Wind.even, but the massive damage to Djokovic was done in sets 2 and 3 which he lost.
Alcaraz was kinda paralyzed in set 1 so he lost it, but Djokovic served atrociously almost entire match but especially in first half of the match when wind was strong. It subsided latter in the match, in sets 4 and 5 in which both played well and were
Wind fucked with his timing on shots, but serve especially. With normal serving he wins routinely?
Too bad for the annoying weather, as clearly the age gap was still not as big this year and Djokovic could have won on grass easily.
Hard and clay not really, that's already for Alcaraz to lose, but this one was kinda a freebie.
But hey, both kinda won matches they weren't supposed to win, Djokovic at FO and Alcaraz at Wimbledon.
In the end, I'd still take it the way it happened, triple CGS is more important than co-owning Wimbledon record at 8. There will be guys winning 8, 9, 10 and perhaps more so it's not really eternal to that extent.
And Djokovic surely won't ever be contender for FO, while he might get a chance at Wimbledon.
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Wind.even, but the massive damage to Djokovic was done in sets 2 and 3 which he lost.
Alcaraz was kinda paralyzed in set 1 so he lost it, but Djokovic served atrociously almost entire match but especially in first half of the match when wind was strong. It subsided latter in the match, in sets 4 and 5 in which both played well and were
Wind fucked with his timing on shots, but serve especially. With normal serving he wins routinely?
Too bad for the annoying weather, as clearly the age gap was still not as big this year and Djokovic could have won on grass easily.
Hard and clay not really, that's already for Alcaraz to lose, but this one was kinda a freebie.
But hey, both kinda won matches they weren't supposed to win, Djokovic at FO and Alcaraz at Wimbledon.
In the end, I'd still take it the way it happened, triple CGS is more important than co-owning Wimbledon record at 8. There will be guys winning 8, 9, 10 and perhaps more so it's not really eternal to that extent.
And Djokovic surely won't ever be contender for FO, while he might get a chance at Wimbledon.
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 7:21:11 PM UTC+1, *skriptis wrote:even, but the massive damage to Djokovic was done in sets 2 and 3 which he lost.
Wind.
Alcaraz was kinda paralyzed in set 1 so he lost it, but Djokovic served atrociously almost entire match but especially in first half of the match when wind was strong. It subsided latter in the match, in sets 4 and 5 in which both played well and were
Wind fucked with his timing on shots, but serve especially. With normal serving he wins routinely?
Too bad for the annoying weather, as clearly the age gap was still not as big this year and Djokovic could have won on grass easily.
Hard and clay not really, that's already for Alcaraz to lose, but this one was kinda a freebie.
But hey, both kinda won matches they weren't supposed to win, Djokovic at FO and Alcaraz at Wimbledon.
In the end, I'd still take it the way it happened, triple CGS is more important than co-owning Wimbledon record at 8. There will be guys winning 8, 9, 10 and perhaps more so it's not really eternal to that extent.
And Djokovic surely won't ever be contender for FO, while he might get a chance at Wimbledon.
--
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Can't agree. An eighth wimbledon would be worth far more to his legacy than a third french open. Yes, he will have another chance next year, but that could have been a chance for the standalone wimbledon crown had he won this one.
Can't agree. An eighth wimbledon would be worth far more to his legacy than a third french open. Yes, he will have another chance next year, but that could have been a chance for the standalone wimbledon crown had he won this one.
Djokovic also had a chance at Calendar Slam. The last one, I think.
Djoke was a stiffy.
I'm just saying standalone triple CGS winner looks much safer than 8 Wimbledon titles.
TT <TT@dprk.kp> Wrote in message:
Djoke was a stiffy.
He got upset over squandering the tiebreak lead in set 2, and in set 5 after not converting that break point and losing his serve immediately afterwards.
This was very close to Djokovic winning 6-3 in the fifth yet it went the other way around. Can't win all.you'd do against Berdych, Berrettini types.
But it started well and maybe this is where he needs me for coach? You Djokovic don't go into "lockdown" mode vs brave big hitting young guys such as Thiem, Rune, Alcaraz and so on. At least you don't go into "lockdown" mode as early in the match as
Previously it cost him 2019 FO SF vs Thiem and YEC SF in 2020 I believe. And that's just Thiem.
These better and braver guys who can hit couple of winners in a row, they won't choke, they might miss, but they're in form and confident and they're more likely to hit than miss.
You go into lockdown mode vs guys like Alcaraz when you're e.g. 6-5 ahead in tiebreak, not at 3-0. Not to mention the lockdown mode totally failed in today's tiebreak vs Alcaraz due to wind.
He had that insane stat 0 unforced errors in couple of tiebreaks at FO recently, but you can't have that with a wind on grass.
Perhaps on clay you can compensate a bit with topspin, but not on grass.
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 7:21:11 PM UTC+1, *skriptis wrote:even, but the massive damage to Djokovic was done in sets 2 and 3 which he lost.
Wind.
Alcaraz was kinda paralyzed in set 1 so he lost it, but Djokovic served atrociously almost entire match but especially in first half of the match when wind was strong. It subsided latter in the match, in sets 4 and 5 in which both played well and were
Wind fucked with his timing on shots, but serve especially. With normal serving he wins routinely?
Too bad for the annoying weather, as clearly the age gap was still not as big this year and Djokovic could have won on grass easily.
Hard and clay not really, that's already for Alcaraz to lose, but this one was kinda a freebie.
But hey, both kinda won matches they weren't supposed to win, Djokovic at FO and Alcaraz at Wimbledon.
In the end, I'd still take it the way it happened, triple CGS is more important than co-owning Wimbledon record at 8. There will be guys winning 8, 9, 10 and perhaps more so it's not really eternal to that extent.
