You want to race AAT better on Condor?I think what Davis is getting at, is that there are possibly different tactics/strategies to flying AATs than fixed small traditional turn point tasks. I'd be curious to learn here too. While there are differences between Condor and real life, there
R
On Friday, November 11, 2022 at 9:03:01 PM UTC-7, R wrote:are many similarities as well, including these tactics/strategies. Practicing in Condor can make you a better and faster pilot in real life.
You want to race AAT better on Condor?
RI think what Davis is getting at, is that there are possibly different tactics/strategies to flying AATs than fixed small traditional turn point tasks. I'd be curious to learn here too. While there are differences between Condor and real life, there
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 1:54:48 AM UTC-5, johngf...@gmail.com wrote:are many similarities as well, including these tactics/strategies. Practicing in Condor can make you a better and faster pilot in real life.
On Friday, November 11, 2022 at 9:03:01 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
You want to race AAT better on Condor?
RI think what Davis is getting at, is that there are possibly different tactics/strategies to flying AATs than fixed small traditional turn point tasks. I'd be curious to learn here too. While there are differences between Condor and real life, there
Has Davis competed in real competitions? The SSA legacy website shows none for Davis, but could be outdated. Never having partaken in Condor, I’ll accept your belief it will improve your racing skills since you have done both…Condor and Real.I looked at the flights that Davis has made on OLC and I saw his Condor flights, he needs to stick to Condor. Old Bob, The Purist
So we don’t hijack Davis thread, why don’t we let Condor racers post their thoughts for Davis. If you want all the secrets JohnG …. I advise you to start your own thread.
Could be interesting.
R
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 1:54:48 AM UTC-5, johngf...@gmail.com wrote:are many similarities as well, including these tactics/strategies. Practicing in Condor can make you a better and faster pilot in real life.
On Friday, November 11, 2022 at 9:03:01 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
You want to race AAT better on Condor?
RI think what Davis is getting at, is that there are possibly different tactics/strategies to flying AATs than fixed small traditional turn point tasks. I'd be curious to learn here too. While there are differences between Condor and real life, there
Has Davis competed in real competitions? The SSA legacy website shows none for Davis, but could be outdated. Never having partaken in Condor, I’ll accept your belief it will improve your racing skills since you have done both…Condor and Real.Members.ssa.org is the SSA Contest Management site.
So we don’t hijack Davis thread, why don’t we let Condor racers post their thoughts for Davis. If you want all the secrets JohnG …. I advise you to start your own thread.
Could be interesting.
R
All,with regular racing tasks)? What tricks have you learned?
I am looking for some advice/help. I fly a lot of condor racing tasks and all of the books and literature devolve into the following 4 rules:
climb better, glide better, fly straighter, don't put yourself in jail.
If you analyze several IGC files it is clear the winner did one or more of these things better than their competitors, so it is very clear what to improve on or what to maximize depending on the terrain or weather of the task area.
I win or top 3 most of the condor flights and I have a great understanding of how to follow these 4 rules in regular racing tasks.
When it comes to AAT I am demonstrably middle of the pack. https://www.condor.club/comp/besttimes/0/?id=22068 not just in this one but others I've flown.
Looking at analysis and improvement I am a bit lost - when comparing igc files, what am I looking for? Avg speed determines the winner but how do I maximize it? What tools do you use to analyze AAT igc files to determine where you gained/lost (easy
Come on UH, give them some of your secrets. 😂How about "You can't buy experience but you do pay for it".
What you write reads like work.
They think you’re holding out on them.
R
Dang, Old Bob you're still on here discouraging people? Someone looking to improve and ask questions in the off season. Not all of us are old sky geezers like you that were born with all the knowledge and yet choose not to share it with the community.I haven't met Davis but he's the one putting in countless hours to help implement OGN across the US so we can all benefit from seeing gliders while on the ground, whether thats just around the local club, cross-countries or contests.
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 2:24:17 PM UTC-5, R wrote:
Come on UH, give them some of your secrets. 😂
What you write reads like work.
They think you’re holding out on them.
RHow about "You can't buy experience but you do pay for it".
UH
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 4:29:43 AM UTC-7, R wrote:are many similarities as well, including these tactics/strategies. Practicing in Condor can make you a better and faster pilot in real life.
