• Shirts not numbered in World Cups

    From =?UTF-8?B?TGzDqW8=?=@21:1/5 to All on Sun Nov 20 01:11:13 2022
    So today's the big day, our countdown reached zero and the World Cup will
    kick off in a few hours. There's been no "shirt zero" in World Cup history
    as far as I know, but there HAS been a time in which shirt numbers weren't used: the pre-war World Cups, whose players have, for this reason, being excluded by default from all the countdown posts I've made thus far.

    Now, on one hand that isn't fair to the stars of that epoch, who probably should be remembered too, since they too helped write World Cup history, indeed they started it all. On the other, my attempt here to close my countdown posts by listing players from the pre-war World Cups will surely leave a lot to be desired. I can't possibly claim to know much about them.
    The distance in time between their heyday and my birth is up to half a century, information wasn't anywhere near as readily available as it is
    today. The game, its rules and, most of all, the world itself changed by
    a lot since these days.

    So, early disclaimer out of the way :-), where to begin?

    A good one to start with is Luis Monti, an Argentinian-born center-half
    who has played in two World Cups, 1930 and 1934. He played for his native Argentina in the former and as one of Italy's Oriundi in the latter. Indeed, he only ever lost two games for Argentina, both to Uruguay: the Olympic final of 1928 and the World Cup final of 1930. Having played two WC finals, each with a different team, he used to say he would have been killed if he had won in 1930 or lost in 1934... A multiple champion for San Lorenzo and Juventus, Monti would probably be a #5 had numbering been in place at his time.

    His countryman Guillermo Stábile was one of the top goalscorers of the pre-war WC's, scoring eight goals in four games in WC'1930. He started the World Cup as a reserve, entering the team from the second game onwards, replacing Roberto Cherro, sidelined due to an anxiety attack, and scored in all four games he played. He then moved to Genoa thanks to his World Cup feats and, thus, would never play for Argentina again.

    Also on eight goals there's Brasil's Leonidas da Silva, who pushed the team ahead to an unprecedented semifinal exit in 1938, having also been part of
    the team's 1934 first round exit. One of the first Brazilian stars, Leonidas was dropped from the team in the semifinals against Italy due to injury. At the time, many people didn't believe it, attributing his abscence to an arrogant option by coach Adhemar Pimenta to allegedly "rest him for the final",
    but Leonidas himself always denied this. Like Stábile, Leonidas also scored in every World Cup game he played. Both would play #9's role.

    The Brazilian star of the epoch was Domingos da Guia, held as one of the world's finest defenders on his day. He was also a member of Brasil's 1938 squad, and won titles in Brasil, Argentina and Uruguay. A #2, in the old
    days formations.

    The Uruguayans were one of the teams to beat of the epoch. Though they refused to play WC's 1934 and 1938 due to hosting issues, they won the first World Cup on the wake of two Olympic titles in 1924 and 1928. Colombes and Amsterdam are names of tribunes of Estadio Centenario due to these victories, and that stadium was built precisely for the World Cup.

    Some of the main Uruguayan players of the epoch: the "Great Marshal" Jose Nasazzi, the first captain to lift the Jules Rimet trophy; "El Mago" Hector Scarone, whose goalscoring record for the Uruguayan national team stood until 2011; and the "Black Pearl" Jose Leandro Andrade, considered one of the finest footballers of his time, whose nephew, Victor Rodriguez Andrade, was also a world champion in 1950.

    From the epoch's two-time world champions Italy we have already mentioned Luis Monti. Let's also bring up forward Silvio Piola, to this day Serie A's historical
    top goalscorer, with 274 goals from 537 games and third all time top goalscorer of the Italian national team, world cup winner in 1938 with 5 goals in 4 games. And Giuseppe Meazza, who played every game of both Italian WC winning runs, captaining the team in the second one, also considered one of the finest of his generation.

