1. Forum
  2. Usenet
  3. REC.GAMES.BACKGAMMON

  • O wins the "ugly board prize"

    From Timothy Chow@21:1/5 to All on Wed Jan 4 07:45:39 2023
    XGID=--Ba-bC-EC---B-------aeae-:1:-1:1:64:0:0:0:0:10

    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
    +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+
    | X | | O O O O | +---+
    | X | | O O | | 2 |
    | | | O O | +---+
    | | | O O |
    | | | O O |
    | |BAR| |
    | X | | |
    | X | | |
    | X X | | X |
    | X X | | X O X |
    | X X | | X O O X |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 115 O: 88 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 2, O own cube
    X to play 64

    ---
    Tim Chow

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From ah....Clem@21:1/5 to Timothy Chow on Wed Jan 4 13:37:38 2023
    On 1/4/2023 7:45 AM, Timothy Chow wrote:
    XGID=--Ba-bC-EC---B-------aeae-:1:-1:1:64:0:0:0:0:10

    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
     +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-
     | X                |   |       O  O  O  O | +---+
     | X                |   |          O     O | | 2 |
     |                  |   |          O     O | +---+
     |                  |   |          O     O |
     |                  |   |          O     O |
     |                  |BAR|                  |
     |             X    |   |                  |
     |             X    |   |                  |
     |          X  X    |   | X                |
     |          X  X    |   | X  O        X    |
     |          X  X    |   | X  O     O  X    |
     +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count  X: 115  O: 88 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 2, O own cube
    X to play 64


    X is behind in the race and if O can slide past X's checkers she'll have
    a strong recube, perhaps a pass. To prevent that I'll hit loose on the
    three point, then the question becomes how to play the four.

    Banana split? Sure. O has no board so recirculating checkers should help
    X even if he doesn't pick up one of the blots on the way. If O fails to
    hit, X should be able to cover at least one of the slotted points. And I
    think keeping the midpoint is better than 13/9 since X wants to increase contact.

    9/3* 8/4.

    --
    Ah....Clem
    The future is fun, the future is fair.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pepstein5@gmail.com@21:1/5 to ah....Clem on Wed Jan 4 12:08:33 2023
    On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 6:37:40 PM UTC, ah....Clem wrote:
    On 1/4/2023 7:45 AM, Timothy Chow wrote:
    XGID=--Ba-bC-EC---B-------aeae-:1:-1:1:64:0:0:0:0:10

    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
    +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-
    | X | | O O O O | +---+
    | X | | O O | | 2 |
    | | | O O | +---+
    | | | O O |
    | | | O O |
    | |BAR| |
    | X | | |
    | X | | |
    | X X | | X |
    | X X | | X O X |
    | X X | | X O O X |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 115 O: 88 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 2, O own cube
    X to play 64
    X is behind in the race and if O can slide past X's checkers she'll have
    a strong recube, perhaps a pass. To prevent that I'll hit loose on the
    three point, then the question becomes how to play the four.

    Banana split? Sure. O has no board so recirculating checkers should help
    X even if he doesn't pick up one of the blots on the way. If O fails to
    hit, X should be able to cover at least one of the slotted points. And I think keeping the midpoint is better than 13/9 since X wants to increase contact.

    9/3* 8/4.

    I think this play seems clear, and I definitely want to play it too.
    But this is one where I regret not Walting.
    I don't know whether I could have found Walt's play Waltishly -- it
    might not have occurred to me.

    Paul

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Stick Rice@21:1/5 to ah....Clem on Wed Jan 4 11:17:32 2023
    On Wednesday, January 4, 2023 at 1:37:40 PM UTC-5, ah....Clem wrote:
    On 1/4/2023 7:45 AM, Timothy Chow wrote:
    XGID=--Ba-bC-EC---B-------aeae-:1:-1:1:64:0:0:0:0:10

    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
    +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-
    | X | | O O O O | +---+
    | X | | O O | | 2 |
    | | | O O | +---+
    | | | O O |
    | | | O O |
    | |BAR| |
    | X | | |
    | X | | |
    | X X | | X |
    | X X | | X O X |
    | X X | | X O O X |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 115 O: 88 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 2, O own cube
    X to play 64
    X is behind in the race and if O can slide past X's checkers she'll have
    a strong recube, perhaps a pass. To prevent that I'll hit loose on the
    three point, then the question becomes how to play the four.