And Djokovic surely won't ever be contender for FO, while he might get a chance at Wimbledon.
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Can't agree. An eighth wimbledon would be worth far more to his legacy than a third french open. Yes, he will have another chance next year, but that could have been a chance for the standalone wimbledon crown had he won this one.
Can't agree. An eighth wimbledon would be worth far more to his legacy than a third french open. Yes, he will have another chance next year, but that could have been a chance for the standalone wimbledon crown had he won this one.
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:43:31 PM UTC-4, *skriptis wrote:
me <nei...@googlemail.com> Wrote in message:
Can't agree. An eighth wimbledon would be worth far more to his legacy than a third french open. Yes, he will have another chance next year, but that could have been a chance for the standalone wimbledon crown had he won this one.Yes, ok I respect that.
Whether record CGS is a bigger deal than Wimbledon record I don't go there now.
But the thing is, if Rafa at FO is a benchmark for eternal record, I'm just saying standalone triple CGS winner looks much safer than 8 Wimbledon titles.I'm looking long-term, what is supposed to last longer.
But of course winning Wimbledon would be huge. Had Djokovic won his 8th, Federer could start eat himself alive over those match points.
Djokovic at 8, 9 and 10 Wimbledon titles is a nightmare for Federer as +1 and -1 changes the Wimbledon goat.
Djokovic at 7 or 11+, and Federer can forget their match as it doesn't affect Wimbledon goat.
So maybe it was not meant to be painful for Federer? ;)
Alcaraz would win it today. Needless to add, with the 7-1/2 S continuing to be active, it will get harder for Djokovic to get easy wins. As for Federer, how could he receive adverse news this year? No chance. I won't go into the details, but let me sayBtw Alcaraz is almost certain to break Djokovic's year-end record, and very likely to break his weeks record.
He'll be already on 2 this year and he's only 20.
Federer has 5 year end #1.
--
Djokovic will have to eke out slam titles here and there from hereon. I reckoned that with the 7-1/2 Saturn in full swing for him, he would have a hard time getting the 8th Wimbledon title. Indeed, I noted unambiguously in two threads that Avatar
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:57:01 PM UTC-4, RaspingDrive wrote:Alcaraz would win it today. Needless to add, with the 7-1/2 S continuing to be active, it will get harder for Djokovic to get easy wins. As for Federer, how could he receive adverse news this year? No chance. I won't go into the details, but let me say
Djokovic will have to eke out slam titles here and there from hereon. I reckoned that with the 7-1/2 Saturn in full swing for him, he would have a hard time getting the 8th Wimbledon title. Indeed, I noted unambiguously in two threads that Avatar
Nah, let's not get carried away just yet! These reactions are too premature IMO. It's one loss and it was a close call. I'd like to see Pipe humiliated over and over again by Alkie or somebody else but it's much too early to make that call.
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:57:39 PM UTC-7, Court_1 wrote:Alcaraz would win it today. Needless to add, with the 7-1/2 S continuing to be active, it will get harder for Djokovic to get easy wins. As for Federer, how could he receive adverse news this year? No chance. I won't go into the details, but let me say
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:57:01 PM UTC-4, RaspingDrive wrote:
Djokovic will have to eke out slam titles here and there from hereon. I reckoned that with the 7-1/2 Saturn in full swing for him, he would have a hard time getting the 8th Wimbledon title. Indeed, I noted unambiguously in two threads that Avatar
Nah, let's not get carried away just yet! These reactions are too premature IMO. It's one loss and it was a close call. I'd like to see Pipe humiliated over and over again by Alkie or somebody else but it's much too early to make that call.
Agree about it being too early to make wild predictions. But as you said, you didn't see much of the match and the way it unfolded.
Remember, this was Djokovic on HIS court against Alcaraz, who hasn't even mastered grass court play yet.
Djokovic looked sure he'd run away with the match when he had the first set in the bag and he was pulling his jackass antics with the crowd. Then, Alcaraz got progressively stronger and more confident, keeping Djoke frustrated and overreaching. Hestymied him in the second set tiebreak, which just *isn't done.* And never let him fully regain his balance up until the end.
I'm not saying I think Alcaraz has crushed Djokovic's spirit, because that would be delusional. But it has to feel like a serious gut-punch. I don't think hyena-head will ever enter a match against Alacaraz with the same smugness going forward. The kidearned some serious streed-cred today.
But that's what I mean. Pipe Cleaner seems to be obsessive about finding solutions when somebody beats him. Although, it sure didn't work vs Wawrinka so much at the slams for a few years. Pipe was visibly scared of him. It showed. Let's hope Alkiecontinues the damage and doesn't get injured.
On 16/07/2023 19:30, me wrote:
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 7:21:11 PM UTC+1, *skriptis wrote:
Wind.
Alcaraz was kinda paralyzed in set 1 so he lost it, but Djokovic
served atrociously almost entire match but especially in first half
of the match when wind was strong. It subsided latter in the match,
in sets 4 and 5 in which both played well and were even, but the
massive damage to Djokovic was done in sets 2 and 3 which he lost.
Wind fucked with his timing on shots, but serve especially. With
normal serving he wins routinely?
Too bad for the annoying weather, as clearly the age gap was still
not as big this year and Djokovic could have won on grass easily.
Hard and clay not really, that's already for Alcaraz to lose, but
this one was kinda a freebie.
But hey, both kinda won matches they weren't supposed to win,
Djokovic at FO and Alcaraz at Wimbledon.
In the end, I'd still take it the way it happened, triple CGS is more
important than co-owning Wimbledon record at 8. There will be guys
winning 8, 9, 10 and perhaps more so it's not really eternal to that
extent.
And Djokovic surely won't ever be contender for FO, while he might
get a chance at Wimbledon.