    The great goalkeeper of the time was Spain's Ricardo Zamora, whose name is
    on the trophy given to La Liga's best goalkeeper for decades. From France we could mention another keeper, Alex Thepot, the first one to save a penalty
    in a WC game. His countryman, Lucien Laurent, scored the tournament's first goal ever. Austria brings on the great Matthias Sindelar, from the Wunderteam that made the semifinals in World Cup 1934, and Josef Bican, a goalscoring machine whose scoring record goes into four digits. And there's Poland's
    Ernst Willimowski, who scored 4 goals in a game which his team still lost anyway (the 6-5 loss to Brasil in WC 1938 1st round).

    Counting Monti for both sides he played, I've mentioned 3 Italians, 3 Uruguayans,
    2 Argentinians, 2 Brazilians, 2 Austrians, 2 French, 1 Spanish and 1 Polish player. I'm sure I missed a lot of all time greats of the epoch, especially from Italy and Uruguay, but this post is already long enough as it is. Feel free to add or correct anything to the above. And on to the games already!


    Best regards,

    Lléo

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Mark@21:1/5 to All on Sun Nov 20 13:05:42 2022
    On Sunday, November 20, 2022 at 9:11:15 AM UTC, Lléo wrote:
    So today's the big day, our countdown reached zero and the World Cup will kick off in a few hours. There's been no "shirt zero" in World Cup history as far as I know, but there HAS been a time in which shirt numbers weren't used: the pre-war World Cups, whose players have, for this reason, being excluded by default from all the countdown posts I've made thus far.

    Now, on one hand that isn't fair to the stars of that epoch, who probably should be remembered too, since they too helped write World Cup history, indeed they started it all. On the other, my attempt here to close my countdown posts by listing players from the pre-war World Cups will surely leave a lot to be desired. I can't possibly claim to know much about them. The distance in time between their heyday and my birth is up to half a century, information wasn't anywhere near as readily available as it is today. The game, its rules and, most of all, the world itself changed by
    a lot since these days.

    So, early disclaimer out of the way :-), where to begin?

    A good one to start with is Luis Monti, an Argentinian-born center-half
    who has played in two World Cups, 1930 and 1934. He played for his native Argentina in the former and as one of Italy's Oriundi in the latter. Indeed, he only ever lost two games for Argentina, both to Uruguay: the Olympic final
    of 1928 and the World Cup final of 1930. Having played two WC finals, each with a different team, he used to say he would have been killed if he had won
    in 1930 or lost in 1934... A multiple champion for San Lorenzo and Juventus, Monti would probably be a #5 had numbering been in place at his time.

    His countryman Guillermo Stábile was one of the top goalscorers of the pre-war
    WC's, scoring eight goals in four games in WC'1930. He started the World Cup as a reserve, entering the team from the second game onwards, replacing Roberto
    Cherro, sidelined due to an anxiety attack, and scored in all four games he played. He then moved to Genoa thanks to his World Cup feats and, thus, would
    never play for Argentina again.

    Also on eight goals there's Brasil's Leonidas da Silva, who pushed the team ahead to an unprecedented semifinal exit in 1938, having also been part of the team's 1934 first round exit. One of the first Brazilian stars, Leonidas was dropped from the team in the semifinals against Italy due to injury. At the time, many people didn't believe it, attributing his abscence to an arrogant option by coach Adhemar Pimenta to allegedly "rest him for the final",
    but Leonidas himself always denied this. Like Stábile, Leonidas also scored in every World Cup game he played. Both would play #9's role.

    The Brazilian star of the epoch was Domingos da Guia, held as one of the world's finest defenders on his day. He was also a member of Brasil's 1938 squad, and won titles in Brasil, Argentina and Uruguay. A #2, in the old days formations.

    The Uruguayans were one of the teams to beat of the epoch. Though they refused
    to play WC's 1934 and 1938 due to hosting issues, they won the first World Cup
    on the wake of two Olympic titles in 1924 and 1928. Colombes and Amsterdam are
    names of tribunes of Estadio Centenario due to these victories, and that stadium was built precisely for the World Cup.

