• Which Mixer has the Best Mic Preamps for Recording Piano? (and some gui

    From Paul Dorman@21:1/5 to All on Sat Aug 14 14:10:33 2021
    So if you wanted to buy a reasonably priced mixer,
    and get really good mic preamps for recording mainly
    the piano, which one would you all recommend?

    This is instead of buying expensive, dedicated mic preamps.

    I would only need 2-6 channels.

    Or perhaps there is a 2 channel USB audio interface, that is
    reasonably priced, but has excellent mic preamps, that
    you could all recommend?

    Thanks in advance....

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  • From Mike Rivers@21:1/5 to Paul Dorman on Sat Aug 14 18:17:47 2021
    On 8/14/2021 5:10 PM, Paul Dorman wrote:
    So if you wanted to buy a reasonably priced mixer,
    and get really good mic preamps for recording mainly
    the piano, which one would you all recommend?

    Depends on what you consider reasonably priced, and whether you already
    have an interface that's as good as you want the mic preamps to be.

    I would only need 2-6 channels.

    Or perhaps there is a 2 channel USB audio interface, that is
    reasonably priced, but has excellent mic preamps, that
    you could all recommend?

    There are many. It's hard to go wrong Focusrite

    --
    For a good time, call http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com

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  • From Paul Dorman@21:1/5 to Mike Rivers on Sat Aug 14 16:51:52 2021
    On 8/14/2021 3:17 PM, Mike Rivers wrote:
    On 8/14/2021 5:10 PM, Paul Dorman wrote:
    So if you wanted to buy a reasonably priced mixer,
    and get really good mic preamps for recording mainly
    the piano, which one would you all recommend?

    Depends on what you consider reasonably priced, and whether you already
    have an interface that's as good as you want the mic preamps to be.


    Maybe about $100-200.

    I already have a Tascam US-1641, but I have used a Mackie
    mixer's preamps in the past, and they were a good alternative.

    Maybe I could use something like this one:


    https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/402VLZ4--mackie-402vlz4-4-channel-mixer

    Do the Onyx mic preamps get good reviews here?



    I would only need 2-6 channels.

    Or perhaps there is a 2 channel USB audio interface, that is
    reasonably priced, but has excellent mic preamps, that
    you could all recommend?

    There are many. It's hard to go wrong Focusrite


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  • From pallison49@gmail.com@21:1/5 to Paul on Sat Aug 14 16:53:57 2021
    Paul wrote:
    ===========
    So if you wanted to buy a reasonably priced mixer,
    and get really good mic preamps for recording mainly
    the piano,

    ** You need to say what sort of mics you are using.
    The performance demands on a pre-amp are far less if they are condenser types.

    In any case the piano, the room and the playing matter far more.



    ..... Phil

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  • From Paul Dorman@21:1/5 to palli...@gmail.com on Sat Aug 14 19:46:11 2021
    On 8/14/2021 4:53 PM, palli...@gmail.com wrote:
    Paul wrote:
    ===========
    So if you wanted to buy a reasonably priced mixer,
    and get really good mic preamps for recording mainly
    the piano,

    ** You need to say what sort of mics you are using.
    The performance demands on a pre-amp are far less if they are condenser types.


    The mics will be a stereo pair of CM3 condensers by Line Audio
    Design. I might also use my Audio Technica AT4047 in conjunction,
    to get a fuller bodied sound.


    In any case the piano, the room and the playing matter far more.

    True. I'm looking for my first Yamaha grand as I type!

    :)

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  • From Mike Rivers@21:1/5 to Paul Dorman on Sun Aug 15 10:49:11 2021
    On 8/14/2021 7:51 PM, Paul Dorman wrote:

    So if you wanted to buy a reasonably priced mixer,
    and get really good mic preamps for recording mainly
    the piano, which one would you all recommend?

    Depends on what you consider reasonably priced, and whether you
    already have an interface that's as good as you want the mic preamps
    to be.


        Maybe about $100-200.