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Can't agree. An eighth wimbledon would be worth far more to his legacy
than a third french open. Yes, he will have another chance next year,
but that could have been a chance for the standalone wimbledon crown
had he won this one.
Martina has the record in the open era anyway at nine.
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:57:39 PM UTC-7, Court_1 wrote:Alcaraz would win it today. Needless to add, with the 7-1/2 S continuing to be active, it will get harder for Djokovic to get easy wins. As for Federer, how could he receive adverse news this year? No chance. I won't go into the details, but let me say
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:57:01 PM UTC-4, RaspingDrive wrote:
Djokovic will have to eke out slam titles here and there from hereon. I reckoned that with the 7-1/2 Saturn in full swing for him, he would have a hard time getting the 8th Wimbledon title. Indeed, I noted unambiguously in two threads that Avatar
sure he'd run away with the match when he had the first set in the bag and he was pulling his jackass antics with the crowd. Then, Alcaraz got progressively stronger and more confident, keeping Djoke frustrated and overreaching. He stymied him in theNah, let's not get carried away just yet! These reactions are too premature IMO. It's one loss and it was a close call. I'd like to see Pipe humiliated over and over again by Alkie or somebody else but it's much too early to make that call.Agree about it being too early to make wild predictions. But as you said, you didn't see much of the match and the way it unfolded. Remember, this was Djokovic on HIS court against Alcaraz, who hasn't even mastered grass court play yet. Djokovic looked
I'm not saying I think Alcaraz has crushed Djokovic's spirit, because that would be delusional. But it has to feel like a serious gut-punch. I don't think hyena-head will ever enter a match against Alacaraz with the same smugness going forward. The kidearned some serious streed-cred today.
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:57:39 PM UTC-7, Court_1 wrote:Alcaraz would win it today. Needless to add, with the 7-1/2 S continuing to be active, it will get harder for Djokovic to get easy wins. As for Federer, how could he receive adverse news this year? No chance. I won't go into the details, but let me say
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:57:01 PM UTC-4, RaspingDrive wrote:
Djokovic will have to eke out slam titles here and there from hereon. I reckoned that with the 7-1/2 Saturn in full swing for him, he would have a hard time getting the 8th Wimbledon title. Indeed, I noted unambiguously in two threads that Avatar
sure he'd run away with the match when he had the first set in the bag and he was pulling his jackass antics with the crowd. Then, Alcaraz got progressively stronger and more confident, keeping Djoke frustrated and overreaching. He stymied him in theNah, let's not get carried away just yet! These reactions are too premature IMO. It's one loss and it was a close call. I'd like to see Pipe humiliated over and over again by Alkie or somebody else but it's much too early to make that call.
Agree about it being too early to make wild predictions. But as you said, you didn't see much of the match and the way it unfolded. Remember, this was Djokovic on HIS court against Alcaraz, who hasn't even mastered grass court play yet. Djokovic looked
I'm not saying I think Alcaraz has crushed Djokovic's spirit, because that would be delusional. But it has to feel like a serious gut-punch. I don't think hyena-head will ever enter a match against Alacaraz with the same smugness going forward. The kidearned some serious streed-cred today.
On Monday, 17 July 2023 at 02:34:26 UTC+1, Gracchus wrote:Alcaraz would win it today. Needless to add, with the 7-1/2 S continuing to be active, it will get harder for Djokovic to get easy wins. As for Federer, how could he receive adverse news this year? No chance. I won't go into the details, but let me say
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:57:39 PM UTC-7, Court_1 wrote:
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:57:01 PM UTC-4, RaspingDrive wrote:
Djokovic will have to eke out slam titles here and there from hereon. I reckoned that with the 7-1/2 Saturn in full swing for him, he would have a hard time getting the 8th Wimbledon title. Indeed, I noted unambiguously in two threads that Avatar
looked sure he'd run away with the match when he had the first set in the bag and he was pulling his jackass antics with the crowd. Then, Alcaraz got progressively stronger and more confident, keeping Djoke frustrated and overreaching. He stymied him in
Nah, let's not get carried away just yet! These reactions are too premature IMO. It's one loss and it was a close call. I'd like to see Pipe humiliated over and over again by Alkie or somebody else but it's much too early to make that call.Agree about it being too early to make wild predictions. But as you said, you didn't see much of the match and the way it unfolded. Remember, this was Djokovic on HIS court against Alcaraz, who hasn't even mastered grass court play yet. Djokovic
kid earned some serious streed-cred today.
I'm not saying I think Alcaraz has crushed Djokovic's spirit, because that would be delusional. But it has to feel like a serious gut-punch. I don't think hyena-head will ever enter a match against Alacaraz with the same smugness going forward. The
bit lost why you guys think Alcaraz is so good on clay? he got whooped by Djoker and you can make all the oh he got cramps excuses you like cos he got whooped the year before by Zverev. What on earth makes you think he good on clay, he not even wonMonte Carlo.
grif kirjoitti 16.7.2023 klo 23.41:were even, but the massive damage to Djokovic was done in sets 2 and 3 which he lost.
On 16/07/2023 19:30, me wrote:
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 7:21:11 PM UTC+1, *skriptis wrote:
Wind.
Alcaraz was kinda paralyzed in set 1 so he lost it, but Djokovic served atrociously almost entire match but especially in first half of the match when wind was strong. It subsided latter in the match, in sets 4 and 5 in which both played well and
Wind fucked with his timing on shots, but serve especially. With normal serving he wins routinely?
Too bad for the annoying weather, as clearly the age gap was still not as big this year and Djokovic could have won on grass easily.
Hard and clay not really, that's already for Alcaraz to lose, but this one was kinda a freebie.
But hey, both kinda won matches they weren't supposed to win, Djokovic at FO and Alcaraz at Wimbledon.
