https://www.npr.org/2023/09/01/1197205894/johannesburg-building-fire-hijacked-gangs-south-africa

https://www.imf.org/en/News/Articles/2023/06/15/cf-south-africas-economy-loses-momentum-amid-record-power-cuts

I had assumed that S Africa would go thru a destabilization at the end
of apartheid then normalize under a new system of their own.

I hope that the system, and the implied socio-economic order one can
imply from this story is not the permanent state of affairs there.

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I done created myself a monster."

--Juan Carlos Ferrero ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Friday, 1 September 2023 at 21:40:37 UTC+1, Sawfish wrote:

https://www.npr.org/2023/09/01/1197205894/johannesburg-building-fire-hijacked-gangs-south-africa

https://www.imf.org/en/News/Articles/2023/06/15/cf-south-africas-economy-loses-momentum-amid-record-power-cuts

I had assumed that S Africa would go thru a destabilization at the end
of apartheid then normalize under a new system of their own.

what on earth made you ever think that? serious question cos sounds very naive and idealistic, like you'd have to totally ignore every other African nation and its leaders to think such a thing. Not criticising as very interested where such ideas come
from, as to seemed totally obvious what would happen once they booted the white guys out of power and even better brought in full anti-white affirmative action. Would you say it was the media that convinced you to totally ignore such things perhaps.

I hope that the system, and the implied socio-economic order one can
imply from this story is not the permanent state of affairs there.

for decades now Joburg is the place famous for guaranteeing that you get mugged/robbed at some point. Known people that have lived there, one guy was there for 6 months and got robbed 6 times at his housing area, he said you kind of just know it'll
happen and as long you're prepared you deal with it and will generally be alright.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 9/1/23 5:18 PM, The Iceberg wrote:

On Friday, 1 September 2023 at 21:40:37 UTC+1, Sawfish wrote:

https://www.npr.org/2023/09/01/1197205894/johannesburg-building-fire-hijacked-gangs-south-africa

https://www.imf.org/en/News/Articles/2023/06/15/cf-south-africas-economy-loses-momentum-amid-record-power-cuts

I had assumed that S Africa would go thru a destabilization at the end
of apartheid then normalize under a new system of their own.

what on earth made you ever think that? serious question cos sounds very naive and idealistic, like you'd have to totally ignore every other African nation and its leaders to think such a thing.

Real, real simple, Ice: I want to give them ONE chance to ante up. One mutherfucking chance...

Not criticising as very interested where such ideas come from, as to seemed totally obvious what would happen once they booted the white guys out of power and even better brought in full anti-white affirmative action. Would you say it was the media

that convinced you to totally ignore such things perhaps.

No. Fairness.

One muthafuckin' chance to put your money where your mouth is.

I hope that the system, and the implied socio-economic order one can
imply from this story is not the permanent state of affairs there.

for decades now Joburg is the place famous for guaranteeing that you get mugged/robbed at some point. Known people that have lived there, one guy was there for 6 months and got robbed 6 times at his housing area, he said you kind of just know it'll

happen and as long you're prepared you deal with it and will generally be alright.
Certainly I would not live there, and I wonder that any whites live
there, at all.  How they manage, etc.


--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"To the average American or Englishman the very name of anarchy causes a shudder, because it invariably conjures up a picture of a land terrorized by low-browed assassins with matted beards, carrying bombs in one hand and mugs of beer in the other. But
as a matter of fact, there is no reason whatever to believe that, if all laws were abolished tomorrow, such swine would survive the day."

--H. L. Mencken ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

The Iceberg kirjoitti 2.9.2023 klo 3.18:

On Friday, 1 September 2023 at 21:40:37 UTC+1, Sawfish wrote:

https://www.npr.org/2023/09/01/1197205894/johannesburg-building-fire-hijacked-gangs-south-africa

https://www.imf.org/en/News/Articles/2023/06/15/cf-south-africas-economy-loses-momentum-amid-record-power-cuts

I had assumed that S Africa would go thru a destabilization at the end
of apartheid then normalize under a new system of their own.

what on earth made you ever think that? serious question cos sounds very naive and idealistic, like you'd have to totally ignore every other African nation and its leaders to think such a thing. Not criticising as very interested where such ideas come

from, as to seemed totally obvious what would happen once they booted the white guys out of power and even better brought in full anti-white affirmative action. Would you say it was the media that convinced you to totally ignore such things perhaps.

