• We Are The World, Lang Lang on ending war

    From Pluted Pup@21:1/5 to All on Sun Nov 20 16:54:48 2022
    "'We Are the World' by Michael Jackson and
    Lionel Richie is the song that breaks through
    all the barriers in this world. If we had
    more songs like that, there would be no wars."

    -- Lang Lang, BBC Music Magazine November 2022 page 122

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  • From Andy Evans@21:1/5 to All on Mon Nov 21 05:38:56 2022
    Rubbish, of course.

    Climate change is more important than wars anyway.

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  • From HT@21:1/5 to All on Mon Nov 21 06:31:51 2022
    Op maandag 21 november 2022 om 01:54:54 UTC+1 schreef Pluted Pup:
    "'We Are the World' by Michael Jackson and
    Lionel Richie is the song that breaks through
    all the barriers in this world. If we had
    more songs like that, there would be no wars."

    -- Lang Lang, BBC Music Magazine November 2022 page 122

    He's not the first 'artist' to vastly overrate the influence of art.

    Henk

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  • From Frank Berger@21:1/5 to Andy Evans on Mon Nov 21 09:55:59 2022
    On 11/21/2022 8:38 AM, Andy Evans wrote:
    Rubbish, of course.

    Climate change is more important than wars anyway.

    If your most dire predictions of the coming social and economic collapse due to climate change, wars will follow.

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  • From number_six@21:1/5 to Andy Evans on Tue Nov 22 16:22:51 2022
    On Monday, November 21, 2022 at 5:38:59 AM UTC-8, Andy Evans wrote:
    Rubbish, of course.

    Climate change is more important than wars anyway.
    Ukraine war has put climate on the back burner, so to speak.
    It lays bare the chasm between rhetoric and reality in energy policy.

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  • From Frank Berger@21:1/5 to All on Tue Nov 22 20:16:18 2022
    On 11/22/2022 7:22 PM, number_six wrote:
    On Monday, November 21, 2022 at 5:38:59 AM UTC-8, Andy Evans wrote:
    Rubbish, of course.

    Climate change is more important than wars anyway.
    Ukraine war has put climate on the back burner, so to speak.
    It lays bare the chasm between rhetoric and reality in energy policy.

    If I understand you correctly, I don't think that's fair. There is always a trade-off between the present and the future. If a person or government had decided that it was appropriate to reduce the present standard of living by x% in order to
    ameliorate the effects of global warming in the future, it is reasonable to change that decision if bombs start raining down.

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  • From number_six@21:1/5 to Frank Berger on Tue Nov 22 18:19:13 2022
    On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 5:16:27 PM UTC-8, Frank Berger wrote:
    On 11/22/2022 7:22 PM, number_six wrote:
    On Monday, November 21, 2022 at 5:38:59 AM UTC-8, Andy Evans wrote:
    Rubbish, of course.

    Climate change is more important than wars anyway.
    Ukraine war has put climate on the back burner, so to speak.
    It lays bare the chasm between rhetoric and reality in energy policy.
    If I understand you correctly, I don't think that's fair. There is always a trade-off between the present and the future. If a person or government had decided that it was appropriate to reduce the present standard of living by x% in order to
    ameliorate the effects of global warming in the future, it is reasonable to change that decision if bombs start raining down.

    Andy asserted that climate change was more important than wars and, perhaps inartfully, I countered that climate policy had been subordinated to war policy.

    The trade-off you cite is real. The chasm to which I referred is that between (a) rhetoric at Glasgow /Sharm el-Sheikh COP conferences, and (b) European reliance on non-renewables from Russia.

    Hope this helps clarify what I was getting at.

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  • From Frank Berger@21:1/5 to All on Wed Nov 23 00:02:02 2022
    On 11/22/2022 9:19 PM, number_six wrote:
    On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 5:16:27 PM UTC-8, Frank Berger wrote:
    On 11/22/2022 7:22 PM, number_six wrote:
    On Monday, November 21, 2022 at 5:38:59 AM UTC-8, Andy Evans wrote:
    Rubbish, of course.

    Climate change is more important than wars anyway.
    Ukraine war has put climate on the back burner, so to speak.
    It lays bare the chasm between rhetoric and reality in energy policy.
    If I understand you correctly, I don't think that's fair. There is always a trade-off between the present and the future. If a person or government had decided that it was appropriate to reduce the present standard of living by x% in order to
    ameliorate the effects of global warming in the future, it is reasonable to change that decision if bombs start raining down.

