On Saturday, January 9, 1999 at 2:00:00 AM UTC-6, Theron Kousek wrote:

Ok, ok. I suspect I will get many disagreements here. Between a few friends and I, we have had discussions about what 2 neo-prog bands we like better between Marillion or IQ. There are many other neo prog bands but we're just comparing Marillion and IQ. My one friend likes Marillion because he says Fish rules and his lyrics are great. My other friend likes Marillion better because their music is more mainstream. I do agree that Fish-era Marillion has very strong lyrics and Fish is definitely a good
lyric man.

I want to say that I hope noone takes this personally, especially if they're a big Marillion fan. I respect everyone's opinion and I am NOT attacking anyone personally by expressing my opinion. By the same token, if someone wants to reply by saying the complete opposite of what I say, I will totally respect their decision too. Guess what I am asking is for Marillion fans
to NOT take this personally.

Personally, I prefer IQ much more over Marillion. I have "Tales from Lush Attic", "The Wake", "Ever" and "Subterranea" from IQ and "Script for a Jesters Tear", "Fugazi", "Misplaced Childhood", and "Clutching" and "Brave" from Marillion. Other than just a few songs across all Marillion albums(like the title track "Script for a Jesters Tear", "She Chameleon",etc..), their albums really don't do much for me as I think they follow too "bland" and homogenous of a musical formula and don't go off into adventerous musical overatures. "Misplaced Childhood", in my opinion, is an example of an album that was overkill and falls short of being the
classic everyone says it is. I find it quite overrated. IQ, on the
other hand, seems to be more adventurous in their musical compositions and their song structures are much more complex than Marillion. Marillion is not capable of doing a track like "The Narrow Margin" or "Further Away" or "The Last Human Gateway" or I also prefer the keyboards of IQ over
Marillion. As good as everyone tells me Marillion is, I just think they
are an "ok" neo prog band but do not match up to the big stars (like
Genesis, ELP, Le Orme, Yes, Banco, etc...). I have tried on numerous occasions to TRY get into the Hogarth Marillion-era but I simply cannot as the music tends to be dull and it sounds too poppish. There's just too
much other good music out there for me to want to spend anymore time listening to Hogarth/Marillion. IQ has made a strong effort in the past
4-5 years to be more progressive than Marillion with their "Ever" and "Subterranea" and "Seven Stories into 98" albums...

I hope I have not offended any Marillion fans, but I do prefer IQ (the
albums with which Nicholls is at the healm) 10 times over that of Marillion. Although I am not going to come out and say IQ belongs right up there with bands like Yes, Genesis, ELP, etc... I will say I think their music sounds much more complex and progressive than Marillion's and I enjoy it
alot more. It's hard to put a finger on it. I get bored when I listen to Marillion but do not get bored when I listen to IQ because I find their
music very interesting and challenging in spots. I can sit down and listen to "Subterranea" from beginning to end but can only listen to 1 or 2 songs from "Script from a Jester's Tear", etc... And when I listen to "Grendel", I wonder if I am listening to an attempted 17 minute remake of "Supper's Ready" with different lyrics. The last 7 minutes of that song practically mirrors the last 7 minutes of "Supper's Ready" prior to the church bell chimes kicking in.

However, when looking at popularity polls, etc..., it seems that Marillion tends to outsell IQ and outdraw IQ at concerts. However, popularity does not mean better quality. I am sure Kenny G concerts would sell out faster than a Flower Kings concert.

Anyone else care to share their opinions on IQ .vs. Marillion?

I guess I get a little tired when I hear everyone say how great Marillion is(including my 2 friends) when I fail to see what all the fascination is about. I do think "Sunsets on Empire" by Fish is good, if not perhaps better than any Marillion album I own but still not as adventurous or bold
as the IQ albums I own.

In defense of Marillion though, I would rather listen to anything by Marillion than practically anything from today's top 40 or any country radio station or any soft rock station, etc... So I am not saying Marillion is unlistenable. I still listen to my Marillion albums every once in a while but I tend to listen to the IQ one's much more.

thanks in advance for not being offended and being willing to add your opinion,

Presuming we're regarding exclusively the old IQ and Marillion?

Though I'm somewhat biased (as I really dig what IQ eventually became--and have a firm grasp on how their early work naturally led up to their later evolutionary results), I (as a composer myself) am well aware of the compositional wit that IQ outdid
Marillion by.

Though both bands had their share of shortcomings in the beginning, Marillion definitely fucked up with their straight ripoff of supper's ready. (I think it's obvious that IQ intentionally mocked this, by ripping off a riff from Marillion's debut on
their debut--that's cool and respectable.)

On the other hand, Marillion's Fugazi was an underrated concept album that I personally think deserves being considered their real "classic" (rather than misplaced childhood). When you pay attention to the compositional cleverness of fugazi, you will
hear the merit it deserves. Most people aren't really listening.

Once you get past the preliminary stages however (and consider what IQ has done after Peter rejoined), the ball is clearly sitting in IQ's court. From ever to the road of bones (with the exception of the full-of-cheese/GTR-sounding/Asia-sounding album
frequency), IQ has proven to be the group with the fully realized vision of being a "different/well-stylized" band. I agree that script & childhood had too many cliche/bland chord changes indeed. But Fugazi I argue was at least up there enough to earn
them similar respects.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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On Monday, October 12, 2015 at 9:51:04 AM UTC-4, cr8...@gmail.com wrote:

On Saturday, January 9, 1999 at 2:00:00 AM UTC-6, Theron Kousek wrote:

Ok, ok. I suspect I will get many disagreements here. Between a few friends and I, we have had discussions about what 2 neo-prog bands we like better between Marillion or IQ. There are many other neo prog bands but we're just comparing Marillion and IQ. My one friend likes Marillion because he says Fish rules and his lyrics are great. My other friend likes
Marillion better because their music is more mainstream. I do agree that Fish-era Marillion has very strong lyrics and Fish is definitely a good lyric man.