I hope that the system, and the implied socio-economic order one can
imply from this story is not the permanent state of affairs there.

for decades now Joburg is the place famous for guaranteeing that you get mugged/robbed at some point. Known people that have lived there, one guy was there for 6 months and got robbed 6 times at his housing area, he said you kind of just know it'll

happen and as long you're prepared you deal with it and will generally be alright.

Yeah. I've been thinking this immigration problem backwards. It's all
about attitude... if I just accept to get mugged and robbed by Pelle and
his African pals.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 9/2/23 4:13 AM, TT wrote:

The Iceberg kirjoitti 2.9.2023 klo 3.18:

On Friday, 1 September 2023 at 21:40:37 UTC+1, Sawfish wrote:

https://www.npr.org/2023/09/01/1197205894/johannesburg-building-fire-hijacked-gangs-south-africa


https://www.imf.org/en/News/Articles/2023/06/15/cf-south-africas-economy-loses-momentum-amid-record-power-cuts


I had assumed that S Africa would go thru a destabilization at the end
of apartheid then normalize under a new system of their own.

what on earth made you ever think that? serious question cos sounds
very naive and idealistic, like you'd have to totally ignore every
other African nation and its leaders to think such a thing. Not
criticising as very interested where such ideas come from, as to
seemed totally obvious what would happen once they booted the white
guys out of power and even better brought in full anti-white
affirmative action. Would you say it was the media that convinced you
to totally ignore such things perhaps.

I hope that the system, and the implied socio-economic order one can
imply from this story is not the permanent state of affairs there.

for decades now Joburg is the place famous for guaranteeing that you
get mugged/robbed at some point. Known people that have lived there,
one guy was there for 6 months and got robbed 6 times at his housing
area, he said you kind of just know it'll happen and as long you're
prepared you deal with it and will generally be alright.

Yeah. I've been thinking this immigration problem backwards. It's all
about attitude... if I just accept to get mugged and robbed by Pelle
and his African pals.

All joking aside, I think the policy of western Europe, UK, and USA
wants immigration to combat stagnant and falling birthrates. I think to
a degree they are allowing Koreans into Japan, for the same reason--much
to the distaste of the average Japanese person.

Underlying this is the demonstrated fact that free market economies as
we have come to know them for at least 150 years *require* expansion.
Generally speaking, it is impossible to grow profits without a larger population base; the economies MUST expand or you'll get into unexplored economic territory, and no leader in a democratic system wants this
because it'll be their ass if things go to hell in a handbasket.

Add to this the social safety nets in place (Social Security, Medicare,
etc. in the US) require a greater portion of younger workers who can be
taxed to support the safety net. Again, no elected official wants to
either: a) tell workers under SS retirement age that their SS tax has to
up 25%, right now; or b) the recipients of SS that they can no longer
count on their benefits.

So they welcome all the Luises and Ramons they can get. They'll buy
stuff and they'll contribute to payroll taxes.

Probably it's similar in the EU but with Arabs and the like. We're
better off because from my experience, the Mexican work ethic is very pervasive. Most *will* tend to work, a lot.  I don't know about Arabs
and Nigerians and the like. But it's tough to imagine harder workers, culturally, than Mexicans.

You can see that this notion of expansion is a time bomb and leadership
knows how to re-set the detonation time, but not how to disarm the bomb.

Let the firestorm begin...

--
--Sawfish ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"If there's one thing I can't stand, it's intolerance." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On Saturday, 2 September 2023 at 16:47:31 UTC+1, Sawfish wrote:

On 9/2/23 4:13 AM, TT wrote:

The Iceberg kirjoitti 2.9.2023 klo 3.18:

On Friday, 1 September 2023 at 21:40:37 UTC+1, Sawfish wrote:

https://www.npr.org/2023/09/01/1197205894/johannesburg-building-fire-hijacked-gangs-south-africa


https://www.imf.org/en/News/Articles/2023/06/15/cf-south-africas-economy-loses-momentum-amid-record-power-cuts


I had assumed that S Africa would go thru a destabilization at the end >>> of apartheid then normalize under a new system of their own.

what on earth made you ever think that? serious question cos sounds
very naive and idealistic, like you'd have to totally ignore every
other African nation and its leaders to think such a thing. Not
criticising as very interested where such ideas come from, as to
seemed totally obvious what would happen once they booted the white
guys out of power and even better brought in full anti-white
affirmative action. Would you say it was the media that convinced you
to totally ignore such things perhaps.

