One priest's baptisms are invalid and must be done over, according to numerous >news reports including this one:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/catholic-priest-andres-arango-baptisms-invalid-phoenix-church
Isn't the idea that the validity of a sacrement depends on the virtue
of the priest the Donatist heresy?
One priest's baptisms are invalid and must be done over, according to numerous
news reports including this one:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/catholic-priest-andres-arango-baptisms-invalid-phoenix-church
Isn't the idea that the validity of a sacrement depends on the virtue
of the priest the Donatist heresy?
One priest's baptisms are invalid and must be done over, according to numerous
news reports including this one:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/catholic-priest-andres-arango-baptisms-invalid-phoenix-church
Isn't the idea that the validity of a sacrement depends on the virtue
of the priest the Donatist heresy?
On Thursday, February 17, 2022 at 10:10:26 PM UTC-5, Keith F. Lynch wrote:
One priest's baptisms are invalid and must be done over, according to numerous
news reports including this one:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/catholic-priest-andres-arango-baptisms-invalid-phoenix-church
Isn't the idea that the validity of a sacrement depends on the virtue
of the priest the Donatist heresy?
His virtue wasn't in question, merely that he did not use the exact words he needed to.
One priest's baptisms are invalid and must be done over, according to numerous >news reports including this one:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/catholic-priest-andres-arango-baptisms-invalid-phoenix-church
Isn't the idea that the validity of a sacrement depends on the virtue
of the priest the Donatist heresy?
Keith F. Lynch <kfl@KeithLynch.net> wrote:
One priest's baptisms are invalid and must be done over, according to numerous
news reports including this one:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/catholic-priest-andres-arango-baptisms-invalid-phoenix-church
Isn't the idea that the validity of a sacrement depends on the virtue
of the priest the Donatist heresy?
Yes, but, the wording is very specific as is the fact that the person must
be a priest. Some random guy off the street can't baptize you as a
catholic.
And a priest can't baptize you as a catholic by reading
Heinlein to you and sprinkling you with water.
Now, of course this does admit the possibility of low-flying C-130s with >tanks of holy water and big PA speakers for mass baptisms of entire countries >without the consent of the baptized.
--scott--
On 18 Feb 2022 20:25:25 -0000, klu...@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) wrote:
Keith F. Lynch <k...@KeithLynch.net> wrote:
One priest's baptisms are invalid and must be done over, according to numerous
news reports including this one:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/catholic-priest-andres-arango-baptisms-invalid-phoenix-church
Isn't the idea that the validity of a sacrement depends on the virtue
of the priest the Donatist heresy?
Yes, but, the wording is very specific as is the fact that the person must >be a priest. Some random guy off the street can't baptize you as a >catholic.As I understand, they can, in an emergency, e.g. a baby is born alive,
but just barely, and there isn't a priest handy. (Often said of
babies that are actually stillborn.)
Now, of course this does admit the possibility of low-flying C-130s with tanks of holy water and big PA speakers for mass baptisms of entire countries without the consent of the baptized.
On Thursday, February 17, 2022 at 10:10:26 PM UTC-5, Keith F. Lynch
wrote:
One priest's baptisms are invalid and must be done over, according to
numerous news reports including this one:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/catholic-priest-andres-arango-baptisms- invalid-phoenix-church
Isn't the idea that the validity of a sacrement depends on the virtue
of the priest the Donatist heresy?
His virtue wasn't in question, merely that he did not use the exact
words he needed to.
On Fri, 18 Feb 2022 06:21:43 -0800, eleeper@optonline.net wrote:
His virtue wasn't in question, merely that he did not use the exact
words he needed to.
And why wasn't this mistake noticed for 20 years?
That implies that by getting one word wrong, he's put thousands of
souls at risk of eternal damnation, and has caused the damnation of
however many of them have already died. And we thought terrestrial bureaucratic requirements were bad.
Now, of course this does admit the possibility of low-flying C-130s
with tanks of holy water and big PA speakers for mass baptisms of
entire countries without the consent of the baptized.
kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) wrote:
Now, of course this does admit the possibility of low-flying C-130s
with tanks of holy water and big PA speakers for mass baptisms of
entire countries without the consent of the baptized.
Things close to that have happened in the past. The king is
converted and decrees that his kingdom is hence forward Catholic.
Scott Dorsey <kludge@panix.com> wrote:
Now, of course this does admit the possibility of low-flying C-130s
with tanks of holy water and big PA speakers for mass baptisms of
entire countries without the consent of the baptized.
That would take a lot of water. How much water can an average priest >sanctify each day? If there's no limit, why doesn't some priest just
bless all the water in the world?
Maybe one already has, and that's why vampires are extinct.
