• wired - What Happens If a Space Elevator Breaks?

    From a425couple@21:1/5 to All on Sun Jan 23 13:14:46 2022
    XPost: alt.astronomy, alt.books.arthur-clarke, alt.fan.heinlein

    from
    https://www.wired.com/story/what-happens-if-a-space-elevator-breaks/

    What Happens If a Space Elevator Breaks

    These structures are a sci-fi solution to the problem of getting objects
    into orbit without a rocket—but you don’t want to be under one if the
    cable snaps.

    space elevator in foundation
    PHOTOGRAPH: TCD/PROD.DB/APPLE TV+/ALAMY

    IN THE FIRST episode of the Foundation series on Apple TV, we see a
    terrorist try to destroy the space elevator used by the Galactic Empire.
    This seems like a great chance to talk about the physics of space
    elevators and to consider what would happen if one exploded.
    (Hint: It wouldn't be good.)

    People like to put stuff beyond the Earth's atmosphere: It allows us to
    have weather satellites, a space station, GPS satellites, and even the
    James Webb Space Telescope. But right now, our only option for getting
    stuff into space is to strap it to a controlled chemical explosion that
    we usually call "a rocket."

    Don't get me wrong, rockets are cool, but they are also expensive and inefficient. Let's consider what it takes to get a 1-kilogram object
    into low Earth orbit (LEO). This is around 400 kilometers above the
    surface of the Earth, about where the International Space Station is. In
    order to get this object into orbit, you need to accomplish two things.
    First, you need to lift it up 400 kilometers. But if you only increased
    the object’s altitude, it wouldn't be in space for long. It would just
    fall back to Earth. So, second, in order to keep this thing in LEO, it
    has to move—really fast.

    Just a quick refresher on energy: It turns out that the amount of energy
    we put into a system (we call it work) is equal to the change in energy
    in that system. We can mathematically model different types of energy.
    Kinetic energy is the energy an object has due to its velocity. So if
    you increase an object’s velocity, it will increase in kinetic energy. Gravitational potential energy depends on the distance between the
    object and the Earth. This means that increasing an object’s altitude increases the gravitational potential energy.

    So let's say you want to use a rocket to increase the object’s
    gravitational potential energy (to raise it to the right altitude) and
    also increase its kinetic energy (to get it up to speed). Getting into
    orbit is more about speed than height. Only 11 percent of the energy
    would be in the gravitational potential energy. The rest would be kinetic.

    The total energy to get just that 1-kilogram object into orbit would be
    about 33 million joules. For comparison, if you pick up a textbook from
    the floor and put it on a table, that takes about 10 joules. It would
    take a lot more energy to get into orbit.

    But the problem is actually even more difficult than that. With chemical rockets, they don't just need energy to get that 1-kilogram object into orbit—the rockets also need to carry their fuel for the journey to LEO.
    Until they burn this fuel, it's essentially just extra mass for the
    payload, which means they need to launch with even more fuel. For many real-life rockets, up to 85 percent of the total mass can just be fuel.
    That's super inefficient.

    So what if, instead of launching atop a chemical rocket, your object
    could just ride up on a cable that reaches all the way into space?
    That's what would happen with a space elevator.

    Space Elevator Basics

    Suppose you built a giant tower that is 400 kilometers tall. You could
    ride an elevator up to the top and then you would be in space. Simple,
    right? No, actually it's not.

    First, you couldn't easily build a structure like this out of steel; the
    weight would likely compress and collapse the lower parts of the tower.
    Also, it would require massive amounts of material.

    But that's not the biggest problem—there's still the issue with speed. (Remember, you need to move really fast to get into orbit.) If you were standing on the top of a 400-kilometer tower with the base somewhere on
    the Earth's equator, you would indeed be moving, because the planet is rotating—this is just like the motion of a person on the outside of a spinning merry-go-round. Since the Earth rotates about once a day
    (there's a difference between sidereal and synodic rotations), it has an angular velocity of 7.29 x 10-5 radians per second.

    Angular velocity is different than linear velocity. It’s a measure of rotational speed instead of what we normally think of as
    velocity—movement in a straight line. (Radians are a unit of measurement
    to use with rotations, instead of degrees.)

