I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other
side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many
country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my
50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst
dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a
full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's
from the other side of the metro area and has been enjoying
my showing him the many country roads around here. But he
injured his back (not while cycling) so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the
city center then out in a different direction onto more
rural roads, riding to a couple libraries I've not yet
ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential
neighborhood, when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt
with thousands of dogs in my 50+ years of riding. I've
written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I was once quoted
on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst dog
encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite
attempt; it was a full body impact, delivered silently at
full sprint speed. The neighborhood had small scale lots
with plenty of shrubs for his lurking. I didn't even see him
until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have
gone down anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front
fender was a guarantee. Two witnesses stopped to check on
me, and they said the dog had fled west on an intersecting
street. They said they'd seen the dog running loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden
told me by phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not
optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the
bike seems otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure
that if I had been wearing a helmet, it would have been
smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling cap obviously saved
my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of
avid adult cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other
side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many
country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my
50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst
dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a
full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems >otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many
country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my
50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst
dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a
full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
--
- Frank Krygowski
On Fri, 22 Sep 2023 19:42:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other >side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many >country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a >couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my >50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst >dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a >full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The >neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running >loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by >phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems >otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult >cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.I assume you're writing something that you hope will get printed in
the local paper. Mustn't let an opportunity to see your name in print
go to waste. Maybe they'll send somebody out to interview you and get
a photo of your bent fender..
On Saturday, September 23, 2023 at 1:42:07 AM UTC+2, Frank Krygowski wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my 50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
--You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
- Frank Krygowski
Lou
On Fri, 22 Sep 2023 19:42:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other >>side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many >>country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my >>50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst
dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a >>full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by >>phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems >>otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult >>cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
I assume you're writing something that you hope will get printed in
the local paper. Mustn't let an opportunity to see your name in print
go to waste. Maybe they'll send somebody out to interview you and get
a photo of your bent fender.
On Sat, 23 Sep 2023 07:12:42 -0400, Catrike Rider
<sol...@drafting.not> wrote:
On Fri, 22 Sep 2023 19:42:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski ><frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other >>side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many >>country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling) >>so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center >>then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a >>couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood, >>when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my >>50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I >>was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst >>dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a >>full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The >>neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking. >>I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down >>anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee. >>Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled >>west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running >>loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by >>phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems >>otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing >>a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling >>cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult >>cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
I assume you're writing something that you hope will get printed inHey! I've lived in foreign countries for 50 years, or more, and rode a bicycle in many of them.
the local paper. Mustn't let an opportunity to see your name in print
go to waste. Maybe they'll send somebody out to interview you and get
a photo of your bent fender.
Can I get my name in the paper too?
--
Cheers,
John B.
On Sat, 23 Sep 2023 07:12:42 -0400, Catrike Rider
<soloman@drafting.not> wrote:
On Fri, 22 Sep 2023 19:42:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski >><frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other >>>side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many >>>country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center >>>then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a >>>couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood, >>>when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my >>>50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I >>>was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst >>>dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a >>>full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The >>>neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking. >>>I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down >>>anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running >>>loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by >>>phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems >>>otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing >>>a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult >>>cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
I assume you're writing something that you hope will get printed in
the local paper. Mustn't let an opportunity to see your name in print
go to waste. Maybe they'll send somebody out to interview you and get
a photo of your bent fender.
Hey! I've lived in foreign countries for 50 years, or more, and rode a >bicycle in many of them.
Can I get my name in the paper too?
On 9/22/2023 6:42 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the
other side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the
many country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while
cycling) so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in
my 50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes,
and I was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was
my worst dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was
a full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his
lurking. I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems
otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been
wearing a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton
cycling cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
Sorry to hear that. Best wishes on healing (very different than when we
were young)
On Saturday, September 23, 2023 at 1:42:07 AM UTC+2, Frank Krygowski wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other
side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many
country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my
50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst
dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a
full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems
otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
--
- Frank Krygowski
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
On 9/23/2023 8:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
On Saturday, September 23, 2023 at 1:42:07 AM UTC+2, Frank
Krygowski wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's
from the other
side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing
him the many
country roads around here. But he injured his back (not
while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the
city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads,
riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential
neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with
thousands of dogs in my
50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs.
bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine.
This was my worst
dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite
attempt; it was a
full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint
speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs
for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have
gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was
a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the
dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the
dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog
warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but
the bike seems
otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I
had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my
cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of
avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
--
- Frank Krygowski
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
Again, it's a dense old-style neighborhood. I'm assuming the
dog was in some shrubbery close to the road, and took off at
full sprint speed. I saw him only when he was about five
feet away, moving full speed.
It was remarkable, in that I've never had such an
experience, nor anything close, in 50+ years. I could tell
about some dog experiences I did have, but of course I'd be
accused by the resident jerks of making them up.
On 9/23/2023 12:13 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
Again, it's a dense old-style neighborhood. I'm assuming the dog was
in some shrubbery close to the road, and took off at full sprint
speed. I saw him only when he was about five feet away, moving full
speed.
It was remarkable, in that I've never had such an experience, nor
anything close, in 50+ years. I could tell about some dog experiences
I did have, but of course I'd be accused by the resident jerks of
making them up.
Much like deer running downhill and across country roads from tree cover.
On 9/22/2023 6:42 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:Sorry to hear about a dog incident but we certainly could have done without the negative helmet comment. This could only mean that he moves quite slowly so that in a fall he has time to protect his head.
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's
from the other side of the metro area and has been enjoying
my showing him the many country roads around here. But he
injured his back (not while cycling) so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the
city center then out in a different direction onto more
rural roads, riding to a couple libraries I've not yet
ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential
neighborhood, when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt
with thousands of dogs in my 50+ years of riding. I've
written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I was once quoted
on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst dog
encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite
attempt; it was a full body impact, delivered silently at
full sprint speed. The neighborhood had small scale lots
with plenty of shrubs for his lurking. I didn't even see him
until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have
gone down anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front
fender was a guarantee. Two witnesses stopped to check on
me, and they said the dog had fled west on an intersecting
street. They said they'd seen the dog running loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden
told me by phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not
optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the
bike seems otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure
that if I had been wearing a helmet, it would have been
smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling cap obviously saved
my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of
avid adult cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
Sorry to hear that. Best wishes on healing (very different
than when we were young)
--
Andrew Muzi
a...@yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
On 9/23/2023 1:22 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/23/2023 12:13 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
Again, it's a dense old-style neighborhood. I'm assuming the dog was
in some shrubbery close to the road, and took off at full sprint
speed. I saw him only when he was about five feet away, moving full
speed.
It was remarkable, in that I've never had such an experience, nor
anything close, in 50+ years. I could tell about some dog experiences
I did have, but of course I'd be accused by the resident jerks of
making them up.
Much like deer running downhill and across country roads from tree cover.
I've had that experience on a bike as well, but instead of a country
road it was in a densely wooded metropark. I avoided the deer by the
hardest high-speed (~30 mph) braking I'd ever done on a bike.
On Sat, 23 Sep 2023 19:52:16 +0700, John B. <sloc...@gmail.com>
wrote:
On Sat, 23 Sep 2023 07:12:42 -0400, Catrike Rider
<sol...@drafting.not> wrote:
On Fri, 22 Sep 2023 19:42:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski >><frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other >>>side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many >>>country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling) >>>so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center >>>then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a >>>couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood, >>>when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my >>>50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I >>>was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst >>>dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a >>>full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The >>>neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking. >>>I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down >>>anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee. >>>Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled >>>west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running >>>loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by >>>phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems >>>otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing >>>a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling >>>cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult >>>cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
I assume you're writing something that you hope will get printed in
the local paper. Mustn't let an opportunity to see your name in print
go to waste. Maybe they'll send somebody out to interview you and get
a photo of your bent fender.
Hey! I've lived in foreign countries for 50 years, or more, and rode a >bicycle in many of them.
Can I get my name in the paper too?
"I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine."
Frank Krygowski
https://groups.google.com/g/rec.bicycles.tech/c/yq515TehOdo/m/inwa25KMBQAJ
I suspect the puppy came out to say "hello" and Krygoski, who
apparently fears and hates dogs, over reacted, jerked his bike around, causing his foot to slip off the flat pedals, and making him hit the
poor critter.
I hope the puppy wasn't hurt.
My wife and I stopped for ice cream yesterday and in a shaded outdoor seating area, we met, petted and scratched the ears of a delightful rottweiler named "rocky" who belonged to another couple enjoying their
ice cream. He won't bite," the gentleman told us. "I know," I replied.
