• Does Star Trek Suck Now?

    From Travoltron@21:1/5 to All on Sun Apr 10 12:39:51 2022
    XPost: alt.wesley.crusher.die.die.die

    The answer is yes. Yes it does.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Your Name@21:1/5 to Travoltron on Mon Apr 11 10:11:27 2022
    XPost: alt.wesley.crusher.die.die.die

    On 2022-04-10 19:39:51 +0000, Travoltron said:

    The answer is yes. Yes it does.

    It started sucking with the first idiotic reboot attempt "Enterprise"
    and then got even suckier with the second reboot attempt by JarJar
    Abrams. At this point real "Star Trek" has been long dead. :-(

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From The Doctor@21:1/5 to YourName@YourISP.com on Sun Apr 10 23:12:40 2022
    XPost: alt.wesley.crusher.die.die.die

    In article <t2vkmf$mtv$1@gioia.aioe.org>,
    Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
    On 2022-04-10 19:39:51 +0000, Travoltron said:

    The answer is yes. Yes it does.

    It started sucking with the first idiotic reboot attempt "Enterprise"
    and then got even suckier with the second reboot attempt by JarJar
    Abrams. At this point real "Star Trek" has been long dead. :-(


    And then there is Chibnall and Doctor Who!
    --
    Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
    Yahweh, Queen & country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
    Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism https://www.empire.kred/ROOTNK?t=94a1f39b Overreacting has as much virtue as underreacting. -unknown Beware https://mindspring.com

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Ant@21:1/5 to The Doctor on Sun Apr 10 23:27:05 2022
    XPost: alt.wesley.crusher.die.die.die

    In rec.arts.startrek.current The Doctor <doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
    In article <t2vkmf$mtv$1@gioia.aioe.org>,
    Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
    On 2022-04-10 19:39:51 +0000, Travoltron said:

    The answer is yes. Yes it does.

    It started sucking with the first idiotic reboot attempt "Enterprise"
    and then got even suckier with the second reboot attempt by JarJar
    Abrams. At this point real "Star Trek" has been long dead. :-(


    And then there is Chibnall and Doctor Who!

    Star Wars, etc.
    --
    Slammy Palmy Sunday! Also, Jesus' week!
    Note: A fixed width font (Courier, Monospace, etc.) is required to see this signature correctly.
    /\___/\ Ant(Dude) @ http://aqfl.net & http://antfarm.home.dhs.org.
    / /\ /\ \ Please nuke ANT if replying by e-mail.
    | |o o| |
    \ _ /
    ( )

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pehache@21:1/5 to All on Tue Apr 26 09:44:38 2022
    Le 11/04/2022 à 00:11, Your Name a écrit :
    On 2022-04-10 19:39:51 +0000, Travoltron said:

    The answer is yes. Yes it does.

    It started sucking with the first idiotic reboot attempt "Enterprise"

    "Enterprise" is not a reboot, rather a prequel. And in contrast to the
    2009+ fake-trek, ENT is fully consistent with the existing universe, built
    by TOS-TNG-DS9-VOY

    and then got even suckier with the second reboot attempt by JarJar
    Abrams. At this point real "Star Trek" has been long dead. :-(

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pehache@21:1/5 to All on Tue Apr 26 09:40:34 2022
    Le 10/04/2022 à 21:39, Travoltron a écrit :

    The answer is yes. Yes it does.

    Definitely

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Your Name@21:1/5 to pehache on Wed Apr 27 08:40:24 2022
    On 2022-04-26 09:44:38 +0000, pehache said:
    Le 11/04/2022 à 00:11, Your Name a écrit :
    On 2022-04-10 19:39:51 +0000, Travoltron said:

    The answer is yes. Yes it does.

    It started sucking with the first idiotic reboot attempt "Enterprise"

    "Enterprise" is not a reboot, rather a prequel.

    It was both - it was a reboot set before Kirk's time. Beavis & Butthead
    were trying to reboot the franchise due to supposed "franchise fatigue"
    after TNG, DS9, VOY, and TNG movies.



    And in contrast to the 2009+ fake-trek, ENT is fully consistent with
    the existing universe, built by TOS-TNG-DS9-VOY

    Not only did it not consisent with the then-existing universe, they
    purposely tried to distance it by not calling it "Star Trek:
    Enterprise", and then at the end tried to retro-fit it by making it all
    a silly Holodreck fantasy.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Travoltron@21:1/5 to All on Tue Apr 26 17:55:16 2022
    XPost: alt.wesley.crusher.die.die.die

    Dark days. All our favorite "franchises' (hate that term) have been
    entrusted to legit imbeciles.
    These people have no life experience. They go right from university to
    industry jobs that daddy got them. The most worthless, vapid people on
    earth.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pehache@21:1/5 to All on Wed Apr 27 13:29:17 2022
    Le 26/04/2022 à 22:40, Your Name a écrit :
    On 2022-04-26 09:44:38 +0000, pehache said:
    Le 11/04/2022 à 00:11, Your Name a écrit :
    On 2022-04-10 19:39:51 +0000, Travoltron said:

    The answer is yes. Yes it does.