In the end, I'd still take it the way it happened, triple CGS is more important than co-owning Wimbledon record at 8. There will be guys winning 8, 9, 10 and perhaps more so it's not really eternal to that extent.
And Djokovic surely won't ever be contender for FO, while he might get a chance at Wimbledon.
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Can't agree. An eighth wimbledon would be worth far more to his legacy than a third french open. Yes, he will have another chance next year, but that could have been a chance for the standalone wimbledon crown had he won this one.
Martina has the record in the open era anyway at nine.
Sniff
Nole the great lost.
https://www.icegif.com/wp-content/uploads/crying-icegif-3.gif
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:57:01 PM UTC-4, RaspingDrive wrote:
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:43:31 PM UTC-4, *skriptis wrote:
me <nei...@googlemail.com> Wrote in message:
Can't agree. An eighth wimbledon would be worth far more to his legacy than a third french open. Yes, he will have another chance next year, but that could have been a chance for the standalone wimbledon crown had he won this one.Yes, ok I respect that.
Whether record CGS is a bigger deal than Wimbledon record I don't go there now.
But the thing is, if Rafa at FO is a benchmark for eternal record, I'm just saying standalone triple CGS winner looks much safer than 8 Wimbledon titles.I'm looking long-term, what is supposed to last longer.
But of course winning Wimbledon would be huge. Had Djokovic won his 8th, Federer could start eat himself alive over those match points.
Djokovic at 8, 9 and 10 Wimbledon titles is a nightmare for Federer as +1 and -1 changes the Wimbledon goat.
Djokovic at 7 or 11+, and Federer can forget their match as it doesn't affect Wimbledon goat.
So maybe it was not meant to be painful for Federer? ;)
Alcaraz would win it today. Needless to add, with the 7-1/2 S continuing to be active, it will get harder for Djokovic to get easy wins. As for Federer, how could he receive adverse news this year? No chance. I won't go into the details, but let me sayBtw Alcaraz is almost certain to break Djokovic's year-end record, and very likely to break his weeks record.
He'll be already on 2 this year and he's only 20.
Federer has 5 year end #1.
--
Djokovic will have to eke out slam titles here and there from hereon. I reckoned that with the 7-1/2 Saturn in full swing for him, he would have a hard time getting the 8th Wimbledon title. Indeed, I noted unambiguously in two threads that Avatar
Nah, let's not get carried away just yet! These reactions are too premature IMO. It's one loss and it was a close call. I'd like to see Pipe humiliated over and over again by Alkie or somebody else but it's much too early to make that call.
It looked to me, based on this one match only, that Alkie's style fits superbly for grass... as he plays very creatively and you never know
what he will do next. He played quite a few slices and was good at the
net. Drop shots compliment his bazookas. He looked surprisingly finished product on grass. Movement was Nadal-like.
Of course there are some more grass tricks of the trade on returns etc
which he can still improve on, probably game tactics as well. He plays
free flowing tennis, not hitting according to plan but what he feels
like at the moment. Not sure if that's good or bad in the long run but
it sure is fun to watch when it works out.
On 17/07/2023 11:31, TT wrote:
grif kirjoitti 16.7.2023 klo 23.41:
On 16/07/2023 19:30, me wrote:
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 7:21:11 PM UTC+1, *skriptis wrote:
Wind.
Alcaraz was kinda paralyzed in set 1 so he lost it, but Djokovic
served atrociously almost entire match but especially in first half
of the match when wind was strong. It subsided latter in the match,
in sets 4 and 5 in which both played well and were even, but the
massive damage to Djokovic was done in sets 2 and 3 which he lost.
Wind fucked with his timing on shots, but serve especially. With
normal serving he wins routinely?
Too bad for the annoying weather, as clearly the age gap was still
not as big this year and Djokovic could have won on grass easily.
Hard and clay not really, that's already for Alcaraz to lose, but
this one was kinda a freebie.
But hey, both kinda won matches they weren't supposed to win,
Djokovic at FO and Alcaraz at Wimbledon.
In the end, I'd still take it the way it happened, triple CGS is
more important than co-owning Wimbledon record at 8. There will be
guys winning 8, 9, 10 and perhaps more so it's not really eternal
to that extent.
And Djokovic surely won't ever be contender for FO, while he might
get a chance at Wimbledon.
--
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Can't agree. An eighth wimbledon would be worth far more to his
legacy than a third french open. Yes, he will have another chance
next year, but that could have been a chance for the standalone
wimbledon crown had he won this one.
Martina has the record in the open era anyway at nine.
Sniff
Nole the great lost.
https://www.icegif.com/wp-content/uploads/crying-icegif-3.gif
Damn, Nole the Great getting more slams than Nads must have hurt you
badly. Boohoo!
Wind.even, but the massive damage to Djokovic was done in sets 2 and 3 which he lost.
Alcaraz was kinda paralyzed in set 1 so he lost it, but Djokovic served atrociously almost entire match but especially in first half of the match when wind was strong. It subsided latter in the match, in sets 4 and 5 in which both played well and were
Wind fucked with his timing on shots, but serve especially. With normal serving he wins routinely?
Too bad for the annoying weather, as clearly the age gap was still not as big this year and Djokovic could have won on grass easily.
Hard and clay not really, that's already for Alcaraz to lose, but this one was kinda a freebie.
But hey, both kinda won matches they weren't supposed to win, Djokovic at FO and Alcaraz at Wimbledon.
In the end, I'd still take it the way it happened, triple CGS is more important than co-owning Wimbledon record at 8. There will be guys winning 8, 9, 10 and perhaps more so it's not really eternal to that extent.
And Djokovic surely won't ever be contender for FO, while he might get a chance at Wimbledon.
me <neilr76@googlemail.com> Wrote in message:
Can't agree. An eighth wimbledon would be worth far more to his legacy than a third french open. Yes, he will have another chance next year, but that could have been a chance for the standalone wimbledon crown had he won this one.
