flat. BTDT
    I have eight of them that I used to move my big tools. They were flat
    but hold air. I think they have a tube.

    The PITA was having to fill my lawn cart tires every time SWMBO or I wanted to use
    it. Since she's the gardener, she wanted to use it a lot and I wasn't always around.
    Used to really piss her off, especially since I bought the 2 wheel unit mainly for her
    so she didn't have to fight the wheel barrow. Hills, curves and uneven surfaces.

    I replaced the wheels/tires on my 2-wheeled lawn cart with these. Flat free.

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08BCLJZN4
    Some time ago I replaced my wheel barrow tire with one.

    It was tubeless. Bad idea!

    Tubeless air filled or flat free? Those are 2 very different things.

    Solid/flat free on a single wheeled device loses some of it's "give" but on our 2
    wheeled cart they are a godsend, at least in our situation. The thing about a 2
    wheeled cart is that you can pull it as well as push it so you can get it over obstructions even with flat free tires that don't give as much.

    2 wheeled carts are much better for old folks like me. This is what I have. It came with tubeless air filled tires which kept going flat. I added tubes, which
    kept going flat. That's when I bought the flat frees and never looked back.

    https://www.amazon.com/Marathon-Yard-Rover-Wheelbarrow-Garden/dp/B0721CX298

    The one problem with the plastic carts (at least that model) is that they are not made
    for front dumping like a wheel barrow is. All the weight is on the plastic body and if
    loaded with e.g. gravel it will crack if you try to dump it over the front. My neighbors
    cracked my first one that way. I repaired it with some fiberglass mat and epoxy and
    let them keep it. (It still had the cheap air filled tires at the time) They paid me with a
    really great steak dinner.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to teamarrows@eznet.net on Sat Mar 5 15:48:26 2022
    On Sat, 5 Mar 2022 06:35:57 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teamarrows@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 10:34:09 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:51:18 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 6:15:56 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 14:00:47 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 2:03:21 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the
    stability of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There
    were times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time...
    . and though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a
    blade to run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what
    a dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave
    my bag to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop,
    these days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading
    your truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and >> >> >> >> >> opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the >> >> >> >> >> basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't >> >> >> >> >> already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too >> >> >> >> >> narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy. >> >> >> >
    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174 >> >> >> How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)?

    OK, how about this then? Move, cut, assemble, etc.

    https://i.imgur.com/T0uPb2s.jpg

    All you need to do is add these:

    https://i.imgur.com/71dos8Z.jpg
    I guess I'm looking to go off-road.

    Well, you do need to get stuff into your backyard, down the step, etc.

    I can get into the back yard with the truck. Step up (no big deal).
    I got to thinking about these:
    <https://www.harborfreight.com/10-inch-pneumatic-tire-with-gold-hub-41475.html>

    Run away. Those cheap tube tires will go flat and stay flat. BTDT
    I have eight of them that I used to move my big tools. They were flat
    but hold air. I think they have a tube.

    The PITA was having to fill my lawn cart tires every time SWMBO or I wanted to use
    it. Since she's the gardener, she wanted to use it a lot and I wasn't always around.
    Used to really piss her off, especially since I bought the 2 wheel unit mainly for her
    so she didn't have to fight the wheel barrow. Hills, curves and uneven surfaces.I bought one of the Ryobi air pumps. FOr some reason her car tires need filling once every few months.

    My wife's car tires slowly lose air (no idea why but all four do). I
    bought one of the "Ryobi One" battery powered air pumps to fill tires.
    When the tire pressure light comes on, she does it herself.

    Were I to buy again, I wouldn't buy the barrow. It's too unstable. A two-wheeler would be much better.


    I replaced the wheels/tires on my 2-wheeled lawn cart with these. Flat free.

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08BCLJZN4
    Some time ago I replaced my wheel barrow tire with one.

    It was tubeless. Bad idea!

    Tubeless air filled or flat free? Those are 2 very different things.

    Tubeless air filled (like a car's).

    Solid/flat free on a single wheeled device loses some of it's "give" but on our 2
    wheeled cart they are a godsend, at least in our situation. The thing about a 2
    wheeled cart is that you can pull it as well as push it so you can get it over >obstructions even with flat free tires that don't give as much.

