• To hot to plant?

    From T@21:1/5 to All on Tue Aug 23 09:10:05 2022
    Hi All,

    I have noticed that I am unable to get ANY seed to
    germinate if I plant it after the thrid week in May.
    That is when the freezing nights stop. (In May,
    we have 70 to 80F days and 30 to 40 F nights.)

    In june we have 80 to 90 F days. I am wondering
    if the hot days and moist soil cooks or rots
    the seeds.

    I only water every two days.

    Your thoughts?

    Many thanks,
    -T

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  • From songbird@21:1/5 to All on Tue Aug 23 18:47:11 2022
    T wrote:
    Hi All,

    I have noticed that I am unable to get ANY seed to
    germinate if I plant it after the thrid week in May.
    That is when the freezing nights stop. (In May,
    we have 70 to 80F days and 30 to 40 F nights.)

    In june we have 80 to 90 F days. I am wondering
    if the hot days and moist soil cooks or rots
    the seeds.

    I only water every two days.

    Your thoughts?

    depends upon the seed and seed quality you are
    planting, the soil, the conditions that happen after
    the seed is sown.

    it may just be that you have such mineral laden
    soil that there is no moisture retained (sand or
    mineral grains are not moisture retainers). could
    it be that the seeds are placed too shallow for
    your conditions? they might fry if it is full sun,
    sandy and hot enough.

    perhaps your water is really bad, alkaline, etc.

    sometimes things need shade aka a nursery crop or
    some other things like fire or the seed has to be
    mechanically abraded.

    without knowing a lot more about your attempts
    and more exact details we're just guessing.

    perhaps you are talking about direct sown seeds
    into your garden soil and we're thinking you're
    talking about trying to start things in sterile
    seed starting mix with more controlled conditions.

    and that really gets to the next point. when
    you plant a seed you are asking a question, but
    if you've not done any prep work then perhaps
    you are asking a rather poor question which can
    be improved...

    the more you can describe things when you ask a
    question here the better the replies you might get
    in return.


    songbird

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  • From Bob F@21:1/5 to songbird on Tue Aug 23 17:42:03 2022
    On 8/23/2022 3:47 PM, songbird wrote:
    T wrote:
    Hi All,

    I have noticed that I am unable to get ANY seed to
    germinate if I plant it after the thrid week in May.
    That is when the freezing nights stop. (In May,
    we have 70 to 80F days and 30 to 40 F nights.)

    In june we have 80 to 90 F days. I am wondering
    if the hot days and moist soil cooks or rots
    the seeds.

    I only water every two days.

    Your thoughts?

    depends upon the seed and seed quality you are
    planting, the soil, the conditions that happen after
    the seed is sown.

    it may just be that you have such mineral laden
    soil that there is no moisture retained (sand or
    mineral grains are not moisture retainers). could
    it be that the seeds are placed too shallow for
    your conditions? they might fry if it is full sun,
    sandy and hot enough.

    perhaps your water is really bad, alkaline, etc.

    sometimes things need shade aka a nursery crop or
    some other things like fire or the seed has to be
    mechanically abraded.

    without knowing a lot more about your attempts
    and more exact details we're just guessing.

    perhaps you are talking about direct sown seeds
    into your garden soil and we're thinking you're
    talking about trying to start things in sterile
    seed starting mix with more controlled conditions.

    and that really gets to the next point. when
    you plant a seed you are asking a question, but
    if you've not done any prep work then perhaps
    you are asking a rather poor question which can
    be improved...

    the more you can describe things when you ask a
    question here the better the replies you might get
    in return.

    My theory is that if seeds start to sprout, then dry out, they tend to
    die. So I water newly planted seeds regularly but lightly so the soil
    around them stays moist until they sprout and grow a bit. More than once
    a day if they begin to dry out. Then I decrease the frequency of
    watering, but water more so the deeper soil gets wet so the roots grow
    down into it as the top soil dries out.