    It started sucking with the first idiotic reboot attempt "Enterprise"

    "Enterprise" is not a reboot, rather a prequel.

    It was both - it was a reboot set before Kirk's time. Beavis & Butthead
    were trying to reboot the franchise due to supposed "franchise fatigue"
    after TNG, DS9, VOY, and TNG movies.



    And in contrast to the 2009+ fake-trek, ENT is fully consistent with
    the existing universe, built by TOS-TNG-DS9-VOY

    Not only did it not consisent with the then-existing universe,

    What is not consistent, precisely ? I mean speaking about important inconsistencies, not about inconsistent details that happened also in all
    the previous shows and that are impossible to completely avoid during
    almost 800 episodes and 10 movies.

    On the other hand, Enterprise for instance :
    - gave an explanation to the Klingon change of appearance between TOS and
    TNG
    - established how and why the human race took a kind of lead in the
    Federation. This was given for granted in the previous, but was somehow
    strange if you consider that the Vulcan for instance were much more
    advance than the human at that times, both technologically and ethically.

    they
    purposely tried to distance it by not calling it "Star Trek:
    Enterprise",

    Just a name... What is important is the content. "Discovery" and "Picard"
    both display the "Star Trek" name, but are much less "Star Trek" than any
    of the previous shows.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From DaveJohnson12@nomail.@21:1/5 to travoltron@defender.uni on Tue Aug 23 23:24:37 2022
    On Sun, 10 Apr 2022 12:39:51 -0700, Travoltron
    <travoltron@defender.uni> wrote:

    The answer is yes. Yes it does.

    I gave up on STD after 4 seasons. It's too political and the main
    character whispers most of her lines for dramatic effect. I don't like
    her acting.
    Season 1 of Peecard was alright asside from some of the woke aspects.
    Season 2 became more obnoxious with the producer forcing his politics
    on us. I hope I don't watch season 3.
    Strange New World varied between okay and not interesting. Having a
    man play the role of a slender woman will make some people happy. It's
    part of the producer's politics. I didn't appreciate it.
    CBS has mostly ruined Star Trek for many fans of the first 5 tv
    series.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Your Name@21:1/5 to DaveJohnson12@nomail. on Wed Aug 24 16:19:04 2022
    On 2022-08-24 04:24:37 +0000, DaveJohnson12@nomail. said:

    On Sun, 10 Apr 2022 12:39:51 -0700, Travoltron
    <travoltron@defender.uni> wrote:

    The answer is yes. Yes it does.

    I gave up on STD after 4 seasons. It's too political and the main
    character whispers most of her lines for dramatic effect. I don't like
    her acting.
    Season 1 of Peecard was alright asside from some of the woke aspects.
    Season 2 became more obnoxious with the producer forcing his politics
    on us. I hope I don't watch season 3.
    Strange New World varied between okay and not interesting. Having a
    man play the role of a slender woman will make some people happy. It's
    part of the producer's politics. I didn't appreciate it.
    CBS has mostly ruined Star Trek for many fans of the first 5 tv
    series.

    There's only four TV series:

    - Star Trek [the original show]
    - Star Trek: The Next Generation
    - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine
    - Star Trek: Voyager

    Five, I guess, if you include the original animated "Star Trek" show.

    Plus of course the first few movies, although the 'save the whales' one
    was rather silly.

    After that it you get the ridiculous reboot garbage beginning -
    "Enterprise" (note it doesn't even have "Star Trek" in the title being
    a massive clue) and then followed by JarJar Abrams even worse movies.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Elim Garak@21:1/5 to DaveJohnson12@nomail. on Fri Aug 26 11:26:40 2022
    DaveJohnson12@nomail. writes:


    On Sun, 10 Apr 2022 12:39:51 -0700, Travoltron
    <travoltron@defender.uni> wrote:

    The answer is yes. Yes it does.

    I gave up on STD after 4 seasons. It's too political and the main
    character whispers most of her lines for dramatic effect. I don't like
    her acting.
    Season 1 of Peecard was alright asside from some of the woke aspects.
    Season 2 became more obnoxious with the producer forcing his politics
    on us. I hope I don't watch season 3.

    Imagine if TOS had included woke bullshit. You would have had a black
    woman on the bridge who wasn't there just to clean it. Or planets that
    were just heavy-handed metaphors for US 1960s race relations.

    Or if Deep Space Nine were woke... the Ferengi would have been quoting
    Marx!

