not too much different goes on here for gardening at this
time of the year.
daydreaming of spring, planning what to plent,
getting ready for a seed swap coming up towards
the end of February and thinking about what
projects i might be lucky enough to finish.
some spots i can do some more reclaiming the
garden space from grasses that have taken over.
that would be nice to have back as garden for
growing more beans and squash but the deer can
get at it so without a fence it's hard to
justify the amount of work it takes. i may do
it anyways. we'll see how that goes when the
time gets nearer. :)
any plans there for this coming gardening
season? it is mostly looking like the normal
routine here and i'm quite ok with that!
i was thinking
about getting some nice 15 inch heavy glazed ceramic pots, but dayum,
they're $100 each. now i gotta decide if there's pros and cons to resin
vs ceramic pots.
in the mean time, will just keep putting coffee grounds and used loose
tea in the flower barrels and walking kitchen scraps back to the frozen compost piles.
not too much different goes on here for gardening at this
time of the year.
daydreaming of spring,
any plans there for this coming gardening
season? it is mostly looking like the normal
routine here and i'm quite ok with that!
That's what I really need to get on doing. I used to keep coffee
grounds, egg shells, etc... but I hardly think of it, now. I'd like to fasten a rain barrel on the corner of my house nearest the garden, also.
On 1/11/2023 9:49, songbird wrote:...
any plans there for this coming gardening
season? it is mostly looking like the normal
routine here and i'm quite ok with that!
I had a rather small vegetable garden along the side of my hill the last
two years, right at the top, and it's always been difficult to tend
it... especially trying to get footing while I turn soil over with my
old belt-driven rototiller... plus the bricks to keep the dirt from
washing down. I live on a fairly steep city lot. I think I might plant
a few flowers (I have dahlia tubers, etc.) there this year, and move the vegetables elsewhere.
There is a flat spot lower on my lot, about the same size (maybe 3 feet
wide by 18-20 feet long), where I can easily walk along a wide stone retaining wall to tend the garden. I might take Sheldon's (RFC)
suggestion and make a raised bed out of it. Grandpap lived through the depression, and they planted a lot... he strictly advised starting to
turn the soil over in late February, as soon as it isn't frozen... we're gaining on that time fast (eastern Ohio). I do have a few tree limbs to
cut to take full advantage of the southern exposure.
chicken wire is just not strong enough to last very long
in the ground. it will rust through within a few years.
if you're going to do it use a larger gauge wire.
On 1/13/2023 11:59, fos@sdf.org wrote:
i was thinking
about getting some nice 15 inch heavy glazed ceramic pots, but dayum,
they're $100 each. now i gotta decide if there's pros and cons to resin
vs ceramic pots.
Shop second hand stores, flea markets, etc. I work at the local antique mall, and some dealers pick up those big ceramic pots at auction, and
sell them really cheap in my neck of the woods. I've picked them up for
well under $20/ea. sometimes.
in the mean time, will just keep putting coffee grounds and used loose
tea in the flower barrels and walking kitchen scraps back to the frozen
compost piles.
That's what I really need to get on doing. I used to keep coffee
grounds, egg shells, etc... but I hardly think of it, now. I'd like to fasten a rain barrel on the corner of my house nearest the garden, also.
On 2023-01-14, Michael Trew<michael.trew@att.net> wrote:
On 1/13/2023 11:59, fos@sdf.org wrote:
Shop second hand stores, flea markets, etc. I work at the local antique
mall, and some dealers pick up those big ceramic pots at auction, and
sell them really cheap in my neck of the woods. I've picked them up for
well under $20/ea. sometimes.
i'm not going anywhere near an antique mall with my wife who gets to
decide what style and color pots she wants. last time i was at one, in Salamanca NY, she dragged me around in there for 4 hours. it was
torture. i volunteered to go to the casino so she could browse around to
her hearts content but she was having none of that. so no. just no antique malls. lol
there is a giant flea market in a suburb of Buffalo, we will take a look there. thanks for the idea.
in the mean time, will just keep putting coffee grounds and used loose
tea in the flower barrels and walking kitchen scraps back to the frozen
compost piles.
That's what I really need to get on doing. I used to keep coffee
grounds, egg shells, etc... but I hardly think of it, now. I'd like to
fasten a rain barrel on the corner of my house nearest the garden, also.
we were putting the grounds and tea in the compost. my wife started
talking about how her late grandmother was quite the green thumb and
would be quite proud of what we've been doing.
