Στις 4/1/2024 6:00 π.μ., ο/η Andrew T. έγραψε:sink not sing of course. https://www.flickr.com/photos/167258532@N02/53446426731/in/dateposted-public/ here's one of the best shot of this batch...
Hi all. Been reading the group for a while. Don't think I've everthat's a very good question. my book (the photographer's handbook by
posted here.
Anyway, I've finally been putting my darkroom back together after a
move a few years back, and made my first prints in over 2 years. It
still needs work, but had a nice sharpness to it. The subject was a
bashful sunflower using FP4+ film and Ilford RC postcard stock and
Beers solution 4 developer. (When I've finished working it, maybe I
can scan it and share it).
Looking back at my print logbook, I noticed my developer was usually
around 23-24C most times. Tonight the whole room was cold, and
developer was 12-13C.
That led me to wondering, all else being equal, how much of an effect
does developer temperature have on the resulting print? I know colder
chemistry usually works slower, which in B&W can be compensated with
longer development times, and color processes like RA4 need very
precise temperature control. But will a major difference in
temperature, even if compensated, have other effects, like how the
grain develops (sharpness and such) or contrast differences, maybe
localized more to highlights or shadows?
I've never really explored this, and thought I'd see what people's
experiences are before playing with this further.
--Andrew
john hedgecoe-it's excellent and I suggest you get it if you already
haven't it-it's out of print so you can get it only used- I had it bound
here as a hardback for only 20 euros) answers this question for film
which is not dissimilar to paper. it says that, like all chemical
reactions, developing slows down with cold and speeds up with heat, but
below 13 C most developing agents, notably hydroquinone, cease to
function giving very flat results. and above 24 C film (also paper)
softens which makes it prone to damage. colour processing isn't as
difficult as one might expect, modern chemistry and papers are much more forgiving, than, say 50 years ago, I usually fill the sing or a shallow
dish with hot water from the heliothermo, usually at 50-55 C, and put
the jars with the chemistry in the dish, and when I'm finished with
exposing the paper and loading the print drum, the developer is already
hot enough. If it's in the ballpark of 35 c, it's 45 secs development,
ditto for blix. stop washing and stabilizer are relatively unimportant.
if it's in the ballpark of 40 it's 30 secs. down to 30 and it's a minute. HTH....
Hi all. Been reading the group for a while. Don't think I've ever
posted here.
Anyway, I've finally been putting my darkroom back together after a
move a few years back, and made my first prints in over 2 years. It
still needs work, but had a nice sharpness to it. The subject was a
bashful sunflower using FP4+ film and Ilford RC postcard stock and
Beers solution 4 developer. (When I've finished working it, maybe I
can scan it and share it).
Looking back at my print logbook, I noticed my developer was usually
around 23-24C most times. Tonight the whole room was cold, and
developer was 12-13C.
That led me to wondering, all else being equal, how much of an effect
does developer temperature have on the resulting print? I know colder chemistry usually works slower, which in B&W can be compensated with
longer development times, and color processes like RA4 need very
precise temperature control. But will a major difference in
temperature, even if compensated, have other effects, like how the
grain develops (sharpness and such) or contrast differences, maybe
localized more to highlights or shadows?
I've never really explored this, and thought I'd see what people's experiences are before playing with this further.
--Andrew
The novelty of posting on darkroom printing on a shortly to be defunct chatboard!
I suspect if the temperature goes outside a range it will affect grain, sharpness and warmth. But there are better ways to control warmth at leas (paper choice, developer, toner).
I also recollect that, in colder climates, you might warm the developer
- so it wasn???t too cold.
???????? 4/1/2024 6:00 ??.??., ??/?? Andrew T. ????????????:
Hi all. Been reading the group for a while. Don't think I've everthat's a very good question. my book (the photographer's handbook by
posted here.
Anyway, I've finally been putting my darkroom back together after a
move a few years back, and made my first prints in over 2 years. It
still needs work, but had a nice sharpness to it. The subject was a
bashful sunflower using FP4+ film and Ilford RC postcard stock and
Beers solution 4 developer. (When I've finished working it, maybe I
can scan it and share it).
Looking back at my print logbook, I noticed my developer was usually
around 23-24C most times. Tonight the whole room was cold, and
developer was 12-13C.
john hedgecoe-it's excellent and I suggest you get it if you already
haven't it-it's out of print so you can get it only used- I had it bound
here as a hardback for only 20 euros) answers this question for film
which is not dissimilar to paper. it says that, like all chemical
reactions, developing slows down with cold and speeds up with heat, but
below 13 C most developing agents, notably hydroquinone, cease to
function giving very flat results.
colour processing isn't as
difficult as one might expect, modern chemistry and papers are much more forgiving, than, say 50 years ago,
Στις 8/1/2024 4:37 π.μ., ο/η Andrew T. έγραψε:
On 2024-01-06, Dimitris Tzortzakakis <noone@nospam.com> wrote:yes it's a very good book another one (in german although)is by Teicher-Handbuch der Fotografie although you have to be fluent in german
???????? 4/1/2024 6:00 ??.??., ??/?? Andrew T. ????????????:
Hi all. Been reading the group for a while. Don't think I've everthat's a very good question. my book (the photographer's handbook by
posted here.