I can quickly and easily detirmine a dog's intentions, and Rocky was obvioulsy looking for a meet and greet.
On Friday, September 22, 2023 at 6:01:01 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/22/2023 6:42 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He'sSorry to hear that. Best wishes on healing (very different
from the other side of the metro area and has been enjoying
my showing him the many country roads around here. But he
injured his back (not while cycling) so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the
city center then out in a different direction onto more
rural roads, riding to a couple libraries I've not yet
ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential
neighborhood, when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt
with thousands of dogs in my 50+ years of riding. I've
written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I was once quoted
on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst dog
encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite
attempt; it was a full body impact, delivered silently at
full sprint speed. The neighborhood had small scale lots
with plenty of shrubs for his lurking. I didn't even see him
until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have
gone down anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front
fender was a guarantee. Two witnesses stopped to check on
me, and they said the dog had fled west on an intersecting
street. They said they'd seen the dog running loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden
told me by phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not
optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the
bike seems otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure
that if I had been wearing a helmet, it would have been
smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling cap obviously saved
my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of
avid adult cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
than when we were young)
Sorry to hear about a dog incident but we certainly could have done without the negative helmet comment. This could only mean that he moves quite slowly so that in a fall he has time to protect his head.
On 9/23/2023 12:13 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/23/2023 8:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
On Saturday, September 23, 2023 at 1:42:07?AM UTC+2, Frank
Krygowski wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's
from the other
side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing
him the many
country roads around here. But he injured his back (not
while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the
city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads,
riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential
neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with
thousands of dogs in my
50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs.
bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine.
This was my worst
dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite
attempt; it was a
full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint
speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs
for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have
gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was
a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the
dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the
dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog
warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but
the bike seems
otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I
had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my
cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of
avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
--
- Frank Krygowski
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
Again, it's a dense old-style neighborhood. I'm assuming the
dog was in some shrubbery close to the road, and took off at
full sprint speed. I saw him only when he was about five
feet away, moving full speed.
It was remarkable, in that I've never had such an
experience, nor anything close, in 50+ years. I could tell
about some dog experiences I did have, but of course I'd be
accused by the resident jerks of making them up.
Much like deer running downhill and across country roads
from tree cover.
On 9/23/2023 8:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
On Saturday, September 23, 2023 at 1:42:07?AM UTC+2, Frank Krygowski wrote: >>> I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other >>> side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many
country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my >>> 50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst
dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a
full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking. >>> I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems
otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing >>> a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
--
- Frank Krygowski
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
Again, it's a dense old-style neighborhood. I'm assuming the dog was in
some shrubbery close to the road, and took off at full sprint speed. I
saw him only when he was about five feet away, moving full speed.
It was remarkable, in that I've never had such an experience, nor
anything close, in 50+ years. I could tell about some dog experiences I
did have, but of course I'd be accused by the resident jerks of making
them up.
On Sat, 23 Sep 2023 12:22:56 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 9/23/2023 12:13 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/23/2023 8:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
On Saturday, September 23, 2023 at 1:42:07?AM UTC+2, Frank
Krygowski wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's
from the other
side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing
him the many
country roads around here. But he injured his back (not
while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the
city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads,
riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential
neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with
thousands of dogs in my
50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs.
bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine.
This was my worst
dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite
attempt; it was a
full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint
speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs
for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have
gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was
a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the
dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the
dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog
warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but
the bike seems
otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I
had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my
cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of
avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
--
- Frank Krygowski
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
Again, it's a dense old-style neighborhood. I'm assuming the
dog was in some shrubbery close to the road, and took off at
full sprint speed. I saw him only when he was about five
feet away, moving full speed.
It was remarkable, in that I've never had such an
experience, nor anything close, in 50+ years. I could tell
about some dog experiences I did have, but of course I'd be
accused by the resident jerks of making them up.
Much like deer running downhill and across country roads
from tree cover.
Had one of those a few weeks ago.
On 9/23/2023 1:27 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Friday, September 22, 2023 at 6:01:01 PM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/22/2023 6:42 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He'sSorry to hear that. Best wishes on healing (very different
from the other side of the metro area and has been enjoying
my showing him the many country roads around here. But he
injured his back (not while cycling) so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the
city center then out in a different direction onto more
rural roads, riding to a couple libraries I've not yet
ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential
neighborhood, when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt
with thousands of dogs in my 50+ years of riding. I've
written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I was once quoted
on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst dog
encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite
attempt; it was a full body impact, delivered silently at
full sprint speed. The neighborhood had small scale lots
with plenty of shrubs for his lurking. I didn't even see him
until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have
gone down anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front
fender was a guarantee. Two witnesses stopped to check on
me, and they said the dog had fled west on an intersecting
street. They said they'd seen the dog running loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden
told me by phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not
optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the
bike seems otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure
that if I had been wearing a helmet, it would have been
smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling cap obviously saved
my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of
avid adult cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
than when we were young)
Sorry to hear about a dog incident but we certainly could have done
without the negative helmet comment. This could only mean that he moves
quite slowly so that in a fall he has time to protect his head.
What negative?
He crashed, hit his head and lived.
Without the Magic Cotton Safety Cap he may well indeed have
died. It saved his life!
On 9/23/2023 3:24 PM, Catrike Rider wrote:
On Sat, 23 Sep 2023 12:22:56 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 9/23/2023 12:13 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/23/2023 8:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
On Saturday, September 23, 2023 at 1:42:07?AM UTC+2, Frank
Krygowski wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's
from the other
side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing
him the many
country roads around here. But he injured his back (not
while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the
city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads,
riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential
neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with
thousands of dogs in my
50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs.
bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine.
This was my worst
dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite
attempt; it was a
full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint
speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs
for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have
gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was
a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the
dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the
dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog
warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but
the bike seems
otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I
had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my
cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of
avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
--
- Frank Krygowski
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
Again, it's a dense old-style neighborhood. I'm assuming the
dog was in some shrubbery close to the road, and took off at
full sprint speed. I saw him only when he was about five
feet away, moving full speed.
It was remarkable, in that I've never had such an
experience, nor anything close, in 50+ years. I could tell
about some dog experiences I did have, but of course I'd be
accused by the resident jerks of making them up.
Much like deer running downhill and across country roads
from tree cover.
Had one of those a few weeks ago.
And oh so much more in Florida!
https://nypost.com/2023/09/22/10-foot-alligator-caught-carrying-lifeless-floridian-down-a-canal/
Sorry to hear about a dog incident but we certainly could have done without the negative helmet comment. This could only mean that he moves quite slowly so that in a fall he has time to protect his head.
On 9/23/2023 2:27 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
Sorry to hear about a dog incident but we certainly could have done
without the negative helmet comment. This could only mean that he moves
quite slowly so that in a fall he has time to protect his head.
I'm sorry, I forgot the 11th commandment: "Thou shalt show no skepticism regarding helmets."
Today I got a sort of email post card from two friends visiting Chicago.
The friend who wrote the email said that as they rode along, using bike
share bikes, some guy passed them and said "You forgot your helmets."
As if anyone who might possibly use a bike share should carry a helmet
with them at all times!
Helmet shamers are obnoxious nannies. They deserve pushback, in the name
of freedom of choice.
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many
country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my
50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst
dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a
full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
--
- Frank Krygowski
On Saturday, September 23, 2023 at 12:12:57 PM UTC+1, Catrike Rider wrote:stare which usually causes them to pause and take a step bag, and when I step towards turn tail and run, one day when the idiot dog came close to me to snarl at my ankles, I caught him in the mouth, hauled him into the air, and kicked him just once under
On Fri, 22 Sep 2023 19:42:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski <frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other >side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many >country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling) >so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center >then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a >couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood, >when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my >50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I >was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst >dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a >full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The >neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking. >I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down >anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee. >Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled >west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running >loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by >phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems >otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing >a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling >cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult >cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.I assume you're writing something that you hope will get printed in
the local paper. Mustn't let an opportunity to see your name in print
go to waste. Maybe they'll send somebody out to interview you and get
a photo of your bent fender..
Aw, come on, Catrike, at least the local dog box liner can't call Franki-boy a "scold" again for being put down by a dog.
For years when a dog threatened us, my family would say, "Do a Rexie on him, Dad." Rex was a prise-winning King Charles Spaniel so inbred that he was quite stupid. Since he was so stupid he was immune to my usual remedy for ill-mannered dogs of a hard
Here's a tip for you, Franki-boy. If you don't want a dog to put you down again, develop some personality. That, of course, is the difficult bit, especially for you, but, after you have some personality, it is not difficult to impress your personalityon an animal as dumb as a dog, or a cat, or even a fox or a hedgehog -- my pets are a fox family which lives at the bottom of the orchard and a hedgehog family from behind the old stables.
