The patient was on life support already but passed away this afternoon.
RIP.
https://bigten.org/news/2023/8/4/general-big-ten.aspx
--
“I usually skip over your posts because of your disguistng, contrarian, liberal personality.” — Altie
The patient was on life support already but passed away this afternoon.
RIP.
https://bigten.org/news/2023/8/4/general-big-ten.aspx
On Friday, August 4, 2023 at 7:23:14 PM UTC-4, xyzzy wrote:
The patient was on life support already but passed away this afternoon. RIP.
https://bigten.org/news/2023/8/4/general-big-ten.aspx
--So we'll end up with two conferences - Big Dumb, and South Dumber.
“I usually skip over your posts because of your disguistng, contrarian, liberal personality.” — Altie
The inevitable greed-fed explosion and destruction will be glorious.
I wonder how FanDuel will book it.
The patient was on life support already but passed away this afternoon.
RIP.
https://bigten.org/news/2023/8/4/general-big-ten.aspx
--
“I usually skip over your posts because of your disguistng, contrarian, liberal personality.” — Altie
Apparently Oregon and Washington didn't think much of Kliavkoff's plan which would mean the schools would have to go door to door selling subscriptions like they were peddling Grit Magazine.
On Friday, August 4, 2023 at 11:09:15 PM UTC-7, Eric Ramon wrote:
Apparently Oregon and Washington didn't think much of Kliavkoff's plan
which would mean the schools would have to go door to door selling
subscriptions like they were peddling Grit Magazine.
I, for one, am happy with the death of such an irrelevant conference.
Seeing the Pac-12 die actually is a good thing, because the only thing hanging on in football was the Rose Bowl, and when was the last Pac-12
team relevant in men's basketball?
Mike
I mourn the loss of the PAC12. It was the last of the major conferences
with a geographic identity and long-time traditional rivalries that made sense.
That it collapsed so spectacularly also shows how relevant the things I
care about are to college football.
On Saturday, August 5, 2023 at 8:17:51 AM UTC-7, xyzzy wrote:
I mourn the loss of the PAC12. It was the last of the major conferences
with a geographic identity and long-time traditional rivalries that made
sense.
That it collapsed so spectacularly also shows how relevant the things I
care about are to college football.
Basically, we just lost a Power 5 conference in a matter of days. They
can point to USC and UCLA, but the fact is the Pac-12 could still have survived.
Now, real chance (at least IMODO) that at least one of the remaining four schools drops it's athletic program completely.
There is zero chance that happens. They may drop to a lower level but will not completely eliminate.
Now, real chance (at least IMODO) that at least one of the remaining four schools drops it's athletic program completely.
There is zero chance that happens. They may drop to a lower level but will not completely eliminate.
Now, real chance (at least IMODO) that at least one of the remaining four
schools drops it's athletic program completely.
There is zero chance that happens. They may drop to a lower level but will not completely eliminate."Drop to a lower level?" He's not talking about just football; he's talking about all sports. No way any of these schools ends up in Division II, much less get rid of all of their sports, or change them all to "club level," whatever that means.
Cal and Stanford are far too entrenched in the "minor sports" to drop them. Cut a few, maybe - back in 2010, Cal tried cutting its baseball, women's lacrosse, and men's and women's gymnastics programs (all four of which currently exist) - but certainlynot the one thing that still brings in money; men's basketball.
not the one thing that still brings in money; men's basketball.Now, real chance (at least IMODO) that at least one of the remaining four
schools drops it's athletic program completely.
There is zero chance that happens. They may drop to a lower level but will not completely eliminate."Drop to a lower level?" He's not talking about just football; he's talking about all sports. No way any of these schools ends up in Division II, much less get rid of all of their sports, or change them all to "club level," whatever that means.
Cal and Stanford are far too entrenched in the "minor sports" to drop them. Cut a few, maybe - back in 2010, Cal tried cutting its baseball, women's lacrosse, and men's and women's gymnastics programs (all four of which currently exist) - but certainly
There's a slim change Oregon State or Washington State could drop their football program, and a slightly less slim chance one or more of the four drops down to FCS and joins the Big West.schools, it has 2 years to get back to 7, or its remaining shares go to the teams' new conferences.
Men's basketball...pardon me while I look something up...
Normally, when a school leaves a conference, any shares of the Basketball TV money that it earned remain with the conference. However, according to the NCAA Bylaws, once a multisport (as opposed to something like the CCHA) conference drops below 7
Assuming none of these four teams gets into the NCAA tournament in the next few years (and the last time any of them did was when Cal and Oregon State got in in 2016, although I think Cal was one of the "first four out" in 2017), that's about $10.9million in 2025 and $9.25 million in 2026.
