Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have been given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
On 11/15/22 13:20, Alan wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have
been given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
As with your first sentence, Verstappen had established his
presence, and continued it, and at time of contact Verstappen's
left front tire was just behind Hamilton's right front tire.
This was certainly not a 'last second dive bomb'.
Yes, for all us racing in US and Canadian rules, he had
earned the right to a car's width of racing room.
But, obviously, FIA and F1 have established their own set
of standards and rules.
I wish
On 2022-11-15 13:59, a425couple wrote:
On 11/15/22 13:20, Alan wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's
width of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have
been given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
As with your first sentence, Verstappen had established his
presence, and continued it, and at time of contact Verstappen's
left front tire was just behind Hamilton's right front tire.
This was certainly not a 'last second dive bomb'.
Yes, for all us racing in US and Canadian rules, he had
earned the right to a car's width of racing room.
But, obviously, FIA and F1 have established their own set
of standards and rules.
I wish I could believe there was actually one set of standards and rules
that was being applied.
On 16/11/2022 11:37 am, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-15 13:59, a425couple wrote:
On 11/15/22 13:20, Alan wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's
width of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have
been given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
As with your first sentence, Verstappen had established his
presence, and continued it, and at time of contact Verstappen's
left front tire was just behind Hamilton's right front tire.
This was certainly not a 'last second dive bomb'.
Yes, for all us racing in US and Canadian rules, he had
earned the right to a car's width of racing room.
But, obviously, FIA and F1 have established their own set
of standards and rules.
I wish I could believe there was actually one set of standards and
rules that was being applied.
Yes, they certainly shifted their usual bias this time.
...but I'm sorry,
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have been given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's
width of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have
been given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
Your post is more or less a troll, the stewards have made their
decision and that’s that.
Much more interesting to discuss the possibility that Perez crashed deliberately at Monaco or the reasons for Max’s seemingly inexplicable behaviour towards his team mate. Both could have future implications.
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have been
given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
Your post is more or less a troll, the stewards have made their decision
and that’s that.
Much more interesting to discuss the possibility that Perez crashed deliberately at Monaco or the reasons for Max’s seemingly inexplicable behaviour towards his team mate. Both could have future implications.
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have been
given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
Your post is more or less a troll, the stewards have made their decision
and that’s that.
Much more interesting to discuss the possibility that Perez crashed deliberately at Monaco or the reasons for Max’s seemingly inexplicable behaviour towards his team mate. Both could have future implications.
On 2022-11-16 02:05, Sir Tim wrote:
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have been >>> given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
Your post is more or less a troll, the stewards have made their decision
and that’s that.
Suddenly discussing penalties is "trolling"?
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2022-11-16 02:05, Sir Tim wrote:
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width >>>> of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have been >>>> given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
Your post is more or less a troll, the stewards have made their decision >>> and that’s that.
Suddenly discussing penalties is "trolling"?
Well, it’s certainly an attempt to create another of your endless, boring did/didn’t threads.
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have been given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in forWhat Brundle actually wrote:
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have been
given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
“I have no doubt Max has a different set of limits when in combat with Lewis, and Lewis has similarly decided to fight fire with fire. And so inevitably they hit but continued.
“The stewards said Lewis could have given ‘a little more space’, and in my
view Max could have taken even more kerb or indeed lifted off the throttle, but that’s not racing. The stewards decided it was predominantly Max’s fault and he got a five-second penalty and a pit-stop for a new nose.
“I thought it was a racing incident. Lewis’ car was a bit scruffy but all the fast bits were intact, and he set off in spectacular recovery mode.”
On 2022-11-16 14:43, Sir Tim wrote:
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in forWhat Brundle actually wrote:
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have been >>> given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
“I have no doubt Max has a different set of limits when in combat with
Lewis, and Lewis has similarly decided to fight fire with fire. And so
inevitably they hit but continued.
“The stewards said Lewis could have given ‘a little more space’, and >> in my
view Max could have taken even more kerb or indeed lifted off the
throttle,
but that’s not racing. The stewards decided it was predominantly Max’s >> fault and he got a five-second penalty and a pit-stop for a new nose.
“I thought it was a racing incident. Lewis’ car was a bit scruffy but all
the fast bits were intact, and he set off in spectacular recovery mode.” >>
It's not what he said at the time.