    A tubed pneumatic tire works well.

    2 wheeled carts are much better for old folks like me. This is what I have. It >came with tubeless air filled tires which kept going flat. I added tubes, which
    kept going flat. That's when I bought the flat frees and never looked back.

    https://www.amazon.com/Marathon-Yard-Rover-Wheelbarrow-Garden/dp/B0721CX298

    The one problem with the plastic carts (at least that model) is that they are not made
    for front dumping like a wheel barrow is. All the weight is on the plastic body and if
    loaded with e.g. gravel it will crack if you try to dump it over the front. My neighbors
    cracked my first one that way. I repaired it with some fiberglass mat and epoxy and
    let them keep it. (It still had the cheap air filled tires at the time) They paid me with a
    really great steak dinner.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DerbyDad03@21:1/5 to k...@notreal.com on Sat Mar 5 13:46:05 2022
    On Saturday, March 5, 2022 at 3:48:33 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 5 Mar 2022 06:35:57 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 10:34:09 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:51:18 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 6:15:56 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 14:00:47 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 2:03:21 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote: >> >> >> On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the
    stability of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage.
    There were times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time.
    ... and though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a
    blade to run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than
    what a dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave
    my bag to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop,
    these days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is
    unloading your truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174
    How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)? >> >> >
    OK, how about this then? Move, cut, assemble, etc.

    https://i.imgur.com/T0uPb2s.jpg

    All you need to do is add these:

    https://i.imgur.com/71dos8Z.jpg
    I guess I'm looking to go off-road.

    Well, you do need to get stuff into your backyard, down the step, etc. >> >
    I can get into the back yard with the truck. Step up (no big deal).
    I got to thinking about these:
    <https://www.harborfreight.com/10-inch-pneumatic-tire-with-gold-hub-41475.html>

    Run away. Those cheap tube tires will go flat and stay flat. BTDT
    I have eight of them that I used to move my big tools. They were flat
    but hold air. I think they have a tube.

    The PITA was having to fill my lawn cart tires every time SWMBO or I wanted to use
    it. Since she's the gardener, she wanted to use it a lot and I wasn't always around.
    Used to really piss her off, especially since I bought the 2 wheel unit mainly for her
    so she didn't have to fight the wheel barrow. Hills, curves and uneven surfaces.

    My wife's car tires slowly lose air (no idea why but all four do). I
    bought one of the "Ryobi One" battery powered air pumps to fill tires.
    When the tire pressure light comes on, she does it herself.

    Bad seal at the rim or bad seal at the TMPS sensor (valve stem).

    I've experience both, especially with aluminum wheels.


    Were I to buy again, I wouldn't buy the barrow. It's too unstable. A two-wheeler would be much better.

    That's why I bought what I bought.

    I replaced the wheels/tires on my 2-wheeled lawn cart with these. Flat free.

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08BCLJZN4
    Some time ago I replaced my wheel barrow tire with one.

    It was tubeless. Bad idea!

    Tubeless air filled or flat free? Those are 2 very different things. Tubeless air filled (like a car's).

    Solid/flat free on a single wheeled device loses some of it's "give" but on our 2
    wheeled cart they are a godsend, at least in our situation. The thing about a 2
    wheeled cart is that you can pull it as well as push it so you can get it over
    obstructions even with flat free tires that don't give as much.
    A tubed pneumatic tire works well.

    2 wheeled carts are much better for old folks like me. This is what I have. It
    came with tubeless air filled tires which kept going flat. I added tubes, which
    kept going flat. That's when I bought the flat frees and never looked back.