    If two people are standing on a merry-go-round as it spins, they will
    both have the same angular velocity. (Let's say it's 1 radian per
    second.) However, the person that is farther from the center of rotation
    will be moving faster. Let's say one person is 1 meter from the center
    and the other person is 3 meters from the center. Their speeds will be 1
    m/s and 3 m/s respectively. This same thing works with a rotating Earth.
    It's possible to get far enough away such that the Earth's rotation
    gives you the required orbital velocity to stay in orbit around the planet.

    So let’s go back to our example of a person standing on the top of a 400-kilometer tower. Are they far enough away from Earth that they can
    stay in orbit? For one complete rotation of the Earth, their angular
    velocity would be 2Ï€ radians per day. That might not seem very fast, but
    at the equator this rotation gives you a speed of 465 meters per second.
    That's over 1,000 miles per hour. However, it's still not enough. The
    orbital velocity (the velocity needed to stay in orbit) at that altitude
    is 7.7 kilometers per second, or over 17,000 miles per hour.

    Actually, there's another factor: As you increase your distance from the
    Earth, the orbital velocity also decreases. If you go from an altitude
    of 400 to 800 kilometers above the surface of the Earth, the orbital
    speed decreases from 7.7 km/s to 7.5 km/s. That doesn't seem like a
    large difference, but remember, it's really the orbital radius that
    matters and not just the height above the surface of the Earth.
    Theoretically, you could build a magical tower that was high enough that
    you could just step off of it and be in orbit—but it would have to be
    36,000 kilometers tall. That’s not going to happen.


    Here is something that's very cool and more practical: An orbit at the
    altitude of 36,000 kilometers has a special name. It's called a
    geosynchronous orbit, meaning that the time it takes an object to
    complete one orbit is exactly the same time it takes the Earth to
    rotate. If you put this object in an orbit directly over the equator, it
    will appear in the same location in the sky relative to the surface of
    the Earth. (Then it's called a geostationary orbit.) That's useful,
    because you know exactly where to find it. A geostationary orbit makes
    it easier to communicate with objects like TV or weather satellites, or
    for satellite cameras that need to stay focused on the same part of the
    Earth.

    OK, back to the space elevator. If we can’t build a tower from the
    ground up, we can hang a 36,000-kilometer cable from an object that’s in
    a geostationary orbit. Boom: That's the space elevator.

    To get this to work, you would need a large mass in orbit—either a space station or a small asteroid. The mass has to be large so that it doesn't
    get pulled out of orbit every time something climbs up the cable.

    But perhaps now you can see the problem with a space elevator. Who wants
    to make a 36,000-kilometer-long cable? For a cable that long, even the strongest material, like kevlar, would have to be super thick to prevent
    it from breaking. Of course, thicker cables means more weight hanging
    down below, and that means the higher parts of the cable have to be even thicker to support the cable below. It's a compounding problem that
    seems essentially impossible. The only hope for the future of space
    elevator construction is to figure out how to use some super strong and lightweight material like carbon nanotubes. Perhaps we will make this
    work someday, but that day is not today.

    What About a Falling Elevator Cable?
    In the first episode of Foundation, some people decide to set off
    explosives that separate the space elevator’s top station from the rest
    of the cable. The cable falls to the surface of the planet and does some
    real damage down there.

    What would a falling space elevator cable look like in real life? It's
    not that simple to model, but we can make a rough guess. Let's model the
    cable as being made up of 100 individual pieces. Each piece starts in a
    motion around the Earth, but with the same angular velocity as the
    Earth. (So, not in orbit.) In an actual space elevator cable, there
    would be some tension forces between pieces. But just for simplicity, in
    the model each piece will only have the gravitational force from the interaction with the Earth. Now I can just model the motion of these
    individual 100 parts of the cable to see what happens. (It's actually
    not too difficult to do this with some code in Python—but I'll skip all
    of that.)

    Here's what it would look like:

    PLAY/PAUSE BUTTON
    VIDEO: RHETT ALLAIN

    So, what's going on? Notice that the lower part of the cable just falls
    to Earth and probably causes some severe destruction. In this model, it
    wraps about a third of the way around the equator, even though its full
    length would almost make it all the way around the Earth, which has a circumference of 40,000 kilometers.

    But some of the parts of the cable might not even hit the surface. If
    the pieces start high enough, their velocity will increase as they get
    closer to the surface. It's possible that the pieces will speed up
    enough to put them in a non-circular orbit around the Earth. If you are
    living on the equator, that's a good thing. Better to have that debris
    in space than falling on your head, right?

