On 03.08.2020 13:06, Janis Papanagnou wrote:

My character entered the Plane of Air, and when passing the cloud I saw four(!) hostile Archons, one close enough to start a summon storm. After three or so turns the [visible] level appeared to be completely filled,
and moving was not possible any more. But the archons were not the worst monsters, planetars and solars were guided in, also minotaurs, Olog-hai,
and similar. [ etc. etc. etc. ] Three turns later I was dead.

I'd like to hear from the experienced Slashem players how they'd solve
such extreme situations. One high level summoner is already bad enough.
Four of them is really disturbing. And when solars and planetars enter
the scene I'm really clueless. Could I have done something in advance
to alleviate the risk?

Contributing an answer to my own question. Just had a Bar-Elf-Neu going. Entered the Plane of Air, and it looked not too bad. Though either one
of the first critters I tackled or some summoner started again such a
storm. I certainly had better stats this time (HP:684(684), AC:-47) and
carried 4 blessed health-stones in open inventory. (My weapon was only
the +6 Vorpal Blade.) I cannot recall the exact order but the crucial
part of the solution was a wish for a chickatrice corpse to stone all
the 'A' and other beasts. A ring of conflict (worn when two 'c' got
summoned adjacent) alleviated the situation as well. And a scroll of
taming or two wasn't bad either. When monster density decreased I took
the first opportunity to move towards the border of the screen; five
monsters adjacent is better than eight. That worked quite well but I
had a few problems; to get the wish I [stupidly] used a magic lamp
(to get rid of some weight) instead of a wand of wishing, and I also
wasn't sure whether the djinni needs to be created on an adjacent free
square to provide the wish - a bit difficult when residing in the mid
of a summoning storm. Another problem was that I could not use the
c-corpse against two adjacent basilisks, and constant weapon switches
were not part of a good timing tactics. So I decided to ignore the
basilisks, hoping for my armor to prevent their deadly attacks. Some
time and a few newly manufactured statues later I managed to leave the
level to reach the Plane if Fire where another major angelic being
greeted me just the moment when my c-corpse decayed. I teleported that
critter away and hurried across the level to reach the next portal.
The Plane of Water went smoothly. But Astral again looked like a tough challenge. The situation made it necessary to head for the Pestilence
path, a killed cockatrice corpse again supporting my quick advancement.
And luckily the end of that path even led me to the altar of my god.

Janis

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Am 22.03.21 um 20:12 schrieb Janis Papanagnou:

On 03.08.2020 13:06, Janis Papanagnou wrote:

My character entered the Plane of Air, and when passing the cloud I saw
four(!) hostile Archons, one close enough to start a summon storm. After
three or so turns the [visible] level appeared to be completely filled,
and moving was not possible any more. But the archons were not the worst
monsters, planetars and solars were guided in, also minotaurs, Olog-hai,
and similar. [ etc. etc. etc. ] Three turns later I was dead.

I'd like to hear from the experienced Slashem players how they'd solve
such extreme situations. One high level summoner is already bad enough.
Four of them is really disturbing. And when solars and planetars enter
the scene I'm really clueless. Could I have done something in advance
to alleviate the risk?

I never had enormous problems in the Planes, meaning that all characters
that made it to the Planes in slash'em also ascended. It is definitely
easier with lawfuls, who in my case usually have a Planetar or Solar pet
(the former from an altar, the latter from a wished-for figurine). With neutrals and chaotics, the ring of conflict is very helpful.

One major difference in our play style will be that I always get a
decent firearm and a sufficient number (about 300) bullets that are at
least enchanted to +4. That allows you to take out a Solar from a
distance, presumably they never did much summoning for me because of
this. Also, I essentially always can avoid that one of the Riders ever
gets to a square adjacent to me. With an assault rifle, you almost never
take more than two rounds to take them out.

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On 23.03.2021 10:53, klaus kassner wrote:

I never had enormous problems in the Planes, meaning that all characters
that made it to the Planes in slash'em also ascended. It is definitely
easier with lawfuls, who in my case usually have a Planetar or Solar pet
(the former from an altar, the latter from a wished-for figurine). With neutrals and chaotics, the ring of conflict is very helpful.

In case of the summoning storms that I had in the past, conflict
alone (while certainly helpful) didn't save me.

One major difference in our play style will be that I always get a
decent firearm and a sufficient number (about 300) bullets that are at
least enchanted to +4. That allows you to take out a Solar from a
distance, presumably they never did much summoning for me because of
this.