Go rewatch the reace.
Suddenly discussing penalties is "trolling"?
Then start your own thread.
I'm just amused at the two double standards in play here...
Go rewatch the reace.
On 17/11/2022 11:50 am, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-16 14:43, Sir Tim wrote:
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in forWhat Brundle actually wrote:
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width >>>> of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have
been
given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
“I have no doubt Max has a different set of limits when in combat with >>> Lewis, and Lewis has similarly decided to fight fire with fire. And so
inevitably they hit but continued.
“The stewards said Lewis could have given ‘a little more space’, and >>> in my
view Max could have taken even more kerb or indeed lifted off the
throttle,
but that’s not racing. The stewards decided it was predominantly Max’s >>> fault and he got a five-second penalty and a pit-stop for a new nose.
“I thought it was a racing incident. Lewis’ car was a bit scruffy but >>> all
the fast bits were intact, and he set off in spectacular recovery mode.” >>>
It's not what he said at the time.
Go rewatch the reace.
So.... since then he has had a chance to review the incident, rather
than just his immediate gut reaction, and noted that VER surged forward
late, largely off-track to the point of the collision.
I've just reviewed Verstappen's in-car video
On 2022-11-16 15:26, geoff wrote:
On 17/11/2022 11:50 am, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-16 14:43, Sir Tim wrote:
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in forWhat Brundle actually wrote:
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width >>>>> of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have
been
given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
“I have no doubt Max has a different set of limits when in combat with >>>> Lewis, and Lewis has similarly decided to fight fire with fire. And so >>>> inevitably they hit but continued.
“The stewards said Lewis could have given ‘a little more space’, and >>>> in my
view Max could have taken even more kerb or indeed lifted off the
throttle,
but that’s not racing. The stewards decided it was predominantly Max’s >>>> fault and he got a five-second penalty and a pit-stop for a new nose.
“I thought it was a racing incident. Lewis’ car was a bit scruffy
but all
the fast bits were intact, and he set off in spectacular recovery
mode.”
It's not what he said at the time.
Go rewatch the reace.
So.... since then he has had a chance to review the incident, rather
than just his immediate gut reaction, and noted that VER surged
forward late, largely off-track to the point of the collision.
I've just reviewed Verstappen's in-car video on F1TV and every single
word you said there was wrong.
His surge ahead happened as they were both braking for turn ONE. The
turn BEFORE the incident. He established his right to a car's width at
that point.
And Verstappen as never off track until the apex of TURN TWO, where he
did have his right side wheels on the kerbing, leaving as much room as
he possibly could for Hamilton. His right side tires didn't so much as
As they both turn into turn one, Verstappen edges ahead and from that
point until contact his front tire is never further back than the middle
of Hamilton's car, and in fact, when they make contact, Hamilton's front
tire hits Verstappen's front wing.
Your geometry must be different to mine
On 2022-11-16 14:30, Sir Tim wrote:
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2022-11-16 02:05, Sir Tim wrote:
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width >>>>> of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have been >>>>> given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
Your post is more or less a troll, the stewards have made their decision >>>> and thats that.
Suddenly discussing penalties is "trolling"?
Well, its certainly an attempt to create another of your endless, boring
did/didnt threads.
I'm just amused at the two double standards in play here...
:-)
And unable to see that there is no great appetite here for getting
involved in one of your interminable arguments.
On Wed, 16 Nov 2022 14:36:18 -0800, Alan <nuh...@nope.com> wrote:
On 2022-11-16 14:30, Sir Tim wrote:
Alan <nuh...@nope.com> wrote:
On 2022-11-16 02:05, Sir Tim wrote:
Alan <nuh...@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for >>>>> corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could. >>>>>
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width >>>>> of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have been
given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
Your post is more or less a troll, the stewards have made their decision
and that’s that.
Suddenly discussing penalties is "trolling"?
Well, it’s certainly an attempt to create another of your endless, boring
did/didn’t threads.
I'm just amused at the two double standards in play here...And unable to see that there is no great appetite here for getting
involved in one of your interminable arguments.
