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  • =?UTF-8?Q?Beethoven_Christus_am_=C3=96lberge_with_King_David_Inste?= =?

    From simonelvladtepes@21:1/5 to All on Thu Jan 12 14:00:56 2023
    I had an LP of Beethoven op.85 oratorio "Christus am Ölberge" 50 years ago. It was an English version where Jesus was replaced by King David. According to the back of the cover, IIRC, English sensitivities at the time did not allow for Christ to be
    portrayed as an actual character or something like that, hence the changes. Please do not laugh - I can't find any mention of this anywhere on the web - is my memory playing tricks on me?

    Simonel

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  • From Notsure01@21:1/5 to simonelvladtepes on Thu Jan 12 20:21:05 2023
    On 1/12/23 5:00 PM, simonelvladtepes wrote:
    I had an LP of Beethoven op.85 oratorio "Christus am Ölberge" 50 years ago. It was an English version where Jesus was replaced by King David. According to the back of the cover, IIRC, English sensitivities at the time did not allow for Christ to be
    portrayed as an actual character or something like that, hence the changes. Please do not laugh - I can't find any mention of this anywhere on the web - is my memory playing tricks on me?

    Simonel

    No, you are not hallucinating (although if you have been reading some of
    the other threads here at RMCR, you might not want to believe your eyes...)

    According to this: https://theoryofmusic.files.wordpress.com/2020/01/edited-paper-transformation-of-beethovens-chr-barry-mitchell-2019.pdf

    "The oratorio Christus am Ölberge, Op. 85, despite being Beethoven’s
    only through- composed dramatic work, is not generally regarded as one
    of his masterpieces. It is now rarely performed or recorded. Beethoven expressed dissatisfaction with the oratorio and especially with Franz
    Xaber Huber’s libretto and it seems that posterity has agreed. In nineteenth-century Britain, probably originating in the early 1840s, an ambitious attempt was made to overcome the perceived shortcomings of
    Huber’s libretto by grafting a new libretto in English onto Beethoven’s music."


    "The new title is Engedi or David in the Wilderness and the librettist
    is Henry Hudson (1798-1889)."

    The attached link goes into a lot of detail, but does not mention
    anything about recordings, and I have not found any so far...

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  • From Christopher Howell@21:1/5 to All on Fri Jan 13 22:54:46 2023
    Il giorno venerdì 13 gennaio 2023 alle 02:21:12 UTC+1 Notsure01 ha scritto:
    On 1/12/23 5:00 PM, simonelvladtepes wrote:
    I had an LP of Beethoven op.85 oratorio "Christus am Ölberge" 50 years ago. It was an English version where Jesus was replaced by King David. According to the back of the cover, IIRC, English sensitivities at the time did not allow for Christ to be
    portrayed as an actual character or something like that, hence the changes. Please do not laugh - I can't find any mention of this anywhere on the web - is my memory playing tricks on me?

    Simonel
    No, you are not hallucinating (although if you have been reading some of
    the other threads here at RMCR, you might not want to believe your eyes...)

    According to this: https://theoryofmusic.files.wordpress.com/2020/01/edited-paper-transformation-of-beethovens-chr-barry-mitchell-2019.pdf

    "The oratorio Christus am Ölberge, Op. 85, despite being Beethoven’s only through- composed dramatic work, is not generally regarded as one
    of his masterpieces. It is now rarely performed or recorded. Beethoven expressed dissatisfaction with the oratorio and especially with Franz
    Xaber Huber’s libretto and it seems that posterity has agreed. In nineteenth-century Britain, probably originating in the early 1840s, an ambitious attempt was made to overcome the perceived shortcomings of Huber’s libretto by grafting a new libretto in English onto Beethoven’s music."


    "The new title is Engedi or David in the Wilderness and the librettist
    is Henry Hudson (1798-1889)."

    The attached link goes into a lot of detail, but does not mention
    anything about recordings, and I have not found any so far...

    No, not hallucinating, I remember looking with amusement at the score of this adaptation in my university library back in the 1970s. But I'm amazed that anyone in the mid-20th century should still have performed it that way let alone recorded it (except
    as a joke, but it would be an expensive joke to assemble). Still, evidently somebody did.

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  • From simonelvladtepes@21:1/5 to All on Sat Jan 14 07:46:22 2023
    I'm amazed that anyone in the mid-20th century should still have performed it that way let alone recorded it

    I loved the recording in my teens, but then, as a teenager I thought Beethoven was god and loved everything he wrote. I am now usually allergic to anything I idealized back then.

    Simonel

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