    --
    Elim Garak
    Just a plain and simple tailor.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From dumpster4@hotmail.com@21:1/5 to All on Sun Sep 11 14:44:12 2022
    It's not just Star Trek:

    https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLFz_00sC7mo7Zu5GSSj9hqJ8G3faYyhLK

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Your Name@21:1/5 to dumpster4@hotmail.com on Mon Sep 12 10:30:32 2022
    On 2022-09-11 21:44:12 +0000, dumpster4@hotmail.com said:

    It's not just Star Trek:

    https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLFz_00sC7mo7Zu5GSSj9hqJ8G3faYyhLK

    The biggest reason is that Hollyweird is infested with a lazy,
    talentless generation who *think* they know better than the original's
    creator what it "should" be ... and 99.99% of the time prove they
    haven't got a clue. :-(

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pH@21:1/5 to dumpster4@hotmail.com on Mon Sep 12 02:56:50 2022
    On 2022-09-11, dumpster4@hotmail.com <dumpster4@hotmail.com> wrote:
    It's not just Star Trek:

    https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLFz_00sC7mo7Zu5GSSj9hqJ8G3faYyhLK

    If anyone has the courage to bravely do an "experimental" 1950's style hero movie--Star Trek or otherwise--I predict it would be *very* successful
    despite a firestorm of (predictable) criticism.

    Do I hold my breath in hopes that this might actually occur?

    ......no.


    pH in Aptos

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From dumpster4@hotmail.com@21:1/5 to All on Mon Sep 12 13:20:11 2022
    On Sunday, September 11, 2022 at 7:56:51 PM UTC-7, pH wrote:
    On 2022-09-11, dump...@hotmail.com <dump...@hotmail.com> wrote:
    It's not just Star Trek:

    https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLFz_00sC7mo7Zu5GSSj9hqJ8G3faYyhLK
    If anyone has the courage to bravely do an "experimental" 1950's style hero movie--Star Trek or otherwise--I predict it would be *very* successful despite a firestorm of (predictable) criticism.

    Do I hold my breath in hopes that this might actually occur?

    ......no.


    pH in Aptos


    Hollywoke doesn't like Capt. Kirk and his ilk:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=heDoY1dALoA

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pehache@21:1/5 to All on Tue Sep 13 20:08:17 2022
    Le 24/08/2022 à 06:19, Your Name a écrit :
    On 2022-08-24 04:24:37 +0000, DaveJohnson12@nomail. said:

    On Sun, 10 Apr 2022 12:39:51 -0700, Travoltron
    <travoltron@defender.uni> wrote:

    The answer is yes. Yes it does.

    I gave up on STD after 4 seasons. It's too political and the main
    character whispers most of her lines for dramatic effect. I don't like
    her acting.
    Season 1 of Peecard was alright asside from some of the woke aspects.
    Season 2 became more obnoxious with the producer forcing his politics
    on us. I hope I don't watch season 3.
    Strange New World varied between okay and not interesting. Having a
    man play the role of a slender woman will make some people happy. It's
    part of the producer's politics. I didn't appreciate it.
    CBS has mostly ruined Star Trek for many fans of the first 5 tv
    series.

    There's only four TV series:

     - Star Trek [the original show]
     - Star Trek: The Next Generation
     - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine
     - Star Trek: Voyager

    Five, I guess, if you include the original animated "Star Trek" show.

    Plus of course the first few movies, although the 'save the whales' one
    was rather silly.

    After that it you get the ridiculous reboot garbage beginning -
    "Enterprise" (note it doesn't even have "Star Trek" in the title being a massive clue) and then followed by JarJar Abrams even worse movies.

    Enterprise is fully part of the historical ST and retains all the spirit
    of ST.


    --
    "...sois ouvert aux idées des autres pour peu qu'elles aillent dans le
    même sens que les tiennes.", ST sur fr.bio.medecine
    ST passe le mur du çon : <j3nn2hFmqj7U1@mid.individual.net>

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Your Name@21:1/5 to pehache on Wed Sep 14 08:34:12 2022
    On 2022-09-13 18:08:17 +0000, pehache said:

    Le 24/08/2022 à 06:19, Your Name a écrit :
    On 2022-08-24 04:24:37 +0000, DaveJohnson12@nomail. said:

    On Sun, 10 Apr 2022 12:39:51 -0700, Travoltron
    <travoltron@defender.uni> wrote:

    The answer is yes. Yes it does.

    I gave up on STD after 4 seasons. It's too political and the main
    character whispers most of her lines for dramatic effect. I don't like
    her acting.
    Season 1 of Peecard was alright asside from some of the woke aspects.
    Season 2 became more obnoxious with the producer forcing his politics
    on us. I hope I don't watch season 3.
    Strange New World varied between okay and not interesting. Having a
    man play the role of a slender woman will make some people happy. It's
    part of the producer's politics. I didn't appreciate it.
    CBS has mostly ruined Star Trek for many fans of the first 5 tv
    series.

    There's only four TV series:

     - Star Trek [the original show]
     - Star Trek: The Next Generation
     - Star Trek: Deep Space Nine
     - Star Trek: Voyager

    Five, I guess, if you include the original animated "Star Trek" show.

    Plus of course the first few movies, although the 'save the whales' one
    was rather silly.

    After that it you get the ridiculous reboot garbage beginning -
    "Enterprise" (note it doesn't even have "Star Trek" in the title being
    a massive clue) and then followed by JarJar Abrams even worse movies.