Yes, ok I respect that.
Whether record CGS is a bigger deal than Wimbledon record I don't go there now.
But the thing is, if Rafa at FO is a benchmark for eternal record, I'm just saying standalone triple CGS winner looks much safer than 8 Wimbledon titles.I'm looking long-term, what is supposed to last longer.
But of course winning Wimbledon would be huge. Had Djokovic won his 8th, Federer could start eat himself alive over those match points.
Djokovic at 8, 9 and 10 Wimbledon titles is a nightmare for Federer as +1 and -1 changes the Wimbledon goat.
Djokovic at 7 or 11+, and Federer can forget their match as it doesn't affect Wimbledon goat.
So maybe it was not meant to be painful for Federer? ;)
Btw Alcaraz is almost certain to break Djokovic's year-end record, and very likely to break his weeks record.
He'll be already on 2 this year and he's only 20.
Federer has 5 year end #1.
*skriptis kirjoitti 16.7.2023 klo 21.43:
I'm just saying standalone triple CGS winner looks much safer than 8
Wimbledon titles.
I don't think so. Alcaraz could well do it.
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:43:31 PM UTC-4, *skriptis wrote:Alcaraz would win it today. Needless to add, with the 7-1/2 S continuing to be active, it will get harder for Djokovic to get easy wins. As for Federer, how could he receive adverse news this year? No chance. I won't go into >the details, but let me say
me <nei...@googlemail.com> Wrote in message:
Can't agree. An eighth wimbledon would be worth far more to his legacy than a third french open. Yes, he will have another chance next year, but that could have been a chance for the standalone wimbledon crown had he won this one.Yes, ok I respect that.
Whether record CGS is a bigger deal than Wimbledon record I don't go there now.
But the thing is, if Rafa at FO is a benchmark for eternal record, I'm just saying standalone triple CGS winner looks much safer than 8 Wimbledon titles.I'm looking long-term, what is supposed to last longer.
But of course winning Wimbledon would be huge. Had Djokovic won his 8th, Federer could start eat himself alive over those match points.
Djokovic at 8, 9 and 10 Wimbledon titles is a nightmare for Federer as +1 and -1 changes the Wimbledon goat.
Djokovic at 7 or 11+, and Federer can forget their match as it doesn't affect Wimbledon goat.
So maybe it was not meant to be painful for Federer? ;)
Btw Alcaraz is almost certain to break Djokovic's year-end record, and very likely to break his weeks record.
He'll be already on 2 this year and he's only 20.
Federer has 5 year end #1.
--
Djokovic will have to eke out slam titles here and there from hereon. I reckoned that with the 7-1/2 Saturn in full swing for him, he would have a hard time getting the 8th Wimbledon title. Indeed, I noted unambiguously in two threads >that Avatar
On 17/07/2023 4:46 am, TT wrote:
*skriptis kirjoitti 16.7.2023 klo 21.43:
I'm just saying standalone triple CGS winner looks much safer than 8
Wimbledon titles.
I don't think so. Alcaraz could well do it.
Sampras 7, Djoker 7, Fed 8 - doesn't seem so rare to get to this level
for great players. Even Becker made 7 finals, Borg 6 in a row and quit
at 25, Connors made 6 finals too. Carlos has only played 4 grass
tournaments apparently and has now won Queens and Wimbledon in his last
2. Grass may end up being his best surface who knows? The way he demolished quality players this week is an other sign he's going to be a tyrant in yrs to come - can we rule out 10 Wimbledons in a row before
age 30?
: )
Whisper kirjoitti 17.7.2023 klo 16.52:
On 17/07/2023 4:46 am, TT wrote:
*skriptis kirjoitti 16.7.2023 klo 21.43:
I'm just saying standalone triple CGS winner looks much safer than 8
Wimbledon titles.
I don't think so. Alcaraz could well do it.
Sampras 7, Djoker 7, Fed 8 - doesn't seem so rare to get to this level
for great players. Even Becker made 7 finals, Borg 6 in a row and quit
at 25, Connors made 6 finals too. Carlos has only played 4 grass tournaments apparently and has now won Queens and Wimbledon in his last
2. Grass may end up being his best surface who knows? The way he demolished quality players this week is an other sign he's going to be a tyrant in yrs to come - can we rule out 10 Wimbledons in a row before
age 30?
: )
Considering how new he was to grass, I reckon he'll be ending with Nadal7 usopens, 7 aos, 0000 fopens, not a goat!
at RG kinda numbers, maybe even a couple more. I predict he'll win 17 Wimbledon titles. 3 Queens titles.
On 17/07/2023 4:46 am, TT wrote:
*skriptis kirjoitti 16.7.2023 klo 21.43:
I'm just saying standalone triple CGS winner looks much safer than 8
Wimbledon titles.
I don't think so. Alcaraz could well do it.Sampras 7, Djoker 7, Fed 8 - doesn't seem so rare to get to this level
for great players. Even Becker made 7 finals, Borg 6 in a row and quit
at 25, Connors made 6 finals too. Carlos has only played 4 grass
tournaments apparently and has now won Queens and Wimbledon in his last
2. Grass may end up being his best surface who knows? The way he
demolished quality players this week is an other sign he's going to be a tyrant in yrs to come - can we rule out 10 Wimbledons in a row before
age 30?
: )
grif kirjoitti 17.7.2023 klo 15.57:> On 17/07/2023 11:31, TT wrote:>> grif kirjoitti 16.7.2023 klo 23.41:>>> On 16/07/2023 19:30, me wrote:>>>> On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 7:21:11 PM UTC+1, *skriptis wrote:>>>>> Wind.>>>>>>>>>> Alcaraz was kindaparalyzed in set 1 so he lost it, but Djokovic >>>>> served atrociously almost entire match but especially in first half >>>>> of the match when wind was strong. It subsided latter in the match, >>>>> in sets 4 and 5 in which both played well and were
Alcaraz and Wawrinka have one common factor: both are super great to blast a ball from a neutral dead weight ball.