I hope that the system, and the implied socio-economic order one can
imply from this story is not the permanent state of affairs there.

for decades now Joburg is the place famous for guaranteeing that you
get mugged/robbed at some point. Known people that have lived there,
one guy was there for 6 months and got robbed 6 times at his housing
area, he said you kind of just know it'll happen and as long you're
prepared you deal with it and will generally be alright.

Yeah. I've been thinking this immigration problem backwards. It's all about attitude... if I just accept to get mugged and robbed by Pelle
and his African pals.

All joking aside, I think the policy of western Europe, UK, and USA
wants immigration to combat stagnant and falling birthrates. I think to
a degree they are allowing Koreans into Japan, for the same reason--much
to the distaste of the average Japanese person.

Underlying this is the demonstrated fact that free market economies as
we have come to know them for at least 150 years *require* expansion. Generally speaking, it is impossible to grow profits without a larger population base; the economies MUST expand or you'll get into unexplored economic territory, and no leader in a democratic system wants this
because it'll be their ass if things go to hell in a handbasket.

Add to this the social safety nets in place (Social Security, Medicare,
etc. in the US) require a greater portion of younger workers who can be taxed to support the safety net. Again, no elected official wants to
either: a) tell workers under SS retirement age that their SS tax has to
up 25%, right now; or b) the recipients of SS that they can no longer
count on their benefits.

So they welcome all the Luises and Ramons they can get. They'll buy
stuff and they'll contribute to payroll taxes.

Probably it's similar in the EU but with Arabs and the like. We're
better off because from my experience, the Mexican work ethic is very pervasive. Most *will* tend to work, a lot. I don't know about Arabs
and Nigerians and the like. But it's tough to imagine harder workers, culturally, than Mexicans.

You can see that this notion of expansion is a time bomb and leadership knows how to re-set the detonation time, but not how to disarm the bomb.

Let the firestorm begin...

agree mostly but reckon reasons are a bit fake, summary of above is really:
1) the globalists want it for cheap labour, they want to run a company of $5ph Consuela cleaners.
2) the leftists want it cos immigrants always vote leftist Democrat or Labour, so power and $$$ for them and they see it as a way of revenge on Western Europe(Pelle's main reason)
3) middle-class leftists want it cos they like paying $5ph to Consuela for cleaning
4) politicians terrified that the benefits Ponzi scheme $$$ will run out

The population thing is a total lie - as the push is only for white folks not to have children(due to the climate/whatever) whilst same time encouraging more immigration and encouraging immigrants/non-white-folks to have big families, just look at skrip'
s post other day and the article about India where the NYT says "them now have more people than China is not necessarily a bad thing".

Above all though it's the World Economic Forum who are pushing all this, along with the climate change insanity and they are globalists, mostly billionaires or power mad politician types. Soros the same. Soros' son has now taken over, have you seen what
he's saying and how he wants to influence the world even though he's never been elected and never earnt any money himself? it quite disgusting.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 9/4/23 12:51 PM, The Iceberg wrote:

On Saturday, 2 September 2023 at 16:47:31 UTC+1, Sawfish wrote:

On 9/2/23 4:13 AM, TT wrote:

The Iceberg kirjoitti 2.9.2023 klo 3.18:

On Friday, 1 September 2023 at 21:40:37 UTC+1, Sawfish wrote:

https://www.npr.org/2023/09/01/1197205894/johannesburg-building-fire-hijacked-gangs-south-africa


https://www.imf.org/en/News/Articles/2023/06/15/cf-south-africas-economy-loses-momentum-amid-record-power-cuts


I had assumed that S Africa would go thru a destabilization at the end >>>>> of apartheid then normalize under a new system of their own.

what on earth made you ever think that? serious question cos sounds
very naive and idealistic, like you'd have to totally ignore every
other African nation and its leaders to think such a thing. Not
criticising as very interested where such ideas come from, as to
seemed totally obvious what would happen once they booted the white
guys out of power and even better brought in full anti-white
affirmative action. Would you say it was the media that convinced you
to totally ignore such things perhaps.