    Some of the main Uruguayan players of the epoch: the "Great Marshal" Jose Nasazzi, the first captain to lift the Jules Rimet trophy; "El Mago" Hector Scarone, whose goalscoring record for the Uruguayan national team stood until
    2011; and the "Black Pearl" Jose Leandro Andrade, considered one of the finest
    footballers of his time, whose nephew, Victor Rodriguez Andrade, was also a world champion in 1950.

    From the epoch's two-time world champions Italy we have already mentioned Luis
    Monti. Let's also bring up forward Silvio Piola, to this day Serie A's historical
    top goalscorer, with 274 goals from 537 games and third all time top goalscorer
    of the Italian national team, world cup winner in 1938 with 5 goals in 4 games.
    And Giuseppe Meazza, who played every game of both Italian WC winning runs, captaining the team in the second one, also considered one of the finest of his generation.

    The great goalkeeper of the time was Spain's Ricardo Zamora, whose name is on the trophy given to La Liga's best goalkeeper for decades. From France we could mention another keeper, Alex Thepot, the first one to save a penalty in a WC game. His countryman, Lucien Laurent, scored the tournament's first goal ever. Austria brings on the great Matthias Sindelar, from the Wunderteam
    that made the semifinals in World Cup 1934, and Josef Bican, a goalscoring machine whose scoring record goes into four digits. And there's Poland's Ernst Willimowski, who scored 4 goals in a game which his team still lost anyway (the 6-5 loss to Brasil in WC 1938 1st round).

    Counting Monti for both sides he played, I've mentioned 3 Italians, 3 Uruguayans,
    2 Argentinians, 2 Brazilians, 2 Austrians, 2 French, 1 Spanish and 1 Polish player. I'm sure I missed a lot of all time greats of the epoch, especially from Italy and Uruguay, but this post is already long enough as it is. Feel free to add or correct anything to the above. And on to the games already!


    Best regards,

    Lléo

    Well done. These posts have been quite interesting and informative, and have made the build-up to the World Cup a bit more exciting.

    I'd like to suggest you do the same thing again when the 2023 Copa Libertadores and/or the 2024 Copa America is about to start.

    I'd also like to add another player to the above post. Raimundo Orsi.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Mark@21:1/5 to Mark on Wed Nov 30 06:18:05 2022
    On Sunday, November 20, 2022 at 9:05:44 PM UTC, Mark wrote:
    On Sunday, November 20, 2022 at 9:11:15 AM UTC, Lléo wrote:
    So today's the big day, our countdown reached zero and the World Cup will kick off in a few hours. There's been no "shirt zero" in World Cup history as far as I know, but there HAS been a time in which shirt numbers weren't used: the pre-war World Cups, whose players have, for this reason, being excluded by default from all the countdown posts I've made thus far.

    Now, on one hand that isn't fair to the stars of that epoch, who probably should be remembered too, since they too helped write World Cup history, indeed they started it all. On the other, my attempt here to close my countdown posts by listing players from the pre-war World Cups will surely leave a lot to be desired. I can't possibly claim to know much about them. The distance in time between their heyday and my birth is up to half a century, information wasn't anywhere near as readily available as it is today. The game, its rules and, most of all, the world itself changed by
    a lot since these days.

    So, early disclaimer out of the way :-), where to begin?

    A good one to start with is Luis Monti, an Argentinian-born center-half who has played in two World Cups, 1930 and 1934. He played for his native Argentina in the former and as one of Italy's Oriundi in the latter. Indeed,
    he only ever lost two games for Argentina, both to Uruguay: the Olympic final
    of 1928 and the World Cup final of 1930. Having played two WC finals, each with a different team, he used to say he would have been killed if he had won
    in 1930 or lost in 1934... A multiple champion for San Lorenzo and Juventus,
    Monti would probably be a #5 had numbering been in place at his time.

    His countryman Guillermo Stábile was one of the top goalscorers of the pre-war
    WC's, scoring eight goals in four games in WC'1930. He started the World Cup
    as a reserve, entering the team from the second game onwards, replacing Roberto
    Cherro, sidelined due to an anxiety attack, and scored in all four games he
    played. He then moved to Genoa thanks to his World Cup feats and, thus, would
    never play for Argentina again.