This was a high quality final but the wind - which clearly frustrated Djoker. But same for both and maybe Alcaraz played wind generally better?
Similar to FO, Djoker really had to push it as Alcaraz really is very good.
Nice post-match speeches by Djoker: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=867mtHTsaDo (on court) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qA4Y350fHI (press conf)
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 7:57:39 PM UTC-4, Court_1 wrote:
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:57:01 PM UTC-4, RaspingDrive wrote:
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:43:31 PM UTC-4, *skriptis wrote:
me <nei...@googlemail.com> Wrote in message:
Can't agree. An eighth wimbledon would be worth far more to his legacy than a third french open. Yes, he will have another chance next year, but that could have been a chance for the standalone wimbledon crown had he won this one.Yes, ok I respect that.
Whether record CGS is a bigger deal than Wimbledon record I don't go there now.
But the thing is, if Rafa at FO is a benchmark for eternal record, I'm just saying standalone triple CGS winner looks much safer than 8 Wimbledon titles.I'm looking long-term, what is supposed to last longer.
But of course winning Wimbledon would be huge. Had Djokovic won his 8th, Federer could start eat himself alive over those match points.
Djokovic at 8, 9 and 10 Wimbledon titles is a nightmare for Federer as +1 and -1 changes the Wimbledon goat.
Djokovic at 7 or 11+, and Federer can forget their match as it doesn't affect Wimbledon goat.
So maybe it was not meant to be painful for Federer? ;)
Alcaraz would win it today. Needless to add, with the 7-1/2 S continuing to be active, it will get harder for Djokovic to get easy wins. As for Federer, how could he receive adverse news this year? No chance. I won't go into the details, but let me sayBtw Alcaraz is almost certain to break Djokovic's year-end record, and very likely to break his weeks record.
He'll be already on 2 this year and he's only 20.
Federer has 5 year end #1.
--
Djokovic will have to eke out slam titles here and there from hereon. I reckoned that with the 7-1/2 Saturn in full swing for him, he would have a hard time getting the 8th Wimbledon title. Indeed, I noted unambiguously in two threads that Avatar
Nah, let's not get carried away just yet! These reactions are too premature IMO. It's one loss and it was a close call. I'd like to see Pipe humiliated over and over again by Alkie or somebody else but it's much too early to make that call.It's one loss to a grass greenhorn! Consider it :)
On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 12:46:50 AM UTC-4, MBDunc wrote:
Alcaraz and Wawrinka have one common factor: both are super great to blast a ball from a neutral dead weight ball.True.
This was a high quality final but the wind - which clearly frustrated Djoker. But same for both and maybe Alcaraz played wind generally better?Right, that's another point. Djokovic is notoriously a poor wind player. That had to have a bad effect on Djokovic. We've seen many matches where Djokovic lost due to the wind conditions.
Similar to FO, Djoker really had to push it as Alcaraz really is very good.
Nice post-match speeches by Djoker: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=867mtHTsaDo (on court) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qA4Y350fHI (press conf)Thanks. I didn't see the speeches before.
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:57:01 PM UTC-4, RaspingDrive wrote:Alcaraz would win it today. Needless to add, with the 7-1/2 S continuing to be active, it will get harder for Djokovic to get easy wins. As for Federer, how could he receive adverse news this year? No chance. I won't go into the details, but let me say
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:43:31 PM UTC-4, *skriptis wrote:
Djokovic will have to eke out slam titles here and there from hereon. I reckoned that with the 7-1/2 Saturn in full swing for him, he would have a hard time getting the 8th Wimbledon title. Indeed, I noted unambiguously in two threads that Avatar
Nah, let's not get carried away just yet! These reactions are too premature IMO. It's one loss and it was a close call. I'd like to see Pipe humiliated over and over again by Alkie or somebody else but it's much too early to make that >call.
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:57:39 PM UTC-7, Court_1 wrote:Alcaraz would win it today. Needless to add, with the 7-1/2 S continuing to be active, it will get harder for Djokovic to get easy wins. As for Federer, how could he receive adverse news this year? No chance. I won't go into the details, but let me say
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:57:01 PM UTC-4, RaspingDrive wrote:
Djokovic will have to eke out slam titles here and there from hereon. I reckoned that with the 7-1/2 Saturn in full swing for him, he would have a hard time getting the 8th Wimbledon title. Indeed, I noted unambiguously in two threads that Avatar
sure he'd run away with the match when he had the first set in the bag and he was pulling his jackass antics with the crowd. Then, Alcaraz got progressively stronger and more confident, keeping Djoke frustrated and overreaching. He stymied him in theNah, let's not get carried away just yet! These reactions are too premature IMO. It's one loss and it was a close call. I'd like to see Pipe humiliated over and over again by Alkie or somebody else but it's much too early to make that call.
Agree about it being too early to make wild predictions. But as you said, you didn't see much of the match and the way it unfolded. Remember, this was Djokovic on HIS court against Alcaraz, who hasn't even mastered grass court play yet. Djokovic looked
I'm not saying I think Alcaraz has crushed Djokovic's spirit, because that would be delusional. But it has to feel like a serious gut-punch. I don't think hyena-head will ever enter a match against Alacaraz with the same smugness going >forward. Thekid earned some serious streed-cred today.
Right, that's another point. Djokovic is notoriously a poor wind player. That had to have a bad effect on Djokovic. We've seen many matches where Djokovic lost due to the wind conditions.