Good if it works for you. I seem to have generally two problems
with that approach; ranged attacks need a straight line to the
target, which is usually a problem on the Plane of Air. And the
summonings are done by the critters from quite some distance.

Also, I essentially always can avoid that one of the Riders ever
gets to a square adjacent to me. With an assault rifle, you almost never
take more than two rounds to take them out.

I don't seem to have issues with the riders; I died from Famine
once and it was while I was helples. My deaths on the Planes:

Earth Wiz Elf Mal Neu drowned in a pool of water
Air Cav Dwa Mal Law killed by a giant shoggoth
Earth Kni Hum Mal Law drowned in a pool of water
Astral Sam Hum Mal Law killed by Famine, while helples
Fire Mon Hum Mal Cha killed by an Archon
Air Und Dop Mal Cha killed by a Planetar
Air Tou Hum Mal Neu killed by a monadic deva

The pool incident was from ignorance, the giant shoggoth is a
pain and since then typically gets genocided with all the 'P'
as soon as I see one. All the 'A' incidents are a persistent
problem, though.

Janis

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Am 23.03.2021 um 12:39 schrieb Janis Papanagnou:

On 23.03.2021 10:53, klaus kassner wrote:

I never had enormous problems in the Planes, meaning that all characters
that made it to the Planes in slash'em also ascended. It is definitely
easier with lawfuls, who in my case usually have a Planetar or Solar pet
(the former from an altar, the latter from a wished-for figurine). With
neutrals and chaotics, the ring of conflict is very helpful.

In case of the summoning storms that I had in the past, conflict
alone (while certainly helpful) didn't save me.

One major difference in our play style will be that I always get a
decent firearm and a sufficient number (about 300) bullets that are at
least enchanted to +4. That allows you to take out a Solar from a
distance, presumably they never did much summoning for me because of
this.

Good if it works for you. I seem to have generally two problems
with that approach; ranged attacks need a straight line to the
target, which is usually a problem on the Plane of Air.

In any case, you should fly, not levitate, when shooting a gun. But to
get into a straight line with the critter should not be that big a
problem. I think the Plane of Air is not as full in slash'em as in NH 3.6.

And the
summonings are done by the critters from quite some distance.

But hardly from a distance out of the range of an assault rifle.
Actually, I don't know that. I just never had these huge summoning
storms, except once on the Plane of Fire. And there I think I did not
leave my hit point comfort zone, due to conflict.

While I never tried the following, because it was not necessary, putting
on the ring of conflict and breaking a wand of teleport when hit points
are getting low might be a good strategy. Probably, the fact that the
monsters will fight each other and not close back in immediately, leaves
time enough for quaffing a potion of full healing. Of course, the main
target should then always be the summoner.

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Am 23.03.2021 um 12:39 schrieb Janis Papanagnou:

On 23.03.2021 10:53, klaus kassner wrote:

Earth Wiz Elf Mal Neu drowned in a pool of water
Air Cav Dwa Mal Law killed by a giant shoggoth
Earth Kni Hum Mal Law drowned in a pool of water
Astral Sam Hum Mal Law killed by Famine, while helples
Fire Mon Hum Mal Cha killed by an Archon
Air Und Dop Mal Cha killed by a Planetar
Air Tou Hum Mal Neu killed by a monadic deva

The pool incident was from ignorance, the giant shoggoth is a
pain and since then typically gets genocided with all the 'P'
as soon as I see one. All the 'A' incidents are a persistent
problem, though.

The shoggoth is bad, but once it swallows you, a wand of death should
always hit it.

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On 24.03.2021 20:45, Klaus Kassner wrote:

Am 23.03.2021 um 12:39 schrieb Janis Papanagnou:

Air Cav Dwa Mal Law killed by a giant shoggoth

[...], the giant shoggoth is a
pain and since then typically gets genocided with all the 'P'
as soon as I see one. [...]

The shoggoth is bad, but once it swallows you, a wand of death should
always hit it.

Oh, okay. With the Cthulhu background in mind I wouldn't have thought
that death would work on them, but I may have confused shoggoths with Yog-Sothoth.

Janis

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On 24.03.2021 20:43, Klaus Kassner wrote:

Am 23.03.2021 um 12:39 schrieb Janis Papanagnou:

In any case, you should fly, not levitate, when shooting a gun.

Right, and flying is also generally my preferred way of moving.

But to
get into a straight line with the critter should not be that big a
problem. I think the Plane of Air is not as full in slash'em as in NH 3.6.

Well, it's not a problem in a default setup. What I mean was at
the moment when the first crowd is summoned around you, then it
gets nasty and very problematic in my experience.