    Of course, if the cable is still intact, then each piece would be
    pulling on other nearby pieces. This would cause more of the cable to
    crash into Earth. But at some point, the forces in the cable would
    become so strong that it would just break apart. You would still end up
    with space debris.

    So not only is building a space elevator very difficult, but you really
    don’t want the cable to snap and fall. Maybe it’s a good thing that we
    are still in the rocket phase of space exploration.


    Rhett Allain is an associate professor of physics at Southeastern
    Louisiana University. He enjoys teaching and talking about physics.
    Sometimes he takes things apart and can't put them back together.
    CONTRIBUTOR

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jim Wilkins@21:1/5 to All on Sun Jan 23 16:53:32 2022
    XPost: alt.astronomy, alt.books.arthur-clarke, alt.fan.heinlein

    "a425couple" wrote in message news:azjHJ.15064$OF3.2389@fx14.iad...

    from
    https://www.wired.com/story/what-happens-if-a-space-elevator-breaks/

    What Happens If a Space Elevator Breaks

    These structures are a sci-fi solution to the problem of getting objects
    into orbit without a rocket—but you don’t want to be under one if the
    cable snaps.

    ------------------------

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fountains_of_Paradise

    Clarke's home on Sri Lanka (Ceylon) was nearly the right place to build it.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From kozelsm@yahoo.com@21:1/5 to All on Sun Jan 23 20:57:25 2022
    On Sunday, January 23, 2022 at 4:14:49 PM UTC-5, a425couple wrote:
    from
    https://www.wired.com/story/what-happens-if-a-space-elevator-breaks/

    What Happens If a Space Elevator Breaks

    How do they make sure that no aircraft accidently hit and sever the cable?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From SolomonW@21:1/5 to All on Mon Jan 24 15:50:07 2022
    XPost: alt.astronomy, alt.books.arthur-clarke, alt.fan.heinlein

    On Sun, 23 Jan 2022 13:14:46 -0800, a425couple wrote:

    from
    https://www.wired.com/story/what-happens-if-a-space-elevator-breaks/

    What Happens If a Space Elevator Breaks

    These structures are a sci-fi solution to the problem of getting objects
    into orbit without a rocket¡Xbut you don¡¦t want to be under one if the
    cable snaps.

    space elevator in foundation
    PHOTOGRAPH: TCD/PROD.DB/APPLE TV+/ALAMY

    IN THE FIRST episode of the Foundation series on Apple TV, we see a
    terrorist try to destroy the space elevator used by the Galactic Empire.
    This seems like a great chance to talk about the physics of space
    elevators and to consider what would happen if one exploded.
    (Hint: It wouldn't be good.)

    People like to put stuff beyond the Earth's atmosphere: It allows us to
    have weather satellites, a space station, GPS satellites, and even the
    James Webb Space Telescope. But right now, our only option for getting
    stuff into space is to strap it to a controlled chemical explosion that
    we usually call "a rocket."

    Don't get me wrong, rockets are cool, but they are also expensive and inefficient. Let's consider what it takes to get a 1-kilogram object
    into low Earth orbit (LEO). This is around 400 kilometers above the
    surface of the Earth, about where the International Space Station is. In order to get this object into orbit, you need to accomplish two things. First, you need to lift it up 400 kilometers. But if you only increased
    the object¡¦s altitude, it wouldn't be in space for long. It would just
    fall back to Earth. So, second, in order to keep this thing in LEO, it
    has to move¡Xreally fast.

    Just a quick refresher on energy: It turns out that the amount of energy
    we put into a system (we call it work) is equal to the change in energy
    in that system. We can mathematically model different types of energy. Kinetic energy is the energy an object has due to its velocity. So if
    you increase an object¡¦s velocity, it will increase in kinetic energy. Gravitational potential energy depends on the distance between the
    object and the Earth. This means that increasing an object¡¦s altitude increases the gravitational potential energy.

    So let's say you want to use a rocket to increase the object¡¦s
    gravitational potential energy (to raise it to the right altitude) and
    also increase its kinetic energy (to get it up to speed). Getting into
    orbit is more about speed than height. Only 11 percent of the energy
    would be in the gravitational potential energy. The rest would be kinetic.

    The total energy to get just that 1-kilogram object into orbit would be
    about 33 million joules. For comparison, if you pick up a textbook from
    the floor and put it on a table, that takes about 10 joules. It would
    take a lot more energy to get into orbit.