On 17/07/2023 4:21 am, *skriptis wrote:were even, but the massive damage to Djokovic was done in sets 2 and 3 which he lost.
Wind.
Alcaraz was kinda paralyzed in set 1 so he lost it, but Djokovic served atrociously almost entire match but especially in first half of the match when wind was strong. It subsided latter in the match, in sets 4 and 5 in which both played well and
Wind fucked with his timing on shots, but serve especially. With normal serving he wins routinely?
Too bad for the annoying weather, as clearly the age gap was still not as big this year and Djokovic could have won on grass easily.
Hard and clay not really, that's already for Alcaraz to lose, but this one was kinda a freebie.
But hey, both kinda won matches they weren't supposed to win, Djokovic at FO and Alcaraz at Wimbledon.
In the end, I'd still take it the way it happened, triple CGS is more important than co-owning Wimbledon record at 8. There will be guys winning 8, 9, 10 and perhaps more so it's not really eternal to that extent.
And Djokovic surely won't ever be contender for FO, while he might get a chance at Wimbledon.
I'd like to see him get to 25, that would be fitting and very satisfying
for him to be on top of the slam mountain for men and women. But who
knows how safe any of these numbers are with Alcaraz - he may end up
with 30 slams himself in 15 yrs : )
I understand that and it's a good point. But I've also underestimated Djokovic too many times in the past 15 years. I'll believe he's finished when I actually see it.
On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 8:12:45 PM UTC-4, Court_1 wrote:slowly descends as Djok positions to pocket the point by depositing it forcefully in Alcaraz's corner. Yet he fails because of the drift that the wind caused. Intrepid play by Alcaraz. Watch it when you have time. Amazing.
Right, that's another point. Djokovic is notoriously a poor wind player. That had to have a bad effect on Djokovic. We've seen many matches where Djokovic lost due to the wind conditions.Fifth set 2nd game. Break point for Djoker (on 1-0 already in that set). He makes Alcaraz move from one side to the other. He almost has the game clinched...but Avatar Alcaraz, with a valiant attempt, gets a ball high to Djoks right side. The ball
On Tuesday, July 18, 2023 at 9:58:54 AM UTC-4, RaspingDrive wrote:> On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 8:12:45 PM UTC-4, Court_1 wrote: > > > Right, that's another point. Djokovic is notoriously a poor wind player. That had to have a bad effect onDjokovic. We've seen many matches where Djokovic lost due to the wind conditions.> Fifth set 2nd game. Break point for Djoker (on 1-0 already in that set). He makes Alcaraz move from one side to the other. He almost has the game clinched...but Avatar
"gap...@gmail.com" <gap...@gmail.com> Wrote in message:rDjokovic. We've seen many matches where Djokovic lost due to the wind conditions.> Fifth set 2nd game. Break point for Djoker (on 1-0 already in that set). He makes Alcaraz move from one side to the other. He almost has the game clinched...but Avatar
On Tuesday, July 18, 2023 at 9:58:54 AM UTC-4, RaspingDrive wrote:> On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 8:12:45 PM UTC-4, Court_1 wrote: > > > Right, that's another point. Djokovic is notoriously a poor wind player. That had to have a bad effect on
"...Yet he fails because of the drift that the wind caused..."
It's very simple, he sucks in wind, relatively to other guys at least.
The other day he faced goat level oponent, very young and windy conditions, overall it's what made match even and of course in the end it went to Alcaraz's side.
He lost 2019 FO semi to Thiem, 7:5 in the fifth, very similar, although the wind was actually a hurricane back then.
Not that I compare Alcaraz to Thiem only establishing a pattern here.
On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 8:14:52 PM UTC-4, Court_1 wrote:
I understand that and it's a good point. But I've also underestimated Djokovic too many times in the past 15 years. I'll believe he's finished when I actually see it.Not a bad idea.
"gap...@gmail.com" <gapp111@gmail.com> Wrote in message:rDjokovic. We've seen many matches where Djokovic lost due to the wind conditions.> Fifth set 2nd game. Break point for Djoker (on 1-0 already in that set). He makes Alcaraz move from one side to the other. He almost has the game clinched...but Avatar
On Tuesday, July 18, 2023 at 9:58:54 AM UTC-4, RaspingDrive wrote:> On Monday, July 17, 2023 at 8:12:45 PM UTC-4, Court_1 wrote: > > > Right, that's another point. Djokovic is notoriously a poor wind player. That had to have a bad effect on
"...Yet he fails because of the drift that the wind caused..."
It's very simple, he sucks in wind, relatively to other guys at least.
The other day he faced goat level oponent, very young and windy conditions, overall it's what made match even and of course in the end it went to Alcaraz's side.
He lost 2019 FO semi to Thiem, 7:5 in the fifth, very similar, although the wind was actually a hurricane back then.
Not that I compare Alcaraz to Thiem only establishing a pattern here.
https://indianexpress.com/article/sports/tennis/french-open-2019-novak-djokovic-angry-as-his-hopes-are-gone-with-the-wind-5771408/It looks like Djok needs to work on his "wind game".
After his five-setter defeat to Austrian Dominic Thiem, World No. 1 Novak Djokovic expressed his frustrations about the weather conditions that befell the semi-final more than twice in two days.
Novak Djokovic said conditions during his French Open defeat by Dominic Thiem over Friday and Saturday were some of the worst he had played in after his hopes of a second Roland Garros title were blown out in a stormy semi-final.
World number one Djokovic had trailed 2-6 6-3 1-3 on Friday when rain interrupted the match and then play was abandoned for the day despite it being a largely dry, though windy, evening.
Swirling winds were still buffeting Court Philippe Chatrier when play resumed just past midday local time on Saturday and play was again interrupted for an hour before Thiem completed a dramatic 6-2 3-6 7-5 5-7 7-5 victory.