Also, the NCAA is probably sweating about whether Cal and Stanford can keep up their mens' gymnastics programs, as there are already so few schools that support it that any defections could mean the NCAA no longer conductiong a championship for it.
I disagree. Cal-Berkeley has a culture most people find... weird. And then you have the culture in California that if you aren't some form of a pro team (HS football counts for the sports factories), no one cares. Which see, again, the vote to disallowsports gambling.
Now, real chance (at least IMODO) that at least one of the remaining four >>> schools drops it's athletic program completely.
There is zero chance that happens. They may drop to a lower level but will >> not completely eliminate.
"Drop to a lower level?" He's not talking about just football; he's
talking about all sports. No way any of these schools ends up in Division
II, much less get rid of all of their sports, or change them all to "club level," whatever that means.
Cal and Stanford are far too entrenched in the "minor sports" to drop
them. Cut a few, maybe - back in 2010, Cal tried cutting its baseball, women's lacrosse, and men's and women's gymnastics programs (all four of which currently exist) - but certainly not the one thing that still
brings in money; men's basketball.
There's a slim change Oregon State or Washington State could drop their football program, and a slightly less slim chance one or more of the four drops down to FCS and joins the Big West.
Men's basketball...pardon me while I look something up...
Normally, when a school leaves a conference, any shares of the Basketball
TV money that it earned remain with the conference. However, according to
the NCAA Bylaws, once a multisport (as opposed to something like the
CCHA) conference drops below 7 schools, it has 2 years to get back to 7,
or its remaining shares go to the teams' new conferences.
Assuming none of these four teams gets into the NCAA tournament in the
next few years (and the last time any of them did was when Cal and Oregon State got in in 2016, although I think Cal was one of the "first four
out" in 2017), that's about $10.9 million in 2025 and $9.25 million in 2026.
Also, the NCAA is probably sweating about whether Cal and Stanford can
keep up their mens' gymnastics programs, as there are already so few
schools that support it that any defections could mean the NCAA no longer conductiong a championship for it.
disallow sports gambling.I disagree. Cal-Berkeley has a culture most people find... weird. And then you have the culture in California that if you aren't some form of a pro team (HS football counts for the sports factories), no one cares. Which see, again, the vote to
Cal and Stanford have one advantage when it comes to the minor sports. Nobody plays a minor sport expecting to make it their professional career, which means a scholarship is pretty much a free ticket into a school where a degree just might be worthsomething.
And refresh my memory - you're not from California? I am, and I saw the politics behind this vote first hand, starting long before the ballot propositions even had numbers.
One problem with the vote was, there were two competing propositions. One would limit it to being physically in a tribal casino, or one of the four (oops - now three, now that Golden Gate Fields is being sold) major horse racing tracks in California;the other would allow for online betting, but while technically it had to be run by the tribes, they could (and would) outsource it to companies like DraftKings, FanDuel, and BetMGM (which, in fact, were the main contributors to that proposition). The TV
The commercials for the "no online betting" ones pretty much consisted of two kinds: (a) "DraftKings and FanDuel will pocket most of the money, and California will get very little of it!", and (b) "Do you honestly think your teenagers won't be able toplace bets?" Meanwhile,
the ones supporting online betting also had two kinds; the ones that aired outside of sporting events touted how some of the profits would go towards supporting the state's homeless,
while the ones that aired during sporting events (literally, one aired for the first time in the first 10 minutes of Fox's first NFL pregame show of 2022) said, "Online betting in California if you vote for us. Enough said." Between each side'sdetractors and the people against sports betting in California in general (plus who knows how much money from various Vegas/Reno/Tahoe casino interests), both were doomed to defeat.
Note that, under California law, the next chance to change the law to allow for sports betting of any sort (besides horse racing) is in November, 2024.
On Saturday, August 5, 2023 at 12:14:10 PM UTC-7, The NOTBCS Guy wrote:certainly not the one thing that still brings in money; men's basketball.
Now, real chance (at least IMODO) that at least one of the remaining four
schools drops it's athletic program completely.
There is zero chance that happens. They may drop to a lower level but will"Drop to a lower level?" He's not talking about just football; he's talking about all sports. No way any of these schools ends up in Division II, much less get rid of all of their sports, or change them all to "club level," whatever that means.
not completely eliminate.