    But the problem is actually even more difficult than that. With chemical rockets, they don't just need energy to get that 1-kilogram object into orbit¡Xthe rockets also need to carry their fuel for the journey to LEO. Until they burn this fuel, it's essentially just extra mass for the
    payload, which means they need to launch with even more fuel. For many real-life rockets, up to 85 percent of the total mass can just be fuel. That's super inefficient.

    So what if, instead of launching atop a chemical rocket, your object
    could just ride up on a cable that reaches all the way into space?
    That's what would happen with a space elevator.

    Space Elevator Basics

    Suppose you built a giant tower that is 400 kilometers tall. You could
    ride an elevator up to the top and then you would be in space. Simple,
    right? No, actually it's not.

    First, you couldn't easily build a structure like this out of steel; the weight would likely compress and collapse the lower parts of the tower.
    Also, it would require massive amounts of material.

    But that's not the biggest problem¡Xthere's still the issue with speed. (Remember, you need to move really fast to get into orbit.) If you were standing on the top of a 400-kilometer tower with the base somewhere on
    the Earth's equator, you would indeed be moving, because the planet is rotating¡Xthis is just like the motion of a person on the outside of a spinning merry-go-round. Since the Earth rotates about once a day
    (there's a difference between sidereal and synodic rotations), it has an angular velocity of 7.29 x 10-5 radians per second.

    Angular velocity is different than linear velocity. It¡¦s a measure of rotational speed instead of what we normally think of as
    velocity¡Xmovement in a straight line. (Radians are a unit of measurement
    to use with rotations, instead of degrees.)

    If two people are standing on a merry-go-round as it spins, they will
    both have the same angular velocity. (Let's say it's 1 radian per
    second.) However, the person that is farther from the center of rotation
    will be moving faster. Let's say one person is 1 meter from the center
    and the other person is 3 meters from the center. Their speeds will be 1
    m/s and 3 m/s respectively. This same thing works with a rotating Earth.
    It's possible to get far enough away such that the Earth's rotation
    gives you the required orbital velocity to stay in orbit around the planet.

    So let¡¦s go back to our example of a person standing on the top of a 400-kilometer tower. Are they far enough away from Earth that they can
    stay in orbit? For one complete rotation of the Earth, their angular
    velocity would be 2£k radians per day. That might not seem very fast, but
    at the equator this rotation gives you a speed of 465 meters per second. That's over 1,000 miles per hour. However, it's still not enough. The
    orbital velocity (the velocity needed to stay in orbit) at that altitude
    is 7.7 kilometers per second, or over 17,000 miles per hour.

    Actually, there's another factor: As you increase your distance from the Earth, the orbital velocity also decreases. If you go from an altitude
    of 400 to 800 kilometers above the surface of the Earth, the orbital
    speed decreases from 7.7 km/s to 7.5 km/s. That doesn't seem like a
    large difference, but remember, it's really the orbital radius that
    matters and not just the height above the surface of the Earth. Theoretically, you could build a magical tower that was high enough that
    you could just step off of it and be in orbit¡Xbut it would have to be
    36,000 kilometers tall. That¡¦s not going to happen.


    Here is something that's very cool and more practical: An orbit at the altitude of 36,000 kilometers has a special name. It's called a geosynchronous orbit, meaning that the time it takes an object to
    complete one orbit is exactly the same time it takes the Earth to
    rotate. If you put this object in an orbit directly over the equator, it
    will appear in the same location in the sky relative to the surface of
    the Earth. (Then it's called a geostationary orbit.) That's useful,
    because you know exactly where to find it. A geostationary orbit makes
    it easier to communicate with objects like TV or weather satellites, or
    for satellite cameras that need to stay focused on the same part of the Earth.

    OK, back to the space elevator. If we can¡¦t build a tower from the
    ground up, we can hang a 36,000-kilometer cable from an object that¡¦s in
    a geostationary orbit. Boom: That's the space elevator.

    To get this to work, you would need a large mass in orbit¡Xeither a space station or a small asteroid. The mass has to be large so that it doesn't
    get pulled out of orbit every time something climbs up the cable.

    But perhaps now you can see the problem with a space elevator. Who wants
    to make a 36,000-kilometer-long cable? For a cable that long, even the strongest material, like kevlar, would have to be super thick to prevent
    it from breaking. Of course, thicker cables means more weight hanging
    down below, and that means the higher parts of the cable have to be even thicker to support the cable below. It's a compounding problem that
    seems essentially impossible. The only hope for the future of space
    elevator construction is to figure out how to use some super strong and lightweight material like carbon nanotubes. Perhaps we will make this
    work someday, but that day is not today.