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 1:54:48 AM UTC-5, johngf...@gmail.com wrote:
On Friday, November 11, 2022 at 9:03:01 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
You want to race AAT better on Condor?I think what Davis is getting at, is that there are possibly different tactics/strategies to flying AATs than fixed small traditional turn point tasks. I'd be curious to learn here too. While there are differences between Condor and real life, there
R
Has Davis competed in real competitions? The SSA legacy website shows none for Davis, but could be outdated. Never having partaken in Condor, I’ll accept your belief it will improve your racing skills since you have done both…Condor and Real.Members.ssa.org is the SSA Contest Management site.
So we don’t hijack Davis thread, why don’t we let Condor racers post their thoughts for Davis. If you want all the secrets JohnG …. I advise you to start your own thread.
Could be interesting.
R
On 11/12/2022 9:25 AM, Frank Whiteley wrote:there are many similarities as well, including these tactics/strategies. Practicing in Condor can make you a better and faster pilot in real life.
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 4:29:43 AM UTC-7, R wrote:
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 1:54:48 AM UTC-5, johngf...@gmail.com wrote:
On Friday, November 11, 2022 at 9:03:01 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
You want to race AAT better on Condor?I think what Davis is getting at, is that there are possibly different tactics/strategies to flying AATs than fixed small traditional turn point tasks. I'd be curious to learn here too. While there are differences between Condor and real life,
R
I'm thinking of entering couple contests next year. Because it's been 10+ years since myHas Davis competed in real competitions? The SSA legacy website shows none for Davis, but could be outdated. Never having partaken in Condor, I’ll accept your belief it will improve your racing skills since you have done both…Condor and Real.Members.ssa.org is the SSA Contest Management site.
So we don’t hijack Davis thread, why don’t we let Condor racers post their thoughts for Davis. If you want all the secrets JohnG …. I advise you to start your own thread.
Could be interesting.
R
last contest, the tasking is very different, and I feel like I'll almost be starting over.
I'm thinking Condor flying might be good way to learn the new rules and particularly the
tasks. Now I just have to find a Condor systme! The EAA group at the airport has a
simulator set up, so I'll start there. It's not running Condor, but has the nifty
controls, screens, and strong computer.
--
Eric Greenwell - USA
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications
Excellent!
Welcome back.
The new established order of the day is to race what makes YOU happy. Many pros and Hall of Famers have taken to
the Sports Class for many reasons….no water, shorter task, simpler task, low pressure/high fun. Ease into it. Now the Nationals Sports Class has become a knife fight, but in a fun way.
Pick your game, elevate the fun. The great thing about the majority get older, no one remembers past last week.
Also, not much has change with Regional Contest.
Make it what you want it to be.
Good luck!
R
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 5:30:53 PM UTC-5, Eric Greenwell wrote:there are many similarities as well, including these tactics/strategies. Practicing in Condor can make you a better and faster pilot in real life.
On 11/12/2022 9:25 AM, Frank Whiteley wrote:
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 4:29:43 AM UTC-7, R wrote:
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 1:54:48 AM UTC-5, johngf...@gmail.com wrote:
On Friday, November 11, 2022 at 9:03:01 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
You want to race AAT better on Condor?I think what Davis is getting at, is that there are possibly different tactics/strategies to flying AATs than fixed small traditional turn point tasks. I'd be curious to learn here too. While there are differences between Condor and real life,
R
Getting up to speed may be easier than I thought. I'll still pursue Condor for contestI'm thinking of entering couple contests next year. Because it's been 10+ years since myHas Davis competed in real competitions? The SSA legacy website shows none for Davis, but could be outdated. Never having partaken in Condor, I’ll accept your belief it will improve your racing skills since you have done both…Condor and Real.Members.ssa.org is the SSA Contest Management site.
So we don’t hijack Davis thread, why don’t we let Condor racers post their thoughts for Davis. If you want all the secrets JohnG …. I advise you to start your own thread.
Could be interesting.
R
last contest, the tasking is very different, and I feel like I'll almost be starting over.
I'm thinking Condor flying might be good way to learn the new rules and particularly the
tasks. Now I just have to find a Condor systme! The EAA group at the airport has a
simulator set up, so I'll start there. It's not running Condor, but has the nifty
controls, screens, and strong computer.
--
Eric Greenwell - USA
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications
Not really so different. Starts and finishes have evolved. At the regional level there is not much change. Find a current mentor and go for it.
My son came back form 10 years off and did just fine.
UH
On 11/12/2022 3:28 PM, R wrote:
Excellent!
Welcome back.