Cal and Stanford are far too entrenched in the "minor sports" to drop them. Cut a few, maybe - back in 2010, Cal tried cutting its baseball, women's lacrosse, and men's and women's gymnastics programs (all four of which currently exist) - but
schools, it has 2 years to get back to 7, or its remaining shares go to the teams' new conferences.There's a slim change Oregon State or Washington State could drop their football program, and a slightly less slim chance one or more of the four drops down to FCS and joins the Big West.
Men's basketball...pardon me while I look something up...
Normally, when a school leaves a conference, any shares of the Basketball TV money that it earned remain with the conference. However, according to the NCAA Bylaws, once a multisport (as opposed to something like the CCHA) conference drops below 7
million in 2025 and $9.25 million in 2026.Assuming none of these four teams gets into the NCAA tournament in the next few years (and the last time any of them did was when Cal and Oregon State got in in 2016, although I think Cal was one of the "first four out" in 2017), that's about $10.9
the Beavers are a national power in baseball. If any school does drop sports it won't be Oregon StateAlso, the NCAA is probably sweating about whether Cal and Stanford can keep up their mens' gymnastics programs, as there are already so few schools that support it that any defections could mean the NCAA no longer conductiong a championship for it.there is NO chance Oregon State drops football. Jonathan Smith has a contract that runs until 2029. They have to pay him somehow and football is the best way to raise that money. I think they end up in the Mountain West. Additionally, with Oregon State,
On Saturday, August 5, 2023 at 3:27:57 PM UTC-4, Eric Ramon wrote:
On Saturday, August 5, 2023 at 12:14:10 PM UTC-7, The NOTBCS Guywrote:
g fourNow, real chance (at least IMODO) that at least one of the
remainin
willschools drops it's athletic program completely.
There is zero chance that happens. They may drop to a lower level
but
king about all sports. No way any of these schools ends up in Divisionnot completely eliminate."Drop to a lower level?" He's not talking about just football; he's
tal
II, much less get rid of all of their sports, or change them all to
"club level," whatever that means.
hem. Cut a few, maybe - back in 2010, Cal tried cutting its baseball,Cal and Stanford are far too entrenched in the "minor sports" to
drop t
women's lacrosse, and men's and women's gymnastics programs (all four
of which currently exist) - but certainly not the one thing that still
brings in money; men's basketball.
football program, and a slightly less slim chance one or more of the
There's a slim change Oregon State or Washington State could drop
their
four drops down to FCS and joins the Big West.
ll TV money that it earned remain with the conference. However,
Men's basketball...pardon me while I look something up...
Normally, when a school leaves a conference, any shares of the
Basketba
according to the NCAA Bylaws, once a multisport (as opposed to
something like the CCHA) conference drops below 7 schools, it has 2
years to get back to 7, or its remaining shares go to the teams' new conferences.
next few years (and the last time any of them did was when Cal andAssuming none of these four teams gets into the NCAA tournament in
the
Oregon State got in in 2016, although I think Cal was one of the
"first four out" in 2017), that's about $10.9 million in 2025 and
$9.25 million in 2026.
keep up their mens' gymnastics programs, as there are already so few
Also, the NCAA is probably sweating about whether Cal and Stanford
can
schools that support it that any defections could mean the NCAA no
longer conductiong a championship for it.
there is NO chance Oregon State drops football. Jonathan Smith has aract that runs until 2029. They have to pay him somehow and football
cont
is the best way to raise that money. I think they end up in the
Mountain West. Additionally, with Oregon State, the Beavers are a
national power in baseball. If any school does drop sports it won't be
Oregon State
Oregon State, Cal, Stanford, and Washington State might not be
brand-name enough for the Big Ten, but they are still miles ahead of
most of the Mountain West. I feel like the MWC would take any of
those schools in a heartbeat.
You might run to run your numbers on that again. Half the MW can beat any
of those leftover teams.
On Saturday, August 5, 2023 at 7:44:49 PM UTC-7, AJ wrote:
You might run to run your numbers on that again. Half the MW can beat any of those leftover teams.He's talking Mar-Kee Val-You.
On Saturday, August 5, 2023 at 11:14:00 PM UTC-4, Michael Falkner wrote:
On Saturday, August 5, 2023 at 7:44:49 PM UTC-7, AJ wrote:
You might run to run your numbers on that again. Half the MW can beat any >>> of those leftover teams.He's talking Mar-Kee Val-You.