    What About a Falling Elevator Cable?
    In the first episode of Foundation, some people decide to set off
    explosives that separate the space elevator¡¦s top station from the rest
    of the cable. The cable falls to the surface of the planet and does some
    real damage down there.

    What would a falling space elevator cable look like in real life? It's
    not that simple to model, but we can make a rough guess. Let's model the cable as being made up of 100 individual pieces. Each piece starts in a motion around the Earth, but with the same angular velocity as the
    Earth. (So, not in orbit.) In an actual space elevator cable, there
    would be some tension forces between pieces. But just for simplicity, in
    the model each piece will only have the gravitational force from the interaction with the Earth. Now I can just model the motion of these individual 100 parts of the cable to see what happens. (It's actually
    not too difficult to do this with some code in Python¡Xbut I'll skip all
    of that.)

    Here's what it would look like:

    PLAY/PAUSE BUTTON
    VIDEO: RHETT ALLAIN

    So, what's going on? Notice that the lower part of the cable just falls
    to Earth and probably causes some severe destruction. In this model, it
    wraps about a third of the way around the equator, even though its full length would almost make it all the way around the Earth, which has a circumference of 40,000 kilometers.

    But some of the parts of the cable might not even hit the surface. If
    the pieces start high enough, their velocity will increase as they get
    closer to the surface. It's possible that the pieces will speed up
    enough to put them in a non-circular orbit around the Earth. If you are living on the equator, that's a good thing. Better to have that debris
    in space than falling on your head, right?

    Of course, if the cable is still intact, then each piece would be
    pulling on other nearby pieces. This would cause more of the cable to
    crash into Earth. But at some point, the forces in the cable would
    become so strong that it would just break apart. You would still end up
    with space debris.

    So not only is building a space elevator very difficult, but you really don¡¦t want the cable to snap and fall. Maybe it¡¦s a good thing that we
    are still in the rocket phase of space exploration.


    Rhett Allain is an associate professor of physics at Southeastern
    Louisiana University. He enjoys teaching and talking about physics.
    Sometimes he takes things apart and can't put them back together.
    CONTRIBUTOR

    An interesting video

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZdjjbULyrY

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From a425couple@21:1/5 to Jim Wilkins on Mon Jan 24 06:10:58 2022
    XPost: alt.astronomy, alt.books.arthur-clarke, alt.fan.heinlein

    On 1/23/2022 1:53 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
    "a425couple"  wrote in message news:azjHJ.15064$OF3.2389@fx14.iad...

    from
    https://www.wired.com/story/what-happens-if-a-space-elevator-breaks/

    What Happens If a Space Elevator Breaks

    These structures are a sci-fi solution to the problem of getting objects
    into orbit without a rocket—but you don’t want to be under one if the cable snaps.

    ------------------------

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fountains_of_Paradise

    That was/is a good book.
    I take it that you read it also?

    Clarke's home on Sri Lanka (Ceylon) was nearly the right place to build it.


    Almost. Not quite on the equator.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From a425couple@21:1/5 to koz...@yahoo.com on Mon Jan 24 06:46:48 2022
    On 1/23/2022 8:57 PM, koz...@yahoo.com wrote:
    On Sunday, January 23, 2022 at 4:14:49 PM UTC-5, a425couple wrote:
    from
    https://www.wired.com/story/what-happens-if-a-space-elevator-breaks/

    What Happens If a Space Elevator Breaks

    How do they make sure that no aircraft accidently hit and sever the cable?

    It is a fixed object.
    Just like a very tall, thin building.
    Going up, over the equator.
    Mark on all maps etc. as a known object/hazard.

    But, seems like Arthur Clarke did not foresee
    some of the evil and destructiveness in some
    individuals.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jim Wilkins@21:1/5 to koz...@yahoo.com on Mon Jan 24 12:43:32 2022
    "a425couple" wrote in message news:qZyHJ.15210$yS2.9676@fx20.iad...

    On 1/23/2022 8:57 PM, koz...@yahoo.com wrote:
    On Sunday, January 23, 2022 at 4:14:49 PM UTC-5, a425couple wrote:
    from
    https://www.wired.com/story/what-happens-if-a-space-elevator-breaks/

    What Happens If a Space Elevator Breaks

    How do they make sure that no aircraft accidently hit and sever the cable?