    $100-$200 per channel for mic preamps of any decent quality hasn't been
    seen for a long time. It's more in line with the price per channel of an inexpensive "better quality" mixer.


        I already have a Tascam US-1641, but I have used a Mackie
    mixer's preamps in the past, and they were a good alternative.

    Anything wrong with the TASCAM? If you're looking for a "better than"
    you need to specify in which ways you would like it to be better. "Sound quality" doesn't count.

        Maybe I could use something like this one: mackie-402vlz4-4-channel-mixer

    What would you do with it? Just use the preamps ahead of the TASCAM
    1641? I doubt that the Mackie preamps would offer any improvement over
    what's in the TASCAM.


        Do the Onyx mic preamps get good reviews here?

    It's rare that anything gets reviews here any more. Most everyone agrees
    that Onyx preamps are OK, but nothing exceptional.

    What problem are you trying to solve? Or do you just want to spend some
    money and see what kind of improvement you can make? As Phil said, the
    mic preamps are the least likely thing to affect the sound than the
    piano, mics, mic placement, and player.






    I would only need 2-6 channels.

    Or perhaps there is a 2 channel USB audio interface, that is
    reasonably priced, but has excellent mic preamps, that
    you could all recommend?

    There are many. It's hard to go wrong Focusrite




    --
    For a good time, call http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com

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  • From Scott Dorsey@21:1/5 to quiller123@gmail.com on Sun Aug 15 14:45:17 2021
    Paul Dorman <quiller123@gmail.com> wrote:
    So if you wanted to buy a reasonably priced mixer,
    and get really good mic preamps for recording mainly
    the piano, which one would you all recommend?

    I have always liked the APIs. They are not super expensive, the preamps
    are not super transparent but they are clean and not grubby.

    This is instead of buying expensive, dedicated mic preamps.

    I would only need 2-6 channels.

    Although you probably won't find a shortloaded API these days, you can
    still buy a cheap 500-series rack and put some API preamps into one. It's
    like having a console without the EQ or bussing. If you need a buss, you
    can get a small master module too.
    --scott
    --
    "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

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  • From polymod@21:1/5 to All on Sun Aug 15 17:45:50 2021
    "Paul Dorman" wrote in message news:sf9v5k$6sa$1@dont-email.me...
    <snip>

    I'm looking for my first Yamaha grand as I type! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    If you're going the used route I would look for the C series of grand
    pianos.
    The C7 is a great piano if you have the room. If you're short (no pun
    intended) on space the C3 is also a great piano.
    I am a piano tuner and have quite a few customers with both models.

    Good luck!
    Poly




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  • From Paul Dorman@21:1/5 to polymod on Sun Aug 15 18:20:55 2021
    On 8/15/2021 2:45 PM, polymod wrote:


    "Paul Dorman"  wrote in message news:sf9v5k$6sa$1@dont-email.me...
    <snip>

    I'm looking for my first Yamaha grand as I type!


    If you're going the used route I would look for  the C series of grand pianos.
    The C7 is a great piano if you have the room. If you're short (no pun intended) on space the C3 is also a great piano.
    I am a piano tuner and have quite a few customers with both models.


    Agreed 100%. I have space for a 6-7 footer, so I am
    looking for a used C3-C6.

    They are fantastic instruments!

    :)

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  • From Paul Dorman@21:1/5 to Mike Rivers on Sun Aug 15 18:53:14 2021
    On 8/15/2021 7:49 AM, Mike Rivers wrote:
    On 8/14/2021 7:51 PM, Paul Dorman wrote:

    So if you wanted to buy a reasonably priced mixer,
    and get really good mic preamps for recording mainly
    the piano, which one would you all recommend?

    Depends on what you consider reasonably priced, and whether you
    already have an interface that's as good as you want the mic preamps
    to be.


         Maybe about $100-200.

    $100-$200 per channel for mic preamps of any decent quality hasn't been
    seen for a long time. It's more in line with the price per channel of an inexpensive "better quality" mixer.