Andre Jute
PS If you can't manage personality, Franki-boy, carry a piece of bacon in your pocket and dogs will love you instead of fearing you.
On Fri, 22 Sep 2023 19:42:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other >side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many >country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a >couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my >50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst >dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a >full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The >neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running >loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by >phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems >otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult >cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
Frank Krygowski <frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 9/23/2023 2:27 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
Sorry to hear about a dog incident but we certainly could have done
without the negative helmet comment. This could only mean that he moves >> quite slowly so that in a fall he has time to protect his head.
I'm sorry, I forgot the 11th commandment: "Thou shalt show no skepticism regarding helmets."
Today I got a sort of email post card from two friends visiting Chicago. The friend who wrote the email said that as they rode along, using bike share bikes, some guy passed them and said "You forgot your helmets."
As if anyone who might possibly use a bike share should carry a helmet with them at all times!
Helmet shamers are obnoxious nannies. They deserve pushback, in the name of freedom of choice.
Hire bike or scooter and so on don’t work well with helmets, as it removes the spontaneity aspect of it, and adds barriers.
Boris bikes, ie london hire bikes don’t require helmets and to the best of my knowledge the risks are within normal range. Note that though not mandatory most london commuters will be wearing helmets.
Roger Merriman
On 9/23/2023 3:24 PM, Catrike Rider wrote:
On Sat, 23 Sep 2023 12:22:56 -0500, AMuzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
On 9/23/2023 12:13 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/23/2023 8:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
On Saturday, September 23, 2023 at 1:42:07?AM UTC+2, Frank
Krygowski wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's
from the other
side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing
him the many
country roads around here. But he injured his back (not
while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the
city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads,
riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential
neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with
thousands of dogs in my
50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs.
bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine.
This was my worst
dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite
attempt; it was a
full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint
speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs
for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have
gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was
a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the
dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the
dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog
warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but
the bike seems
otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I
had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my
cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of
avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
--
- Frank Krygowski
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
Again, it's a dense old-style neighborhood. I'm assuming the
dog was in some shrubbery close to the road, and took off at
full sprint speed. I saw him only when he was about five
feet away, moving full speed.
It was remarkable, in that I've never had such an
experience, nor anything close, in 50+ years. I could tell
about some dog experiences I did have, but of course I'd be
accused by the resident jerks of making them up.
Much like deer running downhill and across country roads
from tree cover.
Had one of those a few weeks ago.And oh so much more in Florida!
https://nypost.com/2023/09/22/10-foot-alligator-caught-carrying-lifeless-floridian-down-a-canal/
On Sunday, September 24, 2023 at 4:05:52 AM UTC-7, Roger Meriman wrote:life but because the largest cause of injuries ranging from mild to very serious are one vehicle falls. While helmets will not save your life and may even cause your head to strike the ground due to their weight, they will minimize injuries in these much
Frank Krygowski <frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 9/23/2023 2:27 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
Sorry to hear about a dog incident but we certainly could have done
without the negative helmet comment. This could only mean that he moves >> quite slowly so that in a fall he has time to protect his head.
I'm sorry, I forgot the 11th commandment: "Thou shalt show no skepticism regarding helmets."
Today I got a sort of email post card from two friends visiting Chicago. The friend who wrote the email said that as they rode along, using bike share bikes, some guy passed them and said "You forgot your helmets."
As if anyone who might possibly use a bike share should carry a helmet with them at all times!
Helmet shamers are obnoxious nannies. They deserve pushback, in the name of freedom of choice.
Hire bike or scooter and so on don’t work well with helmets, as it removes
the spontaneity aspect of it, and adds barriers.
Boris bikes, ie london hire bikes don’t require helmets and to the best of
my knowledge the risks are within normal range. Note that though not mandatory most london commuters will be wearing helmets.
Roger MerrimanLong ago in another galaxy far, far away I wrote the original study showing that helmets have no effect on deaths. Anyone that claims that they life was saved by a helmet is crazy. But I do not recommend the use of helmets because they will save your
Because of my recommendation Krygowski has taken it upon himself to make anti-helmet comments where ever they can be shoe-horned in, He is a sick person with a sick mind and because he rides so slowly that he can normally put a foot down he believesthat proves me wrong.
... Krygowski has taken it upon himself to make anti-helmet comments where ever they can be shoe-horned in ...
On Friday, September 22, 2023 at 7:42:07 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:d. the dog took off yelping, I'm sure I cracked a few of it's ribs. When I finally made it home and inspected the bike, I found dog hairs embedded in between the tire and rim.
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other
side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the many
country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my
50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst
dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a
full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems
otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
--
- Frank Krygowski
Condolences...I suffered a similar incident albeit over 20 years ago - a large dog darted out of a driveway when I was on a training ride - we were moving at a pretty good clip - I t-boned the dog and endoed, landing on my back, The front wheel taco'
As far as regrettable - there really isn't anything to regret. It wasn't your fault, there wasn't anything you could have done different. Heal well!
On Saturday, September 23, 2023 at 8:34:52?AM UTC-4, shit stain wrote:stare which usually causes them to pause and take a step bag, and when I step towards turn tail and run, one day when the idiot dog came close to me to snarl at my ankles, I caught him in the mouth, hauled him into the air, and kicked him just once under
On Saturday, September 23, 2023 at 12:12:57?PM UTC+1, Catrike Rider wrote: >> > On Fri, 22 Sep 2023 19:42:01 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:Aw, come on, Catrike, at least the local dog box liner can't call Franki-boy a "scold" again for being put down by a dog.
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's from the other >> > >side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing him the manyI assume you're writing something that you hope will get printed in
country roads around here. But he injured his back (not while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads, riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with thousands of dogs in my >> > >50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs. bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine. This was my worst >> > >dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite attempt; it was a >> > >full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs for his lurking. >> > >I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but the bike seems
otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I had been wearing >> > >a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
the local paper. Mustn't let an opportunity to see your name in print
go to waste. Maybe they'll send somebody out to interview you and get
a photo of your bent fender..
For years when a dog threatened us, my family would say, "Do a Rexie on him, Dad." Rex was a prise-winning King Charles Spaniel so inbred that he was quite stupid. Since he was so stupid he was immune to my usual remedy for ill-mannered dogs of a hard
even get a lawyer to mess with me, on my suggestion bragged in a low bar he would normally not be seen dead in of how much he made out of this dog's breeding, and a gypsy in the bar obligingly stole it, and the owner collected on the insurance!on an animal as dumb as a dog, or a cat, or even a fox or a hedgehog -- my pets are a fox family which lives at the bottom of the orchard and a hedgehog family from behind the old stables.
Here's a tip for you, Franki-boy. If you don't want a dog to put you down again, develop some personality. That, of course, is the difficult bit, especially for you, but, after you have some personality, it is not difficult to impress your personality
Andre Jute
PS If you can't manage personality, Franki-boy, carry a piece of bacon in your pocket and dogs will love you instead of fearing you.
Shit stain doesn't need to worry about dogs attacking him because dogs merely sniff the pile and the leave their own mark.
On 9/24/2023 7:41 AM, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
On Friday, September 22, 2023 at 7:42:07 PM UTC-4, Frank
Krygowski wrote:
I'd planned another mostly rural ride with a friend. He's
from the other
side of the metro area and has been enjoying my showing
him the many
country roads around here. But he injured his back (not
while cycling)
so I was on my own.
I started on what should be an interesting ride, into the
city center
then out in a different direction onto more rural roads,
riding to a
couple libraries I've not yet ridden to.
I made it about five miles, going through a residential
neighborhood,
when I was nailed hard by a dog. I've dealt with
thousands of dogs in my
50+ years of riding. I've written articles about dogs vs.
bikes, and I
was once quoted on the issue in _Bicycling_ magazine.
This was my worst
dog encounter.
This dog gave absolutely no warning. It wasn't a bite
attempt; it was a
full body impact, delivered silently at full sprint
speed. The
neighborhood had small scale lots with plenty of shrubs
for his lurking.
I didn't even see him until he was within five feet.
He hit the back side of my front tire. I'm sure I'd have
gone down
anyway, but my front tire sucking in my front fender was
a guarantee.
Two witnesses stopped to check on me, and they said the
dog had fled
west on an intersecting street. They said they'd seen the
dog running
loose many times.
Of course there's a leash law, and of course the dog
warden told me by
phone that they'd look for the dog, but I'm not optimistic.
The fender is trashed and my saddle frame is bent, but
the bike seems
otherwise OK. I did hit my head, and I'm sure that if I
had been wearing
a helmet, it would have been smashed. But as it is, my
cotton cycling
cap obviously saved my life!