For me, the words 'racing incident' come to mind. Not every accident has to be punished with a penalty.:-)
On 17/11/2022 2:53 pm, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-16 15:26, geoff wrote:
On 17/11/2022 11:50 am, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-16 14:43, Sir Tim wrote:
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for >>>>>> corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could. >>>>>>What Brundle actually wrote:
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's
width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should
have been
given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
“I have no doubt Max has a different set of limits when in combat with >>>>> Lewis, and Lewis has similarly decided to fight fire with fire. And so >>>>> inevitably they hit but continued.
“The stewards said Lewis could have given ‘a little more space’, >>>>> and in my
view Max could have taken even more kerb or indeed lifted off the
throttle,
but that’s not racing. The stewards decided it was predominantly Max’s
fault and he got a five-second penalty and a pit-stop for a new nose. >>>>>
“I thought it was a racing incident. Lewis’ car was a bit scruffy >>>>> but all
the fast bits were intact, and he set off in spectacular recovery
mode.”
It's not what he said at the time.
Go rewatch the reace.
So.... since then he has had a chance to review the incident, rather
than just his immediate gut reaction, and noted that VER surged
forward late, largely off-track to the point of the collision.
I've just reviewed Verstappen's in-car video on F1TV and every single
word you said there was wrong.
Your geometry must be different to mine, and that of the stewards. And Brundle's.
His surge ahead happened as they were both braking for turn ONE. The
turn BEFORE the incident. He established his right to a car's width at
that point.
Then dropped back momentarily, and lost that right.
And Verstappen as never off track until the apex of TURN TWO, where he
did have his right side wheels on the kerbing, leaving as much room as
he possibly could for Hamilton. His right side tires didn't so much as
That would be 'well over the kerbing'.
As they both turn into turn one, Verstappen edges ahead and from that
point until contact his front tire is never further back than the
middle of Hamilton's car, and in fact, when they make contact,
Hamilton's front tire hits Verstappen's front wing.
Surging forward from significantly behind that point.
On 2022-11-17 14:44, geoff wrote:
On 17/11/2022 2:53 pm, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-16 15:26, geoff wrote:
On 17/11/2022 11:50 am, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-16 14:43, Sir Tim wrote:
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for >>>>>>> corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could. >>>>>>>What Brundle actually wrote:
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's >>>>>>> width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should
have been
given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed. >>>>>>>
“I have no doubt Max has a different set of limits when in combat >>>>>> with
Lewis, and Lewis has similarly decided to fight fire with fire.
And so
inevitably they hit but continued.
“The stewards said Lewis could have given ‘a little more space’, >>>>>> and in my
view Max could have taken even more kerb or indeed lifted off the
throttle,
but that’s not racing. The stewards decided it was predominantly >>>>>> Max’s
fault and he got a five-second penalty and a pit-stop for a new nose. >>>>>>
“I thought it was a racing incident. Lewis’ car was a bit scruffy >>>>>> but all
the fast bits were intact, and he set off in spectacular recovery
mode.”
It's not what he said at the time.
Go rewatch the reace.
So.... since then he has had a chance to review the incident, rather
than just his immediate gut reaction, and noted that VER surged
forward late, largely off-track to the point of the collision.
I've just reviewed Verstappen's in-car video on F1TV and every single
word you said there was wrong.
Your geometry must be different to mine, and that of the stewards. And
Brundle's.
His surge ahead happened as they were both braking for turn ONE. The
turn BEFORE the incident. He established his right to a car's width
at that point.
Then dropped back momentarily, and lost that right.
And Verstappen as never off track until the apex of TURN TWO, where
he did have his right side wheels on the kerbing, leaving as much
room as he possibly could for Hamilton. His right side tires didn't
so much as
That would be 'well over the kerbing'.
As they both turn into turn one, Verstappen edges ahead and from that
point until contact his front tire is never further back than the
middle of Hamilton's car, and in fact, when they make contact,
Hamilton's front tire hits Verstappen's front wing.
Surging forward from significantly behind that point.
I've got a copy of the in-car camera from Verstappen's car.
Are you willing to look at it and tell me:
Where he "surged forward late"?
Where he was "significantly behind"?
Hmmm?