    Getting that soil test earlier, and adding the lime, nitrogen, and
    potassium it said I needed has made my garden take off! we went from a
    really dismal looking garden of bolting tiny yellowish plants, to very
    strong healthy rapidly growing dark green produce everywhere.

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  • From songbird@21:1/5 to Bob F on Wed Aug 24 11:54:13 2022
    Bob F wrote:
    ...
    My theory is that if seeds start to sprout, then dry out, they tend to
    die. So I water newly planted seeds regularly but lightly so the soil
    around them stays moist until they sprout and grow a bit. More than once
    a day if they begin to dry out. Then I decrease the frequency of
    watering, but water more so the deeper soil gets wet so the roots grow
    down into it as the top soil dries out.

    yes, when i start beans here in mostly clay i water twice
    a day but lightly to keep it moist enough. once they sprout
    i reduce to once every other day or so and then after that it
    might gradually ease off to once a week. depends upon how
    much rain we get. in sandier soil with more minerals and less
    clay and organic matter you'd have to water more frequently.
    in the arid southwest it's a whole different ballgame. you
    might need some shade, a wind break or mulches to keep seeds
    cool enough and evenly moist enough.


    Getting that soil test earlier, and adding the lime, nitrogen, and
    potassium it said I needed has made my garden take off! we went from a
    really dismal looking garden of bolting tiny yellowish plants, to very
    strong healthy rapidly growing dark green produce everywhere.

    glad it helped out. :)

    have you been getting regular rains there? it had been
    really dry here for quite a long time. so much that i was
    wondering how much BER my tomatoes were going to get as
    usually the first few that come ripe might have some BER.
    this year none of the first few pickings had really bad
    BER but it was close. will have to pick again in a few
    days.


    songbird

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  • From Bob F@21:1/5 to songbird on Wed Aug 24 12:30:01 2022
    On 8/24/2022 8:54 AM, songbird wrote:
    Bob F wrote:
    ...
    My theory is that if seeds start to sprout, then dry out, they tend to
    die. So I water newly planted seeds regularly but lightly so the soil
    around them stays moist until they sprout and grow a bit. More than once
    a day if they begin to dry out. Then I decrease the frequency of
    watering, but water more so the deeper soil gets wet so the roots grow
    down into it as the top soil dries out.

    yes, when i start beans here in mostly clay i water twice
    a day but lightly to keep it moist enough. once they sprout
    i reduce to once every other day or so and then after that it
    might gradually ease off to once a week. depends upon how
    much rain we get. in sandier soil with more minerals and less
    clay and organic matter you'd have to water more frequently.
    in the arid southwest it's a whole different ballgame. you
    might need some shade, a wind break or mulches to keep seeds
    cool enough and evenly moist enough.


    Getting that soil test earlier, and adding the lime, nitrogen, and
    potassium it said I needed has made my garden take off! we went from a
    really dismal looking garden of bolting tiny yellowish plants, to very
    strong healthy rapidly growing dark green produce everywhere.

    glad it helped out. :)

    have you been getting regular rains there? it had been
    really dry here for quite a long time. so much that i was
    wondering how much BER my tomatoes were going to get as
    usually the first few that come ripe might have some BER.
    this year none of the first few pickings had really bad
    BER but it was close. will have to pick again in a few
    days.

    We have been watering. I had to look up BER. I don't remember running
    into that here in western WA.

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  • From Bob F@21:1/5 to songbird on Wed Aug 24 15:13:37 2022
    On 8/24/2022 2:33 PM, songbird wrote:
    Bob F wrote:
    ...
    We have been watering. I had to look up BER. I don't remember running
    into that here in western WA.

    lucky you! :) no hot droughts there and/or plenty of
    good deep soil?


    Well, we did have a few days of up to 108F in that "heat dome" last
    year, breaking many records. Normally, it seldom gets much into the
    80's, with a few days into the 90's. Upper 70's today. It is getting
    hotter over the years for sure. And dryer, but not in the drought range
    yet. East of the Cascades is entirely different.