    It is a fixed object.
    Just like a very tall, thin building.
    Going up, over the equator.
    Mark on all maps etc. as a known object/hazard.

    But, seems like Arthur Clarke did not foresee
    some of the evil and destructiveness in some
    individuals.

    -------------------------

    Usually a cable wins the encounter: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barrage_balloon

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From kozelsm@yahoo.com@21:1/5 to All on Tue Jan 25 18:33:26 2022
    On Monday, January 24, 2022 at 9:46:49 AM UTC-5, a425couple wrote:
    On 1/23/2022 8:57 PM, koz...@yahoo.com wrote:
    On Sunday, January 23, 2022 at 4:14:49 PM UTC-5, a425couple wrote:
    from
    https://www.wired.com/story/what-happens-if-a-space-elevator-breaks/

    What Happens If a Space Elevator Breaks

    How do they make sure that no aircraft accidently hit and sever the cable?

    It is a fixed object.
    Just like a very tall, thin building.
    Going up, over the equator.
    Mark on all maps etc. as a known object/hazard.

    But, seems like Arthur Clarke did not foresee
    some of the evil and destructiveness in some
    individuals.

    From what I have read, the cable would move considerably, like up to a couple miles at high altitude.

    From a couple miles away it would be invisible to the human eye.

    Wind, storms, various things could blow aircraft off course. Clouds would hide it.

    CFIT -- aircraft hit things that are massive and can be seen from miles away.

    Sooner or later someone will hit and sever the cable.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From a425couple@21:1/5 to koz...@yahoo.com on Wed Jan 26 08:14:02 2022
    XPost: alt.books.arthur-clarke

    On 1/25/2022 6:33 PM, koz...@yahoo.com wrote:
    On Monday, January 24, 2022 at 9:46:49 AM UTC-5, a425couple wrote:
    On 1/23/2022 8:57 PM, koz...@yahoo.com wrote:
    On Sunday, January 23, 2022 at 4:14:49 PM UTC-5, a425couple wrote:
    from
    https://www.wired.com/story/what-happens-if-a-space-elevator-breaks/

    What Happens If a Space Elevator Breaks

    How do they make sure that no aircraft accidently hit and sever the cable? >>
    It is a fixed object.
    Just like a very tall, thin building.
    Going up, over the equator.
    Mark on all maps etc. as a known object/hazard.

    But, seems like Arthur Clarke did not foresee
    some of the evil and destructiveness in some
    individuals.

    From what I have read, the cable would move considerably, like up to a couple miles at high altitude.

    From a couple miles away it would be invisible to the human eye.

    Wind, storms, various things could blow aircraft off course. Clouds would hide it.

    CFIT -- aircraft hit things that are massive and can be seen from miles away.

    Sooner or later someone will hit and sever the cable.

    I can accept that it is quite possible,
    that "sooner or later someone will hit -- the cable".

    But it will be have to be extremely strong.
    And that is the reason it has not been built yet.
    We do not have the materials strong enough
    (and at same time "light enough")
    to build it.

    But meanwhile, and thankfully, people like
    Musk making rockets reusable have already
    greatly reduced the cost of putting objects
    into orbit, and space.

    In my opinion, we need to keep making real progress,
    while steadily looking for big breakthroughs
    in science like a workable space elevator would be.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Jim Wilkins@21:1/5 to koz...@yahoo.com on Wed Jan 26 12:10:58 2022
    XPost: alt.books.arthur-clarke

    "a425couple" wrote in message news:9reIJ.7168$uP.7011@fx16.iad...

    On 1/25/2022 6:33 PM, koz...@yahoo.com wrote:
    On Monday, January 24, 2022 at 9:46:49 AM UTC-5, a425couple wrote:
    On 1/23/2022 8:57 PM, koz...@yahoo.com wrote:
    On Sunday, January 23, 2022 at 4:14:49 PM UTC-5, a425couple wrote:
    from
    https://www.wired.com/story/what-happens-if-a-space-elevator-breaks/

    What Happens If a Space Elevator Breaks

    How do they make sure that no aircraft accidently hit and sever the
    cable?

    It is a fixed object.
    Just like a very tall, thin building.
    Going up, over the equator.
    Mark on all maps etc. as a known object/hazard.