         I already have a Tascam US-1641, but I have used a Mackie
    mixer's preamps in the past, and they were a good alternative.

    Anything wrong with the TASCAM? If you're looking for a "better than"
    you need to specify in which ways you would like it to be better. "Sound quality" doesn't count.

         Maybe I could use something like this one:
    mackie-402vlz4-4-channel-mixer

    What would you do with it? Just use the preamps ahead of the TASCAM
    1641?  I doubt that the Mackie preamps would offer any improvement over what's in the TASCAM.

    I've used my Mackie 1402-VLZ preamps ahead of the Tascam, and I
    thought the sound was a bit brighter, and clearer.

    But my 1402 is busy with another job, so I was looking for a
    2nd unit.

    But I understand your point: I could probably make the Tascam
    preamp signals work fine, with a bit of post production EQing.




         Do the Onyx mic preamps get good reviews here?

    It's rare that anything gets reviews here any more. Most everyone agrees
    that Onyx preamps are OK, but nothing exceptional.

    What problem are you trying to solve? Or do you just want to spend some
    money and see what kind of improvement you can make? As Phil said, the
    mic preamps are the least likely thing to affect the sound than the
    piano, mics, mic placement, and player.






    I would only need 2-6 channels.

    Or perhaps there is a 2 channel USB audio interface, that is
    reasonably priced, but has excellent mic preamps, that
    you could all recommend?

    There are many. It's hard to go wrong Focusrite





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  • From Mike Rivers@21:1/5 to Paul Dorman on Mon Aug 16 09:20:59 2021
    On 8/15/2021 9:53 PM, Paul Dorman wrote:


        I've used my Mackie 1402-VLZ preamps ahead of the Tascam, and I thought the sound was a bit brighter, and clearer.

        But my 1402 is busy with another job, so I was looking for a
    2nd unit.

        But I understand your point:  I could probably make the Tascam preamp signals work fine, with a bit of post production EQing.

    You might be fooling yourself as to which signal route is better - with
    or without the TASCAM in line. It depends on how you're connecting the
    mixer with the interface. If you connect the Insert Send of the Mackie
    channel to one of the analog inputs (11-14) on the TASCAM, you will have bypassed the TASCAM's mic preamp and will only be hearing what goes
    through the Mackie.

    If you connected them some other way, you could be hearing both preamps
    in series, and/or you could be slightly overdriving the TASCAM input,
    giving you a slightly brighter sound because of increased harmonic
    distortion.

    Take some time to experiment. If the TASCAM, with or without some post-recording treatment, sounds fine, make use of it. The simplest
    signal path that works is the best one to use.


    --
    For a good time, call http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com

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  • From Paul Dorman@21:1/5 to Mike Rivers on Mon Aug 16 07:54:04 2021
    On 8/16/2021 6:20 AM, Mike Rivers wrote:
    On 8/15/2021 9:53 PM, Paul Dorman wrote:


         I've used my Mackie 1402-VLZ preamps ahead of the Tascam, and I
    thought the sound was a bit brighter, and clearer.

         But my 1402 is busy with another job, so I was looking for a
    2nd unit.

         But I understand your point:  I could probably make the Tascam
    preamp signals work fine, with a bit of post production EQing.

    You might be fooling yourself as to which signal route is better - with
    or without the TASCAM in line. It depends on how you're connecting the
    mixer with the interface. If you connect the Insert Send of the Mackie channel to one of the analog inputs (11-14) on the TASCAM, you will have bypassed the TASCAM's mic preamp and will only be hearing what goes
    through the Mackie.

    I was only hearing the preamp of the Mackie, via pre-fader/pre-EQ Tip-send from the back channel insert connections.



    If you connected them some other way, you could be hearing both preamps
    in series, and/or you could be slightly overdriving the TASCAM input,
    giving you a slightly brighter sound because of increased harmonic distortion.

    Take some time to experiment. If the TASCAM, with or without some post-recording treatment, sounds fine, make use of it. The simplest
    signal path that works is the best one to use.


    True.

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