    Enterprise is fully part of the historical ST and retains all the spirit of ST.

    "Enterprise" was the first crappy reboot attempt. The idiots making it
    even said they were making a "Star Trek" show to try to appeal to
    non-Star Trek fans (hence leaving "Star Trek" out of the title) ...
    what they ended up with was a show that didn't appeal to most Star Trek
    fans either.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pehache@21:1/5 to All on Fri Sep 16 21:04:17 2022
    Le 13/09/2022 à 22:34, Your Name a écrit :


    After that it you get the ridiculous reboot garbage beginning -
    "Enterprise" (note it doesn't even have "Star Trek" in the title
    being a massive clue) and then followed by JarJar Abrams even worse
    movies.

    Enterprise is fully part of the historical ST and retains all the
    spirit of ST.

    "Enterprise" was the first crappy reboot attempt.

    It's not a reboot it's a prequel.

    The idiots making it
    even said they were making a "Star Trek" show to try to appeal to
    non-Star Trek fans (hence leaving "Star Trek" out of the title) ... what
    they ended up with was a show that didn't appeal to most Star Trek fans either.

    Last time I asked, you have been unable to list any significant
    inconsistency between ENT and the other shows.


    --
    "...sois ouvert aux idées des autres pour peu qu'elles aillent dans le
    même sens que les tiennes.", ST sur fr.bio.medecine
    ST passe le mur du çon : <j3nn2hFmqj7U1@mid.individual.net>

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Your Name@21:1/5 to pehache on Sat Sep 17 10:42:19 2022
    On 2022-09-16 19:04:17 +0000, pehache said:

    Le 13/09/2022 à 22:34, Your Name a écrit :

    After that it you get the ridiculous reboot garbage beginning -
    "Enterprise" (note it doesn't even have "Star Trek" in the title being >>>> a massive clue) and then followed by JarJar Abrams even worse movies.

    Enterprise is fully part of the historical ST and retains all the spirit of ST.

    "Enterprise" was the first crappy reboot attempt.

    It's not a reboot it's a prequel.

    It's a supposed prequel that in reality is just another reboot.

    It's possible to be termed both, or in other examples it can be a
    sequel and a reboot. They do it often. Simply saying it is set
    earlier/later in the timeline doens't actually mean it fits with
    existing content or does not make idiotic changes for the sake of it.
    The up-coming new "Quantum Leap" is supposedly a sequel, but similarly
    is in reality just a reboot. Another example was the "Knight Rider"
    (using a crappy Mustang).



    The idiots making it even said they were making a "Star Trek" show to
    try to appeal to non-Star Trek fans (hence leaving "Star Trek" out of
    the title) ... what they ended up with was a show that didn't appeal to
    most Star Trek fans either.

    Last time I asked, you have been unable to list any significant
    inconsistency between ENT and the other shows.

    There are many lists available all over the internet of the problems
    with "Enterprise", starting with the opening song and the lack of "Star
    Trek" in the title, and going on from there (including the soft-porn
    "oil me up, Scotty" decontamination scenes). Hell, even Beavis &
    Butthead making it reportedly said they were making it for non-Star
    Trek fans, which includes making idiotic changes.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pH@21:1/5 to dumpster4@hotmail.com on Fri Sep 16 23:17:25 2022
    On 2022-09-12, dumpster4@hotmail.com <dumpster4@hotmail.com> wrote:
    On Sunday, September 11, 2022 at 7:56:51 PM UTC-7, pH wrote:
    On 2022-09-11, dump...@hotmail.com <dump...@hotmail.com> wrote:
    It's not just Star Trek:

    https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLFz_00sC7mo7Zu5GSSj9hqJ8G3faYyhLK >> If anyone has the courage to bravely do an "experimental" 1950's style hero >> movie--Star Trek or otherwise--I predict it would be *very* successful
    despite a firestorm of (predictable) criticism.

    Do I hold my breath in hopes that this might actually occur?

    ......no.


    pH in Aptos


    Hollywoke doesn't like Capt. Kirk and his ilk:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=heDoY1dALoA

    I went and watched this....thank-you for this link.

    pH

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pehache@21:1/5 to All on Sat Sep 17 15:43:53 2022
    Le 17/09/2022 à 00:42, Your Name a écrit :
    "Enterprise" was the first crappy reboot attempt.

    It's not a reboot it's a prequel.

    It's a supposed prequel that in reality is just another reboot.

    It's possible to be termed both, or in other examples it can be a sequel
    and a reboot. They do it often. Simply saying it is set earlier/later in
    the timeline doens't actually mean it fits with existing content or does
    not make idiotic changes for the sake of it. The up-coming new "Quantum
    Leap" is supposedly a sequel, but similarly is in reality just a reboot. Another example was the "Knight Rider" (using a crappy Mustang).


    Still, Enterprise is a prequel, not a reboot.