This was my third moving on-road fall in over 50 years of
avid adult
cycling in about a dozen countries. Regrettable.
--
- Frank Krygowski
Condolences...I suffered a similar incident albeit over
20 years ago - a large dog darted out of a driveway when I
was on a training ride - we were moving at a pretty good
clip - I t-boned the dog and endoed, landing on my back,
The front wheel taco'd. the dog took off yelping, I'm sure
I cracked a few of it's ribs. When I finally made it home
and inspected the bike, I found dog hairs embedded in
between the tire and rim.
As far as regrettable - there really isn't anything to
regret. It wasn't your fault, there wasn't anything you
could have done different. Heal well!
Thanks. I just regret that it happened. You're correct in
that there was nothing I could have done. In fact, nobody
riding in my place could have done anything.
My closest experience to yours was probably 25 years ago, on
a long fast ride (140 mile, IIRC) with two friends. We were
on a super-narrow super-quiet rural road and violating the
law by riding three abreast. I was in the middle. A small
dog, maybe 10" high at the shoulder, suddenly ran out from a
hidden position right in front of me. I had nowhere to go
but up, so I jumped the dog. My rear wheel didn't quite
clear him, and it seemed to break his shoulder. One front
leg was disabled, and he was squealing and scooting circles,
pivoting around that front shoulder on the road. We woke the
young guy living at the house. He seemed very unconcerned.
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week
to jump an unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a
downhill. My buddy hit it and cursed pretty loudly.
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump an unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill.
--
- Frank Krygowski
On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 1:41:21 AM UTC+1, Frank Krygowski wrote:their time, is to advise them to jump their bicycles over obstacles. This is a poor show from someone who pretends to be "a spokesman for bicycles".
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump an unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill.
--
- Frank Krygowski
Put your brains, such as they are, in gear before you make stupid comments, Franki-boy. The last thing you want to do on a "discussion" group of senior citizens for whom a broken hip will very likely end their cycling days, and perhaps kill them before
Andre Jute
has authorised this message in on behalf of Common Sense.
On 9/23/2023 7:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
<snip>
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
That's essentially the key issue where the whole AHZ
narrative breaks down. You can ride very carefully but you
can't anticipate a driver running a red light, a dog chasing
you or a dog running in front of you to investigate another
dog (this is what caused my last fall), a low-hanging branch
(except in Ohio), or a number of other things that can cause
a fall that results in a head-impact crash.
On 9/25/2023 9:40 AM, sms wrote:
On 9/23/2023 7:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
<snip>
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
That's essentially the key issue where the whole AHZ
narrative breaks down. You can ride very carefully but you
can't anticipate a driver running a red light, a dog chasing
you or a dog running in front of you to investigate another
dog (this is what caused my last fall), a low-hanging branch
(except in Ohio), or a number of other things that can cause
a fall that results in a head-impact crash.
And yet, with his Magic Cotton Safety Headgear, he lived.
--
Andrew Muzi
a...@yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
On 9/23/2023 7:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
<snip>
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.That's essentially the key issue where the whole AHZ narrative breaks
down. You can ride very carefully but you can't anticipate a driver
running a red light, a dog chasing you or a dog running in front of you
to investigate another dog (this is what caused my last fall), a
low-hanging branch (except in Ohio), or a number of other things that
can cause a fall that results in a head-impact crash.
--
“If you are not an expert on a subject, then your opinions about it
really do matter less than the opinions of experts. It's not
indoctrination nor elitism. It's just that you don't know as much as
they do about the subject.”—Tin Foil Awards
On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 3:40:17 PM UTC+1, sms wrote:being killed. A better design and material of helmet may yet do that without too much of a weight penalty, but meanwhile the available cycling helmets, if sensibly chosen to have a visor or some other structure ahead of the forehead, do a good job of
On 9/23/2023 7:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
<snip>
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.That's essentially the key issue where the whole AHZ narrative breaks down. You can ride very carefully but you can't anticipate a driver running a red light, a dog chasing you or a dog running in front of you
to investigate another dog (this is what caused my last fall), a low-hanging branch (except in Ohio), or a number of other things that
can cause a fall that results in a head-impact crash.
--
“If you are not an expert on a subject, then your opinions about it really do matter less than the opinions of experts. It's not indoctrination nor elitism. It's just that you don't know as much as
they do about the subject.”—Tin Foil Awards
Nah, the AHZ make themselves ridiculous well before that point by their transparent junior-high debating trick of trying to make out that the only case they have to answer is that cycling helmets serve the single purpose of preventing cyclists from
Andre Jute
Mind you, America is the only place on earth where I found hard and extremely credible evidence for a mandatory bicycle helmet edict being a beneficial thing for cyclists.
On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 7:50:58 AM UTC-7, Andre Jute wrote:before their time, is to advise them to jump their bicycles over obstacles. This is a poor show from someone who pretends to be "a spokesman for bicycles".
On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 1:41:21 AM UTC+1, Frank Krygowski wrote: >>>
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump anPut your brains, such as they are, in gear before you make stupid comments, Franki-boy. The last thing you want to do on a "discussion" group of senior citizens for whom a broken hip will very likely end their cycling days, and perhaps kill them
unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill.
--
- Frank Krygowski
Frank was at the front of the Stupid 4 telling everyone that obviously I couldn't ride because I couldn't see into dark shadows and see a pothole, thereby breaking a spoke. But his jumping a 30 lb bicycle over a trench is brilliant.Andre Jute
has authorised this message in on behalf of Common Sense.
Frank has criticized helmets every chance he gets.
I WAS wearing a helmet which no doubt saved me from a broken skull ...
So it is a little foolish to act as if he doesn't need one because he doesn't like them. But it is HIS decision. My only complaints is that his making anti-helmet comments is entirely out of place.
On 9/25/2023 9:40 AM, sms wrote:
On 9/23/2023 7:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
<snip>
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
That's essentially the key issue where the whole AHZ narrative breaks
down. You can ride very carefully but you can't anticipate a driver
running a red light, a dog chasing you or a dog running in front of
you to investigate another dog (this is what caused my last fall), a
low-hanging branch (except in Ohio)...
... or a number of other things that
can cause a fall that results in a head-impact crash.
And yet, with his Magic Cotton Safety Headgear, he lived.
On 9/23/2023 7:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
<snip>
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
That's essentially the key issue where the whole AHZ narrative breaks
down. You can ride very carefully but you can't anticipate a driver
running a red light, a dog chasing you or a dog running in front of you
to investigate another dog (this is what caused my last fall), a
low-hanging branch (except in Ohio), or a number of other things that
can cause a fall that results in a head-impact crash.
sms <scharf...@geemail.com> wrote:It is most uncommon for people to hit their heads with any force. It is instinctive to protect your head. But the chances of a severe injury if you DO hit your head and the sheer commonness of falling on a bike just make using a helmet good sense. Being
On 9/23/2023 7:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
<snip>
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
That's essentially the key issue where the whole AHZ narrative breaks down. You can ride very carefully but you can't anticipate a driver running a red light, a dog chasing you or a dog running in front of you
to investigate another dog (this is what caused my last fall), a low-hanging branch (except in Ohio), or a number of other things that
can cause a fall that results in a head-impact crash.
I’m not following the logic here? That folks might have crashed on bikes be
they helmet or no helmets can’t imagine being any difference.
And do folks really hit their head with most crashes? I certainly don’t hips is most common impact point and shoulders.
Take cars out of the equation and the risks drop dramatically, and the idea that a helmet will protect in such a situation? Really not happening.
In pro sport much like most sports cycling and road cycling in particular needs to do better, see Stefan Küng being allowed to compete with a significant head injury.
Not the only sport by any means but the nature of brain injuries is that
the sport player are highly unlikely to want to stop that decision needs to be made by others who have capacity.
Note for example rugby players who played on in match’s they can’t remember
rugby does to its credit have protocols at least in the professional game.
Roger Merriman
But the chances of a severe injury if you DO hit your head and the sheer commonness of falling on a bike just make using a helmet good sense.
On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 1:41:21?AM UTC+1, Frank Krygowski wrote:their time, is to advise them to jump their bicycles over obstacles. This is a poor show from someone who pretends to be "a spokesman for bicycles".
Put your brains, such as they are, in gear before you make stupid comments, Franki-boy. The last thing you want to do on a "discussion" group of senior citizens for whom a broken hip will very likely end their cycling days, and perhaps kill them before
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump an
unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill.
--
- Frank Krygowski
Andre Jute
has authorised this message in on behalf of Common Sense.
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 07:50:55 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jutebefore their time, is to advise them to jump their bicycles over obstacles. This is a poor show from someone who pretends to be "a spokesman for bicycles".
