• Lots of legal candidates, but Stick sees only one play

    From Timothy Chow@21:1/5 to All on Thu May 12 09:48:02 2022
    XGID=-a---BDBBaA--B--aade---bB-:1:-1:1:32:0:0:0:0:10

    X:Player 1 O:Player 2
    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
    +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+
    | X O O O | | O O X | +---+
    | X O | | O O X | | 2 |
    | O | | O | +---+
    | O | | O |
    | | | O |
    | |BAR| |
    | | | |
    | | | X |
    | | | X |
    | X X | | X X |
    | X O X X | | X X O |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 148 O: 119 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 2, O own cube
    X to play 32

    ---
    Tim Chow

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pepstein5@gmail.com@21:1/5 to Tim Chow on Thu May 12 08:45:40 2022
    On Thursday, May 12, 2022 at 2:48:05 PM UTC+1, Tim Chow wrote:
    XGID=-a---BDBBaA--B--aade---bB-:1:-1:1:32:0:0:0:0:10

    X:Player 1 O:Player 2
    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
    +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+
    | X O O O | | O O X | +---+
    | X O | | O O X | | 2 |
    | O | | O | +---+
    | O | | O |
    | | | O |
    | |BAR| |
    | | | |
    | | | X |
    | | | X |
    | X X | | X X |
    | X O X X | | X X O |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 148 O: 119 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 2, O own cube
    X to play 32

    My candidates are 10/7 24/22 and 10/8 24/21.
    I prefer the first one. Being pointed at on a low point doesn't seem
    so unpleasant as bing pointed on on a higher point.
    If the opponent can't point on me, I'l have some nice shots.

    10/7 24/22

    Paul

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  • From Stick Rice@21:1/5 to Tim Chow on Thu May 12 22:22:23 2022
    On Thursday, May 12, 2022 at 9:48:05 AM UTC-4, Tim Chow wrote:
    XGID=-a---BDBBaA--B--aade---bB-:1:-1:1:32:0:0:0:0:10

    X:Player 1 O:Player 2
    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
    +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+
    | X O O O | | O O X | +---+
    | X O | | O O X | | 2 |
    | O | | O | +---+
    | O | | O |
    | | | O |
    | |BAR| |
    | | | |
    | | | X |
    | | | X |
    | X X | | X X |
    | X O X X | | X X O |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 148 O: 119 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 2, O own cube
    X to play 32

    ---
    Tim Chow

    You're not wrong.

    Stick

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From atilamalcok@gmail.com@21:1/5 to All on Sat May 14 09:13:35 2022
    13 Mayıs 2022 Cuma tarihinde saat 08:22:25 UTC+3 itibarıyla Stick Rice şunları yazdı:
    On Thursday, May 12, 2022 at 9:48:05 AM UTC-4, Tim Chow wrote:
    XGID=-a---BDBBaA--B--aade---bB-:1:-1:1:32:0:0:0:0:10

    X:Player 1 O:Player 2
    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+
    | X O O O | | O O X | +---+
    | X O | | O O X | | 2 |
    | O | | O | +---+
    | O | | O |
    | | | O |
    | |BAR| |
    | | | |
    | | | X |
    | | | X |
    | X X | | X X |
    | X O X X | | X X O |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 148 O: 119 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 2, O own cube
    X to play 32

    ---
    Tim Chow
    You're not wrong.

    Stick
    We have seen that the tempo play is not just about hitting. It's a very nice position.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pepstein5@gmail.com@21:1/5 to atila...@gmail.com on Sat May 14 09:26:31 2022
    On Saturday, May 14, 2022 at 5:13:36 PM UTC+1, atila...@gmail.com wrote:
    13 Mayıs 2022 Cuma tarihinde saat 08:22:25 UTC+3 itibarıyla Stick Rice şunları yazdı:
    On Thursday, May 12, 2022 at 9:48:05 AM UTC-4, Tim Chow wrote:
    XGID=-a---BDBBaA--B--aade---bB-:1:-1:1:32:0:0:0:0:10

    X:Player 1 O:Player 2
    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+
    | X O O O | | O O X | +---+
    | X O | | O O X | | 2 |
    | O | | O | +---+
    | O | | O |
    | | | O |
    | |BAR| |
    | | | |
    | | | X |
    | | | X |
    | X X | | X X |
    | X O X X | | X X O |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 148 O: 119 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 2, O own cube
    X to play 32

    ---
    Tim Chow
    You're not wrong.

    Stick
    We have seen that the tempo play is not just about hitting. It's a very nice position.
    The tempo play duplicates the opponent's aces and plays like a dream when the opponent dances which happens 11% of the time.
    Playing anything other than 6/1* must be a blajor munder.