    Andy asserted that climate change was more important than wars and, perhaps inartfully, I countered that climate policy had been subordinated to war policy.

    The trade-off you cite is real. The chasm to which I referred is that between (a) rhetoric at Glasgow /Sharm el-Sheikh COP conferences, and (b) European reliance on non-renewables from Russia.

    Hope this helps clarify what I was getting at.

    It does. Thanks.

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  • From Andy Evans@21:1/5 to Frank Berger on Wed Nov 23 03:59:22 2022
    On Wednesday, 23 November 2022 at 01:16:27 UTC, Frank Berger wrote:
    There is always a trade-off between the present and the future. If a person or government had decided that it was appropriate to reduce the present standard of living by x% in order to ameliorate the effects of global warming in the future, it is
    reasonable to change that decision if bombs start raining down.

    It's reasonable to delay action because of voters who insist on their creature comforts, because of wars, because of heavy investment in fossil fuels, because we need nice warm houses, because, because, because........

    None of this fixes the emissions which are poisoning the planet. Reasonable thinking has failed and will continue to fail. We need new thinking and an end to "reasonable" excuses, carbon trading and all the rest of the "reasonable" cop outs from actually
    fixing the problem.

    "I sit on a man's back, choking him and making him carry me, and yet assure myself and others that I am very sorry for him and wish to ease his lot by all possible means -- except by getting off his back." Tolstoy

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  • From Dan Koren@21:1/5 to Andy Evans on Wed Nov 23 08:11:44 2022
    On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 3:59:25 AM UTC-8, Andy Evans wrote:

    None of this fixes the emissions which are poisoning the planet.
    Reasonable thinking has failed and will continue to fail. We need
    new thinking and an end to "reasonable" excuses, carbon trading
    and all the rest of the "reasonable" cop outs from actually fixing
    the problem.

    We need public more efficient public transportation, fewer private
    cars, lower the speed limits, improve the efficiency of IC engines,
    etc. -- all plain common sense. Carbon credits are just as unreal
    and insane as crypto currencies.

    dk

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  • From raymond.hallbear1@gmail.com@21:1/5 to Andy Evans on Wed Nov 23 14:16:21 2022
    On Wednesday, 23 November 2022 at 22:59:25 UTC+11, Andy Evans wrote:
    On Wednesday, 23 November 2022 at 01:16:27 UTC, Frank Berger wrote:
    There is always a trade-off between the present and the future. If a person or government had decided that it was appropriate to reduce the present standard of living by x% in order to ameliorate the effects of global warming in the future, it is
    reasonable to change that decision if bombs start raining down.
    It's reasonable to delay action because of voters who insist on their creature comforts, because of wars, because of heavy investment in fossil fuels, because we need nice warm houses, because, because, because........

    None of this fixes the emissions which are poisoning the planet. Reasonable thinking has failed and will continue to fail. We need new thinking and an end to "reasonable" excuses, carbon trading and all the rest of the "reasonable" cop outs from
    actually fixing the problem.

    Pigs will fly before commonsense and real concern prevails.

    Ray Hall, Taree

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  • From Dan Koren@21:1/5 to raymond....@gmail.com on Wed Nov 23 16:00:40 2022
    On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 2:16:24 PM UTC-8, raymond....@gmail.com wrote:

    Pigs will fly before commonsense
    and real concern prevails.

    One clearly needs to offer pigs better
    incentives to fly. We should all admit
    the world is not treating pigs kindly,
    except when they are in government.

    dk

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  • From Frank Berger@21:1/5 to Andy Evans on Thu Nov 24 14:26:49 2022
    On 11/23/2022 6:59 AM, Andy Evans wrote:
    On Wednesday, 23 November 2022 at 01:16:27 UTC, Frank Berger wrote:
    There is always a trade-off between the present and the future. If a person or government had decided that it was appropriate to reduce the present standard of living by x% in order to ameliorate the effects of global warming in the future, it is
    reasonable to change that decision if bombs start raining down.

    It's reasonable to delay action because of voters who insist on their creature comforts, because of wars, because of heavy investment in fossil fuels, because we need nice warm houses, because, because, because........