    https://www.amazon.com/Marathon-Yard-Rover-Wheelbarrow-Garden/dp/B0721CX298

    The one problem with the plastic carts (at least that model) is that they are not made
    for front dumping like a wheel barrow is. All the weight is on the plastic body and if
    loaded with e.g. gravel it will crack if you try to dump it over the front. My neighbors
    cracked my first one that way. I repaired it with some fiberglass mat and epoxy and
    let them keep it. (It still had the cheap air filled tires at the time) They paid me with a
    really great steak dinner.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to teamarrows@eznet.net on Sat Mar 5 17:07:42 2022
    On Sat, 5 Mar 2022 13:46:05 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teamarrows@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Saturday, March 5, 2022 at 3:48:33 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 5 Mar 2022 06:35:57 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 10:34:09 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:51:18 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 6:15:56 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 14:00:47 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 2:03:21 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote: >> >> >> >> On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the
    stability of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage.
    There were times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short
    time.... and though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for
    a blade to run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than
    what a dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I
    gave my bag to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my
    shop, these days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >
    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is
    unloading your truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174
    How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)? >> >> >> >
    OK, how about this then? Move, cut, assemble, etc.

    https://i.imgur.com/T0uPb2s.jpg

    All you need to do is add these:

    https://i.imgur.com/71dos8Z.jpg
    I guess I'm looking to go off-road.

    Well, you do need to get stuff into your backyard, down the step, etc. >> >> >
    I can get into the back yard with the truck. Step up (no big deal).
    I got to thinking about these:
    <https://www.harborfreight.com/10-inch-pneumatic-tire-with-gold-hub-41475.html>

    Run away. Those cheap tube tires will go flat and stay flat. BTDT
    I have eight of them that I used to move my big tools. They were flat
    but hold air. I think they have a tube.

    The PITA was having to fill my lawn cart tires every time SWMBO or I wanted to use
    it. Since she's the gardener, she wanted to use it a lot and I wasn't always around.
    Used to really piss her off, especially since I bought the 2 wheel unit mainly for her
    so she didn't have to fight the wheel barrow. Hills, curves and uneven surfaces.

    My wife's car tires slowly lose air (no idea why but all four do). I
    bought one of the "Ryobi One" battery powered air pumps to fill tires.
    When the tire pressure light comes on, she does it herself.

    Bad seal at the rim or bad seal at the TMPS sensor (valve stem).

    I've experience both, especially with aluminum wheels.

    All four? Well it's obvious that it is all four but that seems to be
    pretty poor quality/design/whatever. Her car has to go into the shop
    Monday (brake light on). Maybe have them look at it but at $100 per
    wheel, it's easier to just have her check the pressure occasionally.

    Were I to buy again, I wouldn't buy the barrow. It's too unstable. A
    two-wheeler would be much better.

    That's why I bought what I bought.

    Indeed. Smart. My father always had a wheelbarrow so that's what I
    bought (at least 40 years ago). Funny how these "new fangled" things
    can make life easier.

    I replaced the wheels/tires on my 2-wheeled lawn cart with these. Flat free.

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08BCLJZN4
    Some time ago I replaced my wheel barrow tire with one.

    It was tubeless. Bad idea!

    Tubeless air filled or flat free? Those are 2 very different things.
    Tubeless air filled (like a car's).

    Solid/flat free on a single wheeled device loses some of it's "give" but on our 2
    wheeled cart they are a godsend, at least in our situation. The thing about a 2
    wheeled cart is that you can pull it as well as push it so you can get it over
    obstructions even with flat free tires that don't give as much.
    A tubed pneumatic tire works well.

    2 wheeled carts are much better for old folks like me. This is what I have. It
    came with tubeless air filled tires which kept going flat. I added tubes, which
    kept going flat. That's when I bought the flat frees and never looked back. >> >
    https://www.amazon.com/Marathon-Yard-Rover-Wheelbarrow-Garden/dp/B0721CX298 >> >
    The one problem with the plastic carts (at least that model) is that they are not made
    for front dumping like a wheel barrow is. All the weight is on the plastic body and if
    loaded with e.g. gravel it will crack if you try to dump it over the front. My neighbors
    cracked my first one that way. I repaired it with some fiberglass mat and epoxy and
    let them keep it. (It still had the cheap air filled tires at the time) They paid me with a
    really great steak dinner.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Leon@21:1/5 to All on Sat Mar 5 17:34:49 2022
    On 3/5/2022 3:46 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
    On Saturday, March 5, 2022 at 3:48:33 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 5 Mar 2022 06:35:57 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 10:34:09 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:51:18 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 6:15:56 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>>>>> On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 14:00:47 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 2:03:21 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote: >>>>>>>> On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the
    stability of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage. There
    were times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short time....
    and though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports for a
    blade to run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than what a
    dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I gave my
    bag to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my shop,
    these days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets >>>>>>>>>>>>>> anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is unloading
    your truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate >>>>>>>>>>>> that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop >>>>>>>>>>>> either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and >>>>>>>>>>>> opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the >>>>>>>>>>>> basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't >>>>>>>>>>>> already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine >>>>>>>>>>>> are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too >>>>>>>>>>>> narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy. >>>>>>>>>
    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174 >>>>>>>> How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)? >>>>>>>
    OK, how about this then? Move, cut, assemble, etc.

