I retract my question about McCartney's claim about
the song being in part about the civil rights movement.
I came across an older quote in which he says, "I had in
mind a black woman rather than a bird."
I didn't think it *was* about any major social issue and
was skeptical, at first, about McCartney's response to
Beyonce's version of the song. Then I found an older
quote from Paul that supported it.
I think a lot of the Beatles' songs aren't particularly
about anything -- and I agree, that's fine. However, if a
songwriter wants to tackle an issue, that could be great,
too, especially if it's done well as with "Blackbird."
And I only like songs that deal with social issues
if they're good songs -- say, Gordon Lightfoot's "The
Patriot's Dream" which dealt with the Vietnam War --
and if it's a cause I believe in.
Lennon and Ono dealt with real causes all over Sometime
In New York City, but the songs were beyond bad and those
were nutcase fringe causes. It's the worst album ever
by a former Beatle -- unless you count John and Yoko's
other collaborationa.
On 2024-04-05, Norbert <nyarlathotep1@hotmail.com> wrote:
I didn't think it *was* about any major social issue and
was skeptical, at first, about McCartney's response to
Beyonce's version of the song. Then I found an older
quote from Paul that supported it.
I think a lot of the Beatles' songs aren't particularly
about anything -- and I agree, that's fine. However, if a
songwriter wants to tackle an issue, that could be great,
too, especially if it's done well as with "Blackbird."
My admittedly over the top response was more to "moderns"
hell-bent on hijacking something already amazing into the more
purely conceptual space of "Aboutness", as though the rest of us
somehow missed The Real Value, which new enlightenment/wokeness
predictably devolves further into shaming/canceling those who
don't acknowledge said "Aboutness" as though the actual - if
not *only* - value.
Example:
"There goes 'oldernow' again, being insensitive to the plight of
black girls by ignoring that Higher Truth in order to *merely*
praise the song/arrangement/lyrics/recording!"
I swear said slope is getting slipperier by the instant.
Then again, the wife and I are currently plagued by some respiratory
bug, so it could be the illness talking....
On 6/04/2024 8:48 am, oldernow wrote:
On 2024-04-05, Norbert <nyarlathotep1@hotmail.com> wrote:
I didn't think it *was* about any major social issue and
was skeptical, at first, about McCartney's response to
Beyonce's version of the song. Then I found an older
quote from Paul that supported it.
I think a lot of the Beatles' songs aren't particularly
about anything -- and I agree, that's fine. However, if a
songwriter wants to tackle an issue, that could be great,
too, especially if it's done well as with "Blackbird."
My admittedly over the top response was more to "moderns"
hell-bent on hijacking something already amazing into the more
purely conceptual space of "Aboutness", as though the rest of us
somehow missed The Real Value, which new enlightenment/wokeness
predictably devolves further into shaming/canceling those who
don't acknowledge said "Aboutness" as though the actual - if
not *only* - value.
Example:
"There goes 'oldernow' again, being insensitive to the plight of
black girls by ignoring that Higher Truth in order to *merely*
praise the song/arrangement/lyrics/recording!"
I swear said slope is getting slipperier by the instant.
Then again, the wife and I are currently plagued by some respiratory
bug, so it could be the illness talking....
Al contraire - so much these days would appear to be about nothing at
all,or about trivial shit.
As opposed to 'then', when music typically actually was 'about'
something - although this may have gone over the heads of some at the
time ....
On 2024-04-05, geoff <geoff@nospamgeoffwood.org> wrote:
On 6/04/2024 8:48 am, oldernow wrote:
On 2024-04-05, Norbert <nyarlathotep1@hotmail.com> wrote:
I didn't think it *was* about any major social issue and
was skeptical, at first, about McCartney's response to
Beyonce's version of the song. Then I found an older
quote from Paul that supported it.
I think a lot of the Beatles' songs aren't particularly
about anything -- and I agree, that's fine. However, if a
songwriter wants to tackle an issue, that could be great,
too, especially if it's done well as with "Blackbird."
My admittedly over the top response was more to "moderns"
hell-bent on hijacking something already amazing into the more
purely conceptual space of "Aboutness", as though the rest of us
somehow missed The Real Value, which new enlightenment/wokeness
predictably devolves further into shaming/canceling those who
don't acknowledge said "Aboutness" as though the actual - if
not *only* - value.
Example:
"There goes 'oldernow' again, being insensitive to the plight of
black girls by ignoring that Higher Truth in order to *merely*
praise the song/arrangement/lyrics/recording!"