    12" or so of rick loam, with excess organic material from all the
    compost I've added over the years, according to the soil test, over
    10-15 feet of fine sand. Apparently a hard clay layer under that. Water
    table is 8-10 feet down in the summer. Up to the lower spots in the winter.

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  • From songbird@21:1/5 to Bob F on Wed Aug 24 17:33:54 2022
    Bob F wrote:
    ...
    We have been watering. I had to look up BER. I don't remember running
    into that here in western WA.

    lucky you! :) no hot droughts there and/or plenty of
    good deep soil?


    songbird

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  • From songbird@21:1/5 to Bob F on Sat Aug 27 12:11:35 2022
    Bob F wrote:
    On 8/24/2022 2:33 PM, songbird wrote:
    Bob F wrote:
    ...
    We have been watering. I had to look up BER. I don't remember running
    into that here in western WA.

    lucky you! :) no hot droughts there and/or plenty of
    good deep soil?


    Well, we did have a few days of up to 108F in that "heat dome" last
    year, breaking many records. Normally, it seldom gets much into the
    80's, with a few days into the 90's. Upper 70's today. It is getting
    hotter over the years for sure. And dryer, but not in the drought range
    yet. East of the Cascades is entirely different.

    12" or so of rick loam, with excess organic material from all the
    compost I've added over the years, according to the soil test, over
    10-15 feet of fine sand. Apparently a hard clay layer under that. Water
    table is 8-10 feet down in the summer. Up to the lower spots in the winter.

    that sounds ok to me. you have drainage. we have it here too
    but it is almost all via runoff from the top. i capture what
    rains i can and soak it in.


    songbird

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  • From T@21:1/5 to songbird on Mon Aug 29 20:11:23 2022
    On 8/23/22 15:47, songbird wrote:
    without knowing a lot more about your attempts
    and more exact details we're just guessing.

    The only difference is the heat

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  • From Bloke Down The Pub@21:1/5 to T@invalid.invalid on Thu Sep 1 11:05:43 2022
    "T" <T@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
    news:te2u59$31dbc$1@dont-email.me...
    Hi All,

    I have noticed that I am unable to get ANY seed to
    germinate if I plant it after the thrid week in May.
    That is when the freezing nights stop. (In May,
    we have 70 to 80F days and 30 to 40 F nights.)

    In june we have 80 to 90 F days. I am wondering
    if the hot days and moist soil cooks or rots
    the seeds.

    I only water every two days.

    Your thoughts?

    Many thanks,

    Sounds to me as if they are drying out before they germinate. Here I keep
    the soil/sand moist, watering/misting 2 or 3 times a day until I see results and the cut the watering times back gradually to once every 2 days but with sufficient water to soak deeper. PLUS the all important keeping an eye on
    the weather and adjusting accordingly.

    Mike

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  • From T@21:1/5 to Bloke Down The Pub on Wed Aug 31 21:32:29 2022
    On 8/31/22 20:05, Bloke Down The Pub wrote:
    "T" <T@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
    news:te2u59$31dbc$1@dont-email.me...
    Hi All,

    I have noticed that I am unable to get ANY seed to
    germinate if I plant it after the thrid week in May.
    That is when the freezing nights stop. (In May,
    we have 70 to 80F days and 30 to 40 F nights.)

    In june we have 80 to 90 F days. I am wondering
    if the hot days and moist soil cooks or rots
    the seeds.

    I only water every two days.

    Your thoughts?

    Many thanks,

    Sounds to me as if they are drying out before they germinate. Here I keep the soil/sand moist, watering/misting 2 or 3 times a day until I see results and the cut the watering times back gradually to once every 2 days but with sufficient water to soak deeper. PLUS the all important keeping an eye on the weather and adjusting accordingly.

    Mike



    After the initial watering, I only
    do once every two days. I think
    you solved the mystery.

    Thank you!
    -T

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