And the
summonings are done by the critters from quite some distance.

Yes, though one needs to get to a good shooting position in time.

Actually, I don't know that. I just never had these huge summoning
storms, except once on the Plane of Fire.

Lucky you! :-)

While I never tried the following, because it was not necessary, putting
on the ring of conflict and breaking a wand of teleport when hit points
are getting low might be a good strategy.

One may think so (me too, if I hadn't experienced it differently).
There are a couple problems. One is that you only relocate the
first row of monsters away, and on the next turn the second row
is already adjacent. And sadly, the summonings also continue very
quickly. Once you have more than one summoner nearby you observe
an exponential growth; the level is quickly filled. And in parallel
the monsters also hit you, some of them very hard. (Some drum or
horn might help to scare the monsters.)

Probably, the fact that the
monsters will fight each other and not close back in immediately, leaves
time enough for quaffing a potion of full healing. Of course, the main
target should then always be the summoner.

The conflicted "fight each other" isn't sufficient. During my first
summoning incident I had to quaff all my full healing, but to no
avail; the damage done to me was too huge. The other problem is that
"the" summoner (i.e. the assumption of a single one) doesn't hold
long, as already mentioned above. But of course any summoner should
be taken down first and as soon as possible, without delay.

Janis

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Am 25.03.2021 um 01:50 schrieb Janis Papanagnou:

On 24.03.2021 20:45, Klaus Kassner wrote:

Am 23.03.2021 um 12:39 schrieb Janis Papanagnou:

Air Cav Dwa Mal Law killed by a giant shoggoth

[...], the giant shoggoth is a
pain and since then typically gets genocided with all the 'P'
as soon as I see one. [...]

The shoggoth is bad, but once it swallows you, a wand of death should
always hit it.

Oh, okay. With the Cthulhu background in mind I wouldn't have thought
that death would work on them, but I may have confused shoggoths with Yog-Sothoth.

Janis

Also, if you were already low on HP when it swallowed you, it might kill
you in one turn. They are doing quite some damage (although the few
times one swallowed me I was mostly annoyed by the damage done to my
armor and items).

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On 03.08.2020 13:06, Janis Papanagnou wrote:

[ Angelic beings' summoning storms on Plane of Air ]

I'd like to hear from the experienced Slashem players how they'd solve
such extreme situations. One high level summoner is already bad enough.
Four of them is really disturbing. And when solars and planetars enter
the scene I'm really clueless. Could I have done something in advance
to alleviate the risk?

Current game, a neutral elven ranger. Had throughout the game a couple appearances of single 'A's from the major species of angelic beings.
The good thing was that I was able to work around any direct encounter.

But, again, I feared for the Plane of Air, and, as expected the portal
was diagonally at the far end of the map and titans and angelic beings
visible. Had been prepared, wished for a chickatrice corpse before I
entered Air. It was tough, nonetheless; between getting engulfed and
the need to kill these monsters (air elementals, vortices, etc.) and
stone the stonable creatures I had to constantly switch between weapon
and corpse. Eventually I got rid of all nearby summoner-threats and
cleared a narrow path to finally reach the portal. During that process
my HP:723 melted down to something like HP:70. But okay, I was alive.

On Astral I wanted to avoid two Archons and took the path to Pestilence.
Wands of death and teleport did a fairly good job and I reached that
altar without too many wounds. I had my focus on some helm of opposite alignment management (constantly uncursing and re-wearing) until I got
lawful as the altar was, while an adjacent player character drained my
live from XL:30 to 25, before I noticed. Restored my level to XL:28,
offered the amulet, and was bestowed with the number one highscore in
my local slashem record file.

Janis

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On 16.05.2021 20:43, Janis Papanagnou wrote:

On 03.08.2020 13:06, Janis Papanagnou wrote:

[ Angelic beings' summoning storms on Plane of Air ]

Yet another annoying death... (a chaotic orcish ranger)

Before I entered the Plane of Air I wielded a cockatrice corpse to
be prepared. On Air I had two or three A close by (Planetar, or so).
Petrified one of them. Summoning storm. Killed another adjacent one.
Engulfed by an air elemental I had to switch weapons. And there was
still a titan and another A adjacent. - DYWYPI? - What? With HP:478
(max: 649) I thought I had some buffer. What happened was that there
were two basilisks adjacent and I just missed them and their attack;
I got petrified. Note to self: next time I have to genocide ':' too.
Maybe I should have scared the monsters with my drum of earthquake
first?

N+1 to my died on the Plane of Air record.

Janis

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