I hope that the system, and the implied socio-economic order one can >>>>> imply from this story is not the permanent state of affairs there.

for decades now Joburg is the place famous for guaranteeing that you
get mugged/robbed at some point. Known people that have lived there,
one guy was there for 6 months and got robbed 6 times at his housing
area, he said you kind of just know it'll happen and as long you're
prepared you deal with it and will generally be alright.

Yeah. I've been thinking this immigration problem backwards. It's all
about attitude... if I just accept to get mugged and robbed by Pelle
and his African pals.

All joking aside, I think the policy of western Europe, UK, and USA
wants immigration to combat stagnant and falling birthrates. I think to
a degree they are allowing Koreans into Japan, for the same reason--much
to the distaste of the average Japanese person.

Underlying this is the demonstrated fact that free market economies as
we have come to know them for at least 150 years *require* expansion.
Generally speaking, it is impossible to grow profits without a larger
population base; the economies MUST expand or you'll get into unexplored
economic territory, and no leader in a democratic system wants this
because it'll be their ass if things go to hell in a handbasket.

Add to this the social safety nets in place (Social Security, Medicare,
etc. in the US) require a greater portion of younger workers who can be
taxed to support the safety net. Again, no elected official wants to
either: a) tell workers under SS retirement age that their SS tax has to
up 25%, right now; or b) the recipients of SS that they can no longer
count on their benefits.

So they welcome all the Luises and Ramons they can get. They'll buy
stuff and they'll contribute to payroll taxes.

Probably it's similar in the EU but with Arabs and the like. We're
better off because from my experience, the Mexican work ethic is very
pervasive. Most *will* tend to work, a lot. I don't know about Arabs
and Nigerians and the like. But it's tough to imagine harder workers,
culturally, than Mexicans.

You can see that this notion of expansion is a time bomb and leadership
knows how to re-set the detonation time, but not how to disarm the bomb.

Let the firestorm begin...

agree mostly but reckon reasons are a bit fake, summary of above is really: 1) the globalists want it for cheap labour, they want to run a company of $5ph Consuela cleaners.

Agreed. But tax reporting makes this almost impossible here in the US.

2) the leftists want it cos immigrants always vote leftist Democrat or Labour, so power and $$$ for them and they see it as a way of revenge on Western Europe(Pelle's main reason)

Agreed.

3) middle-class leftists want it cos they like paying $5ph to Consuela for cleaning

Agreed, but this is much less a factor than is commonly thought, and
here's why:

These people have money, and they also have some level of guilt. They
have usually only 1-3 domestic help people (cleaning, yard, etc) and the difference between min wage, min wage + 25%, or 2x min wage is not a lot
in absolute terms. And by somewhat overpaying, it absolves them of some
guilt and at cocktail; parties they can tell their limp-wristed brethren
that the pay Juanita an outrageous wage, but really, she's worth it.

4) politicians terrified that the benefits Ponzi scheme $$$ will run out

YES!!! YES!!!

To me, this is the primary reason and all the others are supporting
rationales for going ahead and encouraging high levels of immigration.
Side benefits...like the free lunch in a bar. You really want to get
shitfaced, and the free lunch permits you to do this and still feel
practical and in control.

The population thing

Exactly what population thing, Ice?

is a total lie - as the push is only for white folks not to have children(due to the climate/whatever) whilst same time encouraging more immigration and encouraging immigrants/non-white-folks to have big families, just look at skrip's post other day

and the article about India where the NYT says "them now have more people than China is not necessarily a bad thing".

Above all though it's the World Economic Forum who are pushing all this, along with the climate change insanity and they are globalists, mostly billionaires or power mad politician types. Soros the same. Soros' son has now taken over, have you seen

what he's saying and how he wants to influence the world even though he's never been elected and never earnt any money himself? it quite disgusting.


--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"If we use Occam's Razor, whose razor will *he* use?" --Sawfish ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)