After my post quoted above, I started putting the morning's grounds (and
egg shells) into a large zip-lock back in my freezer, until I figure out
a compost pile. Worst case, I'll just start dumping it where I turn
soil over once it's full.
i do still consider myself a gardening noob, so those are just my
thoughts and i'm quite capable of wrongthink so tread carefully. lol.
fos@sdf.org wrote:
...
i do still consider myself a gardening noob, so those are just my
thoughts and i'm quite capable of wrongthink so tread carefully. lol.
if you have room in a basement or an unfreezing and
uncooked by heat in the summer type of space you can
keep worms in buckets and they will actively help break
down any food scraps.
i'll get much closer to being self sustaining someday, Rome wasn't
built in a day.
fos@sdf.org wrote:
...
i do still consider myself a gardening noob, so those are just my
thoughts and i'm quite capable of wrongthink so tread carefully. lol.
if you have room in a basement or an unfreezing and
uncooked by heat in the summer type of space you can
keep worms in buckets and they will actively help break
down any food scraps.
it cost me all of $20 to get started and most of that
expense was buying sheer fabric (for curtains) to use
as bucket covers, but you could use old t-shirts
instead as long as they weren't holey.
for that $20 i've gotten a few hundred pounds a year
on average of reconditioned garden soil and fertilzer
that i don't spend any money on those in a normal year.
the other thing to do for free garden nutrients is
to grow some green manure crops and cut them back once
in a while and feed that to the gardens.
i have plenty of other tips from experience doing
this too. :) it's fun to learn about worms, ecology
and nature while you're at it.
songbird
That's a nifty idea; I would have never thought of it! Presumably you
only use plant type food scraps, and not any kind of meat scraps.
On 1/18/2023 12:13, songbird wrote:
fos@sdf.org wrote:
...
i do still consider myself a gardening noob, so those are just my
thoughts and i'm quite capable of wrongthink so tread carefully. lol.
if you have room in a basement or an unfreezing and
uncooked by heat in the summer type of space you can
keep worms in buckets and they will actively help break
down any food scraps.
it cost me all of $20 to get started and most of that
expense was buying sheer fabric (for curtains) to use
as bucket covers, but you could use old t-shirts
instead as long as they weren't holey.
for that $20 i've gotten a few hundred pounds a year
on average of reconditioned garden soil and fertilzer
that i don't spend any money on those in a normal year.
the other thing to do for free garden nutrients is
to grow some green manure crops and cut them back once
in a while and feed that to the gardens.
i have plenty of other tips from experience doing
this too. :) it's fun to learn about worms, ecology
and nature while you're at it.
That's a nifty idea; I would have never thought of it! Presumably you
only use plant type food scraps, and not any kind of meat scraps.
fos@sdf.org wrote:
...
i'll get much closer to being self sustaining someday, Rome wasn't
built in a day.
that's an interesting expression if you look at what Rome
did to North Africa and also the topsoil of much of Italy
and other surrounding areas... well they basically turned
a lot of area into bare rocks or desert from removing so
much organic materials (to feed the citizens of Rome, etc.).
it can happen so gradually that people don't even notice
the changes, but it can eventually add up to destruction.
On 2023-01-23, Michael Trew<michael.trew@att.net> wrote:
.
That's a nifty idea; I would have never thought of it! Presumably you
only use plant type food scraps, and not any kind of meat scraps.
i think it's a great idea too. i mentioned it to my wife and she said if
i did it in the house she's moving out. she has a fear of creatures
without legs. snakes and worms. it's a deep primal fear. even seeing
them on tv triggers her. i told her they'd be covered and wouldn't be
able to get out. doesn't matter, she'd know they are there.
if i put a greenhouse outside and heated it i could do it. but that's a
faint blip on the outer edge of the radar screen so it's unlikely to
happen anytime soon, if ever.
thanks for the history lesson, i did not know this. am going to have to
train myself to use a better expression now, but great achievements are
not accomplished overnight so it'll take some patience. ;)
i think it's a great idea too. i mentioned it to my wife and she said if
i did it in the house she's moving out. she has a fear of creatures
without legs. snakes and worms. it's a deep primal fear. even seeing
them on tv triggers her. i told her they'd be covered and wouldn't be
able to get out. doesn't matter, she'd know they are there.