I want to say that I hope noone takes this personally, especially if they're
a big Marillion fan. I respect everyone's opinion and I am NOT attacking anyone personally by expressing my opinion. By the same token, if someone wants to reply by saying the complete opposite of what I say, I will totally
respect their decision too. Guess what I am asking is for Marillion fans to NOT take this personally.

Personally, I prefer IQ much more over Marillion. I have "Tales from Lush Attic", "The Wake", "Ever" and "Subterranea" from IQ and "Script for a Jesters Tear", "Fugazi", "Misplaced Childhood", and "Clutching" and "Brave" from Marillion. Other than just a few songs across all Marillion albums(like the title track "Script for a Jesters Tear", "She Chameleon",etc..), their albums really don't do much for me as I think they follow too "bland" and homogenous of a musical formula and don't go off into
adventerous musical overatures. "Misplaced Childhood", in my opinion, is an example of an album that was overkill and falls short of being the classic everyone says it is. I find it quite overrated. IQ, on the other hand, seems to be more adventurous in their musical compositions and their song structures are much more complex than Marillion. Marillion is not capable of doing a track like "The Narrow Margin" or "Further Away" or "The Last Human Gateway" or I also prefer the keyboards of IQ over Marillion. As good as everyone tells me Marillion is, I just think they are an "ok" neo prog band but do not match up to the big stars (like Genesis, ELP, Le Orme, Yes, Banco, etc...). I have tried on numerous occasions to TRY get into the Hogarth Marillion-era but I simply cannot as the music tends to be dull and it sounds too poppish. There's just too much other good music out there for me to want to spend anymore time listening to Hogarth/Marillion. IQ has made a strong effort in the past 4-5 years to be more progressive than Marillion with their "Ever" and "Subterranea" and "Seven Stories into 98" albums...

I hope I have not offended any Marillion fans, but I do prefer IQ (the albums with which Nicholls is at the healm) 10 times over that of Marillion.
Although I am not going to come out and say IQ belongs right up there with bands like Yes, Genesis, ELP, etc... I will say I think their music sounds much more complex and progressive than Marillion's and I enjoy it alot more. It's hard to put a finger on it. I get bored when I listen to
Marillion but do not get bored when I listen to IQ because I find their music very interesting and challenging in spots. I can sit down and listen
to "Subterranea" from beginning to end but can only listen to 1 or 2 songs from "Script from a Jester's Tear", etc... And when I listen to "Grendel",
I wonder if I am listening to an attempted 17 minute remake of "Supper's Ready" with different lyrics. The last 7 minutes of that song practically mirrors the last 7 minutes of "Supper's Ready" prior to the church bell chimes kicking in.

However, when looking at popularity polls, etc..., it seems that Marillion tends to outsell IQ and outdraw IQ at concerts. However, popularity does not mean better quality. I am sure Kenny G concerts would sell out faster than a Flower Kings concert.

Anyone else care to share their opinions on IQ .vs. Marillion?

I guess I get a little tired when I hear everyone say how great Marillion is(including my 2 friends) when I fail to see what all the fascination is about. I do think "Sunsets on Empire" by Fish is good, if not perhaps better than any Marillion album I own but still not as adventurous or bold as the IQ albums I own.

In defense of Marillion though, I would rather listen to anything by Marillion than practically anything from today's top 40 or any country radio
station or any soft rock station, etc... So I am not saying Marillion is unlistenable. I still listen to my Marillion albums every once in a while but I tend to listen to the IQ one's much more.

thanks in advance for not being offended and being willing to add your opinion,

Presuming we're regarding exclusively the old IQ and Marillion?

Though I'm somewhat biased (as I really dig what IQ eventually became--and have a firm grasp on how their early work naturally led up to their later evolutionary results), I (as a composer myself) am well aware of the compositional wit that IQ outdid

Marillion by.

Though both bands had their share of shortcomings in the beginning, Marillion definitely fucked up with their straight ripoff of supper's ready. (I think it's obvious that IQ intentionally mocked this, by ripping off a riff from Marillion's debut on

their debut--that's cool and respectable.)

On the other hand, Marillion's Fugazi was an underrated concept album that I personally think deserves being considered their real "classic" (rather than misplaced childhood). When you pay attention to the compositional cleverness of fugazi, you will

hear the merit it deserves. Most people aren't really listening.

Once you get past the preliminary stages however (and consider what IQ has done after Peter rejoined), the ball is clearly sitting in IQ's court. From ever to the road of bones (with the exception of the full-of-cheese/GTR-sounding/Asia-sounding album

frequency), IQ has proven to be the group with the fully realized vision of being a "different/well-stylized" band. I agree that script & childhood had too many cliche/bland chord changes indeed. But Fugazi I argue was at least up there enough to earn
them similar respects.

I'll finally be seeing Marillion in the fall. I actually prefer IQ also. However, I think Marillion deserves a lot of credit for their helping to keep prog alive during tough times as well as their innovations in crowdfunding. They were doing that before
anyone even heard of the term. I actually prefer Hogarth over FIsh but both are great singers.

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I prefer IQ too, because I don't like vocals of Fish, i.e. his vocal manner. "Subterranea" and "The Seventh House" are more listenable than any Marillion's work. This text from "The Seventh House", in my horrible opinion, is very great: "Cathedral that
man created, You're weighted down by a jealous sound, Bewildered and dislocated, Your soul deflated and gone to ground, Nobody, no final direction, no way to connect in this heavier state, The lives that we never remember are heading us out to another
mistake". And I can listen "Subterranea" many-many times at a stretch.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)