The present monarch of Great Britain has now reached the age of ninety-four, >never reached by Eomer (or Thain Isumbras III,or the Masters of Buckland >Marmadoc and Saradoc Brandybuck)...only Aldor the Old among the Kings of
the Mark remains as having reached a greater age.
Shall she surpass him?
On Wed, 22 Apr 2020 00:00:17 +0000 (UTC), Louis Epstein
<le@top.put.com> wrote:
The present monarch of Great Britain has now reached the age of ninety-four, >>never reached by Eomer (or Thain Isumbras III,or the Masters of Buckland >>Marmadoc and Saradoc Brandybuck)...only Aldor the Old among the Kings of >>the Mark remains as having reached a greater age.
Shall she surpass him?
Interesting question.
But would not "Will she surpass him?" have been better?
Or is this some Brit/American English thing?
On Wed, 22 Apr 2020 00:00:17 +0000 (UTC), Louis Epstein
<le@top.put.com> wrote:
The present monarch of Great Britain has now reached the age of ninety-four, >>never reached by Eomer (or Thain Isumbras III,or the Masters of Buckland >>Marmadoc and Saradoc Brandybuck)...only Aldor the Old among the Kings of >>the Mark remains as having reached a greater age.
Shall she surpass him?
Interesting question.
But would not "Will she surpass him?" have been better?
Or is this some Brit/American English thing?
In alt.fan.tolkien Paul S Person <psperson1@ix.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Wed, 22 Apr 2020 00:00:17 +0000 (UTC), Louis Epstein
<le@top.put.com> wrote:
The present monarch of Great Britain has now reached the age of ninety-four, >>>never reached by Eomer (or Thain Isumbras III,or the Masters of Buckland >>>Marmadoc and Saradoc Brandybuck)...only Aldor the Old among the Kings of >>>the Mark remains as having reached a greater age.
Shall she surpass him?
Interesting question.
But would not "Will she surpass him?" have been better?
Or is this some Brit/American English thing?
I'm really not sure which word works best to what listener...
but my intention is to ask whether it is going to happen,
without implying a deliberate act unnecessarily.
(To what extent is survival consciously willed and to what extent
a consequence of life processes?)
No doubt it reflects my age and education, but, in that case, "will"
would be what you want -- for second and third person -- and "shall"
would be a command to do what you ordered.
In first person, just to make this even more pedantic, these meanings >/reverse/: "I shall" indicates what you intend to do; "I will"
indicates what you are going to do (or, at least, are determined to
do, or are promising to do).
But according to Fowler's "Modern English Usage", the difference is
north and south rather than East and West, and cites the case of a
Scot who fell into an English river and was misunderstood when he
shouted out "I shall drown, no one will save me."
No doubt it reflects my age and education, but, in that case, "will"
would be what you want -- for second and third person -- and "shall"
would be a command to do what you ordered.
On 2020-04-25, Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> wrote:
But according to Fowler's "Modern English Usage", the difference is
north and south rather than East and West, and cites the case of a
Scot who fell into an English river and was misunderstood when he
shouted out "I shall drown, no one will save me."
You have that the wrong way round.
he shouted "I will be drowned, no one shall save me."
The list below has not been augmented this time,there is
unlikely to be additional scholarship to extend it,but I
repost as ever on the birthday of the only British monarch
in whose reign TLotR has been in print...the Queen is now 96.
On the list below she remains in the gap between the 3-way tie
at 93 (including Eomer) and the 4-way tie at 98 (including
3 Stewards of Gondor and a Thain).
It bears noting that she is the first British monarch to reach
82 let alone 96...in that 14-year span she has passed five Kings
of Rohan,most recently Eomer,and only Aldor the Old of that realm
remains ahead of her,as he does in years of reign as well (Eomer's
65 years exceeding any prior Briton).
Named hereditary titleholders of Arda reigning between 60 and 100 years:
Thorin I 99 years
Nain II 97
Arantar 96
Gloin 96
Thorin II 91
Eldacar (Arnor) 90
Cemendur 90
Tar-Calmacil 88
Tarondor (Arnor) 87
Anardil 87
Earendil 86
Amlaith 85
Earendur 84
Faramir 84
Beleg 83
Tarannon Falastur 83
Siriondil 82
Mallor 81
Celepharn 81
Celebrindor 81
Argeleb II 81
Ostoher 81
Atanatar I 81
Hyarmendacil II 81
Tarcil 80
Araphor 80
Calimehtar 80
Ciryandil 79
Tar-Palantir 78
Araval 78
Dain II 78
Cirion 78
Malvegil 77
Atanatar II 77
Ar-Gimilzor 75
Aldor the Old 75
Tar-Ardamin 74
Arvegil 73
Araphant 73
Aravir 72
Gerontius 72
Ar-Zimrathon 71
Arahael 71
Arveleg II 70
Aranuir 70
Ar-Sakalthor 69
Arahad I 68
Narmacil I 68
Aravorn 66
Valacar 66
Aragost 65
Arahad II 65
Arassuil 65
Eomer 65
Ar-Pharazon 64
Arathorn I 64
Argonui 64
Ar-Adunakhor 63
Romendacil II 62 (after 64 years as regent)
Belecthor II 61
Gondor's Eldacar reigned only 58 years
de jure and 48 de facto.Gondor's Tarondor
reigned 162 years.