<fiultra1@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 1:41:21?AM UTC+1, Frank Krygowski wrote: >>>
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump anPut your brains, such as they are, in gear before you make stupid comments, Franki-boy. The last thing you want to do on a "discussion" group of senior citizens for whom a broken hip will very likely end their cycling days, and perhaps kill them
unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill.
--
- Frank Krygowski
Andre Jute
has authorised this message in on behalf of Common Sense.
I'd have to see Krygowski actually do it before I believed he could
get both wheels off the ground at the same time.
On 9/25/2023 3:08 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
But the chances of a severe injury if you DO hit your head and the sheer commonness of falling on a bike just make using a helmet good sense.
I don't know about how often Tom crashes, but my "sheer commonness" has
been three moving on-road falls in 50+ years of avid adult riding. I
fell more when I used to do adventurous mountain biking, but I never hit
my head.
And looking at fatal brain injuries (since those stats are most
precise), there are only about 400 bike TBI fatalities in a typical year.
By contrast: from
https://www.cdc.gov/traumaticbraininjury/get_the_facts.html
There were over 69,000 TBI-related deaths in the United States in
2021.3 Thats about 190 TBI-related deaths every day.
or from >https://stokesstemle.com/blog/how-common-are-traumatic-brain-injuries-after-car-accidents/
"Traumatic brain injuries are extremely common in the United States. >Information from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) >indicates there were roughly 61,000 TBI-related deaths nationwide in the >recently reported year.
"Additional research from the CDC shows car accidents are among the most >common causes of TBIs. The CDCs latest Surveillance Report on TBIs
shows motor-vehicle accidents were the cause of about 25 percent of all
brain injuries for the data year."
So the total TBI fatality count is uncertain. Using the lower estimate,
that would be over 15,000 motorist TBI fatalities. Cyclists are just 3%
of that. And cyclists are about 0.6% of the total TBI fatalities.
Not particularly common! When, oh when, will we get helmets on the other
99% of the victims?
On 9/25/2023 4:15 PM, Catrike Rider wrote:before their time, is to advise them to jump their bicycles over obstacles. This is a poor show from someone who pretends to be "a spokesman for bicycles".
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 07:50:55 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jute
<fiultra1@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 1:41:21?AM UTC+1, Frank Krygowski wrote: >>>>
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump an >>>> unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill.Put your brains, such as they are, in gear before you make stupid comments, Franki-boy. The last thing you want to do on a "discussion" group of senior citizens for whom a broken hip will very likely end their cycling days, and perhaps kill them
--
- Frank Krygowski
Andre Jute
has authorised this message in on behalf of Common Sense.
I'd have to see Krygowski actually do it before I believed he could
get both wheels off the ground at the same time.
It's not that hard for a foot of utility trench. A set of
railroad tracks is a bit much at our age. And neither with a
tricycle!
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 16:11:20 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 9/25/2023 3:08 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
But the chances of a severe injury if you DO hit your head and theI don't know about how often Tom crashes, but my "sheer commonness" has
sheer commonness of falling on a bike just make using a helmet good sense. >>
been three moving on-road falls in 50+ years of avid adult riding. I
fell more when I used to do adventurous mountain biking, but I never hit
my head.
And looking at fatal brain injuries (since those stats are most
precise), there are only about 400 bike TBI fatalities in a typical year.
By contrast: from
https://www.cdc.gov/traumaticbraininjury/get_the_facts.html
There were over 69,000 TBI-related deaths in the United States in
2021.3 Thats about 190 TBI-related deaths every day.
or from
https://stokesstemle.com/blog/how-common-are-traumatic-brain-injuries-after-car-accidents/
"Traumatic brain injuries are extremely common in the United States.
Information from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC)
indicates there were roughly 61,000 TBI-related deaths nationwide in the
recently reported year.
"Additional research from the CDC shows car accidents are among the most
common causes of TBIs. The CDCs latest Surveillance Report on TBIs
shows motor-vehicle accidents were the cause of about 25 percent of all
brain injuries for the data year."
So the total TBI fatality count is uncertain. Using the lower estimate,
that would be over 15,000 motorist TBI fatalities. Cyclists are just 3%
of that. And cyclists are about 0.6% of the total TBI fatalities.
Not particularly common! When, oh when, will we get helmets on the other
99% of the victims?
When, oh when, will everybody just get their noses out of everybody
else's bycycling preferences and mind their own business.
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 16:11:20 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 9/25/2023 3:08 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
But the chances of a severe injury if you DO hit your head and the sheer commonness of falling on a bike just make using a helmet good sense.
I don't know about how often Tom crashes, but my "sheer commonness" has >>been three moving on-road falls in 50+ years of avid adult riding. I
fell more when I used to do adventurous mountain biking, but I never hit
my head.
And looking at fatal brain injuries (since those stats are most
precise), there are only about 400 bike TBI fatalities in a typical year.
By contrast: from >>https://www.cdc.gov/traumaticbraininjury/get_the_facts.html
There were over 69,000 TBI-related deaths in the United States in
2021.3 Thats about 190 TBI-related deaths every day.
or from >>https://stokesstemle.com/blog/how-common-are-traumatic-brain-injuries-after-car-accidents/
"Traumatic brain injuries are extremely common in the United States. >>Information from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) >>indicates there were roughly 61,000 TBI-related deaths nationwide in the >>recently reported year.
"Additional research from the CDC shows car accidents are among the most >>common causes of TBIs. The CDCs latest Surveillance Report on TBIs
shows motor-vehicle accidents were the cause of about 25 percent of all >>brain injuries for the data year."
So the total TBI fatality count is uncertain. Using the lower estimate, >>that would be over 15,000 motorist TBI fatalities. Cyclists are just 3%
of that. And cyclists are about 0.6% of the total TBI fatalities.
Not particularly common! When, oh when, will we get helmets on the other >>99% of the victims?
When, oh when, will everybody just get their noses out of everybody
else's bycycling preferences and mind their own business.
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 16:11:20 -0400, Frank KrygowskiBoth sides can get somewhat evangelical!
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 9/25/2023 3:08 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
But the chances of a severe injury if you DO hit your head and theI don't know about how often Tom crashes, but my "sheer commonness" has
sheer commonness of falling on a bike just make using a helmet good sense. >>>
been three moving on-road falls in 50+ years of avid adult riding. I
fell more when I used to do adventurous mountain biking, but I never hit >>> my head.
And looking at fatal brain injuries (since those stats are most
precise), there are only about 400 bike TBI fatalities in a typical year. >>>
By contrast: from
https://www.cdc.gov/traumaticbraininjury/get_the_facts.html
There were over 69,000 TBI-related deaths in the United States in
2021.3 Thats about 190 TBI-related deaths every day.
or from
https://stokesstemle.com/blog/how-common-are-traumatic-brain-injuries-after-car-accidents/
"Traumatic brain injuries are extremely common in the United States.
Information from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC)
indicates there were roughly 61,000 TBI-related deaths nationwide in the >>> recently reported year.
"Additional research from the CDC shows car accidents are among the most >>> common causes of TBIs. The CDCs latest Surveillance Report on TBIs
shows motor-vehicle accidents were the cause of about 25 percent of all
brain injuries for the data year."
So the total TBI fatality count is uncertain. Using the lower estimate,
that would be over 15,000 motorist TBI fatalities. Cyclists are just 3%
of that. And cyclists are about 0.6% of the total TBI fatalities.
Not particularly common! When, oh when, will we get helmets on the other >>> 99% of the victims?
Though it’s in some places and for some people government mandated which as Tom notes doesn’t population wise have merit.
And I’d argue that in general barriers to cycling or any form of exercise or personal mobility should be avoided unless necessary.
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 18:12:48 -0400, Catrike Rider
<soloman@drafting.not> wrote:
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 16:11:20 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 9/25/2023 3:08 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
But the chances of a severe injury if you DO hit your head and the sheer commonness of falling on a bike just make using a helmet good sense.
I don't know about how often Tom crashes, but my "sheer commonness" has
been three moving on-road falls in 50+ years of avid adult riding. I
fell more when I used to do adventurous mountain biking, but I never hit >>> my head.
And looking at fatal brain injuries (since those stats are most
precise), there are only about 400 bike TBI fatalities in a typical year. >>>
By contrast: from
https://www.cdc.gov/traumaticbraininjury/get_the_facts.html
“There were over 69,000 TBI-related deaths in the United States in
2021.3 That’s about 190 TBI-related deaths every day.”
or from
https://stokesstemle.com/blog/how-common-are-traumatic-brain-injuries-after-car-accidents/
"Traumatic brain injuries are extremely common in the United States.
Information from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC)
indicates there were roughly 61,000 TBI-related deaths nationwide in the >>> recently reported year.
