• Emerick On John's Personality Change In 1967

    From Norbert@21:1/5 to All on Fri Aug 16 15:59:37 2024
    "By now [1967, after 'Lucy In the Sky' was finished], it was evident
    that John's personality was changing. Instead of being opinionated
    about everything, he was becoming complacent; in fact, he seemed quite
    content to have someone else do his thinking for him, even when he was
    working on one of his own songs. By the spring of 1967, he was becoming increasingly disengaged, and that would more or less continue until the
    end of the Beatles' career."

    -- Geoff Emerick, quoted from Here, There, and Everywhere

    I've personally seen this happen to people too many times. I've had acquaintances fry their minds on dope and metamorphose into
    Trump-mimicking Q-Anon freaks. I had a neighbor go senile and start
    boasting about his days in the Army battling the South Koreans. I've
    witnessed people joining cults and allowing fellow crackpots tell them
    how to spend money and mistreat family members.

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  • From pamina58@21:1/5 to All on Sun Aug 18 19:09:34 2024
    Let's see...
    We have Yoko as John
    and
    Paul as John
    and now we also have
    Norbert as John's shrink...:-)

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  • From Norbert@21:1/5 to All on Sun Aug 18 19:21:37 2024
    I quoted Emerick, who was a direct witness to the changes in Lennon's
    behavior.

    Since you want to get personal, in fact I have studied some psychology
    and psychiatry. However, one doesn't need any expertise to be aware of
    the harmful effects of "eating acid like candy," which is how John
    described his overindulgence of the drug.

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  • From pamina58@21:1/5 to All on Mon Aug 19 18:32:47 2024
    In addition, I wouldn't be surprised if May was also causing John to
    ingest substances of some sort without his knowledge or permission, as
    part of her deal with Yoko. I think that is why John was not allowed to
    be alone. He had to have a minder with him at all times; otherwise
    Yoko's carefully constructed torture to keep John would have fallen
    apart...

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  • From pamina58@21:1/5 to All on Mon Aug 19 18:29:31 2024
    I think your opinion falls prey to the fallacy of false alternatives.
    Yoko had already sunk her fangs into John by that time. I think she was
    causing him to consume toxic substances of some sort without his
    knowledge or permission, designed to keep him submissive. What Emerick
    said could be evidence of this...

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  • From Norbert@21:1/5 to All on Mon Aug 19 20:13:03 2024
    No, John's "eating acid like candy" preceded Yoko and made him
    susceptible to such predators, who also included "Magic" Alex Mardas and
    the Maharishi.

    Yoko turned Lennon into a junkie, I'll agree to that.

    Creepily, they John and Yoko became smack addicts again almost as soon
    as John returned to the Dakota after his years with May. It's as if
    they couldn't stand each other sober.

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  • From Norbert@21:1/5 to All on Mon Aug 19 20:15:35 2024
    No, May frowned upon John's use of hard drugs and liquor. She'd chide
    him when catching him slip a flask of vodka into his pocket for the
    Spector sessions, and he'd sneak into another room to do cocaine.

    Just look at Lennon-with-May versus John-and-Yoko. The former was 100% healthier-looking.

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  • From Geoff@21:1/5 to All on Tue Aug 20 21:38:30 2024
    On 20/08/2024 6:32 am, pamina58 wrote:
    In addition, I wouldn't be surprised if May was also causing John to
    ingest substances of some sort without his knowledge or permission, as
    part of her deal with Yoko.  I think that is why John was not allowed to
    be alone. He had to have a minder with him at all times; otherwise
    Yoko's carefully constructed torture to keep John would have fallen
    apart...


    Yes, John was just an innocent gullible victim ? Yeah right....

    geoff

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  • From pamina58@21:1/5 to All on Tue Aug 20 12:03:19 2024
    My point is that I don't think Yoko would have let May spend a day alone
    with John unless she had extracted from May a promise that she would
    continue to cause John to consume substances without his knowledge or permission in order to keep him submissive...

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  • From pamina58@21:1/5 to All on Tue Aug 20 12:09:15 2024
    I see John as a victim. I see the cover-up of what was really happening
    as "blame the victim"...

