https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/toyota-s-upcoming-hydrogen-powered-5-0-v-8-engine-has-the-potential-to-bury-evs/ar-AA15Q9mq?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=b018bd7ba2834a66d86d0ee38ce1ef53
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/toyota-s-upcoming-hydrogen-powered-5-0-v-8-engine-has-the-potential-to-bury-evs/ar-AA15Q9mq?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=b018bd7ba2834a66d86d0ee38ce1ef53
ScottW
On Saturday, December 31, 2022 at 3:54:12 PM UTC-5, Trevor Wilson wrote:
On 1/01/2023 5:04 am, ScottW wrote:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/toyota-s-upcoming-hydrogen-powered-5-0-v-8-engine-has-the-potential-to-bury-evs/ar-AA15Q9mq?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=b018bd7ba2834a66d86d0ee38ce1ef53
ScottW
**It'll never happen. Toyota are just show-boating. The real action is
with EVs and, particularly, H2 fuel cell EVs. Here are the reasons why:
* The THEORETICAL efficiency of a non-Diesel ICE vehicle 35%. The figure
is always lower. Often (when starting, cold weather, etc) that figure is
more like 15%.
* The REAL-WORLD efficiency of an EV is around 90%. Frequently, it is
higher. Combined with regenerative braking systems, that efficiency is
bumped up a few more points.
* ICE torque is generated at several thousand RPM.
* EV torque is generated at anything over zero RPM. If real-world
driving conditions (ie: city), this is ideal.
* Electric motors are simpler and require far less maintenance than ICE.
Since H2 fuel cell and H2 ICE vehicles require the same H2 storage
systems, it makes far more sense to use a system which uses that fuel
more efficiently.
H2 will, almost certainly, be a significant part of transport mix in
coming years. It will, almost certainly, NOT involve ICE technology,
except for a handful of niche applications.
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Did you recover from swallowing that man o war?
https://www.pedestrian.tv/news/bluebottle-bondi-beach/
On 1/01/2023 5:04 am, ScottW wrote:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/toyota-s-upcoming-hydrogen-powered-5-0-v-8-engine-has-the-potential-to-bury-evs/ar-AA15Q9mq?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=b018bd7ba2834a66d86d0ee38ce1ef53
ScottW
**It'll never happen. Toyota are just show-boating. The real action is
with EVs and, particularly, H2 fuel cell EVs. Here are the reasons why:
* The THEORETICAL efficiency of a non-Diesel ICE vehicle 35%. The figure
is always lower. Often (when starting, cold weather, etc) that figure is
more like 15%.
* The REAL-WORLD efficiency of an EV is around 90%. Frequently, it is
higher. Combined with regenerative braking systems, that efficiency is
bumped up a few more points.
* ICE torque is generated at several thousand RPM.
* EV torque is generated at anything over zero RPM. If real-world
driving conditions (ie: city), this is ideal.
* Electric motors are simpler and require far less maintenance than ICE.
Since H2 fuel cell and H2 ICE vehicles require the same H2 storage
systems, it makes far more sense to use a system which uses that fuel
more efficiently.
H2 will, almost certainly, be a significant part of transport mix in
coming years. It will, almost certainly, NOT involve ICE technology,
except for a handful of niche applications.
--
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On 1/01/2023 4:15 pm, ScottW wrote:
On Saturday, December 31, 2022 at 12:54:12 PM UTC-8, Trevor Wilson wrote:
On 1/01/2023 5:04 am, ScottW wrote:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/toyota-s-upcoming-hydrogen-powered-5-0-v-8-engine-has-the-potential-to-bury-evs/ar-AA15Q9mq?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=b018bd7ba2834a66d86d0ee38ce1ef53
ScottW
**It'll never happen. Toyota are just show-boating. The real action is
with EVs and, particularly, H2 fuel cell EVs. Here are the reasons why:
I guess you didn't watch the video embedded in the link comparing hydrogen storage capacity**Fuel cells show great promise. So much so, that vast swathes of the Japanese auto industry are converting to fuel cell EVs.
and range. It clearly showed the issues. Then again it also showed that batteries aren't that great as space eaters and we already know what they do to GVW.
Anyway, I don't really consider a hydrogen fuel fuel cell car an EV.
It's not fueled with electricity.
**Uh-huh. And what power source do the motors in a fuel cell operate from?
A: Hydrogen
On 1/01/2023 5:04 am, ScottW wrote:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/toyota-s-upcoming-hydrogen-powered-5-0-v-8-engine-has-the-potential-to-bury-evs/ar-AA15Q9mq?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=b018bd7ba2834a66d86d0ee38ce1ef53
ScottW
**It'll never happen. Toyota are just show-boating. The real action is
with EVs and, particularly, H2 fuel cell EVs. Here are the reasons why:
On 1/01/2023 4:15 pm, ScottW wrote:
On Saturday, December 31, 2022 at 12:54:12 PM UTC-8, Trevor Wilson wrote:
On 1/01/2023 5:04 am, ScottW wrote:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/toyota-s-upcoming-hydrogen-powered-5-0-v-8-engine-has-the-potential-to-bury-evs/ar-AA15Q9mq?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=b018bd7ba2834a66d86d0ee38ce1ef53
ScottW
**It'll never happen. Toyota are just show-boating. The real action is
with EVs and, particularly, H2 fuel cell EVs. Here are the reasons why:
I guess you didn't watch the video embedded in the link comparing hydrogen storage capacity**Fuel cells show great promise. So much so, that vast swathes of the Japanese auto industry are converting to fuel cell EVs.
and range. It clearly showed the issues. Then again it also showed that batteries aren't that great as space eaters and we already know what they do to GVW.