Scott Dorsey <kludge@panix.com> wrote:
Now, of course this does admit the possibility of low-flying C-130s
with tanks of holy water and big PA speakers for mass baptisms of
entire countries without the consent of the baptized.
That would take a lot of water. How much water can an average priest >sanctify each day? If there's no limit, why doesn't some priest just
bless all the water in the world?
Maybe one already has, and that's why vampires are extinct.
Gary McGath <garym@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote:
That implies that by getting one word wrong, he's put thousands of
souls at risk of eternal damnation, and has caused the damnation of
however many of them have already died. And we thought terrestrial
bureaucratic requirements were bad.
Is posthumous baptism possible in the Catholic church? I know it
is (by proxy) in the Mormon church (which is why they're big on
preserving as much genealogical data as possible, and storing it in
a nuke-proof cavern). And that performance of same is often very
annoying to their living relatives. Are they afraid that their late >relatives will be relocated to the wrong Heaven?
At least Muslims have always allowed non-Muslims in their kingdoms,
albeit with special taxes and with limits on the practice of their
religions.
On Saturday, February 19, 2022 at 3:11:14 PM UTC-5, Keith F. Lynch wrote:
Scott Dorsey <klu...@panix.com> wrote:
Now, of course this does admit the possibility of low-flying C-130sThat would take a lot of water. How much water can an average priest
with tanks of holy water and big PA speakers for mass baptisms of
entire countries without the consent of the baptized.
sanctify each day? If there's no limit, why doesn't some priest just
bless all the water in the world?
If the priest sanctifies a quart of water, and then someone combines it
with a quart of unsanctified water, is the resultant two quarts sanctified
or not?
Scott Dorsey <klu...@panix.com> wrote:
Now, of course this does admit the possibility of low-flying C-130sThat would take a lot of water. How much water can an average priest
with tanks of holy water and big PA speakers for mass baptisms of
entire countries without the consent of the baptized.
sanctify each day? If there's no limit, why doesn't some priest just
bless all the water in the world?
eleeper@optonline.net <evelynchimelisleeper@gmail.com> wrote:
On Saturday, February 19, 2022 at 3:11:14 PM UTC-5, Keith F. Lynch wrote:
Scott Dorsey <klu...@panix.com> wrote:
Now, of course this does admit the possibility of low-flying C-130sThat would take a lot of water. How much water can an average priest
with tanks of holy water and big PA speakers for mass baptisms of
entire countries without the consent of the baptized.
sanctify each day? If there's no limit, why doesn't some priest just
bless all the water in the world?
If the priest sanctifies a quart of water, and then someone combines it >with a quart of unsanctified water, is the resultant two quarts sanctified >or not?
If one is a Homeopathic Catholic, they would believe that it becomes yet more sanctified in the process.
On Saturday, February 19, 2022 at 3:11:14 PM UTC-5, Keith F. Lynch wrote:
Scott Dorsey <klu...@panix.com> wrote:If the priest sanctifies a quart of water, and then someone combines it
Now, of course this does admit the possibility of low-flying C-130sThat would take a lot of water. How much water can an average priest sanctify each day? If there's no limit, why doesn't some priest just
with tanks of holy water and big PA speakers for mass baptisms of
entire countries without the consent of the baptized.
bless all the water in the world?
with a quart of unsanctified water, is the resultant two quarts sanctified
or not?
Tim Merrigan <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote:
kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) wrote:
Now, of course this does admit the possibility of low-flying C-130s
with tanks of holy water and big PA speakers for mass baptisms of
entire countries without the consent of the baptized.
Things close to that have happened in the past. The king is
converted and decrees that his kingdom is hence forward Catholic.
That doesn't mean that everyone in the kingdom is suddenly Catholic.
It means that anyone who isn't, and refuses to become so, is breaking
the law and will be either deported or killed.
At least Muslims have always allowed non-Muslims in their kingdoms,
albeit with special taxes and with limits on the practice of their
religions.
On Saturday, February 19, 2022 at 8:54:08 PM UTC-5, ele...@optonline.net wrote:
On Saturday, February 19, 2022 at 3:11:14 PM UTC-5, Keith F. Lynch wrote:On a related note, I understand that leftover sacramental is expected to be consumed by the priest after Mass, so passage through the liver and kidneys Is presumably desacramenting.
Scott Dorsey <klu...@panix.com> wrote:If the priest sanctifies a quart of water, and then someone combines it with a quart of unsanctified water, is the resultant two quarts sanctified or not?
Now, of course this does admit the possibility of low-flying C-130s with tanks of holy water and big PA speakers for mass baptisms of entire countries without the consent of the baptized.That would take a lot of water. How much water can an average priest sanctify each day? If there's no limit, why doesn't some priest just bless all the water in the world?
Pt
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