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  • From Norbert@21:1/5 to All on Tue Aug 20 12:31:21 2024
    Where do you get these paranoid notions about Lennon?

    I think May was a good person who wanted John to be healthy and active.

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  • From pamina58@21:1/5 to All on Wed Aug 21 10:10:30 2024
    It seems you may be attempting to whitewash May's role as John's minder,
    per Yoko's instructions, which very likely could have included causing
    John to continue to consume substances without his knowledge or
    permission designed to keep him submissive...

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  • From Norbert@21:1/5 to All on Wed Aug 21 10:31:30 2024
    You're overstating Yoko's control over May. In her book, May describes numerous phone calls she received from an enraged Ono. These occurred
    after the Troubadour incidents -- and after Lennon evinced knowledge of
    Yoko's intimacy with David Spiozza.

    If Yoko's control over May were as total as you suppose, why did May
    write her memoir? The book had Yoko insane with anger. Indeed, Yoko
    sent Mintz out to make the stupid claim that he had "documentary
    evidence" that everything in the book was false.

    (Needless to say, Mintz never divulged a single document, and as time
    went on, he acknowledged the truth of many o May's accounts.)

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  • From Geoff@21:1/5 to All on Thu Aug 22 09:59:45 2024
    On 21/08/2024 10:10 pm, pamina58 wrote:
    It seems you may be attempting to whitewash May's role as John's minder,
    per Yoko's instructions, which very likely could have included causing
    John to continue to consume substances without his knowledge or
    permission designed to keep him submissive...


    "Without his knowledge"!

    What planet are you on ? He was a conscious and wilful drug abuser.

    geoff

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  • From pamina58@21:1/5 to All on Thu Aug 22 17:45:46 2024
    How do we know which came first, the chicken or the egg? John could have
    been caused to ingest substances without his knowledge or permission
    even before he turned to drugs.

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  • From pamina58@21:1/5 to All on Thu Aug 22 17:26:15 2024
    May documents John's rages when she was his minder. I think that may
    show that he at some level may have understood to some extent that she
    had also betrayed him.

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  • From Norbert@21:1/5 to All on Thu Aug 22 21:04:49 2024
    I'm not sure if I'm following, but you seem to be saying that John's
    rages were caused by his knowledge that *May* had betrayed him? Yoko's
    jumping into bed with multiple other guys; May is utterly faithful to
    him; and you think the rages were directed at May?

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  • From pamina58@21:1/5 to All on Fri Aug 23 18:14:22 2024
    Yes, that even May was a part of the betrayal...

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  • From Norbert@21:1/5 to All on Fri Aug 23 18:52:48 2024
    No, I don't buy it. May encouraged John's social and artistic lives --
    the last thing Ono wanted.

    In fact, with May's companionship, John created the best of his
    post-Beatles work (W&B) and attained his first #1 selling single and
    album.

    John was off the heroin and methadone when with May.

    And -- there's the clincher -- May was encouraging John to be friends
    with McCartney again. That was the last thing Ono wanted. Indeed, the prospect of Lennon and Ono working together, which had become a
    possibility, what with John and May's plans to meet with McCartney in
    the studio in New Orleans -- is what droe Ono to physically intervene
    and become pregnant by John.

    Lennon's life with May was in stark contrast to what it was under the controlling, narcissistic Yoko.

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  • From pamina58@21:1/5 to All on Sun Aug 25 19:34:53 2024
    I see May and Yoko as good cop, bad cop...

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  • From Norbert@21:1/5 to All on Sun Aug 25 19:48:21 2024
    They were not working in concert. Lennon's music was his life. When he
    was with May, his work thrived; when he returned to Yoko, it ceased.
    And he returned to heroin.

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  • From pamina58@21:1/5 to All on Mon Aug 26 17:57:02 2024
    I think the goal of May and Yoko as his minders was to cheat John out of
    his original destiny.

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  • From pamina58@21:1/5 to All on Fri Aug 30 18:02:00 2024
    Fortunately, Mozart was able to take into account the shenanigens of
    May, Yoko and any others who might have been involved...

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