Lifespans between 90 years and the 130 of the Old Took,
Argeleb I of Arnor,and the Steward Belegorn:
Hallas 125 years
Earnur 122
Barahir 122
Telemnar 120
Mardil 120
Hurin I 120
Belecthor II 120
Faramir 120
Pelendur 119
Cirion 118
Eradan 117
Egalmoth 117
Turin I 113
Hurin II 113
Herion 111
Beregond 111
Angelimir 111
Arvedui 110
Arador 110
Belecthor I 110
Orodreth 109
Beren 108
Dior 107
Rorimac Brandybuck 106
Aglahad 105
Fortinbras I 103
Gorbadoc Brandybuck 103
Denethor I 102
Isengrim II 102
Fortinbras II 102
Gormadoc Brandybuck 102
Madoc Brandybuck 102
Aldor the Old 101
Isumbras IV 101
Paladin II 101
Elphir 101
Arveleg I 100
Aragorn I 100
Thorondir 100
Ferumbras II 100
Imrahil 100
Turin II 99
Ferumbras III 99
Alphros 99
Ecthelion I 98
Turgon 98
Ecthelion II 98
Isengrim III 98
Isumbras III 93
Marmadoc Brandybuck 93
Eomer 93
Saradoc Brandybuck 92
-=-=-
The World Trade Center towers MUST rise again,
at least as tall as before...or terror has triumphed.
Louis Epstein <le@top.put.com> wrote:
The list below has not been augmented this time,there is
unlikely to be additional scholarship to extend it,but I
repost as ever on the birthday of the only British monarch
in whose reign TLotR has been in print...the Queen is now 96.
On the list below she remains in the gap between the 3-way tie
at 93 (including Eomer) and the 4-way tie at 98 (including
3 Stewards of Gondor and a Thain).
It bears noting that she is the first British monarch to reach
82 let alone 96...in that 14-year span she has passed five Kings
of Rohan,most recently Eomer,and only Aldor the Old of that realm
remains ahead of her,as he does in years of reign as well (Eomer's
65 years exceeding any prior Briton).
Named hereditary titleholders of Arda reigning between 60 and 100 years:
Thorin I 99 years
Nain II 97
Arantar 96
Gloin 96
Thorin II 91
Eldacar (Arnor) 90
Cemendur 90
Tar-Calmacil 88
Tarondor (Arnor) 87
Anardil 87
Earendil 86
Amlaith 85
Earendur 84
Faramir 84
Beleg 83
Tarannon Falastur 83
Siriondil 82
Mallor 81
Celepharn 81
Celebrindor 81
Argeleb II 81
Ostoher 81
Atanatar I 81
Hyarmendacil II 81
Tarcil 80
Araphor 80
Calimehtar 80
Ciryandil 79
Tar-Palantir 78
Araval 78
Dain II 78
Cirion 78
Malvegil 77
Atanatar II 77
Ar-Gimilzor 75
Aldor the Old 75
Tar-Ardamin 74
Arvegil 73
Araphant 73
Aravir 72
Gerontius 72
Ar-Zimrathon 71
Arahael 71
Arveleg II 70
Aranuir 70
Ar-Sakalthor 69
Arahad I 68
Narmacil I 68
Aravorn 66
Valacar 66
Aragost 65
Arahad II 65
Arassuil 65
Eomer 65
Ar-Pharazon 64
Arathorn I 64
Argonui 64
Ar-Adunakhor 63
Romendacil II 62 (after 64 years as regent)
Belecthor II 61
Gondor's Eldacar reigned only 58 years
de jure and 48 de facto.Gondor's Tarondor
reigned 162 years.
Lifespans between 90 years and the 130 of the Old Took,
Argeleb I of Arnor,and the Steward Belegorn:
Hallas 125 years
Earnur 122
Barahir 122
Telemnar 120
Mardil 120
Hurin I 120
Belecthor II 120
Faramir 120
Pelendur 119
Cirion 118
Eradan 117
Egalmoth 117
Turin I 113
Hurin II 113
Herion 111
Beregond 111
Angelimir 111
Arvedui 110
Arador 110
Belecthor I 110
Orodreth 109
Beren 108
Dior 107
Rorimac Brandybuck 106
Aglahad 105
Fortinbras I 103
Gorbadoc Brandybuck 103
Denethor I 102
Isengrim II 102
Fortinbras II 102
Gormadoc Brandybuck 102
Madoc Brandybuck 102
Aldor the Old 101
Isumbras IV 101
Paladin II 101
Elphir 101
Arveleg I 100
Aragorn I 100
Thorondir 100
Ferumbras II 100
Imrahil 100
Turin II 99
Ferumbras III 99
Alphros 99
Ecthelion I 98
Turgon 98
Ecthelion II 98
Isengrim III 98
Isumbras III 93
Marmadoc Brandybuck 93
Eomer 93
Saradoc Brandybuck 92
-=-=-
The World Trade Center towers MUST rise again,
at least as tall as before...or terror has triumphed.
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