"Additional research from the CDC shows car accidents are among the most >>> common causes of TBIs. The CDC’s latest Surveillance Report on TBIs
shows motor-vehicle accidents were the cause of about 25 percent of all
brain injuries for the data year."
So the total TBI fatality count is uncertain. Using the lower estimate,
that would be over 15,000 motorist TBI fatalities. Cyclists are just 3%
of that. And cyclists are about 0.6% of the total TBI fatalities.
Not particularly common! When, oh when, will we get helmets on the other >>> 99% of the victims?
When, oh when, will everybody just get their noses out of everybody
else's bycycling preferences and mind their own business.
What Frank ignores is the CDC statement that:
"Each year, nearly 1,000 persons die from injuries caused by bicycle
crashes, and 550,000 persons are treated in emergency departments for injuries related to bicycle riding. Approximately 6% of the bicycle
riders treated in emergency departments require hospitalization. Head injuries account for 62% of bicycle-related deaths, for 33% of bicycle-related emergency department visits, and for 67% of
bicycle-related hospital admissions. " https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00036941.htm
But, really, what is the hoopalla about a helmet? As I've mentioned, I remember when "hard hats" were made mandatory for guys working on "the
floor" of an oil drilling rig. Nobody threw a tantrum about it. In
fact the first hard hats were aluminum and guys sort of competed about
the scenes and figures then they had embossed on the aluminum shell.
On 9/25/2023 9:40 AM, sms wrote:
On 9/23/2023 7:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
<snip>
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
That's essentially the key issue where the whole AHZ narrative breaks
down. You can ride very carefully but you can't anticipate a driver
running a red light, a dog chasing you or a dog running in front of
you to investigate another dog (this is what caused my last fall), a
low-hanging branch (except in Ohio), or a number of other things that
can cause a fall that results in a head-impact crash.
And yet, with his Magic Cotton Safety Headgear, he lived.
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump an unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill. My buddy hit
it and cursed pretty loudly.
--
- Frank Krygowski
What Frank ignores is the CDC statement that:
"Each year, nearly 1,000 persons die from injuries caused by bicycle
crashes, and 550,000 persons are treated in emergency departments for injuries related to bicycle riding. Approximately 6% of the bicycle
riders treated in emergency departments require hospitalization. Head injuries account for 62% of bicycle-related deaths, for 33% of bicycle-related emergency department visits, and for 67% of
bicycle-related hospital admissions. " https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00036941.htm
But, really, what is the hoopalla about a helmet? As I've mentioned, I remember when "hard hats" were made mandatory for guys working on "the
floor" of an oil drilling rig. Nobody threw a tantrum about it. In
fact the first hard hats were aluminum and guys sort of competed about
the scenes and figures then they had embossed on the aluminum shell.
On 9/25/2023 10:38 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/25/2023 9:40 AM, sms wrote:
On 9/23/2023 7:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
<snip>
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
That's essentially the key issue where the whole AHZ
narrative breaks down. You can ride very carefully but
you can't anticipate a driver running a red light, a dog
chasing you or a dog running in front of you to
investigate another dog (this is what caused my last
fall), a low-hanging branch (except in Ohio), or a number
of other things that can cause a fall that results in a
head-impact crash.
And yet, with his Magic Cotton Safety Headgear, he lived.
Yes, and that feeds into the false narrative. "I fell and
hit my head while not wearing a helmet and that proves that
helmets are worthless." Sadly, that is often not the result
in head-impact crash.
On 9/25/2023 9:07 PM, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 18:12:48 -0400, Catrike Rider
<soloman@drafting.not> wrote:
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 16:11:20 -0400, Frank Krygowski
<frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
On 9/25/2023 3:08 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
But the chances of a severe injury if you DO hit your head and the
sheer commonness of falling on a bike just make using a helmet good sense.
I don't know about how often Tom crashes, but my "sheer commonness" has >>>> been three moving on-road falls in 50+ years of avid adult riding. I
fell more when I used to do adventurous mountain biking, but I never hit >>>> my head.
And looking at fatal brain injuries (since those stats are most
precise), there are only about 400 bike TBI fatalities in a typical year. >>>>
By contrast: from
https://www.cdc.gov/traumaticbraininjury/get_the_facts.html
“There were over 69,000 TBI-related deaths in the United States in
2021.3 That’s about 190 TBI-related deaths every day.”
or from
https://stokesstemle.com/blog/how-common-are-traumatic-brain-injuries-after-car-accidents/
"Traumatic brain injuries are extremely common in the United States.
Information from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC)
indicates there were roughly 61,000 TBI-related deaths nationwide in the >>>> recently reported year.
"Additional research from the CDC shows car accidents are among the most >>>> common causes of TBIs. The CDC’s latest Surveillance Report on TBIs
shows motor-vehicle accidents were the cause of about 25 percent of all >>>> brain injuries for the data year."
So the total TBI fatality count is uncertain. Using the lower estimate, >>>> that would be over 15,000 motorist TBI fatalities. Cyclists are just 3% >>>> of that. And cyclists are about 0.6% of the total TBI fatalities.
Not particularly common! When, oh when, will we get helmets on the other >>>> 99% of the victims?
When, oh when, will everybody just get their noses out of everybody
else's bycycling preferences and mind their own business.
What Frank ignores is the CDC statement that:
"Each year, nearly 1,000 persons die from injuries caused by bicycle
crashes, and 550,000 persons are treated in emergency departments for
injuries related to bicycle riding. Approximately 6% of the bicycle
riders treated in emergency departments require hospitalization. Head
injuries account for 62% of bicycle-related deaths, for 33% of
bicycle-related emergency department visits, and for 67% of
bicycle-related hospital admissions. "
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00036941.htm
No, John, I don't ignore that. Instead, I put it in context.
The U.S. is a big country. All numbers are big. Is "nearly 1000" deaths
cause for scaring people away from cycling, or convincing them to buy ineffective protective measures? Then why is the same logic not applied
to the 6500+ pedestrians who die each year, or the ~40,000 motorist fatalities?
Even accepting your 62% TBI (which is far more than the ~45% found in
The Centers for Disease Control & Prevention, in Victor G. Coronado et.
al., "Surveillance for Traumatic Brain Injury Related Deaths, United
States, 1997-2007" Surveillance Summaries May 6, 2011 / 60(SS05); 1-32),
the number of bike TBI fatalities comes nowhere near the 15,000 motorist fatalities.
But, really, what is the hoopalla about a helmet? As I've mentioned, I
remember when "hard hats" were made mandatory for guys working on "the
floor" of an oil drilling rig. Nobody threw a tantrum about it. In
fact the first hard hats were aluminum and guys sort of competed about
the scenes and figures then they had embossed on the aluminum shell.
Based on your weak logic, you really should wear a helmet each time you
ride in a motor vehicle. To use your words, don't "throw a tantrum about
it." Do it!
If you can't be logical, at least be consistent.
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 07:50:55 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jute
<fiultra1@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 1:41:21?AM UTC+1, Frank Krygowski wrote: >>>
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump anPut your brains, such as they are, in gear before you make stupid
unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill.
--
- Frank Krygowski
comments, Franki-boy. The last thing you want to do on a "discussion"
group of senior citizens for whom a broken hip will very likely end
their cycling days, and perhaps kill them before their time, is to
advise them to jump their bicycles over obstacles. This is a poor show
from someone who pretends to be "a spokesman for bicycles".
Andre Jute
has authorised this message in on behalf of Common Sense.
I'd have to see Krygowski actually do it before I believed he could
get both wheels off the ground at the same time.
On 9/25/2023 8:07 PM, John B. wrote:
<snip>
What Frank ignores is the CDC statement that:
"Each year, nearly 1,000 persons die from injuries caused by bicycle
crashes, and 550,000 persons are treated in emergency departments for
injuries related to bicycle riding. Approximately 6% of the bicycle
riders treated in emergency departments require hospitalization. Head
injuries account for 62% of bicycle-related deaths, for 33% of
bicycle-related emergency department visits, and for 67% of
bicycle-related hospital admissions. "
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00036941.htm
What those statistics can't show is the number of people that don't end
up in the ER at all because they were wearing a helmet.
But, really, what is the hoopalla about a helmet? As I've mentioned, I
remember when "hard hats" were made mandatory for guys working on "the
floor" of an oil drilling rig. Nobody threw a tantrum about it. In
fact the first hard hats were aluminum and guys sort of competed about
the scenes and figures then they had embossed on the aluminum shell.
It's a lot of manufactured antagonism from those that have a lack
critical thinking and analysis skills and that will always find an
excuse to ignore the data and to ignore the statements by experts. There
is a long list of excuses that they endlessly repeat.