    https://i.imgur.com/T0uPb2s.jpg

    All you need to do is add these:

    https://i.imgur.com/71dos8Z.jpg
    I guess I'm looking to go off-road.

    Well, you do need to get stuff into your backyard, down the step, etc. >>>>>
    I can get into the back yard with the truck. Step up (no big deal).
    I got to thinking about these:
    <https://www.harborfreight.com/10-inch-pneumatic-tire-with-gold-hub-41475.html>

    Run away. Those cheap tube tires will go flat and stay flat. BTDT
    I have eight of them that I used to move my big tools. They were flat
    but hold air. I think they have a tube.

    The PITA was having to fill my lawn cart tires every time SWMBO or I wanted to use
    it. Since she's the gardener, she wanted to use it a lot and I wasn't always around.
    Used to really piss her off, especially since I bought the 2 wheel unit mainly for her
    so she didn't have to fight the wheel barrow. Hills, curves and uneven surfaces.

    My wife's car tires slowly lose air (no idea why but all four do). I
    bought one of the "Ryobi One" battery powered air pumps to fill tires.
    When the tire pressure light comes on, she does it herself.

    Bad seal at the rim or bad seal at the TMPS sensor (valve stem).




    I've experience both, especially with aluminum wheels.

    Some factory aluminum wheels are porous and not properly painted inside.
    The air oozes out.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DerbyDad03@21:1/5 to k...@notreal.com on Sat Mar 5 15:33:12 2022
    On Saturday, March 5, 2022 at 5:07:50 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 5 Mar 2022 13:46:05 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Saturday, March 5, 2022 at 3:48:33 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 5 Mar 2022 06:35:57 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 10:34:09 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote: >> >> On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:51:18 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 6:15:56 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote: >> >> >> On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 14:00:47 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 2:03:21 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to the
    stability of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage.
    There were times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short
    time.... and though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports
    for a blade to run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than
    what a dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I
    gave my bag to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my
    shop, these days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be.

    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is
    unloading your truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174
    How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)?

    OK, how about this then? Move, cut, assemble, etc.

    https://i.imgur.com/T0uPb2s.jpg

    All you need to do is add these:

    https://i.imgur.com/71dos8Z.jpg
    I guess I'm looking to go off-road.

    Well, you do need to get stuff into your backyard, down the step, etc.

    I can get into the back yard with the truck. Step up (no big deal).
    I got to thinking about these:
    <https://www.harborfreight.com/10-inch-pneumatic-tire-with-gold-hub-41475.html>

    Run away. Those cheap tube tires will go flat and stay flat. BTDT
    I have eight of them that I used to move my big tools. They were flat >> >> but hold air. I think they have a tube.

    The PITA was having to fill my lawn cart tires every time SWMBO or I wanted to use
    it. Since she's the gardener, she wanted to use it a lot and I wasn't always around.
    Used to really piss her off, especially since I bought the 2 wheel unit mainly for her
    so she didn't have to fight the wheel barrow. Hills, curves and uneven surfaces.

    My wife's car tires slowly lose air (no idea why but all four do). I
    bought one of the "Ryobi One" battery powered air pumps to fill tires.
    When the tire pressure light comes on, she does it herself.

    Bad seal at the rim or bad seal at the TMPS sensor (valve stem).

    I've experience both, especially with aluminum wheels.
    All four? Well it's obvious that it is all four but that seems to be
    pretty poor quality/design/whatever. Her car has to go into the shop
    Monday (brake light on). Maybe have them look at it but at $100 per
    wheel, it's easier to just have her check the pressure occasionally.