    If it had been a reboot, all the events of the previous series could
    have been simply ignored and for example they wouldn't have bothered to
    give an explanation to the change of look of the Klingons between TOS
    and TNG. And it's just an example, Enterprise has considerably
    consolidated the Star Trek worldbuilding (the episode with the Borgs,
    that tell what happened to them after "First contact", the episode with
    the Defiant that links to TOS "The Tholian Web", etc...)



    The idiots making it even said they were making a "Star Trek" show to
    try to appeal to non-Star Trek fans (hence leaving "Star Trek" out of
    the title) ... what they ended up with was a show that didn't appeal
    to most Star Trek fans either.

    Last time I asked, you have been unable to list any significant
    inconsistency between ENT and the other shows.

    There are many lists available all over the internet of the problems
    with "Enterprise",

    I am not asking the internet, I am asking you.

    starting with the opening song

    With is the inconsistency introduced by the opening song?

    and the lack of "Star
    Trek" in the title,

    Decision of Paramount, not of the showrunners. The title doesn't matter,
    what matters is the content.

    and going on from there

    Where's the list ?

    (including the soft-porn
    "oil me up, Scotty" decontamination scenes).

    Sure, for instance we had never seen before in Star Trek sexy girls that
    made the male audience crazy...

    Oh, wait...

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EaASUaPVAAEV80e?format=png https://i.imgur.com/kuYh7DP.jpeg

    Hell, even Beavis &
    Butthead making it reportedly said they were making it for non-Star Trek fans, which includes making idiotic changes.

    I'd like to see a (supposed) citation in context, not interpreted.

    During the last years of Voyager and during all Enterprise, Berman has
    been constantly accused of being a temple guardian and denying
    substantive developments in Star Trek. He resisted as much as he could
    the studio's demands to make the show more mainstream.

    I'm still waiting for a solid list, not just about a song or a title.

    --
    "...sois ouvert aux idées des autres pour peu qu'elles aillent dans le
    même sens que les tiennes.", ST sur fr.bio.medecine
    ST passe le mur du çon : <j3nn2hFmqj7U1@mid.individual.net>

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Your Name@21:1/5 to pehache on Sun Sep 18 09:47:39 2022
    On 2022-09-17 13:43:53 +0000, pehache said:

    Le 17/09/2022 à 00:42, Your Name a écrit :
    "Enterprise" was the first crappy reboot attempt.

    It's not a reboot it's a prequel.

    It's a supposed prequel that in reality is just another reboot.

    It's possible to be termed both, or in other examples it can be a
    sequel and a reboot. They do it often. Simply saying it is set
    earlier/later in the timeline doens't actually mean it fits with
    existing content or does not make idiotic changes for the sake of it.
    The up-coming new "Quantum Leap" is supposedly a sequel, but similarly
    is in reality just a reboot. Another example was the "Knight Rider"
    (using a crappy Mustang).


    Still, Enterprise is a prequel, not a reboot.
    <snip>

    Another braindead numbnut with the reading comprehension of a dried dog
    poo for the killfile. :-\

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pehache@21:1/5 to All on Mon Sep 19 14:02:08 2022
    Le 17/09/2022 à 23:47, Your Name a écrit :
    On 2022-09-17 13:43:53 +0000, pehache said:

    Le 17/09/2022 à 00:42, Your Name a écrit :
    "Enterprise" was the first crappy reboot attempt.

    It's not a reboot it's a prequel.

    It's a supposed prequel that in reality is just another reboot.

    It's possible to be termed both, or in other examples it can be a
    sequel and a reboot. They do it often. Simply saying it is set
    earlier/later in the timeline doens't actually mean it fits with
    existing content or does not make idiotic changes for the sake of it.
    The up-coming new "Quantum Leap" is supposedly a sequel, but
    similarly is in reality just a reboot. Another example was the
    "Knight Rider" (using a crappy Mustang).


    Still, Enterprise is a prequel, not a reboot.
    <snip>

    Another braindead numbnut with the reading comprehension of a dried dog
    poo for the killfile.  :-\


    And still no list of significant inconsistency that would make
    Enterprise a reboot. You are barking like a dog "reboot! reboot!
    reboot!" without knowing why you are barking.

    --
    "...sois ouvert aux idées des autres pour peu qu'elles aillent dans le
    même sens que les tiennes.", ST sur fr.bio.medecine
    ST passe le mur du çon : <j3nn2hFmqj7U1@mid.individual.net>

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Travoltron@21:1/5 to All on Tue Sep 20 15:44:25 2022
    I don't hate Enterprise. I've seen maybe half of the episodes, off and
    on. But there were a lot of inconsistencies and canon violations.
    Prequels almost always do this.

    I recall contact with the Gorn, Ferengi, and Borg long before that
    should have happened.

    Also, why are the Xindi NEVER mentioned again in the other Trek shows,
    even though they were a major power and fought a war with Earth? Again, prequels cause problems.