While I don't think there should be a mandatory helmet law, at least for >adults, there is zero evidence that such laws have any reduction in
cycling numbers. In some countries without any such laws cycling numbers
have plunged, and in some countries with such laws cycling numbers have >increased.
On Sunday, September 24, 2023 at 8:41:21?PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:the front tire footprint at that moment) but how does that back wheel come up? Or are your legs strong enough to power you into the air directly?
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump an
unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill. My buddy hit
it and cursed pretty loudly.
--
- Frank Krygowski
Maybe I did that when I was a kid, can't remember back that far. Now past 70, it's a skill I don't intend to practice.
But I'm curious. Do you need to be locked into pedals to do it? I can see pulling up the front wheel (with some warning - my last fall was a sommersault over the front wheel by braking too hard, I was astonished by how close the balance point was to
Catrike Rider <soloman@drafting.not> wrote:
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 07:50:55 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jute
<fiultra1@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 1:41:21?AM UTC+1, Frank Krygowski wrote: >>>>
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump an >>>> unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill.Put your brains, such as they are, in gear before you make stupid
--
- Frank Krygowski
comments, Franki-boy. The last thing you want to do on a "discussion"
group of senior citizens for whom a broken hip will very likely end
their cycling days, and perhaps kill them before their time, is to
advise them to jump their bicycles over obstacles. This is a poor show
from someone who pretends to be "a spokesman for bicycles".
Andre Jute
has authorised this message in on behalf of Common Sense.
I'd have to see Krygowski actually do it before I believed he could
get both wheels off the ground at the same time.
Has he claimed it or this been made up/misread by folks wanting to have a
go?
Getting both wheels off if momentarily isnt difficult speed bump if your
no jumper, and pull gently on the bars will do it. Or something bigger such >as a drop off at which point wheels off is easy its just landing or at
least well!
Roger Merriman
On Tue, 26 Sep 2023 12:42:10 GMT, Roger Meriman <roger@sarlet.com>
wrote:
Catrike Rider <soloman@drafting.not> wrote:
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 07:50:55 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jute
<fiultra1@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 1:41:21?AM UTC+1, Frank Krygowski wrote: >>>>>
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump an >>>>> unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill.Put your brains, such as they are, in gear before you make stupid
--
- Frank Krygowski
comments, Franki-boy. The last thing you want to do on a "discussion"
group of senior citizens for whom a broken hip will very likely end
their cycling days, and perhaps kill them before their time, is to
advise them to jump their bicycles over obstacles. This is a poor show >>>> from someone who pretends to be "a spokesman for bicycles".
Andre Jute
has authorised this message in on behalf of Common Sense.
I'd have to see Krygowski actually do it before I believed he could
get both wheels off the ground at the same time.
Has he claimed it or this been made up/misread by folks wanting to have a
go?
Getting both wheels off if momentarily isnt difficult speed bump if your >> no jumper, and pull gently on the bars will do it. Or something bigger such >> as a drop off at which point wheels off is easy its just landing or at
least well!
Roger Merriman
I think the term "jump" means to get both wheels off the ground at the
sae time. Doing it one wheel at a time is child's play...
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 07:50:55 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jute
<fiultra1@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 1:41:21?AM UTC+1, Frank Krygowski wrote: >>>
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump anPut your brains, such as they are, in gear before you make stupid
unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill.
--
- Frank Krygowski
comments, Franki-boy. The last thing you want to do on a "discussion"
group of senior citizens for whom a broken hip will very likely end
their cycling days, and perhaps kill them before their time, is to
advise them to jump their bicycles over obstacles. This is a poor show
from someone who pretends to be "a spokesman for bicycles".
Andre Jute
has authorised this message in on behalf of Common Sense.
I'd have to see Krygowski actually do it before I believed he could
get both wheels off the ground at the same time.
Catrike Rider <soloman@drafting.not> wrote:
On Tue, 26 Sep 2023 12:42:10 GMT, Roger Meriman <roger@sarlet.com>
wrote:
Catrike Rider <soloman@drafting.not> wrote:
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 07:50:55 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jute
<fiultra1@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 1:41:21?AM UTC+1, Frank Krygowski wrote: >>>>>>
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump an >>>>>> unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill.Put your brains, such as they are, in gear before you make stupid
--
- Frank Krygowski
comments, Franki-boy. The last thing you want to do on a "discussion" >>>>> group of senior citizens for whom a broken hip will very likely end
their cycling days, and perhaps kill them before their time, is to
advise them to jump their bicycles over obstacles. This is a poor show >>>>> from someone who pretends to be "a spokesman for bicycles".
Andre Jute
has authorised this message in on behalf of Common Sense.
I'd have to see Krygowski actually do it before I believed he could
get both wheels off the ground at the same time.
Has he claimed it or this been made up/misread by folks wanting to have a >>> go?
Getting both wheels off if momentarily isn?t difficult speed bump if your >>> no jumper, and pull gently on the bars will do it. Or something bigger such >>> as a drop off at which point wheels off is easy it?s just landing or at
least well!
Roger Merriman
I think the term "jump" means to get both wheels off the ground at the
sae time. Doing it one wheel at a time is child's play...
Assuming you have a ramp be that say speed bump and use a wee bit of motion >on the bike getting two wheels off is easy enough or drop offs where by
its nature both wheels will leave the ground.
And for drop off the worse thing folks do is to panic and slow so the front >wheel drops and they can endo/go over the bars.
Roger Merriman
Catrike Rider <soloman@drafting.not> wrote:
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 07:50:55 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jute
<fiultra1@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 1:41:21?AM UTC+1, Frank Krygowski wrote: >>>>
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump an >>>> unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill.Put your brains, such as they are, in gear before you make stupid
--
- Frank Krygowski
comments, Franki-boy. The last thing you want to do on a "discussion"
group of senior citizens for whom a broken hip will very likely end
their cycling days, and perhaps kill them before their time, is to
advise them to jump their bicycles over obstacles. This is a poor show
from someone who pretends to be "a spokesman for bicycles".
Andre Jute
has authorised this message in on behalf of Common Sense.
I'd have to see Krygowski actually do it before I believed he could
get both wheels off the ground at the same time.
Okay reading back its some roadworks trench, and his companion rode though >with out issue so maybe he jumped a bit, cant say Ive ever found jumping >useful bar MTB trails.
My road bikes are a Gravel bike and an old MTB both of which will roll >though potholes and what not than will pinch flat a 23/25mm etc tire
without issue.
Reading the road has always served me well, and what you learn quickly off >road particularly if like myself started pre suspension!
Roger Merriman
On 9/26/2023 6:52 AM, sms wrote:
On 9/25/2023 10:38 AM, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/25/2023 9:40 AM, sms wrote:
On 9/23/2023 7:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
<snip>
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
That's essentially the key issue where the whole AHZ
narrative breaks down. You can ride very carefully but
you can't anticipate a driver running a red light, a dog
chasing you or a dog running in front of you to
investigate another dog (this is what caused my last
fall), a low-hanging branch (except in Ohio), or a number
of other things that can cause a fall that results in a
head-impact crash.
And yet, with his Magic Cotton Safety Headgear, he lived.
Yes, and that feeds into the false narrative. "I fell and
hit my head while not wearing a helmet and that proves that
helmets are worthless." Sadly, that is often not the result
in head-impact crash.
Goes both ways.
We're often told that, "I fell, helmeted, and still live!"
'proves' the value of helmets
--
Andrew Muzi
a...@yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
On Tue, 26 Sep 2023 13:24:31 GMT, Roger Meriman <roger@sarlet.com>
wrote:
Catrike Rider <soloman@drafting.not> wrote:
On Mon, 25 Sep 2023 07:50:55 -0700 (PDT), Andre Jute
<fiultra1@yahoo.com> wrote:
On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 1:41:21?AM UTC+1, Frank Krygowski wrote: >>>>>
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump an >>>>> unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill.Put your brains, such as they are, in gear before you make stupid
--
- Frank Krygowski
comments, Franki-boy. The last thing you want to do on a "discussion"
group of senior citizens for whom a broken hip will very likely end
their cycling days, and perhaps kill them before their time, is to
advise them to jump their bicycles over obstacles. This is a poor show >>>> from someone who pretends to be "a spokesman for bicycles".
Andre Jute
has authorised this message in on behalf of Common Sense.
I'd have to see Krygowski actually do it before I believed he could
get both wheels off the ground at the same time.
Okay reading back its some roadworks trench, and his companion rode though >> with out issue so maybe he jumped a bit, cant say Ive ever found jumping >> useful bar MTB trails.
My road bikes are a Gravel bike and an old MTB both of which will roll >> though potholes and what not than will pinch flat a 23/25mm etc tire
without issue.
Reading the road has always served me well, and what you learn quickly off >> road particularly if like myself started pre suspension!