The Austrian will go forward to Sunday’s final against Rafael Nadal while Djokovic will head to the grasscourt season with his hopes of holding all four Grand Slam titles simultaneously, for the second time in his career, over.
Djokovic’s usually clinical game was thrown out of kilter by the conditions and the match included some bizarre points with the ball making wicked deviations in flight as the remnants of Storm Miguel made mischief.
On 17/07/2023 11:34 am, Gracchus wrote:
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 4:57:39 PM UTC-7, Court_1 wrote:
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:57:01 PM UTC-4, RaspingDrive wrote:
Djokovic will have to eke out slam titles here and there from
hereon. I reckoned that with the 7-1/2 Saturn in full swing for
him, he would have a hard time getting the 8th Wimbledon title.
Indeed, I noted unambiguously in two threads that Avatar Alcaraz
would win it today. Needless to add, with the 7-1/2 S continuing to
be active, it will get harder for Djokovic to get easy wins. As for
Federer, how could he receive adverse news this year? No chance. I
won't go into the details, but let me say that he will remain the
Wimbledon King until Alcaraz possibly overhauls it. As already
noted, next year also it will be tough for Djokovic. I just feel
that he will remain at 7.
Nah, let's not get carried away just yet! These reactions are too
premature IMO. It's one loss and it was a close call. I'd like to
see Pipe humiliated over and over again by Alkie or somebody else
but it's much too early to make that call.
Agree about it being too early to make wild predictions. But as you
said, you didn't see much of the match and the way it unfolded.
Remember, this was Djokovic on HIS court against Alcaraz, who hasn't
even mastered grass court play yet. Djokovic looked sure he'd run
away with the match when he had the first set in the bag and he was
pulling his jackass antics with the crowd. Then, Alcaraz got
progressively stronger and more confident, keeping Djoke frustrated
and overreaching. He stymied him in the second set tiebreak, which
just *isn't done.* And never let him fully regain his balance up
until the end.
I'm not saying I think Alcaraz has crushed Djokovic's spirit, because
that would be delusional. But it has to feel like a serious
gut-punch. I don't think hyena-head will ever enter a match against
Alacaraz with the same smugness going >forward. The kid earned some
serious streed-cred today.
The kid is getting better all the time, and this win will make him
even more confident next time v Novak. I watched the Sinner v Novak
semi and was surprised (and disappointed) how Sinner had made no
improvements in his game at all in a whole year. He played exactly
the same way and didn't seem to have a strategy. Carlos is way ahead,
getting better and hungrier all the time. He's an obvious goat level
player.
We know Novak never chokes and is up for any challenge, so I hope they
have a nice mini rivalry over the next 2 years.
Wind.even, but the massive damage to Djokovic was done in sets 2 and 3 which he lost.
Alcaraz was kinda paralyzed in set 1 so he lost it, but Djokovic served atrociously almost entire match but especially in first half of the match when wind was strong. It subsided latter in the match, in sets 4 and 5 in which both played well and were
Wind fucked with his timing on shots, but serve especially. With normal serving he wins routinely?
Too bad for the annoying weather, as clearly the age gap was still not as big this year and Djokovic could have won on grass easily.
Hard and clay not really, that's already for Alcaraz to lose, but this one was kinda a freebie.
But hey, both kinda won matches they weren't supposed to win, Djokovic at FO and Alcaraz at Wimbledon.
In the end, I'd still take it the way it happened, triple CGS is more important than co-owning Wimbledon record at 8. There will be guys winning 8, 9, 10 and perhaps more so it's not really eternal to that extent.
And Djokovic surely won't ever be contender for FO, while he might get a chance at Wimbledon.
--
----Android NewsGroup Reader---- https://piaohong.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/usenet/index.htmlI thought Djoker serve bailed him out quite a bit. So, different perspective I guess. If you expected him to serve Isner/Medvedev style no he did not. But, the serve came through when he was down in games.
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:21:11 PM UTC-4, *skriptis wrote:> Wind. > > Alcaraz was kinda paralyzed in set 1 so he lost it, but Djokovic served atrociously almost entire match but especially in first half of the match when wind was strong. Itsubsided latter in the match, in sets 4 and 5 in which both played well and were even, but the massive damage to Djokovic was done in sets 2 and 3 which he lost. > > Wind fucked with his timing on shots, but serve especially. With normal serving he wins
On 7/18/23 11:58 AM, *skriptis wrote:subsided latter in the match, in sets 4 and 5 in which both played well and were even, but the massive damage to Djokovic was done in sets 2 and 3 which he lost. > > Wind fucked with his timing on shots, but serve especially. With normal serving he wins
undecided <cos...@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r
On Sunday, July 16, 2023 at 2:21:11 PM UTC-4, *skriptis wrote:> Wind. > > Alcaraz was kinda paralyzed in set 1 so he lost it, but Djokovic served atrociously almost entire match but especially in first half of the match when wind was strong. It
Couple of grueling games it felt as if his 1st serve percentage was 20%?
That's what I meant. It could have been higher, better, at least in those patches.
I checked overall serve stats and they seem okayish?
So you're right overall, just as you pointed out to whekdr, he's not predicted on making winner and neither is on unreturbarble serves.
He bailed himself quite a few times, but again back to my point it feels those were mostly 2nd serves.
But yeah, perspective.
He hung tough when he needed to, and that's pretty much his trademark.as a matter of fact, there is no reason whatever to believe that, if all laws were abolished tomorrow, such swine would survive the day."
I think the *reason* he lost concentration right after the missed
put-away is that he, better than anyone else, *knew* just how damned
good Alcaraz is, and that he could not afford *any* mistakes against him.
And even so he reigned it in and made it pretty close.
But yeah, I think that miss really rattled him for a while.
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