XPost: soc.history.war.misc, sci.military.naval

Chris Morehouse
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Aerospace Engineer at U.S. Air Force (2017–present) Upvoted by
Kevin Kitchen
, studied ILS & TACAN at U.S. Air Force (1988) and
Robert A. Clemons
, former USAF Security Specialist/ Flight Officer at U.S. Air Force (1977-2001)Updated 4y
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Is an F-22 Raptor better than the F-35?
I am going to make a very direct statement, because this comes up in a
lot of different questions I see on Quora regarding fighter aircraft.

As of today, April 20th 2019, the F-22A Raptor is the absolute best at
what it does. Hunting and killing other aircraft.

There is no better Air Dominance fighter in service today by any
military force. None. Zero. The Raptor stands alone as the top dog. This
is not a biased statement from American pride or some defense industry propaganda. The F-22 has flaws, has aspects that could be better, and
places that can (and will) be improved. But there is simply nothing in
the sky today better at hunting and killing other aircraft than the
Raptor. That includes the F-35.

Now, that being said, is the F-22 “better” than the F-35? As a blanket statement? No. No it is not. There are plenty of great things about the
F-35 that the F-22 can’t match. And full disclosure, I have been a
frequent and vocal critic of the JSF program since, well, forever I
guess. Plenty of mistakes to be found there. Plenty of bad calls, and
just straight up ignorance when it came to the planning and execution of
this ambitious effort. All that aside, the F-35 is an impressive aircraft.

It is not an air dominance fighter in the weight class of the F-22, but
it can operate in an Air to Air role. But it can also operate as a
strike aircraft, and ISR asset, suppression of enemy air defense
aircraft, penetrating ground attack, you name it. It has a CTOL variant,
a STOVL variant, and a CATOBAR variant. It is less expensive, and has a
smaller logistical footprint than the F-22.

It can do a lot of things the F-22 can not do, such as share targeting
data with other aircraft (as of today the F-22 can only share targeting
data with other F-22s, though they can receive data from other
aircraft). Other things it can do that the Raptor can’t is track and
target ground targets with a whole bunch of nifty sensors, including its
main radar. The Raptor radar, even though the 35’s radar was derived
from it, is not set up to target and track ground targets like this. It
also doesn’t have several other targeting and tracking sensor systems
that the Lightnings do.

Don’t get me wrong, the F-22 can engage ground targets. It can perform penetrating strike missions. It inherited that role when the F-117s were retired, before the F-35s came into service. But the F-22 ground attack capabilities are very modest when compared to those of the Lightnings.
Keep in mind, the F-117s strike capabilities weren’t all that big of
shoes to fill when you take away the stealth capabilities. The F-117
could only carry two weapons, and relied on laser guided munitions. The
F-22 could take that mission easily, and could do so with the same radar penetrating capability. The F-35s now, they have taken this mission and
added much depth and enhanced capabilities. The weapons that can be used
are more diverse, and there are more options for targeting. Also, F-35s
can strike moving targets (with the addition of the SDB II) something
the F-22 and F-117s could not do.

So, is the Raptor better than the F-35? No. Is the F-35 better than the
Raptor? No.

The Raptor is the absolute king of the sky. The F-35 is the absolute
best multi-role fighter in service today. So one is not better than the
other, but they are both the best at what they do.


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Albert
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Former Cmpt Apps Mfg/Dist, US Army Officer Air Def Arty
(1970–2012)Upvoted by
Anthony Hendrex
, former KC-135, T-38 Pilot at U.S. Air Force (1974-1980)Updated 4y
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How advanced is the F-35?
The F-35 is advanced to the point that no Quora contributors know about
or can talk about its true capabilities. We can't really imagine what an
F-35 pilot sees in his helmet or how much an F-35 actually helps its
pilot find and prioritize targets or fly the plane. We are likely not
able to comprehend what it is like to do cooperative hunting in a
tightly controlled F-35 MADL network. The F-35 strategies used are fun
to guess at, but after several years with Block 3F capabilities and a
few months of Block 4 capabilities, how are they really being used.
We just about never see anything about patrolling or loitering at the
most efficient fuel levels, as in how long can F-35s loiter in a CAS
area and still give em 5 minutes of hell at the right time. Also, how
close to the battle zone can F-35s be aerial refueled with a drone like
the Navy's MQ-25? How far away can CATOBAR carriers actually stay from ground-2-sea launch sites with F-35Cs refueled from stealthy drones?

We see Federal reports on availability that don't take into account the
age of the planes and their block levels or variant. Part of the F-35
advanced capabilities have to do with the ALIS support and planning
system and where the F-35 is going to be availability wise as we go from
1000 to 3000 operational units. Judging the results at the current level
should be based on progress made toward availability goals for platforms
that were manufactured at the Block 3F level and later. Parts that fail
too often or limit the expected life cycle will be re-engineered to
better meet the planned life cycle. Parts that fail often will also be a
high priority in the supply chain and will be readily available along
with updated maintenance training to install them quickly. After several
years of experience, maintainers at Luke and Hill are likely getting
better at mission turnaround times as with Hill's Bolt system. The Navy
and Marine F-35 variants are more complex and will take longer to
achieve availability results similar to the F-35A.

The whole concept of F-35s herding bomb and missile trucks like the
F-15E, F-15EX, F-16, or F-18E/F is new and different. The pilots of all
the platforms have to learn to do this to best advantage for delivering
their weapons and getting away safely.

No publicly available war exercise information, like Red Flag results,
tells us how advanced the F-35 is against adversaries. During the
exercises the F-35s have to perform by rules that give the other planes
and/or ground based air defenses a chance. The F-35 user countries don't
want foriegn participants like France or India to know what the F-35 can actually do. If F-35s were allowed to use their full array of
capabilities and to avoid WVR (within visual range) like they should do,
the F-35 kill ratios may be close to infinite against any 4th generation fighters.

The term advanced should include safety. As of March 31, 2019, no pilot
has been killed in an F-35 in around 190,000 flying hours. Considering
that there are 3 variants, some of which regularly make carrier
landings, these are excellent results. F-35s have a far better chance to
return from battle than other fighters because of their stealth and EW,
and a better chance of returning from battle and training exercises than
other fighters because of their advanced safety.

The ability to manufacture thousands of F-35s at their level of
complexity speaks to very advanced manufacturing technology and
planning. Russia may be able to hand build a dozen SU-57s, but the
Russians know that they are far from mass producing a capable 5th
generation, multirole fighter. They seem to have given-up for the time
being due to the technical and financial reality. The Russians will need China's money and commitment, along with another 15 years to finish
development and manufacture enough SU-57 platforms to be competitive. By
then, the F-35s will be much further advanced from Block 3F.

How advanced is the F-35? You don't want to be the other guy.

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the overall subject area on Quora is at: https://www.quora.com/How-effective-is-the-F-35

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