    When I pulled SWMBO's snows out of storage a few months ago, one
    was flat flat. The other was down to about 20 lbs. It was inspection time
    so I put them in the back of her SUV and took them over to my indy.

    Both wheels had bad valve stems. One was rubber and was easily rebuilt
    with a kit. $38 with for the repair and a rim cleaning. The other was metal and was too corroded to be repaired, so it had to be replaced. $80 for the valve stem and a rim cleaning. (They were different because I bought 4 OEM wheels at a salvage yard and one was missing a stem, so they put a rubber
    one in it for me. 4-ish years ago)

    What do you get for $100 a wheel at your shop?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From krw@notreal.com@21:1/5 to teamarrows@eznet.net on Sat Mar 5 23:07:49 2022
    On Sat, 5 Mar 2022 15:33:12 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teamarrows@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Saturday, March 5, 2022 at 5:07:50 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 5 Mar 2022 13:46:05 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Saturday, March 5, 2022 at 3:48:33 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 5 Mar 2022 06:35:57 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 10:34:09 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote: >> >> >> On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:51:18 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 6:15:56 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote: >> >> >> >> On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 14:00:47 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
    <teama...@eznet.net> wrote:

    On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 2:03:21 PM UTC-5, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:39:21 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 8:30:56 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 10:14:19 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 3:12:34 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:58:41 -0800 (PST), Bob Davis
    <wrober...@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 7:19:19 PM UTC-6, k...@notreal.com wrote:
    On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 16:19:20 -0800 (PST), Sonny <cedar...@aol.com>
    wrote:
    On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:59:40 AM UTC-6, wrober...@gmail.com wrote:

    So recently, I have been looking at a Bora Centipede. It receives mostly 4-5 star reviews, along with a smattering of de-riguere 1 star "this is junk" reviews.
    Does anyone here have experience or opinions to share?
    Bob

    I bought the 4X8 Centipede about 4-5 yrs ago, when Centipede Tool had it. Affinity Tool Works acquired it and rebranded it Bora PortaMate.
    It was touted as working well on uneven surfaces. That's probably accurate on an uneven job site, similarly as using saw horses on an uneven job site. Even if a leg was lower or higher than others, that leg would contribute to
    the stability of the whole since the leg would be "anchored".

    Initially I used my centipede, topped with 1/2" padded ply, mostly as an upholstery work table. When Mom became needy and it was my turn to go over and stay with her, I established a satellite upholstery shop in her 2 car garage.
    There were times when I worked out on the lawn, which was pretty much level. I never had any issues with wobbling of the table on a slight uneven surface.

    There were times when I didn't unfold it completely, hence it was taller than when fully opened. I'd use a half sheet of ply on top. Though partially opened/extended, I needed a work space a little higher than normal for a short
    time.... and though partially opened is not secure for its touted 4500 lbs weight bearing, the open position was sufficient for my smaller projects or tasks at hand. It was plenty secure for this much lesser weight.

    As to cutting sheet goods, I've never used it for that, however one could easily cut any sheet, any direction as long as you made adjustments to prevent cutting the supports, pads, etc. There is plenty of space between supports
    for a blade to run well past any of them.

    It's a heck of a lot easier to toss it in the garage (out of the rain) for a quick job, than hauling in saw horses for table top support. I don't do lots of carpentry work/jobs, so my experience with it is probably much less than
    what a dedicated carpenter or similar would do.

    Today's C costs $200. I paid $100 for mine. Today's accessories (designs) are a little different, but same function. My accessories are in a plastic shopping bag hanging on the shop wall... don't need the carrying bag anymore. I
    gave my bag to my nephew for carrying some of his 30" surveying work tools and/or accessories. I sewed a several velcro strips/straps inside for better securing the tools.... worked out great for him and I was glad to surrender the bag.

    My only complaint about the Centipede today is... I'm getting too old for lifting heavy stuff. Though it's only ..... I don't know, guessing.... about 25 lbs, I don't like lifting "heavy" awkward stuff anymore. Many things in my
    shop, these days, have been relabeled as heavy and awkward, that use to not be. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >
    Sonny
    Plywood weighs a lot more than 25lbs and is about as awkward as it
    gets. You plywood on your Centipede, right?