if i put a greenhouse outside and heated it i could do it. but that's a
faint blip on the outer edge of the radar screen so it's unlikely to
happen anytime soon, if ever.
fos@sdf.org wrote:
...
i think it's a great idea too. i mentioned it to my wife and she said if
i did it in the house she's moving out. she has a fear of creatures
without legs. snakes and worms. it's a deep primal fear. even seeing
them on tv triggers her. i told her they'd be covered and wouldn't be
able to get out. doesn't matter, she'd know they are there.
yeah, some people are like that. do you have a spot where
you can put in an external cellar? like the side of a hill?
that is something i wish we could have here as we have no
cellar space at all. nothing good for root crop storage or
even an out-building. the water table here is so high at
times that it's pointless to consider digging anything as it
all has to be above grade, and several feet above grade is
pretty much required in case of flash floods.
the other important considerations with worm keeping is
to not introduce invasive species to your area or gardens
and if you are a fisherperson to not introduce them to the
woods or streams just in case your area already has some
unique animals you don't want to mess things up.
On 2023-01-25, songbird <songbird@anthive.com> wrote:
fos@sdf.org wrote:
...
i think it's a great idea too. i mentioned it to my wife and she said if >>> i did it in the house she's moving out. she has a fear of creatures
without legs. snakes and worms. it's a deep primal fear. even seeing
them on tv triggers her. i told her they'd be covered and wouldn't be
able to get out. doesn't matter, she'd know they are there.
yeah, some people are like that. do you have a spot where
you can put in an external cellar? like the side of a hill?
that is something i wish we could have here as we have no
cellar space at all. nothing good for root crop storage or
even an out-building. the water table here is so high at
times that it's pointless to consider digging anything as it
all has to be above grade, and several feet above grade is
pretty much required in case of flash floods.
i don't have a place for an external cellar. i have excellent drainage,
just no place to do it and it may even be against municipal ordinances.
doing it outside means in an out building with heat in the winter. i
have some very well shaded areas where they wouldn't get scorched in the summer. heat wouldn't be a big deal it seems. even in a shed i could box
off an area and use a small ceramic radiant heater. my basement is so
cool when i start seeds at the end of this month i use one in my faux greenhouse else the heat pads are nearly contently on. i keep my living
space at 63-64F, the basement is mid 50s during single digit cold snaps.
the other important considerations with worm keeping is
to not introduce invasive species to your area or gardens
and if you are a fisherperson to not introduce them to the
woods or streams just in case your area already has some
unique animals you don't want to mess things up.
i was warned about invasive (jumping) worms when i contacted the local
agri extension for sources of composted manure. when i got a load i
checked it carefully. used it in my raised beds when i built them. had
spring worms hitch a ride home in a few bags of coca shell mulch. within
days of putting the mulch down we got a heavy rain and when i went in
back to see if any of the flower plants got flattened i was greeted by zillions of them on top of the mulch. haven't seen them since though.
kind of freaked me out lol.
Michael Trew wrote:
On 1/11/2023 9:49, songbird wrote:...
any plans there for this coming gardening
season? it is mostly looking like the normal
routine here and i'm quite ok with that!
I had a rather small vegetable garden along the side of my hill the last
two years, right at the top, and it's always been difficult to tend
it... especially trying to get footing while I turn soil over with my
old belt-driven rototiller... plus the bricks to keep the dirt from
washing down. I live on a fairly steep city lot. I think I might plant
a few flowers (I have dahlia tubers, etc.) there this year, and move the
vegetables elsewhere.
yes, slopes are always a challenge. i try to plant them
with thymes and then leave them alone other than keeping
them weeded. rocks and bricks can make some interesting
contrasts and help break up any flows that might happen
during heavier downpours.
There is a flat spot lower on my lot, about the same size (maybe 3 feet
wide by 18-20 feet long), where I can easily walk along a wide stone
retaining wall to tend the garden. I might take Sheldon's (RFC)
suggestion and make a raised bed out of it. Grandpap lived through the
depression, and they planted a lot... he strictly advised starting to
turn the soil over in late February, as soon as it isn't frozen... we're
gaining on that time fast (eastern Ohio). I do have a few tree limbs to
cut to take full advantage of the southern exposure.
yeah, trees can become a challenge and they can happen
gradually enough that you don't notice it until it becomes
a bigger problem to deal with. i have some trees here that
i wanted to take out years ago but could not (i'm not the
owner). such is life...
good luck! :)
songbird
Something my dad used to say, It has been tough sledding this winter -
no snow.