    Also, the idea that mind melds were forbidden was dumb.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pehache@21:1/5 to All on Fri Sep 23 22:05:25 2022
    Le 21/09/2022 à 00:44, Travoltron a écrit :
    I don't hate Enterprise. I've seen maybe half of the episodes, off and
    on. But there were a lot of inconsistencies and canon violations.
    Prequels almost always do this.

    I recall contact with the Gorn, Ferengi, and Borg long before that
    should have happened.

    The point is "should have happened"... or not.

    The Gorns: it was in the mirror universe if I remember correctly. Just a one-shot encounter.

    The Ferengis: in TNG it is not stated that this is the first contact
    with them.

    The Borgs: when Picard meets them in TNG, he could hardly make a link to
    the species that briefly showed up 200 years and never again after
    that... Time passes and humans forget.


    Also, why are the Xindi NEVER mentioned again in the other Trek shows,
    even though they were a major power and fought a war with Earth? Again, prequels cause problems.

    This one is more significant, I agree. But actually it's not uncommon in
    ST to have species that are set aside for a long time or even that never
    show up again. Although a major threat, the Borgs do appear only in very
    few episodes of TNG, not at all in DS9, and quite late in VOY. We have
    to assume that Xindis were no longer a problem after that, and that they
    did not seek to establish close relations with the Federation. And all
    along ST new species are introduced, and very often we may also wonder
    why they were never mentioned before.


    Also, the idea that mind melds were forbidden was dumb.

    I don't think so... But anyway it's a detail.

    I don't claim that Entreprise is a perfect prequel. But given all the challenges to build a prequel, I find that they did really well.

    --
    "...sois ouvert aux idées des autres pour peu qu'elles aillent dans le
    même sens que les tiennes.", ST sur fr.bio.medecine
    ST passe le mur du çon : <j3nn2hFmqj7U1@mid.individual.net>

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pehache@21:1/5 to All on Sat Sep 24 11:53:15 2022
    Le 23/09/2022 à 22:05, pehache a écrit :


    I don't claim that Entreprise is a perfect prequel. But given all the challenges to build a prequel, I find that they did really well.


    All the more if we take into account the pressure from the studio.

    Berman didn't want to start a new serie right after Voyager, he was
    feeling that the audience was less demanding after 14 years non-stop and
    that waiting a few years before starting a new one would be wise.
    Paramount ignored that and answered "we'll do it anyway, with or without
    you".

    The full Xindi arc was resulting from a demand of the studio after the
    9-11.

    The initial plan was at least a 7-seasons serie (or possibly more) to
    develop all the events that led to the creation of the Federation and
    explain many things that exist in TOS-TNG etc... Once cancelled, they
    had to shrink everything into the 4th season, which was mission:
    impossible...

    --
    "...sois ouvert aux idées des autres pour peu qu'elles aillent dans le
    même sens que les tiennes.", ST sur fr.bio.medecine
    ST passe le mur du çon : <j3nn2hFmqj7U1@mid.individual.net>

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pH@21:1/5 to pehache on Sun Sep 25 01:11:48 2022
    On 2022-09-24, pehache <pehache.7@gmail.com> wrote:
    Le 23/09/2022 à 22:05, pehache a écrit :


    I don't claim that Entreprise is a perfect prequel. But given all the
    challenges to build a prequel, I find that they did really well.


    All the more if we take into account the pressure from the studio.

    Berman didn't want to start a new serie right after Voyager, he was
    feeling that the audience was less demanding after 14 years non-stop and
    that waiting a few years before starting a new one would be wise.
    Paramount ignored that and answered "we'll do it anyway, with or without you".

    The full Xindi arc was resulting from a demand of the studio after the
    9-11.

    The initial plan was at least a 7-seasons serie (or possibly more) to
    develop all the events that led to the creation of the Federation and
    explain many things that exist in TOS-TNG etc... Once cancelled, they
    had to shrink everything into the 4th season, which was mission: impossible...


    Well, this is diappointing to learn. Thank-you for this info, though.

    I've not been watching anything "streaming"...just youtube segmets et. al. these days.

    BUT...I do have high hopes for ST Strange New Worlds. If they can just keep their current vibe goind it will be the best (current) Trek yet.

    pH

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Your Name@21:1/5 to pehache on Sun Sep 25 18:09:17 2022
    On 2022-09-24, pehache <pehache.7@gmail.com> wrote:
    Le 23/09/2022 à 22:05, pehache a écrit :

    I don't claim that Entreprise is a perfect prequel. But given all the
    challenges to build a prequel, I find that they did really well.

    All the more if we take into account the pressure from the studio.

    Berman didn't want to start a new serie right after Voyager, he was
    feeling that the audience was less demanding after 14 years non-stop and
    that waiting a few years before starting a new one would be wise.
    <snip>

    Ahhh, the old "franchise fatigue" nonsense to explain away the fact
    that they had no senisble ideas and simply wanted to do things they're
    own way via a moronic "reboot" (because of course they "know better"
    than Gene Roddenberry what Star Trek is "meant to be"). :-\

    The reality is that the fans were not "tired" or "less demanding". They
    were simply fed up with all the changes and garbage being funnelled out
    by Beavuis & Butthead ... who then went and made even more changes and
    garbage. Then the studio replaced them and JarJar Abrams made even more
    idiotic changes and garbage.