Roger Merriman
A short obstical in the road can be dealt with by first hopping the
front wheel over it, then lifting the back wheel. In fact, just
dropping the front wheel back down hard can actually lift the rear
wheel.
On Tuesday, September 26, 2023 at 5:40:13 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/26/2023 6:52 AM, sms wrote:
On 9/25/2023 10:38 AM, AMuzi wrote:Goes both ways.
On 9/25/2023 9:40 AM, sms wrote:
On 9/23/2023 7:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
<snip>
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
That's essentially the key issue where the whole AHZ
narrative breaks down. You can ride very carefully but
you can't anticipate a driver running a red light, a dog
chasing you or a dog running in front of you to
investigate another dog (this is what caused my last
fall), a low-hanging branch (except in Ohio), or a number
of other things that can cause a fall that results in a
head-impact crash.
And yet, with his Magic Cotton Safety Headgear, he lived.
Yes, and that feeds into the false narrative. "I fell and
hit my head while not wearing a helmet and that proves that
helmets are worthless." Sadly, that is often not the result
in head-impact crash.
We're often told that, "I fell, helmeted, and still live!"
'proves' the value of helmets
While that is a concern because it leads to the idea that "I have a helmet so I am safe" it is still probably preferable to needing one to prevent semi-serious injuries without one.
On 9/26/2023 8:55 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Tuesday, September 26, 2023 at 5:40:13 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:I agree with you.
On 9/26/2023 6:52 AM, sms wrote:While that is a concern because it leads to the idea that "I have a helmet so I am safe" it is still probably preferable to needing one to prevent semi-serious injuries without one.
On 9/25/2023 10:38 AM, AMuzi wrote:Goes both ways.
On 9/25/2023 9:40 AM, sms wrote:
On 9/23/2023 7:11 AM, Lou Holtman wrote:
<snip>
You were not able to anticipate on that? Remarkable.
That's essentially the key issue where the whole AHZ
narrative breaks down. You can ride very carefully but
you can't anticipate a driver running a red light, a dog
chasing you or a dog running in front of you to
investigate another dog (this is what caused my last
fall), a low-hanging branch (except in Ohio), or a number
of other things that can cause a fall that results in a
head-impact crash.
And yet, with his Magic Cotton Safety Headgear, he lived.
Yes, and that feeds into the false narrative. "I fell and
hit my head while not wearing a helmet and that proves that
helmets are worthless." Sadly, that is often not the result
in head-impact crash.
We're often told that, "I fell, helmeted, and still live!"
'proves' the value of helmets
Helmets obviously do something. They just as obviously don't
do everything.
Hence personal evaluation.
--
Andrew Muzi
a...@yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
On 9/25/2023 8:07 PM, John B. wrote:
<snip>
What Frank ignores is the CDC statement that:
"Each year, nearly 1,000 persons die from injuries caused by bicycle
crashes, and 550,000 persons are treated in emergency departments for
injuries related to bicycle riding. Approximately 6% of the bicycle
riders treated in emergency departments require hospitalization. Head
injuries account for 62% of bicycle-related deaths, for 33% of
bicycle-related emergency department visits, and for 67% of
bicycle-related hospital admissions. "
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00036941.htm
What those statistics can't show is the number of people that don't end
up in the ER at all because they were wearing a helmet.
While I don't think there should be a mandatory helmet law, at least for adults, there is zero evidence that such laws have any reduction in
cycling numbers.
On Sunday, September 24, 2023 at 8:41:21 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:past 70, it's a skill I don't intend to practice.
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump an
unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill. My buddy hit
it and cursed pretty loudly.
--
- Frank Krygowski
Maybe I did that when I was a kid, can't remember back that far. Now
But I'm curious. Do you need to be locked into pedals to do it? Ican see pulling up the front wheel (with some warning - my last fall was
Okay reading back it’s some roadworks trench, and his companion rode though with out issue so maybe he jumped a bit, can’t say I’ve ever found jumping
useful bar MTB trails.
On 9/26/2023 8:04 AM, Tim R wrote:
On Sunday, September 24, 2023 at 8:41:21 PM UTC-4, FrankKrygowski wrote:
week to jump anBTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last
downhill. My buddy hitunmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a
it and cursed pretty loudly.
--
- Frank Krygowski
Maybe I did that when I was a kid, can't remember backthat far. Now past 70, it's a skill I don't intend to
practice.
But I'm curious. Do you need to be locked into pedals todo it? I can see pulling up the front wheel (with some
warning - my last fall was a sommersault over the front
wheel by braking too hard, I was astonished by how close the
balance point was to the front tire footprint at that
moment) but how does that back wheel come up? Or are your
legs strong enough to power you into the air directly?
For most of my riding I use old style toe clips and straps;
so my feet are attached to my pedals, but not really locked
in. The straps are at most moderately tight.
It turns out that for me, that's sufficient for jumping. I
learned the skill in the 1970s, partly because one route to
work had some nasty railroad tracks. It's done by pushing my
torso suddenly upward with both arms and legs (ideally
starting from a crouched position) then pulling the bike
upward with both arms and legs. But take care to keep the
steering pointed straight! You want a straight landing.
I haven't tried to jump a railroad track for a long time,
but for years it was a regular event on my ride to and from
work. I did it even with a briefcase on the rear carrier.
It's possible without toe clips or clipless pedals. I can do
it a bit, but not as well as with toe clips; and I'd bet
YouTube has instructions.
I _think_ the physics goes like this: You pop your torso up,
then pull up to lift just the front wheel. This raises the
bike center of mass. Then while your body is still elevated,
you quickly push down on the bars as you contract your legs
to take force off the pedals. The bike rotates around its
center of mass, so while the front wheel is dropping, the
rear wheel is rising.
At least that's how it feels to me. I think the same physics
applies, more or less, to jumping a skateboard.
Maybe someone will dig through YouTube and find instructions.
On 9/26/2023 11:53 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/26/2023 8:04 AM, Tim R wrote:
On Sunday, September 24, 2023 at 8:41:21 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowskiwrote:
jump anBTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to
buddy hitunmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill. My
Now past 70, it's a skill I don't intend to practice.it and cursed pretty loudly.;
;
--
- Frank Krygowski
Maybe I did that when I was a kid, can't remember back that far.
;can see pulling up the front wheel (with some warning - my last fall
But I'm curious. Do you need to be locked into pedals to do it? I
was a sommersault over the front wheel by braking too hard, I was
astonished by how close the balance point was to the front tire
footprint at that moment) but how does that back wheel come up? Or
are your legs strong enough to power you into the air directly?
For most of my riding I use old style toe clips and straps; so my feet
are attached to my pedals, but not really locked in. The straps are at
most moderately tight.
It turns out that for me, that's sufficient for jumping. I learned the
skill in the 1970s, partly because one route to work had some nasty
railroad tracks. It's done by pushing my torso suddenly upward with
both arms and legs (ideally starting from a crouched position) then
pulling the bike upward with both arms and legs. But take care to keep
the steering pointed straight! You want a straight landing.
I haven't tried to jump a railroad track for a long time, but for
years it was a regular event on my ride to and from work. I did it
even with a briefcase on the rear carrier.
It's possible without toe clips or clipless pedals. I can do it a bit,
but not as well as with toe clips; and I'd bet YouTube has instructions.
I _think_ the physics goes like this: You pop your torso up, then pull
up to lift just the front wheel. This raises the bike center of mass.
Then while your body is still elevated, you quickly push down on the
bars as you contract your legs to take force off the pedals. The bike
rotates around its center of mass, so while the front wheel is
dropping, the rear wheel is rising.
At least that's how it feels to me. I think the same physics applies,
more or less, to jumping a skateboard.
Maybe someone will dig through YouTube and find instructions.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjyvGLqNtLI
On Sunday, September 24, 2023 at 8:41:21 PM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
BTW, jumping a bike is a valuable skill. I used it last week to jump an unmarked, badly filled trench across a road on a downhill. My buddy hit
it and cursed pretty loudly.
--Maybe I did that when I was a kid, can't remember back that far. Now past 70, it's a skill I don't intend to practice.
- Frank Krygowski
But I'm curious. Do you need to be locked into pedals to do it?
On 9/26/2023 9:24 AM, Roger Meriman wrote:
Okay reading back it’s some roadworks trench, and his companion rode though
with out issue so maybe he jumped a bit, can’t say I’ve ever found jumping
useful bar MTB trails.
I've jumped one small dog, countless potholes, quite a few transverse
road trenches (badly filled), occasional railroad tracks, many parking
lot speed bumps, some curbs, etc.
That's all with a road or touring bike. I can't jump the touring bike
with a full load, nor the tandem.
It's not an essential skill; but for me, it's been worth knowing.
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