The new established order of the day is to race what makes YOU happy. Many pros and Hall of Famers have taken to
the Sports Class for many reasons….no water, shorter task, simpler task, low pressure/high fun. Ease into it. Now the Nationals Sports Class has become a knife fight, but in a fun way.
Pick your game, elevate the fun. The great thing about the majority get older, no one remembers past last week.
Also, not much has change with Regional Contest.
Make it what you want it to be.
Good luck!
R
Thanks, R. Sport Class may be a good reentry point, given that my 18M ASH26E is not
competitive in 18M class.
--
Eric Greenwell - USA
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications
On Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 10:43:10 AM UTC-6, Eric Greenwell wrote:
On 11/12/2022 3:28 PM, R wrote:
Excellent!Thanks, R. Sport Class may be a good reentry point, given that my 18M ASH26E is not
Welcome back.
The new established order of the day is to race what makes YOU happy. Many pros and Hall of Famers have taken to
the Sports Class for many reasons….no water, shorter task, simpler task, low pressure/high fun. Ease into it. Now the Nationals Sports Class has become a knife fight, but in a fun way.
Pick your game, elevate the fun. The great thing about the majority get older, no one remembers past last week.
Also, not much has change with Regional Contest.
Make it what you want it to be.
Good luck!
R
competitive in 18M class.
--
Eric Greenwell - USA
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications
Hey, Eric. My Nimbus 3 isn't competitive in Open Class, but that doesn't stop me from going to the Nationals and having a blast! I got about 86% of Butler's score with him in Concordia, so I think I did pretty good.
But, as R said, fly for fun and you will have it!
Steve Leonard
Flying the ex-Moffat/Gimmey Nimbus 3
Strange that of all those replies there is only one which discusses ways to get better results from an AAT. Some specifics were mentioned in that:times during the contest day and planning your flight accordingly while keeping some options open.
Go far enough in earlier sectors not to risk running out of distance before the minimum time
Always fly in a direction which maximises the task distance for the distance flown
Try to come in just over the minimum time, while not risking coming in early
Another specific suggestion - always try to turn from the top of a climb, that is equivalent to running into a downwind turnpoint high and an upwind turnpoint low.
But the biggest difference between a racing task and an AAT is that success in AAT's is all about planning. You have to fly in a better area at better times than the other guy. This is about predicting what conditions will be like where at different
Modern flight computers all offer ways to help fly AAT's - generally making it easy to move planned turn locations around within Assigned Areas and to see predicted arrival times (shown as delta times, times over or under the minimum) and guidance ofthe direction to fly with Assigned Areas to maximise task distance. I bet the guys doing well on Condor AAT's are using flight computers.
You should always be faster on an AAT because you choose where to go.
Hope this helps.
All,with regular racing tasks)? What tricks have you learned?
I am looking for some advice/help. I fly a lot of condor racing tasks and all of the books and literature devolve into the following 4 rules:
climb better, glide better, fly straighter, don't put yourself in jail.
If you analyze several IGC files it is clear the winner did one or more of these things better than their competitors, so it is very clear what to improve on or what to maximize depending on the terrain or weather of the task area.
I win or top 3 most of the condor flights and I have a great understanding of how to follow these 4 rules in regular racing tasks.
When it comes to AAT I am demonstrably middle of the pack. https://www.condor.club/comp/besttimes/0/?id=22068 not just in this one but others I've flown.
Looking at analysis and improvement I am a bit lost - when comparing igc files, what am I looking for? Avg speed determines the winner but how do I maximize it? What tools do you use to analyze AAT igc files to determine where you gained/lost (easy
On 11/12/2022 9:25 AM, Frank Whiteley wrote:there are many similarities as well, including these tactics/strategies. Practicing in Condor can make you a better and faster pilot in real life.
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 4:29:43 AM UTC-7, R wrote:
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 1:54:48 AM UTC-5, johngf...@gmail.com wrote:
On Friday, November 11, 2022 at 9:03:01 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
You want to race AAT better on Condor?I think what Davis is getting at, is that there are possibly different tactics/strategies to flying AATs than fixed small traditional turn point tasks. I'd be curious to learn here too. While there are differences between Condor and real life,
R
Looking forward to seeing you at Region 8 Eric!I'm thinking of entering couple contests next year. Because it's been 10+ years since myHas Davis competed in real competitions? The SSA legacy website shows none for Davis, but could be outdated. Never having partaken in Condor, I’ll accept your belief it will improve your racing skills since you have done both…Condor and Real.Members.ssa.org is the SSA Contest Management site.