Anyway, I don't really consider a hydrogen fuel fuel cell car an EV.
It's not fueled with electricity.
**Uh-huh. And what power source do the motors in a fuel cell operate from?
A: ELECTRICITY.
That makes an H2 fuel cell vehicle an EV. The fuel cell is merely a
different kind of battery.
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On Saturday, December 31, 2022 at 12:54:12 PM UTC-8, Trevor Wilson wrote:
On 1/01/2023 5:04 am, ScottW wrote:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/toyota-s-upcoming-hydrogen-powered-5-0-v-8-engine-has-the-potential-to-bury-evs/ar-AA15Q9mq?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=b018bd7ba2834a66d86d0ee38ce1ef53
ScottW
**It'll never happen. Toyota are just show-boating. The real action is
with EVs and, particularly, H2 fuel cell EVs. Here are the reasons why:
I guess you didn't watch the video embedded in the link comparing hydrogen storage capacity
and range. It clearly showed the issues. Then again it also showed that batteries aren't that great as space eaters and we already know what they
do to GVW.
Anyway, I don't really consider a hydrogen fuel fuel cell car an EV.
It's not fueled with electricity.
On Saturday, December 31, 2022 at 9:20:47 PM UTC-8, Trevor Wilson wrote:
On 1/01/2023 4:15 pm, ScottW wrote:
On Saturday, December 31, 2022 at 12:54:12 PM UTC-8, Trevor Wilson wrote: >>>> On 1/01/2023 5:04 am, ScottW wrote:**Fuel cells show great promise. So much so, that vast swathes of the
I guess you didn't watch the video embedded in the link comparing hydrogen storage capacityhttps://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/toyota-s-upcoming-hydrogen-powered-5-0-v-8-engine-has-the-potential-to-bury-evs/ar-AA15Q9mq?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=b018bd7ba2834a66d86d0ee38ce1ef53
ScottW
**It'll never happen. Toyota are just show-boating. The real action is >>>> with EVs and, particularly, H2 fuel cell EVs. Here are the reasons why: >>>
and range. It clearly showed the issues. Then again it also showed that
batteries aren't that great as space eaters and we already know what they >>> do to GVW.
Japanese auto industry are converting to fuel cell EVs.
Anyway, I don't really consider a hydrogen fuel fuel cell car an EV.**Uh-huh. And what power source do the motors in a fuel cell operate from? >>
It's not fueled with electricity.
A: Hydrogen
I fixed it. You're simply confusing people by implying the electricity
grid plays a role.
No one says locomotives are powered by electricity.
On 1/01/2023 4:55 pm, ScottW wrote:
On Saturday, December 31, 2022 at 9:20:47 PM UTC-8, Trevor Wilson wrote:
On 1/01/2023 4:15 pm, ScottW wrote:
On Saturday, December 31, 2022 at 12:54:12 PM UTC-8, Trevor Wilson wrote: >>>> On 1/01/2023 5:04 am, ScottW wrote:**Fuel cells show great promise. So much so, that vast swathes of the
I guess you didn't watch the video embedded in the link comparing hydrogen storage capacityhttps://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/toyota-s-upcoming-hydrogen-powered-5-0-v-8-engine-has-the-potential-to-bury-evs/ar-AA15Q9mq?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=b018bd7ba2834a66d86d0ee38ce1ef53
ScottW
**It'll never happen. Toyota are just show-boating. The real action is >>>> with EVs and, particularly, H2 fuel cell EVs. Here are the reasons why: >>>
and range. It clearly showed the issues. Then again it also showed that >>> batteries aren't that great as space eaters and we already know what they >>> do to GVW.
Japanese auto industry are converting to fuel cell EVs.
Anyway, I don't really consider a hydrogen fuel fuel cell car an EV.**Uh-huh. And what power source do the motors in a fuel cell operate from? >>
It's not fueled with electricity.
A: Hydrogen
I fixed it. You're simply confusing people by implying the electricity**I never implied such a thing, though it is obvious that H2 will be
grid plays a role.
made via the use of electricity.
No one says locomotives are powered by electricity.**Yeah, they do. It's in the name:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel%E2%80%93electric_transmission
Only Trevor thinks diesel locomotives aren't run on diesel fuel.
But he's crazy.
Then so is the rail industry:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel%E2%80%93electric_transmission
Only Trevor thinks diesel locomotives aren't run on diesel fuel.
But he's crazy.
On 1/2/23 1:13 AM, ScottW wrote:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel%E2%80%93electric_transmission
Only Trevor thinks diesel locomotives aren't run on diesel fuel.Then so is the rail industry:
But he's crazy.
https://www.up.com/aboutup/special_trains/diesel-electric/
Although commonly called "diesels," the locomotives actually are
electrically driven. The diesel engine drives an alternator, which
produces electricity to run electric motors mounted on the locomotive's axles.
On Monday, January 2, 2023 at 7:48:38 AM UTC-8, MINe109 wrote:
On 1/2/23 1:13 AM, ScottW wrote:
Then so is the rail industry:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel%E2%80%93electric_transmission
Only Trevor thinks diesel locomotives aren't run on diesel fuel.
But he's crazy.
https://www.up.com/aboutup/special_trains/diesel-electric/
Although commonly called "diesels," the locomotives actually are
electrically driven. The diesel engine drives an alternator, which
produces electricity to run electric motors mounted on the locomotive's
axles.
So their source of power is diesel fuel.
In reality electricity isn't a power source, just a means of transporting it. When we harness the earth's magnetic field as source of power...I'll reconsider.
Until then...it's just a means of transport and/or storage.
But never a source. Now if you want to knitpik that carbon fuels are also just a
means of transport and storage....you'd be technically correct, but not practically.
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