I swear said slope is getting slipperier by the instant.
Then again, the wife and I are currently plagued by some respiratory
bug, so it could be the illness talking....
Al contraire - so much these days would appear to be about nothing at
all,or about trivial shit.
Well, and then there's that. :-)
I don't know how to rewrite what I did to address what I was feeling
at the time *and* what you're pointing out, which I don't disagree
with. But I'll try some meandering, and maybe I chance upon it:
I think part of what I was getting at was that I've tended to be more
into the music than the meaning of any lyrics. But that's not to say
I don't adore the *words* comprising the lyrics. However, for me the important aspects of the words are more their pronunciation, syllable metering, and musical notes underlying the vocalizing thereof.
Take "Help!", for example. Fantastic lyrics. And yet none of them
give me the kind of chills/goosebumps that the first "When" does.
The power of that "When" for me isn't what 'when' means: it's the
sound of the word, how it's vocally attacked, whatever musical note
is underlying it relative to its surroundings, and that it's a single
brief - yet sustained so exquisitely long - syllable sandwiched
between that wonderful descending guitar thing, and my all-time
favorite vocalist's voice entering the soundscape squarely in its
zone that's always moved/spoken to me - that voice itself.
Does that make any sense?
As opposed to 'then', when music typically actually was 'about'
something - although this may have gone over the heads of some at the
time ....
My take is music is no doubt about something ("meaning of lyrics"
sense) to those who need it to be about something, starting with
the composer. And that's fine. It's just that any aboutness simply
hasn't typically added much to my joy over/with songs.
Another example: the harmony and duration of the sustain of the
final "yeah" in "She Loves You" reaches much more deeply into
me than whatever the song is about, whatever it meant to others,
to history, etc.
Of *course* I've chanced upon all such analysis of such over the
years, but whereas such tends toward 'tl;dr', the sound of that
word presented by their voices at that moment in the song still
drops my jaw involuntarily.
oldernow wrote:
On 2024-04-05, geoff <geoff@nospamgeoffwood.org> wrote:
Al contraire - so much these days would appear to be about nothing at
all,or about trivial shit.
Well, and then there's that. :-)
I don't know how to rewrite what I did to address what I was feeling
at the time *and* what you're pointing out, which I don't disagree
with. But I'll try some meandering, and maybe I chance upon it:
I think part of what I was getting at was that I've tended to be more
into the music than the meaning of any lyrics. But that's not to say
I don't adore the *words* comprising the lyrics. However, for me the
important aspects of the words are more their pronunciation, syllable
metering, and musical notes underlying the vocalizing thereof.
Take "Help!", for example. Fantastic lyrics. And yet none of them
give me the kind of chills/goosebumps that the first "When" does.
The power of that "When" for me isn't what 'when' means: it's the
sound of the word, how it's vocally attacked, whatever musical note
is underlying it relative to its surroundings, and that it's a single
brief - yet sustained so exquisitely long - syllable sandwiched
between that wonderful descending guitar thing, and my all-time
favorite vocalist's voice entering the soundscape squarely in its
zone that's always moved/spoken to me - that voice itself.
Does that make any sense?
As opposed to 'then', when music typically actually was 'about'
something - although this may have gone over the heads of some at the
time ....
My take is music is no doubt about something ("meaning of lyrics"
sense) to those who need it to be about something, starting with
the composer. And that's fine. It's just that any aboutness simply
hasn't typically added much to my joy over/with songs.
Another example: the harmony and duration of the sustain of the
final "yeah" in "She Loves You" reaches much more deeply into
me than whatever the song is about, whatever it meant to others,
to history, etc.
Of *course* I've chanced upon all such analysis of such over the
years, but whereas such tends toward 'tl;dr', the sound of that
word presented by their voices at that moment in the song still
drops my jaw involuntarily.
Great post.
I'm like 95% with you here. In my case I have no interest
at all in what the words are supposed to mean. They are
only important phonetically. The little bit I differ with
you is that you mentioned that "Help" had great lyrics. I
have no idea if the lyrics are good because I've never
been interested in figuring out what they are supposed to
be saying.
I have no idea what most of my favorite songs are
about. Never cared to examine that. If I want somebody's
opinion about social issues or about other aspects of life,
I wouldn't ask some musician. I may as well ask my plumber
before I ask John Lennon, or Bob Dylan.
I once put "St. James Infirmary" by Bobby Bland on a
playlist I was making for having sex too, thinking that
it was something romantic. My girlfriend had to tell me
that it's about a guy going down to the clinic because he
got VD from his woman.
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