    Now the franchise is just a mess of conflicting different versions. :-(

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From The Horny Goat@21:1/5 to All on Sun Sep 25 01:44:42 2022
    On Fri, 16 Sep 2022 23:17:25 -0000 (UTC), pH <wNOSPAMp@gmail.org>
    wrote:

    Hollywoke doesn't like Capt. Kirk and his ilk:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=heDoY1dALoA

    I went and watched this....thank-you for this link.

    Of course they don't - he was very much 'a girl in every port' type of
    guy.

    From the woke point of view his impregnation of the faux native maiden
    was the last straw.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pehache@21:1/5 to All on Sun Sep 25 22:54:15 2022
    Le 25/09/2022 à 07:09, Your Name a écrit :
    On 2022-09-24, pehache <pehache.7@gmail.com> wrote:
    Le 23/09/2022 à 22:05, pehache a écrit :

    I don't claim that Entreprise is a perfect prequel. But given all the
    challenges to build a prequel, I find that they did really well.

    All the more if we take into account the pressure from the studio.

    Berman didn't want to start a new serie right after Voyager, he was
    feeling that the audience was less demanding after 14 years non-stop and
    that waiting a few years before starting a new one would be wise.

    <snip>


    Weren't you supposed to killfile me???


    Ahhh, the old "franchise fatigue" nonsense to explain away the fact that
    they had no senisble ideas and simply wanted to do things they're own
    way via a moronic "reboot"

    I'm still waiting for your list of significant inconsistencies that
    would support your "reboot" theory (which until just looks like a flat
    earth theory).

    (because of course they "know better" than
    Gene Roddenberry what Star Trek is "meant to be").   :-\

    That's pure nonsense. Berman did handle and faithfully develop the
    Roddenberry heritage during 14 years and 3 shows, and suddenly he wanted
    to throw it away??


    Then the studio replaced them and JarJar Abrams made even more
    idiotic changes and garbage.

    At least we can agree on that. But after all, JJA movies are claimed
    reboots. Recent kurtzmanians shows are even more damaging, as they
    contradicts events of the classic shows.



    --
    "...sois ouvert aux idées des autres pour peu qu'elles aillent dans le
    même sens que les tiennes.", ST sur fr.bio.medecine
    ST passe le mur du çon : <j3nn2hFmqj7U1@mid.individual.net>

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Travoltron@21:1/5 to All on Fri Sep 30 17:14:07 2022
    I know there was some talk about giving Takei his own Excelsior TV show.
    That Voyager episode does seem to be a backdoor pilot for that.

    I like Sulu and I love the Excelsior and would have loved to see THAT
    show. I was so disappointed they went the way they did with Enterprise.

    But Enterprise looks like Shakespeare compared to what Abrams, Kurtzman,
    and Orci have cranked out since 2009. I do enjoy most of the episodes
    that I've seen. It seemed to improve a lot in the last couple seasons.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Travoltron@21:1/5 to Elim Garak on Fri Sep 30 17:33:45 2022
    On 8/26/2022 8:26 AM, Elim Garak wrote:

    Imagine if TOS had included woke bullshit. You would have had a black
    woman on the bridge who wasn't there just to clean it.
    Uhura was an excellent officer, but not a Mary Sue like Mikey Burnham.
    Not woke.


    Or planets that
    were just heavy-handed metaphors for US 1960s race relations.
    An episode that showed the cop AND the social activist as equally insane
    as violent. Both sides refused to negotiate until their planet was
    destroyed. Not woke.

    Try harder next time.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Travoltron@21:1/5 to The Horny Goat on Fri Sep 30 17:20:17 2022
    On 9/25/2022 1:44 AM, The Horny Goat wrote:

    From the woke point of view his impregnation of the faux native maiden
    was the last straw.

    Oh yeah, THAT episode is the fodder for a lot of bad-faith arguments
    about TOS. It was just a sub-par season 3 episode and a product of its time.

    Someone on the wiki is obsessed with these things and keeps adding in
    quotes from this book:

    https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Star_Trek_and_History:_Race-ing_Toward_a_White_Future

    I don't even know why the hell that book and its author are on the wiki.
    It's not an official product. It doesn't even belong on Memory Beta.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pH@21:1/5 to Travoltron on Sat Oct 1 17:55:53 2022
    On 2022-10-01, Travoltron <travoltron@defender.uni> wrote:
    I know there was some talk about giving Takei his own Excelsior TV show.
    That Voyager episode does seem to be a backdoor pilot for that.

    I like Sulu and I love the Excelsior and would have loved to see THAT
    show. I was so disappointed they went the way they did with Enterprise.

    But Enterprise looks like Shakespeare compared to what Abrams, Kurtzman,
    and Orci have cranked out since 2009. I do enjoy most of the episodes
    that I've seen. It seemed to improve a lot in the last couple seasons.