On 19/11/2022 4:56 pm, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-17 14:44, geoff wrote:
On 17/11/2022 2:53 pm, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-16 15:26, geoff wrote:
On 17/11/2022 11:50 am, Alan wrote:I've just reviewed Verstappen's in-car video on F1TV and every
On 2022-11-16 14:43, Sir Tim wrote:
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for >>>>>>>> corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could. >>>>>>>>What Brundle actually wrote:
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's >>>>>>>> width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should >>>>>>>> have been
given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed. >>>>>>>>
“I have no doubt Max has a different set of limits when in combat >>>>>>> with
Lewis, and Lewis has similarly decided to fight fire with fire.
And so
inevitably they hit but continued.
“The stewards said Lewis could have given ‘a little more space’, >>>>>>> and in my
view Max could have taken even more kerb or indeed lifted off the >>>>>>> throttle,
but that’s not racing. The stewards decided it was predominantly >>>>>>> Max’s
fault and he got a five-second penalty and a pit-stop for a new
nose.
“I thought it was a racing incident. Lewis’ car was a bit scruffy >>>>>>> but all
the fast bits were intact, and he set off in spectacular recovery >>>>>>> mode.”
It's not what he said at the time.
Go rewatch the reace.
So.... since then he has had a chance to review the incident,
rather than just his immediate gut reaction, and noted that VER
surged forward late, largely off-track to the point of the collision. >>>>
single word you said there was wrong.
Your geometry must be different to mine, and that of the stewards.
And Brundle's.
His surge ahead happened as they were both braking for turn ONE. The
turn BEFORE the incident. He established his right to a car's width
at that point.
Then dropped back momentarily, and lost that right.
And Verstappen as never off track until the apex of TURN TWO, where
he did have his right side wheels on the kerbing, leaving as much
room as he possibly could for Hamilton. His right side tires didn't
so much as
That would be 'well over the kerbing'.
As they both turn into turn one, Verstappen edges ahead and from
that point until contact his front tire is never further back than
the middle of Hamilton's car, and in fact, when they make contact,
Hamilton's front tire hits Verstappen's front wing.
Surging forward from significantly behind that point.
I've got a copy of the in-car camera from Verstappen's car.
Are you willing to look at it and tell me:
Where he "surged forward late"?
Where he was "significantly behind"?
Hmmm?
Sufficiently, yes.
As the stewards clearly haven't seen your footage, I suggest you send it
to them.
geoff
On 2022-11-19 20:49, geoff wrote:
On 19/11/2022 4:56 pm, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-17 14:44, geoff wrote:
On 17/11/2022 2:53 pm, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-16 15:26, geoff wrote:
On 17/11/2022 11:50 am, Alan wrote:I've just reviewed Verstappen's in-car video on F1TV and every
On 2022-11-16 14:43, Sir Tim wrote:
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in >>>>>>>>> forWhat Brundle actually wrote:
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he >>>>>>>>> could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one
car's width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should >>>>>>>>> have been
given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed. >>>>>>>>>
“I have no doubt Max has a different set of limits when in
combat with
Lewis, and Lewis has similarly decided to fight fire with fire. >>>>>>>> And so
inevitably they hit but continued.
“The stewards said Lewis could have given ‘a little more space’, >>>>>>>> and in my
view Max could have taken even more kerb or indeed lifted off
the throttle,
but that’s not racing. The stewards decided it was predominantly >>>>>>>> Max’s
fault and he got a five-second penalty and a pit-stop for a new >>>>>>>> nose.
“I thought it was a racing incident. Lewis’ car was a bit
scruffy but all
the fast bits were intact, and he set off in spectacular
recovery mode.”
It's not what he said at the time.
Go rewatch the reace.
So.... since then he has had a chance to review the incident,
rather than just his immediate gut reaction, and noted that VER
surged forward late, largely off-track to the point of the collision. >>>>>
single word you said there was wrong.
Your geometry must be different to mine, and that of the stewards.
And Brundle's.
His surge ahead happened as they were both braking for turn ONE.
The turn BEFORE the incident. He established his right to a car's
width at that point.
Then dropped back momentarily, and lost that right.
And Verstappen as never off track until the apex of TURN TWO, where
he did have his right side wheels on the kerbing, leaving as much
room as he possibly could for Hamilton. His right side tires didn't
so much as
That would be 'well over the kerbing'.