    But, seems like Arthur Clarke did not foresee
    some of the evil and destructiveness in some
    individuals.

    From what I have read, the cable would move considerably, like up to a couple miles at high altitude.

    From a couple miles away it would be invisible to the human eye.

    Wind, storms, various things could blow aircraft off course. Clouds would hide it.

    CFIT -- aircraft hit things that are massive and can be seen from miles
    away.

    Sooner or later someone will hit and sever the cable.

    I can accept that it is quite possible,
    that "sooner or later someone will hit -- the cable".

    But it will be have to be extremely strong.
    And that is the reason it has not been built yet.
    We do not have the materials strong enough
    (and at same time "light enough")
    to build it.

    But meanwhile, and thankfully, people like
    Musk making rockets reusable have already
    greatly reduced the cost of putting objects
    into orbit, and space.

    In my opinion, we need to keep making real progress,
    while steadily looking for big breakthroughs
    in science like a workable space elevator would be.

    -----------------------

    If the cable material is many times stronger than the hardest steel how do
    you expect aluminum to cut it?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From John Weiss@21:1/5 to All on Wed Jan 26 14:50:07 2022
    XPost: alt.books.arthur-clarke

    On 01/26/22 08:14, a425couple wrote:

    I can accept that it is quite possible,
    that "sooner or later someone will hit -- the cable".

    But it will be have to be extremely strong.
    And that is the reason it has not been built yet.
    We do not have the materials strong enough
    (and at same time "light enough")
    to build it.

    But meanwhile, and thankfully, people like
    Musk making rockets reusable have already
    greatly reduced the cost of putting objects
    into orbit, and space.

    In my opinion, we need to keep making real progress,
    while steadily looking for big breakthroughs
    in science like a workable space elevator would be.

    Graphene is a popular material for one in current science fiction...

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From kozelsm@yahoo.com@21:1/5 to All on Wed Jan 26 18:48:52 2022
    On Wednesday, January 26, 2022 at 11:14:00 AM UTC-5, a425couple wrote:
    On 1/25/2022 6:33 PM, koz...@yahoo.com wrote:
    On Monday, January 24, 2022 at 9:46:49 AM UTC-5, a425couple wrote:
    On 1/23/2022 8:57 PM, koz...@yahoo.com wrote:
    On Sunday, January 23, 2022 at 4:14:49 PM UTC-5, a425couple wrote:
    from
    https://www.wired.com/story/what-happens-if-a-space-elevator-breaks/ >>>>
    What Happens If a Space Elevator Breaks

    How do they make sure that no aircraft accidently hit and sever the cable?

    It is a fixed object.
    Just like a very tall, thin building.
    Going up, over the equator.
    Mark on all maps etc. as a known object/hazard.

    But, seems like Arthur Clarke did not foresee
    some of the evil and destructiveness in some
    individuals.

    From what I have read, the cable would move considerably, like up to a couple miles at high altitude.

    From a couple miles away it would be invisible to the human eye.

    Wind, storms, various things could blow aircraft off course. Clouds would hide it.

    CFIT -- aircraft hit things that are massive and can be seen from miles away.

    Sooner or later someone will hit and sever the cable.

    I can accept that it is quite possible,
    that "sooner or later someone will hit -- the cable".

    But it will be have to be extremely strong.
    And that is the reason it has not been built yet.
    We do not have the materials strong enough
    (and at same time "light enough")
    to build it.

    But meanwhile, and thankfully, people like
    Musk making rockets reusable have already
    greatly reduced the cost of putting objects
    into orbit, and space.

    In my opinion, we need to keep making real progress,
    while steadily looking for big breakthroughs
    in science like a workable space elevator would be.

    I am aware that no material yet exists that is light enough and strong enough.

    Just that even if there was this would still be a huge problem.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Mike Van Pelt@21:1/5 to a425couple@hotmail.com on Wed Jul 6 13:01:05 2022
    XPost: alt.astronomy, alt.books.arthur-clarke, alt.fan.heinlein

    In article <azjHJ.15064$OF3.2389@fx14.iad>,
    a425couple <a425couple@hotmail.com> wrote:
    from
    https://www.wired.com/story/what-happens-if-a-space-elevator-breaks/

    What Happens If a Space Elevator Breaks

    Ages ago, for one of these sorts of schemes, I came up with the
    description, "No non-cataclysmic failure modes."

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)