[...]
any plans there for this coming gardening
season? it is mostly looking like the normal
routine here and i'm quite ok with that!
Admittedly, the wildflower gardens also feed my subversive streak a bit, since as pretty as the closeup shots you see on google are, the plants themselves also tend to look a little "weedy"; which'll give that lady
down the road all kinds of stuff to whine about on the community
facebook page.
Dan Purgert wrote:
...
Admittedly, the wildflower gardens also feed my subversive streak a bit,
since as pretty as the closeup shots you see on google are, the plants
themselves also tend to look a little "weedy"; which'll give that lady
down the road all kinds of stuff to whine about on the community
facebook page.
if you have a community regulation that says you must keep
your lawn to a certain height or less it may end up being
something that ends up with legal complaints and mowers.
[...]
carrots and potatoes are still fairly inexpensive here.
i mostly grow tomatoes, onion, garlic, squash, beans,
peppers and melons, plus all the flowers.
i generally do not recommend using wildflower seed
blends as sometimes you can introduce a real pest species
and then have to spend the next 20 years weeding. yes,
i'm speaking from experience. :(
songbird wrote:
Lawn has to be under 8" tall (wow, that's actually kinda high, come to
think of it); but there are not regulations for garden plots, beyond
"well maintained, and weed-free". I've got an outstanding enquiry with
the garden center that the plants are "dwarf" varieties (as many of the flowering plants native to the area can get to be 4 feet tall).
[...]
carrots and potatoes are still fairly inexpensive here.
i mostly grow tomatoes, onion, garlic, squash, beans,
peppers and melons, plus all the flowers.
Same here with the prices; but we've got pretty much "clay" as the
soil around here (glacial whatever it's called around the US Great
Lakes); and it is my understanding from the agriculture annex that it is "better" to use root vegetables do some of the work on the soil than
just come in and start mechanically messing it up. Also, they taste
good :)
Hopefully then next year I'll have learned enough about the available sunlight in the "vegetable garden area" that I can have some of the
"more common" things (tomatoes, cucumbers, maybe some squash, etc).
i generally do not recommend using wildflower seed
blends as sometimes you can introduce a real pest species
and then have to spend the next 20 years weeding. yes,
i'm speaking from experience. :(
As I understand the mixes I'm considering; they were developed in
conjunction with the state's department of wildlife and beekeepers / lepidopterist societies to help address our ever-growing impact on the habitats for pollinators. They're all state-native plant species, and
unlike the thistle / nettles I have now, aren't sharp!
Dan Purgert wrote:
songbird wrote:
...
Lawn has to be under 8" tall (wow, that's actually kinda high, come to
think of it); but there are not regulations for garden plots, beyond
"well maintained, and weed-free". I've got an outstanding enquiry with
the garden center that the plants are "dwarf" varieties (as many of the
flowering plants native to the area can get to be 4 feet tall).
haha, i'd like to see how they enforce "weed free" as weed
is now legal (in MI which is where i think your comments below
indicate you're at).
[...]
carrots and potatoes are still fairly inexpensive here.
i mostly grow tomatoes, onion, garlic, squash, beans,
peppers and melons, plus all the flowers.
Same here with the prices; but we've got pretty much "clay" as the
soil around here (glacial whatever it's called around the US Great
Lakes); and it is my understanding from the agriculture annex that it is
"better" to use root vegetables do some of the work on the soil than
just come in and start mechanically messing it up. Also, they taste
good :)
daikon radishes are good ones to use for that if you like
hot radishes they're also nice flowering plants. :)
carrots are likely not going to do as well in heavy soil
and you might want to avoid having to amend a large chunk
deeply by going with a raised bed over that area where you
want to grow those specific root crops.
around here fences are required.
Hopefully then next year I'll have learned enough about the available
sunlight in the "vegetable garden area" that I can have some of the
"more common" things (tomatoes, cucumbers, maybe some squash, etc).
tomatoes do well in the mostly clay soil we have here.
i'm in mid-Michigan (Saginaw River Valley floodplain).
[...]