    Banana split? Sure. O has no board so recirculating checkers should help
    X even if he doesn't pick up one of the blots on the way. If O fails to
    hit, X should be able to cover at least one of the slotted points. And I think keeping the midpoint is better than 13/9 since X wants to increase contact.

    9/3* 8/4.

    --
    Ah....Clem
    The future is fun, the future is fair.

    That is not what a banana split play is.

    Stick

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Timothy Chow@21:1/5 to Stick Rice on Thu Jan 5 08:16:15 2023
    On 1/4/2023 2:17 PM, Stick Rice wrote:
    That is not what a banana split play is.

    I have to agree with Stick here. In a banana split play, you
    break a home-board point, creating two new blots in the process.

    ---
    Tim Chow

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pepstein5@gmail.com@21:1/5 to Tim Chow on Thu Jan 5 13:58:50 2023
    On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 1:16:16 PM UTC, Tim Chow wrote:
    On 1/4/2023 2:17 PM, Stick Rice wrote:
    That is not what a banana split play is.
    I have to agree with Stick here. In a banana split play, you
    break a home-board point, creating two new blots in the process.

    Not just "I agree with Stick" but "I have to agree with Stick"
    implying that your aim is to disagree with him as much as possible
    and will only agree with him if forced to.

    Paul

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Timothy Chow@21:1/5 to peps...@gmail.com on Fri Jan 6 07:45:58 2023
    On 1/5/2023 4:58 PM, peps...@gmail.com wrote:
    On Thursday, January 5, 2023 at 1:16:16 PM UTC, Tim Chow wrote:
    On 1/4/2023 2:17 PM, Stick Rice wrote:
    That is not what a banana split play is.
    I have to agree with Stick here. In a banana split play, you
    break a home-board point, creating two new blots in the process.

    Not just "I agree with Stick" but "I have to agree with Stick"
    implying that your aim is to disagree with him as much as possible
    and will only agree with him if forced to.

    It's not my aim, but it's what I typically find myself doing when
    Stick nitpicks about terminology.

    ---
    Tim Chow

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Timothy Chow@21:1/5 to All on Fri Jan 6 08:01:22 2023
    XGID=--Ba-bC-EC---B-------aeae-:1:-1:1:64:0:0:0:0:10

    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
    +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+
    | X | | O O O O | +---+
    | X | | O O | | 2 |
    | | | O O | +---+
    | | | O O |
    | | | O O |
    | |BAR| |
    | X | | |
    | X | | |
    | X X | | X |
    | X X | | X O X |
    | X X | | X O O X |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 115 O: 88 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 2, O own cube
    X to play 64

    X is 27 pips down before the roll and needs to do something to contain
    O's checkers, especially the straggler. O's terrible board means that
    he can afford to play boldly. The play 9/3* 8/4, suggested by ah...clem,
    is not a terrible idea, but there's an even bolder play available, which
    makes a bid for the bar point: 13/7 8/4! Another thing to note about
    13/7 8/4 is that it forces O to break her anchor with some 5's and 6's.

    1. Rollout¹ 13/7 8/4 eq:+0.577
    Player: 72.92% (G:23.16% B:1.77%)
    Opponent: 27.08% (G:4.31% B:0.02%)
    Confidence: ±0.009 (+0.568..+0.587) - [100.0%]

    2. Rollout¹ 8/4 8/2 eq:+0.537 (-0.041)
    Player: 71.55% (G:20.60% B:1.70%)
    Opponent: 28.45% (G:2.63% B:0.02%)
    Confidence: ±0.009 (+0.528..+0.545) - [0.0%]

    3. Rollout¹ 9/3* 8/4 eq:+0.525 (-0.053)
    Player: 71.76% (G:20.10% B:1.28%)
    Opponent: 28.24% (G:2.86% B:0.01%)
    Confidence: ±0.008 (+0.516..+0.533) - [0.0%]

    4. Rollout¹ 13/3* eq:+0.420 (-0.157)
    Player: 68.85% (G:16.05% B:1.15%)
    Opponent: 31.15% (G:2.37% B:0.01%)
    Confidence: ±0.008 (+0.412..+0.429) - [0.0%]

    ¹ 1296 Games rolled with Variance Reduction.
    Dice Seed: 271828
    Moves: 3-ply, cube decisions: XG Roller

    eXtreme Gammon Version: 2.19.211.pre-release

    ---
    Tim Chow

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)