    Also on eight goals there's Brasil's Leonidas da Silva, who pushed the team
    ahead to an unprecedented semifinal exit in 1938, having also been part of the team's 1934 first round exit. One of the first Brazilian stars, Leonidas
    was dropped from the team in the semifinals against Italy due to injury. At
    the time, many people didn't believe it, attributing his abscence to an arrogant option by coach Adhemar Pimenta to allegedly "rest him for the final",
    but Leonidas himself always denied this. Like Stábile, Leonidas also scored
    in every World Cup game he played. Both would play #9's role.

    The Brazilian star of the epoch was Domingos da Guia, held as one of the world's finest defenders on his day. He was also a member of Brasil's 1938 squad, and won titles in Brasil, Argentina and Uruguay. A #2, in the old days formations.

    The Uruguayans were one of the teams to beat of the epoch. Though they refused
    to play WC's 1934 and 1938 due to hosting issues, they won the first World Cup
    on the wake of two Olympic titles in 1924 and 1928. Colombes and Amsterdam are
    names of tribunes of Estadio Centenario due to these victories, and that stadium was built precisely for the World Cup.

    Some of the main Uruguayan players of the epoch: the "Great Marshal" Jose Nasazzi, the first captain to lift the Jules Rimet trophy; "El Mago" Hector
    Scarone, whose goalscoring record for the Uruguayan national team stood until
    2011; and the "Black Pearl" Jose Leandro Andrade, considered one of the finest
    footballers of his time, whose nephew, Victor Rodriguez Andrade, was also a
    world champion in 1950.

    From the epoch's two-time world champions Italy we have already mentioned Luis
    Monti. Let's also bring up forward Silvio Piola, to this day Serie A's historical
    top goalscorer, with 274 goals from 537 games and third all time top goalscorer
    of the Italian national team, world cup winner in 1938 with 5 goals in 4 games.
    And Giuseppe Meazza, who played every game of both Italian WC winning runs,
    captaining the team in the second one, also considered one of the finest of
    his generation.

    The great goalkeeper of the time was Spain's Ricardo Zamora, whose name is on the trophy given to La Liga's best goalkeeper for decades. From France we
    could mention another keeper, Alex Thepot, the first one to save a penalty in a WC game. His countryman, Lucien Laurent, scored the tournament's first
    goal ever. Austria brings on the great Matthias Sindelar, from the Wunderteam
    that made the semifinals in World Cup 1934, and Josef Bican, a goalscoring machine whose scoring record goes into four digits. And there's Poland's Ernst Willimowski, who scored 4 goals in a game which his team still lost anyway (the 6-5 loss to Brasil in WC 1938 1st round).

    Counting Monti for both sides he played, I've mentioned 3 Italians, 3 Uruguayans,
    2 Argentinians, 2 Brazilians, 2 Austrians, 2 French, 1 Spanish and 1 Polish
    player. I'm sure I missed a lot of all time greats of the epoch, especially
    from Italy and Uruguay, but this post is already long enough as it is. Feel
    free to add or correct anything to the above. And on to the games already!


    Best regards,

    Lléo
    Well done. These posts have been quite interesting and informative, and have made the build-up to the World Cup a bit more exciting.

    I'd like to suggest you do the same thing again when the 2023 Copa Libertadores and/or the 2024 Copa America is about to start.

    I'd also like to add another player to the above post. Raimundo Orsi.

    I never got round to saying anything about Raimundo Orsi.

    Raimundo Orsi won the Copa America with Argentina in 1927, and was an Olympic silver medallist in 1928. He played as a forward, usually as a left winger, and won 3 League Championships with Independiente in the 1920s, and 5 consecutive Italian League
    Championships with Juventus from 1931-35. He’s generally considered to be 1 of the best ever Italian left wingers, and scored the equaliser for Italy in the 1934 World Cup Final.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)