Yep. Attendance rankings may not be a perfect way to rank this, but it
gets it close. Looking at this site:
https://collegefootballnews.com/rankings/college-football-attendance-rankings-2023-five-year-program-analysis
we have the following for the MWC plus the remaining Pac-4:
121. San Jose State
116. New Mexico
112. Hawaii
108. Nevada
97. Utah State
91. UNLV
88. Wyoming
87. San Diego State
80. Air Force
78. Colorado State
77. Washington State
69. Oregon State
67. Boise State
64. Stanford
60. Fresno State
55. Cal
You might run to run your numbers on that again. Half the MW can beat any
of those leftover teams.
JGibson <james.m...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Saturday, August 5, 2023 at 11:14:00 PM UTC-4, Michael Falkner wrote:
On Saturday, August 5, 2023 at 7:44:49 PM UTC-7, AJ wrote:
You might run to run your numbers on that again. Half the MW can beat anyHe's talking Mar-Kee Val-You.
of those leftover teams.
Yep. Attendance rankings may not be a perfect way to rank this, but it gets it close. Looking at this site:
https://collegefootballnews.com/rankings/college-football-attendance-rankings-2023-five-year-program-analysis
we have the following for the MWC plus the remaining Pac-4:
121. San Jose State
116. New Mexico
112. Hawaii
108. Nevada
97. Utah State
91. UNLV
88. Wyoming
87. San Diego State
80. Air Force
78. Colorado State
77. Washington State
69. Oregon State
67. Boise State
64. Stanford
60. Fresno State
55. Cal
That was an informative link. By my reckoning, and I’m not sure I know who all the B12 members are, the worst power conference teams in that ranking are:
86 Duke
77 Washington State
76 Vanderbilt
72 Wake Forest
Also for the B1G, the rear is brought up by successful expansion candidate:
62 Maryland
Here's some things that strike me from the list. After Oklahoma and Texas (but still prior to the Big Ten acquisitions) went to the SEC, 18 of the top 20 are Big Ten or SEC schools, the only exceptions being Notre Dame and Clemson. The Pac-12 only had2 in the top 30: Washington and USC, and two more between 30 and 40: Oregon and Utah. Without USC and UCLA, I don't think the Pac-N was ever going to be able to pull a really good TV deal. The Big 12 did themselves some favors by quickly snagging BYU (
Note that, under California law, the next chance to change the law to allow for sports betting of any sort (besides horse racing) is in November, 2024.Not happening, as I said above.
require that minors have permission from a parent or judge to get an abortion), but you're right; there aren't even any petitions being circulated to authorize sports betting in California at the moment. I guess Vegas is betting on Plan B: that high-Usually, even repeated serious losses at the ballot box doesn't stop some people from trying again (examples: all of the attempts in the late 1980s to get an independent commission to draw the Congressional districts, and then all of the attempts toNote that, under California law, the next chance to change the law to allow for sports betting of any sort (besides horse racing) is in November, 2024.Not happening, as I said above.
Here's some things that strike me from the list. After Oklahoma and Texas (but still prior to the Big Ten acquisitions) went to the SEC, 18 of the top 20 are Big Ten or SEC schools, the only exceptions being Notre Dame and Clemson. The Pac-12 only had2 in the top 30: Washington and USC, and two more between 30 and 40: Oregon and Utah. Without USC and UCLA, I don't think the Pac-N was ever going to be able to pull a really good TV deal. The Big 12 did themselves some favors by quickly snagging BYU (
On Saturday, August 5, 2023 at 11:14:00 PM UTC-4, Michael Falkner wrote:
On Saturday, August 5, 2023 at 7:44:49 PM UTC-7, AJ wrote:
Yep. Attendance rankings may not be a perfect way to rank this, but it gets it close. Looking at this site:You might run to run your numbers on that again. Half the MW can beat anyHe's talking Mar-Kee Val-You.
of those leftover teams.
https://collegefootballnews.com/rankings/college-football-attendance-rankings-2023-five-year-program-analysis
we have the following for the MWC plus the remaining Pac-4:
121. San Jose State
116. New Mexico
112. Hawaii
108. Nevada
97. Utah State
91. UNLV
88. Wyoming
87. San Diego State
80. Air Force
78. Colorado State
77. Washington State
69. Oregon State
67. Boise State
64. Stanford
60. Fresno State
55. Cal
| Sysop: | Keyop |
|---|---|
| Location: | Huddersfield, West Yorkshire, UK |
| Users: | 300 |
| Nodes: | 16 (2 / 14) |
| Uptime: | 99:32:34 |
| Calls: | 6,700 |
| Calls today: | 5 |
| Files: | 12,232 |
| Messages: | 5,349,709 |