As they both turn into turn one, Verstappen edges ahead and from
that point until contact his front tire is never further back than
the middle of Hamilton's car, and in fact, when they make contact,
Hamilton's front tire hits Verstappen's front wing.
Surging forward from significantly behind that point.
I've got a copy of the in-car camera from Verstappen's car.
Are you willing to look at it and tell me:
Where he "surged forward late"?
Where he was "significantly behind"?
Hmmm?
Sufficiently, yes.
As the stewards clearly haven't seen your footage, I suggest you send
it to them.
geoff
So you don't have the balls to look at it and point out where your
claims apply.
Got it.
On 20/11/2022 5:50 pm, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-19 20:49, geoff wrote:
On 19/11/2022 4:56 pm, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-17 14:44, geoff wrote:
On 17/11/2022 2:53 pm, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-16 15:26, geoff wrote:
On 17/11/2022 11:50 am, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-16 14:43, Sir Tim wrote:
Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned >>>>>>>>>> in forWhat Brundle actually wrote:
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he >>>>>>>>>> could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one >>>>>>>>>> car's width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should >>>>>>>>>> have been
given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed. >>>>>>>>>>
“I have no doubt Max has a different set of limits when in >>>>>>>>> combat with
Lewis, and Lewis has similarly decided to fight fire with fire. >>>>>>>>> And so
inevitably they hit but continued.
“The stewards said Lewis could have given ‘a little more >>>>>>>>> space’, and in my
view Max could have taken even more kerb or indeed lifted off >>>>>>>>> the throttle,
but that’s not racing. The stewards decided it was
predominantly Max’s
fault and he got a five-second penalty and a pit-stop for a new >>>>>>>>> nose.
“I thought it was a racing incident. Lewis’ car was a bit >>>>>>>>> scruffy but all
the fast bits were intact, and he set off in spectacular
recovery mode.”
It's not what he said at the time.
Go rewatch the reace.
So.... since then he has had a chance to review the incident,
rather than just his immediate gut reaction, and noted that VER
surged forward late, largely off-track to the point of the
collision.
I've just reviewed Verstappen's in-car video on F1TV and every
single word you said there was wrong.
Your geometry must be different to mine, and that of the stewards.
And Brundle's.
His surge ahead happened as they were both braking for turn ONE.
The turn BEFORE the incident. He established his right to a car's
width at that point.
Then dropped back momentarily, and lost that right.
And Verstappen as never off track until the apex of TURN TWO,
where he did have his right side wheels on the kerbing, leaving as >>>>>> much room as he possibly could for Hamilton. His right side tires
didn't so much as
That would be 'well over the kerbing'.
As they both turn into turn one, Verstappen edges ahead and from
that point until contact his front tire is never further back than >>>>>> the middle of Hamilton's car, and in fact, when they make contact, >>>>>> Hamilton's front tire hits Verstappen's front wing.
Surging forward from significantly behind that point.
I've got a copy of the in-car camera from Verstappen's car.
Are you willing to look at it and tell me:
Where he "surged forward late"?
Where he was "significantly behind"?
Hmmm?
Sufficiently, yes.
As the stewards clearly haven't seen your footage, I suggest you send
it to them.
geoff
So you don't have the balls to look at it and point out where your
claims apply.
Got it.
Clearly not.
Sufficiently, yes.
Hmmm?
So you don't have the balls to look at it and point out where your
claims apply.
Got it.
Clearly not.
No... ...I've got it very clear.
I've got a copy of the in-car camera from Verstappen's car.
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have been given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
On 11/16/2022 12:20 AM, Alan wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have
been given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
LOL, so I can carry as much speed as possible into the corner, ram the
driver that is taking a turn, and then said I was not left the space?
This is not GranTursimo on PSX.
Also, those drivers and you and Brundle are F-ing clowns for thinking
Max had any right to that corner. Even after a contact, Max overshot the
damn corner. Imagine if he did not hit Lewis what would have happened.
On 11/16/2022 12:20 AM, Alan wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's width
of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have
been given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
LOL, so I can carry as much speed as possible into the corner, ram the
driver that is taking a turn, and then said I was not left the space?
This is not GranTursimo on PSX.