So we don’t hijack Davis thread, why don’t we let Condor racers post their thoughts for Davis. If you want all the secrets JohnG …. I advise you to start your own thread.
Could be interesting.
R
last contest, the tasking is very different, and I feel like I'll almost be starting over.
I'm thinking Condor flying might be good way to learn the new rules and particularly the
tasks. Now I just have to find a Condor systme! The EAA group at the airport has a
simulator set up, so I'll start there. It's not running Condor, but has the nifty
controls, screens, and strong computer.
--
Eric Greenwell - USA
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications
All,with regular racing tasks)? What tricks have you learned?
I am looking for some advice/help. I fly a lot of condor racing tasks and all of the books and literature devolve into the following 4 rules:
climb better, glide better, fly straighter, don't put yourself in jail.
If you analyze several IGC files it is clear the winner did one or more of these things better than their competitors, so it is very clear what to improve on or what to maximize depending on the terrain or weather of the task area.
I win or top 3 most of the condor flights and I have a great understanding of how to follow these 4 rules in regular racing tasks.
When it comes to AAT I am demonstrably middle of the pack. https://www.condor.club/comp/besttimes/0/?id=22068 not just in this one but others I've flown.
Looking at analysis and improvement I am a bit lost - when comparing igc files, what am I looking for? Avg speed determines the winner but how do I maximize it? What tools do you use to analyze AAT igc files to determine where you gained/lost (easy
On 11/12/2022 3:28 PM, R wrote:Eric, consider the Truckee FAI. It is handicapped, so any glider is competitive (well, within reasonable limits, anyway). We also try to do some California Grand Prix tasking, which is more like.... well, racing.
Excellent!
Welcome back.
The new established order of the day is to race what makes YOU happy. Many pros and Hall of Famers have taken to
the Sports Class for many reasons….no water, shorter task, simpler task, low pressure/high fun. Ease into it. Now the Nationals Sports Class has become a knife fight, but in a fun way.
Pick your game, elevate the fun. The great thing about the majority get older, no one remembers past last week.
Also, not much has change with Regional Contest.
Make it what you want it to be.
Good luck!
R
Thanks, R. Sport Class may be a good reentry point, given that my 18M ASH26E is not
competitive in 18M class.
--
Eric Greenwell - USA
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications
On Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 8:43:10 AM UTC-8, Eric Greenwell wrote:
On 11/12/2022 3:28 PM, R wrote:Eric, consider the Truckee FAI. It is handicapped, so any glider is competitive (well, within reasonable limits, anyway). We also try to do some California Grand Prix tasking, which is more like.... well, racing.
Excellent!Thanks, R. Sport Class may be a good reentry point, given that my 18M ASH26E is not
Welcome back.
The new established order of the day is to race what makes YOU happy. Many pros and Hall of Famers have taken to
the Sports Class for many reasons….no water, shorter task, simpler task, low pressure/high fun. Ease into it. Now the Nationals Sports Class has become a knife fight, but in a fun way.
Pick your game, elevate the fun. The great thing about the majority get older, no one remembers past last week.
Also, not much has change with Regional Contest.
Make it what you want it to be.
Good luck!
R
competitive in 18M class.
--
Eric Greenwell - USA
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 5:30:53 PM UTC-5, Eric Greenwell wrote:there are many similarities as well, including these tactics/strategies. Practicing in Condor can make you a better and faster pilot in real life.
On 11/12/2022 9:25 AM, Frank Whiteley wrote:
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 4:29:43 AM UTC-7, R wrote:
On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 1:54:48 AM UTC-5, johngf...@gmail.com wrote:
On Friday, November 11, 2022 at 9:03:01 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
You want to race AAT better on Condor?I think what Davis is getting at, is that there are possibly different tactics/strategies to flying AATs than fixed small traditional turn point tasks. I'd be curious to learn here too. While there are differences between Condor and real life,
R
Hoping to make Methow and R8!Looking forward to seeing you at Region 8 Eric!I'm thinking of entering couple contests next year. Because it's been 10+ years since myHas Davis competed in real competitions? The SSA legacy website shows none for Davis, but could be outdated. Never having partaken in Condor, I’ll accept your belief it will improve your racing skills since you have done both…Condor and Real.Members.ssa.org is the SSA Contest Management site.
So we don’t hijack Davis thread, why don’t we let Condor racers post their thoughts for Davis. If you want all the secrets JohnG …. I advise you to start your own thread.
Could be interesting.