    I'm starting to worry that I won't be able to carry full sheets
    anymore. My arm/hand may never fully recover. I can handle it around
    the shop but unloading sheets off my truck may be a real problem.

    I bought a rockler Material Mate cart to serve the purpose of moving heavy sheet goods. It helps a lot and it is sturdy. I would appreciate it more if it did not take up so much space. It is worth considering if your concern is
    unloading your truck and getting the material to the shop.
    I have all sorts of panel movers that I thought were a good idea at
    the time. All have one problem or another. I have a Bora Portamate
    that looks great on paper but it's simply too heavy to be of any use
    bringing panels in from my truck. The latch is in an impossible place
    with a panel on it so it's not really of much use around the shop
    either.

    My shop is in a walk-out basement. The access is in the rear and
    opens out to "grass". I think the casters on the Rockler panel cart
    would be way too small to work. It has to go up a step into the
    basement, as well.

    I bought a Gorilla Gripper that would break my arm if it weren't
    already broken. It's probably OK for 1/2" ply but MDF and melamine
    are killers.

    This is about the best I've seen but one still has to lift the panel
    over obstacles. The big problem is that the hand bar is just too
    narrow. It's only about 1/4" and it needs to be about 1" or perhaps a
    little more.

    <https://www.amazon.com/Telpro-Troll-300-Pound-Capacity-Handler/dp/B0000224PA/ref=sr_1_19?keywords=Plywood+Lifting+Tool&qid=1645996066&sr=8-19>

    It sounds like you would need something like a cross between a garden cart with pneumatic tires and a panel mover. I have not seen such an animal.
    That sounds about right. Anything I'd build would be way too heavy.

    Interesting.

    https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200198174_200198174
    How does that move a sheet of plywood (or two sheets of drywall)?

    OK, how about this then? Move, cut, assemble, etc.

    https://i.imgur.com/T0uPb2s.jpg

    All you need to do is add these:

    https://i.imgur.com/71dos8Z.jpg
    I guess I'm looking to go off-road.

    Well, you do need to get stuff into your backyard, down the step, etc.

    I can get into the back yard with the truck. Step up (no big deal).
    I got to thinking about these:
    <https://www.harborfreight.com/10-inch-pneumatic-tire-with-gold-hub-41475.html>

    Run away. Those cheap tube tires will go flat and stay flat. BTDT
    I have eight of them that I used to move my big tools. They were flat >> >> >> but hold air. I think they have a tube.

    The PITA was having to fill my lawn cart tires every time SWMBO or I wanted to use
    it. Since she's the gardener, she wanted to use it a lot and I wasn't always around.
    Used to really piss her off, especially since I bought the 2 wheel unit mainly for her
    so she didn't have to fight the wheel barrow. Hills, curves and uneven surfaces.

    My wife's car tires slowly lose air (no idea why but all four do). I
    bought one of the "Ryobi One" battery powered air pumps to fill tires.
    When the tire pressure light comes on, she does it herself.

    Bad seal at the rim or bad seal at the TMPS sensor (valve stem).

    I've experience both, especially with aluminum wheels.
    All four? Well it's obvious that it is all four but that seems to be
    pretty poor quality/design/whatever. Her car has to go into the shop
    Monday (brake light on). Maybe have them look at it but at $100 per
    wheel, it's easier to just have her check the pressure occasionally.

    When I pulled SWMBO's snows out of storage a few months ago, one
    was flat flat. The other was down to about 20 lbs. It was inspection time
    so I put them in the back of her SUV and took them over to my indy.

    Both wheels had bad valve stems. One was rubber and was easily rebuilt
    with a kit. $38 with for the repair and a rim cleaning. The other was metal >and was too corroded to be repaired, so it had to be replaced. $80 for the >valve stem and a rim cleaning. (They were different because I bought 4 OEM >wheels at a salvage yard and one was missing a stem, so they put a rubber
    one in it for me. 4-ish years ago)

    What do you get for $100 a wheel at your shop?

    From what I can find, the TMPS sensor is about $40 plus an hour labor.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)