    Paul

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pepstein5@gmail.com@21:1/5 to atila...@gmail.com on Sat May 14 09:23:41 2022
    On Saturday, May 14, 2022 at 5:13:36 PM UTC+1, atila...@gmail.com wrote:
    13 Mayıs 2022 Cuma tarihinde saat 08:22:25 UTC+3 itibarıyla Stick Rice şunları yazdı:
    On Thursday, May 12, 2022 at 9:48:05 AM UTC-4, Tim Chow wrote:
    XGID=-a---BDBBaA--B--aade---bB-:1:-1:1:32:0:0:0:0:10

    X:Player 1 O:Player 2
    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+
    | X O O O | | O O X | +---+
    | X O | | O O X | | 2 |
    | O | | O | +---+
    | O | | O |
    | | | O |
    | |BAR| |
    | | | |
    | | | X |
    | | | X |
    | X X | | X X |
    | X O X X | | X X O |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 148 O: 119 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 2, O own cube
    X to play 32

    ---
    Tim Chow
    You're not wrong.

    Stick
    We have seen that the tempo play is not just about hitting. It's a very nice position.

    Oh, I see. We play 6/1* to stop the opponent's pointmaking.
    I didn't see that actually.
    I'm not surprised that this play is immediate and obvious for someone of Stick's strength.

    Paul

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Timothy Chow@21:1/5 to All on Sat May 14 16:18:49 2022
    XGID=-a---BDBBaA--B--aade---bB-:1:-1:1:32:0:0:0:0:10

    X:Player 1 O:Player 2
    Score is X:0 O:0. Unlimited Game
    +13-14-15-16-17-18------19-20-21-22-23-24-+
    | X O O O | | O O X | +---+
    | X O | | O O X | | 2 |
    | O | | O | +---+
    | O | | O |
    | | | O |
    | |BAR| |
    | | | |
    | | | X |
    | | | X |
    | X X | | X X |
    | X O X X | | X X O |
    +12-11-10--9--8--7-------6--5--4--3--2--1-+
    Pip count X: 148 O: 119 X-O: 0-0
    Cube: 2, O own cube
    X to play 32

    Finding the bot play here isn't so easy, but there is an easier
    question that I still see lots of players getting wrong: What's
    your game plan? X is way behind in the pip count. O has big
    stacks, and X already has a prime forming. So the answer is:
    X's game plan is to prime. O, on the other hand, prefers to
    race or attack. In particular, any play involving 24/22 or
    24/21 *is not even a candidate*. You should not even think
    about touching those back checkers. What do you think you're
    accomplishing? You're not trying to race. You're not in grave
    danger of getting primed. Playing 24/22 or 24/21 just gives O
    a chance to unload those stacks on your head. This theme comes
    up over and over again, sometimes as early as the third roll of
    a game, such as if you open with 8/5 6/5 and your opponent rolls
    55 and plays 13/3(2). If this happens, what's your game plan?
    If you didn't immediately say that you want to prime then I'll
    come over to your house and beat you over the head with a foam
    bat until you say it. And if you then roll 32 and split then
    you deserve to lose.

    Even after you decide that you want to prime, though, there
    are still a few options. You can give yourself partial credit
    for 13/10 6/4 because that's at least a reasonable strategic
    idea---making 5 out of 6 points and slotting the front of the
    prime. However, the bot play is 7/4 6/4. This is similar to
    the first problem in this year's Othello quiz, although in one
    way it's trickier because O's sixes aren't duplicated. But it
    does make the strongest bid for a good prime. Leaving a double
    shot is bold, but Magriel's criteria all point to a bold play.

    1. Rollout¹ 7/4 6/4 eq:+0.121
    Player: 60.76% (G:19.77% B:1.38%)
    Opponent: 39.24% (G:14.95% B:1.71%)
    Confidence: ±0.010 (+0.111..+0.132) - [100.0%]

    2. Rollout¹ 13/10 6/4 eq:+0.073 (-0.048)
    Player: 60.48% (G:15.99% B:0.88%)
    Opponent: 39.52% (G:14.69% B:1.64%)
    Confidence: ±0.011 (+0.062..+0.084) - [0.0%]

    3. Rollout¹ 10/7 6/4 eq:+0.024 (-0.097)
    Player: 57.74% (G:16.42% B:0.92%)
    Opponent: 42.26% (G:14.16% B:1.25%)
    Confidence: ±0.013 (+0.011..+0.037) - [0.0%]

    4. Rollout¹ 6/1* eq:-0.012 (-0.133)
    Player: 55.48% (G:20.20% B:1.73%)
    Opponent: 44.52% (G:16.15% B:1.72%)
    Confidence: ±0.012 (-0.024..+0.001) - [0.0%]

    5. Rollout¹ 13/11 13/10 eq:-0.016 (-0.137)
    Player: 56.58% (G:15.47% B:0.77%)
    Opponent: 43.42% (G:13.92% B:1.05%)
    Confidence: ±0.011 (-0.026..-0.005) - [0.0%]

    6. Rollout¹ 10/5 eq:-0.025 (-0.146)
    Player: 55.69% (G:16.04% B:0.81%)
    Opponent: 44.31% (G:13.18% B:0.95%)
    Confidence: ±0.010 (-0.035..-0.014) - [0.0%]

    ¹ 1296 Games rolled with Variance Reduction.
    Dice Seed: 271828
    Moves: 3-ply, cube decisions: XG Roller

    eXtreme Gammon Version: 2.19.207.pre-release

    ---
    Tim Chow

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