R
last contest, the tasking is very different, and I feel like I'll almost be starting over.
I'm thinking Condor flying might be good way to learn the new rules and particularly the
tasks. Now I just have to find a Condor systme! The EAA group at the airport has a
simulator set up, so I'll start there. It's not running Condor, but has the nifty
controls, screens, and strong computer.
--
Eric Greenwell - USA
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications
Charlie
On 11/16/2022 8:16 AM, jfitch wrote:Generally in the past no, but now there are a couple of ASH31 based in hangers there. There was some flying after TTSA closed for the season so there may be some in the spring if the day looks good!
On Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 8:43:10 AM UTC-8, Eric Greenwell wrote:It's on the list. Does anyone fly from Truckee before May, when TTSA opens? --
On 11/12/2022 3:28 PM, R wrote:Eric, consider the Truckee FAI. It is handicapped, so any glider is competitive (well, within reasonable limits, anyway). We also try to do some California Grand Prix tasking, which is more like.... well, racing.
Excellent!Thanks, R. Sport Class may be a good reentry point, given that my 18M ASH26E is not
Welcome back.
The new established order of the day is to race what makes YOU happy. Many pros and Hall of Famers have taken to
the Sports Class for many reasons….no water, shorter task, simpler task, low pressure/high fun. Ease into it. Now the Nationals Sports Class has become a knife fight, but in a fun way.
Pick your game, elevate the fun. The great thing about the majority get older, no one remembers past last week.
Also, not much has change with Regional Contest.
Make it what you want it to be.
Good luck!
R
competitive in 18M class.
--
Eric Greenwell - USA
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications
Eric Greenwell - USA
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation" https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications
I'll note that Davis flew his first real-world contest at Region 9 in a field of 22 pilots including some pretty darn good racing pedigrees. He made the podium with 95% of the winner's points. (We can now all speculate from our armchairs as to whetherCondor helped or not).
Not too shabby. Congratulations Davis!wasn't YOUR thermal) was pretty compelling - and occasionally humbling.
I watched some of the action on WeGlide which offered some pretty good excitement since 100% of the pilots were registered. Congrats to the Region 9 team for putting on an excellent show! The day replay feature with all the thermals marked (even if it
Andy Blackburnafter gaining real race experience by improving task execution.
9B
On Tuesday, November 15, 2022 at 11:44:46 PM UTC-8, R wrote:
My thoughts are to get them racing in the real world before we start throwing math problems at them. They need to decide do they want to sit in a room in their underwear playing with their Condor joystick or fly gliders. I believe Condor can help
Congrats Davis! I have “flown” with Davis on Condor many times. He does great there too and I have no doubt that his Condor off-season exploits have been a great training ground for his flying. Condor is a great way to learn both tactical andIf, for unknown reason, Condor is Davis limits, someone with Condor experience would help the most. The thread drifted for lack of a clear way forward.
I hope Davis responds to your ideas and they help him improve in the standings.
Cheers.
R
My thoughts are to get them racing in the real world before we start throwing math problems at them. They need to decide do they want to sit in a room in their underwear playing with their Condor joystick or fly gliders. I believe Condor can help aftergaining real race experience by improving task execution.
If, for unknown reason, Condor is Davis limits, someone with Condor experience would help the most. The thread drifted for lack of a clear way forward.
I hope Davis responds to your ideas and they help him improve in the standings.
Cheers.
R
I'll note that Davis flew his first real-world contest at Region 9 in a field of 22 pilots including some pretty darn good racing pedigrees. He made the podium with 95% of the winner's points. (We can now all speculate from our armchairs as to whetherCondor helped or not).
Not too shabby. Congratulations Davis!wasn't YOUR thermal) was pretty compelling - and occasionally humbling.
I watched some of the action on WeGlide which offered some pretty good excitement since 100% of the pilots were registered. Congrats to the Region 9 team for putting on an excellent show! The day replay feature with all the thermals marked (even if it
Andy Blackburnafter gaining real race experience by improving task execution.
9B
On Tuesday, November 15, 2022 at 11:44:46 PM UTC-8, R wrote:
My thoughts are to get them racing in the real world before we start throwing math problems at them. They need to decide do they want to sit in a room in their underwear playing with their Condor joystick or fly gliders. I believe Condor can help
If, for unknown reason, Condor is Davis limits, someone with Condor experience would help the most. The thread drifted for lack of a clear way forward.
I hope Davis responds to your ideas and they help him improve in the standings.
Cheers.
R
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