    I wrote a letter to Paramount after that particular Star Trek movie came out proposing that as well.

    Oh well, what does one 'fan letter' amount to.

    Only Takei, Koenig and Shatner are left from the old series....they better
    hop on it if it's to happen. (Kind of like Bing Crosby dying just before
    they were going to do one more "on the road" w/ Bob Hope).

    pH in Aptos

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Your Name@21:1/5 to All on Sun Oct 2 10:38:45 2022
    On 2022-10-01 17:55:53 +0000, pH said:
    On 2022-10-01, Travoltron <travoltron@defender.uni> wrote:
    I know there was some talk about giving Takei his own Excelsior TV show.
    That Voyager episode does seem to be a backdoor pilot for that.

    I like Sulu and I love the Excelsior and would have loved to see THAT
    show. I was so disappointed they went the way they did with Enterprise.

    But Enterprise looks like Shakespeare compared to what Abrams, Kurtzman,
    and Orci have cranked out since 2009. I do enjoy most of the episodes
    that I've seen. It seemed to improve a lot in the last couple seasons.

    I wrote a letter to Paramount after that particular Star Trek movie came out proposing that as well.

    Oh well, what does one 'fan letter' amount to.

    Only Takei, Koenig and Shatner are left from the old series....they better hop on it if it's to happen. (Kind of like Bing Crosby dying just before they were going to do one more "on the road" w/ Bob Hope).

    pH in Aptos

    They're all too old to base a TV show around. Stewart is too old as
    well, as "Picard" rather proves - he's now a doddery old man (or
    perhaps that shold be even more doddery).

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pH@21:1/5 to Your Name on Sat Oct 1 23:01:42 2022
    On 2022-10-01, Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
    On 2022-10-01 17:55:53 +0000, pH said:
    On 2022-10-01, Travoltron <travoltron@defender.uni> wrote:
    I know there was some talk about giving Takei his own Excelsior TV show. >>> That Voyager episode does seem to be a backdoor pilot for that.

    I like Sulu and I love the Excelsior and would have loved to see THAT
    show. I was so disappointed they went the way they did with Enterprise.

    But Enterprise looks like Shakespeare compared to what Abrams, Kurtzman, >>> and Orci have cranked out since 2009. I do enjoy most of the episodes
    that I've seen. It seemed to improve a lot in the last couple seasons.

    I wrote a letter to Paramount after that particular Star Trek movie came out >> proposing that as well.

    Oh well, what does one 'fan letter' amount to.

    Only Takei, Koenig and Shatner are left from the old series....they better >> hop on it if it's to happen. (Kind of like Bing Crosby dying just before
    they were going to do one more "on the road" w/ Bob Hope).

    pH in Aptos

    They're all too old to base a TV show around. Stewart is too old as
    well, as "Picard" rather proves - he's now a doddery old man (or
    perhaps that shold be even more doddery).



    Yes, I think you're right. I kind of noticed that about "Picard" as well.
    Oh well....time marches on.

    pH

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From Travoltron@21:1/5 to All on Sun Oct 2 19:40:17 2022
    They should never have killed off Kirk. Shatner obviously had so many
    good and healthy DECADES after that. What a waste. And he wanted to
    appear in JJ Trek and JJ squandered the opportunity.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pH@21:1/5 to Travoltron on Tue Oct 4 01:37:38 2022
    On 2022-10-03, Travoltron <travoltron@defender.uni> wrote:
    They should never have killed off Kirk. Shatner obviously had so many
    good and healthy DECADES after that. What a waste. And he wanted to
    appear in JJ Trek and JJ squandered the opportunity.


    Yes. At age 91 it is now rather late in the game...but you never know.

    It could have easily been done--this being Science Fiction, after all--by
    doing something like: "Oh, look...Captain Kirk was caught in the Nexux after all and he's actually fine after having popped back out."

    I assume there was $$$ or lack of interest or hidden politics we'll never
    know involved.

    In the meantime, I *am* enjoying the "Strange New Worlds" clips on Youtube...it's the most "real Trek" I've seen for along time.

    pH in Aptos

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From pehache@21:1/5 to All on Sat Oct 15 18:31:27 2022
    Le 01/10/2022 à 02:14, Travoltron a écrit :

    But Enterprise looks like Shakespeare compared to what Abrams, Kurtzman,
    and Orci have cranked out since 2009.

    Indeed...

    I do enjoy most of the episodes
    that I've seen. It seemed to improve a lot in the last couple seasons.

    Yep, the first 2 seasons are somehow weaker. But this is case of all
    other classical ST shows (TOS apart): in their first two seasons, TNG,
    VOY, or DS9 are not at their best


    --
    "...sois ouvert aux idées des autres pour peu qu'elles aillent dans le
    même sens que les tiennes.", ST sur fr.bio.medecine
    ST passe le mur du çon : <j3nn2hFmqj7U1@mid.individual.net>

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)