Also, those drivers and you and Brundle are F-ing clowns for thinking
Max had any right to that corner. Even after a contact, Max overshot the
damn corner. Imagine if he did not hit Lewis what would have happened.
On 21/11/2022 8:38 pm, RzR wrote:
On 11/16/2022 12:20 AM, Alan wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's
width of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have
been given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
LOL, so I can carry as much speed as possible into the corner, ram the
driver that is taking a turn, and then said I was not left the space?
This is not GranTursimo on PSX.
Also, those drivers and you and Brundle are F-ing clowns for thinking
Max had any right to that corner. Even after a contact, Max overshot
the damn corner. Imagine if he did not hit Lewis what would have
happened.
The dick isn't complaining about Sainz v. Hamilton, Abu Dhabi 2022 eh.
On 2022-11-21 00:05, geoff wrote:
On 21/11/2022 8:38 pm, RzR wrote:
On 11/16/2022 12:20 AM, Alan wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's
width of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have
been given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
LOL, so I can carry as much speed as possible into the corner, ram
the driver that is taking a turn, and then said I was not left the
space? This is not GranTursimo on PSX.
Also, those drivers and you and Brundle are F-ing clowns for thinking
Max had any right to that corner. Even after a contact, Max overshot
the damn corner. Imagine if he did not hit Lewis what would have
happened.
The dick isn't complaining about Sainz v. Hamilton, Abu Dhabi 2022 eh.
I haven't had an opportunity yet, but Sainz was in the wrong because he
was attempting an over take and didn't leave Hamilton racing room.
Happy?
:-)
On 22/11/2022 5:50 am, Alan wrote:
On 2022-11-21 00:05, geoff wrote:
On 21/11/2022 8:38 pm, RzR wrote:
On 11/16/2022 12:20 AM, Alan wrote:
Verstappen's nose was ahead of Hamilton's before they turned in for
corner 2 and he positioned his car as far to the right as he could.
Hamilton had lots of room and time to leave Verstappen one car's
width of racing room.
I think the penalty was completely the opposite of what should have
been given.
So did Martin Brundle...
...and so do most of the open wheel racing drivers on ApexSpeed.
LOL, so I can carry as much speed as possible into the corner, ram
the driver that is taking a turn, and then said I was not left the
space? This is not GranTursimo on PSX.
Also, those drivers and you and Brundle are F-ing clowns for
thinking Max had any right to that corner. Even after a contact, Max
overshot the damn corner. Imagine if he did not hit Lewis what would
have happened.
The dick isn't complaining about Sainz v. Hamilton, Abu Dhabi 2022 eh.
I haven't had an opportunity yet, but Sainz was in the wrong because
he was attempting an over take and didn't leave Hamilton racing room.
Happy?
:-)
Whatever made you think I was referring to you ?
But correct, and HAM didn't even come from half-way off the track.
How naive.
On 2022-11-21 12:50, geoff wrote:
Whatever made you think I was referring to you ?Intelligence. Perception.
Just remember, dick:
Knowing to whom you are referring is not agreement with your method of referral
Why do you insist on this lie?
You don't imagine that the contact might have changed his trajectory?
On 11/21/2022 7:49 PM, Alan wrote:
You don't imagine that the contact might have changed his trajectory?
Nah, Max's trajectory is always the same. Directly towards Lewis.
Grow up.
On 2022-12-01 00:20, RzR wrote:
On 11/21/2022 7:49 PM, Alan wrote:
You don't imagine that the contact might have changed his trajectory?
Nah, Max's trajectory is always the same. Directly towards Lewis.
Grow up.
And how did Max magically create these DNFs: his spies in the Mercedes garage?
And how did Max magically create these DNFs: his spies in the Mercedes garage?
On 12/1/2022 10:03 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2022-12-01 00:20, RzR wrote:
On 11/21/2022 7:49 PM, Alan wrote:
You don't imagine that the contact might have changed his trajectory?
Nah, Max's trajectory is always the same. Directly towards Lewis.
Grow up.
So you have not really been watching last 4 races in 2021, when Max
needed Lewis' DNF. Got it. Next time tell us which races you watched, so
we can provide examples from those.
And how did Max magically create these DNFs: his spies in the Mercedes garage?
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