Anyway, I've finally been putting my darkroom back together after a
move a few years back, and made my first prints in over 2 years. It
still needs work, but had a nice sharpness to it. The subject was a
bashful sunflower using FP4+ film and Ilford RC postcard stock and
Beers solution 4 developer. (When I've finished working it, maybe I
can scan it and share it).
Looking back at my print logbook, I noticed my developer was usually
around 23-24C most times. Tonight the whole room was cold, and
developer was 12-13C.
john hedgecoe-it's excellent and I suggest you get it if you already
haven't it-it's out of print so you can get it only used- I had it bound >>> here as a hardback for only 20 euros) answers this question for film
I'll have to look for a copy. Sounds like he covers a good bit of
chemistry.
to read it. It's from ex-East Germany so you can find it only used.
There must be similar ones in English although I don't know about them.
It explicitly explains how colour developing works, exactly how flash circuits work, filters in B&W, and many obsolete technologies.
whatever, I shared what the book said, it might be valid only for films. Paper developers are more active and bromide paper is extremely finewhich is not dissimilar to paper. it says that, like all chemical
reactions, developing slows down with cold and speeds up with heat, but
below 13 C most developing agents, notably hydroquinone, cease to
function giving very flat results.
I wonder how metol reacts to low temperatures. I've been using Beers
formula 4, which is 5 parts solution A (metol) and 3 parts B
(hydroquinone). While it was very slow at 12C (about 135s, with a
factor of 3), it seemed anything but flat.
grained.
Although bringing it up to 17C with a heat mat brought the time downyes, on the book it says the ideal development temperature is around 20
to 100s, even with increasing to a factor of 4. Of course I also went
from Ilford MGIV 4x6 paper to Warmtone 8x10, so I can't do a true
comparison. I might cold-develop the same print with the Warmtone and
compare.
C, here in the summer I have to cool the developer by placing it in the freezer.
my B&W enlarger is very old (meopta axomat II-it came with LOTS ofcolour processing isn't as
difficult as one might expect, modern chemistry and papers are much more >>> forgiving, than, say 50 years ago,
I'd still like to branch into color, but that may be a while. I
estimated nearly US$200 for RA4 paper, chem and filters from Freestyle
in California. First I need to plumb my sink. :-)
papers and a light control, inside of it there was a siemens capacitor
from 1971!!.it even has a no-standard lens, it's M24 or something, while
the modern ones use M39 IIRC) so I couldn't use filters;it has no filter tray. I bought a used meopta axomat 5 with colour head from the
excellent british site secondhanddarkroom, it came all the way from the
UK and I had to pay taxes and it was still worth it!!! with it came an excellent fujimoto 6 element lens and a jobo paper drum, from 10X15
(4"x5") to 40 X50 (11"X14"). I have developed 11"X14" colour prints and
they look excellent!I order my chemistry from Germany (macodirect.de)
and papers from the UK, because the only factory in EU that still
produced RA4 sheet paper was shut down, and it seems the UK plant won't
sell to the germans!!!!
BTW, the photo you shared in the other post looks very good.
--Andrew
On 2024-01-06, Dimitris Tzortzakakis <noone@nospam.com> wrote:
???????? 4/1/2024 6:00 ??.??., ??/?? Andrew T. ????????????:
Hi all. Been reading the group for a while. Don't think I've everthat's a very good question. my book (the photographer's handbook by
posted here.
Anyway, I've finally been putting my darkroom back together after a
move a few years back, and made my first prints in over 2 years. It
still needs work, but had a nice sharpness to it. The subject was a
bashful sunflower using FP4+ film and Ilford RC postcard stock and
Beers solution 4 developer. (When I've finished working it, maybe I
can scan it and share it).
Looking back at my print logbook, I noticed my developer was usually
around 23-24C most times. Tonight the whole room was cold, and
developer was 12-13C.
john hedgecoe-it's excellent and I suggest you get it if you already
haven't it-it's out of print so you can get it only used- I had it bound
here as a hardback for only 20 euros) answers this question for film
I'll have to look for a copy. Sounds like he covers a good bit of
chemistry.
which is not dissimilar to paper. it says that, like all chemical
reactions, developing slows down with cold and speeds up with heat, but
below 13 C most developing agents, notably hydroquinone, cease to
function giving very flat results.
I wonder how metol reacts to low temperatures. I've been using Beers
formula 4, which is 5 parts solution A (metol) and 3 parts B
(hydroquinone). While it was very slow at 12C (about 135s, with a
factor of 3), it seemed anything but flat.
Although bringing it up to 17C with a heat mat brought the time down
to 100s, even with increasing to a factor of 4. Of course I also went
from Ilford MGIV 4x6 paper to Warmtone 8x10, so I can't do a true
comparison. I might cold-develop the same print with the Warmtone and compare.
colour processing isn't as
difficult as one might expect, modern chemistry and papers are much more
forgiving, than, say 50 years ago,
I'd still like to branch into color, but that may be a while. I
estimated nearly US$200 for RA4 paper, chem and filters from Freestyle
in California. First I need to plumb my sink. :-)
BTW, the photo you shared in the other post looks very good.
--Andrew
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