1. Forum
  2. Usenet
  3. REC.GAMES.BACKGAMMON

  • Just another racing cube

    From Timothy Chow@21:1/5 to All on Wed Sep 14 07:59:39 2022
    XGID=-EBA-BC--AA---aa---cbdaab-:0:0:1:00:0:0:0:0:10

    X:Player 2 O:Player 1
    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
    +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+
    | O O | | O O O O O O |
    | | | O O O O |
    | | | O O |
    | | | O |
    | | | |
    | |BAR| |
    | | | X |
    | | | X |
    | | | X X |
    | | | X X X X |
    | X X | | X X X X X |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 59 O: 72 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 1
    X on roll, cube action

    ---
    Tim Chow

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pepstein5@gmail.com@21:1/5 to Tim Chow on Wed Sep 14 06:42:28 2022
    On Wednesday, September 14, 2022 at 12:59:40 PM UTC+1, Tim Chow wrote:
    XGID=-EBA-BC--AA---aa---cbdaab-:0:0:1:00:0:0:0:0:10

    X:Player 2 O:Player 1
    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
    +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+
    | O O | | O O O O O O |
    | | | O O O O |
    | | | O O |
    | | | O |
    | | | |
    | |BAR| |
    | | | X |
    | | | X |
    | | | X X |
    | | | X X X X |
    | X X | | X X X X X |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 59 O: 72 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 1
    X on roll, cube action

    ---
    Tim Chow

    This seems like a good candidate for Axelisation. However, we can fill in our 4 point rather easily, so Axel's fine for
    this gap may be a bit harsh. Therefore a borderline hold will get translated to a D/T and a borderline take will get translated to a drop.
    Axelising adds 7 to X's score and nothing to O's score. (59 + 7) * 7/6 = 77. 77 - 72 = 5 so this is D/T territory.
    Ignoring the 4 point fine, we are clearly still in D/T territory.
    D/T.

    Paul

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From ah....Clem@21:1/5 to Timothy Chow on Wed Sep 14 10:36:09 2022
    On 9/14/2022 7:59 AM, Timothy Chow wrote:
    XGID=-EBA-BC--AA---aa---cbdaab-:0:0:1:00:0:0:0:0:10

    X:Player 2   O:Player 1
    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
     +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+
     |    O  O          |   | O  O  O  O  O  O |
     |                  |   | O  O  O        O |
     |                  |   | O     O          |
     |                  |   |       O          |
     |                  |   |                  |
     |                  |BAR|                  |
     |                  |   |                X |
     |                  |   |                X |
     |                  |   | X              X |
     |                  |   | X  X        X  X |
     |       X  X       |   | X  X     X  X  X |
     +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count  X: 59  O: 72 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 1
    X on roll, cube action



    Add seven to X's pipcount for the spares on the ace and the open four
    point to get 66. That seems to put it squarely in the D/T zone using
    the Trice metric.

    D/T.


    --
    Ah....Clem
    The future is fun, the future is fair.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pepstein5@gmail.com@21:1/5 to ah....Clem on Wed Sep 14 12:18:02 2022
    On Wednesday, September 14, 2022 at 3:36:12 PM UTC+1, ah....Clem wrote:
    On 9/14/2022 7:59 AM, Timothy Chow wrote:
    XGID=-EBA-BC--AA---aa---cbdaab-:0:0:1:00:0:0:0:0:10

    X:Player 2 O:Player 1
    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
    +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+
    | O O | | O O O O O O |
    | | | O O O O |
    | | | O O |
    | | | O |
    | | | |
    | |BAR| |
    | | | X |
    | | | X |
    | | | X X |
    | | | X X X X |
    | X X | | X X X X X |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 59 O: 72 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 1
    X on roll, cube action

    Add seven to X's pipcount for the spares on the ace and the open four
    point to get 66. That seems to put it squarely in the D/T zone using
    the Trice metric.

    D/T.


    --
    Ah....Clem
    The future is fun, the future is fair.

    Same result as you -- D/T. But I don't agree with applying these formulas so mechanically.
    In this particular case, the open 4 point is not a problem for us and is likely to be filled efficiently.
    So we shouldn't penalize it by a full pip.
    Of course, it makes no difference here. But I think that some thought can be made as to how
    the algo applies to the specific position at hand.

    Paul

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Timothy Chow@21:1/5 to All on Fri Sep 16 07:54:48 2022
    XGID=-EBA-BC--AA---aa---cbdaab-:0:0:1:00:0:0:0:0:10

    X:Player 2 O:Player 1
    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
    +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+
    | O O | | O O O O O O |
    | | | O O O O |
    | | | O O |
    | | | O |
    | | | |
    | |BAR| |
    | | | X |
    | | | X |
    | | | X X |
    | | | X X X X |
    | X X | | X X X X X |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 59 O: 72 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 1
    X on roll, cube action

    No big surprise here. I messed this one up OTB because I quickly
    went with an intuitive assessment instead of using a formula,
    and passed.

    Analyzed in Rollout
    No double
    Player Winning Chances: 76.51% (G:0.00% B:0.00%)
    Opponent Winning Chances: 23.49% (G:0.00% B:0.00%)
    Double/Take
    Player Winning Chances: 76.43% (G:0.00% B:0.00%)
    Opponent Winning Chances: 23.57% (G:0.00% B:0.00%)

    Cubeful Equities:
    No double: +0.796 (-0.123)
    Double/Take: +0.919
    Double/Pass: +1.000 (+0.081)

    Best Cube action: Double / Take

    Rollout:
    1296 Games rolled with Variance Reduction.
    Dice Seed: 271828
    Moves and cube decisions: XG Roller+
    Search interval: Gigantic
    Confidence No Double: ± 0.002 (+0.794..+0.798)
    Confidence Double: ± 0.003 (+0.916..+0.923)

    eXtreme Gammon Version: 2.19.207.pre-release

    ---
    Tim Chow

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)