    None of this fixes the emissions which are poisoning the planet. Reasonable thinking has failed and will continue to fail. We need new thinking and an end to "reasonable" excuses, carbon trading and all the rest of the "reasonable" cop outs from
    actually fixing the problem.

    "I sit on a man's back, choking him and making him carry me, and yet assure myself and others that I am very sorry for him and wish to ease his lot by all possible means -- except by getting off his back." Tolstoy


    Have you defaced any art treasures lately, Andy? Or glued yourself to a runway? What are you waiting for?

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  • From Andy Evans@21:1/5 to Frank Berger on Thu Nov 24 14:44:17 2022
    On Thursday, 24 November 2022 at 19:26:58 UTC, Frank Berger wrote:

    Have you defaced any art treasures lately, Andy? Or glued yourself to a runway? What are you waiting for?

    I have the greatest respect for climate activists.

    You seem to think this is all a joke in whatever world your head lives in.

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  • From Manypeopletrytosee99@21:1/5 to Andy Evans on Thu Nov 24 19:11:15 2022
    On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 12:08:59 AM UTC+10:30, Andy Evans wrote:
    Rubbish, of course.

    Climate change is more important than wars anyway.

    Ok I guess we can just end all aid to Ukraine then ..........
    And focus everything on this predicted end of the world scenario that never comes.
    First we had Armageddon in 400 A.D, Nostrodamus in 1550, Malthus in 1800, Global cooling in 1970, and Global warming in 1990 and 42 failed end of world predictions for the year 2000.
    What crap is next?

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  • From Frank Berger@21:1/5 to Andy Evans on Fri Nov 25 00:16:48 2022
    On 11/24/2022 5:44 PM, Andy Evans wrote:
    On Thursday, 24 November 2022 at 19:26:58 UTC, Frank Berger wrote:

    Have you defaced any art treasures lately, Andy? Or glued yourself to a runway? What are you waiting for?

    I have the greatest respect for climate activists.

    You seem to think this is all a joke in whatever world your head lives in.

    I certainly don't think defacing precious works of hart or even gluing yourself to a runway is at all humorous.

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  • From Andy Evans@21:1/5 to All on Fri Nov 25 01:00:47 2022
    On Friday, 25 November 2022 at 03:11:18 UTC, Manypeopletrytosee99 wrote:

    Climate change is more important than wars anyway.
    Ok I guess we can just end all aid to Ukraine then ..........
    And focus everything on this predicted end of the world scenario that never comes.
    First we had Armageddon in 400 A.D, Nostrodamus in 1550, Malthus in 1800, Global cooling in 1970, and Global warming in 1990 and 42 failed end of world predictions for the year 2000.
    What crap is next?

    Who is this idiot? Never seen his posts before but we can add him to the list of brainless climate sceptics who don't even understand the simplest and most basic things about science.

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  • From Andy Evans@21:1/5 to Frank Berger on Fri Nov 25 01:07:42 2022
    On Friday, 25 November 2022 at 05:16:54 UTC, Frank Berger wrote:

    You seem to think this is all a joke in whatever world your head lives in.
    I certainly don't think defacing precious works of hart or even gluing yourself to a runway is at all humorous.

    So now you think gluing yourself to a runway is a more serious offence than destroying the world's climate?

    Let's face it Frank, you have absolutely nothing of any value to say about climate change. What is the point of adding all these trivialities - does it make you feel inside your head that your views have any kind of weight? Is there some kind of inner
    satisfaction in the idea that someone, somewhere in the universe, will think you're a smart guy who has got all this right.......?

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  • From Frank Berger@21:1/5 to Andy Evans on Fri Nov 25 08:21:33 2022
    On 11/25/2022 4:07 AM, Andy Evans wrote:
    On Friday, 25 November 2022 at 05:16:54 UTC, Frank Berger wrote:

    You seem to think this is all a joke in whatever world your head lives in. >> I certainly don't think defacing precious works of hart or even gluing yourself to a runway is at all humorous.

    So now you think gluing yourself to a runway is a more serious offence than destroying the world's climate?

    I didn't say that.


    Let's face it Frank, you have absolutely nothing of any value to say about climate change. What is the point of adding all these trivialities - does it make you feel inside your head that your views have any kind of weight? Is there some kind of inner
    satisfaction in the idea that someone, somewhere in the universe, will think you're a smart guy who has got all this right.......?

    Back at you.

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