[The wildflowers are] all state-native plant species, and
unlike the thistle / nettles I have now, aren't sharp!
good luck with those. i dig the thistles out by handsince
i don't like to spray poisons here if i can help it. the
larger purple flowering thistles are easier to deal with
than the sow thistles. but a few other weeds are much much
worse (wild grape vines, poison ivy and others).
if you happen to be local enough to where i'm at i have
plenty of plants to give away if you need any.
On 2023-03-02, songbird wrote:
Dan Purgert wrote:
songbird wrote:
...
Lawn has to be under 8" tall (wow, that's actually kinda high, come to
think of it); but there are not regulations for garden plots, beyond
"well maintained, and weed-free". I've got an outstanding enquiry with
the garden center that the plants are "dwarf" varieties (as many of the
flowering plants native to the area can get to be 4 feet tall).
haha, i'd like to see how they enforce "weed free" as weed
is now legal (in MI which is where i think your comments below
indicate you're at).
"weed" as in "undesired plants in the garden" ... like crabgrass. Not
the legal-by-state-at-the-moment kind.
Also, MI is close; but am actually in OH.
[...]
carrots and potatoes are still fairly inexpensive here.
i mostly grow tomatoes, onion, garlic, squash, beans,
peppers and melons, plus all the flowers.
Same here with the prices; but we've got pretty much "clay" as the
soil around here (glacial whatever it's called around the US Great
Lakes); and it is my understanding from the agriculture annex that it is >>> "better" to use root vegetables do some of the work on the soil than
just come in and start mechanically messing it up. Also, they taste
good :)
daikon radishes are good ones to use for that if you like
hot radishes they're also nice flowering plants. :)
Yeah, I went with the milder Cherry Belle ones and a French variety.
Daikon were sold out when I swung through the store last week; but it's
not like there isn't time before spring arrives.
carrots are likely not going to do as well in heavy soil
and you might want to avoid having to amend a large chunk
deeply by going with a raised bed over that area where you
want to grow those specific root crops.
That's sort of what I've got planned for the next couple of years, essentially work the existing earth down about 4 or 6 inches, then put
frames on top so I have about 10 inches of "less bad" soil that the
plants can work with; and expand by a frame or two annually for the next
2-3 years.
around here fences are required.
Not here. Just have to have the vegetables in the back yard; which is annoying since I get WAY more sun up front :)
Hopefully then next year I'll have learned enough about the available
sunlight in the "vegetable garden area" that I can have some of the
"more common" things (tomatoes, cucumbers, maybe some squash, etc).
tomatoes do well in the mostly clay soil we have here.
i'm in mid-Michigan (Saginaw River Valley floodplain).
Yeah, my problem is hours of sun in the available garden spot. Assuming
last year's measurements were dead on -- I've got just about 7 hours (vs
the front which is basically all day)
[...]
[The wildflowers are] all state-native plant species, and
unlike the thistle / nettles I have now, aren't sharp!
good luck with those. i dig the thistles out by handsince
i don't like to spray poisons here if i can help it. the
larger purple flowering thistles are easier to deal with
than the sow thistles. but a few other weeds are much much
worse (wild grape vines, poison ivy and others).
Yeah, they thistles are a right pain. I was pulling shoots as I found
them last summer before they really got established in the front ... but there are probably like a billion more waiting to come up. Hopefully
filling in the garden with more competition will help. Hopefully.
Poison Ivy doesn't really bother me all that much. At least not nearly
as much as Oak or Sumac (ugh, those are brutal).
if you happen to be local enough to where i'm at i have
plenty of plants to give away if you need any.
It's like a 4h trip up thataway (uhh, assuming my memory of MI is right
and it's in the general vicinity of Flint); so probably a bit on the far side. Thanks for the offer though.
Dan Purgert wrote:
Daikon were sold out when I swung through the store last week; but it's
not like there isn't time before spring arrives.
if you have a grain elevator nearby that has a store for
common seeds you can likely find radish seeds in bulk (along
with others) for few $ per lb. they are commonly used in a
mix here too for growing fields of cover crops, turnips,
radishes, etc. deer plots they are commonly called because
of what happens later.
around here fences are required.
Not here. Just have to have the vegetables in the back yard; which is
annoying since I get WAY more sun up front :)
since strawberries are a low growing plant they could maybe
be used up front as an edge plant, but they do require a bit
more work than a normal flower bed.
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